O.J. In The News Again

[martin II]

martin, a mild gathering of men?? What alternate reality do you live in? :eek:

You think people have prejudged OJ Simpson's actions and role in this incident yet you are ready to jump on the idea idea that the victims obtained the goods illegally just because Simpson says so. If he asked that the items to be removed from his home to keep Fred Goldman from getting them then they weren't stolen.

One of the thiefs stated that a guy named Mike had stole some goods from oj
and gave or sold them to one of the thiefs that was caught in the room trying to sell them.

imo
martin II

[martin II]

martin, a mild gathering of men?? What alternate reality do you live in? :eek:

You think people have prejudged OJ Simpson's actions and role in this incident yet you are ready to jump on the idea idea that the victims obtained the goods illegally just because Simpson says so. If he asked that the items to be removed from his home to keep Fred Goldman from getting them then they weren't stolen.

tv
how about you not worry about that reality i live in. It has served me well.
I believe your task if to be concerned about the one you live in.

martin II

[martin II]

yes, that judge did decide that but I do not think JC was actively involved in the case at that time, which does not mean that the judge would not have found there was enough evidence for a trial if he was. I think the judge would rue the decision he made, if he watched the way the prosecution presented the evidence and tried to persuade the jury. I did not include the families in my statement either.

As for the knit cap, I think it showed the ridiculousness of the prosecution's assertion that Simpson wore it as a disguise. I found it to be a comical yet effective demonstrative illustration of that ridiculous assertion.

william
The cap demostration demonstrated the genius of JC. Bless him. He was able to, in the demonstration, say what would taken others a day to say and in a way that the jury and the court could quickly understand.Good for him

martin II

[martin II]

yes, that judge did decide that but I do not think JC was actively involved in the case at that time, which does not mean that the judge would not have found there was enough evidence for a trial if he was. I think the judge would rue the decision he made, if he watched the way the prosecution presented the evidence and tried to persuade the jury. I did not include the families in my statement either.

As for the knit cap, I think it showed the ridiculousness of the prosecution's assertion that Simpson wore it as a disguise. I found it to be a comical yet effective demonstrative illustration of that ridiculous assertion.

WILLIAM

"The prosecution can get the grand jury to indict a ham sandwich"
martin II

[martin II]

william
What i have found is that not only does oj come under attack because some refuse to accept the criminal trial jury's verdict, oj's defense lawyers also come under attack for doing what they are required by law to do.Use every legal means to get their client off. This defense team was made up of some of the country's best defense lawyers available and they proved their worth
by ripping apart that prosections "MOUNTAIN OF EVIDENCE' and turned it into a ant hill of confusion. M Clark and C Darden comes to mind.imo
martin II

[socaldiva]

One of the thiefs stated that a guy named Mike had stole some goods from oj
and gave or sold them to one of the thiefs that was caught in the room trying to sell them.

imo
martin II

Mike was Orenthal's Manager at one point & said that Simpson owed him money that was not paid, that's why he confiscated some of his items. See, it all starts with Orenthal doing something shady ;)

[tv]

tv
how about you not worry about that reality i live in. It has served me well.
I believe your task if to be concerned about the one you live in.

martin IIWhen I see a fellow poster spinning yarns out of fantasy then I'm within my right to call them on it. You didn't mind chastising me several times for characterizing OJ Simpson's women in an unflattering way. I'll decide what my tasks are all on my own.

[tv]

william
What i have found is that not only does oj come under attack because some refuse to accept the criminal trial jury's verdict, oj's defense lawyers also come under attack for doing what they are required by law to do.Use every legal means to get their client off. This defense team was made up of some of the country's best defense lawyers available and they proved their worth
by ripping apart that prosections "MOUNTAIN OF EVIDENCE' and turned it into a ant hill of confusion. M Clark and C Darden comes to mind.imo
martin IIHaHaHa. :biggrin:

[tv]

yes, that judge did decide that but I do not think JC was actively involved in the case at that time, which does not mean that the judge would not have found there was enough evidence for a trial if he was. I think the judge would rue the decision he made, if he watched the way the prosecution presented the evidence and tried to persuade the jury. I did not include the families in my statement either.

As for the knit cap, I think it showed the ridiculousness of the prosecution's assertion that Simpson wore it as a disguise. I found it to be a comical yet effective demonstrative illustration of that ridiculous assertion.William, the judge would have been seriously remiss if he hadn't ruled there was enough to go to trial. It wasn't up to him to decide how the case would be tried. I think the prosecution could and should have been more effective in their presentation but the forensic evidence alone should have sent OJ Simpson to prison for life. I don't think the defense was all that skilled but I suppose that that's an argument for another thread. :)

[martin II]

William, the judge would have been seriously remiss if he hadn't ruled there was enough to go to trial. It wasn't up to him to decide how the case would be tried. I think the prosecution could and should have been more effective in their presentation but the forensic evidence alone should have sent OJ Simpson to prison for life. I don't think the defense was all that skilled but I suppose that that's an argument for another thread. :)

tv
if you have the opportunity to read the resumes of the defense team members you may have a change of mind on their skills. However they were not named the dream team for lack of a name.

martinii

[martin II]

When I see a fellow poster spinning yarns out of fantasy then I'm within my right to call them on it. You didn't mind chastising me several times for characterizing OJ Simpson's women in an unflattering way. I'll decide what my tasks are all on my own.

As long as your comments do not include personal negative attacks on me you may do and speak as you please.
or you can read the moderators comments on the subject of personal comments.
imo
martin II

[martin II]

Tv,

I took the post to be speaking of the prosecutorial farce that was displayed. I think the posters remarks could have been made in regard to the public outcry over the verdict. To me the trial was a waste of taxpayer dollars, as the prosecution did not meet its burden of production or persuassion, imho. It is amaziing that those on the loosing side seemed to have prospered so much, through books, tv appearances, and tv positions. No, I am not making fun of your nic.:), just tired of typing homework, today.

oj has previously stated that many unknowns made millions writing books about him and he saw no reason why he should not write one to make money also. imo
martin II

[William Anthony]

William, the judge would have been seriously remiss if he hadn't ruled there was enough to go to trial. It wasn't up to him to decide how the case would be tried. I think the prosecution could and should have been more effective in their presentation but the forensic evidence alone should have sent OJ Simpson to prison for life. I don't think the defense was all that skilled but I suppose that that's an argument for another thread. :)

I think that the judge would have ruled there was not enough evidence to go to the lab, let alone a trial, had the defense talked about contamination and sloppy collection techniques,:). The forensic evidence did not hold muster under cross, imho. What are you saying? Are you saying that some slightly skilled lawyers beat the socks off Clark and Darden?:)

[William Anthony]

Tv and Martin,

I was suprised to read a post where a poster claimed Simpson was to blame for Mike stealing Simpson's property, because Simpson owed Mike money. That poster has now given Simpson the defense he needed and there should be no trial. If in the world inhabitated by Mike and Simpson theft is acceptable, then Simpson has committed no legal wrong.

[martin II]

Maybe it's just me but having a couple of guns pointed at me as the ring leader is screaming, ......
Up against the wall.......
don't let them leave,.......
give me the phones.
I just tend to think that person is violent.
I know, silly me, he's just talking loudly and up against the wall simply means -please move over here I need to get around you.
Oh and the guns?
Heck he didn't even notice them. :rolleyes: I'm sure had simpson been aware of the guns in the room he would have stopped everything and apologized. lol lol

or he may have said "put the guns away" if he had known.

martin II

[William Anthony]

Tv and Martin,

I was suprised to read a post where a poster claimed Simpson was to blame for Mike stealing Simpson's property, because Simpson owed Mike money. That poster has now given Simpson the defense he needed and there should be no trial. If in the world inhabitated by Mike and Simpson theft is acceptable, then Simpson has committed no legal wrong.

Correction-If in the world inhabited

[Heyes]

Would you say that the police were violent if they acted in the same way?

Oh I'm sorry!
Did oranthal become a cop? I must have missed that.
How did he go through all that training in Las Vegas without the press getting ahold of it?
Wow!

[martin II]

Correction-If in the world inhabited

what i am trying to understand is if Riccio first informed oj of the thiefs activity of offering his goods for sale and then rented the hotel room,caused the thiefs to bring the goods to the room and brought oj and his friends to the meeting, why is he not considered to be involved and charged as the others?
martin II

[Heyes]

I related a person incident in which plain clothes police stuck a gun to my head after forcing me to the ground and then asked me where the gun was. I told them it was pointed to my head. After verifying my story and searching me, one of the officers tried to say he could arrest me for vagrancy. I had enough knowledge of the law at that time to know he could not and explained it to him. While the officers discontinued their assault, not one of them apologized for their behavior, go figure.

gotta tell a WA, you leave me speechless on this comment.
vagrancy huh?

[Heyes]

Talking about violence.
Yesterday at a protest demostration, the cops had handcuffed this white girl. she asked for his badge number.she said he picked her up and slammed her to the grown. since her hands were cuffed she was not able use her arms to break her fall and she landed directly on her face.she was arrested and charged with resisting arrest or something like that. Some would give this cop the benefit of the doubt.

martin II

If Oranthal was white, would you be defending him?

[William Anthony]

Oh I'm sorry!
Did oranthal become a cop? I must have missed that.
How did he go through all that training in Las Vegas without the press getting ahold of it?
Wow!

The discussion started about whether or not Simpson's words on the tape showed his tendency toward violence. It occured to me that Simpson was using the same techniques that police use for self protection and to minimize violence. I was not saying that he was a policeman but that his techniques were similar to those used by police and asked you would you consider that the police were acting violent.

[Heyes]

The discussion started about whether or not Simpson's words on the tape showed his tendency toward violence. It occured to me that Simpson was using the same techniques that police use for self protection and to minimize violence. I was not saying that he was a policeman but that his techniques were similar to those used by police and asked you would you consider that the police were acting violent.
But you can't compare the two. It's silly.
You do understand the difference between law enforcement, their job, and oranthal having a temper tantrum. Right?

[William Anthony]

gotta tell a WA, you leave me speechless on this comment.
vagrancy huh?

I am glad to leave you speechless but I see you were not talking literally, :). Seriously, my friend at the time, who was white, had my car. I went to where her mother lived to get it back but it was not there. I waited under a street light for twenty minutes, because it was a White neighborhood and I was not allowed in the mother's home. I talked to her brother when he came out and told him to tell my friend I need the car. As I left and approached the gas station accross the street is when the other incident happened. I told the police how ridiculous it was to stand under a street light for that length of time in a White residential area, if I planned to rob the gas station. Unfortunately, this is sometimes the price one pays for being Black in America.

[William Anthony]

But you can't compare the two. It's silly.
You do understand the difference between law enforcement, their job, and oranthal having a temper tantrum. Right?

I have never said that Simpson did not have a temper or that his actions were correct. I have questioned whether the words he used showed his propensity for violence. I compared the techniques used to show that their is a similarity and those techniques are used by LE for self protection and to minimize violence. I am not so quick to accuse without considering the circumstances.

[Heyes]

I am glad to leave you speechless but I see you were not talking literally, :). Seriously, my friend at the time, who was white, had my car. I went to where her mother lived to get it back but it was not there. I waited under a street light for twenty minutes, because it was a White neighborhood and I was not allowed in the mother's home. I talked to her brother when he came out and told him to tell my friend I need the car. As I left and approached the gas station accross the street is when the other incident happened. I told the police how ridiculous it was to stand under a street light for that length of time in a White residential area, if I planned to rob the gas station. Unfortunately, this is sometimes the price one pays for being Black in America.

Well I think we've all had our problems, however oranthal is not our icon for equal treatment. I never saw this as a black or white issue. This was a domestic violence issue. The new charges are also not a reason for me to believe this is a racial issue. I can find others in the black community
who I find much more credible and uplifting to support. This man could care less about the black community. His defense in the first case used the racial issue to get him off the hook. As soon as he got his verdict he and his defense packed up their toys and went home. oranthal took up with a new white woman and moved to a golf course in Florida.
Johnny and his paid team used the emotions of the black community only to get his client off. That's all. I feel we were insulted beyond belief. I would think you would too!
We were played! IMO

[Heyes]

I have never said that Simpson did not have a temper or that his actions were correct. I have questioned whether the words he used showed his propensity for violence. I compared the techniques used to show that their is a similarity and those techniques are used by LE for self protection and to minimize violence. I am not so quick to accuse without considering the circumstances.

I said it before, you cannot compare whatever simpson said during his "sting operation" to what a officer is trained to do, by law in the line of his profession. Oranthal,, is NOT allowed by law to storm into someones room with guns blazing and say anything. He cannot say boo, pretty please or mimic his favorite dragnet episode. He should of handled this different and lawfully. But this is oranthal we're talking about and he does what he pleases.

[William Anthony]

I said it before, you cannot compare whatever simpson said during his "sting operation" to what a officer is trained to do, by law in the line of his profession. Oranthal,, is NOT allowed by law to storm into someones room with guns blazing and say anything. He cannot say boo, pretty please or mimic his favorite dragnet episode. He should of handled this different and lawfully. But this is oranthal we're talking about and he does what he pleases.

Have you ever heard of Dawg Chapman, the bounty hunter? Anyway, you now seem to want to change the subject from whether or not the words show a tendency for violence and the techniques employed to a discussion of his conduct, which I have already said I do not believe was correct. This is the first time I heard that the guns were fired!

[William Anthony]

Well I think we've all had our problems, however oranthal is not our icon for equal treatment. I never saw this as a black or white issue. This was a domestic violence issue. The new charges are also not a reason for me to believe this is a racial issue. I can find others in the black community
who I find much more credible and uplifting to support. This man could care less about the black community. His defense in the first case used the racial issue to get him off the hook. As soon as he got his verdict he and his defense packed up their toys and went home. oranthal took up with a new white woman and moved to a golf course in Florida.
Johnny and his paid team used the emotions of the black community only to get his client off. That's all. I feel we were insulted beyond belief. I would think you would too!
We were played! IMO

First, let me clarify to you that the incident I shared was first placed on a thread about race and this trial. I chose to share it with you after your comment that Simpson did not apologize and show you neither did the police.

I am not willing to dismiss the racial issue as moot considering the race of the victims, the remarks made about JC and the criminal jury, the amount of outrage over that fact that Simpson was acquitted. I have never considered Simpson to be an icon for the Black community. I do look up to Dr. Martin Luther King, JC, JKF, Fredrick Douglas, Malcom X, the Freedom Fighters, Morris Dees, Medgar Evers and the likes. I am not insulted by Simpson's associtations or his bed partners as I believe that is his right and I do not have a nickle in that dime.

As far as the race card goes in the trial, the prosecution played it when they decided to place the admitted race hating, evidence tampering, convicted perjurer on the stand. JC did not make the evidence. He only used it to give his client the best defense possible.

[Heyes]

Have you ever heard of Dawg Chapman, the bounty hunter? Anyway, you now seem to want to change the subject from whether or not the words show a tendency for violence and the techniques employed to a discussion of his conduct, which I have already said I do not believe was correct. This is the first time I heard that the guns were fired!

ok it is violent. The police are dealing with violent people. Oranthal has proved to be one of them. Maybe we should look at this from a different angle. For him to blaze into the room with thugs and guns and parrot police commands on the unsuspecting people that were in that room is worrisome at best. Aren't you worried about his mental health when he feels that he can pull these dangerous stunts? He believes he has the right to play cop. what is wrong with this man? I think much more concern should be taken regarding his mind and what's happening to it. He needs help but his mental state has come to the point I'm afraid that he no longer knows reality from fantasy. I hope this is a concern of yours as well. He has got to get help. This is not the behavior of a normal human. He might have been very angry but he pushed it wayyyyy past the point of a law abiding rational person. If I was that girlfriend of his this would give me cause for alarm. I'm afraid she's going to be next.
What does dog have to do with it? By the way Dog is first in line to hunt oranthal down if he skips bail. lol lol

[William Anthony]

ok it is violent. The police are dealing with violent people. Oranthal has proved to be one of them. Maybe we should look at this from a different angle. For him to blaze into the room with thugs and guns and parrot police commands on the unsuspecting people that were in that room is worrisome at best. Aren't you worried about his mental health when he feels that he can pull these dangerous stunts? He believes he has the right to play cop. what is wrong with this man? I think much more concern should be taken regarding his mind and what's happening to it. He needs help but his mental state has come to the point I'm afraid that he no longer knows reality from fantasy. I hope this is a concern of yours as well. He has got to get help. This is not the behavior of a normal human. He might have been very angry but he pushed it wayyyyy past the point of a law abiding rational person. If I was that girlfriend of his this would give me cause for alarm. I'm afraid she's going to be next.
What does dog have to do with it? By the way Dog is first in line to hunt oranthal down if he skips bail. lol lol

I would guess that anyone who steals property and attempts to sell it would be violent. Are you worried about Dog's mental health? A bounty hunter and a citizen's arrest seem to be similar to me. I guess, if Oranthal (I appreciate your pun with the spelling) decides to run and Dog goes after him, there will be guns blazing.

[Jayme K]

I related a person incident in which plain clothes police stuck a gun to my head after forcing me to the ground and then asked me where the gun was. I told them it was pointed to my head. After verifying my story and searching me, one of the officers tried to say he could arrest me for vagrancy. I had enough knowledge of the law at that time to know he could not and explained it to him. While the officers discontinued their assault, not one of them apologized for their behavior, go figure.

William what happened to you sucks and it's the result of the lowest of the low type of people in America but I wish to God that you'd try to understand that there are as many black people that hate whites as there are whites that hate blacks. I found that out the moment I dated this beautiful black man after graduating college and got jumped outside my apartment one Friday evening by a group of black ladies that were aquaintted with him. From then on it was a horrible mix of whites hating him and blacks hating me.

All of sucks, and so I don't just feel sorry for a black man like yourself in America. I feel sorry for all races across the board that suffer this type of crappy nonsense at the hands of others who just don't get it.

[William Anthony]

William what happened to you sucks and it's the result of the lowest of the low type of people in America but I wish to God that you'd try to understand that there are as many black people that hate whites as there are whites that hate blacks. I found that out the moment I dated this beautiful black man after graduating college and got jumped outside my apartment one Friday evening by a group of black ladies that were aquaintted with him. From then on it was a horrible mix of whites hating him and blacks hating me.

All of sucks, and so I don't just feel sorry for a black man like yourself in America. I feel sorry for all races across the board that suffer this type of crappy nonsense at the hands of others who just don't get it.

I have never said that racism does not exist in all races and I, likewise, feel sorry for what happened to you and agree with your feelings. I was not seeking sympathy but acknowledging that those who participate in outrageous and violent conduct are not prone to apologies. I was simply relating an incident that happened to me in connection with a lack of an apology in connection with a poster's comment that Simpson did not apologize. This is not the only incident of racism that I suffered and I am sure Whites have suffered incidents. I think that Black men suffer more than others, although White women, who choose to become involved with Black men suffer quite a bit of racism. Conversely, White men and Black women do not appear to suffer as much. My point was that it is almost ridiculous to expect an apology in some situations. I have learned that an apology is not always forthcoming but welcomed when it happens.

[martin II]

If Oranthal was white, would you be defending him?

if the case was the same YES as a white guy would not have been any more guilty than oj was.

martin II

[tv]

tv
if you have the opportunity to read the resumes of the defense team members you may have a change of mind on their skills. However they were not named the dream team for lack of a name.

martiniiI'm well aware of their resumes. Their performance was lackluster in the trial. Naming them the dream team was all hype.

[tv]

As long as your comments do not include personal negative attacks on me you may do and speak as you please.
or you can read the moderators comments on the subject of personal comments.
imo
martin III haven't personally attacked you. You'll know when I do.

[tv]

I think that the judge would have ruled there was not enough evidence to go to the lab, let alone a trial, had the defense talked about contamination and sloppy collection techniques,:). The forensic evidence did not hold muster under cross, imho. What are you saying? Are you saying that some slightly skilled lawyers beat the socks off Clark and Darden?:)No, I'm saying the jury wanted to find OJ Simpson not guilty and the defense team gave them an excuse to do it. No skill involved there.

[tv]

I would guess that anyone who steals property and attempts to sell it would be violent. Are you worried about Dog's mental health? A bounty hunter and a citizen's arrest seem to be similar to me. I guess, if Oranthal (I appreciate your pun with the spelling) decides to run and Dog goes after him, there will be guns blazing.Dog Chapman doesn't carry a gun. :) If guns blaze it will be from OJ Simpson's end.

[William Anthony]

No, I'm saying the jury wanted to find OJ Simpson not guilty and the defense team gave them an excuse to do it. No skill involved there.

I think what you are saying is that the jury believed in the presumption of innocence and held the prosecution to its burden of proof, which the dream team, without the need to demonstrate their skill, easily tore apart, correct?

[William Anthony]

Dog Chapman doesn't carry a gun. :) If guns blaze it will be from OJ Simpson's end.

I do not know if Dog carries a gun or not. However, if he does not, I am truly concerned for his mental health.:)

[William Anthony]

Dog Chapman doesn't carry a gun. :) If guns blaze it will be from OJ Simpson's end.

There was one incident in which Simpson had a gun that he was threatening to commit suicide, not harm others. Would you consider suicide to be a sign of one's proclivity for violence?

[tv]

I think what you are saying is that the jury believed in the presumption of innocence and held the prosecution to its burden of proof, which the dream team, without the need to demonstrate their skill, easily tore apart, correct?Good afternoon, William. Nope, that's not what I meant. What I said is what I meant. :)

[martin II]

I said it before, you cannot compare whatever simpson said during his "sting operation" to what a officer is trained to do, by law in the line of his profession. Oranthal,, is NOT allowed by law to storm into someones room with guns blazing and say anything. He cannot say boo, pretty please or mimic his favorite dragnet episode. He should of handled this different and lawfully. But this is oranthal we're talking about and he does what he pleases.

heyes

I have not read comments from anyone that confirms that 'OJ stormed into someones room guns blazing" as you have offered. Are you sure that happened.?

Riccio rented the room and brought oj and his pals into the room.

imo
martin II

[tv]

There was one incident in which Simpson had a gun that he was threatening to commit suicide, not harm others. Would you consider suicide to be a sign of one's proclivity for violence?I'd really have to give that question more thought. However, I don't think OJ Simpson seriously considered suicide at that point. What he may do in the future is unknown.

[William Anthony]

Good afternoon, William. Nope, that's not what I meant. What I said is what I meant. :)

Good afternoon Tv.

Who has the burden of proof and who has the presumption of innocence and what should a jury feel at the onset of a trial, :) ?

[tv]

Good afternoon Tv.

Who has the burden of proof and who has the presumption of innocence and what should a jury feel at the onset of a trial, :) ?I will indulge you. The prosecution has the burden of proof and the jury should presume innocence until evidence is shown that proves otherwise, of course. This jury, imo, was looking for anything to give them the permission to vote not guilty. Alan Dershowitz said as much himself.

[martin II]

I think what you are saying is that the jury believed in the presumption of innocence and held the prosecution to its burden of proof, which the dream team, without the need to demonstrate their skill, easily tore apart, correct?

william

the more i read here the more i come to understand that some may not have been able to see the cross by the defense of Fung, Mazzolua (sp) Martz, the glove expert, and a few other prosecution witnesses as that is where the prosecution lost the case.

Some have blamed all of the below and more for the loss of the criminal case.

judge ito
majority black jury
M Clarke C Darden
lapd lab collecting activities mistakes
Lapd lab testing mistakes
Furhman
lapd mistakes.
prosecution experts/witnesses mistakes
The evil defense dream team.

The weak case has never been blamed to my knowledge and that is very sad.
imo
martin II

[William Anthony]

I'd really have to give that question more thought. However, I don't think OJ Simpson seriously considered suicide at that point. What he may do in the future is unknown.

I think that there would be tremendous happiness by some should he decide to commit suicide in the future. However, had he followed through 13 years ago, we would not be in this lively discussion now.:) I think that, perhaps, we should try to pull up the thread on the criminal trial in order to continue our discussion, as I think we may be slightly OT.

[William Anthony]

I will indulge you. The prosecution has the burden of proof and the jury should presume innocence until evidence is shown that proves otherwise, of course. This jury, imo, was looking for anything to give them the permission to vote not guilty. Alan Dershowitz said as much himself.

Alan Dershowitz said it, which sinches it for me. :) Was he part of the jury? I think the discussion is interesting. Do you know how to pull up the other thread?

[martin II]

I will indulge you. The prosecution has the burden of proof and the jury should presume innocence until evidence is shown that proves otherwise, of course. This jury, imo, was looking for anything to give them the permission to vote not guilty. Alan Dershowitz said as much himself.

Dershowits made a lot of predicitons just before the case started on pbs Rose show.None materalized. He gave his opinion on the jury but it was only another opinion by Allen. The jury did not agree with that statement by him or anyone else.imo

martin II

[William Anthony]

william

the more i read here the more i come to understand that some may not have been able to see the cross by the defense of Fung, Mazzolua (sp) Martz, the glove expert, and a few other prosecution witnesses as that is where the prosecution lost the case.

Some have blamed all of the below and more for the loss of the criminal case.

judge ito
majority black jury
M Clarke C Darden
lapd lab collecting activities mistakes
Lapd lab testing mistakes
Furhman
lapd mistakes.
prosecution experts/witnesses mistakes
The evil defense dream team.

The weak case has never been blamed to my knowledge and that is very sad.
imo
martin II

Martin,

You, Tv, and I have recently blamed it and I do think Kate did also. However, some say that the forensics was overwhelming and do not take a good look at the cross of a science that was in its infancy in criminal cases. Some blame the jury for dismissing it. I think the way it was presented and torn apart allowed it to be dismissed. Afterall, it is the jury's responsibility to assign weight to the evidence. I hope we can continue the discussion on the other thread.

[tv]

Dershowits made a lot of predicitons just before the case started on pbs Rose show.None materalized. He gave his opinion on the jury but it was only another opinion by Allen. The jury did not agree with that statement by him or anyone else.imo

martin IIHe made that statement after the trial, not before.

[tv]

Alan Dershowitz said it, which sinches it for me. :) Was he part of the jury? I think the discussion is interesting. Do you know how to pull up the other thread?No, I don't know how to pull up the thread. If you can do it, please do. I must run an errand but I'll be back. :)

[martin II]

He made that statement after the trial, not before.


I know when he made the jury statement. It was long after the trial and was made in a PBA interview which i have posted on this forum before.imo
April 12 2005 is the date of the interview.

martin II

[William Anthony]

No, I don't know how to pull up the thread. If you can do it, please do. I must run an errand but I'll be back. :)

I did not know either, so I started a new one.

[Jayme K]

I have never said that racism does not exist in all races and I, likewise, feel sorry for what happened to you and agree with your feelings. I was not seeking sympathy but acknowledging that those who participate in outrageous and violent conduct are not prone to apologies. I was simply relating an incident that happened to me in connection with a lack of an apology in connection with a poster's comment that Simpson did not apologize. This is not the only incident of racism that I suffered and I am sure Whites have suffered incidents. I think that Black men suffer more than others, although White women, who choose to become involved with Black men suffer quite a bit of racism. Conversely, White men and Black women do not appear to suffer as much. My point was that it is almost ridiculous to expect an apology in some situations. I have learned that an apology is not always forthcoming but welcomed when it happens.

Well well, I think we've actually found a common ground. You know, you might not have been seeking sympathy, but I feel it for you anyway. I don't imagine that it's any type of fun to have to live your life knowing that in some cases you'll always be stereotyped.

And yep, you're right that in some cases it's ridiculous to expect an apology and this would be one; mostly because I really believe that O.J. doesn't think any of the things that he does are wrong and that's my biggest beef with him. So he was aquitted of a crime I think he committed - I can live with that - but the ongoing series of events he's chosen to involve himself in without acknowledging the wrongness really hacks me off.

[WarmNCozy]

I remain convinced that a person deserves to be presumed, even labled, innocent until proven guilty. In a trial, the burden of proof is divided into the burden of production and the burden of persuassion. Judging from what I saw of the criminal trial, it was one that never shoud have been .

I agree! The only people who lost in this trail were the taxpayers for the Prosecution of OJ, and OJ for having to pay for his defense!

But the trial and the subsequent verdict, brought out a nationwide outpouring of emotions between blacks and whites!

OJ and Nicole's relationship was for the most part, behind closed doors! How did this bandwagon of blacks vs whites; guilty vs innocent commence into this recent faux pas of the part of OJ bring us back 12 years to the murders of Nicole and Ron?

OJ was a very giving person: he took care of all the Browns financial needs, even set up Nicole's father in business. He pretty much paid monetarily for everyone's happiness, including both of his wives and all his children, not only with his two children with Nicole!

Myself, I found him innocent in the murders!

This latest incident with his possessions, and his "friend" taping the altercation, let's just say this, another person gets a piece of OJ and makes money!

[tv]

Well well, I think we've actually found a common ground. You know, you might not have been seeking sympathy, but I feel it for you anyway. I don't imagine that it's any type of fun to have to live your life knowing that in some cases you'll always be stereotyped.

And yep, you're right that in some cases it's ridiculous to expect an apology and this would be one; mostly because I really believe that O.J. doesn't think any of the things that he does are wrong and that's my biggest beef with him. So he was aquitted of a crime I think he committed - I can live with that - but the ongoing series of events he's chosen to involve himself in without acknowledging the wrongness really hacks me off.Good post! I'm in total agreement with you. :)

[tv]

I agree! The only people who lost in this trail were the taxpayers for the Prosecution of OJ, and OJ for having to pay for his defense!

But the trial and the subsequent verdict, brought out a nationwide outpouring of emotions between blacks and whites!

OJ and Nicole's relationship was for the most part, behind closed doors! How did this bandwagon of blacks vs whites; guilty vs innocent commence into this recent faux pas of the part of OJ bring us back 12 years to the murders of Nicole and Ron?

OJ was a very giving person: he took care of all the Browns financial needs, even set up Nicole's father in business. He pretty much paid monetarily for everyone's happiness, including both of his wives and all his children, not only with his two children with Nicole!

Myself, I found him innocent in the murders!

This latest incident with his possessions, and his "friend" taping the altercation, let's just say this, another person gets a piece of OJ and makes money!Happiness cannot be bought. I think OJ Simpson should have realized that by now. I agree he was a fairly generous man but his generosity often came with strings attached. One example is that he pulled the plug on helping the Brown family when Nicole was done with him which shows that he wasn't helping them just to be kind but to exert control.

[William Anthony]

Well well, I think we've actually found a common ground. You know, you might not have been seeking sympathy, but I feel it for you anyway. I don't imagine that it's any type of fun to have to live your life knowing that in some cases you'll always be stereotyped.

And yep, you're right that in some cases it's ridiculous to expect an apology and this would be one; mostly because I really believe that O.J. doesn't think any of the things that he does are wrong and that's my biggest beef with him. So he was aquitted of a crime I think he committed - I can live with that - but the ongoing series of events he's chosen to involve himself in without acknowledging the wrongness really hacks me off.

Common ground is not hard to find. The difficulty comes in a willingness to share it. I do not consider being streotyped as a problem for me. It is a problem for those who engage in it, imho.

I would not apologize for taking what I believe to be my property back from someone I believe stole it. Perhaps, if others had learned to live with the acquittal, despite their personal feelings, Simpson may not have acted in the way he has, or maybe he would have. It is just something to consider. I think that society and the law owe higher reciprocal duties to each other.

[William Anthony]

I agree! The only people who lost in this trail were the taxpayers for the Prosecution of OJ, and OJ for having to pay for his defense!

But the trial and the subsequent verdict, brought out a nationwide outpouring of emotions between blacks and whites!

OJ and Nicole's relationship was for the most part, behind closed doors! How did this bandwagon of blacks vs whites; guilty vs innocent commence into this recent faux pas of the part of OJ bring us back 12 years to the murders of Nicole and Ron?

OJ was a very giving person: he took care of all the Browns financial needs, even set up Nicole's father in business. He pretty much paid monetarily for everyone's happiness, including both of his wives and all his children, not only with his two children with Nicole!

Myself, I found him innocent in the murders!

This latest incident with his possessions, and his "friend" taping the altercation, let's just say this, another person gets a piece of OJ and makes money!

I think that we have reached a common ground as when I attempt to type trial, I type trail.:) His acquittal for the murders of Ron and Nicole remains a thorn in the side for MOST OF AMERICA. This is why we remain locked in a discourse about guilt and innocence and America's history on social, judicial, political, and financial disparity between Blacks and Whites keeps the controversy alive.

I do not know whether or not he is innocent ( in the non legal sense) but I do know he is not guilty.

[William Anthony]

Happiness cannot be bought. I think OJ Simpson should have realized that by now. I agree he was a fairly generous man but his generosity often came with strings attached. One example is that he pulled the plug on helping the Brown family when Nicole was done with him which shows that he wasn't helping them just to be kind but to exert control.

Tv,

I have often heard that happiness cannot be bought. However, I am willing to test that premise, if you have any money to throw my way, :). Seriously, I do believe that money is used as a means to control, but, when a person, not including a wife or immediate family, accepts that money, then there is a obligation they incur, if nothing more than acknowlegement, thanks and respect.

[tv]

I think that there would be tremendous happiness by some should he decide to commit suicide in the future. However, had he followed through 13 years ago, we would not be in this lively discussion now.:) I think that, perhaps, we should try to pull up the thread on the criminal trial in order to continue our discussion, as I think we may be slightly OT.I don't want to stay off-topic but I wanted to respond to this.

I'm not one of those people that would be happy at his death. I think he's guilty of the murders but there are no winners in this case no matter what happens. It's been tragic from the beginning for everyone concerned. Even OJ Simpson himself, though he prevailed in the criminal trial, lost out. His life is essentially a shadow of what it could have and would have been if this hadn't happened.

[William Anthony]

I don't want to stay off-topic but I wanted to respond to this.

I'm not one of those people that would be happy at his death. I think he's guilty of the murders but there are no winners in this case no matter what happens. It's been tragic from the beginning for everyone concerned. Even OJ Simpson himself, though he prevailed in the criminal trial, lost out. His life is essentially a shadow of what it could have and would have been if this hadn't happened.

Tv,

I will run the risk of being OT, because I feel that kind, generous, compassionate and civil posts need to be acknowledged and admired.

[WarmNCozy]

Tv,

I will run the risk of being OT, because I feel that kind, generous, compassionate and civil posts need to be acknowledged and admired.

Pointing the generous, compassionate and civil posts out will speak for themselves! Hatred, and vile posts will speak for themselves!

[tv]

Tv,

I will run the risk of being OT, because I feel that kind, generous, compassionate and civil posts need to be acknowledged and admired.Thank you. :)

[martin II]

I don't want to stay off-topic but I wanted to respond to this.

I'm not one of those people that would be happy at his death. I think he's guilty of the murders but there are no winners in this case no matter what happens. It's been tragic from the beginning for everyone concerned. Even OJ Simpson himself, though he prevailed in the criminal trial, lost out. His life is essentially a shadow of what it could have and would have been if this hadn't happened.

We are in agreement.

martin II

[tv]

We are in agreement.

martin IIThis might be a first. :) I think I hear h*ll freezing over. ;)

[martin II]

Happiness cannot be bought. I think OJ Simpson should have realized that by now. I agree he was a fairly generous man but his generosity often came with strings attached. One example is that he pulled the plug on helping the Brown family when Nicole was done with him which shows that he wasn't helping them just to be kind but to exert control.


tv

oJ used his influence and money to get lou brown a Hertz franchise which was expensive and which lou would not have been able to secure if not for oj
giving the required support. He paid for college for Nicoles sister and gave Lou
Brown $350,000 to prevent him from loosing his house.To date oj has not called in lou's note on this loan. Basically it seems he has let lou have the money (fred sued lou to force him to pay him,fred, the loan but the court denied his request)
He gave lou $10,000 per month for his kids care when oj was in jail.

What else would one expect oj to do after that. He did not just look for a stranger to give his money to. He did this because of his involvement with their daughter. These freebies ended when he was no longer involved with her.After all it was nicole that told him, i guess in anger,you are no longer a part of my family.

imo
martin II

[martin II]

;) This might be a first. :) I think I hear h*ll freezing over. ;)

tv
i am not sure of that. Initially as i remember, your first post were not as, should i say what they seem to be now days.It seem that somewhere along the way there was some kind of transformation.That may or may not be correct but that is how it has seemed to me. ;) ;)
martin II

[tv]

tv

oJ used his influence and money to get lou brown a Hertz franchise which was expensive and which lou would not have been able to secure if not for oj
giving the required support. He paid for college for Nicoles sister and gave Lou
Brown $350,000 to prevent him from loosing his house.To date oj has not called in lou's note on this loan. Basically it seems he has let lou have the money (fred sued lou to force him to pay him,fred, the loan but the court denied his request)
He gave lou $10,000 per month for his kids care when oj was in jail.

What else would one expect oj to do after that. He did not just look for a stranger to give his money to. He did this because of his involvement with their daughter. These freebies ended when he was no longer involved with her.After all it was nicole that told him, i guess in anger,you are no longer a part of my family.

imo
martin III understand and agree that Simpson was financially generous with Nicole's family. I felt like he was somewhat cold-hearted in the way he yanked it away when he and Nicole were finished. However, it was his money to do with as he wished. The $10,000 a month sounds fair to support his children. I think he would have tried to get the money back from Lou Brown but he probably knew that Lou Brown didn't have it and if he did have it Fred Goldman may have taken it away, IMO only. I felt sorry for Nicole when I read that she wanted to leave Simpson at one time and went to her parents. They disapproved so she stayed with him. I don't know if their financial obligations to him had anything to do with it but it does make me wonder.

I have to agree that while he was generous with his family he didn't give to strangers. It's well known that he seldom donated to charity or became personally involved with charitable organizations.

[martin II]

I understand and agree that Simpson was financially generous with Nicole's family. I felt like he was somewhat cold-hearted in the way he yanked it away when he and Nicole were finished. However, it was his money to do with as he wished. The $10,000 a month sounds fair to support his children. I think he would have tried to get the money back from Lou Brown but he probably knew that Lou Brown didn't have it and if he did have it Fred Goldman may have taken it away, IMO only. I felt sorry for Nicole when I read that she wanted to leave Simpson at one time and went to her parents. They disapproved so she stayed with him. I don't know if their financial obligations to him had anything to do with it but it does make me wonder.

I have to agree that while he was generous with his family he didn't give to strangers. It's well known that he seldom donated to charity or became personally involved with charitable organizations.


On the night of june 11 oj was one of the featured guest at a jewish charity
that he was involved with that raised a large sum of money. He also regurarly gave to youth organization in san Francisco his birth city. I am not sure it is correct to say he did not give to charity. What i know is that he was one of the leaders that forced the NFL to establish the first retirement program for ex players and thousands now benefit from his efforts.

The loan oj gave to lou to save his home was made long before Nicole was murdered and the civil trial. There was ample time for oj to call in the note if that had been his intention so i don't think it is fair to say he would have tried to get the money if not for fred. Lou was in a jam and oj resolved the problem for him. Many of his friends have commented on how generous he was to them. He was not known to be a cheapie at all.imo
martin II



imo
martin II

[martin II]

william

Mr beasley a mental case.
very interesting

martin II


In a TSG interview, Rogers recalled that Beardsley thought that the newsman was involved in a plot with Simpson and Burbank politicians to harm or kill him. He also said Beardsley--whose car had "BILLS32" vanity license plates--claimed after his arrest that Rogers had waved a gun at him during one of the road confrontations.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2007/0924071beardsley1.html?link=rssfeed

[tv]

On the night of june 11 oj was one of the featured guest at a jewish charity
that he was involved with that raised a large sum of money. He also regurarly gave to youth organization in san Francisco his birth city. I am not sure it is correct to say he did not give to charity. What i know is that he was one of the leaders that forced the NFL to establish the first retirement program for ex players and thousands now benefit from his efforts.

The loan oj gave to lou to save his home was made long before Nicole was murdered and the civil trial. There was ample time for oj to call in the note if that had been his intention so i don't think it is fair to say he would have tried to get the money if not for fred. Lou was in a jam and oj resolved the problem for him. Many of his friends have commented on how generous he was to them. He was not known to be a cheapie at all.imo
martin II



imo
martin III acknowledged he was generous with friends and family. He was not so generous with charities. Jim Brown, the great former running back, stated that OJ Simpson didn't have a presence, in personal time or money, in the black community. I'm sure he showed up here and there at charity events but it certainly wasn't a priority with him. The only charity that Johnny Cochran mentioned that he was involved with was Arnelle's sorority.

I also said that IMO one of the reasons that Simpson didn't try to get the money back from Lou Brown is that he knew he didn't have it. He could be generous but he also used money for control. That's why Kato was living with him. He gave Kato a place to live to keep him from living at Nicole's.

[martin II]

william

Mr beasley a mental case.
very interesting

martin II


In a TSG interview, Rogers recalled that Beardsley thought that the newsman was involved in a plot with Simpson and Burbank politicians to harm or kill him. He also said Beardsley--whose car had "BILLS32" vanity license plates--claimed after his arrest that Rogers had waved a gun at him during one of the road confrontations.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2007/0924071beardsley1.html?link=rssfeed

More on victin beasley

TSG has previously reported on Beardsley's criminal record, which includes a 2004 felony stalking conviction, prison time, and several restraining orders. But an incident in early-2000 may prove key to attacking the accuser's credibility in the Simpson case.

In January of that year, Beardsley was arrested on a pair of misdemeanor assault charges for trying to run another driver off the road. The fellow motorist was journalist Will Rogers, who had just written a story in California's Burbank Leader newspaper about Beardsley's purported plan to run for city council. The story, which was skeptical about the wannabe candidate's political future, apparently set off the erratic Beardsley, who would later admit to using his hulking frame (6' 6" and 270 pounds) to intimidate people.

In a sworn affidavit filed along with a restraining order application, Rogers detailed his interactions with the bizarre Beardsley. In an interview preceding the Leader story, Beardsley told Rogers that he was being harassed by Burbank's police, its city manager, and Mayor Stacey Murphy, whom, Beardsley claimed, was stalking him and "spreading false rumors that they are having an intimate personal relationship."

Beardsley also explained that he "hears voices" urging him to become mayor immediately, "to win control of the Burbank Police Department," according to Rogers's affidavit. And city residents, Beardsley claimed, "communicate with him by various signals, letting him know what they want him to do based upon their actions."

[martin II]

warmncozy
This beasley guy is one that may have to testify against oj for the prosecution in the nevada case.

martin II

[martin II]

I acknowledged he was generous with friends and family. He was not so generous with charities. Jim Brown, the great former running back, stated that OJ Simpson didn't have a presence, in personal time or money, in the black community. I'm sure he showed up here and there at charity events but it certainly wasn't a priority with him. The only charity that Johnny Cochran mentioned that he was involved with was Arnelle's sorority.

I also said that IMO one of the reasons that Simpson didn't try to get the money back from Lou Brown is that he knew he didn't have it. He could be generous but he also used money for control. That's why Kato was living with him. He gave Kato a place to live to keep him from living at Nicole's.

When jc moved to new york he did lots of pro bono work and was a regular on the new york charity circuit so i hope you are saying jc did not give money and time away.

if oj had wanted the loan paid by lou it mattered not that lou may or may not have had it. Oj could have easily moved against lou's assets mainly the house
but he didn't.

at that time oj had net worth of about $10,000,000. $350,000 was nothing
to give to the father of his wife to keep him from loosing him home.lou, his wife their two daughters and their children were still living there. Fred tried to get the courts to make oj give him the note so he could make demand on lou. which is another reason for the static between the two famalies. His efforts failed.
I have never read anything about oj pressuring lou as a result of the note so i am not sure it is accurate to say he only gave money to control.BWTH.
martin II

[martin II]

tv

it may be that you do not know or forgot about the foundation that oj helped fund for children with cancer. It was discussed on the today show NBC.
imo
martin II

[tv]

When jc moved to new york he did lots of pro bono work and was a regular on the new york charity circuit so i hope you are saying jc did not give money and time away.

if oj had wanted the loan paid by lou it mattered not that lou may or may not have had it. Oj could have easily moved against lou's assets mainly the house
but he didn't.

at that time oj had net worth of about $10,000,000. $350,000 was nothing
to give to the father of his wife to keep him from loosing him home.lou, his wife their two daughters and their children were still living there. Fred tried to get the courts to make oj give him the note so he could make demand on lou. which is another reason for the static between the two famalies. His efforts failed.
I have never read anything about oj pressuring lou as a result of the note so i am not sure it is accurate to say he only gave money to control.BWTH.
martin IIFirst of all, you know very well that I was talking about OJ Simpson's charitable contributions, not Johnny Cochran's. If you want to play these word games then I'll play. According to your post, you're saying that Johnny Cochran did not give time and money away. See how that works?

[tv]

tv

it may be that you do not know or forgot about the foundation that oj helped fund for children with cancer. It was discussed on the today show NBC.
imo
martin III believe that was in 2000. Did he become involved in this before or after the murders?

[martin II]

First of all, you know very well that I was talking about OJ Simpson's charitable contributions, not Johnny Cochran's. If you want to play these word games then I'll play. According to your post, you're saying that Johnny Cochran did not give time and money away. See how that works?

It was not clear to me as i did not believe jc would have said that about oj knowing he had done more.

I know jc gave money and time to charity.

martin II

[martin II]

I believe that was in 2000. Did he become involved in this before or after the murders?

tv
I don't know when the charity was established but for me it does not matter.
You seemed to be saying oj did not get involved in charity and i thought you may be interested in this info
martin II

[martin II]

tv

i love jim brown and know him personally for some time. One would have to know jim and the long relationship between jim and oj to understand why jim MAY have made that statement. IF he said it i would not take it as a put down of oj. It is just the way it has been with them. Actually no one does enough for jim and that is ok as he is a great motivator of people.:)

Some people give to charity publically and receive public praise for their charity. Others give more privately but they still give. i have never heard any complaint from any front line black organizations that oj did not contribute as most other do.imo

charity
I am not sure this has much to do with the fact that oj gave great support to nicoles family to help them get ahead and improve their financial position.

Oj was out of a relationship with nicole and both were moving on with their lives, are you saying that he is a bad guy for not continuning to give the Browns his money? When/what exactly are you refering to when you say oj dropped his support or something for the browns?

martin II

[martin II]

The words "happens frequently" come up alot with you when you defend O.J. Simpson.

Is it okay to abuse children in your eyes too because of the fact that it "happens frequently"?

God.

Jayme
Your statement that i believe it is ok to abuse children is not correct as i have not said that. What i did say is that teenagers often become angry when they do not get their way with their parents. Most parents that have raised children know this. imo. In this case le came to oj's house and investigated the phone call and found no abuse had taken place. There was no additional calls by his daughter.imo
martin II

[martin II]

I believe that was in 2000. Did he become involved in this before or after the murders?

tv
Oj was in jail for about 9 month during the criminal trial. After that he was waiting for and on trial in the civil case for some time. I would be my guess that he was involved before Nicole was murdered.
PS. oJ and Paula attended the 6/11 saturday Jewish charity event in LA.

IMO
martin II

[tv]

;)

tv
i am not sure of that. Initially as i remember, your first post were not as, should i say what they seem to be now days.It seem that somewhere along the way there was some kind of transformation.That may or may not be correct but that is how it has seemed to me. ;) ;)
martin III came to this board interested in talking in a way about OJ Simpson, the murders and all the events related. My posts have been subjected to nitpicking and ridicule by some people. I've been surprised at the victim bashing and twisting of facts. So, if you sense a transformation as you call it, you're probably right.

[tv]

tv

i love jim brown and know him personally for some time. One would have to know jim and the long relationship between jim and oj to understand why jim MAY have made that statement. IF he said it i would not take it as a put down of oj. It is just the way it has been with them. Actually no one does enough for jim and that is ok as he is a great motivator of people.:)

Some people give to charity publically and receive public praise for their charity. Others give more privately but they still give. i have never heard any complaint from any front line black organizations that oj did not contribute as most other do.imo

charity
I am not sure this has much to do with the fact that oj gave great support to nicoles family to help them get ahead and improve their financial position.

Oj was out of a relationship with nicole and both were moving on with their lives, are you saying that he is a bad guy for not continuning to give the Browns his money? When/what exactly are you refering to when you say oj dropped his support or something for the browns?

martin IIJim Brown said what he said. I don't know if there's anyway to distort that. I didn't say he was a bad guy for not continuing to give the Brown's money. I said it was his money to do with as he wished. You don't want to see that Simpson didn't have a presence in the community where he was looked up to as a hero and where he could have had a positive impact. It's impossible for you to admit that he has one single flaw. Subject closed for me.

[weezer]

Happiness cannot be bought. I think OJ Simpson should have realized that by now. I agree he was a fairly generous man but his generosity often came with strings attached. One example is that he pulled the plug on helping the Brown family when Nicole was done with him which shows that he wasn't helping them just to be kind but to exert control.

people like orenthal aren't buying happiness -- they're buying people, things, and control. imo

[weezer]

"Monday, October 1, 2007 - Page updated at 01:03 AM

Police reports chronicle Simpson's life since 2000
By Evan S. Benn

MIAMI — O.J. Simpson moved from California to South Florida to lay low, raise his kids, play golf. But his life here has been anything but placid.

Simpson and his on-again, off-again girlfriend Christie Prody have been named in at least 18 Miami-Dade County police reports since he arrived in 2000, according to records.

Only a couple of those incidents resulted in charges, and neither Simpson, 60, nor Prody, 32, has been sentenced to jail time.

That may change with the more serious charges Simpson now faces in Las Vegas. Later this month, the former football star is due in court there to formally respond to charges of kidnapping and robbery — felonies that could send him to prison for decades.

But the Miami-Dade police reports offer a glimpse of Simpson's life with Prody since retiring from his previous stints as football star, rental-car pitchman, comedic actor, sports commentator and murder defendant.

Prody, a Minnesota native and former Los Angeles waitress, met Simpson after he was acquitted of killing his former wife and her friend in 1995.

Police have been called to break up loud fights between the couple five times in the past seven years, records show.

Prody was ejected from a hotel near Miami International Airport in 2000 for kicking and slapping Simpson.

She shoved him again in 2005, and then slapped one of his friends, according to police reports. Prody also has accused Simpson of entering her home without permission, stealing pages from her address book and erasing her voice mails. Neither of them has ever filed charges against the other.

Attempts to contact Simpson were unsuccessful.

Only two of the Miami-Dade police reports resulted in charges: Simpson's so-called "Road Rage Case" from 2000 and Prody's arrest for marijuana possession at Thompson Park in Southwest Miami-Dade last year.

She paid a fine for the misdemeanor drug charge.

She also paid a fine for a city of Miami case in 2002 in which she pleaded no contest to animal cruelty after her cat was found dead from abandonment inside her apartment.

More recently, Simpson's handyman told Miami-Dade police on July 29 that Simpson came to his home and threatened him."

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2003915495_oj01.html

[weezer]

O.J. Simpson's items subject to a fickle market

LAS VEGAS: As public and media attention refocused on O.J. Simpson, Kathleen McCarthy of Maple Springs, New York, thought it might be time to make some money off an autographed book about the football Hall of Famer that her father had found years ago.

Yet more than a week has passed since she posted the 33-year-old paperback biography on eBay with a minimum charge of $150, and nobody has bid on it. McCarthy believed the timing was right to unload the book because Simpson has been accused of bursting into a Las Vegas hotel room to reclaim what he said was memorabilia stolen from him.

"I figured there must be a market for his stuff if they say he's stealing it," McCarthy said. "But maybe not."

http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/10/01/news/simpson.php

[weezer]

I know there's been lots of slamming of the guys who had the 'memorabilia' in the hotel room so I thought we should give equal billing to orenthal's 'posse':

Charles B. Ehrlich, 53, Sunny Isles Beach, Fla. Ehrlich, who surrendered to authorities Friday, has a criminal record in Florida. He agreed to a $60,000 fine last year from the SEC, which had accused him of acting as an unregistered broker-dealer in a penny-stock fraud scheme. It also ordered him to pay back a half-million dollars. In the Palace Station case, he has been released on $32,000 bail, a court official said.

Charles Howard Cashmore, described as a ‘‘nice kid’’ who worked at various Vegas casinos as a ‘‘high-roller concierge,’’ someone who took care of the needs of big-spending casino guests.

Michael F. McClinton, 49, Las Vegas. Police seized two handguns and an assault rifle from his home. He was booked into the Clark County Detention Center on $32,000 bail.

Clarence J. Stewart, 53, Las Vegas. Stewart turned over some of the memorabilia involved in the case. He is originally from Baton Rouge, La., where he pleaded guilty to a drug-related charge in the late ’80s. Stewart posted $78,000 bail the day of his arrest.

[martin II]

Jim Brown said what he said. I don't know if there's anyway to distort that. I didn't say he was a bad guy for not continuing to give the Brown's money. I said it was his money to do with as he wished. You don't want to see that Simpson didn't have a presence in the community where he was looked up to as a hero and where he could have had a positive impact. It's impossible for you to admit that he has one single flaw. Subject closed for me.

tv

In most cases some people can do more than they do.There are more than one way that a person could contribute to the black community then and now.Remember oj was one of the first large wave of blacks accepted into the NFL. There was no sucg thing as a black NFL quarterback and only or two employed in management if any. OJ was a great motivation and role model for many young black players dreaming of being another oJ Simpson. I consider that to be a contribution to the overall advancement of black in the NFL in addition to his charity work and contributions to black organizations.

Oj had flaws like most of us as he was not perfect. I just don't agree that he was the out of control demon that some seem to think he was.imo

At first you stated that he did not give to strangers. Now i know that is not true and hopefully so do you.
imo
martin II

[martin II]

I know there's been lots of slamming of the guys who had the 'memorabilia' in the hotel room so I thought we should give equal billing to orenthal's 'posse':

Charles B. Ehrlich, 53, Sunny Isles Beach, Fla. Ehrlich, who surrendered to authorities Friday, has a criminal record in Florida. He agreed to a $60,000 fine last year from the SEC, which had accused him of acting as an unregistered broker-dealer in a penny-stock fraud scheme. It also ordered him to pay back a half-million dollars. In the Palace Station case, he has been released on $32,000 bail, a court official said.

Charles Howard Cashmore, described as a ‘‘nice kid’’ who worked at various Vegas casinos as a ‘‘high-roller concierge,’’ someone who took care of the needs of big-spending casino guests.

Michael F. McClinton, 49, Las Vegas. Police seized two handguns and an assault rifle from his home. He was booked into the Clark County Detention Center on $32,000 bail.

Clarence J. Stewart, 53, Las Vegas. Stewart turned over some of the memorabilia involved in the case. He is originally from Baton Rouge, La., where he pleaded guilty to a drug-related charge in the late ’80s. Stewart posted $78,000 bail the day of his arrest.

All of this has been posted and made available on many media sites.
imo
martin II

[tv]

[QUOTE=martin II;9005123]tv

In most cases some people can do more than they do.There are more than one way that a person could contribute to the black community then and now.Remember oj was one of the first large wave of blacks accepted into the NFL. There was no sucg thing as a black NFL quarterback and only or two employed in management if any. OJ was a great motivation and role model for many young black players dreaming of being another oJ Simpson. I consider that to be a contribution to the overall advancement of black in the NFL in addition to his charity work and contributions to black organizations.

Oj had flaws like most of us as he was not perfect. I just don't agree that he was the out of control demon that some seem to think he was.imo

At first you stated that he did not give to strangers. Now i know that is not true and hopefully so do you.
imo
martin II[/QUOTEjI'm not going to continue to argue this with you. Let's play the link game -- do you have links to the charities he was involved in before the murders?

[tv]

I know there's been lots of slamming of the guys who had the 'memorabilia' in the hotel room so I thought we should give equal billing to orenthal's 'posse': *snip* Thanks, weezer. Very interesting. :)

[WarmNCozy]

How can you possibly talk to people who want to convict a man acquitted almost 13 years ago. And relate current issues on the past?

It numbs my brain trying to think about it!!!!!!!

[tv]

How can you possible talk to people who want to convict a man acquitted almost 13 years ago. And relate current issues on the past?

It's numbs my brain trying to think about it!!!!!!!

I don't know who you're referring to as wanting to convict Simpson now for something he did 13 years ago. I consider the two incidents completely separate and have stated so in this forum.

If your brain is numb maybe it's your sign to stop thinking about it. :)

[socaldiva]

How can you possibly talk to people who want to convict a man acquitted almost 13 years ago. And relate current issues on the past?

It numbs my brain trying to think about it!!!!!!!

I have yet to see anyone here post that Orenthal should be convicted of these current charges because of the murders he committed :confused: I think the general consensus is that he should be held accountable for these crimes, if indeed he did he has been charged with. Nothing mind numbing about that :shrug:

[martin II]

I don't know who you're referring to as wanting to convict Simpson now for something he did 13 years ago. I consider the two incidents completely separate and have stated so in this forum.

If your brain is numb maybe it's your sign to stop thinking about it. :)

tv

I believe that some poster when discussing the current Nevada case have reverted back to the abuse charges against oj in the criminal trial to declare
that oj was violent in the current case.I also think that the media and others
posting old issues from the past case and oj's old history NOW can have the effect of poisining the curreny jury pool.

I wonder what the nagative stories and post on Purdy's 20002 history has to do with the current Nevada case.It is what some call the BASHING of Purdy.

imo
martin II

[socaldiva]

*snip*
I wonder what the nagative stories and post on Purdy's 20002 history has to do with the current Nevada case.It is what some call the BASHING of Purdy.

imo
martin II

You're the poster that is over on the Othellean Syndrome thread cheering a poster digging into Ron Goldman's traffic history from 14 plus years ago. What's up with that? Isn't that "bashing" according to your post here?

[Kate Sachel]

Common ground is not hard to find. The difficulty comes in a willingness to share it. I do not consider being streotyped as a problem for me. It is a problem for those who engage in it, imho.

I would not apologize for taking what I believe to be my property back from someone I believe stole it. Perhaps, if others had learned to live with the acquittal, despite their personal feelings, Simpson may not have acted in the way he has, or maybe he would have. It is just something to consider. I think that society and the law owe higher reciprocal duties to each other.

I have to disagree here, I don't think that you should allow someone to hide their inappropriate actions behind a wall of blaming another person or society as a whole. I don't believe it's something that should even be considered, in fact I find it dangerous to consider such a thing.

If no one had to be accountable for their actions we'd have nothing but madness on our hands. I firmly believe that a large part of the issues I see with a younger generation is a solid lack of an understanding of personal responsibility and it concerns me greatly.

Kate

[Kate Sachel]

How can you possibly talk to people who want to convict a man acquitted almost 13 years ago. And relate current issues on the past?

It numbs my brain trying to think about it!!!!!!!

This is where you're clearly missing the boat. The only issues being related to the past are those that speak to his personal character, which is necessary to evaluate when considering whether or not you believe he's the type of individual who is capable of these current charges.

Quite frankly I find it equally difficult to talk to someone who seems to believe that because he was aquitted of a different crime thirteen years ago seems to mean that he couldn't possibly be guilty of the current charges brought against him.

Kate

[Kate Sachel]

In most cases some people can do more than they do.There are more than one way that a person could contribute to the black community then and now.Remember oj was one of the first large wave of blacks accepted into the NFL. There was no sucg thing as a black NFL quarterback and only or two employed in management if any. OJ was a great motivation and role model for many young black players dreaming of being another oJ Simpson.


I do agree with this portion of the posting.

Although no one wants to be another OJ anymore; unless they aspire to be a killer I suppose.

Kate

[martin II]

william
i believe there is a good reason why courts do not allow past behavior to enter into a new trial unless the defense "opens that door first"

martin II

[martin II]

How can you possibly talk to people who want to convict a man acquitted almost 13 years ago. And relate current issues on the past?

It numbs my brain trying to think about it!!!!!!!

warmncozy

I agree that it complicates the issues on a current case if people continue to talk about what they believe was abuse and claim that this proves to them that oj was violent in that hotel room.
martin II

[weezer]

Snipped* ". . .I agree that it complicates the issues on a current case if people continue to talk about what they believe was abuse. . ."

guess you've forgotten the pictures of Nicole's face, the description of violence by orenthal Nicole wrote about in her diary, Nicole's voice on the 911 call, orenthal ranting and raving and breaking down doors during the Gretna Green incident, Sydney's voice on her 911 call, orenthal's road rage incident, orenthal's and girlfriend's fights, orenthal ranting and raving on the Vegas tape -- geez martin, some of us believe he has a huge propensity toward violence and abuse. imo

[martin II]

guess you've forgotten the pictures of Nicole's face, the description of violence by orenthal Nicole wrote about in her diary, Nicole's voice on the 911 call, orenthal ranting and raving and breaking down doors during the Gretna Green incident, Sydney's voice on her 911 call, orenthal's road rage incident, orenthal's and girlfriend's fights, orenthal ranting and raving on the Vegas tape -- geez martin, some of us believe he has a huge propensity toward violence and abuse. imo

weezer

you have just confirmed what the poster was pointing out. Discussing the current case by trying to influence others with claims from the case 13 years ago.imo

martinII

[martin II]

When oj was the big time star at USC many young black and white
high school players were motivated to finish school and do the same. Same was true of college players when oj was the big time NFL star.

This contribution cannot be measured in terms of dollars and cents unleas one wants to calculate the money Oj made for usc as their most famous drawing card for satudray games without pay.

Now we know that it is not true that oj never gave to strangers.

martin II

[tv]

When oj was the big time star at USC many young black and white
high school players were motivated to finish school and do the same. Same was true of college players when oj was the big time NFL star.

This contribution cannot be measured in terms of dollars and cents unleas one wants to calculate the money Oj made for usc as their most famous drawing card for satudray games without pay.

Now we know that it is not true that oj never gave to strangers.

martin IImartin, I agree he was at one time a role model for young people. I was well aware of OJ Simpson when he was a football star. I don't disagree with what you've said but that's not what I'm talking about.

I specifically meant he did not contribute time or money to the community. I then asked you for a link to the charities you claim he was involved in before the murders. You have failed to provide the proof to back up your statements. What he did at USC was receive an education is return for his playing football. That was not a charitable contribution.

[weezer]

Evidence Hearing In O.J. Simpson Case To Be Postponed To November

There won't be a preliminary hearing this week in the O.J. Simpson armed robbery case after all.

Prosecutors and defense lawyers are agreeing to push back the date for the evidentiary hearing to November 8th and 9th.

A Las Vegas judge is expected to make the move official on Thursday.

That's the date originally set for a preliminary hearing for two co-defendants in the case.

Simpson and most of the other defendants WON'T have to attend.

Prosecutors accuse the aging football star and five other men of robbing two sports memorabilia dealers at gunpoint in a Las Vegas hotel room on September 13th.

http://www.kolotv.com/home/headlines/10179581.html

[martin II]

martin, I agree he was at one time a role model for young people. I was well aware of OJ Simpson when he was a football star. I don't disagree with what you've said but that's not what I'm talking about.

I specifically meant he did not contribute time or money to the community. I then asked you for a link to the charities you claim he was involved in before the murders. You have failed to provide the proof to back up your statements. What he did at USC was receive an education is return for his playing football. That was not a charitable contribution.

tv
i am not sure i saw a request for a link from you about oj's gift to charity.

However i do know that you never gave links to the following claims made by you;

1. To the statement you claim Jim Browns made about OJ
2. Your claim that oj never gave to strangers.

imo
martin II

[weezer]

LOL -- guess we can assume there aren't any links to the charities orenthal contributed to! LOL

[socaldiva]

LOL -- guess we can assume there aren't any links to the charities orenthal contributed to! LOL

Looks like there aren't any :D Martin wants you to provide a link that shows Orenthal didn't contribute to charities? That's funny. :tongue:

[Suzee10]

Judge to O.J.: Gimme Dat Watch!

Judge to O.J.: Gimme Dat Watch!
Posted Oct 2nd 2007 1:54PM by TMZ Staff
Filed under: Celebrity Justice, O.J.

A Los Angeles judge has ruled that the Juice must hand over a fancy Rolex to the Goldman family, after they saw him wearing it on TMZ. Time is up!

At a hearing today, the judge ruled Simpson must give the watch and other assets to satisfy a judgment that found him liable for the deaths of ex-wife Nicole Brown Simpson and her friend, Ron Goldman.

The judge also ruled that any future royalties from a sports video game that features #32, as well as any of the Las Vegas loot found to be legally his, be given to Fred Goldman, father of Ron.
*************

Looks like a lot more came out of the robbery than first expected. Fred is finally getting what he should have had all along. :D

[Suzee10]

Looks like there aren't any :D Martin wants you to provide a link that shows Orenthal didn't contribute to charities? That's funny. :tongue:


Hi socaldiva, You know this was done a very long time ago, trying to find anything simpson ever did for the black community, charities, etc. or for any charities. The only thing that was found then was where simpson had given some money to a club or whatever for Arnell while she was in college. That was it.

[WarmNCozy]

Snip>Quite frankly I find it equally difficult to talk to someone who seems to believe that because he was aquitted of a different crime thirteen years ago seems to mean that he couldn't possibly be guilty of the current charges brought against him. Kate

I wasn't talking about the current issues. I was talking about trying to convict OJ of charges that he was acquitted of 13 years ago!

What has that got to do with today?

[martin II]

Hi socaldiva, You know this was done a very long time ago, trying to find anything simpson ever did for the black community, charities, etc. or for any charities. The only thing that was found then was where simpson had given some money to a club or whatever for Arnell while she was in college. That was it.

tv
i am not sure that is correct.
yesterday i commented to you about a charity oj helped established for children with cancer.(Katie curic on NBC interview) You responded that this happened in 20002.From your comment i assumed that since you knew when the interview took place on that subject, that you were aware of oj's involvement in that charity.

I will look for that report again, but since you want a link maby you can give links to your statement that JIM Brown made a comment about oj and the black community as far as charity is concerned and your statement that "oj never gave to his community"

If you review criminal trial info you will find that oj took Paula to a Jewish charity on the night of 6/11 that oj was a honored guest and donations were for $25,000.00. I also mentioned to you that it was reported that oj had been responsible for contributions to youth programs in his home town comunity of san francisco and i believe this was before oj met nicole.

imo
martin II

[WarmNCozy]

tv
i am not sure that is correct.
yesterday i commented to you about a charity oj helped established for children with cancer.(Katie curic on NBC interview) You responded that this happened in 20002.From your comment i assumed that since you knew when the interview took place on that subject, that you were aware of oj's involvement in that charity.

I will look for that report again, but since you want a link maby you can give links to your statement that JIM Brown made a comment about oj and the black community as far as charity is concerned and your statement that "oj never gave to his community"

If you review criminal trial info you will find that oj took Paula to a Jewish charity on the night of 6/11 that oj was a honored guest and donations were for $25,000.00. I also mentioned to you that it was reported that oj had been responsible for contributions to youth programs in his home town comunity of san francisco and i believe this was before oj met nicole.

imo
martin II

I would like to know what the OJ haters have done for the black community whether you are black, white, yellow or red? ARG! http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff305/CozyNWarm/4.gif

[martin II]

What i do know is that during the time of oj's NFL football and movie career. It would have been unthinkable for any black celebrity, especially one of oj's success level to evade money donation to front line black organizations such as NAACP, Urban league, UNCF, Mlk and others. No way any black celebrity could escape that requirement.However, i can understand that you may not have known or understood that dynamic in the black community.

imo
martinii

[martin II]

I would like to know what the OJ haters have done for the black community whether you are black, white, yellow or red? ARG! http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff305/CozyNWarm/4.gif

warmncozy

Good question.

MARTIN ii

[martin II]

Judge to O.J.: Gimme Dat Watch!

Judge to O.J.: Gimme Dat Watch!
Posted Oct 2nd 2007 1:54PM by TMZ Staff
Filed under: Celebrity Justice, O.J.

A Los Angeles judge has ruled that the Juice must hand over a fancy Rolex to the Goldman family, after they saw him wearing it on TMZ. Time is up!

At a hearing today, the judge ruled Simpson must give the watch and other assets to satisfy a judgment that found him liable for the deaths of ex-wife Nicole Brown Simpson and her friend, Ron Goldman.

The judge also ruled that any future royalties from a sports video game that features #32, as well as any of the Las Vegas loot found to be legally his, be given to Fred Goldman, father of Ron.
*************

Looks like a lot more came out of the robbery than first expected. Fred is finally getting what he should have had all along. :D


What he may get is a $5.00 copy of a rolex.

martin II

[socaldiva]

I would like to know what the OJ haters have done for the black community whether you are black, white, yellow or red? ARG! http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff305/CozyNWarm/4.gif

Same question could be asked of the OJ lovers ;), but we aren't here to discuss posters are we? We are here to discuss Simpson.

[WarmNCozy]

What he may get is a $5.00 copy of a rolex.

martin II

I hope so! The man is innocent! Why should everything he is entitled to be stripped from him because of a civil trial! This makes no sense to me!:shrug:

[Suzee10]

I would like to know what the OJ haters have done for the black community whether you are black, white, yellow or red? ARG! http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff305/CozyNWarm/4.gif


I can tell you one thing I do for children, black or white. I am a fundraiser for St. Jude Children's Research Hospital, located in Memphis Tn., founded by Danny Thomas. Every year I co-ordinate some type of fundraiser, whether it be a walk-a-thon, canisters, etc. Children from all over the country and world come to this hospital and benefit from the great research and care that is given there.

What do you do?

[socaldiva]

I can tell you one thing I do for children, black or white. I am a fundraiser for St. Jude Children's Research Hospital, located in Memphis Tn., founded by Danny Thomas. Every year I co-ordinate some type of fundraiser, whether it be a walk-a-thon, canisters, etc. Children from all over the country and world come to this hospital and benefit from the great research and care that is given there.

What do you do?

Good for you Suzee! :beer:

I've already mentioned what I do & was mocked for it multiple times by Martin. I posted that I volunteered for LAPD's Youth At Risk Program & also at a battered women's shelter. Martin twisted that into me being a battered woman myself & a "cop wannabe". :rolleyes:

[WarmNCozy]

I can tell you one thing I do for children, black or white. I am a fundraiser for St. Jude Children's Research Hospital, located in Memphis Tn., founded by Danny Thomas. Every year I co-ordinate some type of fundraiser, whether it be a walk-a-thon, canisters, etc. Children from all over the country and world come to this hospital and benefit from the great research and care that is given there.

What do you do?

That is wonderful, Suzee. I admire you for that giving to those who most need it!

Since I work full time, the only thing I can physically get involved in is Big Sisters/Little Sisters. I also give financially to a dozen local endeavors to help those in the community that I live in to have a better life ... a chance at something better! The child I am now Big Sister to is American Indian, mother addicted to meth, father is long gone! She is like my own child! I hope our time together will give her hope that she can be whatever she aspires to! I am teaching her piano, golf, we spend hours discussing books! And we cook together! She is audacious!

[tv]

tv
i am not sure that is correct.
yesterday i commented to you about a charity oj helped established for children with cancer.(Katie curic on NBC interview) You responded that this happened in 20002.From your comment i assumed that since you knew when the interview took place on that subject, that you were aware of oj's involvement in that charity.

I will look for that report again, but since you want a link maby you can give links to your statement that JIM Brown made a comment about oj and the black community as far as charity is concerned and your statement that "oj never gave to his community"

If you review criminal trial info you will find that oj took Paula to a Jewish charity on the night of 6/11 that oj was a honored guest and donations were for $25,000.00. I also mentioned to you that it was reported that oj had been responsible for contributions to youth programs in his home town comunity of san francisco and i believe this was before oj met nicole.

imo
martin II

OUTRAGE: The Five Reasons OJ Simpson Got Away With Murder -- by Vincent Bugliosi, page 146:

When Jim Brown called upon his return from back east and I asked him if he had ever called Simpson to help him out with his efforts in the black community, Big Jim chuckled and and said "I'm like Celes" --I had earlier repeated to him Cele's remark that you don't ask useless questions. Brown added "I don't ask people I know aren't going to help." When I asked Brown for an assessment of Simpson, he said: "OJ is the modern representation of the house Negro," who, he said dressed well and lived much better than the plantation workers. "OJ is not unique," he said, explaining that many blacks who have made it are like him. He lives a life, Brown said, below whites [his white country-club contemporaries] but above blacks".

Brown, who keeps very current on what's going on in the black community, said that throughout the years, "there was no evidence of OJ in the black community,". He added that this neglect was "not mean-spirited on OJ's part." It was just that Simpson had left the community behind and it was no longer a part of his life.

So there you go, martin, quotes from Jim Brown, a man you say you love. Are you going to accept what he said or trash him also in favor of OJ Simpson? By the way, here is what Celes King said if you're interested:

OUTRAGE: The Five Reasons OJ Simpson Got Away With Murder by Vincent Bugliosit...page 145:

"...I got in touch with Celes King, the California state chairman of the Congress of Racial Equality (CORE) and for over forty years a well-known black activist. I had spoken to him a few times in the early 1970's. When I asked him if Simpson had ever helped his group, Celes said no.

"Celes, did you ever ask him?"
"You learn not to ask useless questions, " Celes said.
"Are you saying Simpson never helped the black community?"
"The only group I'm aware he's ever helped out is a black sorority his daughter Arnelle, is a member of, the Angel City Link. And she drags OJ to some of their functions. You know, like when children drag their parents to the park on weekends."

There is more where that came from. :)

[socaldiva]

Just for edification, so someone doesn't think I volunteer to fill empty time, I work full time & am also raising a family.

[WarmNCozy]

Just for edification, so someone doesn't think I volunteer to fill empty time, I work full time & am also raising a family.

Raising a family, working full time is more than most people can handle. That you find time to volunteer is admirable!

[socaldiva]

Raising a family, working full time is more than most people can handle. That you find time to volunteer is admirable!

Thank you. Even though it's tiring I squeeze it in because I think it's important. I think your volunteer work is admirable as well. I'm sure your Little Sister finds your efforts towards her very valuable.

[Suzee10]

Good for you Suzee! :beer:

I've already mentioned what I do & was mocked for it multiple times by Martin. I posted that I volunteered for LAPD's Youth At Risk Program & also at a battered women's shelter. Martin twisted that into me being a battered woman myself & a "cop wannabe". :rolleyes:


That sounds like Martin. That is very good work you do also. Good for you! It is a shame all of these ng's are not putting more of their time on something trying to help people than trying to stick up for simpson.

I too, am with an organization promoting inner, world and domestic peace. In it I focus mainly domestic violence.

[WarmNCozy]

Thank you. Even though it's tiring I squeeze it in because I think it's important. I think your volunteer work is admirable as well. I'm sure your Little Sister finds your efforts towards her very valuable.

I don't think of it as an effort! I am caring, and sharing the things that I am good at and trying to bring out of her, things that she might be good at! Just exposing her to things other than the horrors she lived with!

[WarmNCozy]

That sounds like Martin. That is very good work you do also. Good for you! It is a shame all of these ng's are not putting more of their time on something trying to help people than trying to stick up for simpson.

I too, am with an organization promoting inner, world and domestic peace. In it I focus mainly domestic violence.

Domestic violence! Talk to me about it! When it is REAL, you don't call 911! You hide it! Like I did!

[martin II]

OUTRAGE: The Five Reasons OJ Simpson Got Away With Murder -- by Vincent Bugliosi, page 146:

When Jim Brown called upon his return from back east and I asked him if he had ever called Simpson to help him out with his efforts in the black community, Big Jim chuckled and and said "I'm like Celes" --I had earlier repeated to him Cele's remark that you don't ask useless questions. Brown added "I don't ask people I know aren't going to help." When I asked Brown for an assessment of Simpson, he said: "OJ is the modern representation of the house Negro," who, he said dressed well and lived much better than the plantation workers. "OJ is not unique," he said, explaining that many blacks who have made it are like him. He lives a life, Brown said, below whites [his white country-club contemporaries] but above blacks".

Brown, who keeps very current on what's going on in the black community, said that throughout the years, "there was no evidence of OJ in the black community,". He added that this neglect was "not mean-spirited on OJ's part." It was just that Simpson had left the community behind and it was no longer a part of his life.

So there you go, martin, quotes from Jim Brown, a man you say you love. Are you going to accept what he said or trash him also in favor of OJ Simpson? By the way, here is what Celes King said if you're interested:

OUTRAGE: The Five Reasons OJ Simpson Got Away With Murder by Vincent Bugliosit...page 145:

"...I got in touch with Celes King, the California state chairman of the Congress of Racial Equality (CORE) and for over forty years a well-known black activist. I had spoken to him a few times in the early 1970's. When I asked him if Simpson had ever helped his group, Celes said no.

"Celes, did you ever ask him?"
"You learn not to ask useless questions, " Celes said.
"Are you saying Simpson never helped the black community?"
"The only group I'm aware he's ever helped out is a black sorority his daughter Arnelle, is a member of, the Angel City Link. And she drags OJ to some of their functions. You know, like when children drag their parents to the park on weekends."

There is more where that came from. :)


tv
i love Jim Brown. Have known him for many years.was a coinvestor in "The Black Industrial Development organization and our company made many Dashikies for him. oj is not the first or the last to receive a knock or two from jim as he does speak his mind. Some times he has been on point and sometines not so on point but it does not matter as his overall work receives great approval from most blacks, whites and myself.

Oj like many other black celebraties come under some attack by many when they buy large houses in the most expensive communities where whites are the majority.

I have no specific information on what charities oj contributed to other than to Jewish charity, the foundation for cancer children, the SF youth group and what i have posted above here.

But in the end how much he gave to black charities as opossed to some others is his business and has nothing to do with the criminal,civil or current case.imo
What i do know is that when he was charged with killing nicole the black community gave him their support and the white comminity that had 'LOVED' him turned against him BEFORE ONE PIECE OF EVIDENCE was presented in court.

I am not willing to say oj lived a white lifestyle because he married a white woman and lived in a big house in a white community and became a multi millionair. Everyone tries to get out of the ghetto white and black.

I have not changed my opinion on black celebrities contributing to the front line black organizations and i include oj in that group.

As long as the black community gave their support to oj during the murder trialsl, i fail to uinderstand why his involvement with that community is of concern to you.

IMO

MARTINII

[TobyTiger]

Actually time of legal marriage is very short, although were together better than a decade. Lots of people here feel he is guilty. I've got a real problem with the time frame, it really doesn't fit well. Common sense says he did it, and the same common sense should know the time frame is not only tight but odd.
I must agree that the time-frame is very tight considering no weapon or bloody clothes (worn by the killer) were found, nor was enough blood found in the Bronco to indicate someone wearing blood-stained clothing had been driving it. I do believe that during the criminal trial, the State could have presented another theory as to what happened to those items, short of OJ dumping them in a trash bin at LAX.

[WarmNCozy]

I must agree that the time-frame is very tight considering no weapon or bloody clothes (worn by the killer) were found, nor was enough blood found in the Bronco to indicate someone wearing blood-stained clothing had been driving it. I do believe that during the criminal trial, the State could have presented another theory as to what happened to those items, short of OJ dumping them in a trash bin at LAX.

Go to:/www.wagnerandson.com/

Read it and then make up your mind!

[TobyTiger]

SIMPSON ORDERED TO GIVE UP ASSETS TO GOLDMAN (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21106830/)

Updated: 1 hour, 50 minutes ago

SANTA MONICA, Calif. - O.J. Simpson must hand over a Rolex watch and other assets to satisfy a civil judgment that found him liable for the deaths of his ex-wife, Nicole Brown Simpson, and her friend Ron Goldman, a judge ruled Tuesday.

Any future royalties from a sports video game featuring Simpson also must be delivered to Goldman’s father, Fred Goldman, Superior Court Judge Gerald Rosenberg ruled.

Simpson must also surrender any of the disputed memorabilia items recently seized by Las Vegas authorities that are found to be legally his.

The items would then be auctioned by the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department and the money they bring in given to Goldman. His attorney David Cook estimated the watch’s value between $5,000 and more than $20,000.

Simpson attorney Ronald Slates said his client had already handed the watch over to him and he planned to give it to Goldman’s lawyers Tuesday afternoon. He questioned, however, whether it’s a real Rolex.

“Know any Rolex watches that sell for 125 bucks?” he asked, adding that’s what Simpson told him he paid for it. The lawyer acknowledged, however, that if it is fake, “it’s a pretty good copy.”

The court order specifies a “Submariner Rolex Watch” that was identified in a photograph.

Disputed memorabilia items
Slates said Simpson can’t hand over the memorabilia that Las Vegas police seized when they arrested him on robbery, kidnapping and other charges last month because those items aren’t in his possession.

Cook agreed that was true but said the judge’s order requires that if Simpson ever does acquire the items he says are his he must turn them over. They include footballs, jerseys and other things the former football star says were stolen from him.

Slate said he doesn’t represent the company that was paid for marketing the video game Simpson appears in but, in any case, he isn’t sure there will ever be any future royalty payments.

In 1995, Simpson was acquitted in a criminal trial of charges that he murdered his ex-wife and Ron Goldman. The 1997 civil judgment resulted from the trial of a lawsuit against Simpson.

[martin II]

tv
i love Jim Brown. Have known him for many years.was a coinvestor in "The Black Industrial Development organization and our company made many Dashikies for him. oj is not the first or the last to receive a knock or two from jim as he does speak his mind. Some times he has been on point and sometines not so on point but it does not matter as his overall work receives great approval from most blacks, whites and myself.

Oj like many other black celebraties come under some attack by many when they buy large houses in the most expensive communities where whites are the majority.

I have no specific information on what charities oj contributed to other than to Jewish charity, the foundation for cancer children, the SF youth group and what i have posted above here.

But in the end how much he gave to black charities as opossed to some others is his business and has nothing to do with the criminal,civil or current case.imo
What i do know is that when he was charged with killing nicole the black community gave him their support and the white comminity that had 'LOVED' him turned against him BEFORE ONE PIECE OF EVIDENCE was presented in court.

I am not willing to say oj lived a white lifestyle because he married a white woman and lived in a big house in a white community and became a multi millionair. Everyone tries to get out of the ghetto white and black.

I have not changed my opinion on black celebrities contributing to the front line black organizations and i include oj in that group.

As long as the black community gave their support to oj during the murder trialsl, i fail to uinderstand why his involvement with that community is of concern to you.

IMO


imo
MARTINII

ps
you may not know this but long ago CORE has not receive much if any support form blacks. ROY ENIS lost his bearing some time ago and has for some time been nothing but a group that holds fund raising dinners to give some white political and business types awards in exchange for donations but very little good work is done in the community.

I would agree that core is the kind of black organization that V.B. would support. If he does support any.

[Suzee10]

Domestic violence! Talk to me about it! When it is REAL, you don't call 911! You hide it! Like I did!


I beg your pardon. It too suffered at the hands of a vicious monster and I called 911 and they took his a** away.

[TobyTiger]

Go to:/www.wagnerandson.com/

Read it and then make up your mind!
I have read most of that site...very good research. However the theory is that another party (connected with the mob) committed the murders and that Simpson was "at the scene", which is not what the State was trying to prove at the criminal trial.

[martin II]

SIMPSON ORDERED TO GIVE UP ASSETS TO GOLDMAN (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21106830/)

Updated: 1 hour, 50 minutes ago

SANTA MONICA, Calif. - O.J. Simpson must hand over a Rolex watch and other assets to satisfy a civil judgment that found him liable for the deaths of his ex-wife, Nicole Brown Simpson, and her friend Ron Goldman, a judge ruled Tuesday.

Any future royalties from a sports video game featuring Simpson also must be delivered to Goldman’s father, Fred Goldman, Superior Court Judge Gerald Rosenberg ruled.

Simpson must also surrender any of the disputed memorabilia items recently seized by Las Vegas authorities that are found to be legally his.

The items would then be auctioned by the Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department and the money they bring in given to Goldman. His attorney David Cook estimated the watch’s value between $5,000 and more than $20,000.

Simpson attorney Ronald Slates said his client had already handed the watch over to him and he planned to give it to Goldman’s lawyers Tuesday afternoon. He questioned, however, whether it’s a real Rolex.

“Know any Rolex watches that sell for 125 bucks?” he asked, adding that’s what Simpson told him he paid for it. The lawyer acknowledged, however, that if it is fake, “it’s a pretty good copy.”

The court order specifies a “Submariner Rolex Watch” that was identified in a photograph.

Disputed memorabilia items
Slates said Simpson can’t hand over the memorabilia that Las Vegas police seized when they arrested him on robbery, kidnapping and other charges last month because those items aren’t in his possession.

Cook agreed that was true but said the judge’s order requires that if Simpson ever does acquire the items he says are his he must turn them over. They include footballs, jerseys and other things the former football star says were stolen from him.

Slate said he doesn’t represent the company that was paid for marketing the video game Simpson appears in but, in any case, he isn’t sure there will ever be any future royalty payments.

In 1995, Simpson was acquitted in a criminal trial of charges that he murdered his ex-wife and Ron Goldman. The 1997 civil judgment resulted from the trial of a lawsuit against Simpson.


if oj paid $125.00 for a rolex copy he paid too much. They sell in the streets for $5.00-$10.00 in most cities.
martin II

[TobyTiger]

if oj paid $125.00 for a rolex copy he paid too much. They sell in the streets for $5.00-$10.00 in most cities.
martin II
I agree....he would've been ripped off at that price.

[socaldiva]

I don't think of it as an effort! I am caring, and sharing the things that I am good at and trying to bring out of her, things that she might be good at! Just exposing her to things other than the horrors she lived with!


~sigh~ I wasn't using the word effort in a negative way. I meant it in a postive sense.

[martin II]

I have read most of that site...very good research. However the theory is that another party (connected with the mob) committed the murders and that Simpson was "at the scene", which is not what the State was trying to prove at the criminal trial.

Wagner is the second very good investigator that put forth the idea that oj was at the scene right after the murders, Both named different killers.
William C Dear is the other.imo
martin II

[tv]

tv
i love Jim Brown. Have known him for many years.was a coinvestor in "The Black Industrial Development organization and our company made many Dashikies for him. oj is not the first or the last to receive a knock or two from jim as he does speak his mind. Some times he has been on point and sometines not so on point but it does not matter as his overall work receives great approval from most blacks, whites and myself.

Oj like many other black celebraties come under some attack by many when they buy large houses in the most expensive communities where whites are the majority.

I have no specific information on what charities oj contributed to other than to Jewish charity, the foundation for cancer children, the SF youth group and what i have posted above here.

But in the end how much he gave to black charities as opossed to some others is his business and has nothing to do with the criminal,civil or current case.imo
What i do know is that when he was charged with killing nicole the black community gave him their support and the white comminity that had 'LOVED' him turned against him BEFORE ONE PIECE OF EVIDENCE was presented in court.

I am not willing to say oj lived a white lifestyle because he married a white woman and lived in a big house in a white community and became a multi millionair. Everyone tries to get out of the ghetto white and black.

I have not changed my opinion on black celebrities contributing to the front line black organizations and i include oj in that group.

As long as the black community gave their support to oj during the murder trialsl, i fail to uinderstand why his involvement with that community is of concern to you.

IMO

MARTINIImartin, you wouldn't let this subject go. I wanted to drop it several times. You insinuated I didn't have a source so I provided it. Don't keep on and on about this with me and then when I post an answer you don't like tell me you don't know why it concerns me. You're the one that made the big deal about it. Now can we drop it?

[tv]

ps
you may not know this but long ago CORE has not receive much if any support form blacks. ROY ENIS lost his bearing some time ago and has for some time been nothing but a group that holds fund raising dinners to give some white political and business types awards in exchange for donations but very little good work is done in the community.

I would agree that core is the kind of black organization that V.B. would support. If he does support any.If you don't like the CORE reference I have several more. It does look like you don't want to let this go. Now you're bashing someone else for their questionable contributions for the white political and business community but you think it's wonderful that OJ Simpson was at a Jewish charity benefit. Does your hypocrisy have any limits??

[martin II]

If you don't like the CORE reference I have several more. It does look like you don't want to let this go. Now you're bashing someone else for their questionable contributions for the white political and business community but you think it's wonderful that OJ Simpson was at a Jewish charity benefit. Does your hypocrisy have any limits??

tv
look, you asked me about oj's charity work. I gave you one that happened on 6/11 the evening before nicole was killed as i thought that you would easily recall that one. Maby i was wrong.

I am still trying to understand the reason for your interest on oj and the black community.

1. The black community supported oj during the criminal trial. Why are you
concerned that he MAY not have given to his community at the level you
think he should have. Seems like they would be a better judge of his value
to THEM than YOU and obviously they made their decision on that issue.

2. What does the level of giving by oj have to do with his guilt or non guilt in
the trials.

imo
martin II

[martin II]

If you don't like the CORE reference I have several more. It does look like you don't want to let this go. Now you're bashing someone else for their questionable contributions for the white political and business community but you think it's wonderful that OJ Simpson was at a Jewish charity benefit. Does your hypocrisy have any limits??

tv
i have no problem with white people giving to core. I just think there are other black organization where they can see obvious positive results from their donations. The last i heard of Roy and core where i am the FIB had him jacked for overcharging poor people for immigration papers in the community.

I will give to United Negro College Fund and you can have CORE and V.B.
How about that.
imo
martin II

[tv]

tv
look, you asked me about oj's charity work. I gave you one that happened on 6/11 the evening before nicole was killed as i thought that you would easily recall that one. Maby i was wrong.

I am still trying to understand the reason for your interest on oj and the black community.

1. The black community supported oj during the criminal trial. Why are you
concerned that he MAY not have given to his community at the level you
think he should have. Seems like they would be a better judge of his value
to THEM than YOU and obviously they made their decision on that issue.

2. What does the level of giving by oj have to do with his guilt or non guilt in
the trials.

imo
martin III'm interested in OJ Simpson because of the murders and the criminal trial verdict which let a killer loose. I don't think race has anything to do with the murders or the reason most of America knows he's guilty. The only thing that it has to do with race is that's what Johnny Cochran used to get a jury to vote not guilty. You can be as nasty to me as you want and capitalize all the letters you want. The fact is that I have a right to comment on this trial and the behaviors and motivations of OJ Simpson. Stop twisting my words -- I've never stated his lack of giving had anything to do with his guilt or innocence. If you can't see that he and his defense team used the black community to their advantage then that's your problem.

[martin II]

martin, you wouldn't let this subject go. I wanted to drop it several times. You insinuated I didn't have a source so I provided it. Don't keep on and on about this with me and then when I post an answer you don't like tell me you don't know why it concerns me. You're the one that made the big deal about it. Now can we drop it?

you can post until you get tired as you are the one that opened this issue for some reason about oj giving to the black commuinity

i am just asking you why is that a concern to you since the black community suported oj during the trials.They made their decision on oj. Whats it you you???

martin II

[tv]

you can post until you get tired as you are the one that opened this issue for some reason about oj giving to the black commuinity

i am just asking you why is that a concern to you since the black community suported oj during the trials.They made their decision on oj. Whats it you you???

martin III mentioned it in response to someone else, perhaps you, and you ran with it because you thought I couldn't back it up. Now you're being nasty because you're wrong. Get over it.

[martin II]

I mentioned it in response to someone else, perhaps you, and you ran with it because you thought I couldn't back it up. Now you're being nasty because you're wrong. Get over it.

i never thought you would not be able to 'BACK IT UP' as the info is available by google.
but you still have not explained why after the black community made their decision to support oj that is such a concern to you. The decision as to whether oj was worthy of their support was theirs not others. So i don't understand the concern over their decision.
imo
MARTIN ii

[socaldiva]

i never thought you would not be able to 'BACK IT UP' as the info is available by google.
but you still have not explained why after the black community made their decision to support oj that is such a concern to you. The decision as to whether oj was worthy of their support was theirs not others. So i don't understand the concern over their decision.
imo
MARTIN ii

If the info is readily "available by google", why did you bother to ask her for links & where is your link that you were asked for to support your contrary view?

You can't understand why some think it's sad that those jurors seem to have supported Orenthal as one of their own, yet he does nothing for the black community & seems to prefer to keep his distance from his own race?

btw: Have you forgotten his statement from the 60's? "I'm not black, I'm OJ"

[tv]

i never thought you would not be able to 'BACK IT UP' as the info is available by google.
but you still have not explained why after the black community made their decision to support oj that is such a concern to you. The decision as to whether oj was worthy of their support was theirs not others. So i don't understand the concern over their decision.
imo
MARTIN iiThis forum is to discuss OJ Simpson and the murders, trials etc. I have no obligation to explain myself to you. I've noticed when you're wrong the personal attacks start. You're starting to look foolish.

[tv]

If the info is readily "available by google", why did you bother to ask her for links & where is your link that you were asked for to support your contrary view?

You can't understand why some think it's sad that those jurors seem to have supported Orenthal as one of their own, yet he does nothing for the black community & seems to prefer to keep his distance from his own race?

btw: Have you forgotten his statement from the 60's? "I'm not black, I'm OJ"Thanks, Diva. I'm still waiting for his link but I'm not holding my breath. I'd forgotten about that statement from the '60s, I'm glad you reminded me.

[martin II]

This forum is to discuss OJ Simpson and the murders, trials etc. I have no obligation to explain myself to you. I've noticed when you're wrong the personal attacks start. You're starting to look foolish.

tv
i am not wrong and i have not made a personal attack on you. as you have informed me, when i make a personal attack you will know it. haha. i just asked you to explain why you believe oj did not contribute to the black community when the black community obviously felt he had and that oj deserved their support.Which they gave.imo

martin II

[socaldiva]

*snip* i just asked you to explain why you believe oj did not contribute to the black community when the black community obviously felt he had and that oj deserved their support.Which they gave.imo

martin II

Considering you've yet to provide a link to Orenthal contributing to the black community, I don't know why you keep insisting that he did.

They didn't acquit him because he gave to their community, I believe they acquitted him as a "pay back" to the white community. Both reasons are wrong btw, as their decision should have strictly adhered to the evidence, not their personal agendas.

[tv]

tv
i am not wrong and i have not made a personal attack on you. as you have informed me, when i make a personal attack you will know it. haha. i just asked you to explain why you believe oj did not contribute to the black community when the black community obviously felt he had and that oj deserved their support.Which they gave.imo

martin IISorry, martin, you can't rip my line from me...get one of your own. You have attacked me numerous times. I told you what made me think OJ Simpson didn't contribute to the black community and I gave you the source. If you want to keep beating this dead horse I can post a few more examples or you can supply a link that proves he was involved with the black community before the murders. Another alternative is for you to let it go like I wanted to do many posts back.

[socaldiva]

Thanks, Diva. I'm still waiting for his link but I'm not holding my breath. I'd forgotten about that statement from the '60s, I'm glad you reminded me.

I've noticed that Martin wants to drop a topic when it isn't favorable to Orenthal. If he had a link to support his assertion, he'd be shouting it from the rooftops & he'd be willing to talk about it ad nauseum. :D

[tv]

Considering you've yet to provide a link to Orenthal contributing to the black community, I don't know why you keep insisting that he did.

They didn't acquit him because he gave to their community, I believe they acquitted him as a "pay back" to the white community. Both reasons are wrong btw, as their decision should have strictly adhered to the evidence, not their personal agendas.ITA, diva. I doubt if many average citizens, black or white, had any idea if Simpson was involved in charitable work. The whole point of this is that if the prosecution had pointed out his lack of interest in being black to the jurors it might have made him less of a hero to them. We'll never know if it would have had any impact but it should have been presented.

[tv]

I've noticed that Martin wants to drop a topic when it isn't favorable to Orenthal. If he had a link to support his assertion, he'd be shouting it from the rooftops & he'd be willing to talk about it ad nauseum. :DI really think he thought I couldn't back up what I was saying. It just took me a while to find the time to post it. :D

I'm sure he can dig up a few things on old Orenthal. I'm waiting. :)

[socaldiva]

I really think he thought I couldn't back up what I was saying. It just took me a while to find the time to post it. :D

I'm sure he can dig up a few things on old Orenthal. I'm waiting. :)

I'm waiting too. I'm surprised it's taking him so long as he just posted that these things are readily available on Google. :shrug: :)

[tv]

I have no specific information on what charities oj contributed to other than to Jewish charity, the foundation for cancer children, the SF youth group and what i have posted above here.

Never mind about the link, martin. These vague references will do. :rolleyes:

[tv]

I'm waiting too. I'm surprised it's taking him so long as he just posted that these things are readily available on Google. :shrug: :)

That's what I was thinking. Is Google running slow tonight? ;)

[martin II]

ITA, diva. I doubt if many average citizens, black or white, had any idea if Simpson was involved in charitable work. The whole point of this is that if the prosecution had pointed out his lack of interest in being black to the jurors it might have made him less of a hero to them. We'll never know if it would have had any impact but it should have been presented.

tv
i never saw oj as a front line civil rights person. But i never required him to be
as i had always accepted him for his success in his fields of work and knew the value of his success to youger black kids as a motivating force for them.
Blacks had hardley been accepted in the NFL and to see him be the very best of all running back and the accceptance he received was special for black people.Some people did more charity work than others and it is obvious that the black community accepted him for what he did without measuring his worth by how much charity work he did or did or did not do.

BY no means do i think that the black community was ignorant of who Oj was
and what his involvement in the community was to the point where it was necessary for the prosecution try to get him convicted of murder based on his life style, as you suggested, or that he married a white woman or that he was wealthy and lived in a mostly white community. Most black were proud that he had attained that level of success.If the prosecution had tried use that trick it would have backfired on them.imo Which may be why that idea was not considered.

Others do not set the standard or make the selection as to who black people should support based on what they think is important to blacks.Only blacks can do that.It seems that you would judge a person based on charity work as you have tried to highlight what you think oj did or did not do.

There are some that are of the opinion that oj had too many white friends and not enough blacks. I don't understand that thinking unless there is some
rule that he should confine himself to black people because of his color.But he had black friends.Most of his football buddies were black.

On a serious tip i can say that at no time did oj, with white wife, mixed children, living in a big house in a mostly white neighborhood, making commercials for a white company ever forget that he was anything other than a black man living in America.Not in America, that is for sure.
martinII

[martin II]

tv
how would the prosecution have presented information about oj having little interes in bring black as you have suggested they should have.

C Darden:
oj simpson divoiced his black wife and married a white woman and has not lived in a black community with other blacks for many years.He lives in a mostly white community and has a lot of white friends. He has not contributed money to black organizations as some other blacks have. He does not seem to like being black in our opinion because of his lifestyle.
So we would like for you to convict him of murder because he thinks he is not black.

you think the jury would go for that line.
hahahaha
martin II

[tv]

tv
i never saw oj as a front line civil rights person. But i never required him to be
as i had always accepted him for his success in his fields of work and knew the value of his success to youger black kids as a motivating force for them.
Blacks had hardley been accepted in the NFL and to see him be the very best of all running back and the accceptance he received was special for black people.Some people did more charity work than others and it is obvious that the black community accepted him for what he did without measuring his worth by how much charity work he did or did or did not do.

BY no means do i think that the black community was ignorant of who Oj was
and what his involvement in the community was to the point where it was necessary for the prosecution try to get him convicted of murder based on his life style, as you suggested, or that he married a white woman or that he was wealthy and lived in a mostly white community. Most black were proud that he had attained that level of success.If the prosecution had tried use that trick it would have backfired on them.imo Which may be why that idea was not considered.

Others do not set the standard or make the selection as to who black people should support based on what they think is important to blacks.Only blacks can do that.It seems that you would judge a person based on charity work as you have tried to highlight what you think oj did or did not do.

There are some that are of the opinion that oj had too many white friends and not enough blacks. I don't understand that thinking unless there is some
rule that he should confine himself to black people because of his color.But he had black friends.Most of his football buddies were black.

On a serious tip i can say that at no time did oj, with white wife, mixed children, living in a big house in a mostly white neighborhood, making commercials for a white company ever forget that he was anything other than a black man living in America.Not in America, that is for sure.
martinIIAfter reading this post, and seeing how you've twisted my words, this subject is over with for me. Find someone willing to allow you to shift the focus and make up things about them. It's not going to be me.

[martin II]

After reading this post, and seeing how you've twisted my words, this subject is over with for me. Find someone willing to allow you to shift the focus and make up things about them. It's not going to be me.

tv


I have not twisted your words.

As you know it was you that offered the idea that the prosecution shouLd have offered the jury information to show oj's lack of interest in being black
with the idea that it may have made a differance in the verdict.

I responded to that idea. The balance is my opinions on the subject of oj's acceptance by the black community.

imo
martin II

[socaldiva]

*snip*

I have not twisted your words.



Sure you have & my guess is it's because you can't find a link to backup what you posted yesterday. ;)

[socaldiva]

*snip*
On a serious tip i can say that at no time did oj, with white wife, mixed children, living in a big house in a mostly white neighborhood, making commercials for a white company ever forget that he was anything other than a black man living in America.Not in America, that is for sure.
martinII

Then how do you explain the "I'm not black, I'm OJ" remark? hahaha

[tv]

tv


I have not twisted your words.

As you know it was you that offered the idea that the prosecution shouLd have offered the jury information to show oj's lack of interest in being black
with the idea that it may have made a differance in the verdict.

I responded to that idea. The balance is my opinions on the subject of oj's acceptance by the black community.

imo
martin IIWhatever, martin. I'm not playing your game.

[tv]

Then how do you explain the "I'm not black, I'm OJ" remark? hahahaYep, I'd like to see him twist that around. :biggrin:

[WarmNCozy]

~sigh~ I wasn't using the word effort in a negative way. I meant it in a postive sense.

I didn't take it in a negative way!:rose:

[weezer]

I would like to know what the OJ haters have done for the black community whether you are black, white, yellow or red? ARG! http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff305/CozyNWarm/4.gif

Does it just have to be the black community or can it be for the community?

[William Anthony]

I look at phrases like the jury was biased and wanted to free one of their own and the fact that Simpson did or did not donnate to Black causes to opine that people will not openly state, but will imply, what is own their minds and when the subject of race comes up some run and hide under the cover of not wanting to discuss the role of race in the criminal trial.

[WarmNCozy]

Does it just have to be the black community or can it be for the community?

No it doesn't! It could be any community that is foreign to your life style, be it race, social experiences, background! People choose to be with people they can relate to! That sets up "borders" for relationships, IMO!

[Kate Sachel]

I wasn't talking about the current issues. I was talking about trying to convict OJ of charges that he was acquitted of 13 years ago!

What has that got to do with today?

Then why did you add "and relate current issues to the past"?

That's what that has got to do with today.

Kate

[Kate Sachel]

I would like to know what the OJ haters have done for the black community whether you are black, white, yellow or red? ARG! http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/ff305/CozyNWarm/4.gif

Though I find this a ludicrous and irrelevant question, I will play along as well.

In addition to my full time employment I volunteer for the following;

1.) Three battered women's shelters
2.) Two homeless shelters, and
3.) Planned Parenthood of America

So as you can see, many of us OJ haters on this forum give back to the entire community quite well.

Kate

[socaldiva]

Though I find this a ludicrous and irrelevant question, I will play along as well.

In addition to my full time employment I volunteer for the following;

1.) Three battered women's shelters
2.) Two homeless shelters, and
3.) Planned Parenthood of America

So as you can see, many of us OJ haters on this forum give back to the entire community quite well.

Kate

Kudos to you for working with such worthy causes Kate. I also note that although several of the "Oj haters" have answered the poster's question about working with their communities, the only OJ supporter that answered the question was the original poster :shrug: ;)

[weezer]

Court hearing set for Nov. 8 for O.J. Simpson, co-defendants in memorabilia robbery case
http://www.courttv.com/trials/oj-simpson/100407_ap.html

[William Anthony]

Yep, I'd like to see him twist that around. :biggrin:

This response was made in reply to a remark made by Simpson. I think Simpson's remark paraphrases a statement made by the late great Dr. Martin Luther King.

[tv]

This response was made in reply to a remark made by Simpson. I think Simpson's remark paraphrases a statement made by the late great Dr. Martin Luther King.Are you comparing OJ Simpson motivations to Dr. King's?

[William Anthony]

Are you comparing OJ Simpson motivations to Dr. King's?

MLK is a hero to me. Simpson is far far far less to me. I was comparing the statements.

[tv]

MLK is a hero to me. Simpson is far far far less to me. I was comparing the statements.What do you think Simpson meant when he said that?

[weezer]

Has anyone heard whether or not orenthal was drug tested when he was arrested in Vegas?

[William Anthony]

What do you think Simpson meant when he said that?

That he does not wish to be seen first as a black man but as a human being with a name and an identity. I would have said judged by the contents of his character, but identity will suffice to spawn enough comments, smile.

[William Anthony]

Has anyone heard whether or not orenthal was drug tested when he was arrested in Vegas?

I am sure that, if he had been and drugs were found, you would have heard and posted it.

[weezer]

I am sure that, if he had been and drugs were found, you would have heard and posted it.

LOL -- maybe so -- guess I'll have to wait for the answer.

[William Anthony]

LOL -- maybe so -- guess I'll have to wait for the answer.

Yes, I do not know.:)

[martin II]

BOB

VEGAS CASES
Do you know if all defendants cases will be tried togeather or is it too early to know.

No guns were found by le at the hotel room as group that collected the items had left when le arived to investigate. Some guns were found at a persons house in a later search by le.I think the next day. Has the prosecution made statements that there is proof that these guns were in fact the guns that one of the victims claimed were drawn on him in the hotel room?

imo
martin II

[socaldiva]

*snip*
BOB

VEGAS CASES
Do you know if all defendants cases will be tried togeather or is it too early to know.



I think it's comical that you constantly discount Bob's posts as false, yet you go to him for an answer on this? IIRC, I read a link on this forum the other day that said the cases would be consolidated.

[weezer]

"Pop Culture News
LOOK WHO SEWED UP
ON AND OFF THE RUNWAY, STARS POWERED THE N.Y. FASHION SHOWS.
Two words sum up New York's recent spring fashion shows: pecking order. As more celebrities than ever crowded under the white tents in midtown Manhattan, necks constantly strained to see who was seated where. At Todd Oldham, supermodel Elle Macpherson won a front-row seat; Arnelle Simpson was forced to stand. . ."

she must be a real power house in the fashion industry -- LOL

[socaldiva]

*snip*
At Todd Oldham, supermodel Elle Macpherson won a front-row seat; Arnelle Simpson was forced to stand. . ."

she must be a real power house in the fashion industry -- LOL


Arnelle has to stand & Dad can't get a bus to stop :biggrin:

[weezer]

Arnelle has to stand & Dad can't get a bus to stop :biggrin:

LOL -- poor things.

[socaldiva]

LOL -- poor things.

Yeah, where were the "millions of friends" that some here claim they have? I guess they don't work in the fashion industry or drive buses. :D

[weezer]

Yeah, where were the "millions of friends" that some here claim they have? I guess they don't work in the fashion industry or drive buses. :D

:beer: :beer: :beer:

[martin II]

"Pop Culture News
LOOK WHO SEWED UP
ON AND OFF THE RUNWAY, STARS POWERED THE N.Y. FASHION SHOWS.
Two words sum up New York's recent spring fashion shows: pecking order. As more celebrities than ever crowded under the white tents in midtown Manhattan, necks constantly strained to see who was seated where. At Todd Oldham, supermodel Elle Macpherson won a front-row seat; Arnelle Simpson was forced to stand. . ."

she must be a real power house in the fashion industry -- LOL

Obviously you have not attended a Bryant Park show.As a fashion consultant
imo Arnell would have been there helping to put on the show for the line she may have been working for. But i understand your need to try and bash her.
martin II

[weezer]

Obviously you have not attended a Bryant Park show.As a fashion consultant
imo Arnell would have been there helping to put on the show for the line she may have been working for. But i understand your need to try and bash her.
martin II

riiiiiiiight ;)

[socaldiva]

*snip*
Obviously you have not attended a Bryant Park show.

Was it Bryant Park or Lane Bryant? :D

[William Anthony]

BOB

VEGAS CASES
Do you know if all defendants cases will be tried togeather or is it too early to know.

No guns were found by le at the hotel room as group that collected the items had left when le arived to investigate. Some guns were found at a persons house in a later search by le.I think the next day. Has the prosecution made statements that there is proof that these guns were in fact the guns that one of the victims claimed were drawn on him in the hotel room?

imo
martin II

Martin,

It is my belief that there may not be a trial for many of the defendants, since they may have made plea bargains. The idea of plea bargaining raises many ethical questions, imho. As for the guns it remains a matter of he said/he said, imho.

[weezer]

"OJ Among Football Fans At Ale House
KENDALL, Fla. -- Football fans sounded off about an unlikely game watcher in the crowd at Kendall Ale House on Sunday afternoon.

Among the Dolphins fans was O.J. Simpson, a Kendall resident who hasn't been since much in public since his recent arrest on armed robbery charges.

"I'm pretty surprised he's here," fan Enrique Ruiz said. "I'm like, 'Wow, this guy … he's kind of in trouble.' I think it's awesome, I wish I could say cheers to him, but …"

Apparently, Simpson was in no mood to talk. He shied away from our cameras and kept to himself.

Members of his entourage said he was just trying to enjoy a football game and return to normalcy. . ." http://www.nbc6.net/news/14288401/detail.html

man, he's not looking well!

[William Anthony]

"OJ Among Football Fans At Ale House
KENDALL, Fla. -- Football fans sounded off about an unlikely game watcher in the crowd at Kendall Ale House on Sunday afternoon.

Among the Dolphins fans was O.J. Simpson, a Kendall resident who hasn't been since much in public since his recent arrest on armed robbery charges.

"I'm pretty surprised he's here," fan Enrique Ruiz said. "I'm like, 'Wow, this guy … he's kind of in trouble.' I think it's awesome, I wish I could say cheers to him, but …"

Apparently, Simpson was in no mood to talk. He shied away from our cameras and kept to himself.

Members of his entourage said he was just trying to enjoy a football game and return to normalcy. . ." http://www.nbc6.net/news/14288401/detail.html

man, he's not looking well!

Looks often have little to do with how someone is doing health wise or financially. Maybe, he had read some of the posts on this board before going to the game, :).

[martin II]

"OJ Among Football Fans At Ale House
KENDALL, Fla. -- Football fans sounded off about an unlikely game watcher in the crowd at Kendall Ale House on Sunday afternoon.

Among the Dolphins fans was O.J. Simpson, a Kendall resident who hasn't been since much in public since his recent arrest on armed robbery charges.

"I'm pretty surprised he's here," fan Enrique Ruiz said. "I'm like, 'Wow, this guy … he's kind of in trouble.' I think it's awesome, I wish I could say cheers to him, but …"

Apparently, Simpson was in no mood to talk. He shied away from our cameras and kept to himself.

Members of his entourage said he was just trying to enjoy a football game and return to normalcy. . ." http://www.nbc6.net/news/14288401/detail.html

man, he's not looking well!

you do seem to make quite a few evaluations on others looks.Are you a beauty consultant or someting?

martin II

[weezer]

you do seem to make quite a few evaluations on others looks.Are you a beauty consultant or someting?

martin II

'or something' -- LOL

hey, I didn't say anything about 'beauty' -- I said he doesn't look 'well'. . . .

[socaldiva]

you do seem to make quite a few evaluations on others looks.Are you a beauty consultant or someting?

martin II


Are you? You often post about Arnelle's looks & Orenthal's attire ;)

[socaldiva]

I suppose this isn't "news" as most of us already knew that Simpson is dumber than a doorknob, but here is some backup :biggrin:

"OJ Simpson's IQ is estimated at 89"


http://www.kids-iq-tests.com/famous-people.html

[socaldiva]

This link says that one of the co-defendants in the Vegas caper is going to plead guilty on Monday & will testify against Simpson in exchange for a reduced sentence:

http://www.fox5vegas.com/news/14329137/detail.html?treets=vegas&tml=vegas_break&ts=T&tmi=vegas_break_1_03410110122007

[martin II]

Martin,

It is my belief that there may not be a trial for many of the defendants, since they may have made plea bargains. The idea of plea bargaining raises many ethical questions, imho. As for the guns it remains a matter of he said/he said, imho.

William
I agree. I think oj was the target for the prosecution from the moment it was clear that he was involved.I also believe that most if not all of the other defendants will be allowed to plea bargin down to no jail or very little jail, even the ones that had the guns in hand. It seems that oj has not been offered any kind of plea even against the guys that had the guns or the guy that organized the whole event.All seem to have long criminal records but the prosecution does not seem to care about that issue.So far.
imo

martin II

[martin II]

'or something' -- LOL

hey, I didn't say anything about 'beauty' -- I said he doesn't look 'well'. . . .

It was my error in suggesting that you could be a beaty consultant.Sorry.

martin II

[socaldiva]

*snip*
I agree. I think oj was the target for the prosecution from the moment it was clear that he was involved.

Uh, if OJ was the "target" it was because he was the one that was making the attempt to steal his stuff back.

[kjb19500]

Uh, if OJ was the "target" it was because he was the one that was making the attempt to steal his stuff back.

I'd say that in any case, the prosecutor is going to go after the big shark and toss the smaller fish back if necessary. Simpson apparently is perceived as the big fish here. If he had been on the up and up he would have informed the police that someone had his stolen property and they would have helped him get it back. But then it might have ended up in the hands of Fred Goldman and that wasn't going to be allowed to happen.

Ergo, the floor is freshly painted and Simpson has two walls to his back.

[William Anthony]

I'd say that in any case, the prosecutor is going to go after the big shark and toss the smaller fish back if necessary. Simpson apparently is perceived as the big fish here. If he had been on the up and up he would have informed the police that someone had his stolen property and they would have helped him get it back. But then it might have ended up in the hands of Fred Goldman and that wasn't going to be allowed to happen.

Ergo, the floor is freshly painted and Simpson has two walls to his back.


This is not a civil trial about whether or not the property belonged to Simpson or Goldman. However, that issue will become relevant during the trial, imho. I have given the issue some thought and there may not be a grounds for the robbery charges against Simpson to stand. Given that the property belonged to Goldman, then there was no robbery, imho. If the property belonged to Simpson, there was no robbery, imho. There may be charges of conversion or being in possession of stolen property, imho.

[martin II]

This is not a civil trial about whether or not the property belonged to Simpson or Goldman. However, that issue will become relevant during the trial, imho. I have given the issue some thought and there may not be a grounds for the robbery charges against Simpson to stand. Given that the property belonged to Goldman, then there was no robbery, imho. If the property belonged to Simpson, there was no robbery, imho. There may be charges of conversion or being in possession of stolen property, imho.

william
it is my understanding that the property with oj's name belonged to him and not to goldman as the judge had required goldman to get a list of the items
and return to him for approval before the items could be his.
If the thiefs cannot show that they baught the items from oj then they were still his. If true then the thiefs may be charged with stealing the items from oj.:shrug:

martinII

[weezer]

It was my error in suggesting that you could be a beaty consultant.Sorry.

martin II

oh dang! and I really did want to be a 'beaty' consultant. Oh well! :D

[weezer]

william
it is my understanding that the property with oj's name belonged to him and not to goldman as the judge had required goldman to get a list of the items
and return to him for approval before the items could be his.
If the thiefs cannot show that they baught the items from oj then they were still his. If true then the thiefs may be charged with stealing the items from oj.:shrug:

martinII

LOL -- LOL -- LOL

[martin II]

william
This is by Jemele Hill
espn

"Fourth sign of manure: The audiotape.

Let's see, the man who recorded the now infamous audio of Simpson cursing out the allegedly fraudulent collector released it to TMZ.com. A reputable move. He also is the same one who set up O.J.'s "sting operation." He was Rusty to O.J.'s Danny Ocean.

Now, I'm not saying that Thomas Riccio, co-owner of the auction house, Universal Rarities, provided a fake recording. If you've listened to it, you hear O.J. at Defcom 5, lashing out at Alfred Beardsley, who Juice fingered as the thief.

An angry O.J. screams, "… you think you can just steal my [expletive] and sell it?"

Sounds like a lot of conversations I've heard at the cleaners.

People want to see this guy in prison so badly, they don't care if he does 100 years for a parking ticket. I understand that the first Simpson trial had lasting implications, and it is widely believed that Simpson got away with murdering two people.

People hate to acknowledge this, and I hate to say it, but we have to remember: O.J. doesn't have a criminal record. He's been accused of everything from road rage to stealing cable. No matter what we think he did or didn't do, his slate remains legally clean.

And so far, he's ahead 2-1 on the legal system (a better record than the Saints), with his only loss being in civil court. Hey, I don't like Simpson any more than most people, but I respect the acquittal he was given. More than that, I accept that justice isn't just for people we like.

People are locking in on this incident because it's supposedly our chance to get it right. African-Americans realize that supporting O.J. isn't all it's cracked up to be. White folks want a chance to say, "See, I told you so."

"I just hope we know that revenge does not equal justice."
Jemele Hill
espn

[weezer]

william
This is by Jemele Hill
espn

"Fourth sign of manure: The audiotape.

Let's see, the man who recorded the now infamous audio of Simpson cursing out the allegedly fraudulent collector released it to TMZ.com. A reputable move. He also is the same one who set up O.J.'s "sting operation." He was Rusty to O.J.'s Danny Ocean.

Now, I'm not saying that Thomas Riccio, co-owner of the auction house, Universal Rarities, provided a fake recording. If you've listened to it, you hear O.J. at Defcom 5, lashing out at Alfred Beardsley, who Juice fingered as the thief.

An angry O.J. screams, "… you think you can just steal my [expletive] and sell it?"

Sounds like a lot of conversations I've heard at the cleaners.

People want to see this guy in prison so badly, they don't care if he does 100 years for a parking ticket. I understand that the first Simpson trial had lasting implications, and it is widely believed that Simpson got away with murdering two people.

People hate to acknowledge this, and I hate to say it, but we have to remember: O.J. doesn't have a criminal record. He's been accused of everything from road rage to stealing cable. No matter what we think he did or didn't do, his slate remains legally clean.

And so far, he's ahead 2-1 on the legal system (a better record than the Saints), with his only loss being in civil court. Hey, I don't like Simpson any more than most people, but I respect the acquittal he was given. More than that, I accept that justice isn't just for people we like.

People are locking in on this incident because it's supposedly our chance to get it right. African-Americans realize that supporting O.J. isn't all it's cracked up to be. White folks want a chance to say, "See, I told you so."

"I just hope we know that revenge does not equal justice."
Jemele Hill
espn

yep -- lots of credibility there -- LOL. The criminal verdict is to be respected but the civil verdict can be ignored. Uh -- No!

[kjb19500]

What I'm trying to say (sorry I don't any kind of law experience, just common sense through life) is that there are usually at least two ways to handle a situation. I think Simpson chose the wrong way.

Back in the mid-70s I had a motorcycle stolen. I worked nights and when I came home I found it missing. I had a strong suspicion who took it and I was right. I had a couple of guns at the time and some pretty strong friends.

I had two options: Get my guns and friends, drive over to the home of the person I suspected and take the motorcycle back. After all, it was mine and it was stolen. No question of ownership involved, of course. My second option was calling the police and reporting my suspicions. I chose the second course, the bike was recovered (though useless, the SOB and his friend had already stripped it down.)

It was reported to Simpson by Riccio (apparently) that others had Simpson's memorabilia, alledgedly stolen from him at some point in time. As in my situation, he had two options but chose the former.

My point is that two wrongs don't make a right. If the loot was stolen, Simpson had a legal right to recover it. He could have notified the police and arranged to meet them at the hotel. Maybe they don't like him and think he got away with murder, but I also think that most professionals are able to rise above their prejudices and do what's right. After all, they don't let someone who just murdered a dangerous drug dealer walk. In taking matters into his/their own hand(s), another crime was committed, just as it would have been a crime for me to forcefully recover my stolen motorcycle at gunpoint.

[martin II]

What I'm trying to say (sorry I don't any kind of law experience, just common sense through life) is that there are usually at least two ways to handle a situation. I think Simpson chose the wrong way.

Back in the mid-70s I had a motorcycle stolen. I worked nights and when I came home I found it missing. I had a strong suspicion who took it and I was right. I had a couple of guns at the time and some pretty strong friends.

I had two options: Get my guns and friends, drive over to the home of the person I suspected and take the motorcycle back. After all, it was mine and it was stolen. No question of ownership involved, of course. My second option was calling the police and reporting my suspicions. I chose the second course, the bike was recovered (though useless, the SOB and his friend had already stripped it down.)

It was reported to Simpson by Riccio (apparently) that others had Simpson's memorabilia, alledgedly stolen from him at some point in time. As in my situation, he had two options but chose the former.

My point is that two wrongs don't make a right. If the loot was stolen, Simpson had a legal right to recover it. He could have notified the police and arranged to meet them at the hotel. Maybe they don't like him and think he got away with murder, but I also think that most professionals are able to rise above their prejudices and do what's right. After all, they don't let someone who just murdered a dangerous drug dealer walk. In taking matters into his/their own hand(s), another crime was committed, just as it would have been a crime for me to forcefully recover my stolen motorcycle at gunpoint.

kjb19500

Pleased you got your bike back.I think oj thought it would be easy to get the stuff that Ricco told him was in the room and may have been a little too excited when he saw who had his stuff(some buddies)Don't think he knew someone had guns and would have said no guns to his guys if he had known.
If he had called the police, they would have had to keep the goods as evidence until some court action was over so at the time he may have thought that he would get his goods and it would all be over.

What caused the problem was the people with the guns.

martin II

[Jayme K]

What I'm trying to say (sorry I don't any kind of law experience, just common sense through life) is that there are usually at least two ways to handle a situation. I think Simpson chose the wrong way.

Back in the mid-70s I had a motorcycle stolen. I worked nights and when I came home I found it missing. I had a strong suspicion who took it and I was right. I had a couple of guns at the time and some pretty strong friends.

I had two options: Get my guns and friends, drive over to the home of the person I suspected and take the motorcycle back. After all, it was mine and it was stolen. No question of ownership involved, of course. My second option was calling the police and reporting my suspicions. I chose the second course, the bike was recovered (though useless, the SOB and his friend had already stripped it down.)

It was reported to Simpson by Riccio (apparently) that others had Simpson's memorabilia, alledgedly stolen from him at some point in time. As in my situation, he had two options but chose the former.

My point is that two wrongs don't make a right. If the loot was stolen, Simpson had a legal right to recover it. He could have notified the police and arranged to meet them at the hotel. Maybe they don't like him and think he got away with murder, but I also think that most professionals are able to rise above their prejudices and do what's right. After all, they don't let someone who just murdered a dangerous drug dealer walk. In taking matters into his/their own hand(s), another crime was committed, just as it would have been a crime for me to forcefully recover my stolen motorcycle at gunpoint.

Ah, a voice of reason. Hallelujah!

O.J. Simpson thinks that because he turned justice on it's head once that he'll be able to get away with anything. I personally think justice has been waiting a long time to catch up with this creep and I, for one, am so totally looking forward to this. Even if the guy doesn't do time I'm getting a good chuckle out of the agony he has to endure.

[socaldiva]

Ah, a voice of reason. Hallelujah!

O.J. Simpson thinks that because he turned justice on it's head once that he'll be able to get away with anything. I personally think justice has been waiting a long time to catch up with this creep and I, for one, am so totally looking forward to this. Even if the guy doesn't do time I'm getting a good chuckle out of the agony he has to endure.


:beer: :beer: Pablo F. said yesterday on Dr Phil that he thinks the reason for the Vegas stunt is that OJ was having a meltdown relative to the pending release of the book that was snatched by Fred. :D

[tv]

:beer: :beer: Pablo F. said yesterday on Dr Phil that he thinks the reason for the Vegas stunt is that OJ was having a meltdown relative to the pending release of the book that was snatched by Fred. :DThat thought occurred to me too. IMO, he was having a meltdown when he killed Nicole. Nicole and Paula had both rejected him and he couldn't handle it. I think he handles extreme stress and frustration with violence.

[WarmNCozy]

That thought occurred to me too. IMO, he was having a meltdown when he killed Nicole. Nicole and Paula had both rejected him and he couldn't handle it. I think he handles extreme stress and frustration with violence.

Are you his psychiatrist? How could you possibly assume how he handles stress and frustration by what you read in the media and on a message board?

Nicole and Paula had used him you meant to say. And wanted to move on but with his financial help and connections!

IMOPO

[martin II]

Are you his psychiatrist? How could you possibly assume how he handles stress and frustration by what you read in the media and on a message board?

Nicole and Paula had used him you meant to say. And wanted to move on but with his financial help and connections!

IMOPO

Exactly

Manipulation is what it looks like to me.With that big wad of money Nicole got from the divoice, she should have been long gone.But it seems that she only moved 5 minutes away. Why?
martin II

[martin II]

That thought occurred to me too. IMO, he was having a meltdown when he killed Nicole. Nicole and Paula had both rejected him and he couldn't handle it. I think he handles extreme stress and frustration with violence.

I find it difficult to see how Paula rejected oj as she was by his side for the duration of the trial and after.Where did she go?

martin II

[socaldiva]

I find it difficult to see how Paula rejected oj as she was by his side for the duration of the trial and after.Where did she go?

martin II

Paula left a kiss off message for Orenthal the night of the murders, yet you "find it difficult to see how Paula rejected oj"?. Paula only came back after Orenthal was arrested, because she was implored to do so by his family. They didn't stay together when he got out, did they? How many times can you ignore these basic elements & pretend they don't exist?

[socaldiva]

Are you his psychiatrist? How could you possibly assume how he handles stress and frustration by what you read in the media and on a message board?

Nicole and Paula had used him you meant to say. And wanted to move on but with his financial help and connections!

IMOPO

Why is it that you often feel compelled to make these personal, snide remarks to other posters?

Dr Phil may not be a psychiatrist, but he is a psychologist ;) Judging from Orenthal's behavior, I seriously doubt that he has a psychiatrist. If he does, he needs to up his meds :tongue:

[tv]

Are you his psychiatrist? How could you possibly assume how he handles stress and frustration by what you read in the media and on a message board?

Nicole and Paula had used him you meant to say. And wanted to move on but with his financial help and connections!

IMOPOThis is a message board and I was expressing my opinion as evidenced by IMO and I think . You have no way of knowing if I've formed this opinion from the media and reading message boards or if I've done more research into the OJ Simpson saga.

It's extremely obnoxious of you correct me and tell me what I meant to say. I said exactly what I meant to say and I stand by it. You'll just have to get over it.

[tv]

Exactly

Manipulation is what it looks like to me.With that big wad of money Nicole got from the divoice, she should have been long gone.But it seems that she only moved 5 minutes away. Why?
martin IIGee, martin, why don't we ask Nicole why she made the decisions she did? Oh that's right, we can't, because OJ Simpson cut her throat and left her to die in a pool of her own blood. Now, we're supposed to take Simpson's word for why she did what she did because she's not here to say. Nah...I don't think so.

[Jayme K]

Are you his psychiatrist? How could you possibly assume how he handles stress and frustration by what you read in the media and on a message board?

Nicole and Paula had used him you meant to say. And wanted to move on but with his financial help and connections!

IMOPO

Huh, maybe the same way you claim to know the truth of the crime by reading one website.

And by the way, Paula was financially set before O.J. ambled into the scene. Why don't you try to actually get a fact or two straight before you mouth off?

[martin II]

Huh, maybe the same way you claim to know the truth of the crime by reading one website.

And by the way, Paula was financially set before O.J. ambled into the scene. Why don't you try to actually get a fact or two straight before you mouth off?

tv
The only info we have as to what nicole thought or did not do is what she did and did not do and from testimony from various friends in crourt.
We know she got about $400,000,$10,000.00 child support and oj paying the chlidrens insurance.That is a matter of court records.
We know she only moved 5 minutes away from oj at GG and then Bundy.We know that during this time she approached oj about allowing her to move back to Rockingham and wrote him a letter accepting responsibility and he refused her request.

What i am saying is that from these actions it does not seem that she wanted to be too far from him because if she had, she had the means to move as far away as she wanted to and be finished with him. If she wanted to be away from him she would not have been going out to dinner and to trips to Cobo and other dates with him during this period.

It seems that after the divoice and the opportunity to "do what she wanted to do" and live her own life, she obviously also decided that she still needed various support and invovlement with him.

MARTIN ii

[tv]

tv
The only info we have as to what nicole thought or did not do is what she did and did not do and from testimony from various friends in crourt.
We know she got about $400,000,$10,000.00 child support and oj paying the chlidrens insurance.That is a matter of court records.
We know she only moved 5 minutes away from oj at GG and then Bundy.We know that during this time she approached oj about allowing her to move back to Rockingham and wrote him a letter accepting responsibility and he refused her request.

What i am saying is that from these actions it does not seem that she wanted to be too far from him because if she had, she had the means to move as far away as she wanted to and be finished with him. If she wanted to be away from him she would not have been going out to dinner and to trips to Cobo and other dates with him during this period.

It seems that after the divoice and the opportunity to "do what she wanted to do" and live her own life, she obviously also decided that she still needed various support and invovlement with him.

MARTIN iiYou are wrong, martin. There was talk of her moving back to Rockingham in April of 1994 when they went to Cabo San Lucas. When she returned from Mexico she had changed her mind. She was done with him. He was crushed and furious that she rejected him. I don't know where you get the idea that he refused her.

As far as where she lived we're all free to live where we choose. Perhaps if the IRS had wiped out her savings she would have moved away but we'll never know because she never got the chance to make the decision.

[socaldiva]

You are wrong, martin. There was talk of her moving back to Rockingham in April of 1994 when they went to Cabo San Lucas. When she returned from Mexico she had changed her mind. She was done with him. He was crushed and furious that she rejected him. I don't know where you get the idea that he refused her.

As far as where she lived we're all free to live where we choose. Perhaps if the IRS had wiped out her savings she would have moved away but we'll never know because she never got the chance to make the decision.

Yes, Martin definitely seems to have his times mixed up as to Nicole wanting to move back to Rockingham.

As for where she chose to live, she probably didn't want to uproot the children from their schools, but IIRC she was preparing to move out of the area. Maybe that's part of the equation as to what sent Orenthal over the edge.

[tv]

Yes, Martin definitely seems to have his times mixed up as to Nicole wanting to move back to Rockingham.

As for where she chose to live, she probably didn't want to uproot the children from their schools, but IIRC she was preparing to move out of the area. Maybe that's part of the equation as to what sent Orenthal over the edge.Now that you mention it, I seem to remember reading something about her plans to move out of the area. I'm sure Simpson wouldn't have liked that because it would have hampered his efforts to control her.

[martin II]

LOS ANGELES - Prosecutors normally get a boost from suspects agreeing to testify against one another, but O.J. Simpson's attorneys may be able to use his co-defendants' past legal run-ins to undermine their credibility.

"It's a defense lawyer's dream to cross-examine these witnesses," said Laurie Levenson, a professor at Loyola Law School in Los Angeles and a former federal prosecutor. "You can put someone up before a firing squad and the squad members can start shooting at each other.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071016/ap_on_re_us/o_j__simpson_27;_ylt=AoHlelCDYHvqw0ofUdnPuk1nhVID


martin II

[socaldiva]

Now that you mention it, I seem to remember reading something about her plans to move out of the area. I'm sure Simpson wouldn't have liked that because it would have hampered his efforts to control her.

Simpson probably figured he could get her back to Rockingham with his refusal to go along with the IRS plan, but once that didn't work & she was still moving forward, it was another signal she was done with him. imo

[martin II]

Now that you mention it, I seem to remember reading something about her plans to move out of the area. I'm sure Simpson wouldn't have liked that because it would have hampered his efforts to control her.

tv
you are correct i also read that nicole had plans to move out of the area but this was long after the divoice and after oj and paula had restarted their relationship. It seems that if oj had ideas of controlling her, he would have allowed her to move back to Rockingham when she wrote that letter taking responsibility for some of their problems and asking him to let her move back to his home.imo
martin II

[tv]

Simpson probably figured he could get her back to Rockingham with his refusal to go along with the IRS plan, but once that didn't work & she was still moving forward, it was another signal she was done with him. imoSince she was unwilling to go back to him to save her bank account that says loud and clear that she was cutting her loses with him.

[socaldiva]

*snip*
you are correct i also read that nicole had plans to move out of the area but this was long after the divoice

We are talking about after the 'divoice', right around the time of the murders ;)

[socaldiva]

Since she was unwilling to go back to him to save her bank account that says loud and clear that she was cutting her loses with him.

I agree. Once she realized he was willing to possibly put the children in the position of being without a home, she was done. imo

[martin II]

You are wrong, martin. There was talk of her moving back to Rockingham in April of 1994 when they went to Cabo San Lucas. When she returned from Mexico she had changed her mind. She was done with him. He was crushed and furious that she rejected him. I don't know where you get the idea that he refused her.

As far as where she lived we're all free to live where we choose. Perhaps if the IRS had wiped out her savings she would have moved away but we'll never know because she never got the chance to make the decision.


tv
Niolce wrote that letter to oj asking him to allow her to move back to rockingham, he refused. Otherwise she would have been living at rockingham after the letter.

It was reported that if Nicole had rented the Bundy condo instead of living there she would not have had the IRS problem.So that was her decision. she must have had the advice of a lawyer and accountant when she purchased the Bundy condo. IMO
MARTIN ii
She lived at GG just befoe Bundy. imo
martin II

[tv]

tv
Niolce wrote that letter to oj asking him to allow her to move back to rockingham, he refused. Otherwise she would have been living at rockingham after the letter.

It was reported that if Nicole had rented the Bundy condo instead of living there she would not have had the IRS problem.So that was her decision. she must have had the advice of a lawyer and accountant when she purchased the Bundy condo. IMO
MARTIN ii
She lived at GG just befoe Bundy. imo
martin IImartin, what I posted about them going to Mexico is the way it was. She changed her mind and he was furious. These facts are not really in dispute.

[martin II]

Since she was unwilling to go back to him to save her bank account that says loud and clear that she was cutting her loses with him.

TV
Are you ignoring Nicoles letter to oj taking responsibility and asking him to let her move back to rockingham? This letter has been posted here and discussed more than once. imo


martin II

[martin II]

Since she was unwilling to go back to him to save her bank account that says loud and clear that she was cutting her loses with him.

tv

Nicoles bank account was in trouble the moment she baught and moved into bundy to live there.She was just trying to clean up that mistake when she later asked him to let her use his address. She had to know, using his address would have caused her to be more involved with him. He rejected this involvement by tell her NO.

martin II

[tv]

TV
Are you ignoring Nicoles letter to oj taking responsibility and asking him to let her move back to rockingham? This letter has been posted here and discussed more than once. imo


martin IImartin, testimony from Paula Barbereri in the civil trial:

PETROCELLI: "In April of 1993, did that breakup have anything to do with an attempted reconciliation between Mr. Simpson and Nicole?"

PAULA BARBIERI: "It had something to do with it, yes."

PETROCELLI: "In other words, Mr. Simpson was going to attempt a reconciliation with Nicole. Is that right?"

PAULA BARBIERI: "Yes."

PETROCELLI: "In April of '94, you and Mr. Simpson got back together again...Is that because Mr. Simpson's attempted reconciliation failed?"

PAULA BARBIERI: "Yes."

Triumph of Justice-- Daniel Petrocelli, page 93 - 94

[tv]

tv

Nicoles bank account was in trouble the moment she baught and moved into bundy to live there.She was just trying to clean up that mistake when she later asked him to let her use his address. She had to know, using his address would have caused her to be more involved with him. He rejected this involvement by tell her NO.

martin IIGood for him, martin. It shows how concerned he was for his children.

[martin II]

martin, testimony from Paula Barbereri in the civil trial:

PETROCELLI: "In April of 1993, did that breakup have anything to do with an attempted reconciliation between Mr. Simpson and Nicole?"

PAULA BARBIERI: "It had something to do with it, yes."

PETROCELLI: "In other words, Mr. Simpson was going to attempt a reconciliation with Nicole. Is that right?"

PAULA BARBIERI: "Yes."

PETROCELLI: "In April of '94, you and Mr. Simpson got back together again...Is that because Mr. Simpson's attempted reconciliation failed?"

PAULA BARBIERI: "Yes."

Triumph of Justice-- Daniel Petrocelli, page 93 - 94

tv
imo that when Paula and oj got back togeather Nicole realized that it was over for her and she then made plans to move from the brentwood area.
imo
martin II

[martin II]

Good for him, martin. It shows how concerned he was for his children.

I am sure oj knew nicole could have easily just rentred another apartment as she did at GG when he assisted her in getting that rental lease. The children were never at risk of not having a place to live.imo
martin II

[weezer]

Exactly

Manipulation is what it looks like to me.With that big wad of money Nicole got from the divoice, she should have been long gone.But it seems that she only moved 5 minutes away. Why?
martin II

so the kids could stay in the neighborhood they had grown up in?

[weezer]

I find it difficult to see how Paula rejected oj as she was by his side for the duration of the trial and after.Where did she go?

martin II

IIRC, she curled up in Michael Bolton's bed that night!!!! ;)

[weezer]

tv
The only info we have as to what nicole thought or did not do is what she did and did not do and from testimony from various friends in crourt.
We know she got about $400,000,$10,000.00 child support and oj paying the chlidrens insurance.That is a matter of court records.
We know she only moved 5 minutes away from oj at GG and then Bundy.We know that during this time she approached oj about allowing her to move back to Rockingham and wrote him a letter accepting responsibility and he refused her request.

What i am saying is that from these actions it does not seem that she wanted to be too far from him because if she had, she had the means to move as far away as she wanted to and be finished with him. If she wanted to be away from him she would not have been going out to dinner and to trips to Cobo and other dates with him during this period.

It seems that after the divoice and the opportunity to "do what she wanted to do" and live her own life, she obviously also decided that she still needed various support and invovlement with him.

MARTIN ii

hmmm -- you do know that she had leased an apt away from Brentwood, right? you do know that she had broken it off completely with orenthal, right?