Patsy's clothes

Has anyone heard before that Patsy was still wearing the clothes from the White's party - the next morning after the kidnapping? I apologize if this has been stated before. See the quote below. Also - I take it that this Steve Thomas that I'm quoting is not very credible...can someone shed some light on that? thanks.
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The Smoking Gun

As part of her staging, Thomas wrote that Patsy put a strip of duct tape over JonBenet's mouth. "There was bloody mucus under the tape, and a perfect set of the child's lip prints, which did not indicate a tongue impression or resistance," indicating that JonBenet had not been alive when the tape was affixed to her mouth. The ransom note and the staging of the body took so much of the night that Patsy did not have time to change the clothes she wore to the Whites' Christmas Day party. To Thomas, Patsy's not changing her clothes was the smoking gun. He knew she was wearing the same clothes because a picture taken at the Whites' dinner party on Christmas night showed her wearing a red turtleneck sweater and black pants. A Boulder police officer had noted in his report that when he arrived at the Ramsey home on December 26 in response to the kidnapping emergency that Patsy was wearing a red turtleneck and black pants.

"This woman, to whom looking good appeared always so important that she had a closet full of designer clothes, had attended a party, come home late, put her children to bed, gone to sleep herself, arose early to fly across the country, put on fresh makeup and fixed her hair, and then put on the same clothes she had worn the previous night? Not likely, in my opinion," Thomas wrote.

[nuisanceposter]

Yes, it's true. Patsy was wearing the same outfit on the morning of the 26th that she had worn for some 5 hours the night before.

Thomas's credibility only comes into question with the people who don't want to believe what he says. He could say the sky is blue and people would argue just because he said it, and they don't like anything he says. The Ramseys themselves have a worse track record than Thomas does for being able to relate accurate information. The IDI say Thomas's depo and his book contradict, but no one can site specific examples of what contradicts. I'll be more than willing to point out contradictions in Ramsey statements.

You have to wonder why the wife of a multi-millionaire, a former beauty pageant contestant who prided herself on appearance, would put on the same outfit she'd worn the night before - and without taking a shower. She said her shower was broken, JR was taking a shower that morning, and there were, what...at least three other bathrooms she could have used? Even friends of Patsy's thought it odd that she would get up and dress herself in the same outfit she'd worn the night before. That outfit had to smell like cigarette smoke and perhaps even perspiration after having been worn for sevweral hours the night before, and it wasn't like she didn't have any other outfits to put on to fly to Michigan in. It's just weird.

Originally Posted by nuisanceposter

Yes, it's true. Patsy was wearing the same outfit on the morning of the 26th that she had worn for some 5 hours the night before.

Thomas's credibility only comes into question with the people who don't want to believe what he says. He could say the sky is blue and people would argue just because he said it, and they don't like anything he says. The Ramseys themselves have a worse track record than Thomas does for being able to relate accurate information. The IDI say Thomas's depo and his book contradict, but no one can site specific examples of what contradicts. I'll be more than willing to point out contradictions in Ramsey statements.

You have to wonder why the wife of a multi-millionaire, a former beauty pageant contestant who prided herself on appearance, would put on the same outfit she'd worn the night before - and without taking a shower. She said her shower was broken, JR was taking a shower that morning, and there were, what...at least three other bathrooms she could have used? Even friends of Patsy's thought it odd that she would get up and dress herself in the same outfit she'd worn the night before. That outfit had to smell like cigarette smoke and perhaps even perspiration after having been worn for sevweral hours the night before, and it wasn't like she didn't have any other outfits to put on to fly to Michigan in. It's just weird.

I do agree w/you there. As a youth/teen, I have to admit I sometimes fell asleep in my clothes. But I have NEVER done that as an adult. It is even possible she threw on the clothes when she realized what was going on and that people were coming over - but still not likely. very strange.

As far as Steve Thomas - thanks for the info on him. Regardless of peoples' views of him - it sounds like his theories make sense. Makes you go hmmmm....

[nuisanceposter]

Patsy claimed she already had that outfit on when she came down and found the RN. I don't believe for a second that she'd get up and put on the same dirty worn clothes, intending to wear them on a flight to Michigan where they're meeting up with the other kids.

Of course, she gave two different stories about finding the RN...her first story was that she checked JB's room, and saw her gone and then went downstairs and found the note...then later she changed it to she went downstairs and found the note and then checked JB's room.

[Ames]

Originally Posted by lsu

Has anyone heard before that Patsy was still wearing the clothes from the White's party - the next morning after the kidnapping? I apologize if this has been stated before. See the quote below. Also - I take it that this Steve Thomas that I'm quoting is not very credible...can someone shed some light on that? thanks.
----------

IMO...she never went to bed that night....AND HENCE...she had on the same clothes.

[Athena]

Originally Posted by nuisanceposter

Yes, it's true. Patsy was wearing the same outfit on the morning of the 26th that she had worn for some 5 hours the night before.

Thomas's credibility only comes into question with the people who don't want to believe what he says. He could say the sky is blue and people would argue just because he said it, and they don't like anything he says. The Ramseys themselves have a worse track record than Thomas does for being able to relate accurate information. The IDI say Thomas's depo and his book contradict, but no one can site specific examples of what contradicts. I'll be more than willing to point out contradictions in Ramsey statements.

You have to wonder why the wife of a multi-millionaire, a former beauty pageant contestant who prided herself on appearance, would put on the same outfit she'd worn the night before - and without taking a shower. She said her shower was broken, JR was taking a shower that morning, and there were, what...at least three other bathrooms she could have used? Even friends of Patsy's thought it odd that she would get up and dress herself in the same outfit she'd worn the night before. That outfit had to smell like cigarette smoke and perhaps even perspiration after having been worn for sevweral hours the night before, and it wasn't like she didn't have any other outfits to put on to fly to Michigan in. It's just weird.

I'm at work but I do have notes at work re: conflicting statements Thomas made in his book v his deposition.

Off the top of my head:

Thomas: JBR was wearing a red shirt Fact: She wore a white shirt with a silver star

Thomas: Red shirt JBR wore was soaking Fact: Was a red outfit that Patsy planned to taking on the trip with them -- not a shirt

That Patsy was the ONLY one out of 73 people sampled that matched the handwriting of the note when in fact there were about 6 others that have been mentioned to have even more of a matching handwriting sample

That JBR wet the bed yet the sheets were not collected until some 10 days later and there were no tests conducted

Did not indicate in his book that Don Foster was discredited.

That the book Mindhunter was on JR's night table by the bed when in fact it was a book about death and mourning because of his elder daughter

Thomas made several statements in his book as fact and when questioned about them in his depo said he was not privy to the information

There are more but short on time -- sneaking in from work. Talk to you all soon and will post more from my notes

[nuisanceposter]

As to the red shirt:

According to ST's book, page 24, Patsy was the one who told ST that JonBenet went to bed wearing long white underwear and a red turtleneck top. Considering all of the other times Patsy has said one thing and then changed it later (such as saying in a depo that she saw the heart on JB's hand on the morning of the 26th, then telling interviewers the next day that she had read it in the autopsy report - despite JR saying he and Patsy did not read the autopsy report...and that's just ONE example of Patsy changing her story), I think it's very likely she said that and then changed her story later. That doesn't make ST a liar and someone who isn't credible, though.

Thomas's book, page 37:

"On the bathroom counter lay a balled-up child's red turtleneck sweater. Although Patsy said JonBenet had gone to bed wearing a red turtleneck, the body was discovered in the same white pullover she had worn the evening before. Who had changed her clothes?" No mention of soaking...


There were MORE than 73 people tested for handwriting. Who are these 6 others whose handwriting was a closer match than Patsy's?

CBI tested those sheets, and they tested positive for creatine. It's talked about in Steve's depo.

In what regard was Foster discredited, and by who? Can you honestly say the Rs have never admitted to someone they used being less than credible, either? How about their refusal to polygraph with someone who doesn't require drug testing? Or Dr Gelb's astonishing studies on plants? Or the fact that did not pass every poly they took, not even close?

[Ames]

Well...HERE she says in an interview that JB was wearing the same shirt to bed that night, as she wore to the Whites...(the white one with the star on it).


So John carries JonBenet upstairs, puts her to bed. You pull up the bed sheets. You find this top for her to wear or you just. . .

PR: We just left her top on her.

TT: . . .you leave the top on. . .

PR: Yeah.

TT: . . .uh, find a pair of. . .

PR: bottoms.

TT: . . .bottoms for her to wear. Um, did she wake up at all during this?

PR: No.

TT: Stayed pretty crashed out?

PR: Uh huh.

TT: Okay. Sounds asleep the whole time then.

PR: Um hum.

http://www.jonbenetindexguide.com/19...w-Complete.htm


Geez...how many different times does she change her story???

[Louisadelmar]

Originally Posted by Ames

[...]


Geez...how many different times does she change her story???

If I recall correctly - She initially told French JonBenet was in the red top she had planned on JonBenet wearing. Then she remembers that at the last minute JonBenet wore the white top so she corrects herself.

[Ames]

Originally Posted by Louisadelmar

If I recall correctly - She initially told French JonBenet was in the red top she had planned on JonBenet wearing. Then she remembers that at the last minute JonBenet wore the white top so she corrects herself.

Well, she has to make her story jive with what JB's body was found in. I PERSONALLY do not think that she was asleep when she came in. I believe Burke's intial testimony that JB was awake, and helped to carry in Christmas presents from the car, and went up the spiral staircase to her room. I find it odd that anyone would even question that, or call him "confused". How do you mix up sleeping and being carried in, with walking in, and carrying presents...and then walking up the staircase to the bedroom? I wonder, if she ALSO changed JB's shirt when she changed her out of the pants that she was wearing at the party. Maybe she had on the red turtleneck....when she wet the bed, it got wet....so Patsy put the shirt that JB wore to the party, back on. IMO

[nuisanceposter]

She did tell French that, except she didn't correct herself immediately. She did that later. She also told French she went to JonBenet's room first and pushed the door open (it wasn't closed tight) and saw her bed empty, and then went downstairs to make coffe, etc and that's when she saw the note. We know that she later changed that story to her going downstairs first. Odd thing to confuse, don't you think?

French was also told by JR that he checked the doors before they went to bed and all of them were locked. Arndt and Reichenbacher were also told the same thing by JR, and he changed his story later. Hmmm, they also said they tucked JonBenet in bed, Patsy singing to her and John reading to her...and changed that story too.

I'd love to see the official police reports, but I don't think we're ever going to.

[Ames]

Originally Posted by nuisanceposter

She did tell French that, except she didn't correct herself immediately. She did that later. She also told French she went to JonBenet's room first and pushed the door open (it wasn't closed tight) and saw her bed empty, and then went downstairs to make coffe, etc and that's when she saw the note. We know that she later changed that story to her going downstairs first. Odd thing to confuse, don't you think?

French was also told by JR that he checked the doors before they went to bed and all of them were locked. Arndt and Reichenbacher were also told the same thing by JR, and he changed his story later. Hmmm, they also said they tucked JonBenet in bed, Patsy singing to her and John reading to her...and changed that story too.

I'd love to see the official police reports, but I don't think we're ever going to.

Hmmmm....so MANY lies! I would just love to see those official police reports too!!! I bet that they would be VERY interesting...

[Athena]

Originally Posted by nuisanceposter

As to the red shirt:

According to ST's book, page 24, Patsy was the one who told ST that JonBenet went to bed wearing long white underwear and a red turtleneck top. Considering all of the other times Patsy has said one thing and then changed it later (such as saying in a depo that she saw the heart on JB's hand on the morning of the 26th, then telling interviewers the next day that she had read it in the autopsy report - despite JR saying he and Patsy did not read the autopsy report...and that's just ONE example of Patsy changing her story), I think it's very likely she said that and then changed her story later. That doesn't make ST a liar and someone who isn't credible, though.

Thomas's book, page 37:

"On the bathroom counter lay a balled-up child's red turtleneck sweater. Although Patsy said JonBenet had gone to bed wearing a red turtleneck, the body was discovered in the same white pullover she had worn the evening before. Who had changed her clothes?" No mention of soaking...


There were MORE than 73 people tested for handwriting. Who are these 6 others whose handwriting was a closer match than Patsy's?

CBI tested those sheets, and they tested positive for creatine. It's talked about in Steve's depo.

In what regard was Foster discredited, and by who? Can you honestly say the Rs have never admitted to someone they used being less than credible, either? How about their refusal to polygraph with someone who doesn't require drug testing? Or Dr Gelb's astonishing studies on plants? Or the fact that did not pass every poly they took, not even close?

NP: ST's book was the very first one I read. I had no reason to disbelieve him until his depo was released which he in fact tried very hard to have it not made public. I don't know if you saw a rather lengthy post I made at CTV which made me go from RDI to IDI but ST was one of those reasons. I printed 462 pages of his depo and went through the book and I can assure you he lied or deliberately made misrepresentations in his book. There were NO tests for creatine -- read his depo again. He did not know who was either eliminated from their handwriting samples or included. All of this is admitted in his depo. I have seen none of Patsy's interviews say that JBR wore a red turtleneck. As a matter of fact Patsy says JBR refused to wear it and specifically wanted to wear the white shirt with the silver star. It was ST's imagination and part of his hypothesis. If I were to post all of my notes and STs lies/misrepresentations/twisters it I'd be here for days and don't have the time. I have intermittently posted lies I have found as they come up during a specific topic in discussion.

[nuisanceposter]

Well, by the time Patsy got to the point of the depos and interviews she had finally gotten her story straight...at least about that shirt incident. There were plenty of other things she contradicted herself on, though.

And you can't actually accept everything Patsy says in an interview or deposition as truth, either, as many times as she's been caught contradicting herself or not being able to recall. Not to mention the fact that she and John have everything to gain by lying.

Apparently she told French JonBenet had the red turtleneck on. I can't see Thomas deliberately lying about something that could easily be proven by checking French's report. Don't you think they'd have nailed him on that when they sued him for malice and slander? Speaking of that, why did they bother? Part of the settlement they offered him was that he did NOT have to make any alterations to his book, and it could continue to be published as it had been written. That's kinda like saying Thomas's info is correct.

I just don't see how you can keep giving the Ramseys a pass on all their lies and contradictions and misrepresentations and sit there obsessing over any from Thomas. He wasn't the one with a dead child in his basement to account for.

[SnarkyCow]

Originally Posted by nuisanceposter

I just don't see how you can keep giving the Ramseys a pass on all their lies and contradictions and misrepresentations and sit there obsessing over any from Thomas. He wasn't the one with a dead child in his basement to account for.

Totally agree!

[Athena]

Originally Posted by nuisanceposter

Well, by the time Patsy got to the point of the depos and interviews she had finally gotten her story straight...at least about that shirt incident. There were plenty of other things she contradicted herself on, though.

And you can't actually accept everything Patsy says in an interview or deposition as truth, either, as many times as she's been caught contradicting herself or not being able to recall. Not to mention the fact that she and John have everything to gain by lying.

Apparently she told French JonBenet had the red turtleneck on. I can't see Thomas deliberately lying about something that could easily be proven by checking French's report. Don't you think they'd have nailed him on that when they sued him for malice and slander? Speaking of that, why did they bother? Part of the settlement they offered him was that he did NOT have to make any alterations to his book, and it could continue to be published as it had been written. That's kinda like saying Thomas's info is correct.

I just don't see how you can keep giving the Ramseys a pass on all their lies and contradictions and misrepresentations and sit there obsessing over any from Thomas. He wasn't the one with a dead child in his basement to account for.

You're right NP. Steve Thomas did not have to account for a dead child however he was supposed to let the evidence lead him not make the evidence fit his hypothesis/theory. Once he did that all of his objectivity was clearly gone and just for the record I believe the same thing about Smit. They are both at either extreme and could see nothing other than what they believed. I have stated many times I lean more towards IDI because I have not seen any evidence to convince me the Ramseys killed JBR. Had I seen any I would not have hesitated to jump on the RDI bandwagon. Every single thing that allegedly points to the Ramseys has an explanation. JMO

What specifically did Patsy and/or John actually lie about? I have seen nothing major in their depos/interviews that would indicate that.

[SnarkyCow]

What specifically did Patsy and/or John actually lie about? I have seen nothing major in their depos/interviews that would indicate that.

Seems to me they lied a lot since they couldn't pass the polygraphs (that they paid for) until the third try.

[nuisanceposter]

The lies and contradictions aren't found so much in the depos/interviews. It's what they were saying prior to that (they tucked JB in and read to her, the doors were locked, went to her room then downstairs - no, went downstairs then to her room). Like I said before, by the time J&P got to the interview, depo, state, they had their stories pretty much straight - except for a few here and there, like when Patsy said she saw the heart on JB's hand on the morning of the 26th, and then corrected herself first thing the next day by saying she hadn't seen it, she read about it in the autopsy...but John Ramsey was telling interviewers that he and Patsy hadn't read the autopsy. And that's only one example.

The contradictions and inconsistencies from J&P are all over this case from day one. I can't believe you'd even ask what they've lied about. I don't even know how to begin listing it all off.

[Ames]

Originally Posted by nuisanceposter

<snipped>
The contradictions and inconsistencies from J&P are all over this case from day one. I can't believe you'd even ask what they've lied about. I don't even know how to begin listing it all off.

Agreed! The list just goes on and on and on and on.......

[Louisadelmar]

I remember in the Lindy Chamberlain case the contradictions and differences in her story were held up as proof she killed her daughter.

[docg]

Yup, Patsy was up all night wearing her red sweater, jacket, whatever. Didn't bother to change the next morning, because . . . well, because she WANTED to be found out, why wouldn't she? She'd written a long ransom note too, a real doozy, the "War and Peace" of ransom notes according to some really witty profilers over at the profilers booth, the sort of thing only a wacked out female could write. And then she went and called 911 so she could hand it over to the police. With HER handwriting all over it. AND the body right there in the house.

So Steve Thomas sez to himself, "Gee, what does THAT tell you?" And decides to write a book.

What that tells ME is that Patsy has to be innocent. Because no one stupid enough to be found wearing the same outfit the next day AND stupid enough to call the police on herself could possibly be smart enough to ALSO get away with it.
:lol:

[Ames]

Originally Posted by docg

<snipped>
Because no one stupid enough to be found wearing the same outfit the next day AND stupid enough to call the police on herself could possibly be smart enough to ALSO get away with it.
:lol:

Well, she DID get away with it. (IMO)

[shill]

I'll admit it, I wear the same clothes two or three days in a row. Until I take a shower, I'm not putting clean clothes on. And unless I'm going out in public why bother. And if I was getting up early in the morning and flying in a small plane, I wouldn't loose the extra sleep just to take a shower.
Patsy had no one to impress that morning and didn't need to shower, so why put on clean clothes.

[SnarkyCow]

Snipped from Shill: Patsy had no one to impress that morning and didn't need to shower, so why put on clean clothes.

I thought she was meeting Melinda's fiance for the first time that trip and wanted to make a good impression. I think I read that somewhere, but would need backup cause I'm too tired to dig for a source.

[Louisadelmar]

Either way she wasn't going to be seeing the people who'd seen her the night before.

[shill]

Originally Posted by SnarkyCow

I thought she was meeting Melinda's fiance for the first time that trip and wanted to make a good impression. I think I read that somewhere, but would need backup cause I'm too tired to dig for a source.

You may be right, but that outfit was good enough for a X-mas party and the fiance wouldn't know she had worn it the night before. Family is family, no need to impress.

[SnarkyCow]

To you and me, I agree - the outfit wouldn't matter much at all, but for the way Patsy was, everything just so, I can't see her putting on the same clothes as the night before. This is total speculation on my part and I'm just going with my gut - there is no proof of my opinion - it is meerly based on what I've read about Patsy's personality.

[Coloradokares]

Originally Posted by shill

You may be right, but that outfit was good enough for a X-mas party and the fiance wouldn't know she had worn it the night before. Family is family, no need to impress.

Maybe its just me but I can go through 2 showers or baths a day and changes of clothes. I get up do my shower and skin care and makeup. Blow dry the hair etc. Do my thing through the day. If we are going out or entertaining guests you got it reshower, fresh wardrobe changes made Fresh makeup. If I have been where smoking is allowed A quick bath and off to bed with me.

[Louisadelmar]

Sounds to me like your habits are the exception rather than the rule.

[thewhitewitch1]

Originally Posted by SnarkyCow

To you and me, I agree - the outfit wouldn't matter much at all, but for the way Patsy was, everything just so, I can't see her putting on the same clothes as the night before. This is total speculation on my part and I'm just going with my gut - there is no proof of my opinion - it is meerly based on what I've read about Patsy's personality.

She was concerned enough over making a good impression on the fiance to do her hair and makeup but not enough to take a shower or wear fresh clothes? I would think nothing of her wearing the same clothes either if not for the comment about wanting to make a good impression on the fiance. I just think something is a little "off" with this. IMO

[docg]

Originally Posted by Ames

Well, she DID get away with it. (IMO)

If Patsy was involved in this crime she'd truly have to be the dumbest criminal in history, bar none. And she would NOT have gotten away with it because no one that dumb could possibly have gotten away with it. Patsy was obviously NOT dumb -- but innocent. Which is why she "got away with it."

[docg]

Originally Posted by thewhitewitch1

She was concerned enough over making a good impression on the fiance to do her hair and makeup but not enough to take a shower or wear fresh clothes? I would think nothing of her wearing the same clothes either if not for the comment about wanting to make a good impression on the fiance. I just think something is a little "off" with this. IMO

Yeah, she's concerned with making a good impression on her daughter's fiance, but NOT the BPD. A potential in-law is one thing, but the police, they're just riffraff. So what the Heck, if she wore that outfit all night while up staging, why bother to change just for a bunch of cops?

Doesn't ANYBODY get it? Wearing the same outfit the next day is evidence that tends to exonerate her. Only in the mind of someone blindly fixated on Patsy as perp could that possibly get turned around into evidence against her. WHY if she were up all night staging would she even DREAM of keeping the same outfit on next morning? If she were up all night no question she'd have showered and changed. John showered and changed. Guess that means he WASN'T up all night, huh? duh?

[Coloradokares]

Originally Posted by Louisadelmar

Sounds to me like your habits are the exception rather than the rule.

I don't know I didn't think we were any different than most. I was a preachers kid and my husband a farmers son. We both are like this. I thought it was standard.

[thewhitewitch1]

Originally Posted by docg

If Patsy was involved in this crime she'd truly have to be the dumbest criminal in history, bar none. And she would NOT have gotten away with it because no one that dumb could possibly have gotten away with it. Patsy was obviously NOT dumb -- but innocent. Which is why she "got away with it."

What you fail to admit is all of these things happened. Her writing could not be ruled out. She did call 911. Maybe she didn't think about fiber evidence when she "put on the same clothes". She wasn't a criminal mastermind, remember. I don't think she went to bed at all, by the way.
Her paintbrush was used in the garrote...and on and on.
She got away with it. Everything pointed to her and she got away with it anyway. So what was your point again?
Patsy is not dumb? Her husband killed her daughter and she never questions anything he tells her to say to LE and never doubts his innocence. This is what you believe and now you are saying she wasn't dumb? Come on. Either she was or she wasn't. Make up your mind.
I don't think she was "dumb" at all but how on earth would she know how to properly stage a crime scene?

[shill]

Originally Posted by docg

Doesn't ANYBODY get it? Wearing the same outfit the next day is evidence that tends to exonerate her. Only in the mind of someone blindly fixated on Patsy as perp could that possibly get turned around into evidence against her. WHY if she were up all night staging would she even DREAM of keeping the same outfit on next morning? If she were up all night no question she'd have showered and changed. John showered and changed. Guess that means he WASN'T up all night, huh? duh?

Valid point.

[aussiesheila]

Originally Posted by nuisanceposter

She did tell French that, except she didn't correct herself immediately. She did that later. She also told French she went to JonBenet's room first and pushed the door open (it wasn't closed tight) and saw her bed empty, and then went downstairs to make coffe, etc and that's when she saw the note. We know that she later changed that story to her going downstairs first. Odd thing to confuse, don't you think?

French was also told by JR that he checked the doors before they went to bed and all of them were locked. Arndt and Reichenbacher were also told the same thing by JR, and he changed his story later. Hmmm, they also said they tucked JonBenet in bed, Patsy singing to her and John reading to her...and changed that story too.

I'd love to see the official police reports, but I don't think we're ever going to.

Can you please provide the link to Officer French's deposition nuisanceposter, so we can check that he actually did say this?

Or are you just relying on Steve Thomas' version of what French said?

[Athena]

Originally Posted by SnarkyCow

Seems to me they lied a lot since they couldn't pass the polygraphs (that they paid for) until the third try.

Proof that they didn't pass a polygraph? By all accounts the first ones taken were inconclusive -- doesn't mean pass/fail.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notoriou...y/time_11.html

[Athena]

Originally Posted by Louisadelmar

Sounds to me like your habits are the exception rather than the rule.

I agree. Don't know about anyone else but if your personal hygiene habits are relatively good, nothing wrong with getting up and throwing on the same clothes that noone other than family has seen and washing up the "private parts" and putting on deodorant for the sake of saving time. She wasn't going "out" she was getting on a plane and like Patsy, I don't leave the house without makeup. JMO

[SnarkyCow]

Originally Posted by Athena

Proof that they didn't pass a polygraph? By all accounts the first ones taken were inconclusive -- doesn't mean pass/fail.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notoriou...y/time_11.html

Good point, but you helped make my point too - inconclusive means they didn't pass.

I'm not sure of a source regarding how many they took - I just recall reading about three and (in my words) they shopped around until they got the results they wanted, and then made them public. If I am wrong (it wouldn't be the first time ) let me know & if I am right and anyone has a source please post it.

Wonder why they were so scared of an FBI polygraph? Not being sarcastic, but if I were innocent I'd want to prove it ASAP so we could move forward with the investigation. One of the many things that make me go hmmmm....

[LindaA]

Originally Posted by Louisadelmar

Sounds to me like your habits are the exception rather than the rule.

I think the idea was that there was little time that morning and every opportunity to redress when they reached Michigan. (although I know they were meeting up with John's children before they reached MIchigan.) If she had showered prior to the White's party, it had been less than 24 hours (and I believe she did -- colored her hair). Why take another that soon? And why put on clean clothes if you hadn't showered? Don't see how all this is suspicious anyway.