Caylee Anthony Case Discussion Only

[lorettalockhorn]

I thought the same thing. If they really believed Caylee was alive and "safe" in the care of a nanny (kidnapped or not) why would Cindy be writing suicide notes? That just doesn't make sense. Another lie she didn't think through.

The other night NG was sparring with a psychologist who termed Cindy narcissistic. Nancy disagreed telling the lady Dr. that nothing Cindy has done was to benefit her in any way. I can't believe Nancy can be so blind sometimes. I wanted to jump through the television screen. Cindy may be the most self-centered, self-serving, self-absorbed individual I have ever seen. I think she has both Casey and Scott Peterson beat in those categories. Absolutely EVERYTHING she does or says is "all about ME". Unless I'm dead wrong, that's the basic definition of narcissism.

Totally agree! Well, Cindy's former buddy Oprah might rival her for self-serving! :hat: The whole idea of supporting Casey while collateralizing Caylee and The Alibi Tour is ABOUT G&C! They don't want to lose their daughter. Hellllllllllooooooo They lost her long ago.

And was thinking about this while mowing earlier; the more that G&C go on and on about Casey's being Mother of the Year blah, blah, blah, the MORE sociopathic it makes Casey look. Which in a way explains the premeditation aspects of this crime: she plotted to make mommy and daddy think she was the perfect mother while all the time despising Caylee for interrupting her life.

[Gatordog]

Why would Casey need help? I don't understand that part at all. It's not like she took Caylee's lifeless body off to some obscure place and buried her 6 feet under.

Shady, IMO she was starting her plot to frame others for Caylee's murder. I watched the hearing on tv and she was venemous to LE. She wasn't going to offer any help without it benefitting her in some way.

Gator

[Gatordog]

If you haven't already watched the interviews, here they are. You better take some maalox before watching.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/19259035/detail.html

[One2Snoop]

This is a link to The Petition Site, by Care2. Hundreds of people (hopefully more) are signing a petition to have all media oulets cease having the Anthonys on their shows for interviews to spew their lies and innuendos.

Check this out, you might just want to sign it! The goal is 10,000 signatures...They are now at #264!

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/851674974

Loved your additions to the many faces of Casey LOL. :beer:

:seeya: I'll sign the petition! Thanks OS

[lorettalockhorn]

OS, thanks for the petition link, and floved your version of the truth that G&C are afraid to tell.

You betcha you can pray, Cindy. And you should. After lying under oath. You too Georgie.

[Native Alien]

I am wondering when someone is going to hit G and C with obstruction charges among other things.

[Native Alien]

"When I saw Casey (in July), I could tell something was wrong," said Cindy Anthony. "I don't know how I would react any differently. After I made the first 911 call, Casey thanked me in the car because she said I did something that she couldn't do, which was go to the police."

This statement has bothered me every since I heard her make it. I couldn't figure out why it bothered me so much. Then I realized that she lied again in direct contradiction of the facts. The first 911 call was made from the Anthony's house.

Am I wrong in my thinking on this?

[Native Alien]

So per NG the SA has added a toolmark expert to the witness list. Thoughts?

The knives made marks and a toolmark expert could say that a certain knife left a certain pattern when used to cut things, like duct tape or to break into the shed.

[One2Snoop]

"When I saw Casey (in July), I could tell something was wrong," said Cindy Anthony. "I don't know how I would react any differently. After I made the first 911 call, Casey thanked me in the car because she said I did something that she couldn't do, which was go to the police."

This statement has bothered me every since I heard her make it. I couldn't figure out why it bothered me so much. Then I realized that she lied again in direct contradiction of the facts. The first 911 call was made from the Anthony's house.

Am I wrong in my thinking on this?

IIRC they were sitting in the car when she made the 911 call from her cell phone.

[One2Snoop]

Missing Florida Girl's Grandmother Asks Police to Arrest Daughter for 'Grand Theft' in 911 Call

The grandmother of a missing 2-year-old Florida girl told a 911 dispatcher that she wanted to press charges against her daughter for "grand theft" after she learned of the tot's disappearance, according to a new recording released Friday.

A frantic Cindy Anthony can also be heard threatening to file a court order against her daughter, Casey Marie Anthony, to get Casey's little girl Caylee Marie Anthony away from her.

The new tape released Friday was of the very first call Cindy Anthony made to 911, which was handled by Orlando police. They then rerouted her to the Orange County Sheriff's Department, which is investigating the case. In all, Cindy Anthony had three conversations with 911 dispatchers July 15.

"I have a 22-year-old person that has, um, grand theft sitting in my auto with me," she said in the first. "My car was stolen. We've retrieved it; today we found out where it was at. We've retrieved it, I've got that. And I've got affidavits from my banking account. I want to bring her in. I want to press charges."

After the emergency responder told her she will be transferred to Orange County sheriffs, Cindy Anthony can be heard warning her daughter Casey in the background.

"My next thing will be child's thing and we'll have a court order to get her if that's what you wanna play. We'll do it and you'll never..." she said.

Casey's reply is inaudible, to which Cindy Anthony retorted: "Well, then, you have ... no, I'm not giving you another day. I've given you a month."

Click here to listen to the first 911 call on MyFOXOrlando.com.

Click here to listen to the other 911 calls on MyFOXOrlando.com.

Cindy Anthony said in the calls that her daughter Casey had just admitted that Caylee had been missing for about a month and she didn't know where she was.

"I have someone here that I need to be arrested ... in my home," Cindy Anthony said in the second call. She told the dispatcher that she was referring to her daughter and that it involved the disappearance of a toddler. The 911 responder asked her why she wanted her daughter taken into custody.

"For stealing an auto and stealing money," she replied. "I already spoke with someone. ... I was going to drive her to the police station and no one's open. They said they would bring a deputy to my home when I got home to call them."

Click here for a transcript of the first 911 call.
Click here for a transcript of the second 911 call.

Click here for a transcript of the third 911 call.
Go to the link to for transcripts...

snip
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,391001,00.html

[One2Snoop]

BOMBSHELL Tonight! after months of trying, Lucy and John David STILL refuse to go to sleep at night. Could the fertility treatments have given them the DNA of a bat?

Breaking news tonight in the desperate hunt for a good night's sleep! Six months of trying culminates when I stumble across a dirty diaper, which I triple-bagged like it was trash. Manner of disposal? Diaper Genie!


http://i23.tinypic.com/308wgv6.jpg

she has GOT to change that Caylee opener!

http://i39.tinypic.com/xfavip.jpg

[Native Alien]

I missed a lot...any chance there's marks on the bones?

I seem to remember them talking about the marks on the bones that they thought were from animals but that is another possibility that they could be double checking.

It could also be that there were marks on the bones that they have recovered that they couldn't identify the source of and that is why they brought the toolmark person in. But that is just a stretch in my mind.

[deputydi]

"When I saw Casey (in July), I could tell something was wrong," said Cindy Anthony. "I don't know how I would react any differently. After I made the first 911 call, Casey thanked me in the car because she said I did something that she couldn't do, which was go to the police."

This statement has bothered me every since I heard her make it. I couldn't figure out why it bothered me so much. Then I realized that she lied again in direct contradiction of the facts. The first 911 call was made from the Anthony's house.

Am I wrong in my thinking on this?
I don't know if they were in the car, in the house or standing in the middle of a busy highway -- that gracious thank you from Casey never happened. It's just another figment of Cindy's imagination. Remember, Cindy had just found her daughter WITHOUT Caylee and Casey refused to tell her where the baby was. Now, realistically, what do you think happened??? We've ALL seen the wicked, angry side of Cindy. Can you imagine the interrogation -- she must have grilled Casey for answers the entire time they were in the car. We've also seen Casey's temper and I don't believe she meekly "thanked" her mother for being "so brave" in calling 911. That whole story stinks worse than Casey's car.

[Native Alien]

Hahhahhhah!

"...From the bank account"? What happened to 'never took money'?

Man they just keep piling up the lies. This whole fiasco is going to come tumbling down around someone's head at some point and it is going to get really ugly really fast if you ask me.

Look out Conway and Baez....run everyone that might have to get involved in this case. I can't believe that some of the "dream team" hasn't abandoned a sinking ship already.

[Native Alien]

I don't know if they were in the car, in the house or standing in the middle of a busy highway -- that gracious thank you from Casey never happened. It's just another figment of Cindy's imagination. Remember, Cindy had just found her daughter WITHOUT Caylee and Casey refused to tell her where the baby was. Now, realistically, what do you think happened??? We've ALL seen the wicked, angry side of Cindy. Can you imagine the interrogation -- she must have grilled Casey for answers the entire time they were in the car. We've also seen Casey's temper and I don't believe she meekly "thanked" her mother for being "so brave" in calling 911. That whole story stinks worse than Casey's car.

Was Amy still in the car at that point? Cause she could definitely refute Cindy's testimony in that case.

[Native Alien]

Strange time of night for thoughts to be crossing my mind but here goes.

Is it possible that the Anthony's are purposely lying every other, (well, okay every word in some cases), out of their mouths because they think that they will get out of being called to testify because they have ruined their own creditability?

[deputydi]

[QUOTE=old_soul;9185701]

BOMBSHELL Tonight! after months of trying, Lucy and John David STILL refuse to go to sleep at night. Could the fertility treatments have given them the DNA of a bat?

Breaking news tonight in the desperate hunt for a good night's sleep! Six months of trying culminates when I stumble across a dirty diaper, which I triple-bagged like it was trash. Manner of disposal? Diaper Genie!


http://i23.tinypic.com/308wgv6.jpg

she has GOT to change that Caylee opener!
Now THIS is funny.

[Native Alien]

I'm glad they are double checking if that's what they're doing. I trained on some skeletal remains that had been cannibalized and it would be real easy to not recognize cut marks without training. So here's to an expert making sure! Maybe they found marks that made them go for the DP-the timing works.

(ps, not saying Caylee was cannibalized, of course! Just that cut marks are cut marks)

There is also a vet on their witness list I think because of there being what they think or thought was animal bite marks on some of the recovered bones. Could be that their vet is having them double check some of what he thought was animal bite marks on the bones.

There is also the point that what they might have first thought were animal bite marks weren't and now they are checking to see if the marks were made by some kind of tool.

[lorettalockhorn]

I am wondering when someone is going to hit G and C with obstruction charges among other things.

And when! Praying that it's soon and they will STHU.

http://i25.tinypic.com/op349c.jpg

[lorettalockhorn]

[QUOTE=old_soul;9185701]

BOMBSHELL Tonight! after months of trying, Lucy and John David STILL refuse to go to sleep at night. Could the fertility treatments have given them the DNA of a bat?

Breaking news tonight in the desperate hunt for a good night's sleep! Six months of trying culminates when I stumble across a dirty diaper, which I triple-bagged like it was trash. Manner of disposal? Diaper Genie!


http://i23.tinypic.com/308wgv6.jpg

she has GOT to change that Caylee opener!

LMAO!!!!!

Lucy and John David have been bred and raised to misunderstand the time continuum so that they'll nevah, nevah realize that they were conceived out of wedlock. Like *GASP* so many of the children/victims of crimes she reports on were. (Of course only some of those baby mama's get bashed. Got to maintain that double standard!)

[One2Snoop]

Casey Anthony case meets TV sweeps for a perfect media storm

Hal Boedeker | Sentinel Columnist
5:19 PM EDT, April 23, 2009

WESH-Channel 2 promises to tell us how Casey Anthony could walk away from a murder indictment. WKMG-Channel 6 says it will "break some new ground" in the case against Anthony.

And public relations experts are baffled by the young woman's parents, George and Cindy Anthony, who blew an interview set up with Oprah Winfrey in favor of a two-part appearance on CBS' Early Show.

This is what happens when the Casey Anthony case meets television's May ratings period, which began Thursday.

"We're going to be breaking some new ground in the Casey Anthony case in the next few weeks," WKMG news director Steve Hyvonen said. "Tony Pipitone will do investigations."

Like it or not, the case promises to be a recurring topic in May, and WESH wasted no time. As The Early Show concluded its two-part interview with the Anthonys, WESH countered with an exclusive interview with Anthony attorney Jose Baez.

"Obviously, what happened in the woods is critical," Baez told WESH, alluding to a wooded area where the remains of Caylee Marie Anthony were discovered in December.

WESH reporter Bob Kealing conducted a half-hour interview with Baez this week that will be spread among other reports in coming weeks.

"He's not doing multiple interviews," Kealing said. "There will be follow-up material. We've made a commitment to cover the story in sweeps and non-sweeps."

In Thursday's report, Kealing examined how Anthony might be acquitted of the murder of her daughter, Caylee. In a preview, Kealing said the spot where Caylee's remains were found has become the key battleground in the case. He also said the case "will undoubtedly be one of the biggest trials Central Florida has ever seen."

WFTV-Channel 9 news director Bob Jordan, however, sees some Casey withdrawal.

"There's some fatigue in this story," he said. "Viewers are interested when there's a significant new development. I think they're tired of anything that smells like a rehash."

Events in the case will dictate how much WFTV does, Jordan said.

Jordan and his competitors stress that new technology has made obsolete the traditional, four-times-a-year ratings periods known as "sweeps." Local People Meters supply detailed ratings data the next day, so every month becomes sweeps month.

But sweeps remain a big deal in small markets -- unlike No. 19 Orlando -- that don't have the Local People Meters.

Oprah Winfrey knows the importance of sweeps. She announced an exclusive interview with the Anthonys for the ratings period. But when they turned up elsewhere, the Winfrey people said the chat was off.

The Anthonys' approach confounded public-relations pros.

"If you're trying to reach a larger audience, it's tough to beat Oprah," said Mason Moore, director of public relations at Fry Hammond Barr in Orlando. "If they had done the interview with Oprah, they'd be on the Internet, on Twitter. They would have reached a ton of people."

Losing the Oprah forum was a big deal, said Ron Sachs, who specializes in crisis management at Ron Sachs Communications in Tallahassee.

"An interview with her is the single most important venue you can book," Sachs said. "She is beloved. Most journalists are not beloved. Oprah is the nation's opinion shaper. She is probably the single most important influence, below the president of the United States."

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/orl-casey-anthony-sweeps-042309,0,7713675.story

[One2Snoop]

Baez: How Casey Anthony Could Go Free
Attorney: 'There is so much that is unknown'

POSTED: 9:12 pm EDT April 23, 2009
UPDATED: 11:24 pm EDT April 23, 2009

ORLANDO, Fla. -- Attorney Jose Baez talked about several key parts of his defense of Casey Anthony during an exclusive interview with WESH 2 News.

"There is so much that is unknown, and we have to focus on all of it," Baez said in an interview with WESH 2's Bob Kealing.

Anthony is charged with first-degree murder in connection with the death of her daughter, Caylee, whose remains were found in December 2008 in woods not far from the family's home.

Baez and other attorneys interviewed by WESH 2 said the woods where Caylee's remains were discovered are a central place in which much of the case could revolve.

Caylee was missing almost six months before her body was found. And, Baez said, "They don't know how Caylee passed away. They don't know when Caylee passed away,"

Baez and other defense attorneys say prosecutors have not definitively tied Casey Anthony to Caylee's remains along Suburban Drive. They have to prove that Casey dumped the body there before entering state custody and that they remained there for almost six months.

"That's going to become one of the major battlegrounds in the case," said defense attorney Richard Hornsby.

Thomas Luka, an attorney for Casey Anthony's brother, Lee, agreed: "That would be one of the first things I would want to pursue."

Baez also questioned the forensic evidence in the case.

He plans to vigorously attack the single hair found in Casey Anthony's car trunk that prosecutors say is proof a decomposing body was in there. He said his own expert Henry Lee found 17 hairs in the trunk that showed no signs of decomposition.

Baez also will raise questions about the air test that a lab said showed evidence of human decomposition.

"It's not science that's fully accepted within the scientific community," Baez said "It's science that's not been verified. There's absolutely nothing to gauge this science by, so, therefore, it should not be used when someone's life is at stake.

Prosecutors plan to seek the death penalty in the case.

A spokeswoman for State Attorney Lawson Lamar said, "We don't respond to anything about this case outside the courtroom."

(Program note: On Friday at 11 p.m., Bob Kealing will talk with Baez about what was going on during the period before Caylee was reported missing.)

http://www.wesh.com/news/19266303/detail.html

[mu8shark]

[QUOTE=javahog;9185711]
Now THIS is funny.Isn't that just the funniest thing? All of you guys are making me laugh, I love Java's after replys to the Anthony interviews. George should be proud of his lying, thieving, puking, public peeing, trampy daughter. Who wouldn't be?:eek: Sorry the credit for that funny I believe goes to Old Soul, I think I read the poster's name wrong.

[One2Snoop]

Mom: Casey Has Shown Little Emotion
Anthonys Give Exclusive Interview To CBS 'Early Show'

POSTED: Thursday, April 23, 2009
UPDATED: 9:01 pm EDT April 23, 2009


snip...
Parts of the interview, in which Cindy Anthony defends here daughter, were not shown.

"No one knows what they would do when something so terrifying happens to you....in a panic or whatever," Cindy Anthony said.

The Anthony's admitted their daughter has shown little emotion since the disappearance of her daughter.

"Everybody reacts differently to tragedy. I am not Casey. I don't know what she was feeling. I can't judge and I'm not going to pre-judge," Cindy Anthony said.

When asked if she wished she had called 911 sooner, Cindy Anthony said she called for help as soon as she could.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/19259035/detail.html#-

[mu8shark]

I'm thinking about all of these tv interviews and I wonder if the Anthony are getting bad advice or if maybe more likely they are not taking anybody's advice, because you know Cindy knows better, or she thinks she does. I also can't help but think of how differently the Anthonys would be perceived if they would have just come out and pleaded for Caylee's safe return, ask for privacy(not saying they would of got it) and said they would stand by their daughter. Then if they had something to offer in court that exonerated Casey or threw up reasonable doubt, maybe at least one or two jurors might listen to them and think they were decent, reasonable people caught in a bad situation. . As it stands now , if they had a video of the supposed gorgeous , rich nanny kidnapping Caylee and holding Casey down, the jury would automatically think it was doctored. Their cred is shot! By the time they get done testifying , people will just think it is that lying family again. Not that I care at if it will help sink Casey because she deserves to go down , but can they really think they are actually helping her. ??? I guess in Anthony world anything they have previously said should be forgotten or we should believe it in reverse.

[One2Snoop]

I'd love to take credit, but...I think it was Old Soul that wrote that, though it might also be Snoop...(Nancy's diaper bombshell, though::biggrin:)

Anyone else note that the quote function on the site is whackerdoo?

Yes and its an easy fix :seeya: - delete the second quote tag before posting...

Looks like this...

[QUOTE = javahog; 9185752] Delete this one -> [quote =mu8shark; 9185748]

Sorry can't take any credit for the posted humor LOL but sure did enjoy reading it! :beer:

[mu8shark]

Baez: How Casey Anthony Could Go Free
Attorney: 'There is so much that is unknown'

POSTED: 9:12 pm EDT April 23, 2009
UPDATED: 11:24 pm EDT April 23, 2009

ORLANDO, Fla. -- Attorney Jose Baez talked about several key parts of his defense of Casey Anthony during an exclusive interview with WESH 2 News.

"There is so much that is unknown, and we have to focus on all of it," Baez said in an interview with WESH 2's Bob Kealing.
Anthony is charged with first-degree murder in connection with the death of her daughter, Caylee, whose remains were found in December 2008 in woods not far from the family's home.

Baez and other attorneys interviewed by WESH 2 said the woods where Caylee's remains were discovered are a central place in which much of the case could revolve.

Caylee was missing almost six months before her body was found. And, Baez said, "They don't know how Caylee passed away. They don't know when Caylee passed away,"

Baez and other defense attorneys say prosecutors have not definitively tied Casey Anthony to Caylee's remains along Suburban Drive. They have to prove that Casey dumped the body there before entering state custody and that they remained there for almost six months.

"That's going to become one of the major battlegrounds in the case," said defense attorney Richard Hornsby.

Thomas Luka, an attorney for Casey Anthony's brother, Lee, agreed: "That would be one of the first things I would want to pursue."

Baez also questioned the forensic evidence in the case.

He plans to vigorously attack the single hair found in Casey Anthony's car trunk that prosecutors say is proof a decomposing body was in there. He said his own expert Henry Lee found 17 hairs in the trunk that showed no signs of decomposition.

Baez also will raise questions about the air test that a lab said showed evidence of human decomposition.

"It's not science that's fully accepted within the scientific community," Baez said "It's science that's not been verified. There's absolutely nothing to gauge this science by, so, therefore, it should not be used when someone's life is at stake.

Prosecutors plan to seek the death penalty in the case.

A spokeswoman for State Attorney Lawson Lamar said, "We don't respond to anything about this case outside the courtroom."

(Program note: On Friday at 11 p.m., Bob Kealing will talk with Baez about what was going on during the period before Caylee was reported missing.)

http://www.wesh.com/news/19266303/detail.html Here's what we do know though the car smelled like a dead body, nobody else had that car, Casey did not report her daughter missing for 31 days, her mother finally did, while her daughter was supposedly kidnapping, she partied like it was 1999 and got a BEAUTIFUL LIFE TATTOO. The story she told was complete and utter B.S. And Jose's contention we don't know how or when she was killed, so what?? So under Baez rules we only convict on murders where we know every single detail. He is living in a fantasy world. You never know all the details, in every single case there are things that we don't know and don't make sense and murderers get convicted. Can I just say again that Janie Weintraub is absurd? While I am venting??Tonight she said, so she lied about the nanny, what does that have to do with anything? If I were a defense lawyer I would pay attention to how most jurors think. Number one jurors know when people make up big elaborate lies to the police, it is is because they have something to hide most of the time. And secondly, Janie enlightened us that the phrase that Cindy let fly in the voice mail about Casey had to have had help refers to help as in childcare or a babysiter.:rolleyes: Come again!, this is after Cindy realizes there was no job(Which in my opinion she knew much sooner) Janie says we take it out of context but the sentences before and after do not relate to childcare. Cindy says no matter what you think the scenario is and then after that she says, There should be others who have knowledge of this. While I realize I am paraphrasing, you get the general jist, she is not talking about other people who know she had child care or other child care scenarios. And I also realized tonight that most of the time Janie uses the attack the police strategy, tonight she said something to the effect that the police were bullies and the other night she referred to evidence the police made up. I wish JVM would not have her on.

[One2Snoop]

Here's what we do know though the car smelled like a dead body, nobody else had that car, Casey did not report her daughter missing for 31 days, her mother finally did, while her daughter was supposedly kidnapping, she partied like it was 1999 and got a BEAUTIFUL LIFE TATTOO. The story she told was complete and utter B.S. And Jose's contention we don't know how or when she was killed, so what?? So under Baez rules we only convict on murders where we know every single detail. He is living in a fantasy world. You never know all the details, in every single case there are things that we don't know and don't make sense and murderers get convicted. Can I just say again that Janie Weintraub is absurd? While I am venting??Tonight she said, so she lied about the nanny, what does that have to do with anything? If I were a defense lawyer I would pay attention to how most jurors think. Number one jurors know when people make up big elaborate lies to the police, it is is because they have something to hide most of the time. And secondly, Janie enlightened us that the phrase that Cindy let fly in the voice mail about Casey had to have had help refers to help as in childcare or a babysiter.:rolleyes: Come again!, this is after Cindy realizes there was no job(Which in my opinion she knew much sooner) Janie says we take it out of context but the sentences before and after do not relate to childcare. Cindy says no matter what you think the scenario is and then after that she says, There should be others who have knowledge of this. While I realize I am paraphrasing, you get the general jist, she is not talking about other people who know she had child care or other child care scenarios. And I also realized tonight that most of the time Janie uses the attack the police strategy, tonight she said something to the effect that the police were bullies and the other night she referred to evidence the police made up. I wish JVM would not have her on.

No one knew exactly how and when Laci Peterson was killed and SP was still convicted. I believe Baez is just blowing hot air and hoping to reach a potential juror with some sort of reasonable doubt. Think it will work? I don't.

[mu8shark]

Baez: How Casey Anthony Could Go Free
Attorney: 'There is so much that is unknown'

POSTED: 9:12 pm EDT April 23, 2009
UPDATED: 11:24 pm EDT April 23, 2009

ORLANDO, Fla. -- Attorney Jose Baez talked about several key parts of his defense of Casey Anthony during an exclusive interview with WESH 2 News.

"There is so much that is unknown, and we have to focus on all of it," Baez said in an interview with WESH 2's Bob Kealing.(Better be focusing on what we do know, she did not report her daughter missing, she made up a nanny after she googled the episode of One TRee Hill where the nanny stole a child. she googled, neck breaking, household weapons, and how to make chloroform, her trunk was saturated with it, she partied like it was 1999, she got THAT tattoo in celebration, she borrowed a shovel coincidentally after Caylee went missing. The duct tape, trash bag, laundry bag, stickers and blankie all can be placed in the Anthony house and while you can argue that some of this stuff was taken to the nanny, you don't throw duct tape and trash bags and laundry bags in a backpack to go to the babysitter. )

Anthony is charged with first-degree murder in connection with the death of her daughter, Caylee, whose remains were found in December 2008 in woods not far from the family's home.

Baez and other attorneys interviewed by WESH 2 said the woods where Caylee's remains were discovered are a central place in which much of the case could revolve.

Caylee was missing almost six months before her body was found. And, Baez said, "They don't know how Caylee passed away. They don't know when Caylee passed away,"( And this means what? That if we don't know every single detail, your client is not guilty. do we reward people for being furtive and sneaky and murdering in secret? They did not know how Laci Peterson passed away, but it did not make a bit of difference. ))

Baez and other defense attorneys say prosecutors have not definitively tied Casey Anthony to Caylee's remains along Suburban Drive. They have to prove that Casey dumped the body there before entering state custody and that they remained there for almost six months.(And if Casey had help moving the body she is less culpable?)

"That's going to become one of the major battlegrounds in the case," said defense attorney Richard Hornsby.

Thomas Luka, an attorney for Casey Anthony's brother, Lee, agreed: "That would be one of the first things I would want to pursue."

Baez also questioned the forensic evidence in the case.

He plans to vigorously attack the single hair found in Casey Anthony's car trunk that prosecutors say is proof a decomposing body was in there. He said his own expert Henry Lee found 17 hairs in the trunk that showed no signs of decomposition.(Wait a miinute did they not say these were unidentifed hairs? So why would we expect all 17 to be from a dead body?. Obviously there were not other dead bodies back there. Also what if all 17 were from Caylee? All it would mean is that possibly she was put in the trunk alive and died there or some of the other hairs were deposited there at difference times. Lee is not going to be able to say that all 17 and the decomposed hair were put there at the very same time, Impossible. This means nothing.)

Baez also will raise questions about the air test that a lab said showed evidence of human decomposition.(Alright so then why did Cindy, George, the tow yard guy, a police detective, two cadaver dogs all point to a dead body and Casey in her text refers to something dying in her car? Curious coincidence ?. I think given all that I find the air test credible. )

"It's not science that's fully accepted within the scientific community," Baez said "It's science that's not been verified. There's absolutely nothing to gauge this science by, so, therefore, it should not be used when someone's life is at stake.

Prosecutors plan to seek the death penalty in the case.

A spokeswoman for State Attorney Lawson Lamar said, "We don't respond to anything about this case outside the courtroom."

(Program note: On Friday at 11 p.m., Bob Kealing will talk with Baez about what was going on during the period before Caylee was reported missing.)

http://www.wesh.com/news/19266303/detail.html All of this can be rebutted !

[mu8shark]

And I can't wait to hear him explain things that happened after Caylee went missing, why his client bought scantie panties, Jackie O sunglasses and beer with stolen money. It would be one thing to steal in desperation and pay a private detective or have money to pay Zanny off , but a shopping spree at Target, how does this help Caylee, remember lie , steal , cheat to find her daughter pffft. And how is he going to explain her partying and getting a Beautiful Life tattoo. ? Will he say it was in honor of Caylee? If so it suggests Mommy knew she was dead. And what about that call on July 15 that never took place where she talked about her books and shoes? Pftt....Also why do they keep saying she was afraid of someone? Don't you have to identify the someone she was afraid of to make it credible, like have threatening emails or calls or name someone in this theory? Even Cindy, when asked who said, "I can't tell you that "because she does not have a name to give police because it is B.S. Jose better do better than that. It sounds like when you ask a little kid something, they blurt out "Well just because...."

[One2Snoop]

we are just in defense spin mode now in my opine. So many convicted on much much less-it's a no brainer as far as i am concerned and when defense puts out this garbage thats pretty much all it is-just a weak case on their part-they are grasping at anything-they are drowning and they know it. Moo

all of this can be rebutted !

ita!

[Native Alien]

This case could be wrapped up in about 4 hrs.-3.75 hrs. for the prosecution and .25 for the defense. That would be in the real world but since this is so high profile. MOO

I totally agree with you.

[Gatordog]

It gets better and better! Cindy Anthony now states that SHE cancelled out on Oprah, not the other way around. Hold on to your seats, because this is going to rock you right out - her reason for cancelling on Oprah: Integrity! http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-laughing021.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)


http://www.clickorlando.com/news/19269332/detail.html

Good think Nawny is not by her computer or she'd spew her cawwfee again. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-laughing017.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)

[Gatordog]

Holy bajeez i just watched the Ant's interview's???? I get when they fall into the abnormal-which they pretty much have from day 1. I dont get this new normal??? This is just so abnormal normal. Either they have both had a lobotamy or someone has locked them in a room for weeks and de-programmed them. Ant's normal???? this is really strange and no sign of a drug haze??? :eek:

Beem, that's why I called this phase, "Her Serene Highness" and the most frightening. It's not a normal state for her which means she's thinking and trying her hardest to be deceitful and plotting something diabolical. Not just her normal frenzied state of ranting and raving.

Did you catch George being apprehensive and waiting for her response to questions before he would reply to questions that were directed to him. No way was he going to say something that was going to set her off later. :punch:

Gator

[Gatordog]

Here's what we do know though the car smelled like a dead body, nobody else had that car, Casey did not report her daughter missing for 31 days, her mother finally did, while her daughter was supposedly kidnapping, she partied like it was 1999 and got a BEAUTIFUL LIFE TATTOO. The story she told was complete and utter B.S. And Jose's contention we don't know how or when she was killed, so what?? So under Baez rules we only convict on murders where we know every single detail. He is living in a fantasy world. You never know all the details, in every single case there are things that we don't know and don't make sense and murderers get convicted. Can I just say again that Janie Weintraub is absurd? While I am venting??Tonight she said, so she lied about the nanny, what does that have to do with anything? If I were a defense lawyer I would pay attention to how most jurors think. Number one jurors know when people make up big elaborate lies to the police, it is is because they have something to hide most of the time. And secondly, Janie enlightened us that the phrase that Cindy let fly in the voice mail about Casey had to have had help refers to help as in childcare or a babysiter.:rolleyes: Come again!, this is after Cindy realizes there was no job(Which in my opinion she knew much sooner) Janie says we take it out of context but the sentences before and after do not relate to childcare. Cindy says no matter what you think the scenario is and then after that she says, There should be others who have knowledge of this. While I realize I am paraphrasing, you get the general jist, she is not talking about other people who know she had child care or other child care scenarios. And I also realized tonight that most of the time Janie uses the attack the police strategy, tonight she said something to the effect that the police were bullies and the other night she referred to evidence the police made up. I wish JVM would not have her on.

Janie Weintraub also gets on my last nerve with her ridiculous statements. "She lied about the nanny - what does that prove." It proves that no one took her daugher. It proves that only one person could have killed Caylee. Boy, if I was ever in trouble, the last attorney I would seek would be Weintraub. Maybe that's why she's always on TV, she doesn't have any clients (and it's not for a lack of crime in Miami!).

Gator

[Gatordog]

And I can't wait to hear him explain things that happened after Caylee went missing, why his client bought scantie panties, Jackie O sunglasses and beer with stolen money. It would be one thing to steal in desperation and pay a private detective or have money to pay Zanny off , but a shopping spree at Target, how does this help Caylee, remember lie , steal , cheat to find her daughter pffft. And how is he going to explain her partying and getting a Beautiful Life tattoo. ? Will he say it was in honor of Caylee? If so it suggests Mommy knew she was dead. And what about that call on July 15 that never took place where she talked about her books and shoes? Pftt....Also why do they keep saying she was afraid of someone? Don't you have to identify the someone she was afraid of to make it credible, like have threatening emails or calls or name someone in this theory? Even Cindy, when asked who said, "I can't tell you that "because she does not have a name to give police because it is B.S. Jose better do better than that. It sounds like when you ask a little kid something, they blurt out "Well just because...."


And, I just thought of it - she didn't even steal to buy gasoline so she could look for the Nanny and Caylee. As for her being afraid of someone. You bet she was scared, in fact the word she used was "petrified". She said she was petrified of what her mother would do to her if she found out what happened.

Gator

[Gatordog]

Once Jose produces the script and the nanny, it will all become clear, I'm sure.

Especially went the print on the script matches the printer in the Anthony house. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-basic/slaphead.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)

Gator

[Woostock]

OK folks
I want to know Did the Casey Anthony apple fall far from the Cindy Anthony tree???? Cindy is whacked and getting worse by the day....she cancelled OW sure she did! Wouldn't you think someone would tell her to shut up?????

[shadydaisy]

OK folks
I want to know Did the Casey Anthony apple fall far from the Cindy Anthony tree???? Cindy is whacked and getting worse by the day....she cancelled OW sure she did! Wouldn't you think someone would tell her to shut up?????

No, the apple dropped right under the tree. Reality is whatever scenario they play in their heads. I think it; therefore it is true. They really don't understand why everyone just doesn't see things their way.

[Amy]

IIRC they were sitting in the car when she made the 911 call from her cell phone.

She @ one point had taken Casey by a precinct but it was closed? Or something (if we believe her.) The 911 calls were made from the house after Lee had been called over to try to talk some sense into Casey or make some sense out of what she was saying, is my recollection. Lee and Casey were talking, Cindy was in and out, and then out came the info about not having Caylee w/her for 31 days (or 30, take your pick.)

[Amy]

[QUOTE=deputydi;9185722]Isn't that just the funniest thing? All of you guys are making me laugh, I love Java's after replys to the Anthony interviews. George should be proud of his lying, thieving, puking, public peeing, trampy daughter. Who wouldn't be?:eek: Sorry the credit for that funny I believe goes to Old Soul, I think I read the poster's name wrong.

There are very few men that I know (well, maybe NONE) that would be SO PROUD of their daughters if their daughters had the lifestyle of Casey Anthony--even WITHOUT the murder. I know my Daddy would NOT go about bragging about how proud he is of any daughter who lived like that.

[Amy]

I'm thinking about all of these tv interviews and I wonder if the Anthony are getting bad advice or if maybe more likely they are not taking anybody's advice, because you know Cindy knows better, or she thinks she does. I also can't help but think of how differently the Anthonys would be perceived if they would have just come out and pleaded for Caylee's safe return, ask for privacy(not saying they would of got it) and said they would stand by their daughter. Then if they had something to offer in court that exonerated Casey or threw up reasonable doubt, maybe at least one or two jurors might listen to them and think they were decent, reasonable people caught in a bad situation. . As it stands now , if they had a video of the supposed gorgeous , rich nanny kidnapping Caylee and holding Casey down, the jury would automatically think it was doctored. Their cred is shot! By the time they get done testifying , people will just think it is that lying family again. Not that I care at if it will help sink Casey because she deserves to go down , but can they really think they are actually helping her. ??? I guess in Anthony world anything they have previously said should be forgotten or we should believe it in reverse.

I think we are supposed to believe what ever version is being told @ that moment. Forget anything else that was said before that this version contradicts. Just will yourself to forget every other version. Now, repeat after me--only the current version counts. And, if she has another version of the same issue tomorrow, forget today's version. Don't keep old transcripts or notes if you took any---come to each day with a blank slate in your brain, and take in that day's version (or, that moment's version, as there can be several versions of each issue in a day.)

See, now doesn't that make every thing clearer? If you don't try to remember all the other versions, you don't get confused or even upset!!!!:seeya:

[Amy]

Here's what we do know though the car smelled like a dead body, nobody else had that car, Casey did not report her daughter missing for 31 days, her mother finally did, while her daughter was supposedly kidnapping, she partied like it was 1999 and got a BEAUTIFUL LIFE TATTOO. The story she told was complete and utter B.S. And Jose's contention we don't know how or when she was killed, so what?? So under Baez rules we only convict on murders where we know every single detail. He is living in a fantasy world. You never know all the details, in every single case there are things that we don't know and don't make sense and murderers get convicted. Can I just say again that Janie Weintraub is absurd? While I am venting??Tonight she said, so she lied about the nanny, what does that have to do with anything? If I were a defense lawyer I would pay attention to how most jurors think. Number one jurors know when people make up big elaborate lies to the police, it is is because they have something to hide most of the time. And secondly, Janie enlightened us that the phrase that Cindy let fly in the voice mail about Casey had to have had help refers to help as in childcare or a babysiter.:rolleyes: Come again!, this is after Cindy realizes there was no job(Which in my opinion she knew much sooner) Janie says we take it out of context but the sentences before and after do not relate to childcare. Cindy says no matter what you think the scenario is and then after that she says, There should be others who have knowledge of this. While I realize I am paraphrasing, you get the general jist, she is not talking about other people who know she had child care or other child care scenarios. And I also realized tonight that most of the time Janie uses the attack the police strategy, tonight she said something to the effect that the police were bullies and the other night she referred to evidence the police made up. I wish JVM would not have her on.

I think I watched Janie W ONCE---when she said, "we don't know if Laci Peterson was murdered" I figured, this is one person who is SOOOO not in touch w/reality. Like Laci WALKED to the marina (since her car was @ home) then WALKED OUT into the waters, somehow being able to do that with the weights that would keep her underwater for so long. We know she must have walked out there, as there was no abandoned boat in the marina between Dec 24 and April.

Actually, I guess I did catch a snippet of her one other time, before I had the chance to change the channel. Can't remember the case, but it must have had something to do with a sexual assault, maybe even murder. I remember thinking that she sure must think that assault victims bring the assault on themselves. She was making excuses for some scumbag....of course, being a defense attorney, that's where her brain takes her. But whatever this one was, it was obvious the perp had NO defense. But she sure was trying to make one for him.

[deputydi]

OK folks
I want to know Did the Casey Anthony apple fall far from the Cindy Anthony tree???? Cindy is whacked and getting worse by the day....she cancelled OW sure she did! Wouldn't you think someone would tell her to shut up?????
I think they probably saw the way they came across during the depo and realized they had to do something to soften their image. The CBS interview did not show the same two pit bulls we've seen over and over attacking everything in sight. I believe someone or something intervened to create the kinder, gentler Anthonys.

[browneyes106]

And, I just thought of it - she didn't even steal to buy gasoline so she could look for the Nanny and Caylee. As for her being afraid of someone. You bet she was scared, in fact the word she used was "petrified". She said she was petrified of what her mother would do to her if she found out what happened.

Gator

Didn't the Ants say somewhere that Casey only stole money from Amy so she could look for Caylee?

[Mojo]

[QUOTE=old_soul;9185701]

BOMBSHELL Tonight! after months of trying, Lucy and John David STILL refuse to go to sleep at night. Could the fertility treatments have given them the DNA of a bat?

Breaking news tonight in the desperate hunt for a good night's sleep! Six months of trying culminates when I stumble across a dirty diaper, which I triple-bagged like it was trash. Manner of disposal? Diaper Genie!


http://i23.tinypic.com/308wgv6.jpg

she has GOT to change that Caylee opener!


R O F L M A O!!!!!!!!!!!! HAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA! I think I peed myself!

[lorettalockhorn]

Baez: How Casey Anthony Could Go Free
Attorney: 'There is so much that is unknown'

POSTED: 9:12 pm EDT April 23, 2009
UPDATED: 11:24 pm EDT April 23, 2009

ORLANDO, Fla. -- Attorney Jose Baez talked about several key parts of his defense of Casey Anthony during an exclusive interview with WESH 2 News.

"There is so much that is unknown, and we have to focus on all of it," Baez said in an interview with WESH 2's Bob Kealing.

Anthony is charged with first-degree murder in connection with the death of her daughter, Caylee, whose remains were found in December 2008 in woods not far from the family's home.

Baez and other attorneys interviewed by WESH 2 said the woods where Caylee's remains were discovered are a central place in which much of the case could revolve.

Caylee was missing almost six months before her body was found. And, Baez said, "They don't know how Caylee passed away. They don't know when Caylee passed away,"

Baez and other defense attorneys say prosecutors have not definitively tied Casey Anthony to Caylee's remains along Suburban Drive. They have to prove that Casey dumped the body there before entering state custody and that they remained there for almost six months.

"That's going to become one of the major battlegrounds in the case," said defense attorney Richard Hornsby.

Thomas Luka, an attorney for Casey Anthony's brother, Lee, agreed: "That would be one of the first things I would want to pursue."

Baez also questioned the forensic evidence in the case.

He plans to vigorously attack the single hair found in Casey Anthony's car trunk that prosecutors say is proof a decomposing body was in there. He said his own expert Henry Lee found 17 hairs in the trunk that showed no signs of decomposition.

Baez also will raise questions about the air test that a lab said showed evidence of human decomposition.

"It's not science that's fully accepted within the scientific community," Baez said "It's science that's not been verified. There's absolutely nothing to gauge this science by, so, therefore, it should not be used when someone's life is at stake.

Prosecutors plan to seek the death penalty in the case.

A spokeswoman for State Attorney Lawson Lamar said, "We don't respond to anything about this case outside the courtroom."

(Program note: On Friday at 11 p.m., Bob Kealing will talk with Baez about what was going on during the period before Caylee was reported missing.)

http://www.wesh.com/news/19266303/detail.html

BFD, to a cynic like me, that just sounds like Caylee was being babysat in the trunk up to seventeen times before Casey flubbed and killer her. Or retaliated and killed her.

Thanks for the link!

[browneyes106]

[QUOTE=mu8shark;9185748]

There are very few men that I know (well, maybe NONE) that would be SO PROUD of their daughters if their daughters had the lifestyle of Casey Anthony--even WITHOUT the murder. I know my Daddy would NOT go about bragging about how proud he is of any daughter who lived like that.

I laughed at the part in the article. George is a moron. Even if Casey wasn't a murderer there wouldn't be a reason to be proud of her. She didn't finish high school or get a GED. She didn't have a job and she stole money from various people even her own grandparents.

[lorettalockhorn]

Mom: Casey Has Shown Little Emotion
Anthonys Give Exclusive Interview To CBS 'Early Show'

POSTED: Thursday, April 23, 2009
UPDATED: 9:01 pm EDT April 23, 2009


snip...
Parts of the interview, in which Cindy Anthony defends here daughter, were not shown.

"No one knows what they would do when something so terrifying happens to you....in a panic or whatever," Cindy Anthony said.

The Anthony's admitted their daughter has shown little emotion since the disappearance of her daughter.

"Everybody reacts differently to tragedy. I am not Casey. I don't know what she was feeling. I can't judge and I'm not going to pre-judge," Cindy Anthony said.

When asked if she wished she had called 911 sooner, Cindy Anthony said she called for help as soon as she could.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/19259035/detail.html#-

What the heck does that mean? Cindy lost her phone? Was being threatened? :confused:

[browneyes106]

Missing Florida Girl's Grandmother Asks Police to Arrest Daughter for 'Grand Theft' in 911 Call

The grandmother of a missing 2-year-old Florida girl told a 911 dispatcher that she wanted to press charges against her daughter for "grand theft" after she learned of the tot's disappearance, according to a new recording released Friday.

A frantic Cindy Anthony can also be heard threatening to file a court order against her daughter, Casey Marie Anthony, to get Casey's little girl Caylee Marie Anthony away from her.

The new tape released Friday was of the very first call Cindy Anthony made to 911, which was handled by Orlando police. They then rerouted her to the Orange County Sheriff's Department, which is investigating the case. In all, Cindy Anthony had three conversations with 911 dispatchers July 15.

"I have a 22-year-old person that has, um, grand theft sitting in my auto with me," she said in the first. "My car was stolen. We've retrieved it; today we found out where it was at. We've retrieved it, I've got that. And I've got affidavits from my banking account. I want to bring her in. I want to press charges."

After the emergency responder told her she will be transferred to Orange County sheriffs, Cindy Anthony can be heard warning her daughter Casey in the background.

"My next thing will be child's thing and we'll have a court order to get her if that's what you wanna play. We'll do it and you'll never..." she said.

Casey's reply is inaudible, to which Cindy Anthony retorted: "Well, then, you have ... no, I'm not giving you another day. I've given you a month."

Click here to listen to the first 911 call on MyFOXOrlando.com.

Click here to listen to the other 911 calls on MyFOXOrlando.com.

Cindy Anthony said in the calls that her daughter Casey had just admitted that Caylee had been missing for about a month and she didn't know where she was.

"I have someone here that I need to be arrested ... in my home," Cindy Anthony said in the second call. She told the dispatcher that she was referring to her daughter and that it involved the disappearance of a toddler. The 911 responder asked her why she wanted her daughter taken into custody.

"For stealing an auto and stealing money," she replied. "I already spoke with someone. ... I was going to drive her to the police station and no one's open. They said they would bring a deputy to my home when I got home to call them."

Click here for a transcript of the first 911 call.
Click here for a transcript of the second 911 call.

Click here for a transcript of the third 911 call.
Go to the link to for transcripts...

snip
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,391001,00.html

I remember reading the transcripts months ago about that call. I find it weird that if G&C allowed Casey to use the Pontiac for years why would Cindy suddenly want Casey arrested for auto theft.

[One2Snoop]

It gets better and better! Cindy Anthony now states that SHE cancelled out on Oprah, not the other way around. Hold on to your seats, because this is going to rock you right out - her reason for cancelling on Oprah: Integrity! http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-laughing021.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)


http://www.clickorlando.com/news/19269332/detail.html

Good think Nawny is not by her computer or she'd spew her cawwfee again. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-laughing017.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)

http://i40.tinypic.com/2myniu9.gif "BTW I CANCELLED ON OPRAH because of integrity." http://i42.tinypic.com/2eea2z7.jpg http://i39.tinypic.com/2damvld.jpg http://i39.tinypic.com/s5liee.jpg

[deputydi]

I think the reason she gave was to force Liar to come home and stop giving C the run around. If i remember correctly. Gawd and that sounds like something normal :shrug:
That is nonsense. By the time she reported the car stolen, she had already found Casey and was trying to force her to tell where Caylee was. You can't "force" a 21 yr old woman to "come home". I, too, have wondered what the real reason was for that first call. She got Amy to tell her where Casey was staying and drove there to confront her. She found Casey, but not Caylee. The car was still at the Amscot lot and I wonder if Casey didn't tell her mother it had been stolen from her. If that's the case, saying that now would just point out another instance of what a liar the defendant is and she doesn't want to remind people of her daughter's inability to tell the truth.

[Mojo]

http://i40.tinypic.com/2myniu9.gif "BTW I CANCELLED ON OPRAH because of integrity." http://i42.tinypic.com/2eea2z7.jpg http://i39.tinypic.com/2damvld.jpg http://i39.tinypic.com/s5liee.jpg

So she's saying that the Early Show has more integrity than the Mighty Opes?? (by the way is GMA pissed since they footed the bill at the Ritz??) Way to go Cindy. Piss off Oprah. Now O is going to open the first show of sweeps with a picture of Casey. She'll stand with her arms wide and say THOU SHALT CONVICT! She has guaranteed Casey's conviction. Oprah picks our presidents, she can influence a jury too.

[NMurphy02]

Oprah should have the Grunds on..That would be great.

[One2Snoop]

http://i40.tinypic.com/2myniu9.gif http://i39.tinypic.com/2damvld.jpg

Casey Anthony: Cindy tells WKMG she canceled on Oprah Winfrey because of integrity -- yes, you read that right
posted by halboedeker on Apr 23, 2009 11:58:36 PM

Why did George and Cindy Anthony pass on Oprah Winfrey?

In a text message to WKMG-Channel 6, Cindy said, "BTW I cancelled on Oprah because of integrity."

WKMG's Jessica D'Onofrio said Anthony didn't explain the cryptic message.

Cindy is going to pick a fight with Oprah? Based on honesty?

Who do you think is going to win that one? Duh.

The Winfrey people said they decided not to go forward with an Anthony interview after learning the couple would appear elsewhere. George and Cindy talked to CBS' "Early Show" on Wednesday and Thursday.

So WKMG anchor Mike Garofalo asked which party should be believed: Oprah or Cindy?

"It's really anybody's guess," D'Onofrio said.

Given her track record, Oprah wins my vote. What do you say?

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2009/04/casey-anthony-cindy-tells-wkmg-she-canceled-on-oprah-winfrey-because-of-integrity.html

[One2Snoop]

Motion Filed To Force Cindy To Answer Questions

Posted: 1:58 pm EDT April 24, 2009Updated: 2:16 pm EDT April 24, 2009
ORANGE COUNTY, Fla -- In the case against Casey Anthony, the law firm representing Zenaida Gonzalez in a defamation lawsuit against Casey wants a judge to force Cindy Anthony to answer more questions and to pay for their costs.

Friday, the law firm filed a motion to compel Cindy Anthony to answer whether Casey ever used Cindy's credit cards without her permission. Cindy refused to answer the question in the first deposition.

Gonzalez is suing Casey, because she claimed a babysitter with the same name kidnapped Caylee.

A judge will hear the issue on May 21.

http://www.wftv.com/news/19272863/detail.html#-

[One2Snoop]

Can Casey's Defense Explain Smell of Death?
Preview: Casey Anthony's defense attorney Jose Baez talks with WESH 2 about questions, such as the "smell of death" in her car.

http://www.wesh.com/video/19270531/index.html

BAEZ's expert opinion - we really don't think this science is ready for prime time or a court of law.

[deputydi]

I think she was using it as an anvil to force her to hand over Caylee. I think she thought Casey was hiding Caylee to punish her for their fight, so she decided to one-up her and get not only Caylee but custody, as in, sign her over or go to jail. Little did she know...
In Cindy's twisted mind, that actually makes sense. It is the 911 calls that makes me believe Cindy had no clue that anything bad had happened to Caylee. I think she and George both know the truth now -- but definitely not then.

[Amy]

It gets better and better! Cindy Anthony now states that SHE cancelled out on Oprah, not the other way around. Hold on to your seats, because this is going to rock you right out - her reason for cancelling on Oprah: Integrity! http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-laughing021.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)


http://www.clickorlando.com/news/19269332/detail.html

Good think Nawny is not by her computer or she'd spew her cawwfee again. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-laughing017.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)

Wonder what she is going to say about the conference? I'm sure she is going to say THEY (the A's) cancelled that appearance, too. Probably conflict in scheduling or some such, I'm sure.

Wonder what the integrity thing is? Like anything from the Oprah camp in their promoting the A's was anything but positive. There wasn't one negative connotation. Guess it must be the A's integrity. Oh, I know--the A's probably submitted their list of demands, informed Ms Winfrey of the questions she would be asking them, and Ms Winfrey might have responded that she would NOT be controlled by her guests, that she would be asking what she felt was appropriate. Maybe Cindy thinks THAT shows lack of integrity on the part of Oprah Winfrey?

[Amy]

Janie Weintraub also gets on my last nerve with her ridiculous statements. "She lied about the nanny - what does that prove." It proves that no one took her daugher. It proves that only one person could have killed Caylee. Boy, if I was ever in trouble, the last attorney I would seek would be Weintraub. Maybe that's why she's always on TV, she doesn't have any clients (and it's not for a lack of crime in Miami!).

Gator

Another thing Ms Weintraub seems to be ignoring is, the nanny carp is NOT the only lie. If there was just one lie (even a doozie of a lie) that is one thing. But months and months of lies--hey!!! I'm surprised that she didn't point out that, in reality, Casey isn't the one who lied in many of the instances. What we have read and heard about is lies attributed to Casey by mostly Cindy. The only lies we have heard from Casey in person was in the police interviews. So, wonder if Casey lied to Cindy about things that did not come up in the interviews. Or if Cindy tho't up lying answers to questions she was asked by reporters and talk show hosts about things that came up after Casey's LE interviews.

[lorettalockhorn]

To say that Oprah has more integrity than CA is a left-handed compliment, but hey! that works for me. Sure, Oprah is powerful and she's got (more than) her fair share of sheeple, but for her to have even considered giving G&C an appearance and thereby possibly lending credence to their own special brand of the "truth" affirms what a media wh0re she is. IMO

[lorettalockhorn]

I think she was using it as an anvil to force her to hand over Caylee. I think she thought Casey was hiding Caylee to punish her for their fight, so she decided to one-up her and get not only Caylee but custody, as in, sign her over or go to jail. Little did she know...

That does make sense that she was using grand theft auto charge as leverage. It has always bothered me that Caylee was reported missing after the report of the stolen car.

But it still bothers me no end that she never asked LE to at least look for Casey and Caylee or do some sort of welfare check. Especially since she wasn't going to call all those phone numbers for ZFG or go to all those addresses after she bothered to post that her Caylee was missing.

[Amy]

I would like to know just who (if any ) are her clients.

If my life depended on it, and she were the last D lawyer left, I would not use her. She is disliked so much because of her whole digusting 'aura', if you know what mean. There is nothing decent a jury would find with her, just abrasiveness, whiney, fuglyness...They'd hold that against the perp!

As for her lawyering skills....would anyone here want her for that? UGH.

BTW, what hole did she crawl out of recently anyway...JVM is having anyone jump on the bandwagon!

I have heard about 2 cases where she was the defense lawyer. One was the case of the 2 old men in line @ the movies and one fellow KO'd the other, and the fellow died. Her defense strategy was that the guy who died coincidentally had an aneurism that burst @ the second of impact, or the second he actually fell and hit his head, and of course that had NOTHING to do w/the other guy hitting him. Just a most unfortunate coincidence, that's all. I don't recall if there was evidence of a burst aneurism or not, but doncha think, Ms Weintraub, that a blow to the head might actually be the cause of the aneurism bursting? GEEEESH!!!

Can't remember the other case, but I was thinking--ohhh, that defendant is going down the tubes whether he is guilty or not with that lawyer!!! She'd DEFENSE strategize any defendant right into prison!!!

[Amy]

Ya i did Gator-makes him look like a puppet. I also noticed C with flaring nostrils at times and she just looked like she could barely maintain her composure. It musta killed her to fake normal. MOO

Maybe they were forced to sit thru all the episodes of "Leave it to Beaver," "Father Knows Best," "Ozzie and Harriet (not to be confused w/Ozzie Osborn,)" and " The Donna Reed Show." Brainwashed. Subliminal tactics. And now, they act sickenly sweet (to everyone but Oprah, of course.) I'd like to see them on the same set with say, Mark Klaas, Tim Miller, Leonard Padilla, all the people who dissed the A's by actually searching for Caylee. THEN I'd like to see how long it would take for them to revert to form.

[Amy]

What the heck does that mean? Cindy lost her phone? Was being threatened? :confused:

Maybe Cindy was going about it in the "modern" way by posting on MySpace, possibly hoping MySpace is monitored by LE type folks who would pick up on her plea for the return of Caylee, would read between the lines and contact her about her missing granddaughter. Surprised that she didn't use another "modern" method by text messaging some LE person.

[Amy]

That is nonsense. By the time she reported the car stolen, she had already found Casey and was trying to force her to tell where Caylee was. You can't "force" a 21 yr old woman to "come home". I, too, have wondered what the real reason was for that first call. She got Amy to tell her where Casey was staying and drove there to confront her. She found Casey, but not Caylee. The car was still at the Amscot lot and I wonder if Casey didn't tell her mother it had been stolen from her. If that's the case, saying that now would just point out another instance of what a liar the defendant is and she doesn't want to remind people of her daughter's inability to tell the truth.

@ the time Cindy made her 911 calls, even @ the time she picked up Casey, the car w/the dead body smell was sitting in their garage. The way Cindy was able to contact Amy was because of Amy's stuff in the car.

[Amy]

http://i40.tinypic.com/2myniu9.gif http://i39.tinypic.com/2damvld.jpg

Casey Anthony: Cindy tells WKMG she canceled on Oprah Winfrey because of integrity -- yes, you read that right
posted by halboedeker on Apr 23, 2009 11:58:36 PM

Why did George and Cindy Anthony pass on Oprah Winfrey?

In a text message to WKMG-Channel 6, Cindy said, "BTW I cancelled on Oprah because of integrity."

WKMG's Jessica D'Onofrio said Anthony didn't explain the cryptic message.

Cindy is going to pick a fight with Oprah? Based on honesty?

Who do you think is going to win that one? Duh.

The Winfrey people said they decided not to go forward with an Anthony interview after learning the couple would appear elsewhere. George and Cindy talked to CBS' "Early Show" on Wednesday and Thursday.

So WKMG anchor Mike Garofalo asked which party should be believed: Oprah or Cindy?

"It's really anybody's guess," D'Onofrio said.

Given her track record, Oprah wins my vote. What do you say?

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2009/04/casey-anthony-cindy-tells-wkmg-she-canceled-on-oprah-winfrey-because-of-integrity.html

Actually, there might be a smidgeon of truth in that--Oprah's show has too much integrity for the A's to appear on. Don't think Cindy could deal with INTEGRITY, especially coming from someone else (well, it would HAVE to come from someone else, when you get down to it.)

Or, perhaps the proper wording would have included LACK of integrity--and not on Oprah's part, either.

[One2Snoop]

http://i43.tinypic.com/ety002.jpg

[eatcupcakes]

Oprah should have the Grunds on..That would be great.

This is a great idea, it would make for much better viewing. They are for real and tell the truth. I think it would be very enlightening.

[lorettalockhorn]

They were playing 'chicken'. At least Cindy was. Casey was winning chicken, because she was willing to go all the way. The post was a way to up the ante and stir the pot. She didn't know she'd already lost big time. imo.

BUT wasn't it the very first day that Cindy told George that we've lost her! referring to Caylee? And when he smelled the car, the fact that he was worried that the smell of death was Caylee or Casey in the trunk has to indicate that he knew it was possible. Obviously Casey was alive. For some reason those two brushed off their own correct instincts and went on this bizarre trip with Casey at the helm. They're fried. Fried I tell you!

[deputydi]

@ the time Cindy made her 911 calls, even @ the time she picked up Casey, the car w/the dead body smell was sitting in their garage. The way Cindy was able to contact Amy was because of Amy's stuff in the car.
Oops -- you're right. I had forgotten that little detail. It is still possible that when Cindy called 911 and said she wanted to report the car stolen, that could have come from another lie Casey told her. Just a theory and probably not a very good one. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me that Cindy would or could report a car stolen by her daughter that had been given to her to use for a year or more.

[mu8shark]

Didn't the Ants say somewhere that Casey only stole money from Amy so she could look for Caylee?This makes no sense that they are now saying she never stole. In Cindys call to 911 she distinctly says that she wants to report a theft , a stolen car and stolen money. You can bet she is not reporting Amy's stolen money . They are living in the twilight zone and expect the rest of us to have undergone some kind of lobotomy where we forget all that went before just like I think Amy said before. If only that would work on the jury.... pftt.

[One2Snoop]

I'm not sure when this interview took place but it was posted on Youtube Dec. 20, 2008 - Interesting.....

Cindy Anthony's Freudian Slip?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmGLTPZqBHU

Interesting comment from above link....

The 1st 911 call Cindy made to have Casey arrested Cindy was calm and direct asking to have her daughter arrested. The 2nd she calmly and directly mentions her granddaughter's missing, the 3rd 911 call Cindy's voice reviles the pain and sorrow of losing someone close to you, she can hardly breathe. I think Casey told her that night that Caylee was dead.

ETA:
another comment

What cindy has come out with is very damaging in this video,1)- she is in the woods,2)she has been moved numerous times.3)we have lost precious time to hope for her being alive. Grandma Anthony knew all along Caylee was dead right from the beginning, and now trying to put up a smoke screen to protect her murdering daughter.

[One2Snoop]

From the above video Cindy says....

George and I don't believe that Caylee's in the woods or.... you know...out there. We believe someone has her and she's alive.

Exact spot, we're gettin' close. The actual why.....we're pretty much, you know, we feel were on the right track.

We believe and we believe from day one, that Caylee has not stayed in the same place, there very long. We believe she's been moved numerous times

Well, I feel like we've lost 4 months of precious time following up on the, you know, following up on looking for her alive.

[mu8shark]

BFD, to a cynic like me, that just sounds like Caylee was being babysat in the trunk up to seventeen times before Casey flubbed and killer her. Or retaliated and killed her.

Thanks for the link!About these hairs, I don't see anything really nefarioius about the fact that he found them. I mean if a car has been used a lot you would expect from transference there would lots of hairs back there. I mean you could put luggage , groceries, clothes , get out a spare tire and transfer hair. Hair falls off us every day. And for him to say none of them have decomp on them, so what , why would you expect every single hair in the trunk to come from a dead person?? It makes no sense. It certainly does not clear her. And if any are from Caylee, without decomp, so what? There is no way as I said before for Dr Lee to say they were all put there all at the same time. It's impossible, you can't date when a hair fell out or transferred. And if any of the 17 did turn out to be Caylees without a death band on it , it may suggest she was put back there alive and then died. Why do they think this clears her? ? Are we to believe there were 17 different people who killed Caylee and deposited their non dead hair.? Actually none of his arguments is strong, The fact that a lot is unknown is pretty typical of murders. Most murders do not have witnesses or confessions, so you work with what you have and you can't know everything. If you had to, anybody that did it in secret would get off Scott (no pun intended , see next sentence.. And it did not work in the Peterson case. No pun intended. Then he says there is no connection to the Anthony house. If those trash bags and duct tape match up, are we to believe somebody crept into the Anthony house and stole that? It is absurd, what a risky strategy, a murderer would go out and get their own duct tape and trash bags. All this sneaking in the Anthony house, for duct tape and blankies and trash bags and to do searches on the computer would mean they would risk getting caught breaking in. Oh I forgot Zanny had a key.:rolleyes: By the way Cindy saying that Zenaida was cute but not a 10 in the depo , if Cindy writes a book she , she can use a fake name like I, M Petty and we would still know it was her.. . .

[mu8shark]

I have my own btw, By the way, Jose if you are going to try and say that Jesse or Roy Kronk or Ricardo killed Caylee, you are going to have to explain to me how Jesse or Roy or Ricardo got custody of Caylee.I thought Zanny had her. Were they dating Zanny and they stole her from the nanny who stole her from Casey? Why didn't Casey come clean after Caylee was found dead and say "Oh Zanny is really Roy Kronk, he's my nanny.? LOL " Did she forget? Does she have syphillis and it is affecting her brain? ?? As a juror you are also going to have to give me a motive. I know you do not have to legally provide one, but in order for me to believe your story that one of these guys is the killer, you are going to have to show me how they got Caylee, how they got into the Anthony house for all those searches and duct tape and trash bags and blankies and heart stickers. Also you have to tell me why. I think they need to be careful pointing the finger at others and saying Everyone else is lying or wrong, because juries don't like this and don't go for it.

[lorettalockhorn]

About these hairs, I don't see anything really nefarioius about the fact that he found them. I mean if a car has been used a lot you would expect from transference there would lots of hairs back there. I mean you could put luggage , groceries, clothes , get out a spare tire and transfer hair. Hair falls off us every day. And for him to say none of them have decomp on them, so what , why would you expect every single hair in the trunk to come from a dead person?? It makes no sense. It certainly does not clear her. And if any are from Caylee, without decomp, so what? There is no way as I said before for Dr Lee to say they were all put there all at the same time. It's impossible, you can't date when a hair fell out or transferred. And if any of the 17 did turn out to be Caylees without a death band on it , it may suggest she was put back there alive and then died. Why do they think this clears her? ? Are we to believe there were 17 different people who killed Caylee and deposited their non dead hair.? Actually none of his arguments is strong, The fact that a lot is unknown is pretty typical of murders. Most murders do not have witnesses or confessions, so you work with what you have and you can't know everything. If you had to, anybody that did it in secret would get off Scott (no pun intended , see next sentence.. And it did not work in the Peterson case. No pun intended. Then he says there is no connection to the Anthony house. If those trash bags and duct tape match up, are we to believe somebody crept into the Anthony house and stole that? It is absurd, what a risky strategy, a murderer would go out and get their own duct tape and trash bags. All this sneaking in the Anthony house, for duct tape and blankies and trash bags and to do searches on the computer would mean they would risk getting caught breaking in. Oh I forgot Zanny had a key.:rolleyes: By the way Cindy saying that Zenaida was cute but not a 10 in the depo , if Cindy writes a book she , she can use a fake name like I, M Petty and we would still know it was her.. . .

Well, exactly. Won't things be interesting when we start seeing defense leaks? Er uh, I mean discovery?

Hmmm Casey's exes dating ZFG. Don't go giving that crazy woman any ideers!

[mu8shark]

Well, exactly. Won't things be interesting when we start seeing defense leaks? Er uh, I mean discovery?

Hmmm Casey's exes dating ZFG. Don't go giving that crazy woman any ideers! Personally , I think it is a dumb defense strategy to be revealing how you are going to defend a case. You can be the prosecutor is like "Terrific, now I know what they are going to throw at us and we can be ready." It is always a mistake to tip your hand like this. It seems to me like in a state like Florida where the Sunshine Law makes the prosecution case evident to everyone, the defense should be taking advantage of the fact, they don't have to release anything publicly. Also I have a question I have always wondered. I know because of Cindy's 911 call, that Casey ask for one more day. What difference do you think that would have made? It was not like she could produce Caylee, I know she was stalling but what do you think her plans were. I remember Cindy said when she went through Caseys stuff she had like 200.00 and some credit cards. Do you think she may have been thinking if she had one more day and could get away from her Mom, she could get out of town and evade the whole thing with that dough and the credit card??I have never known what one more day would have done for her. Any thoughts. ??

[One2Snoop]

Remember this e-mail draft or ? that was found on the computer, theoretically from Cindy to Casey?

http://i44.tinypic.com/11a8pax.png

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/files/11.pdf
That was honest Cindy, I think. Of course there were red flags which she now denies, but I think she was more worried that Casey was going to take off with Caylee, not kill her. But the level of panic in this e-mail (which had to be July14-15 night since that's when InBev bought Bud) makes it clear how easy she could tip into knowing what that smell really was..

I don't remember seeing that (could've forgot) - thanks for posting java!

[mu8shark]

Something else I have been thinking about that may cause me to have a reversal of thinking , and lean toward Loretta's theory that George lied about seeing Caylee and Casey that day. I know you said the motive was that they did not want anyone to think there was a fight at all and they wanted everybody to think on the last day everything was fine. And I thought well that is just speculation and I heard Leonard say that, but I don't always trust him after the duct tape statement, . But, now it has become a bit more than a theory because Cindy in her depo absolutely denied there was fight, just out and out denied it. So now , I have to give ya props , those of you who had this doubt, because it bothers me why Cindy is trying to deny this fight. I mean I get why because she does not want to furnish Casey with a motive. But it just bothers me and now I am starting to question George. I wonder what LE really thinks about that story. I don't particulary believe she was killed in the middle of the night though like Leonard does at some hotel parking lot. I think Casey fumed all night and as soon as Dad left she went into that house and killed Caylee. I will tell you why. If you leave in a huff, you would not think to take duct tape and trash bags to aid in the killing or hiding the body. You may have the kids blankie packed and stickers and all kinds of stuff when you storm out because it is in the back pack but not the duct tape and trash bags and laundry bag. She came back to do the killing and got all that stuff then. I think George may have not seen them at all and when he left she came back, did her dirty deed with duct tape and bagged that child up and threw her in the trunk then.

[lighthousedazy]

I think she wanted it stolen from AMSCOT and then she could blame the thieves for kidnapping Caylee.[/QUOTE]
I think she thought if she could just get out of her mother's presence she could start up the stalling again. It was a request born of panic, I think, when her mom uncharacteristically brought in "outsiders", LE. Of course, maybe she was stupid enough to think she could get to the marine. (hint: California is not another country, Casey, and most extradite anyway)

I wonder how long she could have gone had the car not been towed? I think she wanted it stolen from AMSCOT and then she could blame the thieves for kidnapping Caylee.
That's what I have thought all along, that she thought someone would take the car, but who in their right mind would steal that car?? Reminds me of that episode of Seinfeld where the parking attendant left the BO in the car and they could not get rid of the smell. :D Jerry left the keys in the car and was pointing it out to every bum that went by.

[mu8shark]

I think she thought if she could just get out of her mother's presence she could start up the stalling again. It was a request born of panic, I think, when her mom uncharacteristically brought in "outsiders", LE. Of course, maybe she was stupid enough to think she could get to the marine. (hint: California is not another country, Casey, and most extradite anyway)

I wonder how long she could have gone had the car not been towed? I think she wanted it stolen from AMSCOT and then she could blame the thieves for kidnapping Caylee.I totally think at one point she was going to try and go hang out with the marine. I mean think of it, if she could tell the marine that she adopted Caylee out or her parents were watching Caylee and then if her Mom had no way to contact her to know exactly where she was, Casey could of kept it going for a really long time. I think that was plan A and then she got sidetracked with the new boyfriend Anthony. I do believe Leonard when he says Casey thinks ahead for 10 minutes at a time. And she is the kind who really can't stick with one plan when she gets sidetracked or distracted esp by a new man. But I think that marine could of been her best shot. She could of got a new phone number and unless the Anthonys got a private detective to track her down, nobody would have known Caylee was even missing.

[lorettalockhorn]

Remember this e-mail draft or ? that was found on the computer, theoretically from Cindy to Casey?

http://i44.tinypic.com/11a8pax.png

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/files/11.pdf
That was honest Cindy, I think. Of course there were red flags which she now denies, but I think she was more worried that Casey was going to take off with Caylee, not kill her. But the level of panic in this e-mail (which had to be July14-15 night since that's when InBev bought Bud) makes it clear how easy she could tip into knowing what that smell really was..

>>Am I ever going to see her again?

You can't help but have at least a pang of sympathy there, but the whole thing is kind of bizarre. The hotflashes and the worry have her in a tizzy and she expresses herself honestly. Suddenly she rambles (like a crazy cat lady who never mows her yard and recycles paper towels) about the non-existent job. Then, back to her feelings. :confused:

[lorettalockhorn]

Something else I have been thinking about that may cause me to have a reversal of thinking , and lean toward Loretta's theory that George lied about seeing Caylee and Casey that day. I know you said the motive was that they did not want anyone to think there was a fight at all and they wanted everybody to think on the last day everything was fine. And I thought well that is just speculation and I heard Leonard say that, but I don't always trust him after the duct tape statement, . But, now it has become a bit more than a theory because Cindy in her depo absolutely denied there was fight, just out and out denied it. So now , I have to give ya props , those of you who had this doubt, because it bothers me why Cindy is trying to deny this fight. I mean I get why because she does not want to furnish Casey with a motive. But it just bothers me and now I am starting to question George. I wonder what LE really thinks about that story. I don't particulary believe she was killed in the middle of the night though like Leonard does at some hotel parking lot. I think Casey fumed all night and as soon as Dad left she went into that house and killed Caylee. I will tell you why. If you leave in a huff, you would not think to take duct tape and trash bags to aid in the killing or hiding the body. You may have the kids blankie packed and stickers and all kinds of stuff when you storm out because it is in the back pack but not the duct tape and trash bags and laundry bag. She came back to do the killing and got all that stuff then. I think George may have not seen them at all and when he left she came back, did her dirty deed with duct tape and bagged that child up and threw her in the trunk then.

I used to think that the possibility that George lied about the 16th was only (or mostly) to put the kibosh on the big fight between C&C, but I wonder if it could have been part of the Zanny Has a Key to the House setup, just in case LE could narrow down a time of death. It makes perfect sense that Caylee's things would be in the backpack at any given time, but just can't see her killing Caylee at the motel. Just seems much more likely that she was killed at home and Casey availed herself to the duct tape, garbage bags, the knife that was used to cut the duct tape (maybe), etc.

It's so easy to believe that Casey killed Caylee and G&C know it, maybe even because of a direct threat to do so. But I cannot for the life of me imagine what would make G&C decide to support Casey at the expense of justice for Caylee. Isn't there a way to do both?

[mu8shark]

Absolutely mystifying.

We have a case like this out here (LA) with a claim of kidnaping and a dead child, and the family is NOT playing these games.In my mind there was a way to do both to stand by their daughter but not play those games, they could of just made a statement that they were going to stand by their daughter no matter what by being there for her because she was their daughter and then proceed to let LE do their investigation and not get in the way of it the way of the investigation by publicly doing everything they could to frustrate LE and obfuscate everyting they way they have all along. But Cindy in particular can't not be in control because she is afraid this reflects on her. And George honestly I think is just weak and does what Cindy tells him to because if she divorces him, he knows he can't keep a job and Cindy is the breadwinner. I found it telling that not only did Casey take out credit cards in Mom's name behind her back but apparently if it is true that George did as well, well you see where Casey gets her deceiving ways from both parents.

[mu8shark]

Uggh also i have to comment on Cindys coming on that show and saying she too wrote suicide notes and she was so upset at not seeing Caylee. I think Cindy watches the shows and saw that George did get a bit of sympathy and maybe if she said that, people might suddenly feel sorry for her. I totally think it was an attempt to garner sympathy. It makes zero sense that if Caylee was coming home for her third birthday and she was alive and you actually believed that you decide to kill yourself. If she did indeed have those thoughts its more likely that it was because as more and more info came out, she knew Caseys ass was grass. And she could not bear that ruining the perfect family image she had or tried to portray. I kind of think Cindy is too self centered to end her life. She values herself too much.

[One2Snoop]

Absolutely mystifying.

We have a case like this out here (LA) with a claim of kidnaping and a dead child, and the family is NOT playing these games.

Is that the Emma Barker case? I've not been able to find any updates on it. :shrug:

[DrewBerry]

I used to think that the possibility that George lied about the 16th was only (or mostly) to put the kibosh on the big fight between C&C, but I wonder if it could have been part of the Zanny Has a Key to the House setup, just in case LE could narrow down a time of death. It makes perfect sense that Caylee's things would be in the backpack at any given time, but just can't see her killing Caylee at the motel. Just seems much more likely that she was killed at home and Casey availed herself to the duct tape, garbage bags, the knife that was used to cut the duct tape (maybe), etc.

It's so easy to believe that Casey killed Caylee and G&C know it, maybe even because of a direct threat to do so. But I cannot for the life of me imagine what would make G&C decide to support Casey at the expense of justice for Caylee. Isn't there a way to do both?

Loretta, ITA with your summary here. AND, I believe G&C know Casey killed Caylee. They continue to lie and cover up because they have dug their heals in so deep that to come forth with the truth and admit they've been wrong is TOO SHAMEFUL and they could NEVER take back everything they've said and done since the beginning. They are only trying to save face for themselves. They've chosen this avenue rather than help get justice for Caylee. :flamemad:
DrewB

[Native Alien]

The other scenario that plays out is that George did see Casey and Caylee on the 16th and once he left then Casey came back and killed Caylee that is the point where she tried to put the body in the ground behind the house.
but something spooked her

As someone that has dug many a fencepost hole in the sandy soil of Florida I can tell you that digging any size of a hole is a real pain. She realized that and then she put the body in the trunk. I believe at that point she only had the body wrapped in the blanket, with the duct tape and sticker already in place Once it started to smell she went back to the house and got everything and took care of the body and dumped it in the woods.

Chances are good that she laid the body on the ground while she was attempting to dig the hole and that is what the dogs hit on in the back yard.

[eatcupcakes]

The other scenario that plays out is that George did see Casey and Caylee on the 16th and once he left then Casey came back and killed Caylee that is the point where she tried to put the body in the ground behind the house.
but something spooked her

As someone that has dug many a fencepost hole in the sandy soil of Florida I can tell you that digging any size of a hole is a real pain. She realized that and then she put the body in the trunk. I believe at that point she only had the body wrapped in the blanket, with the duct tape and sticker already in place Once it started to smell she went back to the house and got everything and took care of the body and dumped it in the woods.

Chances are good that she laid the body on the ground while she was attempting to dig the hole and that is what the dogs hit on in the back yard.

This girl has to be really stupid if she was planning to bury Caylee in her parents backyard. I just don't buy that she was gonna try to do that. How would C amd G not see fresh soil turned over in their own yard. The best thing for her to do was to dump the body were she did and get as far away from FLA as she could. But she is not the brightest bulb on the tree so she didn't think that far ahead. Now she can sit in prison for the rest of her life and read law books. ROTFLMAO I bet she is really reading Nora Roberts or Ann Rice.

[eatcupcakes]

In her Depo Cindy said that there was no fight. I was wondering how this story about the fight between her and Casey got started. I keep hearing that it was over the Liar stealing money from her Grandmother and that Cindy tried to choke her. The story had to come from someone in the house that witnessed it so how is Cindy now saying it didn't happen. Please fill me in. Thanks:shrug:

[eatcupcakes]

Didn't she say in one of her jail house tapes she was reading the bible? Now the Liar could be lying or she may be one of many that turn over that new leaf thru religion (puke icon)


Please, if she is reading the Bible it's because she is looking for more stories to tell and there are lots of them in the Bible. They are very unbelievable but we all seem to believe them. So she might find more fodder for her Lies.

[Amy]

In her Depo Cindy said that there was no fight. I was wondering how this story about the fight between her and Casey got started. I keep hearing that it was over the Liar stealing money from her Grandmother and that Cindy tried to choke her. The story had to come from someone in the house that witnessed it so how is Cindy now saying it didn't happen. Please fill me in. Thanks:shrug:

In either (or both) the LE or FBI interview, Lee told about the fight--he wasn't there, but said that Casey had told him. SO, is this a real thing that happened, or is this one of Casey's lies? The neighbor (can't remember if he is the shovel neighbor) did say, I think to a reporter, that he had heard a loud argument the night of the 15th. I don't recall ever seeing or hearing that he said what time, tho, like in the evening or later in the night.

That is the one problem I have with the Cindy choking Casey "story." The neighbor heard an argument, but did not witness it. So, I do believe there was an argument. The only thing left to figure out is--did Casey lie to Lee about Cindy choking her, or is Cindy lying about NOT choking her? It's got to be one or the other. The thing is, I wouldn't believe either of them, even if their tongues were notarized.

[eatcupcakes]

Well we do know she thinks she can walk on water-Lord forgive me :shrug:

ROFLMAO :beer:

[eatcupcakes]

In either (or both) the LE or FBI interview, Lee told about the fight--he wasn't there, but said that Casey had told him. SO, is this a real thing that happened, or is this one of Casey's lies? The neighbor (can't remember if he is the shovel neighbor) did say, I think to a reporter, that he had heard a loud argument the night of the 15th. I don't recall ever seeing or hearing that he said what time, tho, like in the evening or later in the night.

That is the one problem I have with the Cindy choking Casey "story." The neighbor heard an argument, but did not witness it. So, I do believe there was an argument. The only thing left to figure out is--did Casey lie to Lee about Cindy choking her, or is Cindy lying about NOT choking her? It's got to be one or the other. The thing is, I wouldn't believe either of them, even if their tongues were notarized.

Thank you for clearing that up for me. So it came from Lee and he heard it from the Liar so it won't stand up in court because it's hear say, right?

[lorettalockhorn]

Didn't she say in one of her jail house tapes she was reading the bible? Now the Liar could be lying or she may be one of many that turn over that new leaf thru religion (puke icon)

She had to start reading law books so she can help Bozo; he's not exactly top shelf! She's going to teach him the motions. ;)

[lorettalockhorn]

In her Depo Cindy said that there was no fight. I was wondering how this story about the fight between her and Casey got started. I keep hearing that it was over the Liar stealing money from her Grandmother and that Cindy tried to choke her. The story had to come from someone in the house that witnessed it so how is Cindy now saying it didn't happen. Please fill me in. Thanks:shrug:

That started with Lee; Casey told him about the incident. LP has done his best to give the story legs. Which is interesting considering any of the Ants' credibility. But the neighbors did confirm some sort of commotion.

[lorettalockhorn]

Bible? Is that what they've been saying she's reading...Good Lord! Here's a shot of what she's been carrying around...http://i39.tinypic.com/30kqemq.jpg

They lie like rugs!

:read:

LMAO She could have WRITTEN that book!

[lorettalockhorn]

Hey! I already made it clear the hubby won't let me mow, and as for the paper towels...they're PAPER, aren't they? If they didn't want them in the recycling can, it wouldn't be 10 times bigger than the garbage can, now, would it?

No need to call me crazy! :D

But this reads to me as real, much more than a nice edited concise e-mail. Besides, it seems to have been written in the middle of the night. This was 11 days after the MySpace post, and I think she was getting hysterical since there was no response to that. Then the morning after this was written, they found out about the car.

HAHAHA Nuttin wrong with crazy! :hat:

That is too eerie for her to have written that right before the nightmare started to unfold.

[One2Snoop]

I was thinking about that this morning when I listened to the "she had help" voicemail. Something happened that made them take a radical turn from "what did you do", "she might be involved" etc. to hysterical assertions of innocence. Maybe they found out she DID have help, and that help needed to be protected.

If BOTH of their children were on the line, their radical 180 and lack of concern for Caylee justice would make some sense.

And along with the slobbering display of affection to CMA by Lee at the Memorial. That struck all of us as being really odd but if your thought turns out to be true then maybe this was Lee's way of thanking CMA for Covering His A Z Z.

Just my thought.

[One2Snoop]

Casey Anthony case: In WESH interview, Jose Baez apologizes if he hasn't shown outrage that wronged woman is jailed
posted by halboedeker on Apr 25, 2009 10:43:11 AM

Where is the outrage from the defense that the wrong woman has been jailed?

Bob Kealing of WESH-Channel 2 asked that question of Jose Baez, who is representing Casey Anthony in her murder trial.

"I apologize if I haven't shown that previously," Baez said.

"I've pulled out all the stops to try to get her the best defense possible," he added. "That's what I'm mostly concerned with. I have to stay focused. I can't get emotional."

Anthony is charged with the first-degree murder of her daughter, Caylee. WESH has heralded its interview with Baez as an exclusive -- the first the attorney has given since the state decided to seek the death penalty. The NBC affiliate aired reports Thursday and Friday -- the first two days of the May sweeps ratings period -- and put other parts of the interview on its Web site.

Kealing asked how Baez will try to explain the smell of decomposition in Anthony's car trunk. Baez countered that the lab has said it could possibly be decomposition -- a "very presumptive result," Baez said. Baez added that the evidence hasn't been submitted in court and that the science behind it isn't fully accepted.

Did you find the interview worthwhile? Or not?

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment_tv_tvblog/2009/04/casey-anthony-case-jose-baez-apologizes-to-wesh-if-he-hasnt-shown-outrage-previously.html

[One2Snoop]

Caylee Anthony added to murdered children's memorial

By Christine Show | Sentinel Staff Writer
April 25, 2009

http://i43.tinypic.com/30u71h4.jpg
Don Williams of Leesburg, Florida, built a memorial wall and pond in memory of missing children who are later found murdered, called the 'Waterfall of Tears.' He was inspired almost 4 years ago after the murder of Jessica Lunsford, a Homosassa girl who was kidnapped, raped and buried alive in 2005. (Tom Benitez, Orlando Sentinel / November 22, 2008)

Caylee Marie Anthony is now one of the hundreds of children's names listed on a Leesburg memorial dedicated to slain children.

Don Williams, 48, who created the "Waterfall of Tears," will host a ceremony at 1 p.m. today at the memorial site located at his home on Radio Road. The Rev. Robert I. Maurais of St. Edward's Episcopal Church in Mount Dora will give a blessing at the ceremony to honor the children.

Williams recently added Caylee's name to the wall along with Mitchell Moore, 20, who was shot to death by his mother earlier this month at a Casselberry shooting range, and 8-year-old Sandra Cantu of Tracy, Calif., who was kidnapped, raped and killed earlier this month. Williams, who began building the memorial more than three years ago, recently decided to build another section of the memorial to honor kids who died of illness or other tragedies after many requests to do so. Names of children already on the list include Polly Klass, JonBenét Ramsey, Jessica Lunsford and Jimmy Ryce.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/lake/orl-lkltopitem25042509apr25,0,6281293.story

[One2Snoop]

Exclusive: Baez Answers Questions In Anthony Case
Defense Attorney Talks To WESH 2

POSTED: 9:21 pm EDT April 24, 2009
UPDATED: 11:43 pm EDT April 24, 2009

ORLANDO, Fla. -- Casey Anthony's attorney Jose Baez sat down with WESH 2's Bob Kealing recently to discuss the key questions surrounding the case.

Below are links to extended video excerpts of the interviews.

Video: Baez On Death Penalty
http://www.wesh.com/video/19275455/index.html

Video: Baez On Outrage
http://www.wesh.com/video/19275374/index.html

Video: Baez On Smell In Truck (?CAR)
http://www.wesh.com/video/19275240/index.html

Video: Report On Baez From WESH 2 On Friday
http://www.wesh.com/video/19278021/index.html

Video: Why Casey Anthony Could Go Free
http://www.wesh.com/video/19267594/index.html

http://www.wesh.com/news/19276717/detail.html

[lorettalockhorn]

Hey Bozo, send this link to G&C, will ya?

...What did Mr. Weissbourd's research tell him? That nowadays "well-intentioned adults undermine children's moral and emotional development." Parents have abandoned the "moral task" of rearing children, he says, and are more concerned about fostering their happiness than their goodness. Therapeutic interaction takes precedence over moral instruction; intimacy is maintained at the cost of authority.

"Blaming peers and popular culture lets adults off the hook," Mr. Weissbourd writes. "The parent-child relationship is at the center of the development of all the most important moral qualities, including honesty, kindness, loyalty, generosity, a commitment to justice, the capacity to think through moral dilemmas, and the ability to sacrifice for important principles."

Among the trends that Mr. Weissbourd finds particularly harmful is the fixation of parents on building "self-esteem" (the "praise craze," as he calls it)...


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124053094209050311.html





Disclaimer: Don't agree with some of the comments re: safety "obsession".

[lorettalockhorn]

He left out an important one: work ethic!!!! You wouldn't believe some of the lazy bum employees I had to deal with. And self-esteem?! They could not handle even a minor reprimand, like don't come to work with kids in a see-through shirt. No one had ever told them "no" or "do this better". I fear how many Caseys walk the earth today, really.

Haven't read the book, just the review. But I swear I thought of how proud George is of Casey. :rolleyes: My erstwhile step-daughter's psycho mother (I use that term loosely) used to be praise crazy. If the child was in gymnastics, she was headed for the Olympics! If she took dance lessons, she was headed for Julliard!! If we would only pay for braces, she would be a Ford model!!! If she made the honor roll, she was headed to Harvard!!!! When the girl was about twelve she asked me what was wrong with her that her mother felt that she had to lie about her talents. It really took some (un)doing to make her see her self-worth. And you're right about the work ethic; she never learned that at home, but when she got into some relatively serious trouble and we broke her plate (after the obligatory last warning), she truly straightened out. She has done herself proud.

[Amy]

She had to start reading law books so she can help Bozo; he's not exactly top shelf! She's going to teach him the motions. ;)

I'm certainly surprised she would need to read law books. Way back @ the beginning, Cindy said Casey is smart, and she was giving her lawyer (Baez) good advice. What???? I wonder if that is part of Baez' problem--taking advice from his client? Maybe her lawyer has been reporting to her what people say about his lawyering abilities and she is hitting the books to see if she needs to give him different advice!!! :chicken::biggrin:

[lorettalockhorn]

Good for her-and you! I don't get why parents think lies are good for kids "self-esteem": if a parent over-praises (lies), kids know, and that means their true abilities aren't good enough in their own minds, imo. Betcha this happened with Casey: it gave her the habit of making up a story to be the best and brightest. (didn't anyone notice she was the youngest major event planner in the history of the world?!)

Kids are messed up these days. In every contest, there is a winner! Don't give every kid a trophy. Gives them a goal to work for. And, o/t I know, but my mil thinks my son should not be told an act of his is "bad". Sorry, pulling the dog's ears is bad, and I will tell him so. And, you know what? He already knew it was bad anyway.

Yes, but he is going to test boundaries (and your resiliance!). Perfectly normal. There is a way to teach children that behaviors are separate from their self, and bad behaviors are not acceptable. Kids aren't bad people for pulling doggie ears and tails unless they keep doing it and graduate to bigger and worse things.

I love telling this; but My Little Love told me a while back that my approach that I would teach him to walk on the sidewalk rather than don't walk on the grass saved him a lot of grief and humiliation in life. Made me so proud. (Which is not to say that I don't know that he has walked on the grass a time or two! :hat: )

[Amy]

Good for her-and you! I don't get why parents think lies are good for kids "self-esteem": if a parent over-praises (lies), kids know, and that means their true abilities aren't good enough in their own minds, imo. Betcha this happened with Casey: it gave her the habit of making up a story to be the best and brightest. (didn't anyone notice she was the youngest major event planner in the history of the world?!)

Kids are messed up these days. In every contest, there is a winner! Don't give every kid a trophy. Gives them a goal to work for. And, o/t I know, but my mil thinks my son should not be told an act of his is "bad". Sorry, pulling the dog's ears is bad, and I will tell him so. And, you know what? He already knew it was bad anyway.

DD worked for a day care for about 3 months thru a government program. OMG!!!! Political correctfulness was the order of the day. A mother asked her about something on the wall. A hundred years ago, when I was in grade school, there was a poster listing our names. When you misbehaved you got a mark, and after 5 marks, you had what would now be called a time out in the cloakroom. I can't remember how many marks it took to get a couple of swats with a ping-pong paddle (gasp, horrors, child abuse!!!!) The thing the mom was asking about was kind of like that. DD made the mistake of saying the board showed when kids were bad and needed a time out.

You NEVER tell a child he is bad or his behaviour is bad. My goodness gracious, you might damage his poor little psyche beyond repair!!!! I can't remember how they had to term it. There must have been something, tho, other wise, the board wouldn't have been there. Oh, and DON'T use the archaic term "time out." Again, negative connotations to the poor little tyke. You can't speak firmly to a tyke who keeps running down the hall even tho it's the 3rd or 4th time you have (meekly and mildly) requested that the child stay w/the class. And heaven forbid that you would isolate for even a few minutes the child who repeatedly throws sand @ the other kids!!!!

No way, no how would I be able to work in an environment like that. It's no wonder the kids run wild, you pretty much can't even explain to them how their behaviours affect the other children, disrupt any sense of order. How are they going to know they shouldn't act in such a manner, if no one can call them on it? :flamemad:

[deputydi]

In my mind there was a way to do both to stand by their daughter but not play those games, they could of just made a statement that they were going to stand by their daughter no matter what by being there for her because she was their daughter and then proceed to let LE do their investigation and not get in the way of it the way of the investigation by publicly doing everything they could to frustrate LE and obfuscate everyting they way they have all along. But Cindy in particular can't not be in control because she is afraid this reflects on her. And George honestly I think is just weak and does what Cindy tells him to because if she divorces him, he knows he can't keep a job and Cindy is the breadwinner. I found it telling that not only did Casey take out credit cards in Mom's name behind her back but apparently if it is true that George did as well, well you see where Casey gets her deceiving ways from both parents.
You really hit it on this post. I think most of us are compassionate enough to understand the impossible place C & G were in -- in the beginning. We could have understood a parent's love for their own child and the willingness to stand by him/her with unconditional love. What most of us have come to despise (some earlier than others) is the way they are showing support.

I can't imagine turning my back completely on any of my three kids -- no matter what. I also can't imagine lying to the police on their behalf or hiding evidence intending to mislead LE or not questioning my child on the material points in an effort to find out the truth.

I did my best to remain nonjudgmental where Cindy and George were concerned but the depo did me in. There is nothing normal about this couple and they don't care about Caylee anymore or finding out the truth. All they care about is getting their killer daughter out of jail. Well, guys, it ain't gonna happen.

[wind149]

About 10 years ago I had a friend who has a son that was ADHD, but at the same time almost a genius and she decided to send him to this school for gifted kids and what a sham that place was!! Granola heads, my least favorite people run the show and Roger is on meds for the ADHD, but still he could be a handful and these dolts are supposed to be experts in teaching children and the first time and last time I went to the school is when Jen asked me if I would pick him up at the school as she would be running late at her job and I was coming down to visit for the weekend anyway and I was like no problem as he never gave him too much grief we are buds and she had called ahead to let them know who I was. I park my truck and start to walk towards the school when this Broomhilda in Birkenstocks comes flying my way demanding to know who I was and why was I there? I explained and she looked at me like I was dirt as I was wearing my bathing suit and shorts and tennis shoes as I planned on taking Roger to the lake nearby as the weather had been warm for May and she tells me to wait outside so she can verify who I am, I gave her license and told her I worked in LE in VT and offered to show my ID and she looked at the ID's and said, "well I can't release this child to you, you live out of state, yeah, about 25 minutes away in NH as this was MA and I said I had told the secretary all about this and still this bulk of a woman will not let me step one foot towards the school.

She told some guy to keep an eye on me like I was some kidnapper while she went and verified and I sat there in the hot sun watching kids come out and I spot Roger coming out so I yelled to him, as far as I was concerned I had waited long enough and he comes over and gives me a hug and here comes Broom yelling and flailing her massive arms! She tells Roger to back away from me slowly and I am like that's it no more nice girl here!! I proceeded to tell her that I was taking him and Roger spoke up and said that I was his auntie and he wanted to go with me!! She looks at him and says, " Roger now that is not how we do things here at Montville, you know all about the bad people and I think she is one, she is not following the rules young man and no one knows about her picking you up" He looks at her and says, "well I want to call my mom, if auntie is here to pick me up she would be the one to say it was OK" And now she scares him with this. Another woman equally as fugly and wearing them nasty ass Birkenstocks and some kind of mumu comes running over to stand by and Lardass proceeds to tell him that he will have to go to the "peaceful room" till we got this sorted out. He turns as pale as a ghost and screams that he does not want to go there and I had had enough! I told him not to worry as I was going to call the police and his mom and I went to the corner store, called Jen and the MA state police!! Jen is about pissed off when I reach her and by the time I got back, the police were there and I explained my side to one officer and explaining to him that I work in LE in VT and that I was not kidnapping this child!! They totally understand especially when they talk to Jen and they told Lard that she should have released Roger to my care and why was all this fuss? Come to find out the dumb hippie who is the secretary "forgot" to tell anyone as she got busy with the "veggie garden hour"

Poor Roger, my little buddy was traumatized by this, and he tells me on the way home that he does not like that school and wants mom to send him somewhere else! Jen is so pissed when she gets home, I then asked what the hell was the peaceful room and he tells us they put the kids in a dark room where music is played and bells and gongs and scary voices and I was like WTF!!! These idiots were putting a child that is afraid of the dark in a dark scary room where he has to listen to chants and sh*t because he was bad?? Oh I need not tell you how pissed off Jen was!! Screaming at the top of lungs at that Lardass for about 4 minutes and really reamed her out over the peaceful room and what had Roger ever done to get put in there??? She tells Jen that often he would interrupt in class, or he would giggle or laugh and I am like, that is what kids do and these asswipes were supposed to be experts with gifted children that have disabilities??? She tells her that she is taking Roger out of that school and it was costing her $50,000 a year to keep him there and you know they did not want to lose that, and she tried sucking up majorly, and Jen was not hearing it and she felt bad afterward because Roger had told her a few times he hated it there and she just chalked it up to he does not like school period and she ended up sending him back to parochial school, and a teacher there evaluated him like those idiots were supposed to do, and came to the conclusion that he often would get bored because he is so smart and would act up just like an ADHD kid does!! I tell you, I would not want a bird to go to that sham of a school! Making little kids go into a dark room and listen to chants and bells, how in the f*ck is that going to change his behavior??? If anything it would make them act up worse!!! Roger also tells us that when he would raise his hand because he knew the answer he would be told that he had to "share" that he could not answer every question??? This kid is extremely smart and I can easily see why he was bored, know what he does for a living now? He went to MIT at the age of 16 and now works at the Pentagon!! SO I am leery of teachers these days, they are book learned but not a lick of anything else, a textbook is all they think they need to teach children especially ones with disabilities.

[deputydi]

Good for u Loretta-and others who do sensible parenting. We have so many good friends with kids a bit younger than ours-I have to walk away. I cant take it as i wanna b/i/t/c/h slap the kid myself. They are hard working folk and good folk. Huge enablers. Being a travel hockey parents for years-so so sad. Lots of parents had their own NHL contract scenario's for their kids-guess what folks for every kid thats good-1,000 just like em and some even better. It's a frickin game??? Parents with stop watches-your kid got 30 sec. more ice time than mine and on and on. We wonder why we have such screwed up kids. Dont get it as our generation sure wasn't raised that way.
I hear you loud and clear. My daughter (now in her 30s) competed in gymnastics for 10 years. She was pretty good and won lots of medals but neither of us ever had Olympic dreams. I watched some of these parents at practice reduce their child to tears, call them names when they screwed up a floor routine or fell off the balance beam. I watched these same girls come off the floor crying if they didn't get a good score or win a medal in competition. So, so sad.

I always told her "when it stops being fun, it's time to quit". It's a sport -- nothing more, nothing less.

[Amy]

I hear you loud and clear. My daughter (now in her 30s) competed in gymnastics for 10 years. She was pretty good and won lots of medals but neither of us ever had Olympic dreams. I watched some of these parents at practice reduce their child to tears, call them names when they screwed up a floor routine or fell off the balance beam. I watched these same girls come off the floor crying if they didn't get a good score or win a medal in competition. So, so sad.

I always told her "when it stops being fun, it's time to quit". It's a sport -- nothing more, nothing less.

I occasionally watch the shows where the moms take the little, and I do mean little, some still just BABIES, to the pageant circuit. The moms--OMG, I feel sorry for all of their kids--the ones who get their attention (the little beauty queens) and their other kids who are kind of left in the background. Oh, Jr just LOVES helping Sis get ready for pageants. He WANTS all his allowance to go for her latest dress/make-up/wig. He isn't @ all interested in sports. (PUKE.) Anyway, the little girls crying half the time, tired like all little kids are after several hours of activity, but nope, no nap for the beauty queen!!! Get up here and work on your routine until you get it right!!!

[Native Alien]

I occasionally watch the shows where the moms take the little, and I do mean little, some still just BABIES, to the pageant circuit. The moms--OMG, I feel sorry for all of their kids--the ones who get their attention (the little beauty queens) and their other kids who are kind of left in the background. Oh, Jr just LOVES helping Sis get ready for pageants. He WANTS all his allowance to go for her latest dress/make-up/wig. He isn't @ all interested in sports. (PUKE.) Anyway, the little girls crying half the time, tired like all little kids are after several hours of activity, but nope, no nap for the beauty queen!!! Get up here and work on your routine until you get it right!!!

Tot's and Tiaras I am thinking that is called. I have watched it a time or two and it just makes me sick. But then the whole thing with Jon Benet upset me too.

My girls both grew up without a lot of things because if I didn't have the money I didn't have it. They both understood what it meant to be told no and to be given chores to do. They also both got their butts smacked if they didn't listen. What seems to surprise everyone is that it didn't kill them to be raised that way. The youngest was learning how to ride a horse at the age of two. She was on a horse of her own by 4 and working with her uncles on a family livestock farm at that time. Granted the horse was very docile and the horse knew what he was suppose to be doing, but still she would say to me, Mom, time to go to work as her uncle would take her with him for the day.

My point is that they are both young women that I am very proud of and they didn't get alot of what other kids had. But they had love and what they needed. Parenting is constantly making choices of what one thinks is in the best interest of one's child. In order to do that one has to be involved.

That is what I think and believe is lacking today. Involvement with the children to make the best choices for them.

[eatcupcakes]

[QUOTE=javahog;9185711]


R O F L M A O!!!!!!!!!!!! HAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA! I think I peed myself!

Me to.

[Gatordog]

In either (or both) the LE or FBI interview, Lee told about the fight--he wasn't there, but said that Casey had told him. SO, is this a real thing that happened, or is this one of Casey's lies? The neighbor (can't remember if he is the shovel neighbor) did say, I think to a reporter, that he had heard a loud argument the night of the 15th. I don't recall ever seeing or hearing that he said what time, tho, like in the evening or later in the night.

That is the one problem I have with the Cindy choking Casey "story." The neighbor heard an argument, but did not witness it. So, I do believe there was an argument. The only thing left to figure out is--did Casey lie to Lee about Cindy choking her, or is Cindy lying about NOT choking her? It's got to be one or the other. The thing is, I wouldn't believe either of them, even if their tongues were notarized.

I have a slightly different recollection - i think it was cindy who told Lee about the fight.

[Gatordog]

So obviously at one point she was halfway normal, a dysfunctional functional normal. This information is going to provide LE with a weath of evidence, I'm so glad this is around!

IT'S A BEAUTIFUL DAY!!!!!!! Make sure you guys enjoy it, you all are having great weather also, right?


BRB

Hi OS, Saturday was a beautiful day. I wish you could have enoyed the weather here too. That would have made a perfect day.

Gator

[browneyes106]

That started with Lee; Casey told him about the incident. LP has done his best to give the story legs. Which is interesting considering any of the Ants' credibility. But the neighbors did confirm some sort of commotion.

Also Cindy's brother Rick posted about the fight on the topix boards.

[Justice Denied?]

I was thinking about that this morning when I listened to the "she had help" voicemail. Something happened that made them take a radical turn from "what did you do", "she might be involved" etc. to hysterical assertions of innocence. Maybe they found out she DID have help, and that help needed to be protected.

If BOTH of their children were on the line, their radical 180 and lack of concern for Caylee justice would make some sense.

I have always wondered what happened that made them change their tune and exactly when it happened. Does anyone remember the aproximate date and what was going on in the case at the time? Did Casey remind them of some secret she knew or some hold she had on them. There has to be a reason why they changed so suddenly.

I may be that Lee helped her dispose of the body. He certainly has avoided law enforcement.

[lighthousedazy]

I have always wondered what happened that made them change their tune and exactly when it happened. Does anyone remember the aproximate date and what was going on in the case at the time? Did Casey remind them of some secret she knew or some hold she had on them. There has to be a reason why they changed so suddenly.

I may be that Lee helped her dispose of the body. He certainly has avoided law enforcement.That could be the case. imo. It would be so embarrasing for "the perfect family" to have raised a murderer and an accomplice.

[Justice Denied?]

Does anyone else wonder what Liar does all day? I do-put all emotion aside from the tragedy-It alway's crosses my mind and interests me. I would luv to sit and observe her for a day. Yeah i know she is reading,sleeping and noshing lol However i wonder if she is like a caged animal at times. I hope so. It has to get to her at times. It's just something that crosses my mind from time to time :shrug:

Beem,

I also wonder what she thinks about all day long and especially in the middle of the night when she wakes up and can't get back to sleep. Does she think about the possibility of dying by lethal injection? How does she feel about Kaylee now? About Cindy? Does she honestly believe she will beat this charge and get free? Does she daydream about all the fun things she will do when she gets out? I'd just like to know if she is scared, paniced or confident after this amount of time.

[Zingo]

I have always wondered what happened that made them change their tune and exactly when it happened. Does anyone remember the aproximate date and what was going on in the case at the time? Did Casey remind them of some secret she knew or some hold she had on them. There has to be a reason why they changed so suddenly.

I may be that Lee helped her dispose of the body. He certainly has avoided law enforcement.

Interesting discussions, about the Anthony's parenting style, and the 180-degree turn. It actually took me awhile to notice the Anthony's colusive (sp?) behavior. *I was in denial* Ha!

They are now (and have been for some time) fully colluding with Casey to suppress the truth. But originally, they were trying to get information from her, and they were cooperating with police. I personally do NOT believe anyone helped her dispose of the body. Because if that happened when she was in custody, it begs the question: where was the body before it was in the woods? It could not have been the backyard because there would have been no time to move it after Cindy called 911. And the family was being watched constantly. Too risky.

I think Casey acted alone. I think her family just knows she did it. Either she told them when she was out on bail, or they figured it out. But I could be wrong. Either way, they're all obstructing justice.

Here are some random observations:

1) I noticed that in the police interview with Cindy's mother, Mrs. Plesea relates what Cindy said after she told her about the money stolen by Casey. Cindy said, "We'll pay you back, Mom." I thought that was interesting. She didn't say, "We'll make Casey pay you back" or "We'll have a stern talk with Casey." She was covering for Casey, trying to make it all better. I picked up on that because it smacked of co-dependency. The co-dependent ALWAYS covers up for the troubled person, and never forces them to take responsibility for their own decisions or behavior. That doesn't mean there wasn't a shouting match later! It just means that most likely Cindy yelled a lot, but in the end, she FIXED Casey's problems instead of making her fix them herself.

2) Cindy went out of her way in the deposition to make it sound like she was not involved in Casey's affairs. Several times I noticed where she would say: "Casey is responsible for that" or "I don't get involved in that." She said this in relation to the stolen money from her mom. I get the sense that Cindy was DEEPLY involved in Casey's life, cleaned up all her messes -- and spent her entire life resentful of everything she did for Casey. That is CLASSIC co-dependency. They ALLOW someone to be irresponsible, then they ***** about the person's irresponsibility, claiming that they should NOT be involved at all.

3) Nancy Grace says in all her years as a prosecutor she never saw a defendant's family that didn't believe they were innocent. So, it's not so unusual for the Anthony's to stand behind Casey. But NG also said she never saw a case where the victim had no family representation in the courtroom.

[Justice Denied?]

She had to start reading law books so she can help Bozo; he's not exactly top shelf! She's going to teach him the motions. ;)

An excellent idea! A not guilty verdict is now guaranteed! NOT! LMAO

[lorettalockhorn]

Zingo, I like your diagnosis of the Ants as co-dependent! Cindy is crisis oriented; she can't function if there isn't a world of sh!t going on in her world. For a while it was George with his wasting away money and bad judgment and supposedly another woman. That was miraculously resolved around the time Caylee came into the picture and now Casey is the focus of poor poor pitiful her.

It does seem like initially the adult Ants were cooperative with LE, and I think it was Padilla who insisted that during the time of the taped jailhouse visits, they were in cahoots with LE and George was working on, or seemingly going to be allowed a one on one private visit with the liar. That was the day that Cindy made the suggestion that Zanny had a key by asking if it was so. (I think that was to pave the way for the items from the Ants' house that would show up in The Zone with Caylee's remains.) I think this was about the time that G&C went around the bend, what with announcements of Caylee being moved from pillar to post and the kidnappers being under surveillance. With mail being subject to being read and censored, I don't think any information was passed along that way, and I truly believe that much of this plot to obstruct was laid out before Casey was arrested after the grand jury indictment.

From what we've read from the botonists' reports, it doesn't seem likely that Caylee could have been anywhere other than The Zone for very long before she was dumped there.

Aside: Cindy's voicemail indicating that Casey had help is still a hoot is interesting because it makes Casey look like the ringleader in whatever happened.

[Justice Denied?]

DD worked for a day care for about 3 months thru a government program. OMG!!!! Political correctfulness was the order of the day. A mother asked her about something on the wall. A hundred years ago, when I was in grade school, there was a poster listing our names. When you misbehaved you got a mark, and after 5 marks, you had what would now be called a time out in the cloakroom. I can't remember how many marks it took to get a couple of swats with a ping-pong paddle (gasp, horrors, child abuse!!!!) The thing the mom was asking about was kind of like that. DD made the mistake of saying the board showed when kids were bad and needed a time out.

You NEVER tell a child he is bad or his behaviour is bad. My goodness gracious, you might damage his poor little psyche beyond repair!!!! I can't remember how they had to term it. There must have been something, tho, other wise, the board wouldn't have been there. Oh, and DON'T use the archaic term "time out." Again, negative connotations to the poor little tyke. You can't speak firmly to a tyke who keeps running down the hall even tho it's the 3rd or 4th time you have (meekly and mildly) requested that the child stay w/the class. And heaven forbid that you would isolate for even a few minutes the child who repeatedly throws sand @ the other kids!!!!

No way, no how would I be able to work in an environment like that. It's no wonder the kids run wild, you pretty much can't even explain to them how their behaviours affect the other children, disrupt any sense of order. How are they going to know they shouldn't act in such a manner, if no one can call them on it? :flamemad:

And now you know why so many well-qualified teachers are leaving the classrooms. Teachers who love teaching and are good at it know they have had the ability to control a group of children.

[Twinners]

<snip>

1) I noticed that in the police interview with Cindy's mother, Mrs. Plesea relates what Cindy said after she told her about the money stolen by Casey. Cindy said, "We'll pay you back, Mom." I thought that was interesting. She didn't say, "We'll make Casey pay you back" or "We'll have a stern talk with Casey." She was covering for Casey, trying to make it all better. I picked up on that because it smacked of co-dependency. The co-dependent ALWAYS covers up for the troubled person, and never forces them to take responsibility for their own decisions or behavior. That doesn't mean there wasn't a shouting match later! It just means that most likely Cindy yelled a lot, but in the end, she FIXED Casey's problems instead of making her fix them herself.

<snip>



In this particular instance, I don't think Cindy would have seen it as trying to fix Casey's problem. I think she would've have seen it as trying to fix the problem Casey created for her mother. Casey's problem, which I believe was paying her phone bill at the time, was solved when she stole the money from her grandmother, but in solving her problem, she created one for her grandmother. I doubt Casey could have given a crap less about the problem she created for her grandmother. Cindy did though, IMO, and that's why I think she offered to pay her back right from the start.

JMO.

[browneyes106]

Interesting discussions, about the Anthony's parenting style, and the 180-degree turn. It actually took me awhile to notice the Anthony's colusive (sp?) behavior. *I was in denial* Ha!

They are now (and have been for some time) fully colluding with Casey to suppress the truth. But originally, they were trying to get information from her, and they were cooperating with police. I personally do NOT believe anyone helped her dispose of the body. Because if that happened when she was in custody, it begs the question: where was the body before it was in the woods? It could not have been the backyard because there would have been no time to move it after Cindy called 911. And the family was being watched constantly. Too risky.

I think Casey acted alone. I think her family just knows she did it. Either she told them when she was out on bail, or they figured it out. But I could be wrong. Either way, they're all obstructing justice.

Here are some random observations:

1) I noticed that in the police interview with Cindy's mother, Mrs. Plesea relates what Cindy said after she told her about the money stolen by Casey. Cindy said, "We'll pay you back, Mom." I thought that was interesting. She didn't say, "We'll make Casey pay you back" or "We'll have a stern talk with Casey." She was covering for Casey, trying to make it all better. I picked up on that because it smacked of co-dependency. The co-dependent ALWAYS covers up for the troubled person, and never forces them to take responsibility for their own decisions or behavior. That doesn't mean there wasn't a shouting match later! It just means that most likely Cindy yelled a lot, but in the end, she FIXED Casey's problems instead of making her fix them herself.

2) Cindy went out of her way in the deposition to make it sound like she was not involved in Casey's affairs. Several times I noticed where she would say: "Casey is responsible for that" or "I don't get involved in that." She said this in relation to the stolen money from her mom. I get the sense that Cindy was DEEPLY involved in Casey's life, cleaned up all her messes -- and spent her entire life resentful of everything she did for Casey. That is CLASSIC co-dependency. They ALLOW someone to be irresponsible, then they ***** about the person's irresponsibility, claiming that they should NOT be involved at all.

3) Nancy Grace says in all her years as a prosecutor she never saw a defendant's family that didn't believe they were innocent. So, it's not so unusual for the Anthony's to stand behind Casey. But NG also said she never saw a case where the victim had no family representation in the courtroom.

Good observations. I noticed those things too in Shirley Plesea's interview. Cindy also told Richard Grund that it wasn't a big deal that Casey stole from Jesse. Casey and Cindy do co dependency problems. Cindy never forced Casey to take responsibility for her own actions. I think Shirley should have contacted LE when Casey stole the money out of Al's nursing care account. But I think she was scared of hurting Cindy so she didn't. I do remember reading that the bank that held the account wanted to press charges. I do wonder if Caylee's death could have been prevented if Casey was charged with something for stealing from the nursing care account.

[Twinners]

Maybe Caylee wasn't the only thing that needed to be hidden? Or placed in locations to try and implicate others? Lots of stuff could have disappeared between July 15 and whenever. Remember "they haven't even found her clothes yet"...sound like there's some evidence that has never been found.

Maybe Lee found the wrong stuff and did the wrong thing based on his misunderstanding of the "code"...

ETA: didn't she visit Jesse Grund after June 15, and that worries his dad? Maybe Caylee's missing clothes were placed somewhere in his vicinity?
I was just listening to one of Jesse's interviews on YouTube and in it, he said Casey came by his place to take a shower on July 1st. He said she didn't look like someone who needed a shower - she was clean & etc, but she had a bag with her that looked like it had clothes in it when she went in his bathroom to take one.

He also said she shows up as "CMA" on his cell.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgoJVUrqv8k

[Twinners]

Maybe she needed "one more day, mom" to point more stuff at the Grunds, but when she didn't get it, she had to run with the Zani story...

eta: the Grunds might want to check their plumbing, lol!

LMAO! I certainly would if I were them!

About the "one more day" thing, I'm in the camp that believes Casey would've hit the ground running if Cindy had given it to her. It's hard to say where, exactly, she may have gone, but I do believe she would've headed as far away as she could get, as fast as she could get there, if Cindy hadn't told her no.

[Twinners]

It demonstrates her lack of brain that she didn't beat feet long before Cindy confronted her. Why didn't she bail when Lee was hunting her, for example? Even Scott Peterson and OJ tried to run when they felt the pressure...

She proves that not all socios are of superior intellect, imo.

I think money was the main reason she didn't run sooner. From the way it looks to me, she was basically living hand-to-mouth during the month she was out of the Anthony home without Caylee. She was stealing what money she did have, but what she had wasn't enough to pay for the expense of getting her to where she was going AND keep her in the manner to which she'd become accustomed until she found someone else to steal from whenever she got there.

I think she may have stayed for Tony too.

And I also think she thinks she's of superior intellect and therefore, could find a way to get away with her crime if and when they did confront her about it.

[One2Snoop]

I'm not sure...don't they sell those "gift" cards at Target for air travel among other things?


Air travel gift cards at Tarjae" ???? Not sure they sell them there. In fact I think the only gift cards Target sells is for "Target Only".. IIRC Safeway carries gift cards for American Express/Visa/Starbucks/Macy's/Nordstroms/Sach's/JC Penae's'/maybe SW Airlines but I'd have to check on that.

I don't think she was bright enough to clean a trunk in such a way as to eliminate dna traces from a biological st. But I think a nurse and a former cop combined probably would. But I do wonder if the cleaning method used might have accidently created chloroform, which would be hilarious justice!
I'm thinkin' you're absolutely spot on with your assessment of the above. http://i40.tinypic.com/2h6bpqc.jpg

[Master Trim]

Air travel gift cards at Tarjae" ???? Not sure they sell them there. In fact I think the only gift cards Target sells is for "Target Only".. IIRC Safeway carries gift cards for American Express/Visa/Starbucks/Macy's/Nordstroms/Sach's/JC Penae's'/maybe SW Airlines but I'd have to check on that.

I'm thinkin' you're absolutely spot on with your assessment of the above. http://i40.tinypic.com/2h6bpqc.jpg
There is a good chance that a cleaner with some sort of chlorine bleach was used as well a some sort of solvent based cleaner.
The labels say "Thou must not mix differrnt cleaners" but I have! You get chlorine. You COULD get chloroform? Even if you don't, the defence can put that forward as a possible source. My neutered tom cat could sucessfully argue reasonable doubt, if there are claims that "raised level" of chloroform in the trunk is from use by KC to drug Caylee.

[Native Alien]

I'm not sure...don't they sell those "gift" cards at Target for air travel among other things?

I don't think she was bright enough to clean a trunk in such a way as to eliminate dna traces from a biological stain. But I think a nurse and a former cop combined probably would. But I do wonder if the cleaning method used might have accidently created chloroform, which would be hilarious justice!

Having looked at the online recipes for Chloroform, I don't think it could be accidentally made. I do know that if you mix bleach and ammonia together it creates a gas that will cause you stop breathing. A friend's mother did that while we were in high school and had to call the fire department to air out their house.

[CelticDawn]

Having looked at the online recipes for Chloroform, I don't think it could be accidentally made. I do know that if you mix bleach and ammonia together it creates a gas that will cause you stop breathing. A friend's mother did that while we were in high school and had to call the fire department to air out their house.


Morning,
I am new to this board. Normally I am on INSession (the other side)...

I don't think Casey had the mental wherewithall to create homemade chloroform, ....accidentally or not... nor do I think that the parents had the common humility to totally clean up any traces of chloroform, or results of Casey's dumb attempts to make said potion. They are much too arrogant and would definitely miss something just by definition. They systematically and without fail underestimate every person with whom they come in.

as for the ammonia and bleach.....trust me, it is a very irritating mess! If you don't pass out from the gas, you will run from it!....Even some urine in a toilet bowl of bleach will produce some of this same toxin. Not a pleasant mixture.

[eatcupcakes]

I had an enlightment this am. Here it goes. Lee was definetly talking to Casey at the Memorial Service when he said "CME I won't forget the promise I made to you" and was kissing his wrist. After all it was Caylee's service so if he was talking to her he would have used her name. I never heard anyome say that was her nic name. He was talking very loudly and clearly like he wanted to get a message across to someone. Usually you don't have to do that when you are talking so someone who is dead. And the promise he is keeping, I believe it is to keep a secret not to tell what Casey told him about how Caylee died. I feel this for sure in my bones. He knows what happened but neither he or his sister are ever going to tell. It may be that they both were jealous of the attention and love she had from their parents. This is a sick family so that would not surprise me. Although I don't think he had a hand in her death.

[CelticDawn]

I had an enlightment this am. Here it goes. Lee was definetly talking to Casey at the Memorial Service when he said "CME I won't forget the promise I made to you" and was kissing his wrist. After all it was Caylee's service so if he was talking to her he would have used her name. I never heard anyome say that was her nic name. He was talking very loudly and clearly like he wanted to get a message across to someone. Usually you don't have to do that when you are talking so someone who is dead. And the promise he is keeping, I believe it is to keep a secret not to tell what Casey told him about how Caylee died. I feel this for sure in my bones. He knows what happened but neither he or his sister are ever going to tell. It may be that they both were jealous of the attention and love she had from their parents. This is a sick family so that would not surprise me. Although I don't think he had a hand in her death.

I believe that eventually, we will see in the documents that there was some kind of communication between Lee and casey on the night of June 15th and the wee hours of the morning of June 16th. I believe that George's allegation (LIE) that he say caylee and Casey and his overly-detailed recollection of their clothing is another nail. He was protecting more than casey at that point. He knew that Lee had a hand in the disposal of caylees body whether directly or instructionally. He is trying to save not only casey, but L:ee, and himself from the wrath of Cindy.

If this weren't so complicated and tragic, it would be great entertainment. It is not.

[eatcupcakes]

Hi, beem! IT, whatever plans she had in mind were thwarted when she and Cindy had that fight...she was yet unprepared to make a move, and hastily went ahead with what she already had in mind to start. That's why she had Caylee in the trunk for a few days, and would up leaving her where she was found....figures in with all the other false starts ~ ie, trying to dig :rolleyes:,etc, and maybe setting someone else up, as you guys have been discussing..also she apparently discussed some things with Cindy, putting thoughts in her head...Jesse=Zani...Amy=Zani...keys to the car/house that Casey claimed either (jesse/zani)or both possibly had.

Twinners had a good thought there, that $ was the reason she hadn't booked yet. She was trying to set things up to run, but she found there were no more people to steal from! Laughing here, but we know she isn't the brightest bulb in the box....she should have surrounded herself with wealthier people! What kind of money can you make stealing from Grandma Shirley and Poppa? Amy and Jesse were slim pickins too.

All very true. What if Lee helped her make the Cholaform. She might have told him she wanted to make it so that Caylee would sleep when she was out partying. I think Lee would have done it for her. Not thinking that she could kill the kid, or he could have obtained if for her. There is definetly more here then meets the eye where Lee is conserned.

[lorettalockhorn]

I think money was the main reason she didn't run sooner. From the way it looks to me, she was basically living hand-to-mouth during the month she was out of the Anthony home without Caylee. She was stealing what money she did have, but what she had wasn't enough to pay for the expense of getting her to where she was going AND keep her in the manner to which she'd become accustomed until she found someone else to steal from whenever she got there.

I think she may have stayed for Tony too.

And I also think she thinks she's of superior intellect and therefore, could find a way to get away with her crime if and when they did confront her about it.

Hadn't Casey stolen upwards of $45,000 from various sources? Looks like even after all those six packs and Target bras, she would have had money for airfare. Maybe she's just too much of a sloth to make a move.

[lorettalockhorn]

I thought the chloraform issue was cleared up way back when? IIRC I thought the air tests showed that due to the concentration level (or pure form?) it could not have come from a mixture of chemicals-cleaning or pool. Way too much to remember here. If Caylee's hair testing showed chloraform(I believe it would only show with prolonged use) then Liar has one more of many nails in her coffin. MOO ;)

That's how I remember it, and I think the prosecution will be able to lay out that the chloroform in the trunk wasn't created from separate elements. That's not to say that chloroform won't be found on the tox report from Caylee's hair. And if bleach and ammonia (for instance) were used to clean the trunk, wouldn't the carpet have been bleached out and stained? Don't remember reading anything like that.

[Gatordog]

I think you have the wrong thread?
This is Caylee thread.

You certainly got the wrong poster!
I brought NO problems here! Personal or otherwise. I said nothing about Sandra! why would I on a Caylee thread?

Hi Master Trim. :seeya: Nice to have you on the boards. Like your Avatar. He maust be a very smary kitty, but then aren't they all?

Gator

[CelticDawn]

You know what torks me about these complaints from prisoners' families about how they are broke and now have to send more money to the prisoner for their snacks?

How dare prisoners accept money from their destitute families, who are probably living in penury since there is one less income! If I were in jail and cost my family money, I would never take food out of my children's mouth to buy HoneyBuns!!!!! How could you leave your family more broke? aaaargh! Ban "canteens"! It will be a public service!


the one in prison probably wasn't contributing anything to the actual family in the first place....unless it was ill-gotten gain.....which probably got him/her locked up in the first place and STIGMATIZED the entire family!!!

these people should ALL be FORCED to work. for anything they get in prison....If they are healthy enough to have committed a crime that sent them there....then surely they are healthy enough to SUPPORT themselves....pay rent...pay for snacks....etc. :cuss:

[CelticDawn]

Absolutamente! Hard labor is NOT cruel or unusual punishment and should be used, imo.

Welcome, btw!

thank You. I am normally on the "other side" I am not so sure why there are multiple message boards, but I sure do like the decor here.....and the peace.

[Twinners]

Hadn't Casey stolen upwards of $45,000 from various sources? Looks like even after all those six packs and Target bras, she would have had money for airfare. Maybe she's just too much of a sloth to make a move.

Yes, I remember something about it being around $45,000. However, I think the majority of that was not taken as cash or checks. I think Casey generally created accounts using Cindy's name, then ran up the amounts on the accounts, knowing Cindy would pay those bills just to keep her credit from being ruined any further. That's how I think Casey stole from her mother the majority of the time. I think she probably gained access to Cindy's bank account online and used it to pay her bills (or whatever), as needed, as well.

Basically, I think Casey stealing money from Amy points to her being cash-poor around the time Caylee went missing. I'm sure she could have pulled together enough money from what she took from Amy to pay for her airfare, but she would've also needed needed more cash than that, IMO. She would've needed "getting started" money, IMO, to use in whatever new place she chose... until she found someone new to cipher money, that is.

[Amy]

You know what torks me about these complaints from prisoners' families about how they are broke and now have to send more money to the prisoner for their snacks?

How dare prisoners accept money from their destitute families, who are probably living in penury since there is one less income! If I were in jail and cost my family money, I would never take food out of my children's mouth to buy HoneyBuns!!!!! How could you leave your family more broke? aaaargh! Ban "canteens"! It will be a public service!

My first tho't was--the A's aren't down one income--because Casey did not bring in any income since 2006--and what do you bet that even back then, she was mainly supported by the A's, her money being hers to spend how she wanted on herself. Except for contributing to her canteen fund, there are no longer any expense put out for Casey--food, gas and maintenance on the car, etc. Unfortunately there are also no more expences relating to Caylee, either.

Anyway, they are down ONE income now--Cindy is no longer working. George seemed to have been working only sporadically, but I guess you could count his disabilty (thinking he was on short-term disability or worker comp) or his unemployment. Now, I would assume Cindy, possibly even George could be collecting unemployment. IMO, they are getting money from somewhere--they still have their house and cars-either someone paid those off, or is making payments. So, either there is a benevolent benefactor somewhere in the background, and/or they ARE receiving funds for licensing fees, or for appearances (no matter WHAT the networks say, bet there was a bidding war for this last spate of appearances, and not just in airfare and lodging.)

[Amy]

the one in prison probably wasn't contributing anything to the actual family in the first place....unless it was ill-gotten gain.....which probably got him/her locked up in the first place and STIGMATIZED the entire family!!!

these people should ALL be FORCED to work. for anything they get in prison....If they are healthy enough to have committed a crime that sent them there....then surely they are healthy enough to SUPPORT themselves....pay rent...pay for snacks....etc. :cuss:

Welcome to the board. I lurk around in the other board, but rarely post.

My post about the A's finances did include this point--except that post went into cyberspace and I forgot it when I reposted.

Not only did Casey not contribute to household expenses (except maybe a bag of groceries in 6 mo time according to George) for @ least 2 years. HER income consisted mainly on that which she stole from the A's--so anything she contributed actually came from them in the first place.

[Amy]

I suspect they are mainly living off backdoor licensing. I do wonder what other sources they may have from former work. I also wonder if they have thought down the road-ya know when nobody cares what pics etc they have or what they have to say? Prolly not-live for the moment. MOO

IMO, either they have tho't about it, or someone brought it to their attention--the lastest foundation they are setting up. Didn't that include that the board members would be receiving fairly healthy salaries for being on the board?? Cindy, George, Lee. The first foundation included Mallory and her mother, I think @ least one is on the board of the new foundation.

That being said, I'm not sure how long anyone would be contributing to the foundation....if they do not perform the mission they put out. And trolling around a stagnant lake in a rowboat with Caylee's name isn't really searching for any missing child. IMO.

[Mojo]

I love humid heat! It's like getting a hug from the air!

woohahhaa! I just pulled a Nawnie and spit water all over my keyboard! I live on the Gulf Coast. Come visit in August. You will not be saying that again! It's so humid sometimes, that when I go outside to smoke, I blow it out and it sinks to the ground.

[Mojo]

I know i hear ya-luv the heat-hate the humidity. It can get horrible here but the worst was having to be in Fla. one July-thought i would die. Of course i was hot flashing too just to add to the mix.I hope your keyboard is ok-sippy cup-only safe way to go. I must add tho i would trade being driven in for several months of the year due to the heat and humidity for our canadian winters :seeya:

I will agree with you there! We got snow this December. We NEVER get snow. We got about 4 inches. Extremely rare. Of course, the entire city took a day off. They cannot drive in the rain so you can forget driving in snow!

[Amy]

The only time it's humid where I live is in the summer if a storm is brewing. I went to college about 250 miles from where I grew up. It was the most miserable 3 years of my life!!! My hair was constantly in a frizz for one thing. Had a little trouble getting all that moist air into my lungs. I was used to dry dry dry air!!!

Went to Nashville once, in the spring. Tho't I was gonna die. Realized that Nashville would not be the place for me--so I had to give up my dream of marrying some hot C&W singer, lol!!!!

[deacon]

I occasionally watch the shows where the moms take the little, and I do mean little, some still just BABIES, to the pageant circuit. The moms--OMG, I feel sorry for all of their kids--the ones who get their attention (the little beauty queens) and their other kids who are kind of left in the background. Oh, Jr just LOVES helping Sis get ready for pageants. He WANTS all his allowance to go for her latest dress/make-up/wig. He isn't @ all interested in sports. (PUKE.) Anyway, the little girls crying half the time, tired like all little kids are after several hours of activity, but nope, no nap for the beauty queen!!! Get up here and work on your routine until you get it right!!!

My son plays golf. Has since he was 4. He loves the game but understands that it is just a game. He has a 0 handicap which means he shoots par or better most of the times he plays. If he practiced like a pro there is a chance he could be one. I really think his take on this is great. He said, "Dad, if I have to practice that much it is a job and not fun. I play golf for fun not work. I sell golf clubs for work." Some may think I am kidding but we played at the course where the seniors once played the Liberty Mutual Legends of Golf tournament. At 12 he shot a 78 (2 over par) from the men's tees. I haven't come close to beating him since he was about 11.

He, I think, has his priorities in the right place.

[Gatordog]

You know what torks me about these complaints from prisoners' families about how they are broke and now have to send more money to the prisoner for their snacks?

How dare prisoners accept money from their destitute families, who are probably living in penury since there is one less income! If I were in jail and cost my family money, I would never take food out of my children's mouth to buy HoneyBuns!!!!! How could you leave your family more broke? aaaargh! Ban "canteens"! It will be a public service!

Thre's one jail here, I think in Polk county, where the jail is now charging inmates $2 a day for their food. I'm surprised people aren't commiting crimes just to eat and get free airconditioning.

Gator

[Gatordog]

Gator i am assuming that dang boat is still being kept in the Ant's driveway? That just makes me crazy. And it will never leave the drive unless fishing or as u said-G being a fishing guide. I wish they would get ship wrecked on some uncharted desert isle. After the trial tho. MOO

No, it's not in the diveway. Keeping it there would be against the Homeowner's Association rules. It wasn't there the last time I past the house. Probably has it in the garage. Lord knows it's not being used to search the St. John's River for Haleigh Cumming's body.

Gator

[Master Trim]

Having looked at the online recipes for Chloroform, I don't think it could be accidentally made. I do know that if you mix bleach and ammonia together it creates a gas that will cause you stop breathing. A friend's mother did that while we were in high school and had to call the fire department to air out their house.

Online recipies for making chlororm describe reacting beach with acetone.

The acetone is an organic sovent and others (such as ethanol) will work also.

Cleaners often have a warning about mixing different types because The chlorine bleach will react with solvents. Many reactions can take place - usually chlorine gas is given off, but several compounds (including chloroform) might well be produced.

It's not hard to imagine that anybody cleaning a trunk might try different cleaners and so COULD produce some chloroform.

Certainly, whether that actually happened or not, a defense lawyer could put that forward as a very plausible explanation for small amounts of Chloroform. Easily argued to a standard of "Reasonable Doubt".

[Justice Denied?]

Air travel gift cards at Tarjae" ???? Not sure they sell them there. In fact I think the only gift cards Target sells is for "Target Only".. IIRC Safeway carries gift cards for American Express/Visa/Starbucks/Macy's/Nordstroms/Sach's/JC Penae's'/maybe SW Airlines but I'd have to check on that.

I'm thinkin' you're absolutely spot on with your assessment of the above. http://i40.tinypic.com/2h6bpqc.jpg

I saw or read somewhere that you could make chloroform from liquid hand soap and bleach. Got to wondering if it would work with liquid laundry soap and bleach. I know that there was a bottle of Arm & Hammer laundry soap i Casey's car. I think Cindy probably intended to clean the car but LE took it before they had the chance.

[Justice Denied?]

Online recipies for making chlororm describe reacting beach with acetone.

The acetone is an organic sovent and others (such as ethanol) will work also.

Cleaners often have a warning about mixing different types because The chlorine bleach will react with solvents. Many reactions can take place - usually chlorine gas is given off, but several compounds (including chloroform) might well be produced.

It's not hard to imagine that anybody cleaning a trunk might try different cleaners and so COULD produce some chloroform.

Certainly, whether that actually happened or not, a defense lawyer could put that forward as a very plausible explanation for small amounts of Chloroform. Easily argued to a standard of "Reasonable Doubt".

But how does the defense attorney explain why they were cleaning the trunk in the first place? I don't think " to get rid of the dead body odor" will go too far.

[Master Trim]

But how does the defense attorney explain why they were cleaning the trunk in the first place? I don't think " to get rid of the dead body odor" will go too far.
I hate to be speaking FOR the defense. I am very definately anti this monster, but....

Not hard to put forward the case that they got the car back, smelly because KC had left a bag of garbage in it. Quite natural thing to have a go at cleaning it.

[Master Trim]

That being my point of this chloroform issue being a double edged sword. Unless he brings in the dead squirrels yep yep that would be plausible ;)
I really think the chloroform thing is way over-done.
Brief google search means nothing.
Nobody amoungst all the witnesses ever saw any chloroform or suspicious bottles.
It really is not going to be an issue unless it turns up in toxicology of the remains

[Master Trim]

No but it may tie in with-who watched Caylee when G&C did not. Where was Caylee the night she spent with the boyfriend-G&C did not have her. Also useful in a soft kill when u want to incapacitate a victim quickly. Add it to her other searches and all the other evidence-she was not planning a birthday party. MOO
All true but.....

No point building scenarios about its use manufacture etc unless it is an issue, and it's not unless it's found in toxicology.
There is no evidence of KC ever having any, or even being within 100miles of any chloroform. None has been found. No bottles with "residue" etc. Normal decomposition and/or cleaning chemicals CAN explain "Raised levels" in trunk.
Besides all that, chloroform is tricky to use as proposed, and does not do what people imagine. It might give a 10 min knockout, but not long period for partying. If we must include drugging Caylee to sleep, then OTC meds can make a child sleep and stay asleep for hours, but NOT CHLOROFORM.

[Master Trim]

Wow. Surgeons must have been real quick back in the day. Of course, if a rag soaked with it were on a person's face, it might last longer than that.
A skilled anaethetist might be able to keep a patient asleep by constant monitoring and re-application. That's not the same as knock out and walk away.
Patients did die from its use. It was not favoured, and soon replaced.

[deacon]

And we all know that is exactly what Bozo will argue and attack the junk science as he calls it. Having said that IF Caylee's hair shows chloroform he cant get around that one. It would have to have been inhaled and over a period of time. MOO :seeya:

I find it interesting that he calls this "junk science." I guess this is a legal term.:) The chloroform was, IIRC, a fairly pure form. That would indicate that it didn't happen by chance. Most searches say it is not that difficult to make but one does not make it this pure by mistake.

I guess bozo will say that the decomp. in the trunk was junk science too. I did a little looking and The Body Farm has been in operation since 1981. That is not new science. Shoot, it isn't even "cutting edge" anymore. That will not be hard to prove. IIRC, they found chemicals in the trunk that were unique to human decomp. Potatoe? squirrel? Nope, human. The research says that the human body releases particular chemicals during decomp. that do not occur when other things decomp. That is why a dog can be trained to identify human decomp. and nothing else. Some will say, it is the smell. Well, what is smell? It is particular chemicals contacting the olfactory nerves. That is why we smell, the chemicals strike these nerves and send a message to our brain. Once we relate these sensations as, say, the smell of onions, as soon as that sensation occurs we know it is onions. I have found nothing else that smells like onions that is why I used that as an example.

To say that this evidence is "junk science" is like saying a trained dog can not find a rotting human body that it can not see. We all know that they can. These two sciences go hand in hand. They work off of the same principal.

[Native Alien]

All true but.....

No point building scenarios about its use manufacture etc unless it is an issue, and it's not unless it's found in toxicology.
There is no evidence of KC ever having any, or even being within 100miles of any chloroform. None has been found. No bottles with "residue" etc. Normal decomposition and/or cleaning chemicals CAN explain "Raised levels" in trunk.
Besides all that, chloroform is tricky to use as proposed, and does not do what people imagine. It might give a 10 min knockout, but not long period for partying. If we must include drugging Caylee to sleep, then OTC meds can make a child sleep and stay asleep for hours, but NOT CHLOROFORM.

Tox reports are not public yet. Still waiting on those and I have feeling that they will contain all the info that is needed to prove that Casey used chloroform not once, but multiple times on Caylee.

More info on Chloroform.....

http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Chloroform

[eatcupcakes]

Naw ya dont-I feel the same way. No perks what so ever for these people and no profit from crime :cuss:

If Sherriff Joe from Maricopa County in Arizona was running these prisons no one would have anything except 2 meals a day. He eliminated breakfast and serves them lunch of green bolonga sandwiches. He dosen't let them have coffee, can't read porno, has Christian Station running on all the TV's makes them wear stripes jump suites and pink underwear and makes them work on a road gang, if they choose to. We need more like him.

[deacon]

Yep-unless u are a defense attorney all logic and science-junk unless to their advantage. I hope they pick a smart jury-hell you dont even have to be smart-just reasonable. As far as i am concerned-there are only a few smells that u just know and never forget-decomp and cancer. MOO

Just for funnzies I looked chloroform up. In about 15 minutes I found a written 8 step or so recipe for it using common things you can find either in your home or in a hardware store. Interesting enough, some of these are also used in crystal meth manufacture. Hmmm. In that time I also found more than one place on the internet where you can buy it online. All it would take would be a credit card that you had applies for in another name. No record of the purchase.
*picture of a big red button*
that was easy.:cool:

[Native Alien]

I just don't believe that idiot could make it herself. She got it from somewhere or someone if its there. Xanax, though, isn't that mentioned in text messages as her having access to it?

I really want that tox report. I'm sick of speculating on stuff people already know the answers to...

That makes two of us wanting the tox reports Javahog.

[deacon]

For sure :beer:

And one byeproduct of decomp. of chloroform is phosgene. Look that one up. It was a popular chemical warfare agent of WWI. Easily applied and almost instantly deadly. Who knows, the tox could bring back traces of phosgene. nasty stuff.

[Master Trim]

And one byeproduct of decomp. of chloroform is phosgene. Look that one up. It was a popular chemical warfare agent of WWI. Easily applied and almost instantly deadly. Who knows, the tox could bring back traces of phosgene. nasty stuff.

As info comes to light about hazardous chemicals and toxic side reactions, does it sound plausible that KC got all the equipment and chemicals to make chloroform?
Months later had some on hand just when she needed it?

I think not? :no:

[Master Trim]

Wow, that'd be great. Too lazy to buy fresh, accidently makes a WMD.

No problem! :cool:

Just add "War Crimes" :flamemad:to KC's list of offences

[Master Trim]

Months later than what? Is there something about Casey's itinerary that leads you to that statement?

KC "google search" for chloraform(sic) 17th March (1:43pm from memory)

KC killed Caylee 16th/17th June

Three months qualifies as "Months"

[DrewBerry]

Something just struck me tho-Bozo can argue that chloroform was a result of a cleaning mixture-having said that it would not be reasonable that Liar was just in cleaning mode given all the garbage that was laying in the trunk? Nobody cleans there trunk with solvents then puts all that garbage back in it. Then there is the other side of the coin-Bozo will need to watch as this one could be a double edged sword. Did Liar try to clean the trunk to rid of dna,odour and proceed to put all the garbage back in-attempting to mask the odour?? Then as i have stated there still may be hair evidence that will show exactly why chloroform was in the trunk. In my opine this is a no win for Bozo.

Hi Beem. I think you're on to something---there's no way the Liar cleaned only her trunk and then left a "pizza" in there to rot in the heat. Also, was the rest of the car cleaned with chemicals? No. So she was just concerned with getting the smell out of the trunk. Why didn't she clean the interior of the car? Bozo has alot of 'spainin' to do. He's definitely out of his league here.
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

The toxicology is from the hair, and if it doesn't show up in her hair, it's not going to be a big thing anyway. If this was the first (and last) time Casey Anthony used Chloroform on Caylee, Dr. Perper has already stated it probably wouldn't show up in her hair. I'm sure the State has a good reason for not letting out the results, and I'm willing to bet the testing found other chemicals there ~ ie cough syrup by products, Bendadryl by products, a favorite of scumbag mothers looking to knock their children out. There IS something they found. The concentration found in the trunk, now that is a problem for the defense. They can shout Junk Science till the cows come home..it will be argued that this same JS has been used for awhile now and found to be solid evidence in thousands of other cases. Oakridge Laboratories has a solid rep, used by top Pros and Defense. For years.

Not sure where you got the info on chloroform (before they started using the anesthesia types we now know of). It would certainly not last for only 10 minutes, many patients were in a near comatose state often, an overdose, if you will. A little bit more and it would have been death. They worked on formulating a better anesthesia because of it's instability and the deaths.

Normal Decomp or cleaning chemicals CANNOT leave the levels of chloroform found in the trunk, and I highly doubt even she would have kept the bottles of ingredients once she used them...

One more thing. It was Casey's car. A dead body was in her trunk, her daughter is dead. There is evidence of human decomposition, and more than a handful of people who were witness to the smell, including Cindy and George. It is not the smell of a rotten potato, pizza, a burger, coldcuts, squirrels, laundry or any other thing you could possibly imagine. It is the most sickening smell, unlike no other, that you will ever know, and you will never forget it. I know this for a fact.

It is a joke, what Baez is putting out there as excuses for what was that childs body.

GREAT post, OS! :beer:ITA. Bozo is going down. What a bunch of crap.
DrewB

[deacon]

Wow, that'd be great. Too lazy to buy fresh, accidently makes a WMD.

It might suprise you just how easy phosgene is to make. All it takes is freon #12 and fire. The ref. does not burn, a chemical reaction happens in the presense of combustion. (Safety Guys have to know this stuff)

[browneyes106]

Yep-unless u are a defense attorney all logic and science-junk unless to their advantage. I hope they pick a smart jury-hell you dont even have to be smart-just reasonable. As far as i am concerned-there are only a few smells that u just know and never forget-decomp and cancer. MOO

I think even if jurors weren't familar with forsenics they would still convict Casey based on other parts of the case such as her history of stealing, the fight with Cindy, her behavior after "Caylee went missing" and the fact that she didn't let George look in the trunk.

[Master Trim]

The toxicology is from the hair, and if it doesn't show up in her hair, it's not going to be a big thing anyway. If this was the first (and last) time Casey Anthony used Chloroform on Caylee, Dr. Perper has already stated it probably wouldn't show up in her hair. I'm sure the State has a good reason for not letting out the results, and I'm willing to bet the testing found other chemicals there ~ ie cough syrup by products, Bendadryl by products, a favorite of scumbag mothers looking to knock their children out. There IS something they found. The concentration found in the trunk, now that is a problem for the defense. They can shout Junk Science till the cows come home..it will be argued that this same JS has been used for awhile now and found to be solid evidence in thousands of other cases. Oakridge Laboratories has a solid rep, used by top Pros and Defense. For years.

Not sure where you got the info on chloroform (before they started using the anesthesia types we now know of). It would certainly not last for only 10 minutes, many patients were in a near comatose state often, an overdose, if you will. A little bit more and it would have been death. They worked on formulating a better anesthesia because of it's instability and the deaths.

Normal Decomp or cleaning chemicals CANNOT leave the levels of chloroform found in the trunk, and I highly doubt even she would have kept the bottles of ingredients once she used them...

One more thing. It was Casey's car. A dead body was in her trunk, her daughter is dead. There is evidence of human decomposition, and more than a handful of people who were witness to the smell, including Cindy and George. It is not the smell of a rotten potato, pizza, a burger, coldcuts, squirrels, laundry or any other thing you could possibly imagine. It is the most sickening smell, unlike no other, that you will ever know, and you will never forget it. I know this for a fact.

It is a joke, what Baez is putting out there as excuses for what was that childs body.

BIG IF KC used chloroform it very likely had to be the first and last time. Most articles stress that it is tricky to use, and easy to use too much. If it was a "home made" brew containing remnants of bleach etc, even trickier.

I'll concede I can not find a mention of how long a patient is out when chloroform used, but it was used for short duration ops, and it did require mask and regular application by anaesthetist for longer ops. There were many deaths even when used by skilled doctors.

This is all moot because I don't think KC would have kept a science article, let alone followed it and made anything. (Perhaps coffee).:)

We can guess that toxicology might show almost anything.
So far we don't know.

Nobody has quantified the "raised levels" of chloroform in the trunk. Most likely talking about so many Parts per Million. Cleaning products COULD account for as much as you like depending on how much was used. I don't think that would be much, but I don't know.
It has already been conceded that there is no exact comparison data to match decomposition of a 2 year old in triple bags in a trunk. Most definately unusual and ANAEROBIC conditions which produce more Chloroform during decomposition.

IMO KC put the rubbish in the trunk to mask/explain the smell, but nobody, (not even Cindy) is really fooled.

I am not defending AT ALL the Baez mantra "junk science" The science is good, there was a decomposing human body in the trunk for aprox 3 days.

What I am saying is that bit of normal science that shows "raised levels" of chloroform can easily be explained by decomposition and POSSIBLY cleaning products.

[deacon]

BIG IF KC used chloroform it very likely had to be the first and last time. Most articles stress that it is tricky to use, and easy to use too much. If it was a "home made" brew containing remnants of bleach etc, even trickier.

I'll concede I can not find a mention of how long a patient is out when chloroform used, but it was used for short duration ops, and it did require mask and regular application by anaesthetist for longer ops. There were many deaths even when used by skilled doctors.

This is all moot because I don't think KC would have kept a science article, let alone followed it and made anything. (Perhaps coffee).:)

We can guess that toxicology might show almost anything.
So far we don't know.

Nobody has quantified the "raised levels" of chloroform in the trunk. Most likely talking about so many Parts per Million. Cleaning products COULD account for as much as you like depending on how much was used. I don't think that would be much, but I don't know.
It has already been conceded that there is no exact comparison data to match decomposition of a 2 year old in triple bags in a trunk. Most definately unusual and ANAEROBIC conditions which produce more Chloroform during decomposition.

IMO KC put the rubbish in the trunk to mask/explain the smell, but nobody, (not even Cindy) is really fooled.

I am not defending AT ALL the Baez mantra "junk science" The science is good, there was a decomposing human body in the trunk for aprox 3 days.

What I am saying is that bit of normal science that shows "raised levels" of chloroform can easily be explained by decomposition and POSSIBLY cleaning products.

IIRC and I may not, the question was not as much the level as the purity. I read tonight that somewhere around 500 ppm is IDLH.

[Master Trim]

IIRC and I may not, the question was not as much the level as the purity. I read tonight that somewhere around 500 ppm is IDLH.

I don't know the IDLH but that refers to administering the Chloroform, not really anything to do with testing decomposition amounts.:shrug:

Nobody (apart from NG on a bad day) is suggesting that the trunk had lethal amounts of chloroform when testing the smell and stain. That would be silly! The trunk had been open, shut, cleaned, looked at, inspected, samples taken etc, and nobody died!!
They may well have gone away to vomit! But that was because it smelled like a Bolivian Unicyclist's Jock Strap! :eek:

[Native Alien]

There is something that has been bothering me and I just had someone else back up what I have been thinking on this.

George and Cindy had a pool and were supposedly so worried about Caylee getting into the pool accidentally. Why was that child not waterproofed? I know that she was old enough.

[One2Snoop]

Bump....

Excerpt: Sources with knowledge of the investigation told WESH 2 that air samples from Casey Anthony's car came back positive for vaporized chloroform.

"I think it's as significant or more significant than finding decomposition products," chemist Jeff Flowers said.

Flowers has testified in state and federal court as an expert and said positive tests for vaporized chloroform mean those results could not have come from cleaning products, human body fluids or a mixture of anything else. Flowers said it had to have been pure chloroform.

"It could not have come from a chemical reaction in the trunk. It's impossible. That solvent could knock out the driver of the car. It's a very dangerous thing to have that material in your car," Flowers said. ...cont.

Link: Sources: Air Samples From Casey Anthony's Car Came Pack Positive For Vaporized Chloroform (http://www.wesh.com/news/17392699/detail.html)

[browneyes106]

You know what torks me about these complaints from prisoners' families about how they are broke and now have to send more money to the prisoner for their snacks?

How dare prisoners accept money from their destitute families, who are probably living in penury since there is one less income! If I were in jail and cost my family money, I would never take food out of my children's mouth to buy HoneyBuns!!!!! How could you leave your family more broke? aaaargh! Ban "canteens"! It will be a public service!

My cousin and uncle worked in prisons here in New Mexico years ago. They said that usually when inmates entered the prison system their families and spouses were very supportive in putting money in their accounts but over time the families either could no longer afford to put money in or they got fed up with the fact that their child, spouse, or sibling was in prison. Commissaries/canteens in a lot of states have overpriced items. I have a friend who lives in Oklahoma and is a corrections officer he has said that stuff like board games, notebooks, plastic cups are very overpriced. He said that a checkers set sold through the commissary is about $12 while a checkers set at a Wal-Mart store is only $9. I think canteens/commissaries should be eliminated in prison and jail systems.

[browneyes106]

If Sherriff Joe from Maricopa County in Arizona was running these prisons no one would have anything except 2 meals a day. He eliminated breakfast and serves them lunch of green bolonga sandwiches. He dosen't let them have coffee, can't read porno, has Christian Station running on all the TV's makes them wear stripes jump suites and pink underwear and makes them work on a road gang, if they choose to. We need more like him.


Too bad Casey can't be in a jail where she gets to eat green bologna sandwiches.

[Master Trim]

Bump....
I have seen this before. and also read fbi and body farm reports the reports. The article seems like hype to me.

The documents talk of testing air samplesfrom trunk, and air samples from evidence placed in sealed containers. By definition that is "Vapour" sample. That does not mean they found a toxic car filled with chloroform vapour. Obviously not. GA drove it lots of people opened and shut trunk.

[deacon]

I don't know the IDLH but that refers to administering the Chloroform, not really anything to do with testing decomposition amounts.:shrug:

Nobody (apart from NG on a bad day) is suggesting that the trunk had lethal amounts of chloroform when testing the smell and stain. That would be silly! The trunk had been open, shut, cleaned, looked at, inspected, samples taken etc, and nobody died!!
They may well have gone away to vomit! But that was because it smelled like a Bolivian Unicyclist's Jock Strap! :eek:

That was what I was saying. It was the purity of the chemical, not the amount tha alerted them.

Decomposition in the trunk is somewhat of a done deal. Like I said in an earlier post, the science of this find is not new, has been proven and if one wants to say it is junk science then they are discrediting the science under which dogs can find decomposing human bodies that are buried underground. It is all about the chemicals that a human body gives off as it decomposes.
H2S (hydrogen sulfide) is just one of many. It is a gas given off by rotting organic matter. Any organic matter. It has a very low odor threshold and is commonly refered to a "rotten egg smell." It, however, will not throw a peoperly trained dog off. It isn't the chemical they are trained to react to. Given that and the fact we know that dogs can tell the difference between human decomposition and other rotting organic matter it is simply shifting that search to gas sensing meters instead of a dog's nose.

This ain't "junk science." He may try to call it junk science but it is not. It isn't even "new science." The Body Farm has been studing this since 1981 as well as the methods of telling how long a person has been dead based on other observable data and appearances.

[deacon]

It's safe to say, the levels at the time of the murder were nowhere as low as when the car was found and tested. What is important is that the testing still showed levels that were registering enough to give them the reading they did get. This will be an important factor when added to the level of purity of the chloroform shown, which is a major issue. I know if you checked my trunk or hundreds of thousands of other people for that matter, you wouldn't get a hit at all. a Search for chloroform ~ chloroform found in trunk...One doesn't need to be be rocket science to see 1+1=2, and what it means.

a brief explaination by Flowers...http://www.wesh.com/news/17800136/detail.html
Dr. Baden's recent slip up on chloroform found in Caylee's hair follicleshttp://mhutch.blogspot.com/2009/03/chloroform-inside-caylee-anthonys-hair.html

Now where's those tox reports?!

I think it is an "I's and T's" thing right now. IF the tox reports show levels of Chloroform, that would be a really big problem for the defence.

[eatcupcakes]

Wow, that'd be great. Too lazy to buy fresh, accidently makes a WMD.

You just made me think (I don't like to think) if she did use chloroform, made it or bought it. What happened to it. Since it could be deadly espically if the stupid bi-ach made it and made WMD. And if she did make it and it was deadly how come she wasn't affected as well. Just thinking, hate thinking.

[Amy]

Since chloroform turns up in tons of cleaning products, and is also produced from mixing them, the defense will totally be able to argue someone cleaned. http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/es702355u

UNLESS it turns up in the hair. No way Casey could be described as habitually tidy, imo.

The way I understood it, the A's in fact DID clean the car prior to Cindy going to TonE's to haul Casey's patooty back home. They were cleaning, Cindy sent George back to work. She found Amy's information whilst they were cleaning (don't know if that was before or after George went to work.) She also had removed the foul smelling pants from the car during their cleaning spree.

[eatcupcakes]

Has anyone else noticed that no one not neighbors friends or other family members or co-workers of the Ants have come forward to say what nice people they are and how awfull that this has happened to them. Neighbors that like in the case of BTU killer said how nice he was and he always offered to help them. All I have heard of a neighbor of the Ants saying George was always pulling Caylee in her little red wagon around the neighborhood. And I have never heard of any of the Liars friends come forward and say she was such a good mother that they just can't believe she would have hurt her daughter. Even the Craig List Killer has friends and a girl friend saying they can't believe he did the crime and they must have the wrong person.

I find it very strange that no one but themselves seem to be supportive of them. They must not be very nice people.

[Amy]

Wow. Surgeons must have been real quick back in the day. Of course, if a rag soaked with it were on a person's face, it might last longer than that.

If it was administered in the same fashion as ether was, it would have been a sort of drip into a mask? Not just a quick dose, but a slow steady administration? I'm betting also that, if we looked back on the use of chloroform as an anesthetic, there was probably a fairly high mortality rate.

[Amy]

Yep-unless u are a defense attorney all logic and science-junk unless to their advantage. I hope they pick a smart jury-hell you dont even have to be smart-just reasonable. As far as i am concerned-there are only a few smells that u just know and never forget-decomp and cancer. MOO

Add gangrene, altho I suppose that could be considered human decomp, just from a live person as opposed to a dead one.

[Amy]

Has anyone else noticed that no one not neighbors friends or other family members or co-workers of the Ants have come forward to say what nice people they are and how awfull that this has happened to them. Neighbors that like in the case of BTU killer said how nice he was and he always offered to help them. All I have heard of a neighbor of the Ants saying George was always pulling Caylee in her little red wagon around the neighborhood. And I have never heard of any of the Liars friends come forward and say she was such a good mother that they just can't believe she would have hurt her daughter. Even the Craig List Killer has friends and a girl friend saying they can't believe he did the crime and they must have the wrong person.

I find it very strange that no one but themselves seem to be supportive of them. They must not be very nice people.

There were several, way back in the first couple of articles that came out. And Holly, the one now on the board of the new Caylee foundation even went on one of the talk shows and explained how good a mother Casey was--you know she was a good mother and could NOT have killed her own baby based on the fact that she breastfed Caylee.

It has been a long time, tho, since there was a show of support. Heck, even their own families are staying out of the limelight. There were statements from some family (George's BIL from Ohio actually is the only one I remember speaking up to media) again way back in the beginning. Yep, it's all very strange that there is nothing more from family, friends and neighbors.

[deacon]

You just made me think (I don't like to think) if she did use chloroform, made it or bought it. What happened to it. Since it could be deadly espically if the stupid bi-ach made it and made WMD. And if she did make it and it was deadly how come she wasn't affected as well. Just thinking, hate thinking.


On that, if she made it, it would not have been that much. You see, it would not take as much or a child as an adult. Sometimes we forget, I think, we are talking about a 2-3 year old child and not an adult. That small a body would not have taken near the dose to kill as an adult. If, and I stress the if, she did use this, it would have probably been on a rag or towel held over the nose or mouth. When it vaporized outside of the confined area between the towel or rag it would disperse and not affect the person holding the towel. (Or at least that is my theory.) As for WMD, decomposing it would give off phosgene but not in levels that would be dangerous unless in a confined area.:eek: IIRC phosgene is a nerve agent that stops breathing very quickly. Now, if Caylee was in the trunk of that car and there was chloroform in that trunk and it was decomposing it would be in a confined enough area to kill her. That is another thought running through my empty head.:cool:

edited to add: Phosgene has what is called a Threshold Limit Value of .4 ppm. Threshold Limit Values are limits that should never be exceeded. So, you see, if there was phosgene gas produced by exposure of chloroform to sunlight in that trunk, it would not have taken a large amount. Problem is, as soon as the trunk was opened the very first time, it is gone.

We will see.

[Gatordog]

Hi Beem. I think you're on to something---there's no way the Liar cleaned only her trunk and then left a "pizza" in there to rot in the heat. Also, was the rest of the car cleaned with chemicals? No. So she was just concerned with getting the smell out of the trunk. Why didn't she clean the interior of the car? Bozo has alot of 'spainin' to do. He's definitely out of his league here.
DrewB

I don't think the Liar did any cleaning. She threw in some dryer sheets to try to mask the smell. If anyone did any cleaning it was Mommy and Daddy, afterall, George lives with a sponge in his hand.

Gator

[Gatordog]

There is something that has been bothering me and I just had someone else back up what I have been thinking on this.

George and Cindy had a pool and were supposedly so worried about Caylee getting into the pool accidentally. Why was that child not waterproofed? I know that she was old enough.

If she was able to swim or not it would have made no difference. She was murdered, not accidentally drowned. As a District Attorney stated, you call 911 when an accident occurs unless you want the person to die.

Gator

[deacon]

I don't think the Liar did any cleaning. She threw in some dryer sheets to try to mask the smell. If anyone did any cleaning it was Mommy and Daddy, afterall, George lives with a sponge in his hand.
Gator

And lately with his foot firmly in his mouth and cindy's foot firmly somewhere else.

[Gatordog]

A nine year old boy went missing Sunday afternoon. His bicycle was found near a lake in a park. Did George take out his boat. No. Police divers went into the lake and found him yesterday.

Hey George - a boat is useless on land you idiot. I just thought of it - maybe he thinks it's like that stupid billboard he spent hours every day pulling behind his car. He thought that would find Caylee. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-think005.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org) Maybe he thinks if the tows the boat around, he'll find the missing drowned children.

Gator

[DrewBerry]

A nine year old boy went missing Sunday afternoon. His bicycle was found near a lake in a park. Did George take out his boat. No. Police divers went into the lake and found him yesterday.

Hey George - a boat is useless on land you idiot. I just thought of it - maybe he thinks it's like that stupid billboard he spent hours every day pulling behind his car. He thought that would find Caylee. http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-think005.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org) Maybe he thinks if the tows the boat around, he'll find the missing drowned children.

Gator

Hi Gator! Excellent post---you crack me up! I used to feel somewhat sorry for George but after seeing those 2 idiots on TV interviews and making asses of themselves during the depos. I have no empathy, sympathy, or otherwise for G & C. They breed rage and hate every time they open their mouths. They have been all about trying to save their "perfect family" image rather than seeking justice for little Caylee. I'm glad Oprah canceled them! :D
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

[QUOTE=Gatordog;9186841]I don't think the Liar did any cleaning. She threw in some dryer sheets to try to mask the smell. If anyone did any cleaning it was Mommy and Daddy, afterall, George lives with a sponge in his hand.

Gator[/QUO


Gator, you are so right about who cleaned out that car. What LIARS! The truth will come out and then Cindy can write "another fake suicide note." :flamemad:
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

When NG showed a portion of the interview on GMA and the woman interviewing said, (paraphrased) There seems to be a lot of evidence against Casey... The look on Cindy's face was precious when she shot a look at Conway.. He claims they are waiting to tell the truth at the trial.

Can I choke her? :cuss:

Good to see you back! Hope you had a great trip to Disney.
Yes, that look on Cindy's face was golden, wasn't it? AND, what the heck is Conway thinking letting these 2 run their mouths off like they are? I lost any respect for him long ago.
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

Has anyone else noticed that no one not neighbors friends or other family members or co-workers of the Ants have come forward to say what nice people they are and how awfull that this has happened to them. Neighbors that like in the case of BTU killer said how nice he was and he always offered to help them. All I have heard of a neighbor of the Ants saying George was always pulling Caylee in her little red wagon around the neighborhood. And I have never heard of any of the Liars friends come forward and say she was such a good mother that they just can't believe she would have hurt her daughter. Even the Craig List Killer has friends and a girl friend saying they can't believe he did the crime and they must have the wrong person.

I find it very strange that no one but themselves seem to be supportive of them. They must not be very nice people.

Great points, cupcakes. Silence speaks volumes doesn't it?! It really is so
abnormal but the Ants ARE an abnormal, sick family that will lie for each other rather than get justice for their murdered granddaughter.
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

I think even if jurors weren't familar with forsenics they would still convict Casey based on other parts of the case such as her history of stealing, the fight with Cindy, her behavior after "Caylee went missing" and the fact that she didn't let George look in the trunk.

Hi Browneyes. . .AND don't forget, Liar did not report her daughter missing for 31 flippin' days! :flamemad:She got busted by mommy dearest or she never would have called the police. This fact alone will not get passed over by any decent jury. JMO.
DrewB

[tv]

I don't think the Liar did any cleaning. She threw in some dryer sheets to try to mask the smell. If anyone did any cleaning it was Mommy and Daddy, afterall, George lives with a sponge in his hand.
Gator

Gator, for some reason this made me laugh out loud. I think it was the mental picture! :D

[POE-33]

I know its been asked many times, many ways...but what's wrong with them? :shrug:


At this point in time, I can't see how anyone can possibly believe that Cindy & George really think that Casey is innocent.
They are obviously lying and trying to cover-up and have been all along.

I'm sick of hearing these taling heads on TV say how the sympathize with Cindy & George.
:mad:

[NMurphy02]

I'm sick of hearing these taling heads on TV say how the sympathize with Cindy & George.


ME TOO! Give me a break!

[One2Snoop]

Meter reader in Casey Anthony case gets money for legal costs

David Damron | Sentinel Staff Writer
1:09 PM EDT, April 28, 2009

he meter reader who discovered the body of Caylee Marie Anthony will get another $2,500 in legal support from taxpayers, Orange County Commissioners decided today.

Roy Kronk, who works for the county's utility department, was already provided with county funding to deal with media and privacy issues related to the discovery.

The additional funds are aimed at dealing with any legal issues that arise with the upcoming criminal proceedings against the girl's mother, Casey Anthony.

Casey Anthony, 23, is charged with first-degree murder in her daughter's death.

Earlier this month, Kronk's attorney, David Evans, wrote in a recent court filing that a request from Anthony's defense team for all of Kronk's cell-phone records was too broad and was not "reasonably calculated" to lead to information related to the case.

The defense's request "constitutes harassment of Mr. Kronk and a substantial invasion of his privacy," Evans wrote.

In December, the toddler's remains were found by Kronk in woods less than a mile from the Anthony home.

Commissioners today approved the additional $2,500 in a consent agenda item, and no commissioner pulled it for discussion, so it passed with a number of other, typically non-controversial county business items.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/orl-bk-casey-anthony-kronk-funding-042809,0,5786669.story

[deacon]

Tell wise poppa-if he can answer the question-he's up for the nobel peace prize LOL-I'll bet he has a good answer. I will have a boo in a bit at pics-I have an appt. shortly with my crazy hairdresser :seeya: Oh and tonight on Law and Order-a storyline somewhat based on this case. Snoop posted it in the no discussion-for details. :seeya:

What is right with the whole lot of them would certain to recieve a much shorter answer.:D

[Amy]

Good to see you back! Hope you had a great trip to Disney.
Yes, that look on Cindy's face was golden, wasn't it? AND, what the heck is Conway thinking letting these 2 run their mouths off like they are? I lost any respect for him long ago.
DrewB

Just like NeJames had no control over his clients, I don't think Conway does, either. He is just trying to do damage control where he can on the interviews, IMO. Not that he is effective in that. But, he does have control over the "mistruths" he spouts. The reason I have no respect for him is that he does speak mistruths, and that he did not take a hike like NeJames did once he realized the A's are gonna do what the A's want to do, regardless of advice of a lawyer.

Maybe the A's should just forego having a lawyer, and get their advice from the one who spends her long, interminable days reading law books. Not that they'd take her advice, either, lol.

[Gatordog]

Just like NeJames had no control over his clients, I don't think Conway does, either. He is just trying to do damage control where he can on the interviews, IMO. Not that he is effective in that. But, he does have control over the "mistruths" he spouts. The reason I have no respect for him is that he does speak mistruths, and that he did not take a hike like NeJames did once he realized the A's are gonna do what the A's want to do, regardless of advice of a lawyer.

Maybe the A's should just forego having a lawyer, and get their advice from the one who spends her long, interminable days reading law books. Not that they'd take her advice, either, lol.

Hey, that one is the head of the Corporation, according to George. Can you just imagine he told her that she was in charge and the police had to listen to her and do what she wanted. They think they are puppet masters.

Gator

[lorettalockhorn]

Tell wise poppa-if he can answer the question-he's up for the nobel peace prize LOL-I'll bet he has a good answer. I will have a boo in a bit at pics-I have an appt. shortly with my crazy hairdresser :seeya: Oh and tonight on Law and Order-a storyline somewhat based on this case. Snoop posted it in the no discussion-for details. :seeya:

Ya think Casey and Cindy will be flattered by the casting? :hat:

Preview:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWcGwi6C_dY

[lorettalockhorn]

Hey, that one is the head of the Corporation, according to George. Can you just imagine he told her that she was in charge and the police had to listen to her and do what she wanted. They think they are puppet masters.

Gator

That analogy kills me to this day! (And the Finger Family.) And interesting that former LE would say that. How often was he a puppet?

[lighthousedazy]

Ya think Casey and Cindy will be flattered by the casting? :hat:

Preview:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWcGwi6C_dYThey certainly have the temperaments of those 2 nailed to a T. jmo :D

[browneyes106]

Has anyone else noticed that no one not neighbors friends or other family members or co-workers of the Ants have come forward to say what nice people they are and how awfull that this has happened to them. Neighbors that like in the case of BTU killer said how nice he was and he always offered to help them. All I have heard of a neighbor of the Ants saying George was always pulling Caylee in her little red wagon around the neighborhood. And I have never heard of any of the Liars friends come forward and say she was such a good mother that they just can't believe she would have hurt her daughter. Even the Craig List Killer has friends and a girl friend saying they can't believe he did the crime and they must have the wrong person.

I find it very strange that no one but themselves seem to be supportive of them. They must not be very nice people.

There were several, way back in the first couple of articles that came out. And Holly, the one now on the board of the new Caylee foundation even went on one of the talk shows and explained how good a mother Casey was--you know she was a good mother and could NOT have killed her own baby based on the fact that she breastfed Caylee.

It has been a long time, tho, since there was a show of support. Heck, even their own families are staying out of the limelight. There were statements from some family (George's BIL from Ohio actually is the only one I remember speaking up to media) again way back in the beginning. Yep, it's all very strange that there is nothing more from family, friends and neighbors.

I remember hearing about and seeing Holly Gagne on tv. Something seems off with that Holly. There have been articles where a few of the Ant neighbors said that George was friendlier than Cindy. I think it was a Hispanic neighbor that said that. George to me seems that have friendlier demeanor than Cindy. I think George's relationship with his family in Ohio is probably strained due to what happened with George's dad's auto business. Also George's sister and brother in law probably are staying out of the media because they don't want their auto business to be effected by what's going on.

[deacon]

Cindy said she didn't report it for31 days because "she was Skeered"

I can't take it... :cuss:

I have been married to my wife for quite a long time and let me tell you, if that would have been her daughter there would have been H_LL to pay. Whew, that lady would have whooped someone over that.:cuss:

Edited to ask: Where is that case of whoop a_ _?

[lorettalockhorn]

I have been married to my wife for quite a long time and let me tell you, if that would have been her daughter there would have been H_LL to pay. Whew, that lady would have whooped someone over that.:cuss:

Edited to ask: Where is that case of whoop a_ _?

http://i29.tinypic.com/2q2lev7.jpg

[JLette]

i am soooo watching that tonite, i love that show as well but hardly ever catch it as i have been an early to bed girl since i got preggers but ima go ahead and stay up just for that tonite!! too good to miss

[browneyes106]

Ya think Casey and Cindy will be flattered by the casting? :hat:

Preview:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWcGwi6C_dY

Gail O'Grady and Hilary Duff are much more attractive than Casey and Cindy. They should have casted less attractive actresses in those roles. Cindy to me looks a manly woman and Casey has a ugly nose and too much of her gums show.

[browneyes106]

Oh gawd Liar will be flattered and so will C and prolly the whole lot of em. I like the similarity of the grandma stating it smells like a dead body has been in the dam car. I will watch for sure-i luv the show. :hat:

I bet the producers probably made Gail O'Grady listen to Cindy's 911 call.

[wind149]

This whole sick group is covering for each others collective asses and I agree that Lee knows more than he has ever said too. He might very well helped her dispose of Caylee's body, he knows that area of the woods too and what has always blown my mind was when Casey says to them that she felt Caylee was close to home? Hell, if that statement is about the only thing she did not lie about!! She was found three blocks from home and what I think is going to be a major impact on the jury is her reaction the day Caylee's remains were found. She freaked! She was gambling that no one would find her body and she hyperventilated and asked for anxiety meds and if that was not where Caylee was, she would not have batted an eye, she knew at that moment her life was over and seeing as she is so into herself, it hit her hard and I would imagine in her mind she probably hopes that her dream team will get her a pass and I am wondering exactly what Bozo has been filling her head with and I am glad that the DA is seeking the DP because when she is found guilty and she will be, I am confident, they have so much on her, half of it would get her the needle and when the judge sentences her to death, her life ain't worth a plugged nickel, it will be a waiting game till her last appeal expires and then the date will be set and you know the Gov will not grant her a stay because he would be committing political suicide and I say this because this whole county hates her and her family with a passion, her dancing the night away while Caylee is missing, that outraged everyone and for him or her to grant her a stay would piss off voters who want her dead which pretty much the whole state of FL, she is not walking out of prison, she will be going out in a body bag.

[One2Snoop]

I wonder if there's a grandfather and an uncle to the child on L&O :eek:

Gawd forbid!

[DrewBerry]

:flamemad:I'm sick of hearing these taling heads on TV say how the sympathize with Cindy & George.


ME TOO! Give me a break!


ITA Murphy. WTF anyway? They feel sorry for G & C because "first they lost their granddaughter and now they've lost their daughter." GMAFB!! The ANTs would get more sympathy if they had originally forced the truth from one of the Liars they raised. I also count Lee as another Liar they raised. Liars raising Liars! I hope they ALL get nailed for obstruction!
JMO.
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

See for me, that does it. That can never been explained away. Casey not calling 911 is not "junk science". Even the stupidest juror in the world will decide on that one point, if nothing else, imo. Even 3 year olds call 911.

Right there with ya Java. :beer:There is no F'ng way the defense can explain that away. Cindy's answer: "She was skeered" won't fly. What a load of crap. They all disgust me.
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

At this point in time, I can't see how anyone can possibly believe that Cindy & George really think that Casey is innocent.
They are obviously lying and trying to cover-up and have been all along.

I'm sick of hearing these taling heads on TV say how the sympathize with Cindy & George.
:mad:

Great post POE. Exactly sums it up.
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

That analogy kills me to this day! (And the Finger Family.) And interesting that former LE would say that. How often was he a puppet?

I cracked up when you referred to the "Finger Family"!!!I could not stop laughing when George named off each finger member!! Remind me again, Loretta, who did he designate as the middle finger??!! HA! HA! Was it that wrist-smacking CMA moaner Lee?!:D
DrewB

[tv]

Hey guys, I have a question -- something I've been wondering about for a while. Why did Casey tell her mother that Caylee had been missing for 31 days? She could have easily made it two weeks or one week...why did she tell the truth about when she disappeared? We know she lies just to stay in practice. Why not lie about this also so it wouldn't look like she waited so long to report her missing?

[JLette]

Dont forget Law and Order SVU in about 15 minutes-NBC :seeya:

*sigh* lucky you i still have 3 hours to wait lol

[mu8shark]

The other scenario that plays out is that George did see Casey and Caylee on the 16th and once he left then Casey came back and killed Caylee that is the point where she tried to put the body in the ground behind the house.
but something spooked her

As someone that has dug many a fencepost hole in the sandy soil of Florida I can tell you that digging any size of a hole is a real pain. She realized that and then she put the body in the trunk. I believe at that point she only had the body wrapped in the blanket, with the duct tape and sticker already in place Once it started to smell she went back to the house and got everything and took care of the body and dumped it in the woods.

Chances are good that she laid the body on the ground while she was attempting to dig the hole and that is what the dogs hit on in the back yard. I go back and forth on whether George is telling the truth on this. At least now I think it is possible he did not. I would be willing to go with what LE puts up as the truth at trial because I think they can evaluate his credibility better than I can.

[tv]

Thanks beem and java -- she could have very well have been getting her jollies with the little rituals she was engaging in and also knew she wouldn't be able to show that Caylee was around after the 16th. Makes perfect sense. It's hard trying to figure out the Liar's thought processes -- that's why I keep up to date with what's going on in this forum! :)

[mu8shark]

Nancy Grace is getting more and more frustrating every night. Tonight at the beginning the stuff she said about Baez that he had an explanation for the partying while Caylee was missing and that Baez said the trunk smelled like a potato, yet she never told where that came from, instead she showed the same old footage again and again. I know Baez gave an interview but I have no sound so I can't view it, does anyone else know about this potato explanation or what Jose actually did say about the partying. In addition to NG being so rude I can barely tolerate her she seems to be really disorganized and putting stuff on the beginning of her show that is not true or that she never explains. Also at the first she alluded to them having footage on Casey maybe removing Caylee from the trunk at Amscot on the 27th. I find that highly doubtful that the body was in there that long. I think she is getting to be like these tabloids, they advertise one thing on the outside and the story inside is nowhere near the truth. If anyone can enlighten me on what Baez actually said on the two subjects it would be great.

[mu8shark]

NG says there's hidden security video of Casey at AMSCOT. All sorts of fun stuff could be on that. She says its a bombshell.

Also says a doc dump in hours. Her producer says more like weeks, as the defense got it yesterday.

eta: LP is poo-pooing the amscot video since it isn't as good as his motel murder story, lol! Well on this one note I agree with Leonard, I doubt it will show her dragging the body out of the trunk in broad daylight in a business parking lot. Nancy is just being sensational which she has done a lot of lately. That body was long gone by the 27th.

[mu8shark]

Okay I found the answer to one of my questions on another board when I googled. Apparently Jose said he read a report that a rotten potato smells a lot like a dead body, however dogs would not hit on a rotten potato and there was no rotten potato found in the trunk that I can recall. Also potatoes are chemically different in that they are mostly carbohydrate base while the human body is not and is protein based, so very different smells chemically. Nancy is really starting to piss me off in her coverage. She needs to quit showing the same old videos and at least adequately cover what is in her introduction because watching her is beginning to be a waste of time.

[DrewBerry]

Your posts make the gods smile wind! :) For that precious little baby, your words pay tribute!

For Caylee:rose::rose::rose::rose::rose:


I second that, Danagher! :beer:Wind, I always read every word you write and it is clear that most of us here agree that this group of twisted liars could actually care less about little Caylee. They sicken me and I hope and pray the Pros. can present the strongest case ever against this sociopath and bring charges against the rest of the damn clan for obstruction and perjury.
Glad the DP is back on the table.
DrewB

[mu8shark]

Pretty funky coinkidink, huh? They smell death, tow truck guy smells death, even Casey smelled death, then the "junk science" smelled death. Go figure. Yeah put that with Casey's party mode and not reporting her daughter... I am sure it was a potato. :eek:

[CelticDawn]

Yeah put that with Casey's party mode and not reporting her daughter... I am sure it was a potato. :eek:

Death according to towtruck operator
Death according to cindy(as per 911 call)
Death according to George ("Please don't let it be my granddaughter")
Death according to CASEY ("Squirrels?")
Death according to LEE? (as he giggled in a very sinister manner)

D E A T H penalty is what I say.
With all these people....who needs the "junk science" to verify what they say?

[One2Snoop]

NANCY GRACE

New Photos to Be Released in Casey Anthony Case
Aired April 28, 2009 - 20:00:00 ET

Bombshell tonight. Have secret surveillance photos of tot mom`s car emerged? And do they pinpoint the time little Caylee`s body may have been removed from tot mom`s car trunk-turned-coffin? Tot mom circling and circling, according to police evidence, before dumping that car at a local Amscot, leaving it chock full of personal items, begging to be stolen. Was tot mom trying to set up a would-be car thief for Caylee`s murder?

After a disastrous PR junket by grandparents George and Cindy, including a botched appearance on Oprah, tot mom`s defense lawyer piles on by speaking on camera, now saying he can explain photos of tot mom`s partying non-stop in the days after Caylee goes missing. He go on to compare tot mom to an accused black widow convicted of poisoning her husband with arsenic, the case later reversed. Is he planning to copy that defense, to battle evidence of deadly chloroform discovered in tot mom`s car?

The lawyer showing all his cards up front and dodging tough questions, still offering no explanation about the nanny they claim kidnapped Caylee or why tot mom goes a whole month without reporting Caylee missing. The lawyer claims cutting-edge science is junk science after it proves a decomposing body was in tot mom`s trunk, even going on to compare the smell of Caylee`s body to a potato. He then says tot mom`s been, quote, "intimidated" and intimates because there`s no cause of death and no eyewitness, tot mom is innocent.

snip
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0904/28/ng.01.html

[mu8shark]

NANCY GRACE

New Photos to Be Released in Casey Anthony Case
Aired April 28, 2009 - 20:00:00 ET

Bombshell tonight. Have secret surveillance photos of tot mom`s car emerged? And do they pinpoint the time little Caylee`s body may have been removed from tot mom`s car trunk-turned-coffin? Tot mom circling and circling, according to police evidence, before dumping that car at a local Amscot, leaving it chock full of personal items, begging to be stolen. Was tot mom trying to set up a would-be car thief for Caylee`s murder?

After a disastrous PR junket by grandparents George and Cindy, including a botched appearance on Oprah, tot mom`s defense lawyer piles on by speaking on camera, now saying he can explain photos of tot mom`s partying non-stop in the days after Caylee goes missing. He go on to compare tot mom to an accused black widow convicted of poisoning her husband with arsenic, the case later reversed. Is he planning to copy that defense, to battle evidence of deadly chloroform discovered in tot mom`s car?

The lawyer showing all his cards up front and dodging tough questions, still offering no explanation about the nanny they claim kidnapped Caylee or why tot mom goes a whole month without reporting Caylee missing. The lawyer claims cutting-edge science is junk science after it proves a decomposing body was in tot mom`s trunk, even going on to compare the smell of Caylee`s body to a potato. He then says tot mom`s been, quote, "intimidated" and intimates because there`s no cause of death and no eyewitness, tot mom is innocent.

snip
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0904/28/ng.01.htmlUm Jose of course there is no eyewitness, most people don't commit murder in a crowd, so duh and no cause of death, so what if we only prosecuted murderers who had eyewitnesses and just ignored cases where there was obviously a murder but no cause of death because the murderer was clever enough to hide the body well, we would barely prosecute anybody. No jury is going to buy that argument that is she is innocent for these reasons. Even if he hooks one errant juror with his arguments, no way, no how is he going to get 12 jurors to acquit her. It is laughable that she will go free as he suggests. The one thing I admired about Robert Shapiro(except in the OJ case) is that he knew when to plead , he knew when he was licked and what a jury would buy and would not buy.

[mu8shark]

I have seen this before. and also read fbi and body farm reports the reports. The article seems like hype to me.

The documents talk of testing air samplesfrom trunk, and air samples from evidence placed in sealed containers. By definition that is "Vapour" sample. That does not mean they found a toxic car filled with chloroform vapour. Obviously not. GA drove it lots of people opened and shut trunk.If may seem like hype to you but Dr Flowers is a chemist and a renowed one and he testifies in lots of trials when a chemist is needed, so I have to tell you, I would tend to side with this guy as he knows his stuff.

[mu8shark]

The way I understood it, the A's in fact DID clean the car prior to Cindy going to TonE's to haul Casey's patooty back home. They were cleaning, Cindy sent George back to work. She found Amy's information whilst they were cleaning (don't know if that was before or after George went to work.) She also had removed the foul smelling pants from the car during their cleaning spree. Here is my thinking on the chloroform, if Cindy and George say they cleaned the car and thus the chloroform by products, it begs a big coincidence. Casey also looked up chloroform and as a juror if I have one expert saying it is chloroform and not a cleaning product and another saying it is a cleaning product, the moment I hear she looked up chloroform , I would believe the first expert. There are no coincidences in true crime.!

[mu8shark]

Right there with ya Java. :beer:There is no F'ng way the defense can explain that away. Cindy's answer: "She was skeered" won't fly. What a load of crap. They all disgust me.
DrewB
I agree, the problem with the defense saying she did not call because she was scared is that they would have to provide a someone for her to be scared of, right? If you feel threatened it is because someone threatened you, they wrote you a note, called you, told you in person they were going to get your family, emailed, contacted you some way, so you have to be able to identify that person. They can't get up there and say she was scared of phantom nanny or worse she was just scared of someone, no names..... just someone. Although the defense does not have to prove anything per se, a jury is going to ask themselves the obvious questions, scared of who? The defense better be specific and have some proof of threats or in my opinion they are dead in the water.

[deacon]

Okay, this is just my opinion and nothing more. After some looking and thinking I have changed my mind about the cause of death. I really don't think chloroform caused Caylee's death. I think it was phosgene, a product of its decomposition. It started as chloroform but I really doubt that it was stored properly. If not, then phosgene would be the result. One reason, other than my belief that casey would not have stored it properly, is that phosgene would have been lethal at a much, much, much lower level than chloroform. In my thoughts, the chloroform found in the trunk was residue left. Oh, to have had the entire body. The different chemicals affect the body and cause death in two distinct ways. One attacks the ability to breath(phosgene) while the other attacks the central nervous system. Another particular thing about phsogene is that the results of the exposure can be delayed for up to 12 hours or so meaning that Caylee could have died sometime after she was exposed. Now if mommy dearest was trying to knock Caylee out for some reason and the chloroform had decomposed a bit the phosgene could have taken effect sometime later. My thoughts on where the duct tape came into play. Either of these two chemicals causes distress and at almost three years old I'll bet Caylee would have expressed her displeasure quite vocally. Hence the duct tape.

My mind roams when I work the night shift.

[eatcupcakes]

That's why her car was at amscot with all her goodies in plain sight...worst case, someone breaks in and prints give her a culprit. Best case, car stolen, and the dingo's got her baby. Trouble is, the lowest thieves don't want to cruise in the Stink Bomb. If thieves wouldn't take it, how did George not smell it? It was only a couple of days after their f-ing gas can incident, right?

She IS capable of forethought...unless someone else suggested it...

Number 1. Nancy Grace show needs to be cancelled or cut to half and hour

Number 2. Casey is as stupid as everyone thinks she is, she is just a LIAR. We are giving her to much credit for thinking she wanted the car to be stolen. She dumped it because it smelled so bad she could not drive it anymore.

# 3. When she parked the car and walked away she had already gotten ride of the body. The video is not gonna tell them anything.

#4. If anyone help her it was Lee for sure. If the car was dumped in hopes it would get stolen it was his idea.

#5. No one and I mean no one in this family of 4 has good Karma

#6. Has anyone seen these people really grieving for Caylee. When they gave te Depo and talked about her I didn't see a tear. Anger yes but not a tear for her not on the Early Show either.

#7. As I said in a previous post, no one has come forward to say what nice people they are.

This is a very sick family and normal minds are not going to be able to figure them out. They have closed ranks around their daughter/sister and even Water Boarding them is not gonna change their stories. They are like the next store neighbors in the movie the Burbs with Tom Hanks. Scary bunch.

[NMurphy02]

Casey is putting on weight. Must be eating a lot of that "icky" mayonaisse.

[eatcupcakes]

Hmmm, Interesting!

My problem with cause of death is the "duct tape" issue. If she out and out murdered her, then the tape would be unnecessary. It stands to reason that she duct taped her mouth to keep her quiet. So, your theory might be right on Deacon. I don't see her with the sticky hearts at her disposal during her travels, which brings me back to her house. This part confuses me. When and where did she tape her mouth and stick that heart on the duct tape? She couldn't possibly have done that deed after the body began to decompose, pray God!!!

(I get that she killed Caylee, what I don't get is where.) THe only thing that makes sense to me is that she stuffed her in the trunk so she could go party, Caylee died, she found her that way, but she taped her mouth, put the heart sticky on before she went pole dancing.


Otherwise, she slept at home that night after the fight with her very furious mother. I don't see it. She flew the coop that very night. IMO And George didn't hear a thing, or see a thing the next day.

A bunch of liars now defined, might be the last words of the closing argument.

IMO

Fight, there was no fight, go ahead, no, no, let him make an a** of himself on the thing. As per Cindy at the depo.:chicken:

[shadydaisy]

Okay I found the answer to one of my questions on another board when I googled. Apparently Jose said he read a report that a rotten potato smells a lot like a dead body, however dogs would not hit on a rotten potato and there was no rotten potato found in the trunk that I can recall. Also potatoes are chemically different in that they are mostly carbohydrate base while the human body is not and is protein based, so very different smells chemically. Nancy is really starting to piss me off in her coverage. She needs to quit showing the same old videos and at least adequately cover what is in her introduction because watching her is beginning to be a waste of time.

Oh please....I've had the honor of smelling both rotting potatoes and decomposing animal flesh - they are not at all similar. OK, maybe a lamb or groundhog are a child, but the smell is distinctive. Rotting potatoes may not smell pleasant but it's not nearly are potent as rotting flesh.

[eatcupcakes]

Yeah the heart sticker leads me to think the murder happened in the house. In my much prior posts about the cleaning of the trunk and the garbage in it-does anyone remember if all garbage was in the bag LE had to go back and get? Or was there other garbage LE found just laying in the trunk? It's still bugging me. Or do we even have that info?

I just realized how sick minded someone has to be to kill their own child and then put a heart sticker over the duct tape on the mouth. Is that I love you I hate you thing. I just don't get it.

[DrewBerry]

1) Yeah. Nancy isn't exactly putting in the effort. Is ANY investigation or proerp reporting going on in her production team?
2) She left her purse in it along with other personal items in plain sight. She DID want it to be at least broken into, and more conveniently, stolen.
3) The video will likely show her circling the amscot. She did NOT run out of gas and get help pushing it into the lot as she said. So, another lie, and why? Wanted car stolen.
4) I wonder if this is why the A's did their 180: I am holding to the thought they are protecting Casey to protect their other child. Somethings up there...
5) Bad JuJu, for sure.
6) Crab puffs are a sign of mourning in some cultures...NOT!
7) Nope, nobody, nada. Not co-workers, neighbors, church goers, checker at the supermarket.

As for waterboarding not working, wouldn't mind seeing someone take a go at it, anyway...


ITA, Java! Wouldn't mind seeing the whole fam-damly waterboarded. IMO, the Ants. are all "emotional terrorists".
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

Ugh! WHAT????? For all that is holy, I beg that they don't go this way! Poor Casey was scared, poor Casey was under stress, Poor little thing is so fragile and weak and young! And Caylee was what? The stronger of the two?

Dis is the iddy bitty finger family darling and we want you to just relax and know we are by your side through this whole thing so don't fret gorgeous, it's okay that you killed Caylee and we are your rock. You are fragile and pretty and we are proud of you! You need to know that we will help you get strong because you're faultless no matter what! We remain supportive, no matter what!

I want to swear right now but I'm enjoying this board too much. If I write what I'm wanting to say, I'll be banned for the rest of my life!
:cuss:

Good morning, Nawny. Everytime you reference that damn finger family analogy I simply cannot stop laughing!:D
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

This is almost too idiotic for me to summarize: http://www.wesh.com/news/19317898/detail.html

Jose Baez is intimating that he is going to go with the "ugly coping" defense. The partying, that was just a PTSD reaction to the stress of having her baby kidnapped.

Well, I'm glad that's been cleared up.

Yeah, yeah, poor little Liar didn't know how to manage her GRIEF!!
Also I've got a new nickname for Baez: Mr. Potato Head.:biggrin:
DrewB

[Gatordog]

That's okay Beemer! You and we know what's wrong with them! They have fazools in their heads, they don't know the meaning of the word love, and they are all having an affair with their own reflections and they're very passionate about it. Now think about this; They want to know why everyone in the world is not totally impressed with their beautiful liar because after all, she's pretty, slim, charming and has been unfairly judged. The LE agents have spent much too much time looking at her and not looking for Zannatha! That's the problem.

I can't get the small world song out of my head.. :hat:

Fazools in their heads! http://www.freesmileys.org/emoticons/emoticon-cartoon-003.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org)

Give to em, Nawny.

Gator

[eatcupcakes]

I lean toward Lee being involved somehow but something catches me with that, and that's the night Cindy got her home, and Lee claims he spoke with her while Cindy was outside pacing. He said, "Why did you not bring Caylee around?" (correct me if I'm wrong here) and she said, "Maybe I'm just a *****." That report leaves me to believe Lee was not involved in the abandoned car thing.

If he wasn't lying his azz off.


I agree with number 2. She was most likely high as a kite during a lot of her decisions too! She did a lot of stunkin thinkin.

They are all lying, it's a family trait. Lee, C & G have not taken lie detector tests and I don't believe they have even been asked so they can do what they all do best LIE!!!.

[lorettalockhorn]

That's why her car was at amscot with all her goodies in plain sight...worst case, someone breaks in and prints give her a culprit. Best case, car stolen, and the dingo's got her baby. Trouble is, the lowest thieves don't want to cruise in the Stink Bomb. If thieves wouldn't take it, how did George not smell it? It was only a couple of days after their f-ing gas can incident, right?

She IS capable of forethought...unless someone else suggested it...

It makes no sense that George wouldn't have smelled the stench while the car was in the enclosed garage. The only reason that I can imagine that he would lie is because he'd like to believe Cindy's BS that someone put a body in the car after it was towed.

Oh Deacon, you have my mind going...unfortunately the visual is kicking in too :(. Many times we have heard profilers and others discuss the murder of someone by someone close to them. Many times, because of this, the murderer tries to disassociate themselves from the victim by covering their face before, and after.

I never thought Casey Anthony had the b***s to do it while Caylee was just sitting there, talking or looking at her. IMO, she was sedated with OTC meds, or sleeping. Then the duct taping.

Your post brings up a thought that a plastic bag was also used, after the duct tape to make the chloroform more 'concentrated' in a smaller area...upon falling unconscious, the bag was taken off, and the remaining vapors/phosgene hours later was the result.... Any tools used, chloroform containers, bags, were thrown out ~ god only knows where.

Sleuths............
The point last night of the BOMBSHELL regarding the Amscott video, is that she was driving around the lot a few times, trying to decide where to leave the car, later to say the car was stolen and that was who killed Caylee. Why would someone drive the car around a lot....? Common sense answers that one. Question is, WHY did the State hold this info...? why put it out now, and Yes, Caylee was already dumped, we know that much. She wanted it to look like the car was stolen, even left a bunch of stuff on the front set and in the car, as we know her enablers later cleaned..... She was counting on that car disappearing from that lot. Lazarro didn't have a clue what she was plotting when he picked her up, and remember, she didn't call mommy and daddy to come get that car, even though she told Lazarro she did call daddy....ultimately the car was TOWED because it was there too long! Now we can see how/what she was thinking and plotting and scheming. The State has an ace in the hole! We know enough , by her actions to see that this is something she thought would work, counting on that car to be taken from that lot...NOT by the towing company! Twit!

Thanks for explaining the BOMBSHELL (slept right through it!!) I have always believed that Casey left the Stinkmobile at the Amscott hoping/praying that it would be stolen and that her purse in plain sight was the bait. Seems like early on, people were asking if there wasn't surveillance of the lot, and now we finally have it. There is no telling what the prosecution will have gleaned from the video and how it will be incorporated into their theory.

To paraphrase a line from The Hunt for Red October: Casey Anthony don't take a dump, son, without a plan.

[Gatordog]

Number 1. Nancy Grace show needs to be cancelled or cut to half and hour

Number 2. Casey is as stupid as everyone thinks she is, she is just a LIAR. We are giving her to much credit for thinking she wanted the car to be stolen. She dumped it because it smelled so bad she could not drive it anymore.

# 3. When she parked the car and walked away she had already gotten ride of the body. The video is not gonna tell them anything.

#4. If anyone help her it was Lee for sure. If the car was dumped in hopes it would get stolen it was his idea.

#5. No one and I mean no one in this family of 4 has good Karma

#6. Has anyone seen these people really grieving for Caylee. When they gave te Depo and talked about her I didn't see a tear. Anger yes but not a tear for her not on the Early Show either.

#7. As I said in a previous post, no one has come forward to say what nice people they are.

This is a very sick family and normal minds are not going to be able to figure them out. They have closed ranks around their daughter/sister and even Water Boarding them is not gonna change their stories. They are like the next store neighbors in the movie the Burbs with Tom Hanks. Scary bunch.

Sorry Cupcakes - I can't agree. First of all, where she left is in one of the highest crime intersections in east Orange County. There are multiple homeless camps there and a murder was commited on that corner just two months ago and a revenge fire was set just last week.

As far as the video, it can show that no one else tampered with the car while it was parked at Amscott. Remember Cindy said that perhaps someone else put a dead body in that car. I think the video will be important. The Amscott manager said it was there when she arrived at 7 ish in the morning. The Liar didn't call Tony to pick her up until hours later. Why? Did someone else drive her around for three hours?

[Gatordog]

I agree DrewB. Don't you just want to see them suffer? I do too and that is totally against everything I am. Obviously losing Caylee didn't do it. I can't get past the fact they they grieve only Casey's problems. I have never seen anything quite like it. Where are they getting all this energy to fight for Casey? They should be holed up in their house weeping between every step they take. Do you think this stuff is a major distraction from grief? Or are they only concerned with what appears on their plate? Caylee is gone, she's just a ship that passed in the night?? WTF? Are they human?

Hey Nawny, it makes me wonder if, when it does come to trial, will G&C wear the Caylee picture buttons in the courtroom? We know they will sit behind their Lying Daughter on the Defense side, so will they still have their buttons on for the jury to see?

Gator

[DrewBerry]

At least they have each other...well, what's left, anyway...
http://i41.tinypic.com/2qjax5c.png

OMG, Java! That is tooooo funny :D.
DrewB

[DrewBerry]

It makes no sense that George wouldn't have smelled the stench while the car was in the enclosed garage. The only reason that I can imagine that he would lie is because he'd like to believe Cindy's BS that someone put a body in the car after it was towed.



Thanks for explaining the BOMBSHELL (slept right through it!!) I have always believed that Casey left the Stinkmobile at the Amscott hoping/praying that it would be stolen and that her purse in plain sight was the bait. Seems like early on, people were asking if there wasn't surveillance of the lot, and now we finally have it. There is no telling what the prosecution will have gleaned from the video and how it will be incorporated into their theory.

To paraphrase a line from The Hunt for Red October: Casey Anthony don't take a dump, son, without a plan.

Loretta, you're right on re: the stinkmobile and I bet the pros. has sooooo much more than we can guess. Great quote at the end! Thanks for the laugh!:D
DrewB