dogs and psychics

I wanted to start a discussion about the dogs involved in this investigation. When I went to Tara's home, they told me that even bloodhounds could get absolutely NO SCENT in her yard of her. Even if people had been in, bloodhounds can pick up a scent after the scene is disturbed.

I also took my dog with me to search. He is not trained to scent find. He is trained to dig where I point and to search through pipes, piles of brush, sniff under houses, etc. He alerts me if there is anything unusual or that bothers him. We went all over that neighborhood and he never even flinched.

There were dogs there from all over--scent dogs, cadaver dogs, SAR dogs. Highly trained and they found NOTHING.

Isn't this all bizarre?

Also, I have been talking to several people who are either psychic or at least very sensitive....they tell me that they have tried to contact Tara and they get NOTHING. No vision, no sound, no pictures, no anything. There is just a big void.....either she passed on quickly and peacefully and crossed over totally....OR she is not herself, maybe mentally snapped.

Comments?

[Atok]

Originally posted by volunteer


Also, I have been talking to several people who are either psychic or at least very sensitive....they tell me that they have tried to contact Tara and they get NOTHING. No vision, no sound, no pictures, no anything. There is just a big void.....either she passed on quickly and peacefully and crossed over totally....OR she is not herself, maybe mentally snapped.

Comments?

I know this topic is a bit touchy, I don't generally "out" myself as being the sensitive type. I will admit, then when it comes to Tara, I get nothing but SILENCE. Unlike many other cold read sensations, there is nothing to pick up on here and I have always found that disturbing.

What first interested me in cases like these were the "impressions" I formed while wading through the details. First curiosity to see if they were correct, then creepiness when things seemed to fall in place. Science teaches me that this is educated guess work.

I also experience feelings, images/colors/temperature changes, what I call "impressions". Still no psychic has solved a darn thing yet. But I trust my feelings on things, strange little nudges that when I listen really turn out to have mattered. I like to believe I can sense things when I deeply focus and calm my mind.

I tried with Tara and it is only a void.

[concernedperson]

I am a little sensitive as well and fairly intuitive when it comes to people. With that being said I like facts and weave them into my impressions.

The other day I was asking if anyone knew a David related to this case. fsiii said yes and wanted to know why before I was told anything.

Well this is what happened. Someone contacted me about this case because they knew I was following it closely. They wanted me to verify some facts. This person was involved in a group that have some psychics and some use EVP. Like the gal Belanger who was involved in the Laci Peterson case. I know a little about it but I can never understand anything on the electonic voice recordings.

They sent me several postings of EVP and other psychic impressions. I figured the regular psychics weren't really on it and had read a lot a crime library but that is JMO.

However, the EVP one had a lot of info that goes along with the most prevalent theory that we have, this one person seemed to know or hear the name Marcus Did It, Rape, Hotel Room, Soldier, Local Black Man Who Saw Or See. Sounds kind of disjointed but it is only partial words or impressions. I could come up with a scenario with these things but the one I couldn't was someone named David. In their impressions Tara has connected with David
psychically. I was going to let them know who David was in hopes of another EVP reading but I don't know who this is.

I too have a hard time hearing what people claim is said in the typical EVP. I think they do exist however. And some are very clear.

Did they send you transcripts or actual recordings? Have you actually heard them and can we get to the links?

And to ATOK: thanks for the reply. Tara just doesn't seem to want to make any kind of contact.

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by volunteer
I too have a hard time hearing what people claim is said in the typical EVP. I think they do exist however. And some are very clear.

Did they send you transcripts or actual recordings? Have you actually heard them and can we get to the links?

And to ATOK: thanks for the reply. Tara just doesn't seem to want to make any kind of contact.

Here is the link to the EVP recordings. I couldn't understand them but my friend translated for me ( I am hard of hearing) They said to use headphones for better sound.

http://home.columbus.rr.com/lsweb/

Ok, I truly believe in spirits and things like that, but I hear nothing on those Evp recordings except garbled sounds. I think you have to have a pretty good imagination to make "David, this is Tara" out of that noise. Anyone hear anything?

For the first time, I will make this short (LOL):

I went to Tara's area for the same reason some of you did and I observed things PHYSICALLY, with my senses. But I told another person with me the same exact things you are saying here. This person will read this and know who they are.

I felt empty of emotion, other than happiness to have a clearer vision about the layout of the area.

I am a very intuitive person, also, and very detail oriented, as some of you know by my posts. I really felt a solemn, calm while in the area.

I felt no immediate danger, no sweaty palms, no hair standing on end, no urgency to cough or run or stop. Nothing regarding Tara and what may have happened.

Perhaps we are in the wrong town, the wrong area.

I do get the general feeling that another FEMALE is involved in the disappearance of Tara. I too, sense a military connection, but in the way of older person, bitter, maybe a dishonorable discharge many years ago, or a medical discharge?
I cannot figure that one out, but if anybody can offer some validity to my feelings, great.

Does this mean anything to anyone?
note to child, bipolar, raped by relative, pregnancy hidden, fear of discovery, street drugs (not doctor's rx) hair falling out, scar on knee, mole under armpit, ice?

The numbers 14 and 17 stand out. I cannot explain, so if there is relevance, maybe somebody can point this out.

I do not hear anything on the EVP: kill me__
I DO hear what could be interpreted as David this is Tara.

I do hear that one. Can anything be extracted further from the top one?

maybe tara was molested or raped by a family member?

That's just plain freaky.. I don't know what to think.. Was this session done with Tara's family?!?

Who are these people concernedperson?!? There are fakes out there.. don't be quick to fall for this.. it could be a hoax..

I don't know.. I'm holding onto the hope she is alive..

I think I'm going to call it a night.. this is upsetting.. sorry, nothing against anything posted.. I know were all searching for answers.. I'm just not ready to believe she may be gone..

Prayers for Tara..

I'd like to know more about this phenonmena, and if there is any scientific proof that it is real. I'm not sure what to think. I could not hear anything on the first one, and the second one could have said something.
With all that being said - Dr. Gattis' middle name is David. Could this be the " David" you are looking for?

[concernedperson]

To answer the above posts...I do not know enough to give an intelligent answer on EVP. The person that contacted me is a victim's advocate that works extremely hard trying to get info on the missing. Not just Tara and not just recent missing...from years ago. So, that tells me she/he is very dedicated to helping. The person mentioned to me that it wasn't the right time to get the family involved as they were trying to discern any fact that could be in the readings.

As people have posted before, psychic tendencies or the paranormal is a subjective field. Bits and pieces but does not replace full investigative procedures. A piece to the puzzle if you will. I know Orlando police have asked for psychic help to try and find Jennifer Kesse (in newspaper article). I want to do anything we can to find Tara and if it is looking at oddities, then we have to try.

I'm sure Tara's family would agree - leave no stone unturned. I know they just want some answers. I know psychics have helped in some cases. Maybe this could be one.

If anyone has any good information, or a legitimate site on EVP, I would appreciate a link. I'd like to learn more about it.

I wonder why no one can get a "feel" for Tara? Is that common among people who are sensitive to that sort of thing?

[Atok]

It's not "normal" for sensitive people to get no impressions whatsoever, though it can happen. However, early on in the case, there was some psychic impressions received by others and they were discussed on another board. They involved the stop sign on the corner, Dolly looking wistfully, a mention of Forsyth, but I can't find that post anymore.

Today, however those same individuals have no impression to reveal. I still want to hammer out facts, so I will continue posting on the other segments until something "intuitive" occurs.

Originally posted by Bamasleuth
I'm sure Tara's family would agree - leave no stone unturned. I know they just want some answers. I know psychics have helped in some cases. Maybe this could be one.

If anyone has any good information, or a legitimate site on EVP, I would appreciate a link. I'd like to learn more about it.

I wonder why no one can get a "feel" for Tara? Is that common among people who are sensitive to that sort of thing?

Here is a short history of ITC/EVP. I am also a EVP researcher and friend of Sandra Belanger, who used EVP on the Laci Peterson case.

http://www.mikepettigrew.com/afterli...c_history.html

If interested I can email you links on Sandra's work with the Peterson case, some of her work is still posted online. Just email me sage_fh2@yahoo.com

ETA: you can also goggle "World ITC" and "AAEVP". Both sites are reputable. There is going to be a EVP convention in Atlanta in June. I would love to go. I live in Bamaland too however it going to be too expensive for my budget.

Glad to hear the comments about the psychics. At this point, i would welcome ANY clue. I am leary of EVPS but i have heard some very haunting ones. If you watch TAPS, the Ghost Hunters, you know they try to debunk things and find reasons for them other than spirits. One night they had an EVP on a tape recorder that gave them and me chills. In a house where a lady often heard children running and playing, a little voice whispered into the recorder "they don't want us here". The lady just sobbed when she heard that and said the children could stay as long as they wanted. So I do know that spirits try to communicate. Why Tara is reluctant or unable is bothering me. If Dr. Gettis name is David, that is truly, truly, truly scary.

What about the dogs? Why could not one of those expertly trained trackers find anything? Makes no sense at all because at least there should have been some scent in the yard just from normal coming and going, don't you think? And Tara had to get out of the house somehow. And she had been all over town that day.

[concernedperson]

Volunteer, the only thing I can say about the dogs is that it was Tara's home and her community and like you said she had been all over town. If the dogs didn't pick up anything in the home I would find that odd. Her scent had to be there unless there is some phenomena with certain people's scent in relation to dogs ability to discern. Another subject I have heard different opinions on. In Laci's case one dog picked up and the other dog didn't.

If they were using scent dogs this could be a possible explanation. With cadaver dogs it takes several hours for them to be able to help....I think I heard Dr. Kobilinsky say 24-48 hours before decomposition occurs (in relation to the Entwistle case).

If you look on the thread about Dr. Gattis and his troubles with prescription drugs, it states that his name is Larry David Gattisin those reports. It certainly caught my attention when I saw the question about who was " David", and I thought i remembered seeing it somewhere on that thread. I went back and checked, and it is his middle name. (I am trying to learn how to post links, so everyone please be patient!)

Thanks, everyone , for the posts about EVP. I will have some reading to do this weekend. It is a fascinating subject.

Originally posted by volunteer
Glad to hear the comments about the psychics. At this point, i would welcome ANY clue. I am leary of EVPS but i have heard some very haunting ones. If you watch TAPS, the Ghost Hunters, you know they try to debunk things and find reasons for them other than spirits. One night they had an EVP on a tape recorder that gave them and me chills. In a house where a lady often heard children running and playing, a little voice whispered into the recorder "they don't want us here". The lady just sobbed when she heard that and said the children could stay as long as they wanted. So I do know that spirits try to communicate. Why Tara is reluctant or unable is bothering me. If Dr. Gettis name is David, that is truly, truly, truly scary.

What about the dogs? Why could not one of those expertly trained trackers find anything? Makes no sense at all because at least there should have been some scent in the yard just from normal coming and going, don't you think? And Tara had to get out of the house somehow. And she had been all over town that day.

It depends on which psychic you talk too. Sandra hates the term "psychic" she doesn't consider herself one. I am the first to admit she is extremely intuitive and gifted in that realm! Just because what one hears or knows something and isnt posted on a messageboard doesn't mean contact hasn't been made with Tara. Some things are kept private and confidential and yes have been forwarded to appropriate authorities, it is just up to them to follow up on it, or disreguard it.

IMO the movie "White Noise" was a hollywood fictional theme concerning EVP, while it does have it's element of danger, Ive never known a EVP researcher to turn up dead in all my years of researching. It does also have a grain of truth to it. Contact can and has been made by use of EVP. It isnt anything to play around with, and as with anything you do need prayers of protection, when dealing with it.

My theory on the dogs is Tara left in a car, and the dogs lost the scent, now wheter or not she drove herself to another location, or was abducted, remains to be seen.

Skeptics will always be around I simply suggest researching it for yourself and drawing your own conclusions before debunking any theory. Thomas edsion was working on ITC (Intra Trans Communication / EVP "Electronic Voice Phenomena") at the time of his death. He didn't get to complete his research, before he passed over. I just wonder if he had if it would be more accepted today than what it is. Im sure he got alot of harrassment when he came up with all his other wild and crazy inventions like the light bulb. Who would have known.

Here is a very good sight that will explain what evp's are,, how they are used,, and how they transmit. Although no one knows the exact reason why they do,,,, some experiments have been made. http://www.cjevpresearch.org/

Another good sight to look at for explanations, although you need to search the site to find it is,,,http://www.coasttocoastam.com/
hosted by George Noory now, use to be Art Bell out of Reno Nevada.

Thanks everyone! Those links were great. I appreciate the responses to my questions. I am going to look into this subject further because I really find this to be so interesting. And who knows - maybe it will help find Tara.

Bama

[shelock]

No scent? Did Tara feed her pets and the pooch she cared for inside the house? I guess someone else put the Halloween decorations out?

Originally Posted by volunteer

I wanted to start a discussion about the dogs involved in this investigation. When I went to Tara's home, they told me that even bloodhounds could get absolutely NO SCENT in her yard of her. Even if people had been in, bloodhounds can pick up a scent after the scene is disturbed.
I also took my dog with me to search. He is not trained to scent find. He is trained to dig where I point and to search through pipes, piles of brush, sniff under houses, etc. He alerts me if there is anything unusual or that bothers him. We went all over that neighborhood and he never even flinched.

There were dogs there from all over--scent dogs, cadaver dogs, SAR dogs. Highly trained and they found NOTHING.

Isn't this all bizarre?

Also, I have been talking to several people who are either psychic or at least very sensitive....they tell me that they have tried to contact Tara and they get NOTHING. No vision, no sound, no pictures, no anything. There is just a big void.....either she passed on quickly and peacefully and crossed over totally....OR she is not herself, maybe mentally snapped.

Comments?

[Esah]

Shelock, I'm glad you posted to this thread. I had forgotten about it. I was wondering if there is some sort of spray that will confuse the best sniffers. Like something simple, such as Lysol, or anything at all that would be so strong to a sensitive dog's nose, that it wouldn't get a hit. Something that LE knows about that maybe someone else does too.

I find it almost unbelieveable that not one dog got anything. And what about the day before Tara disappeared and the day before that, wouldn't her scent be there at some point and how long does it last.

This case boggles my mind.

As far as the psychic info goes, well I think someone sprayed something to confuse me too!! I have gotten clear info one time and totally crazy info the next. IMO I think all of this is due to the fact that Tara is very confused (convinced of a different reality than the rest of the world knows, either by herself or someone else) and not sure what to do. JMO of course.

If we could just turn back the hands of time and give Tara a do-over of that day. I wonder what she would do differently.

Would it be to avoid that one last phone call to someone she angered?

Was there someone at the pageant she would have noticed was watching her so she rearrranged her drive home, to stop them from following her?

Was her front door unlocked when she got home, and she didn't go in this time?

When Dolly barked, did she not ignore it this time?

When that knock came at her door, late that night, did she not so trustingly open it?

What possibly could have been done differently to stop this nightmare from happening?

[Brainstorm]

wishing we could go back is only a NICE THOUGHT
JMHO

[Esah]

When I think of Tara's life on October 22nd, 2005, it was a day filled with many of her favorite things. She was immersed in activites that involved helping friends look their best for a pageant. Then went to the pageant. Then she went by a friends house for a bbq and seemed to be having a good time there as well. In fact, her entired day was normal for Tara.

Until she got the call about MH at the White Horse Saloon. I think that from that point forward, the rug was pulled out from under her feet. She made a call to MH (reportedly) and to HD (reportedly) and excused herself from the bbq with the excuse of being tired. I bet she hardly got to her car before she burst into tears. (I wonder if anyone checked her trash cans for an unusually large amount of makeup stained, tear stained tissues)

I dont' know where I'm going with this, other than to point out that her day didn't appear to be set up in a way that she was consciously leaving. It just seemed like a day in the life of Tara Grinstead.

Until she apparently got home and changed clothes. Put the phone on the charger and then...............

Who can fill in these gaps? Obviously God can, but there is at least one other person who can too.

The dogs would have picked up her scent if she walked away from her home. And since her car was in the carport, then she left in someone elses vehicle or her's was returned. (I also wonder if her driveway was thoroughly checked for any oil residue or otherwise from a different vehicle than Tara's) I know her driveway is not concrete but the usual track in her driveway was there, and it wasn't a long driveway. If someone had an engine leak of some kind, it would be at least one thing to go on.

Oh well, just thinking out loud I guess.

You all have a nice day.

[IrwinIndian]

Where do you get this information from?

Originally Posted by Esah

Until she got the call about MH at the White Horse Saloon. I think that from that point forward, the rug was pulled out from under her feet. She made a call to MH (reportedly) and to HD (reportedly) and excused herself from the bbq with the excuse of being tired. I bet she hardly got to her car before she burst into tears. (I wonder if anyone checked her trash cans for an unusually large amount of makeup stained, tear stained tissues)

[Esah]

Ok, I'm gonna have to do some digging, but I'm pretty sure that it was MHu that was at the White Horse, and called her from there. I stand to be corrected.

[readmylips]

Originally Posted by Esah

Ok, I'm gonna have to do some digging, but I'm pretty sure that it was MHu that was at the White Horse, and called her from there. I stand to be corrected.

no. it was not mhu. mhu is the friend from hawkinsville. it was the pageant girl who went to the whitehorse but talked to tara before she went there. she did not call tara from the whitehorse if i recall correctly.

[Lindsey]

Originally Posted by Esah

Ok, I'm gonna have to do some digging, but I'm pretty sure that it was MHu that was at the White Horse, and called her from there. I stand to be corrected.

You're gonna need a backhoe cause you'll have to dig real deep to find that.

(It didn't happen.)

[PNut]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

You're gonna need a backhoe cause you'll have to dig real deep to find that.

(It didn't happen.)

Linds- the call didn't happen, or it didn't come from MHu?

[Brainstorm]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

You're gonna need a backhoe cause you'll have to dig real deep to find that.

(It didn't happen.)

LOL--------strange how some of these POIs are being "excavated" but we can't get simple answers about HD,LG & AG , right?
JMHO

[Lindsey]

Originally Posted by PNut

Linds- the call didn't happen, or it didn't come from MHu?

See RML's post above.

[readmylips]

Originally Posted by PNut

Linds- the call didn't happen, or it didn't come from MHu?

i am going to jump in even though you didn't ask me.

the answer to the question is both. the call came from a pageant participant not mhu and according to the girl she called before she got to the whitehorse. she did go to the whitehorse but she called before she went.

[fsbiii]

IIRC, old posts on another site indicate that M. E. called Tara on her way to the bar that night. I don't recall anything about Tara calling M.H. (Harper or Hulett?) from the BBQ, but I am about fried when it comes to sorting out details after so long.

[Esah]

Thanks to those who actually know the right names and details. Not my forte', obviously.

How did ME know that MH was at the White Horse then? She was the one that told Tara he was there with the 18 year old, right? Or am I having a halucination about all of this?

[Lindsey]

Originally Posted by Esah

Thanks to those who actually know the right names and details. Not my forte', obviously.

How did ME know that MH was at the White Horse then? She was the one that told Tara he was there with the 18 year old, right? Or am I having a halucination about all of this?

Esah, I don't know where you're getting this different info than we've been discussing for 15+ months. AFAIK, ME did not tell Tara anything about MH, or an 18 year old, or anything except pageant/parade related talk. I hope you feel better soon.

IMO

[minga]

Originally Posted by Lindsey

Esah, I don't know where you're getting this different info than we've been discussing for 15+ months. AFAIK, ME did not tell Tara anything about MH, or an 18 year old, or anything except pageant/parade related talk. I hope you feel better soon.

IMO

Lindsey, I remember reading the same things Esah is talking about. I think it was lots of misinformation that was spread around, but I do remember reading somewhere on one of the boards exactly what she's saying.

That is where some of the speculation that Tara may have headed to the White Horse came into play. I think it was during the time of FWPilot or whoever that was.

[fsbiii]

I think the problem here is a combining of different information and/or rumors into single items. For instance, there was a rumor about Marcus seeing an 18 year old and Tara disapproving (this came from Anita on Nancy Grace, IIRC). I've never heard that rumor combined with Meghan telling Marcus the 18 year old was at the bar that night. See what I mean? I've never read on any board that Meghan told Tara that Marcus was at the bar with an 18 year old, FWIW.

[minga]

Originally Posted by fsbiii

I think the problem here is a combining of different information and/or rumors into single items. For instance, there was a rumor about Marcus seeing an 18 year old and Tara disapproving (this came from Anita on Nancy Grace, IIRC). I've never heard that rumor combined with Meghan telling Marcus the 18 year old was at the bar that night. See what I mean? I've never read on any board that Meghan told Tara that Marcus was at the bar with an 18 year old, FWIW.

I believe someone tried to suggest that...FWP possibly, someone else..I don't remember, but I think someone took that and ran with it and facts and fiction meshed. There was very much misinformation purposely around that time and picking out the truth was very difficult.

I think there has been more information that was taken at face value until someone, likely Results, spotted the inconsistencies and questioned things.

I agree with rumors becoming combined and then possibly taken as fact, but I do remember something like that at some point. Maybe you were ignoring this particular poster who had theories that no one could get through.

[Lindsey]

Originally Posted by minga

Lindsey, I remember reading the same things Esah is talking about. I think it was lots of misinformation that was spread around, but I do remember reading somewhere on one of the boards exactly what she's saying.

That is where some of the speculation that Tara may have headed to the White Horse came into play. I think it was during the time of FWPilot or whoever that was.

I know what you are saying about the rumors is true. I've almost stopped posting because it seems everytime I do it's like tonight ... trying to correct misinformation ... AGAIN. But when it's members that have been here almost from the beginning, it's frustrating. Maybe I need to just hang it up and know I gave it my best shot.

IMO