Haleigh Cummings 5yrs old Missing

[lorettalockhorn]

Mobile home doors are not that hard to get into. The deadbolt would make it harder but not impossible. Who said the possible person came in through the door? Could have been a window. If the deadbolt was not engaged, simple to get in the door and not leave marks. I once lived in one, locked my keys in the house. Took about five minutes. That is one of the reasons I don't like mobile homes. Way too easy to break into.

Mobile homes are death traps here in Tornado Alley! I wondered about the front door; what kind of lock does it have. The perp could have come in one door and out the other. I think the point about the forced entry was due to the fact that Mistie didn't hear anything and you would expect her to have better hearing perhaps than the sleeping Lunsford grandparents (for example). I find it strange that a seventeen year old is up to tinkle after being asleep only five hours. I'm 55 and can sleep through the night. (Do your Kegels people!)

[beachbum]

Isn't missing school a lot one of the symptoms of child abuse? Sems like I read that somewhere.

The detectives need to contact the school for some information...I would be interested to know what they have to say.

[Justice Denied?]

I don't know if kindergarten is required in all states now. I know it is in GA usually around age 5. Pre K for age 4 but that is first come first served for so many slots. jmo

Regarding the folks, I grew up in the GA backwoods, and there all kinds of people out there. It is sad when so many teens quit school and have babies and don't get their education. I do hope this beautiful little girl is found and is ok.

These people are obviously ignorant, low IQ, uneducated and lacking in social graces. But that doesn't mean they harmed Haleigh. In view of Jessica, I'll reserve my judgment.

I typed the words "this child" and had to go back and change it to her name because it reminded me too much of the A's.

[lorettalockhorn]

Can be. Most of the time it is the sign of neglect. From the statute, I really don't know if she was enrolled though. If it isn't required, I would doubt it. IMOO

Nancy specifically asked about her school attendance on Monday, and the reporter said that we only know about Haleigh's schedule from Mistie on Monday night/Tuesday morning. It's going to look mighty hinky if she's not enrolled in kindergarten after her mother's statement.

[beachbum]

It could be possible. I also noticed when she was talking she feigned crying and I could see no tears on her face. But I don't think she did anything to the child. jmo

Another Susan Smith thing.....she always faked crying....

[deacon]

Mobile homes are death traps here in Tornado Alley! I wondered about the front door; what kind of lock does it have. The perp could have come in one door and out the other. I think the point about the forced entry was due to the fact that Mistie didn't hear anything and you would expect her to have better hearing perhaps than the sleeping Lunsford grandparents (for example). I find it strange that a seventeen year old is up to tinkle after being asleep only five hours. I'm 55 and can sleep through the night. (Do your Kegels people!)

I think the forced entry was probably checked at the door. That is why I think it may have been a window. Now that I am out of one I can say this, the windows can be opened with a very little sound and you can not tell they were opened. No, I am not a burglar. I just had to get in where my keys were. I did it more than once when I would work in the yard.

[deacon]

Nancy specifically asked about her school attendance on Monday, and the reporter said that we only know about Haleigh's schedule from Mistie on Monday night/Tuesday morning. It's going to look mighty hinky if she's not enrolled in kindergarten after her mother's statement.

hinky is right. A lot of this case is looking hinky. Of course, so have a lot of others.

[mu8shark]

This case really struck me just as the Caylee Anthony case has. God bless Mr. Duckett for lending his help in this, and that he gets smiled on from above for this. I'm VERY suspicious about this 17yr. old girlfriend , I think she harmed that poor child. She better hope that she didn't because if she did, I will personally WALK to Jacksonville and whip her.
I'm also flabbergasted at the amount of registered sex offenders that are located in and near that house. WTH????? Don't people check this stuff out before moving into an area?
I'll say it before and I'll say it again, it is unacceptable and unforgivable to harm a child, no matter what!
Thank you.

One of the experts on tv said it was a lower than usual number for an area. I find that really, really freaky but apparently this is not a high number.

[mu8shark]

Another Susan Smith thing.....she always faked crying....

OMG I thought the same exact thing, no tears just kind of fake little catch in her voice, just like Susan Smith. I thought the exact same thing tonight.

[deacon]

One of the experts on tv said it was a lower than usual number for an area. I find that really, really freaky but apparently this is not a high number.

Yea, the term "sex offender" covers a very large group of people who have commited different types of crimes.

[lorettalockhorn]

Registered sex offenders by state (adjusted to offenders by million):

http://www.familywatchdog.us/OffenderCountByState.asp

[SuzDuJour]

I think the young GF sounded really frightened during the 911 call and I can't figure out why the dad had her call. He sounds like he might be coaching her in the background, but when he finally picks up the phone he just starts cussing and yelling. I think he may be having her lie for him - do we know that he actually went to work and what time he actually came home? He said he passed the polygraph with flying colors, but has LE confirmed that?

I just can't get the picture out of my mind of his face getting all scrunched up in his interview when he realized he said "I'd give my life to have the life of my child back", and then he collapses to the ground. Then pops right up again.

So far, has there been any confirmation of HIS story?

[lorettalockhorn]

Yea, the term "sex offender" covers a very large group of people who have commited different types of crimes.

Right. The Family Watchdog maps are color coded so that you can pinpoint pedophiles, for instance.

[mu8shark]

I honestly don't understand this case at all....we have three different stories here...and I don't believe any of them...I feel the same way as you do Loretta I don't want to attack the crime victim's either but its just a very weird situation..I really hope Haleigh is found and is alright but my hope is running out..

The cinder block sounds staged to me for one thing. A kidnapper is coming to get a five year old child through the door, not to steal an awkward couch or get a pool table through the door, why would you need to prop open the door exactly? It just sounds staged. Also what kind of a surface would a concrete block be for fingerprints? Would it be a good source or not? I also think something is wrong with the way this story has evolved or changed. It almost sounds like the girl is trying to make her story fit something.. I realize people panic and misspeak but I don't know, I had a hinky feeling about this when they said no forced entry. And after seeing her 'crying' I just get that hmmmmm feeling. Also LE did not say she passed the lie detector test, she told reporters she felt like she passed the test or thought she had passed it. LE would not comment on the tests. As for them saying she is not a suspect for now. I have heard that a lot and it turned out a few days later, they were zeroing in on a person.I think the words for now are key.

[Zingo]

On NG tonight I noticed she had her eyes closed the whole time she was answering one question. I can't remember the ? though.

Well, the father had his eyes closed on NG last night while he answered questions. At first I took it that he was not being truthful, but then I realized that if he was working a 3rd shift, he hadn't slept in more than 24 hours, so I cut him some slack.

Still, something seems fishy about this group ... I didn't like how he kept saying, "I was at work" and "trying to make an honest living." I don't get why people say "honest living."

Anyway, I gotta go to bed now...

[lorettalockhorn]

I think the young GF sounded really frightened during the 911 call and I can't figure out why the dad had her call. He sounds like he might be coaching her in the background, but when he finally picks up the phone he just starts cussing and yelling. I think he may be having her lie for him - do we know that he actually went to work and what time he actually came home? He said he passed the polygraph with flying colors, but has LE confirmed that?

I just can't get the picture out of my mind of his face getting all scrunched up in his interview when he realized he said "I'd give my life to have the life of my child back", and then he collapses to the ground. Then pops right up again.

So far, has there been any confirmation of HIS story?

The original story that I read on the Orlando Sentinel website said that Mistie got up and discovered Haleigh missing around 3am, but the 911 call wasn't until almost 3:30 when Mr. Cummings arrived home. Why the wait? And it's ridiculous that he wouldn't have been on the phone giving the operator pertinent information such as the description. What was he doing? Mistie didn't even know Haleigh's DOB.

No confirmation that I've found on the LDTs.

[mu8shark]

I think the young GF sounded really frightened during the 911 call and I can't figure out why the dad had her call. He sounds like he might be coaching her in the background, but when he finally picks up the phone he just starts cussing and yelling. I think he may be having her lie for him - do we know that he actually went to work and what time he actually came home? He said he passed the polygraph with flying colors, but has LE confirmed that?

I just can't get the picture out of my mind of his face getting all scrunched up in his interview when he realized he said "I'd give my life to have the life of my child back", and then he collapses to the ground. Then pops right up again.

So far, has there been any confirmation of HIS story?

Well what I heard the reporter say was that LE would not confirm what the test results are. And you make a good point on the father. At first they said he was at work when it happened, but as Nancy pointed out, when was the last time an independant souce saw the child. I am not accusing but lets say something did happen to the child prior to him going to work , just for arguments sake, and the girlfriend claim she put her to bed. I am not saying it did happen to this way but they can't necessarily assume she was alive and well at 8 pm or later. Assume nothing.

[SuzDuJour]

Did the search dogs hit on anything or go any particular direction - does anyone know?

Also, if she's only 17 and has been there several months - is this allowed in Florida?? He's way older than she is, seems like statutory rape at least? That could explain some of the strangeness I sense from this guy, maybe he just doesn't want to get into trouble on that front while his daughter has honestly been taken.

I read a comment section in one of the papers online and someone said he has been known to 'prey' on young girls to take care of his children.

Don't know...just something with them both doesn't seem right to me.

[lighthousedazy]

These people are obviously ignorant, low IQ, uneducated and lacking in social graces. But that doesn't mean they harmed Haleigh. In view of Jessica, I'll reserve my judgment.

I typed the words "this child" and had to go back and change it to her name because it reminded me too much of the A's.

They are peculiar, but I don't think they harmed Haleigh either. I really believe she was kidnapped by a stranger and it looks very grim as time goes by.

[lorettalockhorn]

Did the search dogs hit on anything or go any particular direction - does anyone know?

Also, if she's only 17 and has been there several months - is this allowed in Florida?? He's way older than she is, seems like statutory rape at least? That could explain some of the strangeness I sense from this guy, maybe he just doesn't want to get into trouble on that front while his daughter has honestly been taken.

I read a comment section in one of the papers online and someone said he has been known to 'prey' on young girls to take care of his children.

Don't know...just something with them both doesn't seem right to me.

I've asked about laws in FL, my understanding is that Mistie is a minor. Some states take into consideration the age difference as a means of determining statutory rape. She seems immature to me, but I don't see her parents removing her from Cummings' home. I guess she has their blessing.

ETA: Blood hounds followed Haleigh's scent to the river, but sonar didn't reveal anything in the water. Cadaver dogs will search tomorrow.

[lighthousedazy]

Registered sex offenders by state (adjusted to offenders by million):

http://www.familywatchdog.us/OffenderCountByState.asp

I heard Oprah say once that statistically (not physically) there is 1 sex offender in every square mile of this country. If you look at some of these creeps in the Satsuma area they are very old. These people cannot be rehabilitated and should be in prison for life, imo. I live in Columbia SC now. My zipcode is 17 square miles and there are 70+ in my area.

[lorettalockhorn]

Three feet tall and 39 pounds seems very short to me. Wonder if her size had something to do with the allegation that she frequently missed school.

[STLcardfan]

I am fairly sure the father told Greta the other night the last time he seen her was at 3:45 when he got her off the school bus. Don't let the looks or IQ of these people shade your opinion. My first thought when I seen Jessica's dad was wow what a country bumkin yet he managed to get laws changed.

[mu8shark]

Three feet tall and 39 pounds seems very short to me. Wonder if her size had something to do with the allegation that she frequently missed school.

The mother said the father told her if the child missed any more school he would be arrested. What does that mean, can you get in trouble for your child having crappy attendance in school? I mean if you have doctors notes to back it up it does not make sense to me. Was he just telling her that so he could make her skip a visit or has he kept her out of school and can't prove she is sick and the state or district thinks he is contributing to some kind of truancy. Also the story the mother told about why she lost custody of the child seemed sketchy at best. There is something she is not telling. I have never heard that if you don't return a child after a visit as she said he did that the state would just let you keep them like that. I would think the father would be in trouble for doing that. She was very hesitant in some of her answers and I am not of course saying the mother knows anything about her abduction, I just think the story of why he has custody did not come out on NG.

[lighthousedazy]

I am fairly sure the father told Greta the other night the last time he seen her was at 3:45 when he got her off the school bus. Don't let the looks or IQ of these people shade your opinion. My first thought when I seen Jessica's dad was wow what a country bumkin yet he managed to get laws changed.

I hope I haven't seemed snubby. The people that I saw from the neighborhood seemed to be as good as gold. imo Abusers and pedophiles can come from every class. And Ronald Cummings was sincere and distraught and very upset that his child was missing.

[SuzDuJour]

Well what I heard the reporter say was that LE would not confirm what the test results are. And you make a good point on the father. At first they said he was at work when it happened, but as Nancy pointed out, when was the last time an independant souce saw the child. I am not accusing but lets say something did happen to the child prior to him going to work , just for arguments sake, and the girlfriend claim she put her to bed. I am not saying it did happen to this way but they can't necessarily assume she was alive and well at 8 pm or later. Assume nothing.

Actually, I hadn't thought about what could have happened BEFORE he went to work...his shift would be 7:00pm to 3:00am - is that about right? ITA with you about a confirmation of who last saw her and when!

[lorettalockhorn]

I am fairly sure the father told Greta the other night the last time he seen her was at 3:45 when he got her off the school bus. Don't let the looks or IQ of these people shade your opinion. My first thought when I seen Jessica's dad was wow what a country bumkin yet he managed to get laws changed.

I thought he works from 3pm - 3am. How did he get her off the bus while he was at work?

[mu8shark]

I am fairly sure the father told Greta the other night the last time he seen her was at 3:45 when he got her off the school bus. Don't let the looks or IQ of these people shade your opinion. My first thought when I seen Jessica's dad was wow what a country bumkin yet he managed to get laws changed.

Well the fact of whether they are smart or dumb or polished or sleazy or sophisticated or not does not really bear on my judgement as far as if they had something to do with her disappearance at all because the rich and middle classes harm their children too. But what does influence me is that the story so far does not quite add up and just because the Dad says he and the girl passed a lie detector test does not to me anyways automatically exonerate them. I am not saying they had something to do with it, just that so far I would not rule them out. Maybe LE has a clearer picture than I do though of course as it is early. I wonder if every little thing will be released to the media like in the Caylee case. Somehow I still believe Sunshine law or not there are things they can hold close to their vest, not stuff they can keep from the defense but from the public and I am anxious to see how that part of it plays out. I know in the Lunford case we did not learn everything before trial, so it makes me wonder.

[lorettalockhorn]

The mother said the father told her if the child missed any more school he would be arrested. What does that mean, can you get in trouble for your child having crappy attendance in school? I mean if you have doctors notes to back it up it does not make sense to me. Was he just telling her that so he could make her skip a visit or has he kept her out of school and can't prove she is sick and the state or district thinks he is contributing to some kind of truancy. Also the story the mother told about why she lost custody of the child seemed sketchy at best. There is something she is not telling. I have never heard that if you don't return a child after a visit as she said he did that the state would just let you keep them like that. I would think the father would be in trouble for doing that. She was very hesitant in some of her answers and I am not of course saying the mother knows anything about her abduction, I just think the story of why he has custody did not come out on NG.

When I was a caseworker, a large number of neglect (and some abuse) cases were brought to our attention due to frequent absenteeism. And not only is kindergarten mandatory in AR, but so is attendance. Even with a doc's excuse, a child can be remediated. It's difficult to tell what the FL laws are with regard to days absent.

[lorettalockhorn]

Three feet tall and 39 pounds seems very short to me. Wonder if her size had something to do with the allegation that she frequently missed school.

Answering myself here. According to the pediatric BMI calculator, Haleigh is not underweight at all.

[mu8shark]

When I was a caseworker, a large number of neglect (and some abuse) cases were brought to our attention due to frequent absenteeism. And not only is kindergarten mandatory in AR, but so is attendance. Even with a doc's excuse, a child can be remediated. It's difficult to tell what the FL laws are with regard to days absent.

Thanks Loretta good to know!

[SuzDuJour]

I thought he works from 3pm - 3am. How did he get her off the bus while he was at work?

A 12-hour shift and two little tad to take care of - quite a load for a young guy. Not to mention having to get up early to get her on a bus for school. It's an awful lot to deal with at any age.

[lorettalockhorn]

A 12-hour shift and two little tad to take care of - quite a load for a young guy. Not to mention having to get up early to get her on a bus for school. It's an awful lot to deal with at any age.

Couldn't agree more!

[mu8shark]

Actually, I hadn't thought about what could have happened BEFORE he went to work...his shift would be 7:00pm to 3:00am - is that about right? ITA with you about a confirmation of who last saw her and when!

You know what is weird is that when you follow true crime cases you kind of get a feel for certain things and you look at stories I think differently. Not saying I am right about everything of course but one of my cousins once said to me that I tended to be more suspicious and ask more questions on these cases and that I did not accept things just because someone said it was so. And I thought she was putting me down but she added 'And you turn out to be right about 95 per cent of the time." And I think I see that in others on this board, just because someone told the story a certain way does not make it so. I would not call it cynical but realistic because you have to dig a bit to find the truth sometimes. And of course I am not saying if you follow true crime you think everyone is bad or lying but I guess when you have seen the good husband, the devoted wife, the goodie, goodie daughter turn out to be a killer you start looking behind the curtain a bit.

[STLcardfan]

I thought he works from 3pm - 3am. How did he get her off the bus while he was at work?

I was thinking the same thing when he said that. I agree something doesn't add up with these two. I hope they didn't have anything to do with this. The thought of another parent killing their child is just to much.

[lorettalockhorn]

Two things from GVS, 2/12/09:

...GRIFFIS: The only thing we know about any neighbors is there were some kids that lived next door that Haleigh and Junior played with, and they were seen out playing in the yard around 5:00 o'clock yesterday -- or Monday evening. I guess it was Monday evening. I can't even remember anymore. The days are just running together now.

VAN SUSTEREN: Crystal, the father of your child was at work when, apparently, Haleigh disappeared. What kind of work does he do, Crystal?

SHEFFIELD: I'm not sure. All I know is he runs a crane.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you know, Marie, why he was out until 3:00 o'clock in the morning? I mean, what kind of work would have him out that late, or that early, depending on how you characterize it?

GRIFFIS: He -- we was ere told he worked from 3:00 to 3:00, so I supposed it's a 12-hour shift. And he's a crane operator working for a place called PDM Bridge (ph)...

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,491368,00.html

[lorettalockhorn]

Nancy Grace, 2/12/09:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../12/ng.01.html

Jane Velez-Mitchell,2/12/09:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP...2/ijvm.01.html

[Native Alien]

On the door lock:

This is from the transcript at the above link on GVS:

VAN SUSTEREN: Ronald, let me ask you the same question. What's your theory tonight? And I realize this is a very fluid situation, but what's your -- what do you think is the trail we should go down to look for this child? What do you think happened?

RONALD CUMMINGS: Somebody broke into my house and stole my daughter. I know because I specifically locked those doors before I left for work, and my child cannot unlock the deadbolt on that door because I have got the hole cut in a specific place where you have to force the door shut to get it to lock all the way. And I know it was locked all the way. I checked it myself. And she does not open the door for strangers or wander alone in the dark, nothing like that. So somebody broke into my home and stole my child.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was the door broken when you came home? Was that lock broken when you came home?

RONALD CUMMINGS: No. Obviously, a crowbar or something was used. I'm not sure. You'll have to speak more with the detectives about what was used or how it was done. I'm not sure.

As to the girlfriend, first of all if it was a brick that is one thing, but it was a concrete block, commonly referred to as a cinderblock. I would think that living in the state of Florida she would know the difference. Secondly, I don't know how she could have slept thru someone entering the house with the noise that they would have made breaking in that door.

The mother said that the 1st court notice for the custody hearing went to a wrong address. They held that against her when it came to the second hearing.

Kindergarden here in Ohio is a half day, in some places only 3 hours long. So it could have been earlier than 3:45 when he got the little girl off the bus.

[deacon]

On the door lock:

This is from the transcript at the above link on GVS:

VAN SUSTEREN: Ronald, let me ask you the same question. What's your theory tonight? And I realize this is a very fluid situation, but what's your -- what do you think is the trail we should go down to look for this child? What do you think happened?

RONALD CUMMINGS: Somebody broke into my house and stole my daughter. I know because I specifically locked those doors before I left for work, and my child cannot unlock the deadbolt on that door because I have got the hole cut in a specific place where you have to force the door shut to get it to lock all the way. And I know it was locked all the way. I checked it myself. And she does not open the door for strangers or wander alone in the dark, nothing like that. So somebody broke into my home and stole my child.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was the door broken when you came home? Was that lock broken when you came home?

RONALD CUMMINGS: No. Obviously, a crowbar or something was used. I'm not sure. You'll have to speak more with the detectives about what was used or how it was done. I'm not sure.

As to the girlfriend, first of all if it was a brick that is one thing, but it was a concrete block, commonly referred to as a cinderblock. I would think that living in the state of Florida she would know the difference. Secondly, I don't know how she could have slept thru someone entering the house with the noise that they would have made breaking in that door.
The mother said that the 1st court notice for the custody hearing went to a wrong address. They held that against her when it came to the second hearing.

Kindergarden here in Ohio is a half day, in some places only 3 hours long. So it could have been earlier than 3:45 when he got the little girl off the bus.

But from what I read, the door showed no signs of forced entry. So it would not have been broken down.

The question I had about kindergarten wasn't about time but was it required in Florida so the father would be in trouble for her not being in school as he was reported to have said.

[Native Alien]

I lived in Florida some 20 years ago and it was required then where we were. Both of my daughters went a half a day to kindengarden.

So I think that the answer would be yes to your question deacon.