Karla Homolka on Catherine Crier

Her release being discussed on CC today

Nothing we haven't heard before. Just a reminder how evil this woman is

AND she's walking the streets..my God!

The videotapes were destroyed but the transcripts are available. Does anybody know where I can get copies of the court transcripts and the video tapes transcripts?

Originally posted by Insomnia


And had an affair with a murderer in prison. She's going to do it again, no matter what that guest TH said.

JMO

I agree. That idiot kept saying he didn't believe she would rape and kill again but then said he can't say for sure that she's not dangerous. WTF??

I loved that guy from Court TV Canada (can't remember his name), mentioning how she and her lawyers fought to have the media banned and then the first thing she does when released from prison is show her evil face on television giving an interview. Attention seeker!!

[goatgirl]

Originally posted by Angel~Eyes
Nothing we haven't heard before. Just a reminder how evil this woman is

AND she's walking the streets..my God!

The videotapes were destroyed but the transcripts are available. Does anybody know where I can get copies of the court transcripts and the video tapes transcripts?

Hi Angel...

I agree, its a very scary thought knowing that savage is walking the streets...that is if she was brave enough to finally leave her apartment (lol)

I am not sure if the transcripts are available, I personally have never came across them...I too would like to read them if they are out there!

I know there was a gag order during the trial but I am not sure if that prevented the transcripts from being released.... I recall reading all the details from court in the newspaper everyday & they were in detail. But I have a feeling they may not be available !

Goat Girl

Originally posted by Angel~Eyes
Her release being discussed on CC today

Hiya May,

I don't know where we can get the transcripts of the tapes, I wish I could read them...And do we know where she is living in Quebec?

TIA sweetie!

Originally posted by Lauriet


Hiya May,

I don't know where we can get the transcripts of the tapes, I wish I could read them...And do we know where she is living in Quebec?

TIA sweetie!

Hi Lauriet,

The last I heard, she was living in Montreal in the Maisonneuve-Rosemont neighbourhood. That's about 15 minutes away from where I live by car.

Originally posted by Angel~Eyes


Hi Lauriet,

The last I heard, she was living in Montreal in the Maisonneuve-Rosemont neighbourhood. That's about 15 minutes away from where I live by car.

She is a couple of hours away from me... but even that is too close...Has she left her apartment yet???

BTW...How can she afford an apartment when she has been in jail for twelve years???

Originally posted by Angel~Eyes


Hi Lauriet,

The last I heard, she was living in Montreal in the Maisonneuve-Rosemont neighbourhood. That's about 15 minutes away from where I live by car.

OMG!!!

Thanks for the info May...That's sick that she's out there...

Originally posted by giddyupalw


She is a couple of hours away from me... but even that is too close...Has she left her apartment yet???

BTW...How can she afford an apartment when she has been in jail for twelve years???

Hi Giddy,

I believe she's on welfare. AND of course she has mommy and daddy to help her out

[2L8 4A D8]

Originally posted by Angel~Eyes


Hi Giddy,

I believe she's on welfare. AND of course she has mommy and daddy to help her out

Hi May! Question: So Karla can sit on her ***** for the rest of her life and collect welfare? That's a real slap in the face to every law abiding, hardworking and decent Canadian!

[cantstandnuts]

I can't believe her family has anything to do with her, let alone help her!

I also cannot believe people believe she will not re-offend!
She was involved with that killer in prison for goodness sake...goes to show she's not only attracted to that sort of thing, but she hasn't even learned that attracted to it or not, she needs to stay away from it! I wouldn't be surprised if in a year or so, we're reading about her and this prison lover of hers doing goodness knows what!

I understand that Elizabeth Fry Society has offered to assist her and I read on an MSN comments board that one poster wants to offer her a place to stay and help with anything she needs! SHE HAS FANS! That's really scary.

[2L8 4A D8]

Originally posted by cantstandnuts
I can't believe her family has anything to do with her, let alone help her!

I also cannot believe people believe she will not re-offend!
She was involved with that killer in prison for goodness sake...goes to show she's not only attracted to that sort of thing, but she hasn't even learned that attracted to it or not, she needs to stay away from it! I wouldn't be surprised if in a year or so, we're reading about her and this prison lover of hers doing goodness knows what!

I understand that Elizabeth Fry Society has offered to assist her and I read on an MSN comments board that one poster wants to offer her a place to stay and help with anything she needs! SHE HAS FANS! That's really scary.

Karla's family is just as sick as she is. What an absolute slap in the face to Tammy that she obviously meant so little to them that they were able to forgive Karla so quickly and easily for what she and Paul did to poor, unsuspecting Tammy.

Also, as you know, "Birds of A Feather, Flock Together" so it doesn't surprise me that Karla has fans.

JMO and MOO!!

[cantstandnuts]

Just curious, because I've seen it a couple times...What does MOO stand for?

[2L8 4A D8]

Originally posted by cantstandnuts
Just curious, because I've seen it a couple times...What does MOO stand for?

My Opinion Only!

[cantstandnuts]

Just curious, because I've seen it a couple times...What does MOO stand for?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My Opinion Only!
^^^^^^^^^^^^^



thanks.

[cami]

Originally posted by Angel~Eyes
Nothing we haven't heard before. Just a reminder how evil this woman is

AND she's walking the streets..my God!

The videotapes were destroyed but the transcripts are available. Does anybody know where I can get copies of the court transcripts and the video tapes transcripts?

Doubt it, they are subject to a complete publication ban. You can probably get Paul's trial transcripts at the Ontario court but I doubt if you will ever get the transcripts of the tapes alone. for what it's worth the parents of Leslie and Kristen had the tapes pertaining to their daughters copywrited so they could be destroyed. Because those tapes are part of the public record, they had to fight in court to get them.

[northernrflxn]

Originally posted by cami


Doubt it, they are subject to a complete publication ban. You can probably get Paul's trial transcripts at the Ontario court but I doubt if you will ever get the transcripts of the tapes alone. for what it's worth the parents of Leslie and Kristen had the tapes pertaining to their daughters copywrited so they could be destroyed. Because those tapes are part of the public record, they had to fight in court to get them.

The tapes are transcribed virtually verbatim in at least two of the books on the case. They include "Lethal Marriage" by Nick Pron and "Invisible Darkness" by Stephen Williams. Nick Pron defends his use of the full transcripts in the book's foreword. All publication bans were lifted once Bernardo's trial commenced in 1995. Members of the public and the media were not allowed to see the tapes at trial, only hear them.

I believe Stephen Williams faced criminal investigation because some felt he had implied in his writings that he had actually seen the tapes.

[cantstandnuts]

I believe Stephen Williams faced criminal investigation because some felt he had implied in his writings that he had actually seen the tapes.

If I remember correctly, many people thought that he was so spot on with the details of the rapes, that he had to have viewed the tapes. I'm not sure if that's what you meant, but oh well, here's my two cents!

Originally posted by 2L8 4A D8


Hi May! Question: So Karla can sit on her ***** for the rest of her life and collect welfare? That's a real slap in the face to every law abiding, hardworking and decent Canadian!

Crime sure pays, doesn't it? It seems to have in Karla's case. Gosh, a free apartment, and welfare. Karla has it made at Canadian taxpayers expense.

[northernrflxn]

Originally posted by Belly Button


Crime sure pays, doesn't it? It seems to have in Karla's case. Gosh, a free apartment, and welfare. Karla has it made at Canadian taxpayers expense.

You don't think she would prefer to work?

[2L8 4A D8]

Originally posted by northernrflxn


You don't think she would prefer to work?

No. She hasn't worked in 12 years. Why should she start now? You seem very educated and motivated. I do not see you sitting on your ***** and not working. However, I can definitely see low life Karla sitting on her ***** and getting paid for it. Poor thing is afraid to go outside, so she is definitely in no hurry to go to work!

JMO and MOO!!

[northernrflxn]

Originally posted by 2L8 4A D8


No. She hasn't worked in 12 years. Why should she start now? You seem very educated and motivated. I do not see you sitting on your ***** and not working. However, I can definitely see low life Karla sitting on her ***** and getting paid for it. Poor thing is afraid to go outside, so she is definitely in no hurry to go to work!

JMO and MOO!!

I know you have very strong feelings about this case 2L8, but I certainly think she would rather work. She stated as much in her recent interview.

She worked steadily from when she was a teenager to when she was arrested. She had responsibilities in Joliet that were required, and beyond that took optional prison seminars to qualify her for volunteer work. According to author Stephen Williams she literally begged for work- any kind of work- at St-Anne, which had a far less demanding and less structured prisoner environment. She now has a university degree which she worked hard for, and I'm sure she'd like a chance to apply it to something.

Her terrible crimes mean that she will probably never have a chance to reach anything close to her full potential professionally, and perhaps rightly so. But to say she is a low life who would rather sit on her *** and collect welfare is simply gratuitious and not supported by what we know. IMO, it is these kind of baseless pot shots that serve to dilute the credibility of the anger and derision directed her way.

[2L8 4A D8]

[quote]Originally posted by northernrflxn

I know you have very strong feelings about this case 2L8, but I certainly think she would rather work. She stated as much in her recent interview.

<snipped>

I was not able to see Karla's interview because I don't live in Canada. So, was this before or after her interview when she got her gratis apartment and began collecting welfare? Just curious!

...But to say she is a low life who would rather sit on her *** and collect welfare is simply gratuitious and not supported by what we know. IMO, it is these kind of baseless pot shots that serve to dilute the credibility of the anger and derision directed her way.

That's why I always end my posts with JMO and MOO. It's my opinion and I am entitled to that, just like you are. If you want to call them "baseless pot shots" that's your opinion. However, in my opinion, Karla is low life scum. Sorry if you don't like my opinion, but that's life ~ we're all not going to agree all of the time.

[northernrflxn]

[quote]Originally posted by 2L8 4A D8

Originally posted by northernrflxn

I know you have very strong feelings about this case 2L8, but I certainly think she would rather work. She stated as much in her recent interview.

<snipped>

I was not able to see Karla's interview because I don't live in Canada. So, was this before or after her interview when she got her gratis apartment and began collecting welfare? Just curious!

...But to say she is a low life who would rather sit on her *** and collect welfare is simply gratuitious and not supported by what we know. IMO, it is these kind of baseless pot shots that serve to dilute the credibility of the anger and derision directed her way.

That's why I always end my posts with JMO and MOO. It's my opinion and I am entitled to that, just like you are. If you want to call them "baseless pot shots" that's your opinion. However, in my opinion, Karla is low life scum. Sorry if you don't like my opinion, but that's life ~ we're all not going to agree all of the time.

You can think she's a low life - plenty agree with you. But saying she WANTS to sit on her *** and collect welfare rather than work without any evidence of that is just you making stuff up.

If you are interested in seeing the interview, you can watch part of it here on the web:

http://montreal.cbc.ca/regional/serv...omolka20050705

It is is French, but there are English subtitles. If your decide to watch it, you may have to make your media window a little bigger to read them. It is about 13 minutes long.

[2L8 4A D8]

Originally posted by northernrflxn


You can think she's a low life - plenty agree with you. But saying she WANTS to sit on her *** and collect welfare rather than work without any evidence of that is just you making stuff up.

If you are interested in seeing the interview, you can watch part of it here on the web:

http://montreal.cbc.ca/regional/serv...omolka20050705

It is is French, but there are English subtitles. If your decide to watch it, you may have to make your media window a little bigger to read them. It is about 13 minutes long.

Thanks, I will try the link.

Regarding your comment, "...without any evidence of that is just you making stuff up". Well I guess that everyone is making stuff up on these Boards because we are all just stating our opinions! We're not making Statements of Fact (which would be evidence IMO) or else we would have to provide a link.

I feel that Karla's chances of finding a job are slim to none. Heck, she probably wouldn't be able to get a job at McDonald's once they realize who she is. Again, it is JMO and MOO of Karla which I am entitled to. And again, I am sorry that you don't like my opinion.

JMO and MOO!!

Originally posted by Belly Button


Crime sure pays, doesn't it? It seems to have in Karla's case. Gosh, a free apartment, and welfare. Karla has it made at Canadian taxpayers expense.

If the Canadian government has to pay her welfare, why don't they just give her an undergroung job like maybe in the sewers cleaning out the street gutters?

[hockeymomof5]

Originally posted by 2L8 4A D8


Thanks, I will try the link.

Regarding your comment, "...without any evidence of that is just you making stuff up". Well I guess that everyone is making stuff up on these Boards because we are all just stating our opinions! We're not making Statements of Fact (which would be evidence IMO) or else we would have to provide a link.

I feel that Karla's chances of finding a job are slim to none. Heck, she probably wouldn't be able to get a job at McDonald's once they realize who she is. Again, it is JMO and MOO of Karla which I am entitled to. And again, I am sorry that you don't like my opinion.

JMO and MOO!!

Feel like you're banging your head against the wall, don't you? It might help you understand this poster if you go back over her posts and realize that she believes EVERYTHING Karla has stated and discounts other's statements due to their misunderstanding of the "victim of Paul, or as being made for political reasons. It couldn't possibly be that Karla, having a degree is psychology, could be using her knowledge of the human psyche to say what she believes others want to hear. After all, Karla wouldn't possibly lie to anyone now, would she? <said with utter and complete sarcasm>


For the record, the above was JUST MY OWN OPINION.

[northernrflxn]

Originally posted by hockeymomof5


Feel like you're banging your head against the wall, don't you? It might help you understand this poster if you go back over her posts and realize that she believes EVERYTHING Karla has stated and discounts other's statements due to their misunderstanding of the "victim of Paul, or as being made for political reasons. It couldn't possibly be that Karla, having a degree is psychology, could be using her knowledge of the human psyche to say what she believes others want to hear. After all, Karla wouldn't possibly lie to anyone now, would she? <said with utter and complete sarcasm>


For the record, the above was JUST MY OWN OPINION.

Another fine example of your typical approach with me hockeymom - you are a sly and deliberate master of the Straw Man argument. The topic of my post was my belief that Homolka would prefer to work rather than "sit on her *** and collect welfare". To this assertion, and despite your comments:

Regarding Homolka's desire to work, beliefs that she was/was not victimized are irrelevant and raised by nobody but you.

Regarding Homolka's desire to work, politics was raised by nobody but you.

Regarding Homolka's desire to work, my citation of her words was just one part of a an argument that had fully five other points surrounding her education and known work history over almost the last two decades.

Regarding Homolka's desire to work, I can't imagine a weaker or more deliberately mean spirited argument than to imply that one would have to call on a psychology degree to determine that society values productive members more than not, and figure out how to tailor one's remarks accordingly.

I'm sure you would feel much less like you're banging your head against the wall if you'd actually argue the points in my posts, rather than relying on your spiteful and seemingly willfull misunderstanding and mischaracterization of almost everthing I have ever said on this board.

Originally posted by chilione


If the Canadian government has to pay her welfare, why don't they just give her an undergroung job like maybe in the sewers cleaning out the street gutters?

:lol: That is where she belongs......I can't believe someone let her stay in an apartment...sheesh

Originally posted by northernrflxn


Another fine example of your typical approach with me hockeymom - you are a sly and deliberate master of the Straw Man argument. The topic of my post was my belief that Homolka would prefer to work rather than "sit on her *** and collect welfare". To this assertion, and despite your comments:

Regarding Homolka's desire to work, beliefs that she was/was not victimized are irrelevant and raised by nobody but you.

Regarding Homolka's desire to work, politics was raised by nobody but you.

Regarding Homolka's desire to work, my citation of her words was just one part of a an argument that had fully five other points surrounding her education and known work history over almost the last two decades.

Regarding Homolka's desire to work, I can't imagine a weaker or more deliberately mean spirited argument than to imply that one would have to call on a psychology degree to determine that society values productive members more than not, and figure out how to tailor one's remarks accordingly.

I'm sure you would feel much less like you're banging your head against the wall if you'd actually argue the points in my posts, rather than relying on your spiteful and seemingly willfull misunderstanding and mischaracterization of almost everthing I have ever said on this board.

Let's just get to the bottom line ... This women is sick to have participated in this crime...IMO

[northernrflxn]

Originally posted by giddyupalw


Let's just get to the bottom line ... This women is sick to have participated in this crime...IMO

Yes, Karla certainly "had issues". (I don't mean in any way to make light of the heartbreaking consequences of her actions). However, your reply is a non-sequiter in a discussion about her willingness to work vs. a preference to collect welfare.

Message boards being what they are, we can certainly change the subject if you like.

Originally posted by hockeymomof5


Feel like you're banging your head against the wall, don't you? It might help you understand this poster if you go back over her posts and realize that she believes EVERYTHING Karla has stated and discounts other's statements due to their misunderstanding of the "victim of Paul, or as being made for political reasons. It couldn't possibly be that Karla, having a degree is psychology, could be using her knowledge of the human psyche to say what she believes others want to hear. After all, Karla wouldn't possibly lie to anyone now, would she? <said with utter and complete sarcasm>


For the record, the above was JUST MY OWN OPINION.

I share your opinion. I watched the video.

[cami]

Originally posted by northernrflxn


The tapes are transcribed virtually verbatim in at least two of the books on the case. They include "Lethal Marriage" by Nick Pron and "Invisible Darkness" by Stephen Williams. Nick Pron defends his use of the full transcripts in the book's foreword. All publication bans were lifted once Bernardo's trial commenced in 1995. Members of the public and the media were not allowed to see the tapes at trial, only hear them.

I believe Stephen Williams faced criminal investigation because some felt he had implied in his writings that he had actually seen the tapes.

Stephen Williams faced CI because of his description of the rapes was so accurate, they believed he had viewed the tapes. The PB on those tapes has not been lifted. Only the news blackout was lifted. Don't forget Karla's trial was first and in order for Paul to receive a fair trial, they blacked hers out completely.

"In January 2005, author Stephen Williams was sentenced for violating the publication ban by including forbidden details in his two books on Bernardo and Homolka, making him only the second person sentenced for violating the publication ban—the first being one of the "Electronic ban breakers". Stephen Williams reached a plea agreement with the Canadian authorities in which he agreed that he would no longer use "any materials belonging to the Crown" as part of his writings. It is, as of this writing, unclear whether or not Stephen Williams will remain active in this case, but he was present at the June 2005 810.2 hearing for Karla Homolka, which would seem to indicate he will."



I think LM was the best book written about this case but I still disagree with Pron and anyone else who believes Karla murdered the two girls. Yes, she helped Paul rape them and everything else and she should have received a life sentence but I will never believe she was the one who murdered them while he was out getting fast food. We start thinking like that and one day before we know it, Paul will be getting out of prison.

[cami]

Originally posted by chilione


If the Canadian government has to pay her welfare, why don't they just give her an undergroung job like maybe in the sewers cleaning out the street gutters?

Because that would be considered slave labour and against the law. You can't force someone on welfare to work. Your can offer them municipal or provincial employment programs however but it's still up to them if they want to accept or not.

Karla paid a very small price for her enormous crimes. She is one dangerous lady to be walking the streets or to be living near anybody. She should be in prison forever, just like the Manson babes. I watched the video of her interview. She is a cold calculating predator. If she cried all the time it wasn't for her victims, it was for her own stupidity.

She won't be stupid next time.

She handled the question about her relationship with a murderer very adroitly, but not so well that it wasn't noted. It tells me that what she likes. And she gets what she likes.

Scary stuff this.

JMO, MOO.

[northernrflxn]

Originally posted by cami


Stephen Williams faced CI because of his description of the rapes was so accurate, they believed he had viewed the tapes. The PB on those tapes has not been lifted. Only the news blackout was lifted. Don't forget Karla's trial was first and in order for Paul to receive a fair trial, they blacked hers out completely.

"In January 2005, author Stephen Williams was sentenced for violating the publication ban by including forbidden details in his two books on Bernardo and Homolka, making him only the second person sentenced for violating the publication ban—the first being one of the "Electronic ban breakers". Stephen Williams reached a plea agreement with the Canadian authorities in which he agreed that he would no longer use "any materials belonging to the Crown" as part of his writings. It is, as of this writing, unclear whether or not Stephen Williams will remain active in this case, but he was present at the June 2005 810.2 hearing for Karla Homolka, which would seem to indicate he will."

I think LM was the best book written about this case but I still disagree with Pron and anyone else who believes Karla murdered the two girls. Yes, she helped Paul rape them and everything else and she should have received a life sentence but I will never believe she was the one who murdered them while he was out getting fast food. We start thinking like that and one day before we know it, Paul will be getting out of prison.

Thanks for the clarificaiton about the publication ban. I am aware that the blackout was motivated by the desire to ensure that Bernardo was given a fair trial, but I considered the terms news blackout and publication ban synonymous. From your post, I see they should be considered distinct issues.

Lethal Marriage is also my pick for best book about this case. It was the first one, and is the one that I think provides the least nuanced and most straightforward retelling of the facts in a way that most fits the entire body of knowledge about the principal players in this case. Pron sometimes slips into a more narrative style that benefits Karla in spots, but those spots are easy to see and weight accordingly.

It is harder for me to analyse the work of Stephen Williams. He is a fine researcher and a good writer, but he often slips completely into heavily veiled innuendo rather than objective facts for chapters on end. After Deadly Innocence was published, the work sourced heavily through friends and aquaintances of Paul Bernardo and Karla Homoka, there seemed little left to say.

It is my opinion that Williams latched on to the idea of Karla as an equal or greater evil partly as a fresh angle to justify the publication of still another book on this case. Through both commission and omision he sometimes seems to fit the facts around this theory somewhat painfully. Fresh off his own experiences with the legal system, his second book is rife with a slings and arrows for law enforcement and the courts and he seems to find a new sympathy for Karla accordingly. He never divorces himself from the foundations of his first book however, leaving the book with the occassional schizophrenic feel.

Williams' work is still an important voice in this case, but I think it must be read along with Lethal Marriage to allow the reader to best judge what happened and who Karla Homolka really is.

[northernrflxn]

Not entirely clear from my post above that Deadly Innocence is the work of authors Alan Cairns and Scott Burnside from the Toronto Sun. Sorry! Poorly worded, but meant to say that Williams needed a fresh approach after the publication of two books by other authors. Williams wrote Invisible Darkness and Karla A Pact With the Devil.

[northernrflxn]

Sorry again! Somebody just reminded me that Pron's and Cairns and Burnside's books were the first books published post trial and conviction, but there were actually two other lesser known books published before that. They were Karla's Web and A Marriage Made for Murder. So Williams' Invisible Darkness was actually the 5th book on the case.

Originally posted by northernrflxn


Yes, Karla certainly "had issues". (I don't mean in any way to make light of the heartbreaking consequences of her actions). However, your reply is a non-sequiter in a discussion about her willingness to work vs. a preference to collect welfare.

Message boards being what they are, we can certainly change the subject if you like.

HAD issues :lol: Are you suggesting she doens't have any ISSUES now...

Originally posted by giddyupalw


HAD issues :lol: Are you suggesting she doens't have any ISSUES now...

Don't they call this gross understatement?