Caylee Anthony Case Discussion Only

[joekuhl79]

It's hard to know what the telltale item is, and it's hard to know why the rumor (or fact) began that the remains are a girl child rather than a boy.

And this is way OT, but I'm a little concerned about the meter reader taking a leak in the woods near the elementary school and so close to a busy street and residential area. But I'll have to give him a pass since his discovery broke this case wide open.


About it being a girl and not a boy...if there was clothing on, that would be a sign, and the hair would be a good clue too...the hair would still be there. That's not to say a boy couldn't have long hair, but what are the odds?

The meter reader taking a leak? They walk neighborhoods for hours at a time. If he had to go, he had to go. From what I can see, those woods are pretty dense, and far enough from the school.

[FDInLaw]

About it being a girl and not a boy...if there was clothing on, that would be a sign, and the hair would be a good clue too...the hair would still be there. That's not to say a boy couldn't have long hair, but what are the odds?

The meter reader taking a leak? They walk neighborhoods for hours at a time. If he had to go, he had to go. From what I can see, those woods are pretty dense, and far enough from the school.
It's been stated that no clothes were found, I'm betting there was hair like Caylee's and that is why so many on the scene were certain so soon.

[Twinners]

Minute-To-Minute Update In Remains Discovery
Friday, December 12, 2008 9:24:20 AM

ORLANDO -- The remains of a small child were discovered early Thursday morning by a worker for the Orange County Water Department. We are following this story closely with constant updates.

Minute-To-Minute Update Friday, Dec. 12

8:34 a.m.: Investigators tell News 13 they believe they have found everything they needed in the Anthony home search. The home is no longer considered a crime scene, and the Anthonys can now return to their home.

7:46 a.m.: News 13 has learned investigators said they "absolutely" found something of interest at the Anthony's home. Investigators are not saying what the key item is.

7:01 a.m.: Investigators return to scene where skeletal remains were discovered.

http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Local/2008/12/12/minutetominute_update_in_remains_discovery_12_11.h tml

[Twinners]

CSI Removes Bags, Boxes, Vacuum Cleaners From Anthony Home
Missing Caylee Last Seen In Mid-June

ORLANDO, Fla. -- Crime scene detectives late Thursday night removed bags and boxes of evidence from the home of Caylee Anthony's grandparents, hours after the remains of a child were discovered in a wooded area less than half a mile from the house.

Caylee was last seen in mid-June but was not reported missing until a month later by her grandmother, Cindy Anthony. Caylee's mother, Casey Anthony, 22, remains jailed on first-degree murder charges in Caylee's disappearance.

Authorities obtained a search warrant for George and Cindy Anthony's Hopespring Drive home in east Orange County, and investigators were seen removing seven large paper bags and four boxes of evidence. They also seized four vacuum cleaners and two pesticide tanks.

http://www.local6.com/news/18262363/detail.html

Clothing Found Near Skull In Woods Near Anthony Home
Clothing was found near a skull that was discovered in a wooded area near the Anthony home, Local 6 News reports.

Video: http://www.local6.com/video/18262788/index.html

[Mac]

OK...before anyone hammers me on this...lets look at what they took out of the home.

3 different upright Vaccuums

1 Lowe's brand shop vac

1 small shampooer

1 handheld vac

2 of the vaccuums are brand new. Along with the the Shop vac. It is also a new model, which is a Lowes brand 12.5 HP

Follow this reasoning. Assuming when they found the body, they also found some fibers, etc. Something made the OCSO believe that the baby died at the home, or else they would have let the Anthony's come home. They staged a midnight raid on the home, kicked out Lee's girlfriend, and tore the place apart.

Now take a look at the stuff they took...alll cleaning items, most of them brand new. When was the last time you bought 2 new vaccuums and a new shop vac within the same year, especially if you are poorer then most. A vaccuum is the last thing on your mind, food and electric bills, not a vaccuum, let alone 3 of them. All of the vaccuums still had the manufacturers labels on them too, so they where new. The Bissel and the Shop vac are new...I checked.

Everything in my head, leads me to believe that someone cleaned up a crime scene....and that person might be Cindy. We know she cleaned out the car that smelled bad.

I feel it in my heart folks......Cindy is covering up the fact that she knew about the murder...Just my opinion of course.

Help me out here folks....and tell me I am wrong

See y'all this afternoon

[Spider]

I am still a bit stunned that Baden's wife was announced to be on board with the defense. Surely she does not need publicity.

Would a child this young have been to a dentist yet?

Also, as stated above LE removed containers of pesticide. It was shown that a computer search showed household weapons right?

[FDInLaw]

Thank you Twinners! So, clothing was found near the body. Any word about more bones? I don't get why the head would be by itself in the bag. . . from the reports so far, this child was the victim of someone sick (not that we didn't know that) and I'm anxious to have it confirmed that this is in fact Caylee. :(

[Twinners]

OK...before anyone hammers me on this...lets look at what they took out of the home.
Where did you find the specifics on what they took out, Mac? I've only been able to find general info (ie, four cleaners) so far.

[Twinners]

Thank you Twinners! So, clothing was found near the body. Any word about more bones? I don't get why the head would be by itself in the bag. . . from the reports so far, this child was the victim of someone sick (not that we didn't know that) and I'm anxious to have it confirmed that this is in fact Caylee. :(
You're welcome!

I don't think the head was by itself in the bag. From what I've heard/read, the head is what fell out of the bag of bones when the worker either picked it up or kicked it.

[Twinners]

Sheriff: Evidence Links Remains Of Child To Caylee Anthony Home

ORLANDO, Fla. -- A medical examiner found evidence among a child's remains that link them to the home of Caylee Anthony's grandparents, the county sheriff said Friday, offering the strongest indication yet that the remains may be those of the missing 3-year-old girl.

Orange County Sheriff Kevin Beary said investigators searched the home late Thursday night into early Friday morning after the medical examiner found "some clues that came out of the remains" that "linked it to the house." He would not say what clues were found.

"We took some things out of the house that the forensic people are very interested in," he said.

http://www.local6.com/news/18262363/detail.html

[Grave Chaser]

Your theory is beyond good. If it is true she was on that road at that point, I can totally put myself in her place which sickeningly I do often when trying to figure things out. If she went to her parents house to retrieve the body or just went to try and bury it there and she got the shovel that day and lets say she decides naw this won't work I can't leave it in the backyard too obvious, so she pulls into garage and then puts Caylee back in trunk. Then she goes on her merry way and aw hell she runs out of gas a few blocks from her parents house. Does she want that body back there when Tony picks her up?What if he smells something and insists on looking for the source of the smell.? Get out of the car fast, look around, , drag the body into the woods just far enough off the road to be unseen but not so far you get all kinds of mud or dirt or brambles on yourself. Don't want to mess up your shoes. And come back out and wait for Tony. By the way have you been lurking? With ideas like this, you should post more often. I would love to find out where Casey ran out of gas if on that road . Did she then run out of gas again on another day at the check cashing place?

Yeah, mu8shark, I tend to lurk more than post, partly because everyone is already saying what I'm thinking! haha I read this forum pretty much every day to keep up with this story since I don't have cable/satellite. Anyway, as I was going through the last couple days posts, I remembered the whole Chicasaw Drive thing between Casey and Tony. Just struck a nerve. Could be verrrrrrrry interesting.

[Twinners]

Everything in my head, leads me to believe that someone cleaned up a crime scene....and that person might be Cindy. We know she cleaned out the car that smelled bad.
But I can't really imagine Casey taking Caylee back home that day and killing her there. Can you?

I really think the evidence will point to Casey's car being the actual scene of the crime. I think neighbors saw her back into the garage on two different occasions. Maybe she was trying to clean out the trunk then.

I have no idea about the pesticides tanks though. That has me really confused.

[deputydi]

6/19
Thurs
1:30 pm
3 days post mortem
“Casey asks Anthony neighbor Brian Burner to loan her a shovel. He watches her walk into the garage, and notes that her car is backed into the garage. Casey returns the shovel at 2:30.


6/20
Fri
4 days post mortem
Casey runs out of gas near parents home - calls Lazaro to come get her and takes her to Anthony's home. He waits in car while she goes inside to get / steal gas cans.

6/20
Fri
4 days post mortem
Anthony neighbor believes he saw a green pickup, hearing Casey's voice in the afternoon.

Yeah I think she may have run out of gas in her parents neighborhood as early as the 20th and dumped the body in the wooded area that very day. By the 27th when she finally leaves the car at Amscot she must have tried a few things to get rid of that smell. Although this is sooner than Perper said, it may be just an estimate and maybe four days in that heat and humidity. made it smell really , really bad. I think she could of dumped Caylee's body much sooner than I had previously thought. She may have put the detergent in the back of the car to cover that smell and put garbage back there to kind of mask it and nothing worked, thus say goodbye to car on the 27th.
Your timeline here makes a lot of sense. It appears that Caylee was murdered some time in the early afternoon of 6/16 and the flurry of phone calls that Gator posted fits right in. I believe she killed her baby and hastily buried her in the backyard initially. For whatever reason (possibly the next day) she decided that was a bad idea and dug her up and placed her in the trunk. She drove around with Caylee's body (OMG how could she do that) for a couple of days and, as you said, ran out of gas. Now she was forced to dispose of the body again, quickly, before Tony came to her rescue. That would have given her several days to try and get rid of the smell before her next "gas emergency". She probably intended to retrieve the body at a later time and find a more secure place to get rid of it but the hurricane and her arrest prevented that from happening. Yep, it all fits - at least it does in my mind.

[Gatordog]

If there was sand found in the bag, they could compare it to the sand in the sandbox/under the pavers...rain or not, they could show if it came from there or not.

I have dogs and cats and there is always animal hair no matter how often I sweep or vacuum. The Anthonys have two yorkies and a cat. If there is matching animal hair inside of that bag and there are no clothes - bingo - the bag came from inside that house. All of the vacuums were taken during the search last night - I can only guess that they are trying to match animal hair.

Gator

[lorettalockhorn]

Your timeline here makes a lot of sense. It appears that Caylee was murdered some time in the early afternoon of 6/16 and the flurry of phone calls that Gator posted fits right in. I believe she killed her baby and hastily buried her in the backyard initially. For whatever reason (possibly the next day) she decided that was a bad idea and dug her up and placed her in the trunk. She drove around with Caylee's body (OMG how could she do that) for a couple of days and, as you said, ran out of gas. Now she was forced to dispose of the body again, quickly, before Tony came to her rescue. That would have given her several days to try and get rid of the smell before her next "gas emergency". She probably intended to retrieve the body at a later time and find a more secure place to get rid of it but the hurricane and her arrest prevented that from happening. Yep, it all fits - at least it does in my mind.

Link to the entire timeline:

http://www.tcbwebs.com/Ant_Timeline.htm

Mac, very interesting those items seized. I've got some catching up to do!

Just a Q and a couple of observations:

Weren't both of the Badens involved in the Phil Spector case?

From what I can tell having listened to NG last night (she mentioned an FBI insider, I think), the skull rolled out of the bag, but there were other bones, presumably the complete skeleton also in the bag. I have heard no mention of any clothes. Long hair is no indication of gender, so I'm still clueless as to why it was immediately assumed the child was female. It was mentioned that Caylee's dental records are in the hands of LE, but I'm not sure if/why a two year old would have had dental Xrays.

I do think Cindy knows more about Casey's involvement in the crime than she has ever let on, and I can see her cleaning up after Casey, but I do wonder why she would buy new vacs without getting rid of the old one(s). I think Cindy's behavior since Casey's arrest comes from a well deserved sense of guilt.

And yes, I'm glad that the meter reader went into the woods, but it has been mentioned several times that the area is very near the school, and had he been observed doing his business, he could have been arrested for indecent exposure. Sorry if it bugs anyone that I find it extremely ooky (for lack of a better word) to deposit bodily fluids in public.

Twinners, thanks for the updates in the other thread; I see that the clothing was found near the remains. Great news.

[Gatordog]

About it being a girl and not a boy...if there was clothing on, that would be a sign, and the hair would be a good clue too...the hair would still be there. That's not to say a boy couldn't have long hair, but what are the odds?

The meter reader taking a leak? They walk neighborhoods for hours at a time. If he had to go, he had to go. From what I can see, those woods are pretty dense, and far enough from the school.

The area is remote. It's not a main street and probably no more than a few cars an hour would travel the road other than early morning to work/school and then in the afternoon for reverse travel. It's in proximity of a school but no where near school grounds. It's behind the school grounds and there is a fence between the school and the area now. The woods are very thick. In these Florida woods, there is an extreme amount of underbrush, palmetto palms, etc. You can walk about eight feet into them and not been seen at all.

[Gatordog]

Thank you Twinners! So, clothing was found near the body. Any word about more bones? I don't get why the head would be by itself in the bag. . . from the reports so far, this child was the victim of someone sick (not that we didn't know that) and I'm anxious to have it confirmed that this is in fact Caylee. :(

I believe the rest of the skeleton was in the bag.

[Gatordog]

You're welcome!

I don't think the head was by itself in the bag. From what I've heard/read, the head is what fell out of the bag of bones when the worker either picked it up or kicked it.

Sheriff Beary said that he was told that the meter reader used a stick to touch the bag. Knowing that snakes or anything else could have been in the bag, he was careful. He might even have been aware of how close he was to the Anthony's and realized what it could be.

[lorettalockhorn]

...Items removed from the Anthony family home include: three vacuum cleaners, two pesticide tanks, a small pillow, seven large paper bags and four boxes of potential evidence...

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2008/12/several-items-o.html

Small pillow. hmmm

[One2Snoop]

I have dogs and cats and there is always animal hair no matter how often I sweep or vacuum. The Anthonys have two yorkies and a cat. If there is matching animal hair inside of that bag and there are no clothes - bingo - the bag came from inside that house. All of the vacuums were taken during the search last night - I can only guess that they are trying to match animal hair.
Gator

Good guess Gator - I would say you are probably right on that.
4 vaccums? Wow is that excessive or what?

[One2Snoop]

Is there a hearing of some sort today?

[One2Snoop]

Larry King exclusive
Caylee’s grandparents respond to the news of a body found near their home.
Tonight, 9 ET on CNN

[The R]

OK...before anyone hammers me on this...lets look at what they took out of the home.

3 different upright Vaccuums

1 Lowe's brand shop vac

1 small shampooer

1 handheld vac

2 of the vaccuums are brand new. Along with the the Shop vac. It is also a new model, which is a Lowes brand 12.5 HP

Follow this reasoning. Assuming when they found the body, they also found some fibers, etc. Something made the OCSO believe that the baby died at the home, or else they would have let the Anthony's come home. They staged a midnight raid on the home, kicked out Lee's girlfriend, and tore the place apart.

Now take a look at the stuff they took...alll cleaning items, most of them brand new. When was the last time you bought 2 new vaccuums and a new shop vac within the same year, especially if you are poorer then most. A vaccuum is the last thing on your mind, food and electric bills, not a vaccuum, let alone 3 of them. All of the vaccuums still had the manufacturers labels on them too, so they where new. The Bissel and the Shop vac are new...I checked.

Everything in my head, leads me to believe that someone cleaned up a crime scene....and that person might be Cindy. We know she cleaned out the car that smelled bad.

I feel it in my heart folks......Cindy is covering up the fact that she knew about the murder...Just my opinion of course.

Help me out here folks....and tell me I am wrong

See y'all this afternoon



It would seem to me that she'd have a lot of explaining to do. If I were LE I'd be looking at more than one POI just to be sure. Either they think she helped or feel that's where a crime took place IMO.

A case of a parent in denial? Maybe, maybe not.

ALLMO,
R

[One2Snoop]

Is there a hearing of some sort today?

Nevermind - I found it...

A day after a child's remains were found near the Anthony home, an emergency hearing is held in the Casey case.

http://www.local6.com/video/14013179/index.html

[Gatordog]

From the videos I have seen that have been taken inside that house - it is a very clean house. They even have white furniture. I have read in the evidence documents that George is a clean freak. I believe he said it himself and the Liar states that her father is always cleaning out the cars and keeping them in excellent condition. George is the one who is home in the morning because he worked afternoon shift. Cindy was at work the morning of the 16th. George states he saw Caley and the Liar at 12:50 pm leave the house to go to the sitter's and work (haha). It wouldn't surprise me if George cleaned the house unwittingly. Perhaps he thought the Liar spilled something on the rug and didn't want Cindy to find out. If it looks as if she was killed some time around 1:30 a.m. on the 16th, why would George say he saw them at 1:00 p.m.? He seems to be the only one who does tell the truth.

[jas72]

And yes, I'm glad that the meter reader went into the woods, but it has been mentioned several times that the area is very near the school, and had he been observed doing his business, he could have been arrested for indecent exposure. Sorry if it bugs anyone that I find it extremely ooky (for lack of a better word) to deposit bodily fluids in public.

I love that word, "ooky." :) That's the great thing about being a guy. When you've gotta go number 1, it's just way easy to find a bush, tree, or someplace where you can go without exposing yourself. Most guys try to make a point of ensuring that they aren't exposing themselves unnecessarily. I play golf, and we guys are always wandering off the fairway to relieve ourselves. Others may know exactly what it is we're doing, but they can't actually see anything. I'm quite certain that this utility worker was far enough away from the road and school that he wasn't exposing himself. As others have stated, it's a good thing he went where he did, or this bag may have been undiscovered for quite a while longer.

[deputydi]

Link to the entire timeline:

http://www.tcbwebs.com/Ant_Timeline.htm

<snip>
Did you put that timeline together? If so, you did an exceptional job! Thanks.

[deputydi]

Larry King exclusive
Caylee’s grandparents respond to the news of a body found near their home.
Tonight, 9 ET on CNN
They will probably do a satellite interview from Orlando. I can't imagine them flying back to CA to do an interview at a time like this. But, this family has done stranger things I guess. I also can't see them trying to deny this is Caylee's body. My guess is their only purpose is to say Casey had nothing to do with her baby's death and someone else (Zanny?) is trying to frame her. I'll bet this is what they will try to say at trial also. Scott tried the same tactics, but look where it got him.

It's a good thing this crime didn't occur in CA. These two sickos could have ended up in the same prison and that's a truly scary thought. The demon couple from Hell.

[lorettalockhorn]

Did you put that timeline together? If so, you did an exceptional job! Thanks.

No, I believe the email link at the site is most likely to the author; (s)he asks for feedback for any corrections that need to be made.

[Gatordog]

Is there a hearing of some sort today?

Baez filed a motion yesterday upon news of finding the body asking that his forensic team witness the examination of the evidence. Judge Strickland denied the motion. I am very glad that Judge Strickland is still presiding over the case. He has switched to civil court but remained the judge so far in the Casey case. He is my hero ever since he told the Liar "you and the truth are strangers".

[One2Snoop]

I don't know about any of you but I thought Greta was extremely rude to Leonard Padilla last night. I wondered why she even bothered to have him on at all? She kept telling him she was confused as to why he wanted to go back to Orlando now that Caylee was found. She then went on to ask him if he knew the family and again asked why he was going back to Orlando. She kept saying, I just don't get it. :confused: Bizarre.

Sheesh Greta, :rolleyes: I believe LP wants closure like everyone else, which is why he's going back to Orlando.

[Mac]

Where did you find the specifics on what they took out, Mac? I've only been able to find general info (ie, four cleaners) so far.


Wftv video.......if you look at what the took out.

[Gatordog]

I love that word, "ooky." :) That's the great thing about being a guy. When you've gotta go number 1, it's just way easy to find a bush, tree, or someplace where you can go without exposing yourself. Most guys try to make a point of ensuring that they aren't exposing themselves unnecessarily. I play golf, and we guys are always wandering off the fairway to relieve ourselves. Others may know exactly what it is we're doing, but they can't actually see anything. I'm quite certain that this utility worker was far enough away from the road and school that he wasn't exposing himself. As others have stated, it's a good thing he went where he did, or this bag may have been undiscovered for quite a while longer.

Well, I guess the woods was the first out house anyway. :shrug: It's not as bad as the photograph of The Liar squatting down and relieving herself in a parking lot next to a car. :eek:

[One2Snoop]

Baez filed a motion yesterday upon news of finding the body asking that his forensic team witness the examination of the evidence. Judge Strickland denied the motion. I am very glad that Judge Strickland is still presiding over the case. He has switched to civil court but remained the judge so far in the Casey case. He is my hero ever since he told the Liar "you and the truth are strangers".

Truer words couldn't be spoken. Thanks for the info Gator. :seeya:

[Mac]

It would seem to me that she'd have a lot of explaining to do. If I were LE I'd be looking at more than one POI just to be sure. Either they think she helped or feel that's where a crime took place IMO.

A case of a parent in denial? Maybe, maybe not.

ALLMO,
R

I understand what you are saying......but it fits like a puzzle piece.

Remember the fact that all Cindy has done is try to impair the search for the body.

[Gatordog]

They will probably do a satellite interview from Orlando. I can't imagine them flying back to CA to do an interview at a time like this. But, this family has done stranger things I guess. I also can't see them trying to deny this is Caylee's body. My guess is their only purpose is to say Casey had nothing to do with her baby's death and someone else (Zanny?) is trying to frame her. I'll bet this is what they will try to say at trial also. Scott tried the same tactics, but look where it got him.

It's a good thing this crime didn't occur in CA. These two sickos could have ended up in the same prison and that's a truly scary thought. The demon couple from Hell.

My guess is that it will either be a telephone call or at one of the local tv stations here in Orlando. I am slo wondering if the Anthonys will actually say anything. They have a new attorney, Brad Conway, or something like that and the spokeswoman, Michelle Bart. They may be the ones doing the talking. And God help them if they try to say that the Liar didn't do this but that the kidnapper is responsible. :mad:

[Gatordog]

I don't know about any of you but I thought Greta was extremely rude to Leonard Padilla last night. I wondered why she even bothered to have him on at all? She kept telling him she was confused as to why he wanted to go back to Orlando now that Caylee was found. She then went on to ask him if he knew the family and again asked why he was going back to Orlando. She kept saying, I just don't get it. :confused: Bizarre.

Sheesh Greta, :rolleyes: I believe LP wants closure like everyone else, which is why he's going back to Orlando.

She doesn't understand that he's doing it for the child. Everyone grew to love that little girl and when she's singing, my goodness, it tears your heart out, if you have one. Obviously, the Liar didn't have a heart or she could never have done what she did.

[One2Snoop]

My guess is that it will either be a telephone call or at one of the local tv stations here in Orlando. I am slo wondering if the Anthonys will actually say anything. They have a new attorney, Brad Conway, or something like that and the spokeswoman, Michelle Bart. They may be the ones doing the talking. And God help them if they try to say that the Liar didn't do this but that the kidnapper is responsible. :mad:

I think WFTV (channel 6?) is the CNN affiliate.

[One2Snoop]

updated 2 minutes ago
Lawyer: Corpse's hair color matches Caylee's


ORLANDO, Florida (CNN) -- Strands of hair found with remains discovered a half mile from the home of missing toddler Caylee Anthony are the same color as Caylee's, lawyers for her mother said in court Friday.

Defense attorneys for Casey Anthony, the 22-year-old mother charged with Caylee's murder, told Judge Stan Strickland they were notified Thursday the corpse's hair color and other features matched Caylee.

Overnight, investigators searched the home of Caylee's grandparents and "absolutely" found something of interest, Orange County, Florida, Sheriff Kevin Beary said Friday morning.

The girl often lived in the house with her grandparents and her mother, who was arrested in October and charged with murder.

Investigators "concluded there were certain things they wanted to be looking for" and searched the home, Beary said in an interview broadcast on ABC News. Authorities took boxes and bags full of items for review.

A utility worker discovered the remains around 9:30 a.m. Thursday and alerted authorities, sheriff's spokesman Jim Solomons said.

Police Capt. Angelo Nieves said the skeletal remains found in a plastic bag appeared consistent with those of a young child.

Caylee Anthony, 3, has been missing since June in a case that has received national attention.

The remains were taken to the county medical examiner's office and will be sent to the FBI lab in Quantico, Virginia, Beary said Thursday.

Meanwhile, investigators Friday continued searching the area where the remains were found.

"Time is on our side," Beary said Thursday. "We're going to do everything by the book. There will be no mistakes made." Watch sheriff promise 'no mistakes' »

Attorneys for Caylee's 22-year-old mother, Casey Anthony, filed an emergency motion asking that their experts be present for any forensic testing done on the remains. A hearing on that motion is set for Friday. Casey Anthony will not be transported from jail to attend, court officials said.

CNN affiliate WFTV-TV reported that the utility worker, a meter reader, picked up a bag at the site Thursday morning and a skull fell out.

Earlier, Beary told reporters, "Bottom line, it's real simple, folks. We've recovered this human skull. It appears to be that of a small child, and now the investigation continues. We've got a lot of lab work to do, a lot of DNA work to do, a lot of crime scene work to do."

Prosecutors had asked police not to disclose many details surrounding the discovery, Beary said.

The region had previously been searched as part of the investigation into Caylee's disappearance, he said, but the spot where the remains were found -- some "45, 50, 60 feet back" -- was flooded and underwater at the time. No clothes were found with the remains, he said.

Asked whether the remains could belong to another child, Beary said, "Not that we know of, but that's always a possibility, and that's why we've got a lot of work to do on this case still."

Corrections officials said Thursday that Casey Anthony remained in protective custody and has no contact with other inmates.

"She has been seen by a Corrections Health Services psychologist and her status was reviewed," officials said in a statement, adding she was on psychological observation -- which is not the same as suicide watch.

"We will not be releasing any information regarding her demeanor," the statement said, adding that jail policy prohibits interviews of inmates.

Defense attorney Jose Baez arrived at the jail just before noon Thursday and stayed about 90 minutes, officials said.

In a court hearing earlier Thursday, 9th Circuit Judge Stan Strickland postponed Casey Anthony's trial at the request of Baez, who said he had not received all the evidence from prosecutors and was not ready to proceed with the January 5 trial.

Baez asked Strickland if the trial could be delayed until March. The judge scheduled a hearing January 15 to consider a new trial date as well as a possible change of venue.

Prosecutors said earlier this month they would not seek the death penalty against Casey Anthony. She could face a sentence of life in prison if convicted.

Authorities have said Casey Anthony waited about a month before telling her family that Caylee was gone. Cindy Anthony -- Caylee's grandmother and Casey Anthony's mother -- called the Orange County sheriff's office on July 15, saying her daughter would not tell her where Caylee was.

When questioned by police, Casey Anthony gave conflicting statements, including some that were later disproved, according to hundreds of documents and investigative reports released in the case.

She claimed she dropped Caylee off with a babysitter, but when police checked out her story, they learned that the address Casey Anthony supplied belonged to an apartment that had been vacant for weeks. The woman Casey Anthony named as her babysitter told police she did not know her. Review a timeline of the case »

Investigators previously have said that cadaver dogs picked up the scent of death in Anthony's car, as well as in her parents' back yard. They also said air quality tests conducted by the FBI found evidence consistent with human decomposition and chloroform in the car's trunk. A neighbor told police Anthony had asked to borrow a shovel.

Analysis of Anthony's computer found she had visited Web sites discussing chloroform and had done Internet searches of missing children, according to information released in the case.

But "there isn't a motive and they haven't found a motive," Cindy Anthony said Wednesday night during an appearance on CNN's "Larry King Live." "They told us they thought it was an accident and she's scared and tried to cover it up. They don't feel there's a motive."

Cindy Anthony said searches for the girl's body have "come up with nothing. There's nothing that they have found that, you know, has given them any evidence that Caylee is no longer with us."



The Anthonys said they believe the girl is still alive and that someone has her, noting several reports of sightings.

Last month, Strickland denied prosecutors' request to impose a gag order in Anthony's case, saying he could not state that continued publicity would pose a threat to her trial, or even that a gag order would stem the flood of media attention.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/12/12/caylee.anthony/index.html

[lorettalockhorn]

Baez filed a motion yesterday upon news of finding the body asking that his forensic team witness the examination of the evidence. Judge Strickland denied the motion. I am very glad that Judge Strickland is still presiding over the case. He has switched to civil court but remained the judge so far in the Casey case. He is my hero ever since he told the Liar "you and the truth are strangers".

Greatest quote of 2008!!



Well, I guess the woods was the first out house anyway. :shrug: It's not as bad as the photograph of The Liar squatting down and relieving herself in a parking lot next to a car. :eek:

Glad I missed LiarLiarPantsOnFire with her drawers down. :eek: (If'n she wears any.)

There are dozens of nearby places the guy could have gone according to googlemaps, maybe he has bladder issues. I'm telling you, it was serendipiddle.

[FDInLaw]

Thanks for the article O2S! As I suspected, hair gave a big tip off.



Rest in Peace, sweet one! :rose: :rose: :rose:

[Gatordog]

updated 2 minutes ago
Lawyer: Corpse's hair color matches Caylee's


ORLANDO, Florida (CNN) -- Strands of hair found with remains discovered a half mile from the home of missing toddler Caylee Anthony are the same color as Caylee's, lawyers for her mother said in court Friday.

Defense attorneys for Casey Anthony, the 22-year-old mother charged with Caylee's murder, told Judge Stan Strickland they were notified Thursday the corpse's hair color and other features matched Caylee.

Overnight, investigators searched the home of Caylee's grandparents and "absolutely" found something of interest, Orange County, Florida, Sheriff Kevin Beary said Friday morning.

The girl often lived in the house with her grandparents and her mother, who was arrested in October and charged with murder.

Investigators "concluded there were certain things they wanted to be looking for" and searched the home, Beary said in an interview broadcast on ABC News. Authorities took boxes and bags full of items for review.

A utility worker discovered the remains around 9:30 a.m. Thursday and alerted authorities, sheriff's spokesman Jim Solomons said.

Police Capt. Angelo Nieves said the skeletal remains found in a plastic bag appeared consistent with those of a young child.

Caylee Anthony, 3, has been missing since June in a case that has received national attention.

The remains were taken to the county medical examiner's office and will be sent to the FBI lab in Quantico, Virginia, Beary said Thursday.

Meanwhile, investigators Friday continued searching the area where the remains were found.

"Time is on our side," Beary said Thursday. "We're going to do everything by the book. There will be no mistakes made." Watch sheriff promise 'no mistakes' »

Attorneys for Caylee's 22-year-old mother, Casey Anthony, filed an emergency motion asking that their experts be present for any forensic testing done on the remains. A hearing on that motion is set for Friday. Casey Anthony will not be transported from jail to attend, court officials said.

CNN affiliate WFTV-TV reported that the utility worker, a meter reader, picked up a bag at the site Thursday morning and a skull fell out.

Earlier, Beary told reporters, "Bottom line, it's real simple, folks. We've recovered this human skull. It appears to be that of a small child, and now the investigation continues. We've got a lot of lab work to do, a lot of DNA work to do, a lot of crime scene work to do."

Prosecutors had asked police not to disclose many details surrounding the discovery, Beary said.

The region had previously been searched as part of the investigation into Caylee's disappearance, he said, but the spot where the remains were found -- some "45, 50, 60 feet back" -- was flooded and underwater at the time. No clothes were found with the remains, he said.

Asked whether the remains could belong to another child, Beary said, "Not that we know of, but that's always a possibility, and that's why we've got a lot of work to do on this case still."

Corrections officials said Thursday that Casey Anthony remained in protective custody and has no contact with other inmates.

"She has been seen by a Corrections Health Services psychologist and her status was reviewed," officials said in a statement, adding she was on psychological observation -- which is not the same as suicide watch.

"We will not be releasing any information regarding her demeanor," the statement said, adding that jail policy prohibits interviews of inmates.

Defense attorney Jose Baez arrived at the jail just before noon Thursday and stayed about 90 minutes, officials said.

In a court hearing earlier Thursday, 9th Circuit Judge Stan Strickland postponed Casey Anthony's trial at the request of Baez, who said he had not received all the evidence from prosecutors and was not ready to proceed with the January 5 trial.

Baez asked Strickland if the trial could be delayed until March. The judge scheduled a hearing January 15 to consider a new trial date as well as a possible change of venue.

Prosecutors said earlier this month they would not seek the death penalty against Casey Anthony. She could face a sentence of life in prison if convicted.

Authorities have said Casey Anthony waited about a month before telling her family that Caylee was gone. Cindy Anthony -- Caylee's grandmother and Casey Anthony's mother -- called the Orange County sheriff's office on July 15, saying her daughter would not tell her where Caylee was.

When questioned by police, Casey Anthony gave conflicting statements, including some that were later disproved, according to hundreds of documents and investigative reports released in the case.

She claimed she dropped Caylee off with a babysitter, but when police checked out her story, they learned that the address Casey Anthony supplied belonged to an apartment that had been vacant for weeks. The woman Casey Anthony named as her babysitter told police she did not know her. Review a timeline of the case »

Investigators previously have said that cadaver dogs picked up the scent of death in Anthony's car, as well as in her parents' back yard. They also said air quality tests conducted by the FBI found evidence consistent with human decomposition and chloroform in the car's trunk. A neighbor told police Anthony had asked to borrow a shovel.

Analysis of Anthony's computer found she had visited Web sites discussing chloroform and had done Internet searches of missing children, according to information released in the case.

But "there isn't a motive and they haven't found a motive," Cindy Anthony said Wednesday night during an appearance on CNN's "Larry King Live." "They told us they thought it was an accident and she's scared and tried to cover it up. They don't feel there's a motive."

Cindy Anthony said searches for the girl's body have "come up with nothing. There's nothing that they have found that, you know, has given them any evidence that Caylee is no longer with us."



The Anthonys said they believe the girl is still alive and that someone has her, noting several reports of sightings.

Last month, Strickland denied prosecutors' request to impose a gag order in Anthony's case, saying he could not state that continued publicity would pose a threat to her trial, or even that a gag order would stem the flood of media attention.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/12/12/caylee.anthony/index.html

WFTV and WKMG both reporting that soft tissue was remaining on the body. Also reporting that duct tape was still attached to the mouth and it's waterproof so it would protect anything underneath it. They said it is possible that the child's death was horrific and agonizing. A pillow was taken as evidence. Perhaps she smothered the child. :rose:

[Gatordog]

Greatest quote of 2008!!





Glad I missed LiarLiarPantsOnFire with her drawers down. :eek: (If'n she wears any.)

There are dozens of nearby places the guy could have gone according to googlemaps, maybe he has bladder issues. I'm telling you, it was serendipiddle.

Maybe she was trying to put out the pants fire! Serendipiddle. You are so funny! I bet they love you at parties.

Gator

[lorettalockhorn]

WFTV and WKMG both reporting that soft tissue was remaining on the body. Also reporting that duct tape was still attached to the mouth and it's waterproof so it would protect anything underneath it. They said it is possible that the child's death was horrific and agonizing. A pillow was taken as evidence. Perhaps she smothered the child. :rose:

Can't toxicology be done with soft tissue still intact?

David Lohr had the first report that I read of the pillow being taken into evidence. Smothering (and drowning) are supposed to be the most painful way to die.

[Mac]

Link to the entire timeline:

http://www.tcbwebs.com/Ant_Timeline.htm

Mac, very interesting those items seized. I've got some catching up to do!

Just a Q and a couple of observations:

Weren't both of the Badens involved in the Phil Spector case?

From what I can tell having listened to NG last night (she mentioned an FBI insider, I think), the skull rolled out of the bag, but there were other bones, presumably the complete skeleton also in the bag. I have heard no mention of any clothes. Long hair is no indication of gender, so I'm still clueless as to why it was immediately assumed the child was female. It was mentioned that Caylee's dental records are in the hands of LE, but I'm not sure if/why a two year old would have had dental Xrays.

I do think Cindy knows more about Casey's involvement in the crime than she has ever let on, and I can see her cleaning up after Casey, but I do wonder why she would buy new vacs without getting rid of the old one(s). I think Cindy's behavior since Casey's arrest comes from a well deserved sense of guilt.

And yes, I'm glad that the meter reader went into the woods, but it has been mentioned several times that the area is very near the school, and had he been observed doing his business, he could have been arrested for indecent exposure. Sorry if it bugs anyone that I find it extremely ooky (for lack of a better word) to deposit bodily fluids in public.

Twinners, thanks for the updates in the other thread; I see that the clothing was found near the remains. Great news.



Link for the video of the midnight raid on the Anthony home

Keep a close eye on the items NOT bagged.....the vaccuums and the newness of the vaccuums.

Sorry to beat a dead horse here, but my theory just feels right.

Hope someone can talk me out of it!!!

http://www.wftv.com/video/18262763/index.html

[lorettalockhorn]

Maybe she was trying to put out the pants fire! Serendipiddle. You are so funny! I bet they love you at parties.

Gator

LMAO Now I'm picturing the smiley that pees the happy face.

[One2Snoop]

WFTV and WKMG both reporting that soft tissue was remaining on the body. Also reporting that duct tape was still attached to the mouth and it's waterproof so it would protect anything underneath it. They said it is possible that the child's death was horrific and agonizing. A pillow was taken as evidence. Perhaps she smothered the child. :rose:

OMG! I think I'm going to be sick. :flamemad: I had a nightmare last night that she knocked Caylee out with the Cloroform - stuck the tape over her mouth, put her in the bag and threw her in the trunk.

[lorettalockhorn]

Link for the video of the midnight raid on the Anthony home

Keep a close eye on the items NOT bagged.....the vaccuums and the newness of the vaccuums.

Sorry to beat a dead horse here, but my theory just feels right.

Hope someone can talk me out of it!!!

http://www.wftv.com/video/18262763/index.html

Happy to disappoint you; it won't be me. That harridan left a bad impression on me when a) she reported the car missing before Caylee, and b) spoke so tactlessly about the smell of a "dead body in the damn car".

[NMurphy02]

Is that she was home! Blocks away from where she dumped her child like trash! No wonder she wouldn't sleep in the room and would sleep on her parents bedroom floor (according to Cindy) I don't know how she could be in that house to begin with. I mean how could she kill that sweet child to begin with. But then to go home, KNOWING, that child was blocks away in a GARBAGE BAG! UGH..

[One2Snoop]

December 12, 2008
updated 36 minutes ago

The FBI has set up a soil-sifting station this morning along Suburban Drive, just feet from where the body of a small child was found yesterday morning. Orange County forensic unit members are helping nearby.

Yesterday's wet weather was not conducive to the investigation, said sheriff's spokesman Deputy Carlos Padilla. Forensics teams are looking for more evidence in the area, which is about a quarter-mile away from the Anthony house.

Suspicions are high that officials found the remains of Caylee Marie Anthony, but DNA tests to identify the body make take days.

"The shrubbery and undergrowth is really thick," Padilla said. "They are sifting through to see if there is anything that connects this case."

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/orl-bk-caylee-anthony-121208,0,1812243.story

[One2Snoop]

Bumping this to discussion thread. Thanks for posting vanillaangel :seeya:

Judge Denies Lawyer's Bid To Witness Autopsy Of Orlando Remains



The Associated Press
Published: December 12, 2008
Updated: 12:34 pm
Related Links


http://media.tbo.com/assets/_shared/icons/video/video_16.gifInvestigators Collect Evidence (http://www.tbo.com/video/xml/MGB6H0G2NOF.html)
http://media.tbo.com/assets/_shared/icons/camera/camera_16.gifPhotos From The Scene (http://snap.tbo.com/galleries/index.php?id=338793&search_status=ALL&action=&sort=order&display=large)
http://media.tbo.com/assets/_shared/icons/info/info_16.gifMap: Where Remains Found (http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=UTF8&hl=en&oe=UTF8&ms3a=0&msid=110010345750475869289.00045dca812f5384e1a18)
http://media.tbo.com/assets/_shared/icons/newspaper/news2_16.gifRemains Could Bolster Case Against Mom (http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/dec/12/remains-could-bolster-44case-against-casey-anthony/news-metro/)

http://media.tbo.com/photos/trib/2008/july/072408caylee.jpg
Caylee Marie Anthony


ORLANDO - A medical examiner (http://boards.library.trutv.com/topic/k/medical-examiner/) found evidence among a child's remains that link them to the home of a missing toddler, the county sheriff said today, offering the strongest indication yet that the remains may be those of Caylee Anthony.
Orange County Sheriff Kevin Beary (http://boards.library.trutv.com/topic/k/orange-county-sheriff-kevin-beary/) said investigators searched the home early today after the medical examiner (http://boards.library.trutv.com/topic/k/medical-examiner/) found "some clues that came out of the remains" that "linked it to the house." He would not say what clues were found.
"We took some things out of the house that the forensic people are very interested in," he said.

Continues: Article Link (http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/dec/12/121234/evidence-fla-remains-prompts-search-warrant/)

[Gatordog]

OMG! I think I'm going to be sick. :flamemad: I had a nightmare last night that she knocked Caylee out with the Cloroform - stuck the tape over her mouth, put her in the bag and threw her in the trunk.

That's not far from my original thoughts too when I heard about duct tape. I envisioned that little girl waking up in the trunk in total fear because she can't open her mouth and then choking on her own vomit.

There is no punishment harsh enough for that woman to suffer. You have probably noticed that I can no longer call that person by her name but call her the Liar. Names imply humanity. You give a dog or a cat a name to make it your companion, you sometimes name a car, because you love it. That creature deserves no name and I am sure when she is roasting in hell, she will not have one there either.

[Spider]

If the Anthony's now have a new attorney representing them do you think this attorney will be smart enough to tell the to SHUT THE HECK UP ALREADY? Why would they keep talking in the face of this? They astound me.

Where is Lee? Anyone think he called his girlfriend to rush by the house to make sure she got the duct tape out?

[FDInLaw]

WFTV and WKMG both reporting that soft tissue was remaining on the body. Also reporting that duct tape was still attached to the mouth and it's waterproof so it would protect anything underneath it. They said it is possible that the child's death was horrific and agonizing. A pillow was taken as evidence. Perhaps she smothered the child. :rose:
This is painful to read. . . I sure pray not. :rose:

[TheSkwerl]

I've always thought that Cindy had knowledge or had a hand in this. Casey and Cindy seem very close, and George seems to be the type of dad that is more of a provider than anything.

[FDInLaw]

The case began with an emergency call from Casey Anthony's mother, Cindy Anthony in mid-July.

On the tape, she is heard frantically telling emergency operators, "I can't find my granddaughter. ... There's something wrong. ...I found my daughter's car today and it smelled like there's been a dead body in the damn car." Casey Anthony then got on the phone and reported she may have a missing child.

Cindy Anthony later retracted that statement, saying that the smell in the car could have been from garbage.

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/Story?id=6441931&page=2


Cindy had it right in the beginning. . . :flamemad:

[One2Snoop]

Sheriff on GMA: Absolutely Reason To Search...

http://www.wftv.com/video/18262810/index.html

[One2Snoop]

I saw posted elsewhere that Baez was talking and the judge said, "I'm not following you" -

judge couldn't figure out what Baez wants. Oh my LOL!

ETA TruTV Live Cam

[One2Snoop]

Defense Motion Denied
UPDATED: 1:55 pm EST December 12, 2008

Orange County Judge Stan Strickland denied a defense motion requesting that its experts witness the autopsy of the discovered remains.

Casey Anthony's attorney, Jose Baez, filed the emergency motion on Thursday shortly after the remains were found.

The state said it would agree to notify the defense when FBI agents and investigators complete the search of the wooded area, which could be completed by Friday night. Local 6 News reported that the defense may have to hire a security team to preserve the crime scene.

The hearing lasted about 30 minutes, and Casey Anthony was not in attendance.

http://www.local6.com/news/18262363/detail.html

[lorettalockhorn]

Defense Motion Denied
UPDATED: 1:55 pm EST December 12, 2008

Orange County Judge Stan Strickland denied a defense motion requesting that its experts witness the autopsy of the discovered remains.

Casey Anthony's attorney, Jose Baez, filed the emergency motion on Thursday shortly after the remains were found.

The state said it would agree to notify the defense when FBI agents and investigators complete the search of the wooded area, which could be completed by Friday night. Local 6 News reported that the defense may have to hire a security team to preserve the crime scene.

The hearing lasted about 30 minutes, and Casey Anthony was not in attendance.

http://www.local6.com/news/18262363/detail.html

This is interesting (to me anyway):

...Perhaps the most interesting aspect of the hearing was the fact that the defense team informed the court that they had been notified that anthropological measurements taken of the skeleton match that of Caylee Anthony. They also said that hair found with the remains matches Caylee's hair color....

http://www.wftv.com/news/18264817/detail.html

[browneyes106]

Greatest quote of 2008!!





Glad I missed LiarLiarPantsOnFire with her drawers down. :eek: (If'n she wears any.)

There are dozens of nearby places the guy could have gone according to googlemaps, maybe he has bladder issues. I'm telling you, it was serendipiddle.

This link has the infamous pic Casey "No-Class" Anthony.http://hubpages.com/hub/caseyanthony

[TheSkwerl]

I think it was a waste of time having Leonard on last night. I watched the show, and I don't think Greta was rude to him at all. If he would just answer the question honestly as to why he was going back. He seemed to be avoiding the question.

[lorettalockhorn]

When Padilla first got involved, I didn't like him. Of course I felt he was nuts for bailing Casey out. After he pulled out, I did like him. I continued to admire his loyalty to Caylee and his work with the case. But, yesterday when CNN made the unedited phone call moments after the body was found, I thought he was a bit pompous when he said, "I am elated and sad; elated because now I feel vindicated. (paraphrasing) I was put down and attacked because I knew the child was gone and now I feel better knowing that they know, I was right" Then he said he was sad but glad he could go to a funeral,, etc...

I have a problem with putting his ego into the big picture. It didn't belong there. We are strangers to those people and many strangers have spoken since they found the remains and, almost all of us have known the attitudes of the Anthony's pointed to the truth that Caylee was dead. Many have been attacked, as Gator was and I haven't once read or heard anyone say they felt vindicated. Lenard seems full of himself and Gretta probably walked right through him. (I didn't watch her, but I know she's a Scorpio and they got those exray eyes.. ;-) Anyway, I didn't like his response. He is a widdle bit fulla himself.

Somehow I missed that segment of Greta, but it does seem odd that she would say that she doesn't "get it" over and over. Sometimes you can convey more by not saying anything at all. (And it's a great way to get people to talk; I used to use it on my clients all the time. People hate pregnant pauses in conversation and will sell out their beloved dead mothers to fill an uncomfortable silence.)

That said, I do not blame LP one iota for feeling vindicated; but I do fault him for ever having expressed the sentiment out loud.

[NMurphy02]

to think that Lee knows Casey did this and has distanced himself from her and the family. There was the video released of her talking to him from jail, and his body language TO ME said he didn't believe a word coming out of her mouth. I have a feeling he doesn't want anything to to with them anymore. The girlfriend probably went over to get something of his out of the house. Seriously for someone who was there all the time and talking to Casey all the time, he has been MIA. It's possible this was the final straw for him and he knows his sister.

[lorettalockhorn]

This link has the infamous pic Casey "No-Class" Anthony.http://hubpages.com/hub/caseyanthony

Wow, a two streamer. :eek:

[One2Snoop]

updated: 56 minutes ago

Attorney says body found is similar to Caylee Anthony's
Bianca Prieto, Walter Pacheco and Sarah Lundy | Sentinel Staff Writers
1:53 PM EST, December 12, 2008

1:50 p.m. Attorney Mark NeJame, who once represented Cindy and George Anthony, arrived at the Hopespring Drive address this afternoon to comment on the latest developments.

NeJame learned of the discovery of skeletal remains while in Puerto Rico on a one-day business trip. He was shocked when he heard the news.

"Sadly, it was what was expected," NeJame said. "I was hoping at some point that Caylee would be found."

Although the medical examiner has not determined the identity of the remains, NeJame believes they belong to the missing toddler.

"It's more than a hunch," he said. "I have had an opinion for a long time. I absolutely believe that it is [Caylee]."

NeJame resigned as the Anthonys' representative in November because they did not take his advice, he said.

"Everyone hoped that a miracle would occur and that Caylee would show up," NeJame said, adding that he felt more comfortable expressing his opinions about the girl's fate now that a body has been found.

Earlier today a man who identified himself only as a private investigator went inside the home. He entered through the garage door and appeared to be in the back yard near the shed. He did not appear to remove anything from the home.

When asked if he was working for the Anthony family, he declined comment.

An Orange County deputy sheriff is stationed outside the family home and a cruiser is blocking the driveway, although sheriff's officials are done searching the house.

A defense attorney for Casey Anthony said investigators told lead counsel Jose Baez that the body found Thursday near Anthony's house in east Orange County was "tentatively" identified as Anthony's missing daughter, Caylee Marie.

During a court hearing Thursday morning, New York attorney Linda Kenney Baden - who is the wife of a renowned medical examiner and a member of the defense team - said Baez was told the body had light-colored hair and the size of the bones appeared to be similar to the 2-year-old.

But when asked by Orange Circuit Court Judge Stan Strickland if a tentative identification had been made on the body, an Orange County Sheriff's Office attorney consulted with an investigator and replied that one had not.

The development came before Strickland denied Baez's request to have defense experts present during the autopsy of the body.

"At this point, it would do nothing but interfere with the medical examiner's obligation," the judge said.

Strickland said he would address the issue later of whether the defense can review the body, x-rays and other material after the autopsy and a positive identification was made. Authorities couldn't tell him how long that would take.

A county attorney - who was representing the Orange County Medical Examiner's Office - said an FBI lab will be looking at the DNA.

Baez also asked to view the crime scene after authorities are done and before it's open to the public. After the hearing, Baez, prosecutors and investigators began discussing the issue in courtroom. Orange County Sheriff's Sgt. John Allen was heard saying they may be done as early as tonight.

Moments later, they moved the conversation behind closed doors where reporters could not hear. Baez would not comment about when his team would have access to the crime scene.

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/breakingnews/orl-bk-caylee-anthony-121208,0,1812243.story

[Gatordog]

:rose:

Dear Friends,

Once the grave site has been opened up to the public again, I am sure there will be people putting flowers and stuffed animals there. I would like to place a bouquet there for Caylee and have it be from "Caylee's friends on the CL". I hope you all think this is appropriate.

Joanne (AKA Gator)

[One2Snoop]

I think it was a waste of time having Leonard on last night. I watched the show, and I don't think Greta was rude to him at all. If he would just answer the question honestly as to why he was going back. He seemed to be avoiding the question.

He said he wanted to go back and visit the Grunds, NeJame and to pay his respects to Caylee. Greta kept saying she didn't understand why? : How much clearer could he make it? :shrug:

I agree he's arrogant - but he was the only one who continued to look for Caylee - he deserves at least that much credit. JMO

[browneyes106]

to think that Lee knows Casey did this and has distanced himself from her and the family. There was the video released of her talking to him from jail, and his body language TO ME said he didn't believe a word coming out of her mouth. I have a feeling he doesn't want anything to to with them anymore. The girlfriend probably went over to get something of his out of the house. Seriously for someone who was there all the time and talking to Casey all the time, he has been MIA. It's possible this was the final straw for him and he knows his sister.

I agree I think Lee could be at the point where he doesn't want anything to do with his family. It was said that his girlfriend Mallory Parker went to the house yesterday to take care of the pets. I think a week or two ago a caller on NG asked about Lee and I think Kath Belich said he has some kind of job where he travels with athletes and that's why he hasn't been around since Casey went back to jail. I think once the trial is over Lee and his girlfriend will move out of state. There were rumors that Lee and Mallory had broken up but they are still together. Her myspace which is private has a pic of Caylee as the default
http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=33318424

[One2Snoop]

:rose:

Dear Friends,

Once the grave site has been opened up to the public again, I am sure there will be people putting flowers and stuffed animals there. I would like to place a bouquet there for Caylee and have it be from "Caylee's friends on the CL". I hope you all think this is appropriate.

Joanne (AKA Gator)

Awesome idea!

[TheSkwerl]

That would be very nice.

[browneyes106]

:rose:

Dear Friends,

Once the grave site has been opened up to the public again, I am sure there will be people putting flowers and stuffed animals there. I would like to place a bouquet there for Caylee and have it be from "Caylee's friends on the CL". I hope you all think this is appropriate.

Joanne (AKA Gator)

I think it is appropriate. If I lived in Florida I would do the same.

[TheSkwerl]

I guess I didn't understand either why he was going to see the Grunds and didn't mention anything about seeing the Anthonys. Something about him just didn't seem right, that whole 2 minutes didn't seem right.

[samanthajane13]

"Dear Friends,

Once the grave site has been opened up to the public again, I am sure there will be people putting flowers and stuffed animals there. I would like to place a bouquet there for Caylee and have it be from "Caylee's friends on the CL". I hope you all think this is appropriate.

Joanne (AKA Gator)"

Gator-

I thank you for your idea. I think it's a wonderful tribute to the sweet baby who's become so much a part of our lives.

Hugs-
Donna

[Twinners]

He said he wanted to go back and visit the Grunds, NeJame and to pay his respects to Caylee. Greta kept saying she didn't understand why? : How much clearer could he make it? :shrug:

I agree he's arrogant - but he was the only one who continued to look for Caylee - he deserves at least that much credit. JMO
Greta's attitude with Padilla didn't change until he mentioned something about going back to Florida to have some kind of memorial for Caylee with Richard Grund. I'm not one who thinks it's appropriate for him to hold a memorial for her, so I kind of found myself thinking, "finally!" when Greta started questioning him about it last night.

[samanthajane13]

On another page, someone asked about the hair found.

They thought that the hair would fall away from the scalp or skull after 2 oe 3 day, I believe.

This is what I found-

"After 3 weeks:
24} The skin, hair, and nails are so loose they can be easily pulled off the corpse
25} The skin cracks and bursts open in many places because of the pressure of Internal gases and the breakdown of the skin itself
26} Decomposition will continue until body is nothing but skeletal remains, which can take as little as a month in hot climates and two months in cold climates. The teeth are often the only thing left, years and centuries later, because tooth enamel is the strongest substance in the body. The jawbone is the densest, so that usually will also remain. So don't forget - brush regularly and floss only if you're really bored."


I don't know HOW ACCURATE this is, but it's all I really found on it.

http://www.anomalies-unlimited.com/Death/Stages.html

[FDInLaw]

Prosecutors announced last week that they would not seek the death penalty against Casey Anthony. Even if the remains are Caylee's, law experts said it was unlikely the state would reverse its decision because prosecutors still have not determined a motive.

And depending on what the evidence yields, the discovery could also help defense attorneys.

>snip<

In mid-March, someone used the Anthonys' home laptop to search Google and Wikipedia for peroxide, shovels, acetone, alcohol and chloroform. Traces of chloroform, which is used to induce unconsciousness and is a component of human decomposition, were found in the trunk of Casey Anthony's car during forensic testing, the documents said.
Could this not be used to argue premeditation?
http://www.suntimes.com/news/nation/1328144,casey-anthony-caylee-missing-child-121208.article

[Twinners]

I guess I didn't understand either why he was going to see the Grunds and didn't mention anything about seeing the Anthonys. Something about him just didn't seem right, that whole 2 minutes didn't seem right.
I completely agree with you there. The whole thing with him just seemed very strange. When Greta first asked him about going to Florida, he said something about it being a situation where he promised Casey he would do all he could to find Caylee. I think my mouth fell open when he said that. Promised Casey? WTH is that about?

For those of you who didn't catch it last night, you can see his segment on Greta here: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,465851,00.html#.

ETA: You have to click on "watch the video" on the left side of the interview to see it.

[lorettalockhorn]

...In response to questions regarding why the defense or Casey Anthony should be able to witness the autopsy, Baden had this to say:

"Well, in many states you are allowed to witness it ... If this is little Caylee Anthony, [Casey] is still the mother of this child and she's still presumed innocent and like any person, she would have a right to see remains, to view remains, and to hopefully deal with the remains in a manner that would be appropriate scientifically."...

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2008/12/casey-anthony-d.html

[Twinners]

The sheriff's office is no longer securing the Anthony home and Cindy and George Anthony may return there if they wish, Padilla said. He would not discuss any of the evidence that was removed from the home.

Padilla said an investigator spoke to the Anthonys yesterday after the discovery, but out of respect for the family deputies will not comment on their reaction or condition.

There are no plans to question them today, but it may come up in the near future as the case moves forward, Padilla said.

http://www.newsday.com/iphone/orl-bk-caylee-anthony-121208,0,5963789.story?page=2

[Twinners]

Minute-To-Minute Update Friday, Dec. 12

3:10 p.m.: George and Cindy Anthony arrive at their Hopespring Drive home with security.

http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Local/2008/12/12/minutetominute_update_in_remains_discovery_12_11.h tml?refresh=1

[Twinners]

Have you all heard the song playing on the Help Find Caylee MySpace page? It's heartbreaking, IMO.

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=122459029

[Justice Denied?]

Just a few comments about NG and LK preview. Nancy is worse than ever ranting and raving. I think pregnancy did something to her hormones . LOL. Shame on me. And I do not believe for one minute Cindy's statement that LE specifically told her they would not help her look into those photos and sightings because it would quote hurt their case. I don't believe a seasoned detective would be that stupid. I believe Cindy is putting words in a detectives mouth. Secondly if all the calls on LKL are warm and fuzzy you can be sure they carefully screened them to be so. We will see. Hope to see lots of you guys online after LKL.

I would venture to say that NG's ranting and raving and caused by Jane Velez Mitchell and the young lady on the morning news show. (Can't think of her name right now.) Nancy is aging and these young ladies are nipping at her heals. She is no longer the prima donna of CNN and it is not sitting well with her. She is scared, pure and simple.

[Gatordog]

I completely agree with you there. The whole thing with him just seemed very strange. When Greta first asked him about going to Florida, he said something about it being a situation where he promised Casey he would do all he could to find Caylee. I think my mouth fell open when he said that. Promised Casey? WTH is that about?

For those of you who didn't catch it last night, you can see his segment on Greta here: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,465851,00.html#.

ETA: You have to click on "watch the video" on the left side of the interview to see it.

It's not the kind of promise that you think - it was more of a get even promise. When she threw him out of her house - he told her that he would do everything that he could to find Caylee's body so she could be found guilty of murder.

[Gatordog]

The sheriff's office is no longer securing the Anthony home and Cindy and George Anthony may return there if they wish, Padilla said. He would not discuss any of the evidence that was removed from the home.

Padilla said an investigator spoke to the Anthonys yesterday after the discovery, but out of respect for the family deputies will not comment on their reaction or condition.

There are no plans to question them today, but it may come up in the near future as the case moves forward, Padilla said.

http://www.newsday.com/iphone/orl-bk-caylee-anthony-121208,0,5963789.story?page=2

FYI - there are two Padillas - Carlos Padilla is the Sheriff Dept.'s spokesman.

[Gatordog]

I would venture to say that NG's ranting and raving and caused by Jane Velez Mitchell and the young lady on the morning news show. (Can't think of her name right now.) Nancy is aging and these young ladies are nipping at her heals. She is no longer the prima donna of CNN and it is not sitting well with her. She is scared, pure and simple.

I think it's because this case has hit a nerve. She has had her children late in life and they are precious to her. She came close to not even having them survive. I think she is just super sensitive to this case because it involves a child's death and she just can't give it any justification or logic.

[Justice Denied?]

King never asked them a pertinent question......this interview was staged for ratings.....and it is going to piss a lot of people off. George committs perjury, cindi lies about the photos, And the Host mever brings up anything about the lies, the DNA evidence, The fact she wasn't wroking....nothing.

I AM PISSED:flamemad::flamemad::flamemad:



ga did not commit perjury when he lied on LK. Perjury is lying under oath. GA was not under oath at that time.LOL

[One2Snoop]

It's not the kind of promise that you think - it was more of a get even promise. When she threw him out of her house - he told her that he would do everything that he could to find Caylee's body so she could be found guilty of murder.

ITA Gator - thats how I took it too. He is completely on the outs with the Anthony family but I think just about everyone was at this point in time.

When he said memorial, I bet he meant to say prayer vigil instead. ;)

[One2Snoop]

ga did not commit perjury when he lied on LK. Perjury is lying under oath. GA was not under oath at that time.LOL

LOL - he perjured himself in our eyes. JMO

[lorettalockhorn]

I would venture to say that NG's ranting and raving and caused by Jane Velez Mitchell and the young lady on the morning news show. (Can't think of her name right now.) Nancy is aging and these young ladies are nipping at her heals. She is no longer the prima donna of CNN and it is not sitting well with her. She is scared, pure and simple.

hehehe I like all of them (in varying degrees) and enjoyed JV-M's show last night, it was like a MENSA hen party! But I like Nancy's big hair better than Jane's mullet. :hat:

It's not the kind of promise that you think - it was more of a get even promise. When she threw him out of her house - he told her that he would do everything that he could to find Caylee's body so she could be found guilty of murder.

I've always thought that Mr. (Rev.?) Grund and LP are strange bedfellows, but it could very well be that Leonard is spiritual in a way that just isn't obvious to me. But you think he's going to return to Orlando to involve himself in some sort of memorial service where his motive is revenge? Oy.

[Twinners]

It's not the kind of promise that you think - it was more of a get even promise. When she threw him out of her house - he told her that he would do everything that he could to find Caylee's body so she could be found guilty of murder.
Even so, Gator, those bones, hair and whatever else they found is all that's left of that beautiful little girl. IMO, those remains shouldn't be used as a means to get even with anyone.

[abbra]

I completely agree with you there. The whole thing with him just seemed very strange. When Greta first asked him about going to Florida, he said something about it being a situation where he promised Casey he would do all he could to find Caylee. I think my mouth fell open when he said that. Promised Casey? WTH is that about?

For those of you who didn't catch it last night, you can see his segment on Greta here: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,465851,00.html#.

ETA: You have to click on "watch the video" on the left side of the interview to see it.

I just got through watching the video and I couldn't figure Greta out. First of all LP has been involved in the case for a while like Tim Miller has so I assume that he, Tim Miller and anyone else involved in the case have a heartache over the Alledged Caylees body being found. I did see on some news show earlier ( can't think which one) that the newscaster was talking to Leonard and his voice was very choked up and he had a hard time speaking about how he felt when the newscaster asked him. I know through the news and TV I have become very close to this case and when it was first reported that Caylees Body might be found my heart sank and a sick feeling came over me. Going through the trauma of my own daughters death you know a parents worse nightmare is that they will get that call by law enforcement telling them their child is dead and I think in a way thats what happened with Padilla. With all the hooplah over the Anthonys and Casey claiming Caylee is alive its almost as if we know that beautiful child is gone and we all expected she might never have been found because of environmental issues and deterioration of the body in certain climates. I do have to say Tim Miller who lost his own daughter scaled back the search for Caylee while Padilla continued to look for her. I guess its hard to explain but I know when my daughter was killed I wanted to go to the spot where her body had been found to try to find some kind of comfort and I think even though Padilla and Miller and others who were not family members but had a vested interest in finding this little girl may want to go back to the spot where her remains were found. Someone here said they wanted to put flowers at the site. Padilla could just want to be close to those who knew Caylee like Grund and those who helped him search for Caylee. He, Tim Miller and others may want to go to the site to pay their respects in person. At my daughters funeral many State Troopers, Sheriffs deputys and other came to the funeral home , church and cemetery to pay their respects. I know just from following this case on tv Little Cayless stole my heart and I am sure the photos and videotapes of her grabbed the hearts of these big men who are suppose to be stoic.
These guys like Padilla, Miller and even Mark Klass and John Walsh are not immune from having feelings for families who have lost loved ones through crime. Thanks God we have Men like Padilla and others who are willing to hold families up in times of despair. They are families hopes and if all hope is lost they are their to support those families if the families will let them. The Anthonys decided they didn't want help from Miller and Padilla.

[One2Snoop]

hehehe I like all of them (in varying degrees) and enjoyed JV-M's show last night, it was like a MENSA hen party! But I like Nancy's big hair better than Jane's mullet. :hat:



I've always thought that Mr. (Rev.?) Grund and LP are strange bedfellows, but it could very well be that Leonard is spiritual in a way that just isn't obvious to me. But you think he's going to return to Orlando to involve himself in some sort of memorial service where his motive is revenge? Oy.

Maybe more like a "I told you so" situation. :shrug:

[browneyes106]

Have you all heard the song playing on the Help Find Caylee MySpace page? It's heartbreaking, IMO.

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=122459029


It is heartbreaking. I also noticed that there are new comments since yesterday. The last few comments are about LKL.

[One2Snoop]

One other thing - Greta didn't even know who the Grunds were - LP had to explain it to her.

[Mac]

http://www.wftv.com/video/18266518/index.html

[lorettalockhorn]

It is heartbreaking. I also noticed that there are new comments since yesterday. The last few comments are about LKL.

browneyes, I didn't stay even long enough to listen to the whole song; I'm too busy drinking the Haterade today, and not quite ready to give it up.

One of the things that has haunted me since the discovery yesterday is wondering if Caylee was ever baptized. I know we all probably have very different beliefs which should certainly be respected along those lines, but I'm Presbyterian and it bothers me that maybe she never was. I've never seen any Christening type pix.

[TheSkwerl]

Now that would make sense, and make his time on Greta's show make sense.

[Justice Denied?]

Oh yeah about that description which was made by the paragon of truth, Casey , 5'7 brown hair, brown eyes, wears her hair curly/wavy and straight and has a little more meat on her bones than Casey and a lot of money , I jokingly said I thought she was describing Catherine Zeta Jones, so with that description it could be like what millions of women?? Crazy , crazy , looney tunes.

Please do not disrespect Tweety, Sylvester, Taz and the gang to this crazy bunch. They are NOT insane just crazy!:biggrin::D

[Mac]

browneyes, I didn't stay even long enough to listen to the whole song; I'm too busy drinking the Haterade today, and not quite ready to give it up.

One of the things that has haunted me since the discovery yesterday is wondering if Caylee was ever baptized. I know we all probably have very different beliefs which should certainly be respected along those lines, but I'm Presbyterian and it bothers me that maybe she never was. I've never seen any Christening type pix.



Funny you mention that, On another blog we I talked about the fact that Casey and Cindy always talk about faith.......but can't see any evidence of practice in the real world.

But then why should we be surprised

[browneyes106]

browneyes, I didn't stay even long enough to listen to the whole song; I'm too busy drinking the Haterade today, and not quite ready to give it up.

One of the things that has haunted me since the discovery yesterday is wondering if Caylee was ever baptized. I know we all probably have very different beliefs which should certainly be respected along those lines, but I'm Presbyterian and it bothers me that maybe she never was. I've never seen any Christening type pix.

It has been reported that the Anthonys attend a Baptist church. I can't remember the name of the church. I don't think Caylee was baptized. I know some Baptist churches do dedication ceremonies in which the child is dedicated to God or something. It sort of bugged me that Casey wore rosary beads like jewelry.

[abbra]

About this case. Where was Cindy Anthony when Caylee was missing for a month before Casey told her that Caylee was missing. A week doesn't go by that my mom doesn't call my brothers and sisters children asking how they are.

George and Cindy complained about the smell in Caseys Car- the back smells like a dead body was in the car- Cindys a nurse. She certainly knows what a dead body smells like and so does George who made the same comments.
I know that smell from taking care of decomposing corpses that have been brought into the emergency room of where I worked when they are found. You don't forget that smell.

Next- Think about it. If Casey brought Caylee to " Zannys apartment" like she claims she had because thats where Zanny lived- and the apartment had been empty for a while wouldn't the Anthonys question Casey about that. I am sure the police found out who lived in the apartment before it went empty and records showed no one there by that name ever lived there.
Why didn't the Anthonys confront Casey about the empty apartment that was suppose to be the babysitters home.

George is not a very smart law enforcement official if he didn't demand that Casey tell him how they were all in danger, so that he could provide security for his family.

What about the supposed fight Cindy had with Casey and claims of Cindy telling Casey she was an unfit mother,

Cindy said on Larry King the other night that Casey was employed by that club where those photos of her and the girl were acting inappropriately yet if she was working at that club why has the owner not come forward to verify if she was employed there. - Let me guess they will claim she worked under the table for money at the club thats why the club owner hasn't made any statements.

Of course we all know about the running in circles Casey had the police going- her supposed job and her office which she hadn't worked at for a few years was it?

I would like to see how Jose gets Casey off if he claims she innocent.

[browneyes106]

The name of the church is Eastside Baptist

[abbra]

One of the things that has haunted me since the discovery yesterday is wondering if Caylee was ever baptized. I know we all probably have very different beliefs which should certainly be respected along those lines, but I'm Presbyterian and it bothers me that maybe she never was. I've never seen any Christening type pix.


I was thinking the same thing Loretta- Thanks for bringing that up.

[browneyes106]

About this case. Where was Cindy Anthony when Caylee was missing for a month before Casey told her that Caylee was missing. A week doesn't go by that my mom doesn't call my brothers and sisters children asking how they are.

George and Cindy complained about the smell in Caseys Car- the back smells like a dead body was in the car- Cindys a nurse. She certainly knows what a dead body smells like and so does George who made the same comments.
I know that smell from taking care of decomposing corpses that have been brought into the emergency room of where I worked when they are found. You don't forget that smell.

Next- Think about it. If Casey brought Caylee to " Zannys apartment" like she claims she had because thats where Zanny lived- and the apartment had been empty for a while wouldn't the Anthonys question Casey about that. I am sure the police found out who lived in the apartment before it went empty and records showed no one there by that name ever lived there.
Why didn't the Anthonys confront Casey about the empty apartment that was suppose to be the babysitters home.

George is not a very smart law enforcement official if he didn't demand that Casey tell him how they were all in danger, so that he could provide security for his family.

What about the supposed fight Cindy had with Casey and claims of Cindy telling Casey she was an unfit mother,

Cindy said on Larry King the other night that Casey was employed by that club where those photos of her and the girl were acting inappropriately yet if she was working at that club why has the owner not come forward to verify if she was employed there. - Let me guess they will claim she worked under the table for money at the club thats why the club owner hasn't made any statements.

Of course we all know about the running in circles Casey had the police going- her supposed job and her office which she hadn't worked at for a few years was it?

I would like to see how Jose gets Casey off if he claims she innocent.

I think the reason Cindy lied about Casey working at the club and the pics is because Tony did promo work. Tony has said he does promo work for Fusion and he even said Casey has never done any promo work.

[abbra]

Funny you mention that, On another blog we I talked about the fact that Casey and Cindy always talk about faith.......but can't see any evidence of practice in the real world.

But then why should we be surprised

All you have to do is listen to Casey doing all that cursing on those recorded jail tapes and judge her beliefs for yourself.

[abbra]

It has been reported that the Anthonys attend a Baptist church. I can't remember the name of the church. I don't think Caylee was baptized. I know some Baptist churches do dedication ceremonies in which the child is dedicated to God or something. It sort of bugged me that Casey wore rosary beads like jewelry.


Man a Baptist wearing rosary beads. Glad you brought that up Brown Eyes. Thats pretty disrespectful. Its a wonder her minister doesn't get after her for wearing those "Catholic Charms of the Devil!"

[lorettalockhorn]

It has been reported that the Anthonys attend a Baptist church. I can't remember the name of the church. I don't think Caylee was baptized. I know some Baptist churches do dedication ceremonies in which the child is dedicated to God or something. It sort of bugged me that Casey wore rosary beads like jewelry.

I knew that the recent vigils, etc. were at the Baptist church, but didn't actually know if they were members. I've never heard of Baptists performing infant baptism, so if they are members, I suppose it's doubtful that Caylee was baptized. But that seems alien even to a curmudgeon like me. No baptism, no last rites, no nothing.

I know that religions other than Catholic use rosaries, but surely Baptist isn't one of them. And I've got so many rosaries that my housekeeper asked me if I was sure I'm not Catholic. (Um yeah. Pretty sure.) Promise, I don't wear them for jewelry.

[browneyes106]

Man a Baptist wearing rosary beads. Glad you brought that up Brown Eyes. Thats pretty disrespectful. Its a wonder her minister doesn't get after her for wearing those "Catholic Charms of the Devil!"

I saw a party pic of Casey and she is wearing a white rosary. Later on after she got released the first time she started wearing a black rosary that was given by strangers.
I knew that the recent vigils, etc. were at the Baptist church, but didn't actually know if they were members. I've never heard of Baptists performing infant baptism, so if they are members, I suppose it's doubtful that Caylee was baptized. But that seems alien even to a curmudgeon like me. No baptism, no last rites, no nothing.

I know that religions other than Catholic use rosaries, but surely Baptist isn't one of them. And I've got so many rosaries that my housekeeper asked me if I was sure I'm not Catholic. (Um yeah. Pretty sure.) Promise, I don't wear them for jewelry.

I don't think Caylee was baptized but maybe she had a dedication ceremony. My friend used to attend a Baptist church before becoming Lutheran and she had her kids dedicated.

A few Catholic priests who I have known are even against Catholics wearing rosaries as jewelry. Recently some celebs have been wearing them for jewelry I have Reba McEntire and the Rascal Flatts guys wearing them. I know several people who aren't Catholic that collect rosaries and I think that is ok. Maybe Casey wore the black rosary to get a sympathy from people

[applesandorange]

Please don't hate me for saying this. No offense to anyone here. I don't believe in baptizing infants. I don't feel like children have any sins and I don't believe in reincarnation. We do dedication ceremonies where we as the parents pledge to raise our children in accordance to the bible. When the children are old enough to choose if they want to be a part of the Chrisitan faith than they can get baptized. I don't feel the least bit bad about Caylee not being baptized (if she wasn't). I know that sweet little angel is in heavan. I feel at peace with that. I should also say we are members of a non denominational church.

[browneyes106]

Please don't hate me for saying this. No offense to anyone here. I don't believe in baptizing infants. I don't feel like children have any sins and I don't believe in reincarnation. We do dedication ceremonies where we as the parents pledge to raise our children in accordance to the bible. When the children are old enough to choose if they want to be a part of the Chrisitan faith than they can get baptized. I don't feel the least bit bad about Caylee not being baptized (if she wasn't). I know that sweet little angel is in heavan. I feel at peace with that. I should also say we are members of a non denominational church.

No offense taken. We all have different beliefs and I think the way we raise children is what should really matter. Caylee was an innocent being. I get comfort knowing Caylee is in heaven. I lost my brother eight years ago due to accidental gunshot wound and about a year later one of his close friends lost his premature daughter. His friend told me that he believes my brother is the daddy to his daughter in heaven. Maybe up in heaven Caylee has found a mother in someone who didn't never had the chance to have children while on Earth.

[One2Snoop]

http://i37.tinypic.com/kbvol3.gifhttp://i37.tinypic.com/kbvol3.gif

http://i36.tinypic.com/2jcsiur.gif

[FDInLaw]

Please don't hate me for saying this. No offense to anyone here. I don't believe in baptizing infants. I don't feel like children have any sins and I don't believe in reincarnation. We do dedication ceremonies where we as the parents pledge to raise our children in accordance to the bible. When the children are old enough to choose if they want to be a part of the Chrisitan faith than they can get baptized. I don't feel the least bit bad about Caylee not being baptized (if she wasn't). I know that sweet little angel is in heavan. I feel at peace with that. I should also say we are members of a non denominational church. My personal beliefs are probably closest to yours. . . one thing we can probably all agree on, though we could not trust her earthly mother, we CAN trust Caylee's Heavenly Father! She is at peace now. . . . :rose: :rose: :rose:

[lorettalockhorn]

Profiler comments; Dr. Deborah Shurman-Kauflin:

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2008/12/dr-deborah-schu.html?cid=142580268#comments

and Pat Brown:

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2008/12/criminal-prof-2.html

[deputydi]

No offense taken. We all have different beliefs and I think the way we raise children is what should really matter. Caylee was an innocent being. I get comfort knowing Caylee is in heaven. I lost my brother eight years ago due to accidental gunshot wound and about a year later one of his close friends lost his premature daughter. His friend told me that he believes my brother is the daddy to his daughter in heaven. Maybe up in heaven Caylee has found a mother in someone who didn't never had the chance to have children while on Earth.
What a sweet thought. I believe all little children go to heaven, baptized or not.

[FDInLaw]

Profiler comments; Dr. Deborah Shurman-Kauflin:

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2008/12/dr-deborah-schu.html?cid=142580268#comments

and Pat Brown:

http://blogs.discovery.com/criminal_report/2008/12/criminal-prof-2.html
From your first link:

"Casey has shown she will do what's best for Casey. And giving up the ghost could be the only way to save her own life," Dr. Schurman-Kauflin said. "Desperation has certainly set in. Women who kill their children are most likely to talk about the crime when the body is found because that's when their lies get exposed. The stories tend to go from a stranger 'did it', to 'it was an accident,' to 'I don't know what happened.' When they reach the 'I don't know what happened' stage, they say that they don't remember key parts of the murder. They will say it is blank to them, but this is their way of hiding what they've done, even from themselves. If they are forced to look at what they did, even those with psychopathic tendencies feel uncomfortable. Psychopaths are all about toying with people and pleasuring themselves. They will avoid discomfort at any cost. She is a caged, wounded animal now. Remember how an injured animal behaves."

Unfortunately for Anthony, she may have waited far too long to cut a deal.

[One2Snoop]

:eek:CASEY'S PARENTS MAY EVENTUALLY FACE CHARGES

Sources close to the case told Eyewitness News that Casey's parents, George and Cindy, may someday face criminal charges. Sources tipped Eyewitness News off that George and Cindy Anthony checked into the luxury Ritz-Carlton Hotel on Thursday night.

Meanwhile, Eyewitness News has learned the sheriff's office is looking into charging the Anthonys with obstruction of justice.

Rooms go for about $300 a night at the Ritz-Carlton Hotel and sources say they Anthonys had dinner at Normans on Thursday night, where dinner could cost $100 a person. The Anthonys recently hired attorney Brad Conway to replace Mark NeJame.

Conway could not tell Eyewitness News who is paying for the room, but said the Anthonys needed peace and quiet.

"They want to be left alone. They want to grieve and go through the process without the publicity that's been focused on them so long," Conway said.

The Anthonys have spent months insisting Caylee is alive, but with the news of the remains Conway said they are prepared to accept Caylee may be dead.

"They are realistic about the possibilities and about the fact that this is likely Caylee, but continue to pray that likely it's not," Conway said.

In the meantime, sources told Eyewitness News investigators are building a case against the Anthonys. They may face obstructions of justice charges.

Conway said he's talked to the State Attorney's Office and is not aware of any pending charges and maintains the Anthonys have done nothing wrong.

"Anytime the sheriff's office cordons your house and serves a search warrant, there are a potential for charges. I don't know what the sheriff's office has in mind, but the Anthonys have cooperated fully and will continue to cooperate," Conway said.

http://www.wftv.com/news/18264817/detail.html

[FDInLaw]

:eek:CASEY'S PARENTS MAY EVENTUALLY FACE CHARGES

Sources close to the case told Eyewitness News that Casey's parents, George and Cindy, may someday face criminal charges. Sources tipped Eyewitness News off that George and Cindy Anthony checked into the luxury Ritz-Carlton Hotel on Thursday night.

Meanwhile, Eyewitness News has learned the sheriff's office is looking into charging the Anthonys with obstruction of justice.

Rooms go for about $300 a night at the Ritz-Carlton Hotel and sources say they Anthonys had dinner at Normans on Thursday night, where dinner could cost $100 a person. The Anthonys recently hired attorney Brad Conway to replace Mark NeJame.

Conway could not tell Eyewitness News who is paying for the room, but said the Anthonys needed peace and quiet.

"They want to be left alone. They want to grieve and go through the process without the publicity that's been focused on them so long," Conway said.

The Anthonys have spent months insisting Caylee is alive, but with the news of the remains Conway said they are prepared to accept Caylee may be dead.

"They are realistic about the possibilities and about the fact that this is likely Caylee, but continue to pray that likely it's not," Conway said.

In the meantime, sources told Eyewitness News investigators are building a case against the Anthonys. They may face obstructions of justice charges.

Conway said he's talked to the State Attorney's Office and is not aware of any pending charges and maintains the Anthonys have done nothing wrong.

"Anytime the sheriff's office cordons your house and serves a search warrant, there are a potential for charges. I don't know what the sheriff's office has in mind, but the Anthonys have cooperated fully and will continue to cooperate," Conway said.

http://www.wftv.com/news/18264817/detail.htmlBeen wondering if they will be charged!!!!

[FDInLaw]

You've got to wonder if Casey had something on her parents and she was able to “persuade” them into covering for her.

[lorettalockhorn]

:eek:CASEY'S PARENTS MAY EVENTUALLY FACE CHARGES

Conway could not tell Eyewitness News who is paying for the room, but said the Anthonys needed peace and quiet.

"They want to be left alone. They want to grieve and go through the process without the publicity that's been focused on them so long," Conway said.

but the Anthonys have cooperated fully and will continue to cooperate," Conway said.

http://www.wftv.com/news/18264817/detail.html

Yes, it takes peace and quiet to steel yourself for the hard hitting questions that Larry King has a reputation for asking them.

So, Mr. Conway, besides cooperating with Casey, exactly who have G&C cooperated with fully?

[Mac]

http://www.wftv.com/news/18267413/detail.html




It's about time that OCSO stopped pussy footing around with this woman.....Charge her!!!!!!!!!

She tampered with evidence.....Lied 2x to the FBI.....Committed perjury....and obstructed justice.....


'bout time

Cindy....you better play up the grieving Grandmother routine, cause Sherriff Beary is comin' to visit you!!!!


Sorry to sound happy about this....but this woman needs to be in a cell next to her daughter

[Mac]

Yes, it takes peace and quiet to steel yourself for the hard hitting questions that Larry King has a reputation for asking them.

So, Mr. Conway, besides cooperating with Casey, exactly who have G&C cooperated with fully?



Get 'em Loretta. We have been saying all along that OCSO needs to put the hammer down on these 2

Maybe they will dedicate a whole wing at the prison to them?

[browneyes106]

You've got to wonder if Casey had something on her parents and she was able to “persuade” them into covering for her.

I have been wondering too.

[Spider]

They need to be left alone without the media that has been focused on them??!! Give me a big fat break! Cindy is BEGGING for media attention.

Media attention is what she is living for right now. I am sure if they did NOT want media attention they would not be going on LK again. Their attorney really should advise them to shut up finally. They are going to have to face the fact that the Liar is a murderer and they raised a murderer.

I do think in my heart that the Cindy Liar has something to hide as well.


Sorry to sound pithy but I have felt a bit ignored with a few of my questions. Perhaps they were old ones and had already been answered.

I will say that you guys are the best and I have been following everything. Gatordog is a wealth of info with a huge heart. The idea of flowers from the CL folks is beautiful.

[FDInLaw]

They need to be left alone without the media that has been focused on them??!! Give me a big fat break! Cindy is BEGGING for media attention.

Media attention is what she is living for right now. I am sure if they did NOT want media attention they would not be going on LK again. Their attorney really should advise them to shut up finally. They are going to have to face the fact that the Liar is a murderer and they raised a murderer.

I do think in my heart that the Cindy Liar has something to hide as well.


Sorry to sound pithy but I have felt a bit ignored with a few of my questions. Perhaps they were old ones and had already been answered.

I will say that you guys are the best and I have been following everything. Gatordog is a wealth of info with a huge heart. The idea of flowers from the CL folks is beautiful.
Welcome to the board! :seeya:

A few of my questions have been ignored too, but when so much is happening at once it is bound to happen. . . don't take it personally. Just keep jumping in! This is a great place to hang. :hat:

[Mac]

They need to be left alone without the media that has been focused on them??!! Give me a big fat break! Cindy is BEGGING for media attention.

Media attention is what she is living for right now. I am sure if they did NOT want media attention they would not be going on LK again. Their attorney really should advise them to shut up finally. They are going to have to face the fact that the Liar is a murderer and they raised a murderer.

I do think in my heart that the Cindy Liar has something to hide as well.


Sorry to sound pithy but I have felt a bit ignored with a few of my questions. Perhaps they were old ones and had already been answered.

I will say that you guys are the best and I have been following everything. Gatordog is a wealth of info with a huge heart. The idea of flowers from the CL folks is beautiful.



Welcome to the boards!!

My problem tonight is that they are at the Ritz-Carlton at $300 a bight and eating $100 a plate dinners.

Weren't these 2 broke?

or are they spending from the Caylee fund?

[browneyes106]

Welcome to the boards!!

My problem tonight is that they are at the Ritz-Carlton at $300 a bight and eating $100 a plate dinners.

Weren't these 2 broke?

or are they spending from the Caylee fund?

Maybe they are living it up before they stop receiving donations.

[Gatordog]

Even so, Gator, those bones, hair and whatever else they found is all that's left of that beautiful little girl. IMO, those remains shouldn't be used as a means to get even with anyone.

I don't see it that way - he's not using the remains as a weapon but he knew that a body was needed in order for her to be properly punished for her crime. He didn't understand who mhe was dealing with when he put up her bond. When he realized that this was no kidnapping but a deliberate act, he promised to make her pay for her crime and for making him feel used and foolish.

I met him a few times, he really wanted to put that baby to rest.

[FDInLaw]

Welcome to the boards!!

My problem tonight is that they are at the Ritz-Carlton at $300 a bight and eating $100 a plate dinners.

Weren't these 2 broke?

or are they spending from the Caylee fund?If it's any comfort, I doubt the Ritz has anything to offer that will truly ease their misery right now. Even with the aid of a sedative. . . they will wake up to this nightmare like no one else.

I do see your point though. . . not a good statement to be making right now!

[lorettalockhorn]

I don't see it that way - he's not using the remains as a weapon but he knew that a body was needed in order for her to be properly punished for her crime. He didn't understand who mhe was dealing with when he put up her bond. When he realized that this was no kidnapping but a deliberate act, he promised to make her pay for her crime and for making him feel used and foolish.

I met him a few times, he really wanted to put that baby to rest.

Revenge is a dish best served cold. Hopefully someone will remind him of that.

Speaking of LP, he told JV-M that he thinks Casey dumped Caylee "around the corner" after George got too close to the trunk in the garage on the 24th.

Ooh! She's talking about the defense Dream Team (not sure where Baez fits in); wonder who's paying these folks? Is Casey going to be an income tax write-off for fiscal year '09?

[Gatordog]

Man a Baptist wearing rosary beads. Glad you brought that up Brown Eyes. Thats pretty disrespectful. Its a wonder her minister doesn't get after her for wearing those "Catholic Charms of the Devil!"

I don't even think they were baptist - that church offered its locaation when LE advised that a lot of the crazies would disappear if they syopped holding vigils in their driveway. The minister was on local news just tonight. He said he reached out to the Anthonys in August and they have asked him to help them regain their faith through this tragedy.

[Gatordog]

I knew that the recent vigils, etc. were at the Baptist church, but didn't actually know if they were members. I've never heard of Baptists performing infant baptism, so if they are members, I suppose it's doubtful that Caylee was baptized. But that seems alien even to a curmudgeon like me. No baptism, no last rites, no nothing.

I know that religions other than Catholic use rosaries, but surely Baptist isn't one of them. And I've got so many rosaries that my housekeeper asked me if I was sure I'm not Catholic. (Um yeah. Pretty sure.) Promise, I don't wear them for jewelry.

A woman left those roary beads on the Anthony's door after Caylee went missing and Casey was in jail. I don't think the woman intended for Casey to wear them as a fashion accessory. :flamemad:

[lorettalockhorn]

A woman left those roary beads on the Anthony's door after Caylee went missing and Casey was in jail. I don't think the woman intended for Casey to wear them as a fashion accessory. :flamemad:

I've never seen any pix with her wearing the rosary as a fashion accessory (or didn't notice), but then again, I hadn't seen her bare arsed in the parking lot tinkling either.

So G&C didn't show up for LKL. Guess they found a lawyer who got through to them.

BUT Mark Geragos is there. Where the heck has he been??

[applesandorange]

No offense taken. We all have different beliefs and I think the way we raise children is what should really matter. Caylee was an innocent being. I get comfort knowing Caylee is in heaven. I lost my brother eight years ago due to accidental gunshot wound and about a year later one of his close friends lost his premature daughter. His friend told me that he believes my brother is the daddy to his daughter in heaven. Maybe up in heaven Caylee has found a mother in someone who didn't never had the chance to have children while on Earth.


I'm so sorry to hear of your loss. That is such a beautiful thought. I'm glad your brothers riend was able to gain comfort in his belief.

[deputydi]

They need to be left alone without the media that has been focused on them??!! Give me a big fat break! Cindy is BEGGING for media attention.

Media attention is what she is living for right now. I am sure if they did NOT want media attention they would not be going on LK again. Their attorney really should advise them to shut up finally. They are going to have to face the fact that the Liar is a murderer and they raised a murderer.

I do think in my heart that the Cindy Liar has something to hide as well.


Sorry to sound pithy but I have felt a bit ignored with a few of my questions. Perhaps they were old ones and had already been answered.

I will say that you guys are the best and I have been following everything. Gatordog is a wealth of info with a huge heart. The idea of flowers from the CL folks is beautiful.
Trust me -- no one is intentionally ignoring you. Things have been moving so fast the last couple of days, I can see how it may seem that way.

Welcome to the boards.

[deputydi]

If it's any comfort, I doubt the Ritz has anything to offer that will truly ease their misery right now. Even with the aid of a sedative. . . they will wake up to this nightmare like no one else.

I do see your point though. . . not a good statement to be making right now!
Sadly, I agree. No creature comfort will make this nightmare go away for them.

[deputydi]

<snip>BUT Mark Geragos is there. Where the heck has he been??
He's been a talk show pariah since his 15 minutes. I guess he crawled out from under his rock to try for another shot at it. You don't suppose the Anthonys intend to add him to their "dream team" do you? He could then lay claim to having defended the TWO most hated individuals in America.

[Justice Denied?]

I wonder if Casey moved the body to this area after it was searched?

Snoop,

Wasn't Casey in jail during the time the seaches were going on?
someone else could have moved it however. Seems like a credible theory to me.


since LE went rushing to that house so fast, I had to wonder if the didn't think George and Cindy might be involved some way, at least in the coverup.

[javahog]

Sadly, I agree. No creature comfort will make this nightmare go away for them.

The Ritz probably has better security of entry than, say, a Motel 8.

[Gatordog]

They need to be left alone without the media that has been focused on them??!! Give me a big fat break! Cindy is BEGGING for media attention.

Media attention is what she is living for right now. I am sure if they did NOT want media attention they would not be going on LK again. Their attorney really should advise them to shut up finally. They are going to have to face the fact that the Liar is a murderer and they raised a murderer.

I do think in my heart that the Cindy Liar has something to hide as well.


Sorry to sound pithy but I have felt a bit ignored with a few of my questions. Perhaps they were old ones and had already been answered.

I will say that you guys are the best and I have been following everything. Gatordog is a wealth of info with a huge heart. The idea of flowers from the CL folks is beautiful.

Sorry Spider - don't mean to ignore any questions but there has been so much activity on the site, I may have missed them.

[Gatordog]

If it's any comfort, I doubt the Ritz has anything to offer that will truly ease their misery right now. Even with the aid of a sedative. . . they will wake up to this nightmare like no one else.

I do see your point though. . . not a good statement to be making right now!

Saying at the Ritz also shocked me but then maybe that's one of the only hotels where they would get some privacy. I am totally surprised that they would even be able to eat dinner, especially in a restaurant. I'd have eaten in my room if I was hungry.

[javahog]

Snoop,

Wasn't Casey in jail during the time the seaches were going on?
someone else could have moved it however. Seems like a credible theory to me.


since LE went rushing to that house so fast, I had to wonder if the didn't think George and Cindy might be involved some way, at least in the coverup.

After Cindy laundered the (alleged) murderesses smelly pants, I'll bet they wanted to make sure that no other "cleaning" would happen if rumors got out they found, say, a pillowcase. I was kind of amazed that they were in the house at all considering the things they suspected happened there, but I guess there was no "real" reason to keep them out, at least until they found something that changed that.

Caylee had the same sandbox as my 3 year old son:(

[Justice Denied?]

Looks like Detective Allen just threw her off the property
I find Lee's girlfriend going to the house immediately after the body was found very strange. Was thee something they needed to get rid of or what?

[deputydi]

I find Lee's girlfriend going to the house immediately after the body was found very strange. Was thee something they needed to get rid of or what?
Someone said she had been taking care of the pets while the Anthonys were in CA. Her showing up when she did may have been a coincidence.:shrug:

[javahog]

I find Lee's girlfriend going to the house immediately after the body was found very strange. Was thee something they needed to get rid of or what?

I heard (I think on a news report) that she was "staying" there. Maybe housesitting? I wouldn't want to leave that house unguarded since so many are interested in it.

Any word that they took sand out? I've wondered if Caylee was stashed in the sandbox, and if so, wouldn't they find some sand with the body?

[Mac]

Revenge is a dish best served cold. Hopefully someone will remind him of that.

Speaking of LP, he told JV-M that he thinks Casey dumped Caylee "around the corner" after George got too close to the trunk in the garage on the 24th.

Ooh! She's talking about the defense Dream Team (not sure where Baez fits in); wonder who's paying these folks? Is Casey going to be an income tax write-off for fiscal year '09?


Ice cold.

If this is the "Dream Team" for Casey......she better double up on sedatives. With Florida being a law and order state I doubt they can drag this thing out. And the way that OCSO and the FBI are taking their time, no chance of a mistrial IMO

[deputydi]

The Ritz probably has better security of entry than, say, a Motel 8.
I hadn't thought of it that way, but you're right. I still wonder who is footing the bill.

[Justice Denied?]

Guaranteed: All someone has to do is say to Casey "They found your daughter" and Casey would get a morbid 'I'm screwed now' look on her face, as opposed to a happy "GREAT! They found her! She's safe!" reaction.

I'll bet money!
It was reported that Casey had an anxiety attack when she got he news and had to be sedated. I say just a good old panic attack cause she knows she's had it now.

[lorettalockhorn]

They need to be left alone without the media that has been focused on them??!! Give me a big fat break! Cindy is BEGGING for media attention.

Media attention is what she is living for right now. I am sure if they did NOT want media attention they would not be going on LK again. Their attorney really should advise them to shut up finally. They are going to have to face the fact that the Liar is a murderer and they raised a murderer.

I do think in my heart that the Cindy Liar has something to hide as well.


Sorry to sound pithy but I have felt a bit ignored with a few of my questions. Perhaps they were old ones and had already been answered.

I will say that you guys are the best and I have been following everything. Gatordog is a wealth of info with a huge heart. The idea of flowers from the CL folks is beautiful.

Hey Spider! Your self description "pithy" reminded me of one of my GFs who had a terrible lisp growing up. :hat:

Welcome! List your Qs one more time and I'll bet people will help you to find an answer.

[browneyes106]

I'm watching Dateline right now.

[javahog]

Re: the vacuum being taken. I wonder if when the (deleted angry words...) was cleaning up she realized that some attachment or something was uncleanable and she put it in the bag with the body? And the authorities wouldn't have noticed a nozzle or something was missing until they found it in the bag?

I am kind of amazed that LE didn't take all the cleaning equipment the first time around. Wait, I sure hope this doesn't mean they think there was cleanup SINCE they did their search:eek:

[browneyes106]

Earlier on Dateline Jesse said that while Casey was pregnant and believed he was the father he told that the baby should be given up for adoption and Casey said that she wouldn't do it. I think maybe Cindy did something to Casey to make her think she should't give up the baby.

[FDInLaw]

I'm watching Dateline right now.So am I. . . hard to see the pictures of Caylee over and over again. How could someone do this???? :(

Did you catch Casey's conversation with her friend? Gosh, the friend is breaking down over concern for Caylee and Casey's response was a cold "it was a waste of my time to call"!!!!!!!! :cuss: Some choice words come to my mind! :flamemad:

[browneyes106]

So am I. . . hard to see the pictures of Caylee over and over again. How could someone do this???? :(

Did you catch Casey's conversation with her friend? Gosh, the friend is breaking down over concern for Caylee and Casey's response was a cold "it was a waste of my time to call"!!!!!!!! :cuss: Some choice words come to my mind! :flamemad:

I noticed that. I have heard that call before. There are videos of it on youtube. Casey's friend seemed really upset about Caylee and Casey basically bull****s. I think if you search youtube for Casey Anthony jail house call you will find some videos that play the audio of the call.

here's the transcript of the call
http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/2008/7/25/casey_anthony_calls_home_from_jail.html

[javahog]

Another chilling quote just played on GVS, given the shrinks like to say KC always gives a bit of truth in every lie: "She'll always be my baby."

[browneyes106]

Cindy is a moron claiming that her investigators have found that everything Casey has said is true. Cindy that little girl isn't Caylee.

[lorettalockhorn]

Cindy is a moron claiming that her investigators have found that everything Casey has said is true. Cindy that little girl isn't Caylee.

I'm watching and Cindy was just philosophizing on why people lie. :rolleyes:

[lighthousedazy]

O2S, we need you. Dateline, 20/20, and Greta are airing this, and also rerun of NG. I wish I could see all at once but cannot keep up. :(

[browneyes106]

Dateline gaves us a little more info on Casey and Jesse's engagement. Maybe Cindy made Casey call the engagement off.

[lorettalockhorn]

O2S, we need you. Dateline, 20/20, and Greta are airing this, and also rerun of NG. I wish I could see all at once but cannot keep up. :(

Dazy, my DVR didn't pick up 20/20 for some reason. Oh well. Not sure if I want to watch Greta unless she's going to be better prepared than last night.

[lighthousedazy]

I'm watching and Cindy was just philosophizing on why people lie. :rolleyes:I missed that, but how does one philosophy why does Cindy lie? Maybe I shouldn't post this. I feel so sorry for C and G. I don't know what I would do in their shoes. I know one thing, if I thought my daughter killed my grandchild, I would not try to take up for her. Yes, I have dealt with a liar and theif, God bless not a murderer, and I have shown her the error of her ways.
;)

[lorettalockhorn]

I missed that, but how does one philosophy why does Cindy lie? Maybe I shouldn't post this. I feel so sorry for C and G. I don't know what I would do in their shoes. I know one thing, if I thought my daughter killed my grandchild, I would not try to take up for her. Yes, I have dealt with a liar and theif, God bless not a murderer, and I have shown her the error of her ways.
;)

It was rich; Cindy the liar making excuses for Casey the liar. Basically she said that Casey was afraid to tell the whole truth because she was protecting the family from the kidnappers.

Gosh, there are lots of people who sympathize and empathize with G&C for plenty of reasons, some of them personal. Nothing wrong with that at all. Glad your story had a happy ending!

[mu8shark]

Does anyone think it's possible, that Caylee was not in the car very long, but some excrement leaked and that the extraordinary heat of the Florida weather may have made the odor get worse and worse in time? Didn't one of the experts say that hair falls out of the head after death very fast?
I suppose the forensics will determine the time of death but I wondered if the day she tossed the garbage bag, with that precious angel in it, was early rather than later in death. In any event, though I am not an advocate of the Death Penalty, I want to go have lunch and celebrate after Casey gets the pipe.

I'm feeding the evil wolf Loretta. I'll take that wolf to lunch with me. :mad: I think she was in the trunk for at least four to five days maybe a week, dogs would not hit on just excrement with no decomp smell. Cadaver dogs hit on a very specific scent.

[mu8shark]

I'm watching and Cindy was just philosophizing on why people lie. :rolleyes: I totally get the idea Cindy does not think lying is a big deal at all. I mean when Jesse's father called her about Casey stealing money from Jesse Cindy thought he was overreacting. The apple obviously does not far fall from the tree. Who does Cindy think this little girl is. I may have heard wrong but at the end of dateline they said something in the bag tied it to the Anthony home. So, some other little dead child is connected to the Anthony home. By the way the addition of Linda K Baden is not going to save Casey. Now that they have found the body, the defense is going to really have to work hard, no dangling theory maybe she is alive. Also , if they plan on doing the SOD , Some other dude ' did defense, the defense is going to have to come up with something very specific to convince a jury. While I realize that in theory the defense does not have to prove anything, realistically to get her off, they are going to have to show motive, means and opportunity for someone else to have killed Caylee, because it is human nature to want answers and not just, 'Well it isn't Casey, it is someone else, not sure who, so okay acquit her,' No way 12 jurors will buy some vague someone else did it.

[mu8shark]

Snoop,

Wasn't Casey in jail during the time the seaches were going on?
someone else could have moved it however. Seems like a credible theory to me.


since LE went rushing to that house so fast, I had to wonder if the didn't think George and Cindy might be involved some way, at least in the coverup. No I don't think it is their involvement they are looking at , at all. I think they are trying to match trash bags and tape and maybe something else found in that bag, But they would have taken George and Cindy in for questioning if they thought they were involved. No they want to match the trash bags and tape I bet. And just do one more search.

[mu8shark]

Snoop,

Wasn't Casey in jail during the time the seaches were going on?
someone else could have moved it however. Seems like a credible theory to me.


since LE went rushing to that house so fast, I had to wonder if the didn't think George and Cindy might be involved some way, at least in the coverup. Casey was in jail and or monitored by ankle bracelet. The thing is Tim Miller admitted they could not search that area very well at all because of the standing water and then later when it receded a bit chose not to search it because it was roped off and said private property so they researched other areas. Also the water totally receded just a week or so ago according to neighbors. Nothing suspicious in this to me.

[Justice Denied?]

We are watching the same channel......wow....:flamemad:

How could a woman do this

I honestly don't know. When I got the news, I had to go in the other room and cry as my granddaughter and greatgranddaughter were here. I have been sick at my stomach ever since.

Earlier, we had been shopping. When I was putting my GGranddaughter in the car, I said, "my goodness, we bought so much stuff, we almost had to leave you at WalMart". She said, "My mommy wouldn't leave me. She checks on me." I though about the faith of a little child. Kaylee trused her mom like that, too, and look what happened. This has just broken my heart and I never met any of this family.:rose::rose:

[One2Snoop]

Snoop,

Wasn't Casey in jail during the time the seaches were going on?
someone else could have moved it however. Seems like a credible theory to me.


since LE went rushing to that house so fast, I had to wonder if the didn't think George and Cindy might be involved some way, at least in the coverup.

LOL :seeya: Not credible - that thought already got shot down. Casey was in jail.

[lighthousedazy]

I think she was in the trunk for at least four to five days maybe a week, dogs would not hit on just excrement with no decomp smell. Cadaver dogs hit on a very specific scent.Yes, Dr Perper said the body would have to be in the trunk for about a week. I am going to push - Angie Batten, expert cadaver dog trainer - Jesup , GA. " The dogs don't hit on excrement, they don't hit on dead animals, etc. They only hit on human decomposition smells. One day, they will rezalize these dogs are highly trained and mean business. :flamemad:

[lorettalockhorn]

I totally get the idea Cindy does not think lying is a big deal at all. I mean when Jesse's father called her about Casey stealing money from Jesse Cindy thought he was overreacting. The apple obviously does not far fall from the tree. Who does Cindy think this little girl is. I may have heard wrong but at the end of dateline they said something in the bag tied it to the Anthony home. So, some other little dead child is connected to the Anthony home. By the way the addition of Linda K Baden is not going to save Casey. Now that they have found the body, the defense is going to really have to work hard, no dangling theory maybe she is alive. Also , if they plan on doing the SOD , Some other dude ' did defense, the defense is going to have to come up with something very specific to convince a jury. While I realize that in theory the defense does not have to prove anything, realistically to get her off, they are going to have to show motive, means and opportunity for someone else to have killed Caylee, because it is human nature to want answers and not just, 'Well it isn't Casey, it is someone else, not sure who, so okay acquit her,' No way 12 jurors will buy some vague someone else did it.

Hell no, Cindy doesn't think lying is a big deal. That's why she's so comfortable doing it herself. I just hope it earns her an indictment at some point.

Jennifer D'Onofrio said on LKL tonight that there was an article of clothing in the bag that ties the remains to the Anthony home and/or Caylee. It's going to be ding nigh impossible even for Cindy to put a spin on that and claim that the remains are another child's.

Totally agree with you that the defense is going to have to present a reasonable alternate theory.

I'm curious about the pesticide tanks (I think that's how they were described) that were seized last night by LE, and wonder if those are the type that you use to mix your own chemicals to spray your yard and garden with herbicide, maybe that's what was used to mix the chloroform in.

[mu8shark]

I agree with that scenario Gator. It seems it was a rush job. But Amscot from what I understand is pretty far for her to be walking with that body that day, I think she dumped it the day she ran out of gas the first time like on the 23rd when she was found walking by Tony exactly on that street corner where the body was found. He found her walking on chicksaw, it is either the date of the 20th or the 23rd. And she ask him to go to her parents so she could get the gas cans. Then she insisted he not put the gas in her car , she wanted to do it and wanted him to move along pretty fast from what I understand. I think she did not want him to smell that smell. But I think she hid the body right before she called him to pick her up. Can you imagine her panic? She has run out of gas and he has to come pick her up and she hides that body very quickly only 20 feet from the road, far enough so no one will see it but so she does not get her shoes and stuff all screwed up. I think she had gotten rid of it before Amscot, I do

[mu8shark]

Yes, Dr Perper said the body would have to be in the trunk for about a week. I am going to push - Angie Batten, expert cadaver dog trainer - Jesup , GA. " The dogs don't hit on excrement, they don't hit on dead animals, etc. They only hit on human decomposition smells. One day, they will rezalize these dogs are highly trained and mean business. :flamemad: Dogs noses are remarkable and sophisticated. In the Peterson trial I wrote a cadaver dog expert who specifically told me cadaver dogs do not hit on just blood, just excrement, spit or anything else. That is why when Cindy spun the well George may have had a bloody nose in the backyard story on Greta, I laughed. I had already ask that.

[One2Snoop]

Okay, gotcha! Now tell me why one of the talking heads on Larry King was shaking her head, "no, no, no" when the subject of the body being under water came up. Apparently she disagreed with Tim on that. She claimed it was dry weather at the time and the body was not under water at any time.
I'm getting tired of all the contradictions. They found a skull, no no, they found the whole body. They found clothes outside the garbage bag, no, no inside the bag. etc, etc, etc, and on and on.. Now there was water, no, no, no water. It's bad enough that we mess up but now the talking heads are messing up. Was there water, or not?

:confused:

Tim Miller had to suspend search from this area because of 3 feet of water. The skull was definitely found - the rest hasn't been verified that I'm aware of .

[mu8shark]

[QUOTE=mu8shark;9145060]I think she was in the trunk for at least four to five days maybe a week, dogs would not hit on just excrement with no decomp smell. Cadaver dogs hit on a very specific scent.[/QUOT

Okay, gotcha! Now tell me why one of the talking heads on Larry King was shaking her head, "no, no, no" when the subject of the body being under water came up. Apparently she disagreed with Tim on that. She claimed it was dry weather at the time and the body was not under water at any time.
I'm getting tired of all the contradictions. They found a skull, no no, they found the whole body. They found clothes outside the garbage bag, no, no inside the bag. etc, etc, etc, and on and on.. Now there was water, no, no, no water. It's bad enough that we mess up but now the talking heads are messing up. Was there water, or not?

:confused: Okay I have not watched LKL yet , going to now, but Tim Miller was there, unless this talking head was there during the search it is just an expert trying to talk out his butt if you will. Tim Miller was there, it was under water, at the time, he went on NG and said one of the major areas they were interested in was under water He is on tape talking about it being underwater. . He confirmed it was that exact area yesterday. I am sure they have grids that confirm this. She can shake her head all she wants but unless she was there she is just trying to defend Casey. Also the neighbors in that neighborhood who live there said until about a week ago, there was still standing water. So who should we believe some talking head who probably was not there or Tim Miller and those who live there?

[One2Snoop]

Minute-To-Minute Update Friday, Dec. 12
10:00 p.m.:

A group of people put up a memorial to Caylee in front of the Anthony home, made of a white cross covered by a T-shirt with Caylee's picture and the letters R.I.P.

http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Local/2008/12/12/minutetominute_update_in_remains_discovery_12_11.h tml

[mu8shark]

OK...before anyone hammers me on this...lets look at what they took out of the home.

3 different upright Vaccuums

1 Lowe's brand shop vac

1 small shampooer

1 handheld vac

2 of the vaccuums are brand new. Along with the the Shop vac. It is also a new model, which is a Lowes brand 12.5 HP

Follow this reasoning. Assuming when they found the body, they also found some fibers, etc. Something made the OCSO believe that the baby died at the home, or else they would have let the Anthony's come home. They staged a midnight raid on the home, kicked out Lee's girlfriend, and tore the place apart.

Now take a look at the stuff they took...alll cleaning items, most of them brand new. When was the last time you bought 2 new vaccuums and a new shop vac within the same year, especially if you are poorer then most. A vaccuum is the last thing on your mind, food and electric bills, not a vaccuum, let alone 3 of them. All of the vaccuums still had the manufacturers labels on them too, so they where new. The Bissel and the Shop vac are new...I checked.

Everything in my head, leads me to believe that someone cleaned up a crime scene....and that person might be Cindy. We know she cleaned out the car that smelled bad.

I feel it in my heart folks......Cindy is covering up the fact that she knew about the murder...Just my opinion of course.

Help me out here folks....and tell me I am wrong

See y'all this afternoonI don't think so it could be something as simple as trying to match fibers found in that bag to fibers in a vacumm. Also if someone did clean up, remember Cindy works and George works, how can they prove Cindy cleaned up the car and not Casey?. Casey could have come home at any time and used the vacumm. How will they prove CIndy did the cleaning up and Casey did not? I think it is a leap that Cindy actually knew as opposed to she knew in her heart , remember Casey lived there so for them to be looking for more evidence there is not unusual. It is not impossible they are looking at the GP's but I doubt it.

[mu8shark]

I am still a bit stunned that Baden's wife was announced to be on board with the defense. Surely she does not need publicity.

Would a child this young have been to a dentist yet?

Also, as stated above LE removed containers of pesticide. It was shown that a computer search showed household weapons right? I have not been home but I am familiar with Linda K Baden. Probably the defense contacted her to look at the results of the autopsy and any forensic tests. A child this young may or may not have been to a dentist. Some people take their kids early to get them to practice good hygeine, but that is hard to answer .As for Linda K Baden wanting publicity, maybe , maybe not. Sorry to be so vague.

[lorettalockhorn]

I can' help but feel pity for the Anthony's. Getting into the limelight did not serve them well, though I kind of understand what they were trying to do. I myself would not have gone public. I would have let the police do it. At the same time, they have destroyed themselves on international TV. THey are in hell right now and most likely in danger of being harmed even more. There are a lot of nuts out there who want to attack them. There is a lynch mob mentality hovering over them. They are going to need protection. No one should show their underbellies in public. Poor them. Poor Caylee.

I believe, and always believed this all happened because of the relationship between Casey and Cindy. She controlled nothing when Casey told her she wanted to give Caylee up for adoption to her friend who could not have children. She is the victim of her own micro managing of her daughter. We cannot control anyone else's journey.

Daughter or not, she was old enough to make her own decisions. When we support our adult kids we become responsible. Aye, "No free lunch kid." When an adult kid wants us to pay their way, they have to take the crap that goes with it and that includes us minding their business. Privacy is very, very expensive!

I've said those things to one of my kids who came home after he got divorced. One day he told me to mind my business and I told him to get a night job because he was living under my roof. I was a mother of 4 at age 26. My father told me to sleep in the bed I made at age 18. Grow up Casey! If you want Mommy to pay your way, prepare to get told what to do. It makes sense to me!

She hated her controlling mother killed the thing Cindy loved most in the world. What better revenge? At the same time, I say hang her high. One talking head Mark G said he thinks the death penalty is a problem, and it makes more problems. He as a lawyer thinks it should stay off the table and she should get life. Anyone here who thinks we should support Casey to the tune of 40K a year, raise your hand. :no:

Gag me. I'm feeding Loretta's evil wolf.

My evil wolf? LOL I don't think you're giving in to evil at all. You sound practical and pragmatic and responsible. Kids get to a certain age and don't straighten up and fly right; you break their plates. Period.

[mu8shark]

Yeah, mu8shark, I tend to lurk more than post, partly because everyone is already saying what I'm thinking! haha I read this forum pretty much every day to keep up with this story since I don't have cable/satellite. Anyway, as I was going through the last couple days posts, I remembered the whole Chicasaw Drive thing between Casey and Tony. Just struck a nerve. Could be verrrrrrrry interesting. How coincidental is that that the first time she ran out of gas it was on or around Chicasaw Drive and this is where the remains are found? I think she panicked big time and thus went only 20 feet into the wooded area.. And I think she abandoned the car the final time because I think we will find out she spent a few more days just trying to get rid of that scent and thought , Screw it, I can't get rid of that smell. Now I am ditching the car

[mu8shark]

I don't know about any of you but I thought Greta was extremely rude to Leonard Padilla last night. I wondered why she even bothered to have him on at all? She kept telling him she was confused as to why he wanted to go back to Orlando now that Caylee was found. She then went on to ask him if he knew the family and again asked why he was going back to Orlando. She kept saying, I just don't get it. :confused: Bizarre.

Sheesh Greta, :rolleyes: I believe LP wants closure like everyone else, which is why he's going back to Orlando.I agree she was rude esp since she has been completely out of the loop for quite a while being the political horndog. Her coverage has been a huge disappointment on this story. It is like she knew nothing about the dynamics of the relationships and the searches, out of the loop, kind of pathetic and I like Greta.

[mu8shark]

But I can't really imagine Casey taking Caylee back home that day and killing her there. Can you?

I really think the evidence will point to Casey's car being the actual scene of the crime. I think neighbors saw her back into the garage on two different occasions. Maybe she was trying to clean out the trunk then.

I have no idea about the pesticides tanks though. That has me really confused.I never even considered that before that Casey could have pulled the car into the garage to do clean up, probably even so she could plug stuff in. I mean maybe she was trying to get rid of evidence, a mess, a smell , all of those things and pulled the car into the garage , also pulled it in to move Caylees body back and forth between yard and trunk, because I think it was back there for a short time, I do.

[mu8shark]

From the videos I have seen that have been taken inside that house - it is a very clean house. They even have white furniture. I have read in the evidence documents that George is a clean freak. I believe he said it himself and the Liar states that her father is always cleaning out the cars and keeping them in excellent condition. George is the one who is home in the morning because he worked afternoon shift. Cindy was at work the morning of the 16th. George states he saw Caley and the Liar at 12:50 pm leave the house to go to the sitter's and work (haha). It wouldn't surprise me if George cleaned the house unwittingly. Perhaps he thought the Liar spilled something on the rug and didn't want Cindy to find out. If it looks as if she was killed some time around 1:30 a.m. on the 16th, why would George say he saw them at 1:00 p.m.? He seems to be the only one who does tell the truth. I don't think she was killed around 1:30 in the morning, rather sometime between 1:00 pm when George last saw them and when that flurry of phone calls start a 3 pm on the 16th. I think George genuinely saw them then and for some reason probably the reason Gator says she is calling like mad to find Mom and Dad. If she buried that body in the backyard for a time, Gator is right she wants to make sure Mom and Dad are not home. So she makes a flurry of constant calls to make sure. That call pattern that starts at 3pm is too bizarre to be unconnected

[One2Snoop]

Her disconnect though - I can't get that out of my head. How the hell does someone kill their child in the afternoon and later that evening is seen on video in the video store renting movies with her boyfriend?

[One2Snoop]

I never even considered that before that Casey could have pulled the car into the garage to do clean up, probably even so she could plug stuff in. I mean maybe she was trying to get rid of evidence, a mess, a smell , all of those things and pulled the car into the garage , also pulled it in to move Caylees body back and forth between yard and trunk, because I think it was back there for a short time, I do.

Pulled her car into the garage to use the shop vac and maybe sprayed her car with some of the bug spray to try to rid it of the smell? I sure hope LE releases the details like soon LOL.

[mu8shark]

WFTV and WKMG both reporting that soft tissue was remaining on the body. Also reporting that duct tape was still attached to the mouth and it's waterproof so it would protect anything underneath it. They said it is possible that the child's death was horrific and agonizing. A pillow was taken as evidence. Perhaps she smothered the child. :rose:Oh man that is so, so brutal , why would she put tape on her childs mouth, it can't be good. In no accident do you tape your childs mouth. I think they should consider the death penalty again if circumstances warrant it.

[One2Snoop]

I agree she was rude esp since she has been completely out of the loop for quite a while being the political horndog. Her coverage has been a huge disappointment on this story. It is like she knew nothing about the dynamics of the relationships and the searches, out of the loop, kind of pathetic and I like Greta.


Thats it - and when LP started talking about the Grunds she didn't even know who they were. I'm sure LP meant prayer vigil instead of memorial service - you know how he gets those two words mixed up. ;)

[One2Snoop]

My evil wolf? LOL I don't think you're giving in to evil at all. You sound practical and pragmatic and responsible. Kids get to a certain age and don't straighten up and fly right; you break their plates. Period.

:eek: You have an evil wolf? :chicken: :chicken:

[One2Snoop]

CNN LARRY KING LIVE

The Latest on the Caylee Anthony Case; Illinois Governor Pressured to Step Down; Auto Industry Bailout
Aired December 12, 2008 - 21:00 ET

Good evening.

Caylee Anthony's grandparents, Cindy and George, who were here on Wednesday, were supposed to be our guests tonight. And we were told yesterday they would join us to share their reactions to that discovery of a child's remains near their home in Florida.

But circumstances have changed and now they're being advised not to appear on our show at this time.

snip
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0812/12/lkl.01.html

[Justice Denied?]

I dont' know if this has been mentioned before, but I get the feeling that the woods is a "dumpsite", and that perhaps Casey's parents played a bigger role that originally thought.
Just a thought.

You know I had that same thought when I heard that Lee's girlfriend went rushing to the house as soon as the body was foundand the LE was rushing to get a search warrant for the house. Wouldn't it be something if the whole bunch went to jail?:D

[mu8shark]

He said he wanted to go back and visit the Grunds, NeJame and to pay his respects to Caylee. Greta kept saying she didn't understand why? : How much clearer could he make it? :shrug:

I agree he's arrogant - but he was the only one who continued to look for Caylee - he deserves at least that much credit. JMOI agree and I also think he is somewhat shell shocked too. I do. Why was that answer not good enough for Greta? A few of her panel don't like him and it has rubbed off on her. Is it true Greta is a scientologist? Just asking.

[One2Snoop]

I agree and I also think he is somewhat shell shocked too. I do. Why was that answer not good enough for Greta? A few of her panel don't like him and it has rubbed off on her. Is it true Greta is a scientologist? Just asking.

I almost got the impression Greta was trying to act like NG - she certainly can't pull it off like NG can - she just doesn't have it in her LOL.
:shrug: I don't know but I bet a quick search on the net will reveal the answer.

[One2Snoop]

Dateline NBC aired Dec. 12, 2008

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/28117697#28117697

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3032600

[One2Snoop]

I agree and I also think he is somewhat shell shocked too. I do. Why was that answer not good enough for Greta? A few of her panel don't like him and it has rubbed off on her. Is it true Greta is a scientologist? Just asking.

More Celebrity Scientologists
Greta Van Susteren on Scientology

But what kind of religious mission motivates Van Susteren? St. Petersburg Times reporter Mary Jacoby discovered that Van Susteren belongs to Scientology, "a religion that teaches of Xenu, evil head of the Galactic Confederation" who "flew people to Teegeeack (Earth) 75-million years ago in space ships, chained them to volcanos and blew them up with hydrogen bombs, releasing exploded 'thetas'T that are now the source of most human suffering."

http://www.scientology-kills.org/celebrities/vansusteren.htm

[mu8shark]

Even so, Gator, those bones, hair and whatever else they found is all that's left of that beautiful little girl. IMO, those remains shouldn't be used as a means to get even with anyone. I think you are all misunderstanding the revenge part of it. I think he came back to FLorida to do the search to see that Casey got her due, which I don't blame him for. I think he wanted her prosecuted once he figured out she was guilty. The reason he came back to Orlando this time was to go to a memorial or prayer service some others are planning to have, I was the one who originally suggested part of what was motivating him was because he is a guy who hates to get burned and Casey definitely burned him. Once she threw him out of the house and told him not to talk to her like LE, he vowed to help find the little girl to see that she got justice. But the getting even has nothing to do with the remains now. Leonard never mentioned it that way. just my opinion.

[mu8shark]

More Celebrity Scientologists
Greta Van Susteren on Scientology

But what kind of religious mission motivates Van Susteren? St. Petersburg Times reporter Mary Jacoby discovered that Van Susteren belongs to Scientology, "a religion that teaches of Xenu, evil head of the Galactic Confederation" who "flew people to Teegeeack (Earth) 75-million years ago in space ships, chained them to volcanos and blew them up with hydrogen bombs, releasing exploded 'thetas'T that are now the source of most human suffering."

http://www.scientology-kills.org/celebrities/vansusteren.htm
I hope this response does not offend anyone but OH BROTHER!

[One2Snoop]

More Celebrity Scientologists
Greta Van Susteren on Scientology

But what kind of religious mission motivates Van Susteren? St. Petersburg Times reporter Mary Jacoby discovered that Van Susteren belongs to Scientology, "a religion that teaches of Xenu, evil head of the Galactic Confederation" who "flew people to Teegeeack (Earth) 75-million years ago in space ships, chained them to volcanos and blew them up with hydrogen bombs, releasing exploded 'thetas'T that are now the source of most human suffering."

http://www.scientology-kills.org/celebrities/vansusteren.htm

http://i37.tinypic.com/2wc4cqc.jpg

[One2Snoop]

i hope this response does not offend anyone but oh brother!


lol....

[Justice Denied?]

No clothes were found with the remains, Beary said, Now that this has been confirmed it certainly makes Caseys statement that they have not even found the clothes yet really, really chilling.

I just cannot wrap my mind aroud the idea of a mother stripping a child's body naked, putting it in a garbage bag and throwing it in the woods. It makes me ill. I'm going to bed.

[samanthajane13]

"The thing is Tim Miller admitted they could not search that area very well at all because of the standing water and then later when it receded a bit chose not to search it because it was roped off and said private property so they researched other areas."

Okay-that being said-WHO owns the land, and what happened to the rope and sign???

If the water department guy was able to go back there and take a leak, the rope and sign must be gone now, right???

It sounds to me like MAYBE somebody deliberately put the sign there to keep the searchers out-after Tim said he would be searching it after the water receded, then took it down when TES finally gave up and left!!

[One2Snoop]

I just cannot wrap my mind aroud the idea of a mother stripping a child's body naked, putting it in a garbage bag and throwing it in the woods. It makes me ill. I'm going to bed.

Me neither.

G'nite Justice - I'm heading that way soon. :seeya:

[mu8shark]

Please don't hate me for saying this. No offense to anyone here. I don't believe in baptizing infants. I don't feel like children have any sins and I don't believe in reincarnation. We do dedication ceremonies where we as the parents pledge to raise our children in accordance to the bible. When the children are old enough to choose if they want to be a part of the Chrisitan faith than they can get baptized. I don't feel the least bit bad about Caylee not being baptized (if she wasn't). I know that sweet little angel is in heavan. I feel at peace with that. I should also say we are members of a non denominational church. Not to get too far into religious beliefs but I totally agree with your entire post and I don't think if she was not baptised it means she did not go to heaven . I don't think any of us really knows if that is God's rule or not.

[lorettalockhorn]

:eek: You have an evil wolf? :chicken: :chicken:

But of course. And so do you! Don't deny it!! You know you do!!!

http://i37.tinypic.com/2wc4cqc.jpg

LMAO Wouldn't you know that their leader would be a black cat?

[mu8shark]

Well I am finally caught up on tv shows and posts. I am shocked they are trying to build a case against the grandparents. No way were they involved in killing the child and I think Casey did the dumping of the body. So I will be curious to see if it is something as simple as that email and the brush or something more . I also do not find the dream team so intimidating. I predict half of them won't even be around at the finish line. I bet Baez will try to convince Casey to plea, not saying she will but man she is in deep, deep trouble. I can't see many of those experts staking their reps , book deal or not on saying oh the smell in the trunk, the cadaver dogs, the hairs being the same hairs being found in the bag(which has not been proven but will be) all a coincidence, not related. Just because they are talking to these experts does not mean they are all prepared to testify now that she has nothing to do with it. On top of that if they find any of Caseys fingerprints on that tape, it is over. Even if they found one juror who was a dumb ass , pardon my french, that juror could hang the jury but not cause a complete acquittal,. let's be realistic and finally it makes me sick to think of that interview where Casey says Caylee called her and said Hi Mommy! She is evil, evil, evil . Nite all and hope my many, many posts does not drive you all crazy but just so much interesting and thought provoking stuff!

[lorettalockhorn]

Not to get too far into religious beliefs but I totally agree with your entire post and I don't think if she was not baptised it means she did not go to heaven . I don't think any of us really knows if that is God's rule or not.

I never meant to imply that Caylee would not go to heaven if she wasn't baptized; grace is what gives us salvation, not baptism. I'm Presbyterian and like most religions that cling to church history, we do believe in infant baptism; the purpose of which is to differentiate the children of believers from those of non-believers. At the time of baptism, the congregation promises to bring the child up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. I've sworn that covenant dozens, maybe hundreds of times, and it bothers me that Caylee may never have reached that milestone in her short life.

[applesandorange]

I never meant to imply that Caylee would not go to heaven if she wasn't baptized; grace is what gives us salvation, not baptism. I'm Presbyterian and like most religions that cling to church history, we do believe in infant baptism; the purpose of which is to differentiate the children of believers from those of non-believers. At the time of baptism, the congregation promises to bring the child up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. I've sworn that covenant dozens, maybe hundreds of times, and it bothers me that Caylee may never have reached that milestone in her short life.


I didn't think you meant it that way. I was just stating in my post that it doesn't bother me that she wasn't baptized because she is still in heavan. I think what you are saying is that it bothers you that Caylee may never have had the chance to know the Lord Jesus before she passed. She never experienced religion and had a community of people looking out for her like that. I know you Loretta and you will correct me if I'm wrong lol. I'm not trying to put words in your mouth. Thinking about it in that sense bothers me too. The simple fact that she may never have known who Jesus was before meeting him face to face. Now that makes me sad.

[One2Snoop]

But of course. And so do you! Don't deny it!! You know you do!!!



Ok, you're right, I do - just look at her! She's possessed, I tell ya! :biggrin: :tongue:

http://i38.tinypic.com/2m7zqqs.jpg

[samanthajane13]

"The simple fact that she may never have known who Jesus was before meeting him face to face. Now that makes me sad."

That saddens me, too, but she's in His arms now-safe and sound!

[One2Snoop]

I didn't think you meant it that way. I was just stating in my post that it doesn't bother me that she wasn't baptized because she is still in heavan. I think what you are saying is that it bothers you that Caylee may never have had the chance to know the Lord Jesus before she passed. She never experienced religion and had a community of people looking out for her like that. I know you Loretta and you will correct me if I'm wrong lol. I'm not trying to put words in your mouth. Thinking about it in that sense bothers me too. The simple fact that she may never have known who Jesus was before meeting him face to face. Now that makes me sad.

ITA apples. :rose:

[One2Snoop]

On a serious note - don't forget to light a candle for Caylee tonight.

http://www.gratefulness.org/candles/candles.cfm?l=eng&gi=cayle

[lorettalockhorn]

I didn't think you meant it that way. I was just stating in my post that it doesn't bother me that she wasn't baptized because she is still in heavan. I think what you are saying is that it bothers you that Caylee may never have had the chance to know the Lord Jesus before she passed. She never experienced religion and had a community of people looking out for her like that. I know you Loretta and you will correct me if I'm wrong lol. I'm not trying to put words in your mouth. Thinking about it in that sense bothers me too. The simple fact that she may never have known who Jesus was before meeting him face to face. Now that makes me sad.

Infant baptism is something that goes to the very core of my beliefs. I probably shouldn't be insinuating those beliefs on the Anthonys, should I? And I need to get off this maudlin jag. Chocolate will help!

SamanthaJane, you really do have to wonder why those ropes and signs are now removed from the site. Maybe it's because the floodwaters have receded. I read somewhere that that area is to undergo development.

Justice, it's hard to imagine why Caylee would be put into the bag nude, but the clothes weren't destroyed.

[lorettalockhorn]

Ok, you're right, I do - just look at her! She's possessed, I tell ya! :biggrin: :tongue:

http://i38.tinypic.com/2m7zqqs.jpg

Aww Is that a marshmallow next to her left paw? All my wolves are felines!

Thanks for the candles link.

[One2Snoop]

Aww Is that a marshmallow next to her left paw? All my wolves are felines!

Thanks for the candles link.

Thats her chew bone - I have a male feline - he's wicked when he wants attention in the middle of the night LOL, but for the most part they're both good companions, alarm systems, and sleep buddies LOL although my husband would say otherwise.

[samanthajane13]

"SamanthaJane, you really do have to wonder why those ropes and signs are now removed from the site. Maybe it's because the floodwaters have receded. I read somewhere that that area is to undergo development."

It just seems VERY suspicious to me that nobody mentioned the sign being there t the initial searches, but when Tim said there was too much water, and left, there's a sign and cordon when they go back to continue the search.

They called off the search soon after.

It sounds to me that someone didn't want the searchers snooping around.

Then the sign is gone again when the water department guy takes leak.

Just TOO CREEPY for me.

[One2Snoop]

"SamanthaJane, you really do have to wonder why those ropes and signs are now removed from the site. Maybe it's because the floodwaters have receded. I read somewhere that that area is to undergo development."

It just seems VERY suspicious to me that nobody mentioned the sign being there t the initial searches, but when Tim said there was too much water, and left, there's a sign and cordon when they go back to continue the search.

They called off the search soon after.

It sounds to me that someone didn't want the searchers snooping around.

Then the sign is gone again when the water department guy takes leak.

Just TOO CREEPY for me.

It definitly raises some flags. I hope Gator can explain further regarding that situation tomorrow.

[samanthajane13]

Just for the heck of it, I posted the same questions on David Lohr's blog.

Hopefully, we can get to the bottom of this.

[One2Snoop]

They need to be left alone without the media that has been focused on them??!! Give me a big fat break! Cindy is BEGGING for media attention.

Media attention is what she is living for right now. I am sure if they did NOT want media attention they would not be going on LK again. Their attorney really should advise them to shut up finally. They are going to have to face the fact that the Liar is a murderer and they raised a murderer.

I do think in my heart that the Cindy Liar has something to hide as well.


Sorry to sound pithy but I have felt a bit ignored with a few of my questions. Perhaps they were old ones and had already been answered.

I will say that you guys are the best and I have been following everything. Gatordog is a wealth of info with a huge heart. The idea of flowers from the CL folks is beautiful.

Hey spider I apologize - I don't think anyone's purposely ignoring you here and as the others said - the news has been fast and furious and so have the questions/posts. I know I can post 5,6,7 times in a row and no one responds to me - :eek: I keep thinking I need breath mints or something LOL - whatever you do, don't give up on us.

I agree with you that Cindy was seeking media attention for " A LIVE CAYLEE", but now that she knows differently and all her efforts to lie and cover for Casey have crumbled around her - what do you think we can expect once the dna/forensics are verified that its definitly Caylee?

As a parent who has girls in about the same age range as Casey- I'm not sure how I would react although I was discussing this case with my 18 year old today and told her, I can't imagine faking with you all these months if I knew forensics said your daughter was dead. I've been discussing this case with both my daughters since the beginning and her response was...
She started crying and said - its so bizarre mom - how can she do that to her own daughter? Gawd I have to say I was relieved she started crying ( for my own selfish reasons) but she's right - how can a mother do this to her daughter?

You know, this isn't the first nor the last time we'll ever face this question - it happens every day of our waking lives -

SO this is a question for all of you - What makes this situation different from all the others you've read about in the news?

My answer - the unbelievable lies Casey told from day one - She almost mirrored Scott Peterson, although Casey lived in "Universal World" and "not Paris".

In a fantansy world is there any difference? :confused:

[applesandorange]

Hey spider I apologize - I don't think anyone's purposely ignoring you here and as the others said - the news has been fast and furious and so have the questions/posts. I know I can post 5,6,7 times in a row and no one responds to me - :eek: I keep thinking I need breath mints or something LOL - whatever you do, don't give up on us.

I agree with you that Cindy was seeking media attention for " A LIVE CAYLEE", but now that she knows differently and all her efforts to lie and cover for Casey have crumbled around her - what do you think we can expect once the dna/forensics are verified that its definitly Caylee?

As a parent who has girls in about the same age range as Casey- I'm not sure how I would react although I was discussing this case with my 18 year old today and told her, I can't imagine faking with you all these months if I knew forensics said your daughter was dead. I've been discussing this case with both my daughters since the beginning and her response was...
She started crying and said - its so bizarre mom - how can she do that to her own daughter? Gawd I have to say I was relieved she started crying ( for my own selfish reasons) but she's right - how can a mother do this to her daughter?

You know, this isn't the first nor the last time we'll ever face this question - it happens every day of our waking lives -

SO this is a question for all of you - What makes this situation different from all the others you've read about in the news?

My answer - the unbelievable lies Casey told from day one - She almost mirrored Scott Peterson, although Casey lived in "Universal World" and "not Paris".

In a fantansy world is there any difference? :confused:


I can't sleep. I keep thinking and I thought maybe if I type it out it will get out of my head. My husband and I took our 3 kids to see Santa this evening. We were in line behind a family who had a little girl. The women was holding the little girl. She was about the size of an 8 month old child so when she put her down and the little girl walked up to my 4 year old and stared him in the face I was shocked. I commented to the lady how little the child was to be walking. She said "yes she's small but she's 2 and a half" She told me the little girl was only 3 ponds when born and had heart surgery and numerous medical problems. She told me how her and her husband weren't supposed to be able to have children and then they got pregnant with her and ultrasounds showed problems and they had to go through amnios etc etc.. Anyway I thought of poor Caylee. Here was the beautiful, perfect little girl and her mother couldn't see her for the miracle she was. She took her out of this world so nobody will ever know what Caylee could have been. Here's this women at the mall with this baby who she wasn't supposed to have, who is sick, and you could tell this woman cherishes this little girl. WHY do people so undeserving like Casey have these perfect children and people like this woman have to go through heart ache that her child is sick? It's not fair. I looked at my 3 kids and was just so thankful that each of them is healthy. I could not imagine a second without them.

To answer your question... I think this is why this has gotten to me so bad. Because I am a mother who could never imagine anything happening to one of my babies. Because I see other people who can't have children who desperately want a child and to know that Casey had one and killed her. Becase Casey was so callous and uncaring from the begining. Because of all the lies she has told. Because I can't understand anything about this case. I think that's why...because I can't understand it so it makes me think.

I think it's great that your daughter showed such emotion to you when you talked to her. It shows she is a caring person. I bet she will be a great mom someday when she has children. It's moments like those when you as a parent can take a sigh of relief and realize you've done something right.

I'm going to try to sleep again. I have a wrestling tournament for my son in the morning.

[One2Snoop]

I can't sleep. I keep thinking and I thought maybe if I type it out it will get out of my head. My husband and I took our 3 kids to see Santa this evening. We were in line behind a family who had a little girl. The women was holding the little girl. She was about the size of an 8 month old child so when she put her down and the little girl walked up to my 4 year old and stared him in the face I was shocked. I commented to the lady how little the child was to be walking. She said "yes she's small but she's 2 and a half" She told me the little girl was only 3 ponds when born and had heart surgery and numerous medical problems. She told me how her and her husband weren't supposed to be able to have children and then they got pregnant with her and ultrasounds showed problems and they had to go through amnios etc etc.. Anyway I thought of poor Caylee. Here was the beautiful, perfect little girl and her mother couldn't see her for the miracle she was. She took her out of this world so nobody will ever know what Caylee could have been. Here's this women at the mall with this baby who she wasn't supposed to have, who is sick, and you could tell this woman cherishes this little girl. WHY do people so undeserving like Casey have these perfect children and people like this woman have to go through heart ache that her child is sick? It's not fair. I looked at my 3 kids and was just so thankful that each of them is healthy. I could not imagine a second without them.

To answer your question... I think this is why this has gotten to me so bad. Because I am a mother who could never imagine anything happening to one of my babies. Because I see other people who can't have children who desperately want a child and to know that Casey had one and killed her. Becase Casey was so callous and uncaring from the begining. Because of all the lies she has told. Because I can't understand anything about this case. I think that's why...because I can't understand it so it makes me think.

I think it's great that your daughter showed such emotion to you when you talked to her. It shows she is a caring person. I bet she will be a great mom someday when she has children. It's moments like those when you as a parent can take a sigh of relief and realize you've done something right.

I'm going to try to sleep again. I have a wrestling tournament for my son in the morning.

I'm not sure I'm in a "sigh of relief zone just yet" - when they are teens they tell you one thing and it means another or doesn't mean anything at all. I don't mean to downplay my conversation with my daughter but its just another - all talk but is there really any meaning to this situation?

Don't get me wrong - I have great communication with one daughter and the other is all secrets - she's the one I'm concerned about and I keep wondering if she'd ever turn out like a Casey? I hate to say and admit it - but her personality scares the chit out of me at times.... and I keeping thinking, this child came from me? :eek:

We've (husband and I) have had to come to some resolve - we've done the best we can do - we haven't given up yet, (nor could I ever imagine doing that to my child) but we've come to a point in time where we have to ask does our eldest want to remain child or adult?

I don't think I need to spell it out for anyone here - its not easy - I know. I came from a family of 7 kids and I tell my mom to this day she's a saint for taking 7 kids on, plus foster kids, plus foreign exchange students from Nigeria ( I can only tell horrific situations about most of the foster kids we had, so won't go there) thus I still believe to this day my mom was a saint at least in my eyes.
I still ask my mom to this day how she handled things and she would always grin and say - we're in gods hands - he takes care of us. I never knew what my mom meant by that until I became a parent. How true.... ok off my soapbox.... this is about Caylee.

I can't even imagine being in George or Cindy's shoes - granted Cindy hasn't handled this well media wise - who am I to say I'd react any differently? I can't - so I can't place blame - I can only continue to pray for this family as I've done since the day Caylee disappeared - God bless all involved.

Night all! :seeya:

[Mac]

I understand your point. But we know that Cindy cleaned and washed pants and other articles of clothing from the car. We also know that cindy has been in the front of the media yelling "Caylee is not dead!".

I think the Larry King show was a last desperate attempt to try to taint the jury pool. When Cindy said that " my investigators have found evidence that everything Casey has said is true", we all hit the ceiling.

Padilla even said, casey was a prissy little princess that won't get her hands dirty. George made this monster. During the jail-house talks....all he calls her is princesss, gorgeous, etc. He was scared of discipline.....Cindy was in the wings ready to pounce on him. That tells me that George might be involved with a cover-up.

Now we go to the Media circus of all the sightings of Caylee. I think this was done to try to turn the publics image of casey. and I think it was orchestrated by Cindy.

Just my opinion, but i think that Obstruction charges for both of them are coming...and coming real soon

http://www.wftv.com/news/18267413/detail.html

[Mac]

I just cannot wrap my mind aroud the idea of a mother stripping a child's body naked, putting it in a garbage bag and throwing it in the woods. It makes me ill. I'm going to bed.


remember when Padilla came forward and said that Casey told the woman staying inside the home with Casey, said that casey said " They havent even found her clothing yet"

Man o man.....this tells me she knew the baby was naked, and the clothes are somewhere else

jmo

[deputydi]

Tim Miller had to suspend search from this area because of 3 feet of water. The skull was definitely found - the rest hasn't been verified that I'm aware of .
You're right, Snoop. I think it was Hurricane Fay that had just gone through eastern FL and that area was still flooded.

[deputydi]

I can' help but feel pity for the Anthony's. Getting into the limelight did not serve them well, though I kind of understand what they were trying to do. I myself would not have gone public. I would have let the police do it. At the same time, they have destroyed themselves on international TV. THey are in hell right now and most likely in danger of being harmed even more. There are a lot of nuts out there who want to attack them. There is a lynch mob mentality hovering over them. They are going to need protection. No one should show their underbellies in public. Poor them. Poor Caylee.

I believe, and always believed this all happened because of the relationship between Casey and Cindy. She controlled nothing when Casey told her she wanted to give Caylee up for adoption to her friend who could not have children. She is the victim of her own micro managing of her daughter. We cannot control anyone else's journey.

Daughter or not, she was old enough to make her own decisions. When we support our adult kids we become responsible. Aye, "No free lunch kid." When an adult kid wants us to pay their way, they have to take the crap that goes with it and that includes us minding their business. Privacy is very, very expensive!

I've said those things to one of my kids who came home after he got divorced. One day he told me to mind my business and I told him to get a night job because he was living under my roof. I was a mother of 4 at age 26. My father told me to sleep in the bed I made at age 18. Grow up Casey! If you want Mommy to pay your way, prepare to get told what to do. It makes sense to me!

She hated her controlling mother killed the thing Cindy loved most in the world. What better revenge? At the same time, I say hang her high. One talking head Mark G said he thinks the death penalty is a problem, and it makes more problems. He as a lawyer thinks it should stay off the table and she should get life. Anyone here who thinks we should support Casey to the tune of 40K a year, raise your hand. :no:

Gag me. I'm feeding Loretta's evil wolf.
I couldn't agree with you more!

Just because the dp is on the table, doesn't mean the jury will recommend it. All it takes is one holdout during the penalty phase and the Judge's only decision will be LWOP or LWP after a specific number of years (in fact, I don't know if that last one is an option for the Judge in FL). I still think the jury should be given that option, although I seriously doubt she would get it. This one may be an exception to the statistics that say juries rarely sentence women to death and I firmly believe the decision should be up to the jury.

[browneyes106]

Padilla was thrown out of the Anthony's house? (Sorry I got on board late) Who threw him out and why?

Thanks

He said that Casey told me that Zenaida's and her sister Samantha held her down and they took Caylee. LP asked Casey why they would do that and she got mad and said that LP was talking to her like cop and she told him to get out.

[deputydi]

I understand your point. But we know that Cindy cleaned and washed pants and other articles of clothing from the car. We also know that cindy has been in the front of the media yelling "Caylee is not dead!".

I think the Larry King show was a last desperate attempt to try to taint the jury pool. When Cindy said that " my investigators have found evidence that everything Casey has said is true", we all hit the ceiling.

Padilla even said, casey was a prissy little princess that won't get her hands dirty. George made this monster. During the jail-house talks....all he calls her is princesss, gorgeous, etc. He was scared of discipline.....Cindy was in the wings ready to pounce on him. That tells me that George might be involved with a cover-up.

Now we go to the Media circus of all the sightings of Caylee. I think this was done to try to turn the publics image of casey. and I think it was orchestrated by Cindy.

Just my opinion, but i think that Obstruction charges for both of them are coming...and coming real soon

http://www.wftv.com/news/18267413/detail.html
I agree that G & C had a hand in creating this monster, but I don't think they created it consciously. IMO they aren't going to be charged with obstruction or anything else. That would be extremely hard to prove. Whether they really, in their hearts, believed Caylee was alive or not, they were defending their narcissistic daughter and that isn't illegal. Just because they refused to search for a dead Caylee and held out hope that she would be found alive isn't illegal either. I can't think of anything they did that could be construed as obstruction.

As for the "sightings" -- you must remember all the Laci sightings. I believe there were reports of Caylee sightings that came from all over the U.S. and most were probably sincere. People just want to help.

[browneyes106]

I can' help but feel pity for the Anthony's. Getting into the limelight did not serve them well, though I kind of understand what they were trying to do. I myself would not have gone public. I would have let the police do it. At the same time, they have destroyed themselves on international TV. THey are in hell right now and most likely in danger of being harmed even more. There are a lot of nuts out there who want to attack them. There is a lynch mob mentality hovering over them. They are going to need protection. No one should show their underbellies in public. Poor them. Poor Caylee.

I believe, and always believed this all happened because of the relationship between Casey and Cindy. She controlled nothing when Casey told her she wanted to give Caylee up for adoption to her friend who could not have children. She is the victim of her own micro managing of her daughter. We cannot control anyone else's journey.

Daughter or not, she was old enough to make her own decisions. When we support our adult kids we become responsible. Aye, "No free lunch kid." When an adult kid wants us to pay their way, they have to take the crap that goes with it and that includes us minding their business. Privacy is very, very expensive!

I've said those things to one of my kids who came home after he got divorced. One day he told me to mind my business and I told him to get a night job because he was living under my roof. I was a mother of 4 at age 26. My father told me to sleep in the bed I made at age 18. Grow up Casey! If you want Mommy to pay your way, prepare to get told what to do. It makes sense to me!

She hated her controlling mother killed the thing Cindy loved most in the world. What better revenge? At the same time, I say hang her high. One talking head Mark G said he thinks the death penalty is a problem, and it makes more problems. He as a lawyer thinks it should stay off the table and she should get life. Anyone here who thinks we should support Casey to the tune of 40K a year, raise your hand. :no:

Gag me. I'm feeding Loretta's evil wolf.

You brought up some good points. Last on Issues Jane Velez Mitchell said that in a way there is a morality tale from the story. She said that Cindy controlled Casey too much and later bite her back. I have always found it weird that Casey was over 18 when she was pregnant and didn't need permission from Cindy regarding adoption. Last night on Dateline Jesse Grund said that during Casey's pregnancy he believed he was the father and that he told Casey that he felt they weren't ready to be parents and that they should give up the baby for adoption and that Casey told him no and that she wanted to keep the baby. My theory is that Cindy did something to make Casey believe she wanted to keep the baby and that is why she told Jesse she wanted to keep the baby. Jesse got engaged to Casey even though it was proven he wasn't Caylee's father and five months after the engagement Casey called off. Maybe Cindy felt threatened by Jesse becoming a husband and father to Casey and Caylee and again she found a way to control Casey and told her to break off the engagement. I think dysfunction has always existed in Anthony family after reading about their lives before they moved to Florida there are a lot of cracks. I also agree with you about Casey getting the DP.

[Mac]

I agree that G & C had a hand in creating this monster, but I don't think they created it consciously. IMO they aren't going to be charged with obstruction or anything else. That would be extremely hard to prove. Whether they really, in their hearts, believed Caylee was alive or not, they were defending their narcissistic daughter and that isn't illegal. Just because they refused to search for a dead Caylee and held out hope that she would be found alive isn't illegal either. I can't think of anything they did that could be construed as obstruction.

As for the "sightings" -- you must remember all the Laci sightings. I believe there were reports of Caylee sightings that came from all over the U.S. and most were probably sincere. People just want to help.

I don't think they created Casey on purpose. Though the enabling of her attributed to her psyche.

They were defending their daughter, and like you said that is no crime. Until you commit perjury and change your story after the FBI interview, which George did.

As for being charged with obstruction, I think a lot has to be found out as to why the Home became a crime scene, after the discovery of the remains.

That being said, I do believe that the Anthony's knew the baby was gone and dead. The smell of the car, the FBI interview tapes, the Cindy interview, among a few others. They knew....and the probably obstructed the investigation in some aspect.

[lorettalockhorn]

LOL!! Yes, "you break their plates." I've been talking to, and quoting the 2 wolves ever since you posted this:

A Grandfather was talking to his grandson and told him that two wolves
lived inside of every person. One was a good wolf and helped that
person do good to all around him. The other was an evil wolf and made
the person do evil to the people around them. He told the grandson
that these two wolves fought for control of the person everyday. The grandson asked, "Grandfather, which one wins?" The Grandfather said, "the one you feed."


I will always keep this with me. Thanks again! :seeya:

Danagher, that was Deacon's fine post:

I look at through the old Native American story. A Grandfather was talking to his grandson and told him that two wolves lived inside of every person. One was a good wolf and helped that person do good to all around him. The other was an evil wolf and made the person do evil to the people around them. He told the grandson that these two wolves fought for control of the person everyday. The grandson asked, "Grandfather, which one wins?" The Grandfather said, "the one you feed." MOO

I'm thinking about it this morning and reminding myself to hate the sin, not the sinner.

[javahog]

I agree that G & C had a hand in creating this monster, but I don't think they created it consciously. IMO they aren't going to be charged with obstruction or anything else. That would be extremely hard to prove. Whether they really, in their hearts, believed Caylee was alive or not, they were defending their narcissistic daughter and that isn't illegal. Just because they refused to search for a dead Caylee and held out hope that she would be found alive isn't illegal either. I can't think of anything they did that could be construed as obstruction.

As for the "sightings" -- you must remember all the Laci sightings. I believe there were reports of Caylee sightings that came from all over the U.S. and most were probably sincere. People just want to help.

I think the one time we saw the true GA was when he was talking "cop" with the police. I truly believe he knew all along that Caylee was gone and was 99% sure it was KC that did it. But there was Cindy, and he was trying to hold her together...her form of control I bet is like someone in my family who pulls an "Elizabeth, its the Big One, I'm coming!" I can just hear, if you give the baby up for adoption, it'll just kill me, honey! etc. and she actually said that to KC about if something had happened to Caylee. The "threat" to health and sanity is used to keep people in line. Its really hard to fight against directly, because the person in my family often will end up at the doctor after a confrontation...KC hated her for it and struck back in an indirect way, then denied it all...it was an extension of what she had learned to do all along, an indirect attack, then avoid the confrontation by lying. (all imo).

But human beings are not trained animals and have a choice. I hope she gets the DP, myself...

[Justice Denied?]

Isn't it ironic that the dog is being treated better then Caylee

Just figure I throw some arbitrary nonsense in.....:beer: Need a beer

Tim Miller looks sober and explaining why that area was not searched.....feet of water

Beer, h3ll! I need several shots of hard liquor to digest this debacle.:beer:

[Justice Denied?]

And apparantly stripped her naked. No clothes were found in the bag. that just turns my stomach. I keep wondering if her hands and feet were bound with duct tape. Guess not or they would have mentioned it.

[lorettalockhorn]

And apparantly stripped her naked. No clothes were found in the bag. that just turns my stomach. I keep wondering if her hands and feet were bound with duct tape. Guess not or they would have mentioned it.

Jessica D'Onofrio reported last night that there was one item of clothing in the bag. At any rate, I just found this:

Apparently, the bag the remains were found in was open and in water for some time, so other evidence might have floated out. Eyewitness News also learned that the child found could have suffered terrifying last moments. Investigative sources told Eyewitness News duct tape was found still stuck to the child's mouth.

Internationally-respected forensics pathologist Michael Baden told Eyewitness News on Friday that duct tape could have been used to suffocate or silence someone and prevent them from screaming, which means the child could have suffered traumatic injury.

The remains that were found were not just bones. There was tissue left, which apparently is what the duct tape was stuck to, and hair. The hair is said to be consistent in color to Caylee's hair and the body size consistent with the size of Caylee's body, according to information the sheriff's office provided Casey's attorney, Jose Baez, on Thursday.

Dr. Michael Baden told Eyewitness News the duct tape could not only have preserved some of the evidence because it's waterproof, but also could contain evidence such as fingerprints on the sticky side of the tape. He said he would expect there to be some hair as well and said the hair, tissue and bone marrow can be tested for chemicals and could hold the answer to whether chloroform or any other chemical was used to kill the child.


http://www.wftv.com/news/18271333/detail.html

[lorettalockhorn]

I don't think they created Casey on purpose. Though the enabling of her attributed to her psyche.

They were defending their daughter, and like you said that is no crime. Until you commit perjury and change your story after the FBI interview, which George did.

As for being charged with obstruction, I think a lot has to be found out as to why the Home became a crime scene, after the discovery of the remains.

That being said, I do believe that the Anthony's knew the baby was gone and dead. The smell of the car, the FBI interview tapes, the Cindy interview, among a few others. They knew....and the probably obstructed the investigation in some aspect.

I don't think G&C created the monster that Casey is now on purpose, I just think they gave up on her. After all, they had a new model to work on; Caylee.

We don't know what lies Cindy may have told LE, but we do know that she either purposely or unwittingly has helped Casey, she has jacked around with the public's emotions, blabbed when she should have STHU, and ironically kept mum when she should have been talking. Her comments about giving LE the dog's toothbrush and having given them the shared hairbrush show that she had the intent of obfuscating issues. And even though G&C's public comments were not made under oath, it tends to make us think that any of the comments that they made during the official investigation could have been lies. Of course it's more likely that the backpedaling that they've done for the media are the true lies.

It's a struggle for my disgust for them to outweigh the sympathy that I have for their loss.

[javahog]

The only thing worse than her being dead is the thought of her suffering and scared on the way. How could anyone have made carrion of this beautiful little girl? I just can't understand it. I guess any crime is full of what ifs, but if only Caylee had been given up for adoption! She would be in line at a mall today waiting for Santa or something. I at least have learned that I will never try to convince someone that they shouldn't give their baby up for adoption. If a girl says she's not ready to raise a child, I will believe her...

[javahog]

I don't think G&C created the monster that Casey is now on purpose, I just think they gave up on her. After all, they had a new model to work on; Caylee.

We don't know what lies Cindy may have told LE, but we do know that she either purposely or unwittingly has helped Casey, she has jacked around with the public's emotions, blabbed when she should have STHU, and ironically kept mum when she should have been talking. Her comments about giving LE the dog's toothbrush and having given them the shared hairbrush show that she had the intent of obfuscating issues. And even though G&C's public comments were not made under oath, it tends to make us think that any of the comments that they made during the official investigation could have been lies. Of course it's more likely that the backpedaling that they've done for the media are the true lies.

It's a struggle for my disgust for them to outweigh the sympathy that I have for their loss.

I think Cindy had so convinced herself that Caylee was alive, her only means of coping, that she thought she was helping find the "alive" Caylee by obstructing the search for a dead Caylee, keeping LE from being distracted from the "real" search, if you will. DNA only mattered if Caylee was dead...

[Justice Denied?]

There was some discussion back when LP was searching the river about the fact that Casey had a gold cross (purchased from JCPenney(?), and that she had perhaps bought another one for Caylee. There was also some talk about whether or not Cindy had found a receipt for the charge(s) on her account.

I remember watching an interview some time ago between Cindy and LE in which the officer was fairly aggravated and said they had asked Cindy for credit card statements and that she had failed to rovide them.
she stated that she had checked them and there was nothing on there. At the time I felt they were looking for proof that Casey stole from Cindy.:shrug:

[lorettalockhorn]

Just for the heck of it, I posted the same questions on David Lohr's blog.

Hopefully, we can get to the bottom of this.

Donna, we don't know the exact address of the find, but I found this:

http://paarcgis.ocpafl.org/Webmap1/default.aspx

http://www.ocpafl.org/pls/webappI/get_parcel_master?pid=302313129000002&query_data=1111111P

I'm just going by the 911 call that the remains were right by the school. Maybe Gator can help us figure out how close we are.

Okay, I see now that that first link doesn't exactly show you what I found, but you can search by entering the intersection of two streets and then click onto individual parcels on the map. Which is what I did to get the second link.

[lorettalockhorn]

I remember watching an interview some time ago between Cindy and LE in which the officer was fairly aggravated and said they had asked Cindy for credit card statements and that she had failed to rovide them.
she stated that she had checked them and there was nothing on there. At the time I felt they were looking for proof that Casey stole from Cindy.:shrug:

You know, if Cindy refused to turn over those statements and forced LE to subpoena them from the credit card company, that could be construed as obstruction. hmmm *strokes beard*

[samanthajane13]

"Donna, we don't know the exact address of the find, but I found this:

http://paarcgis.ocpafl.org/Webmap1/default.aspx

http://www.ocpafl.org/pls/webappI/ge..._data=1111111P

I'm just going by the 911 call that the remains were right by the school. Maybe Gator can help us figure out how close we are.

Okay, I see now that that first link doesn't exactly show you what I found, but you can search by entering the intersection of two streets and then click onto individual parcels on the map. Which is what I did to get the second link."

Thanks, sweetie!!!

I'm checking it out now.

Still wondering WHO put up the sign!!!

Dang, this is frustrating!!!

[lorettalockhorn]

There was some talk earlier about the ownership of the Anthonys' home due to George's financial problems; according to the county records, Cindy is the sole owner.

[lorettalockhorn]

"Donna, we don't know the exact address of the find, but I found this:

http://paarcgis.ocpafl.org/Webmap1/default.aspx

http://www.ocpafl.org/pls/webappI/ge..._data=1111111P

I'm just going by the 911 call that the remains were right by the school. Maybe Gator can help us figure out how close we are.

Okay, I see now that that first link doesn't exactly show you what I found, but you can search by entering the intersection of two streets and then click onto individual parcels on the map. Which is what I did to get the second link."

Thanks, sweetie!!!

I'm checking it out now.

Still wondering WHO put up the sign!!!

Dang, this is frustrating!!!

I would assume Mr. Hendricks or his bona fide agent.

If that second link was broken, the parcel number is 13-23-30-1290-00-002.

[samanthajane13]

"SamanthaJane, you really do have to wonder why those ropes and signs are now removed from the site. Maybe it's because the floodwaters have receded. I read somewhere that that area is to undergo development."


Of the sign was up as a warning because of the water, wouldn't they use a CAUTION sign or something like that?

And if was because they're planning on developing the land, the signs would still be there-I'd think!!

[Justice Denied?]

updated 2 minutes ago
Lawyer: Corpse's hair color matches Caylee's


ORLANDO, Florida (CNN) -- Strands of hair found with remains discovered a half mile from the home of missing toddler Caylee Anthony are the same color as Caylee's, lawyers for her mother said in court Friday.

Defense attorneys for Casey Anthony, the 22-year-old mother charged with Caylee's murder, told Judge Stan Strickland they were notified Thursday the corpse's hair color and other features matched Caylee.

Overnight, investigators searched the home of Caylee's grandparents and "absolutely" found something of interest, Orange County, Florida, Sheriff Kevin Beary said Friday morning.

The girl often lived in the house with her grandparents and her mother, who was arrested in October and charged with murder.

Investigators "concluded there were certain things they wanted to be looking for" and searched the home, Beary said in an interview broadcast on ABC News. Authorities took boxes and bags full of items for review.

A utility worker discovered the remains around 9:30 a.m. Thursday and alerted authorities, sheriff's spokesman Jim Solomons said.

Police Capt. Angelo Nieves said the skeletal remains found in a plastic bag appeared consistent with those of a young child.

Caylee Anthony, 3, has been missing since June in a case that has received national attention.

The remains were taken to the county medical examiner's office and will be sent to the FBI lab in Quantico, Virginia, Beary said Thursday.

Meanwhile, investigators Friday continued searching the area where the remains were found.

"Time is on our side," Beary said Thursday. "We're going to do everything by the book. There will be no mistakes made." Watch sheriff promise 'no mistakes' »

Attorneys for Caylee's 22-year-old mother, Casey Anthony, filed an emergency motion asking that their experts be present for any forensic testing done on the remains. A hearing on that motion is set for Friday. Casey Anthony will not be transported from jail to attend, court officials said.

CNN affiliate WFTV-TV reported that the utility worker, a meter reader, picked up a bag at the site Thursday morning and a skull fell out.

Earlier, Beary told reporters, "Bottom line, it's real simple, folks. We've recovered this human skull. It appears to be that of a small child, and now the investigation continues. We've got a lot of lab work to do, a lot of DNA work to do, a lot of crime scene work to do."

Prosecutors had asked police not to disclose many details surrounding the discovery, Beary said.

The region had previously been searched as part of the investigation into Caylee's disappearance, he said, but the spot where the remains were found -- some "45, 50, 60 feet back" -- was flooded and underwater at the time. No clothes were found with the remains, he said.

Asked whether the remains could belong to another child, Beary said, "Not that we know of, but that's always a possibility, and that's why we've got a lot of work to do on this case still."

Corrections officials said Thursday that Casey Anthony remained in protective custody and has no contact with other inmates.

"She has been seen by a Corrections Health Services psychologist and her status was reviewed," officials said in a statement, adding shewas on apsychological elaluation -- which is not the same as suicide watch.

"We will not be releasing any information regarding her demeanor," the statement said, adding that jail policy prohibits interviews of inmates.

Defense attorney Jose Baez arrived at the jail just before noon Thursday and stayed about 90 minutes, officials said.

In a court hearing earlier Thursday, 9th Circuit Judge Stan Strickland postponed Casey Anthony's trial at the request of Baez, who said he had not received all the evidence from prosecutors and was not ready to proceed with the January 5 trial.

Baez asked Strickland if the trial could be delayed until March. The judge scheduled a hearing January 15 to consider a new trial date as well as a possible change of venue.

Prosecutors said earlier this month they would not seek the death penalty against Casey Anthony. She could face a sentence of life in prison if convicted.

Authorities have said Casey Anthony waited about a month before telling her family that Caylee was gone. Cindy Anthony -- Caylee's grandmother and Casey Anthony's mother -- called the Orange County sheriff's office on July 15, saying her daughter would not tell her where Caylee was.

When questioned by police, Casey Anthony gave conflicting statements, including some that were later disproved, according to hundreds of documents and investigative reports released in the case.

She claimed she dropped Caylee off with a babysitter, but when police checked out her story, they learned that the address Casey Anthony supplied belonged to an apartment that had been vacant for weeks. The woman Casey Anthony named as her babysitter told police she did not know her. Review a timeline of the case »

Investigators previously have said that cadaver dogs picked up the scent of death in Anthony's car, as well as in her parents' back yard. They also said air quality tests conducted by the FBI found evidence consistent with human decomposition and chloroform in the car's trunk. A neighbor told police Anthony had asked to borrow a shovel.

Analysis of Anthony's computer found she had visited Web sites discussing chloroform and had done Internet searches of missing children, according to information released in the case.

But "there isn't a motive and they haven't found a motive," Cindy Anthony said Wednesday night during an appearance on CNN's "Larry King Live." "They told us they thought it was an accident and she's scared and tried to cover it up. They don't feel there's a motive."

Cindy Anthony said searches for the girl's body have "come up with nothing. There's nothing that they have found that, you know, has given them any evidence that Caylee is no longer with us."



The Anthonys said they believe the girl is still alive and that someone has her, noting several reports of sightings.

Last month, Strickland denied prosecutors' request to impose a gag order in Anthony's case, saying he could not state that continued publicity would pose a threat to her trial, or even that a gag order would stem the flood of media attention.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/12/12/caylee.anthony/index.html

Just had a wierd thought: What if Casey now goes completely insane (or pretends to)? Someone please refresh me on the McNoughton Rule. What if she was sane at the time of the crime but insane now?

[Justice Denied?]

Why not? That night she rented and watched movies about abandoned children and kidnapping. Four days later she was at Fusion on a stripper pole. (no disrespect to strippers). Well, we all grieve in our own way.

Ii had trouble getting to sleep and kept waking up. Of course, that may have had to do with my ggranddaughter who was visiting sleeping with me.

[One2Snoop]

Feature Story here at the Crime Library...

Caylee Anthony
By: Chuck Hustmyre

1. Part 1: Missing
2. A Bizarre Story
3. Suspicious Statement
4. Unraveled
5. The Universal Connection
6. Part 2: Lies
7. "Coming Clean"
8. Getting Nowhere
9. The Nanny and the Boyfriend
10. The Arrest
11. Part 3: Detectives Fear the Worst
12. Jailhouse Phone Call
13. Father's Day
14. More Sightings
15. Strange Behavior
16. A Charge of Murder
17. Sheriffs Office: "We Got Her"

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/notorious_murders/family/caylee_anthony/1.html

[Justice Denied?]

wouldn"t be at all suprised if with soft tissue they were able to determine exact cause of death. Wouldn't that sink Casey's boat?

[deputydi]

You know, if Cindy refused to turn over those statements and forced LE to subpoena them from the credit card company, that could be construed as obstruction. hmmm *strokes beard*
I don't think that rises to a charge of obstruction. Obstruction is usually consciously lying to police in an investigation or destroying evidence. Washing Casey's pants could, I guess, meet the definition of destroying/altering evidence but they would have to prove she did it knowing Caylee was dead and her daughter was the killer. If anyone in this case should be prosecuted, it would be Casey -- but, they are trying her on first degree murder charges and there is such a thing as "overkill". Murder 1 is the conviction they want.

LE has their hands full right now building a case to prosecute Casey. The parents will get a pass on any potential charges (legally speaking) IMO. Their hell will be living with the knowledge that their daughter murdered "Nan's sunshine". I can't watch that clip without crying.

[deputydi]

wouldn"t be at all suprised if with soft tissue they were able to determine exact cause of death. Wouldn't that sink Casey's boat?
Without a doubt! Let's all hope they can connect Caylee's body with at least one of those Google searches. Preferably chloroform since that is what was found in the car. Perfect slam-dunk and I thought I'd never use those words when predicting a jury's verdict.

[Justice Denied?]

So when and why did Cindy change from wanting Casey to pay to Casey can do no wrong?

[One2Snoop]

Casey Anthony's defense brings in high-powered team
Sarah Lundy, Bianca Prieto and Willoughby Mariano | Sentinel Staff Writers
December 13, 2008

There's a star New York City defense attorney with Hollywood connections; a best-selling mystery novelist who doubles as a forensic anthropologist; an expert who testified on the assassinations of John F. Kennedy and Martin Luther King Jr. And a guy who knows bugs.

During an emergency hearing Friday in Orange Circuit Court, the defense for Casey Anthony, the 22-year-old mother suspected of killing her toddler daughter, unveiled a team that read like a cast of characters from a legal thriller.

They join other high-profile names such as criminalist Henry Lee -- made famous by the O.J. Simpson trial -- and Dr. Larry Kobilinsky, a forensic scientist, who is a regular on CNN's Nancy Grace.

Lead counsel Jose Baez is playing to win, his spokesman Todd Black said.:no:

"As you can see, he's been putting together a tremendous team," Black said.

The hearing was called after a meter reader discovered the bones Thursday of a child who may be Caylee Marie Anthony. The remains lay a quarter-mile from the east Orange County home the girl shared with her mother and grandparents.

Orange County deputy sheriffs did not confirm the remains are those of Caylee, but New York attorney Linda Kenney Baden, who represented music impresario Phil Spector in his murder trial last year, said in court Friday that Baez was told the measurements of the bones and the color of hair discovered match those of Caylee.

Caylee's mother and grandparents have maintained since the July 15 report of her disappearance that the girl is alive.

Boxes sent to FBI in Virginia

The legal jostling took place as Orange County deputy sheriffs sifted through dirt near where the bones were found, looking for evidence that might tell them how the child died. The child's skull was found wrapped in duct tape, and other items were found in the bag, a source told the Orlando Sentinel.

The bones are now at the Orange-Osceola Medical Examiner's Office. Casey Anthony remains in Orange County Jail without bail on first-degree-murder and other charges.

Deputies left the Anthony home early Friday with boxes and several paper bags of evidence that will be used by FBI officials in Virginia. Lab technicians will compare the items with evidence found at the scene where the body was discovered, Orange County Sheriff Kevin Beary said. He would not say what was seized from the Anthony home or collected with the remains.

Investigators likely searched the home looking for duct tape or a plastic bag similar to what was found with the body, said Richard Weinblatt, manager of the criminal-justice program at Seminole Community College.

Duct tape can pick up evidence such as carpet fibers, soil and fingerprints.

If these clues link the body with evidence gathered from the home or from the trunk of Casey Anthony's car, where tests showed signs of a decomposing body, the find could be a boon to prosecutors, Weinblatt said.

But if authorities cannot determine how long the body was in the woods, all bets are off, Weinblatt said. The defense could argue the body was placed in the woods while Casey Anthony was in jail.

"The main question is, 'Where has the body been?' " he said.


Little hope left

Hours after police left the Anthony home Friday, Caylee's grandparents Cindy and George Anthony arrived, then left with luggage and their two dogs. Their attorney, Brad Conway, said they are still trying to cope with news of the discovery and are unlikely to return home this weekend. He did not reveal where they were staying.

"They continue to pray this is not Caylee, but everyone is realistic in their expectations," Conway said. (end of page 1)

Page 2 continued at the link

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/orange/orl-caylee1308dec13,0,7376977.story?page=2

[lorettalockhorn]

Whoops, I did it again din I? I have no excuse. :shrug:
Well thank YOU Deacon!

Hide me...

No need to hide!

But loretta, the sin is committed by the sinner. It saddens us all so deeply when the sinners do what Casey did. I'm having a problem with Casey Anthony. But, then again, I'm not God. I'll keep her and her family in my prayers........................................... ... someday. As far as I'm concerned at this point, she's Satan's spawn.

It's hard to separate the sin and the sinner, but I'll work on my man-type analytic skills (now that I don't have much estrogen anymore), and practice compartmentalizing.