The Zodiac killer died Aug 26, 2006 in Olympia Wa.

[dkaufman]

The suspect that has been the focus of the zodiac investigation
since the case reopened in 2000, has passed away on August 26, 2006, at age 78, in Olympia Washington. His identity has never been made public until now, his name is "J.W. Tarrance." Here is the true identity of the Zodiac....
(http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com)

Dennis Kaufman

[quiscalus]

Hi Dennis,

Your information is very compelling, and it sickens me that squabbling and politics between law enforcement factions might have kept this man from being prosecuted while he was alive.

One question: Is his biological son still alive, and if so, do you fear there might be repercussions from him for your coming forward?

My prayers are with you, and I'm sorry that your mother had to live in fear and die so tragically. God bless you, and I hope you are given the opportunity to put this out there for all to see.

[crocdog]

Originally posted by quiscalus
>SNIP<

Your information is very compelling, and it sickens me that squabbling and politics between law enforcement factions might have kept this man from being prosecuted while he was alive.


My prayers are with you, and I'm sorry that your mother had to live in fear and die so tragically. God bless you, and I hope you are given the opportunity to put this out there for all to see. [/B]>SNIP<
///////

Dennis, I, too, am sorry about the fear and the death of your Mother because of political jealousy between law enforcement agencies.

Your information is, indeed, very compelling.

I think Bill Kurtis (A&E COLD CASE FILES), would be very interested in this case.

Contact him at the A&E Cold Case Web Site.

Again, I am very sorry for your loss of your Mother.:rose:

[dkaufman]

Thank you

[diamond d]

This Zodiac case to me is so intriguing, freaky/spooky even. Dennis I really like your website with all the pics and those recorded phone calls are amazing. To my ears I hear Jack confess, maybe that's just me but I do. What has happened to Jacks possessions now that he is dead, where are they, do you have any? What happened to the place where he lived, have you been there after his death? Did you ever go and meet him to have that supposed talk about what he did? Do you have any evidence to support the notion that Jack was also the Texarcanna phantom killer? Sorry for all the questions Dennis, it's just this case is so amazing to me. I wonder how long it takes till your "buddy" Ed gets on here and starts his crap, anyways, look forwards to your posts.

[dkaufman]

Diamond D,

Thank you for your positive feedback, and I appreciate you taking the time and looking at the evidence. As far as the Texarcana murders I have no proof that Jack committed those crimes. Jack told me himself that he was reasponsible for the Texarcana murders, and he almost got caught but managed to escape by jumping onto a moving train. Jack said he had to jump off of the train before it came to a stop, and when he jumped he landed in grassburs and gravel, he got cut up pretty bad. After he told me about the Texarcana murders I looked into them and there were alot of similarities to the zodiac crimes. All the murders in Texarcana were on Saturday, and that is payday according to Jack. Jack's father would keep track of everything Jack did wrong during the week, and on Saturday he would get paddled, it was payday.

[diamond d]

Diamond D,

Thank you for your positive feedback, and I appreciate you taking the time and looking at the evidence. As far as the Texarcana murders I have no proof that Jack committed those crimes. Jack told me himself that he was reasponsible for the Texarcana murders, and he almost got caught but managed to escape by jumping onto a moving train. Jack said he had to jump off of the train before it came to a stop, and when he jumped he landed in grassburs and gravel, he got cut up pretty bad. After he told me about the Texarcana murders I looked into them and there were alot of similarities to the zodiac crimes. All the murders in Texarcana were on Saturday, and that is payday according to Jack. Jack's father would keep track of everything Jack did wrong during the week, and on Saturday he would get paddled, it was payday.

That sounds crazy, no wonder Jack turned out a bit loopy. Dennis the recording on your website are amazing, quite freaky actually. Did you actually go and meet with Jack after those recordings where made, what I want to know is, did Jack ever say to you in plain english that he was the Zodiac killer. I believe he admitted it on your recorded conversations in a round about kind of way, but did he ever say to you "yes Dennis, I am the Zodiac killer"...?

[diamond d]

:seeya: I think Dennis's info about Jack is very persuasive. When I read all his info about Jack, it made perfect sense. It is not at all hard for me to believe that Jack was the Zodiac killer. I just wondered if Jack had the knowledge of language codes(I think I asked this before, somewhere), and if he had been in military? The Zociac, seemed to have a great deal of knowledge when it comes to codes. AND the investigators said they believed him to be a military man(inn his background).

Those cyphers (codes) that Z sent, I can't make heads nor tails of them. All those symbols somehow mean something, one or 2 of them where cracked I believe, I have no idea how they could crack them. Either a codes specialist or an insane person would be able to make those up. Dennis, do you have any insight on the codes and how Z (Jack) would be able to create them.

[sc333]

i have e mailed you waiting for a response to some questions. i look back at some of the replys and i see you say you hope jack dna doesnt mean he is the zodiac the only problem i have with this. he stilled killed your mom isnt that enough never to forgive him lisen i believe your story and the evidence is on point to end this case and bring families that have lost loves some settlement in there lives .i have reached out to a friend that has ties with ae and sent him your web page . like i said before ive been following serial killer for a long time and that killer in nyc that a parking ticket that got him caught . was son of sam david b i have followed alot of big cases even the copycat zodiac in nyc that was caught so if you can please get back to me god bless you and your family i cant imagine or even begin how hard this has been

[Melosz]

(http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com)

Link's broken or maybe just overloaded with traffic :confused:

Anyone have a new/working link for this site?

[lildoxiedog]

The link is working for me.

Very interesting the resemblance to the sketches. And the dates, times and places. Any chance of having a DNA match done?

[sc333]

tonight on americas feb 24th 9pm eastern time the zodiac case and interviews with the stars of new movie

[dkaufman]

Jack Tarrance will be featured on America's Most Wanted this evening. They claim that Jack has been eliminated as a suspect, yet they do not explain how he was eliminated. I am sure they got this info from the San Francisco P.D. I also believe that there is also a posibility that the folks that produced the new zodiac movie might have something to do with Jack's so called "elimination" I ask, when, and how, was Jack eliminated? This is news to me......I have a suprise for the glory seeking SFPD that will be released with my book on March 6...........Dennis Kaufman

(http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com)

[sc333]

did you see americas most wanted on feb 24th they did show your site and jack . as suspects aND MENTIONED YOU DENNIS.they say all your evidence is circumstantial how they see that beyond me its seems two or three people believe that larry cain may be him also but bye what you have shown . is really undeinable to me anyway thou it still seems to me that zodiac did not have a southern kind of way when he talked .like jack has a very strong one did you ever go to someone maybe would be able to compare jacks hjand writting to zodiac that guy alan a the writting specilist says couldnt not be zodiac hand writting was way way off AND WERE DO I GET A COPY OF THIS BOOK ANY BOOK STORE BARNES AND NOBLE WHATS THE NAME OF THE BOOK BUT IF YOU CAN TRULEY EVER PROVE THAT JACK IS THE ZODIAC YOUR BOOK would make triple the money and movies but most of all piece of mind for you and the familys that this terrible evil that they have been living with talk to you soon

[diamond d]

Jack Tarrance will be featured on America's Most Wanted this evening. They claim that Jack has been eliminated as a suspect, yet they do not explain how he was eliminated. I am sure they got this info from the San Francisco P.D. I also believe that there is also a posibility that the folks that produced the new zodiac movie might have something to do with Jack's so called "elimination" I ask, when, and how, was Jack eliminated? This is news to me......I have a suprise for the glory seeking SFPD that will be released with my book on March 6...........Dennis Kaufman

(http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com)

NOT AGAIN, I always miss the shows that feature Zodiac, I can't believe it. I have never seen a show when the Zodiac is featured, needless to say I'm choked. Is there anyway I can see the show online still? Anyways, I have looked into and read pretty much everything that is available on the web as far as Jack Tarrance being a suspect is concerned. Dennis does a great job of putting it all together on his site. To my non expert eyes I see very convincing proof that Jack almost beyond reasonable doubt is Zodiac, but something is wrong. There is a reason why the FBI and SFPD have dismissed Jack as a suspect so readily, I can't put my finger on it just quite yet but something is ascue (not right). Some say it is because of various glory hungry people are putting up road blocks so other agencies can't solve it before them, others say it's because of the politics between the various departments, personally I don't buy either arguements, there is another reason.

[AmyW]

Interesting evidence and theories! I look forward to seeing more. http://www.amw.com/features/feature_story_detail.cfm?id=1542

[diamond d]

I plan on seeing the new movie, I'd be interested to hear any review on it. Dennis if you happen to see it, I'd like to hear your opinion it it as well.

[lildoxiedog]

I saw the new Zodiac movie last Friday night. Here's what I thought about it:

1. It is not really "scary". I thought it was more of a drama. In fact several teenagers were complaining because they said it wasn't scary at all.

2. It is not horribly gruesome. Yes, it depicted the violence, but without turning into a gore fest. I thought it was tastefully done for the most part.

3. It is about one author's theory and why he thinks one particular suspect is the Zodiac. I don't want to spoil the movie if anyone wants to go.

4. I was a little disappointed it didn't delve into more suspects and more theories. But the evidence it portrayed was interesting.

5. I think they presented the "facts" that supported their theory. And briefly touched upon the others.

6. I think it was worth the money it cost to go to the theater and see it. Even though I disagree with the writers.

7. The movie lasted for approx. 2 hours and 50 minutes, but I was engrossed enough that it didn't seem that long. I also wouldn't get up to get a refill on my drink because I was afraid I would miss something.

[AmyW]

I'm really interested in this man as a suspect, but the handwriting analysis threw me a bit. He makes his lower case "A"s the same way I do, but the Zodiac letters show them written the way most people write them. The writing is similar and I'm not giving up on Jack as the possible killer. Thanks for posting this.

[diamond d]

Thanks for the review, I kind figured it was mostly about the authors suspect, which is a little dissapointing, I was hoping for a more non bias interpretation. Personally I consider Jack the overwhelming number 1 suspect, I'd love to see a movie biased towards him being the Zodiac, anyways, I'll wait for DVD to come out on this one ...

[JTF]

Zodiac is a great movie and one of the best true crime movies ever made. Having said that, it is not a ringing endorsement of the truth in this case. For the most part, the movie focuses on Arthur Leigh Allen as Zodiac. Anyone who considers themselves a serious Zodiac case researcher knows that Allen was not Zodiac. You have to go where the evidence takes you and all of the significant evidentiary items clear Allen as a suspect:

1) Allen passed a polygraph exam.

2) Two handwriting experts stated that Allen was not the author of the Zodiac letters.

3) Bloody prints found in Paul Stine's cab and several prints of value found on Zodiac letters do not match Allen's print exemplars.

4) A partial DNA profile obtained in 2002, does not match Allen's DNA profile.

Despite all of this evidence, Robert Graysmith has turned a blind eye for the sake of profit. Zodiac director, David Fincher, has done the same. Allen was not the Zodiac killer and it appears that law enforcement never came close to catching Zodiac.

JTF.

[AmyW]

I have the book that names Allen as the killer and I, too, wasn't convinced. I haven't seen the movie and am disappointed to hear that they used him as inspiration. There was a lot of circumstantial evidence pointing to him, but I still don't believe he was the Zodiac. :shrug:

[JTF]

There is not a single piece of hard evidence that links Arthur Leigh Allen to the Zodiac murders. Graysmith has not allowed the evidence to be his guide in this case. At best, he has become completely tunnel-visioned and at worst, he is an investigative vulture who has chosen the almighty dollar over the truth.

JTF.

[diamond d]

Zodiac is a great movie and one of the best true crime movies ever made. Having said that, it is not a ringing endorsement of the truth in this case. For the most part, the movie focuses on Arthur Leigh Allen as Zodiac. Anyone who considers themselves a serious Zodiac case researcher knows that Allen was not Zodiac. You have to go where the evidence takes you and all of the significant evidentiary items clear Allen as a suspect:

1) Allen passed a polygraph exam.

2) Two handwriting experts stated that Allen was not the author of the Zodiac letters.

3) Bloody prints found in Paul Stine's cab and several prints of value found on Zodiac letters do not match Allen's print exemplars.

4) A partial DNA profile obtained in 2002, does not match Allen's DNA profile.

Despite all of this evidence, Robert Graysmith has turned a blind eye for the sake of profit. Zodiac director, David Fincher, has done the same. Allen was not the Zodiac killer and it appears that law enforcement never came close to catching Zodiac.

JTF.


I agree completely, I was so hoping that this current movie would have focused on both Arthur Allen and Jack, do like a compare and contrast style of film, leave it up to the viewer to decide, don't shove a suspect down the audiences thoats when clearly is not Zodiac when pure evidence is looked at. I just don't understand why the FBI or whoever will not look at suspect Jack as hard and indepth as they did Arthur Allen, at this point in time, what does anyone have to loose?

[JTF]

Diamond D: Notice how they use 4 different actors to play Zodiac during his murder spree, yet when it came time to wrap up the movie, Fincher buys Graysmith's fairy tales about Allen hook, line, and sinker. My guess is that Fincher told Warner Bros executives that a movie without a definitive boogie man can work by simply playing up several scenes (e.g., initial questioning of Allen at his workplace, brief meeting between Graysmith and Allen at the hardware store) for dramatic effect. Fincher used mood over content to bring forth the idea that Zodiac's identity was known, but that the law couldn't touch him.

JTF.

[dkaufman]

For anyone interested my book "The Man Behind the Mask" is now available to order. With the book you also get a cd that contains conversations I had with law enforcement, family members, and Jack Tarrance himself. If there is any doubt about Jack Tarrance being the Zodiac Killer, there won't be after you listen to this cd, and the cd might not be available very long so get it while you can.........http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com

[diamond d]

Diamond D: Notice how they use 4 different actors to play Zodiac during his murder spree, yet when it came time to wrap up the movie, Fincher buys Graysmith's fairy tales about Allen hook, line, and sinker. My guess is that Fincher told Warner Bros executives that a movie without a definitive boogie man can work by simply playing up several scenes (e.g., initial questioning of Allen at his workplace, brief meeting between Graysmith and Allen at the hardware store) for dramatic effect. Fincher used mood over content to bring forth the idea that Zodiac's identity was known, but that the law couldn't touch him.

JTF.

Yes there definitely is that sense of "we know who he is but we just can't touch him." Allen on my list has been crossed off long ago.

[diamond d]

Dennis I just purchased your book and CD combo, I'll give a critique when I receive it.

[diamond d]

Dennis
I am still waiting to receive your book, do you know if it has been sent out yet?

[Charlemaine]

Dennis
I am still waiting to receive your book, do you know if it has been sent out yet?

I'm curious; did you ever receive (and read) the book and CD?

[pickled_oleum]

I have still not heard an absolute refutation by Kaufman regarding the issue of the shirt for sale, nor have I recieved a reply regarding the audio quality of the CD that he is selling.
I must state that I am disconcerted by the premise, though, of a man who would sell this information on an apparently homemade CD (??) rather than, if he believed it to be true, and could prove it, posting it in a more public forum, such as sending it to a major newspaper, etc.

[pickled_oleum]

After having asked kaufman, via email, about specific details not lighted on his site, and after considering that it is likely that he's just trying to get a few extra bucks in his wallet by selling a compelling story, I think that he is a fraud. I'll admit in advance that I might be wrong. There is something irking about his callous inclination to just sell the CD rather than make this info public in a forum where any interested can see it. Really, if I hadn't been poking around for Z info, I'd have never even heard of him.

[Livia]

Interesting how Kaufman just vanished into the ether, isn't it? He stayed around just long enough apparently to drum up some business....then departed. I wonder if diamond d ever received this "book"??

He showed up on another true-crime forum to which I belong and tried the same stuff there. It didn't work and I think he vanished without a trace from that site too.

Creepy.

And if he isn't a fraud, he certainly does an excellent impersonation of one.

IMHO, of course.

[JoAnneMB1]

Diamond D, did you receive the book that you purchased? If you did not, that's completely my fault -- not Dennis'. Although Dennis wrote the book, I am handling his orders. You'll note that the "Buy Now" button links to my PayPal account.

Please let me know if you received the book. If you did not, please accept my apologies... I'll get it to you right away.

JoAnne

[JoAnneMB1]

Pickled, this is in reply to your post stating that Dennis must be a fraud because he is selling his book/CD rather than posting it in a public forum. Dennis has a wealth of information, available for free to the public, on his web site. He wrote the book only because so many visitors to his site begged him to do so. And yes, he is charging a fee for the book to cover the cost of publication. By no means is he "trying to get a few bucks in his wallet" as you state. And believe me, he's not getting rich off the book. In fact, he hasn't broken even yet.

As to your question about the CD, yes it is homemade. It wasn't made in a recording studio. But you know, the fact that Dennis' book and CD are so raw make his story all the more compelling to me. Dennis is not a professional writer, nor is he in the recording business. He's a guy who found out that the man who raised him was the Zodiac. If you want some slick and polished publication, perhaps you'd better stick to Graysmith.

[pickled_oleum]

Okay, but I was curious as to why he had seemed so evasive.
I'm actually too tired to care right now at any rate.

[Mishell1383]

Im curious to see how this all unfolds.
I've been such a lurker in this thread. :( lol

[diamond d]

Hi everyone, I have been away for awhile but I'm back, Yes I did receive the book and CD, I have read the book 2 times over now, my apologies to JoAnne for not replying, I had internet service provider issues and lost my email, nuff said, non the less my bad.

[Path_to_Hope]

The suspect that has been the focus of the zodiac investigation
since the case reopened in 2000, has passed away on August 26, 2006, at age 78, in Olympia Washington. His identity has never been made public until now, his name is "J.W. Tarrance." Here is the true identity of the Zodiac....
(http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com)

Dennis Kaufman

Dennis,

Since I met you in 2002 and heard the tape in person that was not clear at all I see you have named your step dad the Zodiac. Did Jack actually give you a written confession? Did Jack give you anything that the Zodiac took as a trophy say like a piece of Stines shirt? Was he responsible for the disppearance of Donna Lass and if so where is Donna? Was he responsible for killing Cherrie Jo Bates in Riverside? So many questions with no answers.

[Path_to_Hope]

There is not a single piece of hard evidence that links Arthur Leigh Allen to the Zodiac murders. Graysmith has not allowed the evidence to be his guide in this case. At best, he has become completely tunnel-visioned and at worst, he is an investigative vulture who has chosen the almighty dollar over the truth.

JTF.

I agree with you completely. Authur Allen has taken LDT's and passed. His DNA did not match at all. I think Graysmith made money off of this case. I guess he thought he had all the inside information when he worked for the Chronicle at the time Zodiac made his appearance. Now that I know the movie is all about Allen then I will not be wasting my money to see it.

[diamond d]

Path to Hope;
I think it would be helpful for you if you read the book Dennis published, I had to read it twice, both times I was drawn into the chaotic life Dennis must have lived both external from him as as internally. To me, the Zodiac case is no longer this spooky, surreal, nightmarish, only in the movies type of serial killer, murder mystery that it was once to me when I first got interested in the case and joined this board. To me the case has been solved along with a few other cases, and the final nail in the coffin is sitting in a field in Texas that as far as I'm concerned Dennis has to go and get.

[Path_to_Hope]

Path to Hope;
I think it would be helpful for you if you read the book Dennis published, I had to read it twice, both times I was drawn into the chaotic life Dennis must have lived both external from him as as internally. To me, the Zodiac case is no longer this spooky, surreal, nightmarish, only in the movies type of serial killer, murder mystery that it was once to me when I first got interested in the case and joined this board. To me the case has been solved along with a few other cases, and the final nail in the coffin is sitting in a field in Texas that as far as I'm concerned Dennis has to go and get.


I respect your opinion but disagree that this case has been solved. The Zodiac Killer is still on the loose. I would certainly like Dennis to come on here and answer my questions. Where is a new article that says this case has been solved?

[diamond d]

Hope; I understand the opinions are like ... well I'm sure you know how the rest of the saying goes, but when one gives an opinion it can be classified as informed or uninformed. Until you read the book by Dennis, I'm afraid your opinion will be that of the uninformed, with all due respect. For instance, when you say " The Zodiac killer is still on the loose" what single piece of proof do you have that supports the fact that you personally know that the person who committed the crimes associated with the Zodiac killer is still alive and living among us. My bet is you have nothing, but Dennis has a mountain of proof that puts his step dad at each and every Zodiac linked killing location without question and when I say proof I mean physical proof. After you do actually read his book and cross reference it with all the publicly accepted evidence of Zodiac, it's a perfect match. Hope, get the book, it's cheap, take a few days to read it, I read it twice, come back on here and tell us what you think, I guarantee you will sing a different tune...

I respect your opinion but disagree that this case has been solved. The Zodiac Killer is still on the loose. I would certainly like Dennis to come on here and answer my questions. Where is a new article that says this case has been solved?

[Path_to_Hope]

Hope; I understand the opinions are like ... well I'm sure you know how the rest of the saying goes, but when one gives an opinion it can be classified as informed or uninformed. Until you read the book by Dennis, I'm afraid your opinion will be that of the uninformed, with all due respect. For instance, when you say " The Zodiac killer is still on the loose" what single piece of proof do you have that supports the fact that you personally know that the person who committed the crimes associated with the Zodiac killer is still alive and living among us. My bet is you have nothing, but Dennis has a mountain of proof that puts his step dad at each and every Zodiac linked killing location without question and when I say proof I mean physical proof. After you do actually read his book and cross reference it with all the publicly accepted evidence of Zodiac, it's a perfect match. Hope, get the book, it's cheap, take a few days to read it, I read it twice, come back on here and tell us what you think, I guarantee you will sing a different tune...

No offense but I will not ever purchase that book. I have met Dennis in person in and he has told me what he had on Jack and it is nothing more than circumstancial evidence. Unless he has a written confession from Zodiac himself I will continue to believe that Zodiac has not been caught yet.

[diamond d]

Circumstantial evidence, Path are you kidding me? I'm not sure if you have a personal dislike for Dennis because you met him in person and that is why you are so quick to completely dismiss his evidence, but I can not brush off the fact that Dennis is not only able to place Jack at every Zodiac killing area but has on tape Jack himself confessing several times to being Zodiac. Path, if someone accuses me of being Zodiac and I know I'm not that guy, guess what, I'm not going to sit there and agree to that accusation instead, I'm going to deny the hell out of it. So does it not strike you as being strange why Jack would on several taped conversations admit to being Zodiac? After I read read the book, my first thought was why the hell has Jack not been picked up and questioned and DNA tested, that is the one part that I do not understand, Dennis explained it as being the politics between the differing police agencies, but I don't know if I completely accept that explanation. Here in Canada we have our city police and our national police (RCMP) if I go to one of them or both and say I have proof as to the identity of a serial killer, I guarantee you one of the 2 agencies are picking the guy up. Another thing I thought was, doesn't the FBI have authority over all other police agencies, so why would the FBI have to ask SFPD to hand over DNA samples, wouldn't the FBI just go and get them? I guess what I'm trying to say Path is, to me Dennis makes a very very strong case, but there is that one last nail in the coffin that is missing to completely remove reasonable doubt, but if it turns out that Jack is not Zodiac, he died knowing who was because all that circumstace is way too circumstantial to just be circumstance...
No offense but I will not ever purchase that book. I have met Dennis in person in and he has told me what he had on Jack and it is nothing more than circumstancial evidence. Unless he has a written confession from Zodiac himself I will continue to believe that Zodiac has not been caught yet.

[Path_to_Hope]

Circumstantial evidence, Path are you kidding me? I'm not sure if you have a personal dislike for Dennis because you met him in person and that is why you are so quick to completely dismiss his evidence, but I can not brush off the fact that Dennis is not only able to place Jack at every Zodiac killing area but has on tape Jack himself confessing several times to being Zodiac. Path, if someone accuses me of being Zodiac and I know I'm not that guy, guess what, I'm not going to sit there and agree to that accusation instead, I'm going to deny the hell out of it. So does it not strike you as being strange why Jack would on several taped conversations admit to being Zodiac? After I read read the book, my first thought was why the hell has Jack not been picked up and questioned and DNA tested, that is the one part that I do not understand, Dennis explained it as being the politics between the differing police agencies, but I don't know if I completely accept that explanation. Here in Canada we have our city police and our national police (RCMP) if I go to one of them or both and say I have proof as to the identity of a serial killer, I guarantee you one of the 2 agencies are picking the guy up. Another thing I thought was, doesn't the FBI have authority over all other police agencies, so why would the FBI have to ask SFPD to hand over DNA samples, wouldn't the FBI just go and get them? I guess what I'm trying to say Path is, to me Dennis makes a very very strong case, but there is that one last nail in the coffin that is missing to completely remove reasonable doubt, but if it turns out that Jack is not Zodiac, he died knowing who was because all that circumstace is way too circumstantial to just be circumstance...

After listening to the so called taped confession it is in my opinion the transcript has been embellished. When Dennis asked Jack if he was the zodiac and Jack answered back asking what time it is does not make a confession. Enough said. There are many suspects that can also be placed at every one of the crime scenes as well. If Jack was truly the killer then Dennis should have got a signed confession from him and some time of evidence to prove it. Maybe this website would help you to see the whole picture on the case. www.zodiakiller.com

[diamond d]

After listening to the so called taped confession it is in my opinion the transcript has been embellished. When Dennis asked Jack if he was the zodiac and Jack answered back asking what time it is does not make a confession. Enough said. There are many suspects that can also be placed at every one of the crime scenes as well. If Jack was truly the killer then Dennis should have got a signed confession from him and some time of evidence to prove it. Maybe this website would help you to see the whole picture on the case. www.zodiakiller.com

Path, I heard that also and your right it does not make a comfession, however, Jack gives specific details within the book, the one detail that solidified to me that Jack is Zodiac is when Jack tells Dennis that there is a glass jar with all the id's of all the Zodiac victims plus many more burried under the trailer in Texas. Hello, Path, read that sentence again, is that not an admittance? I have read all the sites on this case, looked at mountains of evidence, and Dennis by far has the most convincing batch of evidence. Why can't you just read the book, what's the big deal Path, you have to have an open mind and consider all sources. I have done my research on this case and like I said before there is one piece of evidence missing, either DNA or the glass jar with the id's. But honestly Path your debating me on this which is fine but it is frustrating to me because you have not considered all pieces of info, namely the book. Just read it and if you still believe what your saying now, let's debate some more. Tell me however did you come to meet Dennis ?

[Path_to_Hope]

Path, I heard that also and your right it does not make a comfession, however, Jack gives specific details within the book, the one detail that solidified to me that Jack is Zodiac is when Jack tells Dennis that there is a glass jar with all the id's of all the Zodiac victims plus many more burried under the trailer in Texas. Hello, Path, read that sentence again, is that not an admittance? I have read all the sites on this case, looked at mountains of evidence, and Dennis by far has the most convincing batch of evidence. Why can't you just read the book, what's the big deal Path, you have to have an open mind and consider all sources. I have done my research on this case and like I said before there is one piece of evidence missing, either DNA or the glass jar with the id's. But honestly Path your debating me on this which is fine but it is frustrating to me because you have not considered all pieces of info, namely the book. Just read it and if you still believe what your saying now, let's debate some more. Tell me however did you come to meet Dennis ?

I meet Dennis in California at the task force meeting. Dennis brought the tape and several other items that he has displayed on his webpage. I do agree with you that Dennis may have put things in his book that sounds like it could be an admission but i have seen too many things on this case to believe print in a book makes it legal for Dennis to claim this case is solved. When and if Dennis brings forth solid evidence in this case and the proper authorities holds a news conference to confirm Jack as the killer then I will believe Dennis and will owe him an apology. But in the mean time I do not believe this case has been solved at all.

[diamond d]

I meet Dennis in California at the task force meeting. Dennis brought the tape and several other items that he has displayed on his webpage. I do agree with you that Dennis may have put things in his book that sounds like it could be an admission but i have seen too many things on this case to believe print in a book makes it legal for Dennis to claim this case is solved. When and if Dennis brings forth solid evidence in this case and the proper authorities holds a news conference to confirm Jack as the killer then I will believe Dennis and will owe him an apology. But in the mean time I do not believe this case has been solved at all.

I understand what you're saying, it seems like you might have some inside connection with this case, are you with the press or police? I agree with you on the point of it's hard to believe print in a book, I too was looking for Jack to just outright in his own voice and words say something like yes, I am the Zodiac killer I did them all, but it never happened, now Jack is dead. But would you agree with me on this point that Dennis brings forth more than just circumstantial evidence, he brings forth the type of evidence that is obligated to get a serious all out analysis, I'm talking all out forensics, with complete DNA work up. Do you not think his evidence deserves at least that? Look at how the pretty much witch hunted Arthur Leigh Allen, then low and behold DNA cleared him, and there where even dates of murders when Allen was not even near the location, so why not give Jack now the same scrutiny? Explain that one to me...

[Path_to_Hope]

I understand what you're saying, it seems like you might have some inside connection with this case, are you with the press or police? I agree with you on the point of it's hard to believe print in a book, I too was looking for Jack to just outright in his own voice and words say something like yes, I am the Zodiac killer I did them all, but it never happened, now Jack is dead. But would you agree with me on this point that Dennis brings forth more than just circumstantial evidence, he brings forth the type of evidence that is obligated to get a serious all out analysis, I'm talking all out forensics, with complete DNA work up. Do you not think his evidence deserves at least that? Look at how the pretty much witch hunted Arthur Leigh Allen, then low and behold DNA cleared him, and there where even dates of murders when Allen was not even near the location, so why not give Jack now the same scrutiny? Explain that one to me...

Yes I do agree that Jack's DNA should be checked and then the mystery of Jack will be solved.

[diamond d]

Path, do you have some inside knowledge of this case, are or where you involved in this case?
I rented and watched the movie tonight, I really enjoyed it up until the part when they start to link Allen as Zodiac.

[JTF]

Path: The problem with referring anyone to Zodiackiller.com for an unbiased look at this case is that the individual who runs that website continues to put forth Arthur Leigh Allen as a viable suspect. Robert Graysmith's fairy tales have dominated the media's presentation of this case, so the last thing we need is a popular website backing Graysmith's dubious claims. Bar none, the best Zodiac website in existence is......................................

www.zodiackillerfacts.com

JTF.

[diamond d]

Path: The problem with referring anyone to Zodiackiller.com for an unbiased look at this case is that the individual who runs that website continues to put forth Arthur Leigh Allen as a viable suspect. Robert Graysmith's fairy tales have dominated the media's presentation of this case, so the last thing we need is a popular website backing Graysmith's dubious claims. Bar none, the best Zodiac website in existence is......................................

www.zodiackillerfacts.com

JTF.

JTF, I agree with your assessment of Graysmith and the website zodiackiller.com. I have watched the latest Zodiac movie and even though I enjoyed the movie, for me the legitimacy was lost when the plot began it's desperate attempt to convince the viewers and maybe even itself that Arthur Allen was Zodiac. Anyone who has taken time to evaluate the evidence on Allen and the Zodiac case, no longer considers Arthur Allen a legitimate suspect. I have bought and read twice over the book that Dennis has published on his suspecy Jack, and I can say with great certainty that whatever evidence Graysmith and his supporters have against Allen, Dennis has double that against his suspect Jack. What makes Jack a more credible suspect is not only the multiple verbal confessions by Jack, couple of them actually on tape, but the proof of locations that Jack was at for every Zodiac associated murder. I believe that at this time authorities have absolutely nothing to loose but giving suspect Jack a thorough investigation just like they did to Allen, with all the viable proof that Dennis has, why would the authorities not be willing to have a seriously hard look at this man, like I said before, what do they have to loose.

[JTF]

Diamond: The documented record clearly indicates that Zodiac's bloody fingerprints were present in Paul Stine's cab and partial prints were left on some of the authenticated Zodiac letters. Does Dennis explain why his stepfather's prints have not been compared to the known prints of Zodiac? Despite claims to the contrary by the likes of Graysmith, there is plenty of evidence in this case that excludes specific individuals as the Zodiac killer and would identify the real perp in an eyeblink. Sans hair and fiber evidence, this case contains Zodiac's DNA profile, bloody fingerprint exemplars, palmprint exemplars, partial print exemplars, handwriting exemplars, boot/shoe print exemplars, and eyewitness descriptions.

JTF.

http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.net/

[diamond d]

Diamond: The documented record clearly indicates that Zodiac's bloody fingerprints were present in Paul Stine's cab and partial prints were left on some of the authenticated Zodiac letters. Does Dennis explain why his stepfather's prints have not been compared to the known prints of Zodiac? Despite claims to the contrary by the likes of Graysmith, there is plenty of evidence in this case that excludes specific individuals as the Zodiac killer and would identify the real perp in an eyeblink. Sans hair and fiber evidence, this case contains Zodiac's DNA profile, bloody fingerprint exemplars, palmprint exemplars, partial print exemplars, handwriting exemplars, boot/shoe print exemplars, and eyewitness descriptions.

JTF.

http://www.macdonaldcasefacts.net/

Dennis does explain all of this, without typing a mini novel here it is written in the book that Dennis handed all his evidence over to the FBI, this evidence also included DNA. 3 years later Dennis still did not here back about the finding or about the evaluation of his submitted evidence. Dennis was able to contact an agent that he was familiar with, the agent had told Dennis that the evaluation had not even begun. Because the associated Zodiac murders took place in several different jurisdictions, coordinating the various offices was a task too big for even the FBI to do, so what you have is all of the evidence that Dennis turned in divided among 3 or 4 different offices that can't seem to get together and compare notes. That is pretty much what has happened to Dennis and his evidence. JTF in Dennis's book he recalls multiple conversations he had over the years with Jack before Jacked passed away, if those conversations are accurate and are indeed what Jack said, Jack is Zodiac, it is undeniable, IF the conversations are true and accurate. The info that Dennis provides via his book is compelling at least and without a question of a doubt must be examined by experts. Anyone involved with this case should feel a sense of obligation to look at this evidence. There is one piece of evidence that Jack told Dennis he had that would identify ALL Zodiac killings plus many others, that piece of evidence is a jar with all the ID's of ALL the people Jack (Zodiac) killed. That jar according to Dennis via a conversation with Jack is located in Texas, inn a trailer park, under a trailer. Find that, you find Zodiac and all his victims.

[diamond d]

Has anyone else read the book? or has anyone heard from Dennis?

[JTF]

DD: I must admit that the claims levied by Dennis have raised several red flags and they include the following.

1) He includes several handwriting exemplars of his stepfather on his website. It would take a matter of a few hours to include or exclude his stepfather as the author of the authenticated Zodiac letters. His ongoing claim that the SFPD won't compare Zodiac's fingerprint exemplars because of a power struggle doesn't address the publication of his stepfather's handwriting exemplars. In other words, every handwriting expert above the age of 35 would at least take a cursory look at Dennis' handwriting evidence and most, if not all, of them would be able to ascertain whether the letter resembled the Zodiac letters.

2) I've read where Dennis is alleged to have stated that he had a piece of Paul Stine's shirt, but that he would only be willing to give it up for a price. If memory serves, I believe the price was 50,000 dollars. If that charge is true, any claims levied by Dennis are immediately suspect.

3) I would assume that if Dennis' stepfather left behind bomb diagrams, he would have also left other items of note. This would include a pair of 10 1/2 WW boots/shoes, personal items from one of the victims, or the knife and/or guns used to commit these horrible crimes.

4) It's a myth that authorities in this case did not co-operate with one another during Zodiac's crime spree. If these agencies worked well together in 1970, why would the SFPD suddenly not be willing to share information in 2007? I just don't buy the argument that the SFPD refused to compare Jack's DNA, fingerprint, and handwriting exemplars to the Zodiac killer.

JTF.

[Mishell1383]

By reading these posts and other literature regarding the zodiac, IMO I believe that Dennis is out for a buck, I don't read into any of his claims. All my very own opinion.

[kurro07]

Plus don't forget that some authors have a bad habit of picking the facts that support their theory.

[diamond d]

DD: I must admit that the claims levied by Dennis have raised several red flags and they include the following.

1) He includes several handwriting exemplars of his stepfather on his website. It would take a matter of a few hours to include or exclude his stepfather as the author of the authenticated Zodiac letters. His ongoing claim that the SFPD won't compare Zodiac's fingerprint exemplars because of a power struggle doesn't address the publication of his stepfather's handwriting exemplars. In other words, every handwriting expert above the age of 35 would at least take a cursory look at Dennis' handwriting evidence and most, if not all, of them would be able to ascertain whether the letter resembled the Zodiac letters.

2) I've read where Dennis is alleged to have stated that he had a piece of Paul Stine's shirt, but that he would only be willing to give it up for a price. If memory serves, I believe the price was 50,000 dollars. If that charge is true, any claims levied by Dennis are immediately suspect.

3) I would assume that if Dennis' stepfather left behind bomb diagrams, he would have also left other items of note. This would include a pair of 10 1/2 WW boots/shoes, personal items from one of the victims, or the knife and/or guns used to commit these horrible crimes.

4) It's a myth that authorities in this case did not co-operate with one another during Zodiac's crime spree. If these agencies worked well together in 1970, why would the SFPD suddenly not be willing to share information in 2007? I just don't buy the argument that the SFPD refused to compare Jack's DNA, fingerprint, and handwriting exemplars to the Zodiac killer.

JTF.


JTF;

Yea you know I have struggled with many plus other points of interest within the book and I have mulled over many of the ideas and concepts that Dennis put forth. I do not know any details regarding the $50,000 price tag for the shirt so I won't comment on that. I place most of the weight of my conclusions on a couple of different facts throughout the book. The fact that Dennis has on tape Jack one word shy of all out confessing to being Zodiac. To me that adds tremendous credibility to all other excerpts of conversations between Dennis and Jack throughout the book. keep in mind, I am trusting that Dennis has not embelished and/or out right lied about any of this, having said that I will say again what I have said before, Dennis or someone needs to find the jar of victim id's that Jack said he stashed under the trailer he stayed in. That jar gets found this whole mystery goes away. Does anyone who reads on this board live near or around that trailer park in I believe Dallas who can go snoop around? JTF, I have looked at a lot of evidence and claims about who the Zodiac might be, the latest Zodiac movie was a huge bomb as far as I am concerned simply because the prime suspect in that movie has been ruled out years ago, but there is something about the evidence that Dennis has put together that is far too compelling and frankly it just makes sense. I guess time will tell, maybe

[Mishell1383]

JTF;

Yea you know I have struggled with many plus other points of interest within the book and I have mulled over many of the ideas and concepts that Dennis put forth. I do not know any details regarding the $50,000 price tag for the shirt so I won't comment on that. I place most of the weight of my conclusions on a couple of different facts throughout the book. The fact that Dennis has on tape Jack one word shy of all out confessing to being Zodiac. To me that adds tremendous credibility to all other excerpts of conversations between Dennis and Jack throughout the book. keep in mind, I am trusting that Dennis has not embelished and/or out right lied about any of this, having said that I will say again what I have said before, Dennis or someone needs to find the jar of victim id's that Jack said he stashed under the trailer he stayed in. That jar gets found this whole mystery goes away. Does anyone who reads on this board live near or around that trailer park in I believe Dallas who can go snoop around? JTF, I have looked at a lot of evidence and claims about who the Zodiac might be, the latest Zodiac movie was a huge bomb as far as I am concerned simply because the prime suspect in that movie has been ruled out years ago, but there is something about the evidence that Dennis has put together that is far too compelling and frankly it just makes sense. I guess time will tell, maybe
Do you have access to this tape? Or have you atleast heard it with your own ears?

[diamond d]

Do you have access to this tape? Or have you atleast heard it with your own ears?

M;

Yes I have heard it, Dennis has excerpts of it on his website, plus when you order his book you get the CD with the conversations between Dennis and Jack (Zodiac).

[Elemanzer]

People can who they think the real zodiac killer is, but the only way to know for sure is having someone break the remaining codes that he sent in.

Isn't it true that some to this day are not cracked? if so the real zodiac would be able to crack them or at the vest least give someone the key so they could show without a shadow of a doubt that it was them.

[diamond d]

People can who they think the real zodiac killer is, but the only way to know for sure is having someone break the remaining codes that he sent in.

Isn't it true that some to this day are not cracked? if so the real zodiac would be able to crack them or at the vest least give someone the key so they could show without a shadow of a doubt that it was them.

Yes your right, however it's a bit more complicated than that, read the book, it's the best point to start.

[Elemanzer]

If I spent the time and energy I bet i could say my dad was the Zodiac killer. I could record my dad and I talking, say he was here and there, have him write some old letters and compare them. I could even have him make up some details that no one knows about the cases, but in the end unless he cracks the code people will always have a hard time believeing it's really him. The zodiac killer wanted to be caught and I think when he really dies someone will find proof, perphaps his key code and then people will know who is really is.

[kurro07]

The zodiac killer wanted to be caught and I think when he really dies someone will find proof, perphaps his key code and then people will know who is really is.

I think w/ the kind of person the zodiac killer was I would expect a deathbed confession w/ info on some hidden stuff that proves it, and make it so that by the time you find what the person told you to look for he is dead and can not be arrested and charged. Then that person will be forever famous as the Zodiac Killer.

[Mishell1383]

I agree kurro, I feel as though this killer would want everyone to know what he did and what mass hysteria he caused. He would like to go down in infamy. imo

[kurro07]

I agree kurro, I feel as though this killer would want everyone to know what he did and what mass hysteria he caused. He would like to go down in infamy. imo

and still not be caught!

[cat840]

Dennis, very interesting read going through your site.

The transcripts of you conversations with your dad is quite scary. I must ask though as you actually could have concocted this yourself to sell your book, if you just could give a clue on those ciphers or even have those unsolved ones solved I would buy your story.

In the transcripts he says you are going to talk about those ciphers and how they work. Did you get to talk to him about it?

[Mishell1383]

Dennis, very interesting read going through your site.

The transcripts of you conversations with your dad is quite scary. I must ask though as you actually could have concocted this yourself to sell your book, if you just could give a clue on those ciphers or even have those unsolved ones solved I would buy your story.

In the transcripts he says you are going to talk about those ciphers and how they work. Did you get to talk to him about it?
IIRC Dennis' father conveniently passed away. Right about the time his book was coming out

[JTF]

Unfortunately, there has never been a high profile murder case that didn't have multiple individuals providing bogus confessions or near confessions for attention-seeking purposes. My problem with Dennis' claims is that law enforcement has fingerprint exemplars, handwriting exemplars, and a partial DNA profile of the Zodiac killer. I encouraged Dennis to contact the producers of American Justice and ask if they could use their influence to have his stepfather's fingerprint/handwriting exemplars and/or DNA profile compared with the Zodiac killer. American Justice and 20/20 were able to make DNA comparisons with Arthur Leigh Allen and exclude him as a suspect. They were also able to compare a palm print left on one of the Zodiac letters to Allen's print exemplars and the two didn't match. I see no reason why the producers of American Justice couldn't or wouldn't do the same for Dennis' stepfather.

JTF

[cat840]

Looking at the "my name is" cipher I think the name

"Liam O <unknown initial> O'donald" matches using a simple substitution cipher.

Is it possible to check if there was such a person in the area at the time?

[Elemanzer]

The zodiac was not the brightest person in the world. I was reading one of the ciphers and in order to be solved you can't think of it as the person used a spell checker. He spelt SLOW as SLOI. if you are going to spend the time to make something like that... spell check it.

[cat840]

The zodiac was not the brightest person in the world. I was reading one of the ciphers and in order to be solved you can't think of it as the person used a spell checker. He spelt SLOW as SLOI. if you are going to spend the time to make something like that... spell check it.

Actually error in cipher text like this is very common when the ciphering process is not done automatically by a computer.

Both the solved parts of the Beale cipher and even the solved parts of the Kryptos cipher(Kryptos is a sculpture located on the grounds of CIA Headquarters in Langley, Virginia) contains errors like the one zodiac made in his solved cipher.

[kurro07]

.....that Dennis is not only able to place Jack at every Zodiac killing area but has on tape Jack himself confessing several times to being Zodiac.

read "the Cases That Haunt Us" John Douglas says there is a man who can be placed near the areas the crime took place, fits the profile he (John Douglas) gives, ectect (read the book for the rest and the other good cases he goes over like Lizzie Borden, Jon Bennet and more.) and John Douglas ain't talking about Jack. In fact John refuses to name who he is talking about but he basically gives it away, and his reasons for not out right naming the guy (it's Lee Allen if you haven't guessed) is because none of that stuff really matter because it's just coincident. So Jack could have been in the area. Other people who could have been suspects were as well.

I looked at Dennis' website too. It all seems to be circumstantial. I read the transcripts and it doesn't seem creepy or like Jack is giving a confession at all. I just seems like Jack wants to be famous and thinks he rightly deserves to be. The handwriting comparisons..... IMO the style of writing is NOTHING alike. Jack capitalizes all his "N"s, the "M"s are different. The "A"s changing are irrelevant. I do the same w/ my "A"s I change how I write them. The Zodiac writes w/ a slant and his lines are more spaced out than Jacks.
The only thing I see that is similar is how Jack looks compared the the sketches, but to be honest some of the images are quite grainy.

and the cd might not be available very long so get it while you can.........http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com

That line there I have seen on "get rich quick scemes" and so called "data entry jobs" that want you to buy their programs but in reality the deal will never go away so you can take your time deciding to buy. (I got that quote for the other topic Dennis started http://boards.crimelibrary.com/showthread.php?t=276895)
Also can Dennis link Jack up to the Bates murder? A lot of experts think that she is Zodiacs first victim.

Now here is a little disclaimer because I know ppl can be unreasonable when disagreed with. =\
I am no handwriting expert, I am no Zodiac expert. These are my OPINIONS and therefore can be proven wrong and are in no way the truth. I have come to these conclusions based on common sense and what I have learned from reading the crime library files and this message board. So if you want to just yell at me an call me a liar don't waste my time if you can't be civilized about being critiqued on your claims. If you didn't want people to disagree DON'T POST ABOUT IT ONLINE. (wow that was a long post I don't usually do those =) enjoy.)

[diamond d]

Some very interesting posts since last time I checked. First off the whole Lee Allen controversy is one I am completely done with, DNA has ruled him out, I repeat, DNA (deoxyribonucleic acid) has ruled him out so let's never ever mention him again in connection with the Zodiac. Now as far as Jack goes the problem is is that there has not been a DNA test done on the guy. Dennis explains why this is the case in his book to some lengths, personally I'm 50/50 on his explanation. Is there anyone on this board who has some sort of influence or pull that would be able to convince someone at American Justice or one of the other shows to do a documentary on Dennis and his suspect Jack. Why not give Dennis the same air time that Lee Allen and his accusers have received, after all they even made a movie based on Allen as the suspected killer, give Dennis and Jack that same attention.

[kurro07]

Some very interesting posts since last time I checked. First off the whole Lee Allen controversy is one I am completely done with, DNA has ruled him out,

Ditto on that. I was just mentioning that there are other ppl out there who could fit the profile of the zodiac but are not. I have no problem w/ dennis' stepfather being investigated. Go for it, rule him out or prove it's him. If he has been ruled out all I can say is there must have been a good reason (I hope) it's just from looking at dennis' site he mostly points out circumstantial (holy crap I spelled that right!) evidence, and jack is not the only one out there that is linked by circumstantial evidence. This case like so many others will need hardcore physical proof of some sort to be solved.

[dkaufman]

Have not been to these boards in a long time.

I will say this, I have no doubt whatsoever that Jack is the Zodiac, and I have gathered as much evidence as I could to prove it. No other suspects fit the Zodiac profile like Jack, there is nothing that doesn't fit. Before Jack died he really believed he was going to be arrested for the zodiac crimes. I was able to spend a couple of month's with him before he passed, and we had some interesting conversations. Jack did tell me the 340 cipher is bogus, it's purpose was to direct peoples attention elsewere instead of on him, and it worked..............http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com

[cat840]

Jack did tell me the 340 cipher is bogus, it's purpose was to direct peoples attention elsewere instead of on him,

What did Jack say about the "my name is" cipher, was that bogus too?

[dkaufman]

My name is "Jack the Zodiac"

[cat840]

My name is "Jack the Zodiac"

So, with the cipher AENZ8K8M8TNAM, Z being the zodiac symbol and T the upside down T we have

AENZ8K8M8TNAM
JACKTHEZODIAC

With the key,

A = J,A
E = A
N = C,I
Z = K
8 = T,E,O
K = H
M = Z,C
T = D

Does not look very convincing to me, pretty random IMO.
Or did he use some other scheme for this cipher?

[kurro07]

No other suspects fit the Zodiac profile like Jack,

So did Lee Alan and not just according to graysmith, but like Jack there was NO hard proof evidence just that a few people who decided they knew who the zodiac is/was. Why not contact an FBI profiler and ask them to profile Jack and compare profiles.

[diamond d]

Good to see Dennis is back posting. It has been several months now since I read his (Dennis) book and to be honest I have more questions than ever before however my biggest question is why isn't there a single person who can get the ball rolling to have Jack investigated just like the investigated Lee Allen? Someone posted in this thread a link to the other major zodiac site mentioning that there was some information about zodiac that would be worth while to view. I went on there to view it but all i really saw was people posting stuff that made fun of anyone who didn't think Lee Allen was Zodiac. Some even accused me of being Dennis himself or a Dennis follower, needless to say I was a bit let down by the quality of posts I read. If Dennis reads this I encourage him to post detailed information regarding the discussions with Jack about the cyphers, we need more info on this, also we need to have clarity on what Jack was thinking near the time of his death. Still alot of questions to be asked and answered.

[kurro07]

I agree diamond. Dennis should be able to find some one who can get looking into his claims and put his suspicions to rest or confirm them. There is always some one interested in the Zodiac case that can get others w/ the know-how and money to investigate.

[dkaufman]

Hope this will help everyone to understand my situation when I went to
Olympia Wa. and spent a couple months with Jack before he passed.

It was just a few days before Thanksgiving in 2005, and it was just a
couple of days until my younger brother Charles birthday, Charles is Jack's
biological son. Charles and I were always close until I discovered who Jack
was. It had been over a year since I even talked to Charles, and we used to
talk almost daily. I was debating whether or not to call Charles and wish
him a happy birthday because I knew he was still upset with me about trying
to bring his dad to justice. I really was missing my little bro, as well as
my girlfriend I was with for fifteen years but had to move away because she
couldn't take the stress of this zodiac ordeal. On November 24, 2005, I told
Tina, who was my girlfriend at the time, how I wished that things could be
different so I could be close to my little bro again, and she told me to
call Charles and wish him a happy birthday, so I did. I was a bit relieved
when Charles sounded like he was glad to hear from me, during our
conversation he invited Tina and I up for Thanksgiving, and I told him we
would be there. We arrived in Olympia Wa. the following day. We met Charles
and Jack, at my sisters house, and we were just in time for Thanksgiving
dinner. Everyone seemed glad to see us. The last thing I wanted to do was
talk about zodiac. Later that evening at my little bro's house Jack,
Charles, and I sampled some moonshine Jack had made, and before long it
felt like the old days. As we sat there Jack said, "Dennis I got something
for you" and Jack gets up and go's into his room and comes back and hands me
a pocket knife. I asked him what was up with the pocket knife? He told me
that when he heard I was coming up, he went out and bought that knife to
stab me with. Jack went on to explain that after I got there he could see
that I really didn't come to Washington to get information from him, so he
saw no reason to kill me. Jack was right I was there to see my little bro.
After Jack gave me the knife I told him I had something for him. I went out
to my car and grabbed my zodiac case and I pulled out all of his pictures,
military documents, etc. As I am going through all of the zodiac stuff Jack
notices a picture of Arther Leigh Allen, and he says let me see that, Jack
says that is that school teacher who 's car was broke down at Lake
Berryessa, and I had to give him a ride home. Jack kind of laugh's and says,
"they thought he was the zodiac" I almost got sucked back in but I just
acted like it was no big deal. as time went on the less interested I seemed
in the Zodiac, the more Jack opened up. Our three day trip ended up being
more than two month's. Charles and I did some painting jobs while I was
there, and my girlfriend Tina stayed at the house with Jack. I really
enjoyed hanging out with my little bro. A couple of days before we left Jack
and I were alone and Jack looked over at me and said, I sure thought I was
going to prison, and that is when he disclosed to me were he had put the
victims ID's, and he told me if I used them against him before he was gone
Charles would never forgive me.............

[kurro07]

So why have you not gone and got the IDs?
Although, I have NEVER heard or read anything about the Zodiac taking IDs.
You're story is just that a story. Interesting but still not a way to offer proof.

[Elemanzer]

I just watched the Zodiac 2006 or 2007 movie and I didn't understand the whole movie post thing? Was he saying that that could be the guy or that rick guy. I'm going to have to go with greysmith on this and say it was leigh allen. Was there even dna on that stamp? Maybe he had someone else lick the stamp. I would use my victum's tongue on the stamp. That would throw people off, but of course back then DNA was nothing, so I don't think he was thinking about that, but you never know.

[diamond d]

Oh great here we go again, lol ...

Dennis posted probably one of the top 3 most compelling excerpts from his book. The whole jar of Id's thing, it solves the Zodiac case. If that jar can be found you will have fingerprints, DNA, undisputable PROOF of who Zodiac was. Lee Allen had his DNA tested and it DID NOT MATCH the DNA that is on file regarding the Zodiac case. Jack has never had his DNA tested or if it has the results have never been made public, why? I realize there is a HUGE following of people who think Lee Allen was Zodiac, I did too for a while until I began my research into the evidence and believe me it is very interesting / compelling evidence, but it is no more or no less compelling than the evidence Dennis has that supports Jack being Zodiac, the major difference in both suspects is that Lee Allen has had a DNA test and Jack has not.

[JTF]

Elemanzer: Robert Graysmith was/is a journalistic vulture who has preyed on the general public's ignorance of the facts in this case. It's interesting to note that most of the original investigators in this case don't think much of Graysmith's books and some of the victims/family members in this case have accused Graysmith of distorting the documented record. In terms of Graysmith's fairy tale regarding Arthur Leigh Allen being Zodiac:

1) Despite his assertions to the contrary, Graysmith was unable to place Allen at any of the crime scenes.

2) Allen's fingerprint exemplars did not match Zodiac's print exemplars.

3) A palm print found on one of the authenticated Zodiac letters did not match Allen's palm print exemplars.

4) Allen's handwriting exemplars did not match the handwriting on the Zodiac letters.

5) A partial DNA profile taken off the back of a stamp on an authenticated Zodiac letter did not match Allen's DNA profile.

6) Nothing of evidentiary value was found at Allen's place of residence.

In my opinion, the most knowledgeable Zodiac researcher is Mike Butterfield. His book on the Zodiac killer will be released soon. I can't wait.

JTF.

[dkaufman]

You ask why I have not went to Texas and got the ID's?

To take a trip to Texas will cost a few thousand dollars, if you got the money I can be ready to go in just a few minutes.....

You never heard of zodiac taking his victims ID's? Maybe that information was never made public. if not then how would Jack know about it?

[kurro07]

You ask why I have not went to Texas and got the ID's?
To take a trip to Texas will cost a few thousand dollars, if you got the money I can be ready to go in just a few minutes.....


I can drive from Michigan to Mississippi and pay only a few hundred dollars on gas and food. I've done it. Multiple times. My bf used to live there and we drive down to visit at least once a year. 20 hours in a car straight sucks but it doesn't cost a few thousand dollars. Maybe if we flew first class. I have also flown from Detroit to Jackson MS that cost $300ish round trip. The larger the city you fly out of and into the lower the cost and even then from Grand Rapids, MI to Meridian, MS cost $400 round trip. To fly from Canada to Texas costs around $500-700 ROUND TRIP. Wow, from Washington to Texas is under 200$ for the cheapest round trip. I just looked this all up on expedia.com.

And diamond, you can't say that Dennis' story is a compelling piece of evidence because it is not provable, we have just his word that his story is true. If it is, I have no problem w/ that, but I will not accept something like that as the truth just based on some one's word.
You can't prove who the Zodiac is based on what some one claims is true. If that was the case then Lee Allen would be the Zodiac because of Graysmith.

What about Deer Lodge, Montana? The Zodiac Talked about escaping from there. John Doughlas says there is most likely a connection because it isn't a well known place.

[diamond d]

I can drive from Michigan to Mississippi and pay only a few hundred dollars on gas and food. I've done it. Multiple times. My bf used to live there and we drive down to visit at least once a year. 20 hours in a car straight sucks but it doesn't cost a few thousand dollars. Maybe if we flew first class. I have also flown from Detroit to Jackson MS that cost $300ish round trip. The larger the city you fly out of and into the lower the cost and even then from Grand Rapids, MI to Meridian, MS cost $400 round trip. To fly from Canada to Texas costs around $500-700 ROUND TRIP. Wow, from Washington to Texas is under 200$ for the cheapest round trip. I just looked this all up on expedia.com.

And diamond, you can't say that Dennis' story is a compelling piece of evidence because it is not provable, we have just his word that his story is true. If it is, I have no problem w/ that, but I will not accept something like that as the truth just based on some one's word.
You can't prove who the Zodiac is based on what some one claims is true. If that was the case then Lee Allen would be the Zodiac because of Graysmith.

What about Deer Lodge, Montana? The Zodiac Talked about escaping from there. John Doughlas says there is most likely a connection because it isn't a well known place.

Oh contraire Mon frère, I can say that because it's my opinion. See here is the thing, I am taking what Dennis has said as being the truth, Jack said all those things to him, Dennis has all the documents he said he has, there is a jar with id's hid under a trailer somewhere in Texas. This is how I am looing at all this, it is also how I looked at all the Lee Allen evidence, fortunately or unfortunately depends how you look at it, DNA proved Lee Allen as not a valid suspect. All I'm saying is lets get the DNA from Jack tested, lets go find that jar, let's give suspect Jack all the attention that was once given to Lee Allen, after all what the hell does anyone have to loose??

[Mishell1383]

You ask why I have not went to Texas and got the ID's?

To take a trip to Texas will cost a few thousand dollars, if you got the money I can be ready to go in just a few minutes.....

You never heard of zodiac taking his victims ID's? Maybe that information was never made public. if not then how would Jack know about it?
If its that important to prove that what your "writing about" than you would pay to take the trip, to back up your "book". But the thing I have a problem with is this Zodiac case is so high profile, that in my opinion, if the FBI felt strong enough that Jack was their man, they wouldn't charge you a sent to test dna. Wouldn't they want to solve it? Wouldn't they want to clear any man that has been wrongly accused?! :patriot:

[diamond d]

If its that important to prove that what your "writing about" than you would pay to take the trip, to back up your "book". But the thing I have a problem with is this Zodiac case is so high profile, that in my opinion, if the FBI felt strong enough that Jack was their man, they wouldn't charge you a sent to test dna. Wouldn't they want to solve it? Wouldn't they want to clear any man that has been wrongly accused?! :patriot:

Throughout history we have seen examples of politics superseeding justice. Wrongdoers have not been brought to justice due to political influence, either from within or externally. Possibly there is some of this going on with the Zodiac case, there are alot of aspects of this case that just don't make sense but I guess it all adds to the mystery of Zodiac.

[kurro07]

All I'm saying is lets get the DNA from Jack tested, lets go find that jar, let's give suspect Jack all the attention that was once given to Lee Allen, after all what the hell does anyone have to loose??

Can't disagree w/ you there! LOL

Oh yeah, to fly from London to Texas costs between 1500 and 1800$$.

Also, I was reading through the Zodiac files and they say that now because of technology they have gotten a DNA Profile. So couldn't Dennis convince Jack's real son to give DNA to see if there is any relation?

[diamond d]

Correct me if I'm wrong but I believe Jacks biological son is dead, I may be mistaken though.

[dkaufman]

Diamond D, Jacks biological son "Denny" is still alive.

In response to the other posters about how much money it would cost to drive to Texas. There are alot more expenses than just gas. In Feb 2006, I did go to Texas, this was just after Jack told me about having the victims ID's. Upon our arrival we noticed a concrete foundation over the location were the ID's might be, and we didn't have the money to rent a tractor big enough. We rented a little bobcat, and it wouldn't budge the foundation. In 2002 my sister and her husband were renting the place from Jack, the place had a doublewide mobile with 2 1/2 acres. That same year the mobile home caught fire and burned to the ground. My sister and her husband decided they were going to build a house and poured a foundation were the doublewide used to be. Jack had burried the ID's under the doublewide, and that location is now covered with concrete. So when I make a second trip to get the ID's I am going to have to rent a large tractor to bust out that concrete foundation, and the entire trip will cost several thousand dollars.

[Path_to_Hope]

Diamond D, Jacks biological son "Denny" is still alive.

In response to the other posters about how much money it would cost to drive to Texas. There are alot more expenses than just gas. In Feb 2006, I did go to Texas, this was just after Jack told me about having the victims ID's. Upon our arrival we noticed a concrete foundation over the location were the ID's might be, and we didn't have the money to rent a tractor big enough. We rented a little bobcat, and it wouldn't budge the foundation. In 2002 my sister and her husband were renting the place from Jack, the place had a doublewide mobile with 2 1/2 acres. That same year the mobile home caught fire and burned to the ground. My sister and her husband decided they were going to build a house and poured a foundation were the doublewide used to be. Jack had burried the ID's under the doublewide, and that location is now covered with concrete. So when I make a second trip to get the ID's I am going to have to rent a large tractor to bust out that concrete foundation, and the entire trip will cost several thousand dollars.

Then why don't you let the FBI agent you were in contact with see that the ID's are retrieved? It shouldn't cost you a dime that way.

[diamond d]

Then why don't you let the FBI agent you were in contact with see that the ID's are retrieved? It shouldn't cost you a dime that way.

Both Dennis and Path have good points, it is expensive to rent heavy equipment and if the FBI where involved they probably would foot the bill for most everything if not all. So it sound to me like there is a fair bit of thought and planning needed to actually get those ID's extracted and preserved so they can be properly analyzed. So before digging starts it seems reasonable to gain the support of the FBI but up to now it seems like they have not been that interested for whatever reason, so let's change their mind, any suggestions on how that can be done?

[kurro07]

So before digging starts it seems reasonable to gain the support of the FBI

or better yet, reporters. Get the media to pressure it as well and that should get something done as well.

[Path_to_Hope]

or better yet, reporters. Get the media to pressure it as well and that should get something done as well.

Yes that is an excellent idea and a better one than mone. Let's get the medias attention on this and with enough attention I bet LE will go dig up those ID's. I think more people know about the Zodiac since a movie came out not too long ago and people will be interested in this.

[Path_to_Hope]

Here is some media contacts. Diamond I only think it is fair for you to contact these people since you seem to be the only one that had read the book.

On the Record w/ Greta Van Susteren — Ontherecord@foxnews.com

Geraldo at Large — Atlarge@foxnews.com

FOX News Live w/ Jamie Colby — Jamie@foxnews.com

The Lineup — Lineup@foxnews.com

Nancy Grace http://www.cnn.com/feedback/forms/form5c.html?24

Scarborough Country -joe@msnbc.com

Dateline NBC
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12319584/

America’s Most Wanted http://www.amw.com/contact_us/index.cfm

[diamond d]

Here is some media contacts. Diamond I only think it is fair for you to contact these people since you seem to be the only one that had read the book.

On the Record w/ Greta Van Susteren — Ontherecord@foxnews.com

Geraldo at Large — Atlarge@foxnews.com

FOX News Live w/ Jamie Colby — Jamie@foxnews.com

The Lineup — Lineup@foxnews.com

Nancy Grace http://www.cnn.com/feedback/forms/form5c.html?24

Scarborough Country -joe@msnbc.com

Dateline NBC
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12319584/

America’s Most Wanted http://www.amw.com/contact_us/index.cfm


Wow, well done Path. I will contact each of the above listed people and bring their attention to Dennis, his site, his book and his evidence. This could be the start of something really significant or something very questionable. I really with that more of you on this board would actually take the time to read Dennis's book. Think of it as being just one more piece in this enormous puzzle called Zodiac, it is my belief that every piece needs to be looked at and evaluated and Dennis's book is no different. Put your personal judgments and biases towards Dennis aside and focus on the legitimacy of his evidence. Take the time to evaluate, dissect, scrutinize, Asses all that he has put forth. After all we all did that with Lee Allen and sang the praises of his guilt and low and behold he still has not been charged and DNA samples didn’t match. So I ask the reading and posting public, why can we not give Jack Terrance the same scrutiny that we all gave Lee Allen, how many times in history have we heard stories much to our dismay on people in authority casually dismissing tidbits of information because to them it didn’t sound legit and low and behold down the road after death and mayhem have occurred it turns out that all it would have taken to stop it all would have been one extra look at a little tidbit of castoff information, let’s not do that anymore instead, let’s investigate, probe, ask the hard questions, get to the bottom of things. By doing this, this is how things are found out and cases are solved. Read the book, be a part of the solution and not a part of ignorance.

[Path_to_Hope]

Wow, well done Path. I will contact each of the above listed people and bring their attention to Dennis, his site, his book and his evidence. This could be the start of something really significant or something very questionable. I really with that more of you on this board would actually take the time to read Dennis's book. Think of it as being just one more piece in this enormous puzzle called Zodiac, it is my belief that every piece needs to be looked at and evaluated and Dennis's book is no different. Put your personal judgments and biases towards Dennis aside and focus on the legitimacy of his evidence. Take the time to evaluate, dissect, scrutinize, Asses all that he has put forth. After all we all did that with Lee Allen and sang the praises of his guilt and low and behold he still has not been charged and DNA samples didn’t match. So I ask the reading and posting public, why can we not give Jack Terrance the same scrutiny that we all gave Lee Allen, how many times in history have we heard stories much to our dismay on people in authority casually dismissing tidbits of information because to them it didn’t sound legit and low and behold down the road after death and mayhem have occurred it turns out that all it would have taken to stop it all would have been one extra look at a little tidbit of castoff information, let’s not do that anymore instead, let’s investigate, probe, ask the hard questions, get to the bottom of things. By doing this, this is how things are found out and cases are solved. Read the book, be a part of the solution and not a part of ignorance.

I would be more than happy to order and read the book that Dennis authored just as soon as those ID's are retrieved from the place Jack told Dennis they would be. But until then I am not spending one dime on a book until this pans out. You do realize this is going to cause Dennis to sink or swim don't you?

[diamond d]

I would be more than happy to order and read the book that Dennis authored just as soon as those ID's are retrieved from the place Jack told Dennis they would be. But until then I am not spending one dime on a book until this pans out. You do realize this is going to cause Dennis to sink or swim don't you?

Sink or swim, yes it will, but I believe Dennis will be all for it. I believe Dennis wants very much for someone to give his step dad a serious look, and if it turns out that the proof says Jack is not Zodiac so be it, but at least Dennis and all he has gathered had a chance to be investigated to the fullest extent. The way I see it is that if Dennis is right, alot of people will be eating crow, bigtime but, if Dennis is wrong and Jack is not Zodiac he will get alot of I told you so's but really how much negativity can there be. People all over the country claim they might know who Zodiac was, look at all the theories out there and books and movies being published and made, why is Dennis considered this horrible person because he has decided to publicize his claims. Remember that old movie line; "just the facts ma'am just the facts."

[kurro07]

if Dennis is wrong and Jack is not Zodiac he will get alot of I told you so's but really how much negativity can there be.

Bah, I'd just say "One suspect less to look at now. We are one person closer to finding the answer."

[diamond d]

From what I know this process of eliminating suspects could have been done a whole lot more effective than how it was. There appears to be alot of time waisted playing politics between the different agencies, I think this case could have been solved decades ago had everyone worked together.

[diamond d]

Tom Voigt has cloned my user profile, posted an unauthorized post and kicked me off zodiackiller.com I can not believe this happened.

Go to

http://zodiackiller.21.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=339&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

My first post starts on page 2 of the thread.
You tell me now who has credibility and who doesn't

[kurro07]

Tom Voigt has cloned my user profile, posted an unauthorized post and kicked me off zodiackiller.com I can not believe this happened.

Go to

http://zodiackiller.21.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=339&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

My first post starts on page 2 of the thread.
You tell me now who has credibility and who doesn't

You posted that in the other zodiac topic.
im confused. it says youre a newbie, it doesnt say anything on being banned and you're posts are polite. any ways what does that site have to do w/ this discussion?

[diamond d]

You posted that in the other zodiac topic.
im confused. it says youre a newbie, it doesnt say anything on being banned and you're posts are polite. any ways what does that site have to do w/ this discussion?

I posted in both threads because some users from that site read posts from this site. I was a newbie on that site, I was there about 1 week give or take. My account was deleted and I was told in an email from Tom Voigt that because I talked about Dennis and his stepfather possibly being a Zodiac suspect that I was not welcome there. I challenge anyone to go there and read my posts and point out to me what ettiquette or boared rules I broke. For the record, the last posts by diamond d, is NOT me, that was the fraudulent post I am talking about, it basically recants all my previous posts. And I still think Jack T should be DNA tested just like Lee Allen.

[Path_to_Hope]

I posted in both threads because some users from that site read posts from this site. I was a newbie on that site, I was there about 1 week give or take. My account was deleted and I was told in an email from Tom Voigt that because I talked about Dennis and his stepfather possibly being a Zodiac suspect that I was not welcome there. I challenge anyone to go there and read my posts and point out to me what ettiquette or boared rules I broke. For the record, the last posts by diamond d, is NOT me, that was the fraudulent post I am talking about, it basically recants all my previous posts. And I still think Jack T should be DNA tested just like Lee Allen.

Did you ever email any of the news media I gave you to get this rolling forward? If so did you hear back from any of them?

[diamond d]

Did you ever email any of the news media I gave you to get this rolling forward? If so did you hear back from any of them?

Yes I did and I have not heard back from any yet ...

[Tober]

dkaufman / diamond d (one in the same), you simply have an axe to grind against your stepfather. Your case is not even circumstantial, it's entirely based on wild accusation, without a single colloboratory element. IMO

[diamond d]

dkaufman / diamond d (one in the same), you simply have an axe to grind against your stepfather. Your case is not even circumstantial, it's entirely based on wild accusation, without a single colloboratory element. IMO

Tober;
first off, don't rehash that stupid idea of me and Dkaufman are one in the same, pesonally am starting to get a bit annoyed. ok, now I do not believe one can simply cast off the case Dennis makes against his father considering the fact that his stepfathers finger prints and DNA have NOT been tested agains on file Zodiac prints and DNA. If you look at the case against Lee Allen, all of it is circumstantial, there is not one peice of hard evidence that links Lee Allen to a Zodiac killing, if there was, Lee Allen would have been in jail many, many years ago. Plus his DNA and prints didn't match either. Lee Allen was put under the microscope right up until his death, why not give half of that to Jack and investigate the claim Dennis makes against him. What can it hurt, why take the chance of leaving that 1 stone unturned, turn it over see what you find, if nothing, oh well, on to the next suspect. Remember, whatever the SFPD and whoever else is investigating this case is doing, it all hasn't worked, Zodiac is still at large, time to try something different

[slynn14]

Throughout history we have seen examples of politics superseeding justice. Wrongdoers have not been brought to justice due to political influence, either from within or externally. Possibly there is some of this going on with the Zodiac case, there are alot of aspects of this case that just don't make sense but I guess it all adds to the mystery of Zodiac.

I agree, but I didn't know or heard of The Zodiack taking ID's :confused:

[diamond d]

I agree, but I didn't know or heard of The Zodiack taking ID's :confused:

Ok first thing, please spell Zodiac like that. second thing regarding the id's, it is still up for debate however there are items that Zodiac did take from his crime scenes.

[diamond d]

Has anyone heard of the new development in this case?

[Path_to_Hope]

Has anyone heard of the new development in this case?


Which new development are you talking about?

[Kate-Sawyer]

Oh contraire Mon frère, I can say that because it's my opinion. See here is the thing, I am taking what Dennis has said as being the truth, Jack said all those things to him, Dennis has all the documents he said he has, there is a jar with id's hid under a trailer somewhere in Texas. This is how I am looing at all this, it is also how I looked at all the Lee Allen evidence, fortunately or unfortunately depends how you look at it, DNA proved Lee Allen as not a valid suspect. All I'm saying is lets get the DNA from Jack tested, lets go find that jar, let's give suspect Jack all the attention that was once given to Lee Allen, after all what the hell does anyone have to loose??
Good Call!! What's to loose??? Everything should be able to run it's course, I've had a look at the site, not the book, not sure where to buy it in OZ. It seems credible, not a dead cert, but who can be 100% until there is hard evidence, its certainly heading in the most interesting direction, can't wait to hear more!!

[H. Fenneberg]

Dear Dennis.

I flew in to Bangkok yesterday from Copenhagen, Denmark and after 3 or 4 hours of bad sleep I turned on the TV. I ended up in the last half hour of the newly released movie " Zodiac Killer ". I was preparing to go back to sleep when the rollertext at the end of the movie, stated that the killer was never identified and was still at large.!!

That woke me right up. Even though I am Danish doesn`t mean I`ve never heard about the story but I must admit that I had forgotten the fact that the killer was never found.

I started surfing the internet about the subject. I did that for allmost 16 hours. It is a truly amazing story.

I somehow found your side of the story and I must say that your evidence looks interesting.

I am puzzled though that SFPD and the various law departments involved in the case is working so bad together. It also puzzles me that you have not been able to convince any of those departments to take your case more seriously!

I can`t stop wondering if there is some big holes in your theory that is not obvious on this site. Personally I think you have a lot of good evidence but I still miss the smoking gun.

Anyway it should be pretty straight forward now that you have contacted a company that wants to do a documentary on the subject and your story.

They should be able to throw in the money needed to remove the concrete slab under wich you claim there is a jar full of victims ID´s, even if there sits a house right now.

They should be able to provide the neccesary funds to do a really thorough DNA test on Jack. I mean, after all, that company is only doing a doc. if they can see a profit in it someware and I would belive such a profit would be quite handsome if shown on Discovery or National Geografic.

They should be able to provide the legal means needed.

I am looking forward to hear about the next steps in this case and if Diamond D has any " Braking News" then bring them hether.


All the best

H. Fenneberg

[diamond d]

You can read about the newest development in the Zodiac case
here -> http://zodiackillertruth.com/tarbox.htm

[Chicky]

I thought they had gotten either a partial or total DNA from a stamp Zodiac had licked. I also thought they had tested and eliminated several suspects they had. One was already deceased when tested and eliminated.

[yarbchris]

I thought they had gotten either a partial or total DNA from a stamp Zodiac had licked. I also thought they had tested and eliminated several suspects they had. One was already deceased when tested and eliminated.

I believe there is quite enough room for reasonable doubt when it comes to using forensic evidence to exclude suspects in the Zodiac case.

http://zodiackillertruth.com/forensiczodiac.pdf

While this view may offer hope for those who believe Jack Tarrance or Arthur Leigh Allen to be the Zodiac, there are other factors that may help eliminate them as viable suspects.

[eagleeye]

I thought Jack Tarrance looked like a strong suspect, but apparently the FBI cleared him. There most be some evidence that points away from him.

[yarbchris]

I thought Jack Tarrance looked like a strong suspect, but apparently the FBI cleared him. There most be some evidence that points away from him.

There is no real evidence that points to Jack Tarrance as a suspect. Sure, it is an interesting story that on the surface sounds almost believable; but when you look at all of the so-called evidence there is nothing substantial. Anything tangible and solid that would point to Tarrance is conveniently out of reach. The whole thing is like a bad ghost story or a lame UFO sighting. If Jack Tarrance was the Zodiac and Dennis Kaufman access to him, then why can't he produce a shred of anything that might really prove he is the Zodiac?

[diamond d]

Each and every so called suspect there is in the Zodiac case is a suspect based on circumstantial evidence. From Allen to Jack to Sam to Mr.X and all the others, there is a mountain of circumstantial evidence that says every suspect could have possibly been the Zodiac killer, that's where the problem is. There is no concrete factual evidence that points to one person, this is why the case still remains open. We all have to understand this fact, there is no concrete evidence that points to one specific individual, this is why the case is still open. Now in regards to the mountain of circumstantial evidence, it all must be looked at, every single shred needs to be examined because the possibility exists that within that mountain of circumstance is that one thread of concrete fact that will indicate one person. So keep talking about Jack, keep talking about Mr.X, Tarbox, Allen whoever. Vigilance and persistence will solve this case.

[zurichsl]

are guys kidding me who are they agent`s none of them is looks like him maybe the drawn pic on the left has some kind of basic out of hes looks but the to person no way one of them is like an fbi agent the other is like sherif but integreated in to the secret service .

and i don`t think that he was 78 based on the first murder investigation about the girl from libary like uhm so he was 78 in 2000 than he was than he would be 47 in 69 when that girl got murdered .... there is no way unless he`s acting like a younger guy`s or but that girl would never go to anyone in to a dark woods just to get hes car why he didn`t just went there to pic up the car and back to girl to pic her up the of male would do that i think but it seems to be uhm easyer to hide between us to be younger like if my ideal is right and the person who i`ve seen is driving a very nice blonde cadilack devile with a lot of chrome and tinted windows in a extreamly good shape is that the perosn who you guys are looking for around 53 bot not more than 54.
and trying to look older with those stupid looking old ffashion type of clothes and eye glasses what are looks like out turned in and out or how ever you call than he looks like a gigolo . and there is a same age girl with him or just knows him maybe a sister or girlfriend .
i said the cadilack because i`ve seen it twice in my way once while i was doing delivery than second last night in my apartment complex.
than i think the same guy was sitting in a grey chevy astro but with a different look. seems like who`s looking for something.

after i was reading these ads about murder cases got on ideal what would be if life is a big village .:beer: :beer:

[zurichsl]

i don`t think that you have the full personality profile but how ever the case is continue you can never stop an investigation about some one based on your personal toughts i think but the case is i also was thinking about an a case that what if i `ve seen on you tube when a an other spirit taking ove r a young girls body in video real video so wha tif some is let`s say kiddnapping young and help for an other spirit to get it and live in it and growing in it imagene that so what if they belive that who ever they killed belongs to them ... + killer = zodiac
or even diana what di they knew about some one in egyipt maybe soem one was doing it and they didn`t tought it is a good ideal to do anything like that and the other s got scared and send the over to finish what ever is could be dangeres for them The answer is Who Has More To Hide ...

i don`t mind if they there just don`t force me in to anything , what i don`t want 2 pac ...

ir they justt some how came back to life and they live on a different level of life than anyone elses and can see what you can`t see ....

[SaraSidle]

I thought they had gotten either a partial or total DNA from a stamp Zodiac had licked. I also thought they had tested and eliminated several suspects they had. One was already deceased when tested and eliminated.

I thought they had also Chicky but the DNA did not match anyone in the system. I am not sure. no links!

[zurichsl]

zodiac or just a sekt and if it is the sect are they were zodiac or were covering them .... or hulk are some kind of person who had landed their or just lived there .... are they teaching us , they want us to learn how not to live or judge
and does it takes to build a road to let some one become one of them ....?
are the ykilling us to know how are we taking pain or to lern how to feel when they are between us . who knows .... i`ve got the ideal because i`ve seen some kind of man who were acting very strange like no one else like who trying to scared me of from were i was going in mind and he had those google eyes but were also loooking funny at the time the problem is if you give them a chance to use their sp-ip they could use for the ones for be their cover .....
back to the zodiac he couldn`t talk clearly in the phone was it a exersism or lidokain or strong menthol ..... ? and while if was what he become to is why is he become to be one of hem to know more and help or use it as a weapon against us . maybe was a loely child who couldn`t get a chance to go to scool and when he become smarter than any other people around him were start taking revans when others couldn`t respect him as as he is and with out their knoweledge were start useing the`s brain for their own purposes .....
the mind are like phyramides what ever you dont`t know the others might know based on religion like an operation system totaly understand able the christian faith will fail in time they don`t grow over the ground just on the end of time will grow out as a plant and after that there is the flower .....
and if you touch it you know what would happen ..... hmmmmm .... i think he is something simular he is playing with the souls he can`t stop growing like a flowers of`s . hmmmmm very intresting person if you looking at upstairs trying to put a new puzzle in to the land as a something but not a christian faith but still based an what every body knows how to live and joy they life with out the infaction of life well now there tought are infacted too like the christians . from time with out there knoweledge ... see what operates the world over the top
than you might can see him .... as a person and he would turn to downly angre why he don`t know why but some how he just can`t stop and fullly understand able . the sensitivy about life per persones are different how sensitive you are thats how you could make a wave in the wwater of life .
he want us to know that .... like a combination of personalised life ...... how the community geting closer to him and how he could not live he`s life with out to become one of them makes him to feel that way the heat build him with out exercise can pull your neurves and build the muscles while sending electrikal inpulse to the muscles , i think it is right defination of his life style :rose: black rob / you don`t know me / how can it be controled with out the controlthe real question is that

[AlexisHidell]

Sacramento's CBS 13 TV news reported this week that the FBI will be constructing a DNA profile based on Dennis's findings regarding Jack Tarrance as the potential Zodiac. The photo gallery and video accompanying the article give a good overview of the things that provoked his suspicions about his stepfather. The resemblance between his stepfather and the police composite of Zodiac is chilling. Is this real? Hopefully, we'll find out soon.

http://cbs13.com/local/zodiac.killer.kaufman.2.805799.html

[oldschool]

Just read the new info about zodiac killer, has the case really been solved after all these years. I always felt the true killer would be found through his own family. I believed his ego would never let him get rid of all the evidence but it would come out after the cowardly ******* died.

[SaraSidle]

Just read the new info about zodiac killer, has the case really been solved after all these years. I always felt the true killer would be found through his own family. I believed his ego would never let him get rid of all the evidence but it would come out after the cowardly ******* died.

Well they do have evidence that points to a certain person. Let's just hope the DNA proves it........ IMO

[oldschool]

Well they do have evidence that points to a certain person. Let's just hope the DNA proves it........ IMO

If the dna does match it's to bad it came after he died, as far as him paying for his crimes. Although he could be paying in a much different way than we know about.

[SaraSidle]

If the dna does match it's to bad it came after he died, as far as him paying for his crimes. Although he could be paying in a much different way than we know about.

this is true. I think now it will be great for any relatives to find closure.

[Johnna Depp]

This is amazing! I have been reading about the "Zodiac" since I can remember.

Any new developments???

Thanks :)











The suspect that has been the focus of the zodiac investigation
since the case reopened in 2000, has passed away on August 26, 2006, at age 78, in Olympia Washington. His identity has never been made public until now, his name is "J.W. Tarrance." Here is the true identity of the Zodiac....
(http://thezodiackiller.digitalzones.com)

Dennis Kaufman

[One2Snoop]

I have a few questions after watching the movie Zodiac for probably the 5th time. Anyhow, does LE have actual voice recordings of the Zodiac and where can I listen to it online?

Second - has this person in Olympia WA been positively identified as the Zodiac?

Thanks to anyone who can answer.

[Seashell]

I have a few questions after watching the movie Zodiac for probably the 5th time. Anyhow, does LE have actual voice recordings of the Zodiac and where can I listen to it online?

Second - has this person in Olympia WA been positively identified as the Zodiac?

Thanks to anyone who can answer.

Yes there are links to hear the voice recordings, i recall listening to them a while back but i cant remember where or when i shall try to find out.
bbs.

Found it:
http://www.zodiackiller.com/SuspectGaikowski.html

[One2Snoop]

Apr 23, 2009 9:54 pm US/Pacific
Roll Of Film Could Hold Answers In Zodiac Case

SACRAMENTO (CBS13) ―

http://i39.tinypic.com/ztt5cy.jpg
Photo of Jack Tarrance (left) and a composite of the Zodiac Killer.

The picture is graphic; A dead, bloody body. Dennis Kaufman says the picture came from a roll of film he found in his stepfather's belongings after he died.

Dennis Kaufman agreed to show CBS13 several photographs.

The pictures are difficult to look at, but Kaufman says if just one family finds answers about a loved one who was murdered, the last 9 years he's dedicated to this case will be worth it.

Last year, Dennis Kaufman began supplying the FBI with evidence attempting to prove his stepfather, Jack Tarrance, is the zodiac killer.

The evidence included envelopes for DNA testing and a hood resembling one worn by the zodiac in 1969 during an attack.

The FBI also took rolls of film but Kaufman did not hand over all the film. "When you give something to the FBI you never know what they are going to show or reveal to you," explained Kaufman.

Kaufman says the picture of the tattooed man was on a single roll of film he developed prior to giving evidence the FBI.

He gave three rolls to the FBI and the remaining 16 rolls he turned over to Stephen Dewhurst, a professor at Northern Arizona University.

"These are colloquially called snuff films. They are films documenting the death of someone," explains Dewhurst.

Dewhurst began working with Kaufman two years ago after reading his website www.therealzodiackiller.com

Dewhurst himself has been long fascinated by the zodiac case, believing a family friend could be one of the serial killer's victims.

"She was stabbed 31 times and sexually assaulted," says Dewhurst.
Gladys Gresham was killed in Vallejo in 1971. Her case was never connected to the zodiac.

The psychotic killer is known to have attacked seven people, but in taunting letters the zodiac claimed 37 victims.

Of the 16 rolls he developed, Dewhurst believes one reveals disturbing images of murder.

Dewhurst says the pictures are graphic, but the film is deteriorated and many images appear to be a haze of colors.

The first picture on the roll is the clearest. A stained baseball cap near what could be blood spatter.

The rest of the images are blurry, but Dewhurst believes they show two people being murdered.
"There are two victims apparently on the film. Both of whom are minors. There are pictures of them before and after their deaths," says Dewhurst.
In one photo Dewhurst believes he see the face of a young woman who disappeared from San Francisco in the 1970's.

"The pictures are open to interpretation. With how cloudy they are, why do you think she was tortured? What kind of mutilation do you see?" asked cbs13 reporter Kris Pickel.

Dewhurst responds, "She was cut up. She was decapitated. Body parts were cut off."
In one hazy photo, Dewhurst believes he see a woman's naked, decapitated body from the stump of her neck to her mid torso.
He says he is able to see that her right breast has been removed and a knife is being held above her left breast.

"The film proves in my mind Jack Tarrance was a serial killer," says Dewhurst.

He adds, "This is a monster in human form that went out and did horrible things to people for pleasure."

In another photo you can see the image of a boy.
Dewhurst says other pictures show the child's murder.
"The little boy was strangled," says Dewhurst.
Even the clearest image leaves a haze of questions.

Is the tattooed body with a peace sign the victim of an unsolved murder?
Do the ghostly images show the murders of a girl and boy or are they just hazy images?

Perhaps the biggest question: if Jack Tarrance took the pictures could he be a previously unknown serial killer or one of the most infamous in history.
Dennis Kaufman believes the evidence is overwhelming. "I know my stepfather is the zodiac. There is no doubt in my mind whatsoever," says Kaufman.

The FBI told Kaufman the three rolls he gave them had nothing but family pictures on them.
They currently have the photos developed by Dewhurst and may be able to make the images shaper.

http://cbs13.com/local/zodiac.dna.tests.2.993180.html

[One2Snoop]

Has The Infamous Zodiac Killer Been Identified?

Posted: 8:34 am PDT April 29, 2009Updated: 9:41 am PDT April 29, 2009
SAN FRANCISCO -- A question that has both gripped and terrorized the Bay Area for decades – who was the Infamous Zodiac Killer – may be answered Wednesday by new evidence from a group of forensic experts and an alleged relative.

The evidence -- including cryptology, handwriting analysis and the revelation of a murder accomplice – was to be unveiled at a noon press conference.

The Zodiac killer -- he gave himself that moniker in his taunting letters to police and newspapers -- is blamed for at least seven murders in 1968 and 1969.

He was never caught, though many believe he was Arthur Leigh Allen, a convicted child molester from Vallejo who died in 1992.

In September 1969, the Zodiac struck in Napa County, stabbing two 20-year-old college students picnicking at Lake Berryessa. The crime scene was a small peninsula jutting out into the lake. The couple was accosted, hog-tied and repeatedly stabbed by a man dressed all in black and wearing an executioner-type hood.

Cecelia Shepard died; Bryan Hartnell survived and is now a lawyer in Southern California.

Three killings then took place in the Vallejo area. David Farraday and Betty Lou Jensen, teenagers on their first date, were shot to death in December 1968. Darlene Ferrin, 22, was shot and killed seven months later at the Blue Springs Golf Club, while her companion, Michael Mageau, 19, survived.

His final Bay Are slaying may have occurred on October 11, 1969, when a man entered Paul Stine's cab at the intersection of Mason and Geary Streets in San Francisco and requested to be taken to Washington and Maple Streets in Presidio Heights.

One block later, the passenger shot Stine once in the head with a 9 mm, took his wallet and car keys, and then tore off his shirt tail. On October 14, the San Francisco Chronicle received a letter from the Zodiac containing a swatch of Stine's shirt tail as proof he was the killer.

http://www.ktvu.com/news/19322231/detail.html#-

[zurichsl]

[i`m sorry to say that but that isn`t the person who supposed to be the zodiac killer at all ... unfortunatly you know when someone is trying to prove hes right instead just sit on hes ass and let the judge judge the person than it would make a turn i know he might look like the but he isn`t the person that we are looking for look at him and exmple look at that policer officer who`s wifes are misterysly dies oine in the bathroom , than the other who has noticed hes real personality who actually is the last one we know about . so if you are looking at thet person , now see look at him the way hes acting and nervus even a lot more inside than people actully think . when he recorded the video , that happened when i saw him last on tv he held a camera and making a fun / look , like / so were making a fil or acting like making one against all reporter who were holding him in the spot light . se if he made a video it happened to just , so he can look around and find the way how to live or hide , but also i`m pretty much sure that someone were helping him a corrupt officer or he set them up both you know what i mean. for some reason he is nervus , even he was close to get solved against hes last wife misterical death or she found out what happened she new maybe
or he was useing for many more people to get what he, wanted to reach .
who knows , or could be a corrupt officer helped him . now so my point is that person is guilty for sure . and also he is nervus , very much ... i don`t see the point that the investigaters why didn`t use that agains him , maybe they know but they keep him under the scope to help to resolve more unsolved cases , who knows .. but if you match these person you could the difference between the two . also you why the FBI were looking for the father of the childs from that secta . well becasue they were wonder how come the profile of some serial killers are the same but never the same person attack . :) well dear when you`ll know theconnections you will see a lot different as now me ...

[One2Snoop]

WTH? :confused: :shrug: zurichsl I didn't write those articles, I merely just posted them here. Futhermore your post is very difficult to follow..... :shrug:

[taboo]

It kind of makes me feel sick that this guy ( and i think it is really him so many facts add up ! ) died before anyone found out or got the chance to lock him up and make that mother f**** suffer real slow ! Vomit , vomit , vomit !

[SaraSidle]

It kind of makes me feel sick that this guy ( and i think it is really him so many facts add up ! ) died before anyone found out or got the chance to lock him up and make that mother f**** suffer real slow ! Vomit , vomit , vomit !

he was an evil man and hard to find obviously. but at least we know who on the case. Many many times we do not...........IMO sara

[taboo]

he was an evil man and hard to find obviously. but at least we know who on the case. Many many times we do not...........IMO sara

Do you think on some level serial killers on a subconcious level actually fear themselves ?

[SaraSidle]

Do you think on some level serial killers on a subconcious level actually fear themselves ?

I think if they have any fear......which I do not think they have.... they are afraid of getting caught. sara

[taboo]

I think if they have any fear......which I do not think they have.... they are afraid of getting caught. sara

Yes I think your right actually . Its hard to imagine that someone can do that because most normal people dont think like that . I mean we all say aaaa this person drives me nuts I could kill them but we dont LITERALLY mean it .

[SaraSidle]

Yes I think your right actually . Its hard to imagine that someone can do that because most normal people dont think like that . I mean we all say aaaa this person drives me nuts I could kill them but we dont LITERALLY mean it .

Or we have morals so we do not kill them.....or hurt them......IMO sara