CLR: Renee Fox, 25, Found: Bones Identified as Hers

[Deepwater]

Family continues to hold out hope for Renee Fox, lost for 11 days in the desert

by Seamus McGraw

July 5, 2006

INDEPENDENCE,Calif. (Crime Library) — It had been a hard year for 25-year-old Renee Fox, what with the ordeal of her divorce, the pressure of completing school, the nerve damage she had suffered in her hands, not to mention the stress that her periodic use of meth had placed on her body and her mind.

But things seemed to be turning around. The pretty young mother of a 5-year-old had a new boyfriend and a new direction in life, and was, according to her brother, Reese Somes, looking forward to starting school in the fall at California State University in Northridge, where she planned to become a teacher. By all accounts she had given up the drugs, and was, by late June, in that emotional twilight between what was and what was to come.

Full article:

http://www.crimelibrary.com/news/original/0706/0501_renee_fox.html

[RogerV]

I tend to be a pessemist by nature, but I have a hard time seeing how this case could have a happy ending. Authorities think she made it out to a main highway and now could even be in another state. Her family disagrees, saying she would have contacted them by now if this were the case.

If she didn't make it to the highway, that leaves her still in the desert, which is an even worse scenario. She had no water, gear, or other equipment. The two bottles of water she was given by two men she encountered would be barely enough to sustain her for one day. Her family fears she may have been abducted, but that's not a very hopeful situation either.

It would seem that she was somehow impaired, because her actions don't make a lot of sense. There's the fact that she took the wrong road in the first place, and the question of why she didn't just turn around when its hard surface ended. Even after getting stuck, the logical thing would have been to retrace her route along the road, but she apparently didn't do that either.

[SallyG]

Am I the only one wondering why the guys she encountered on their four wheelers did not assist her. If she was lost, why didn't they take her back to civilization, instead of just giving her a couple of bottles of water and letting her continue to wander in the desert? I'd love to hear their version of the encounter.

[MATTHEWsevenone]

Originally posted by SallyG
Am I the only one wondering why the guys she encountered on their four wheelers did not assist her. If she was lost, why didn't they take her back to civilization, instead of just giving her a couple of bottles of water and letting her continue to wander in the desert? I'd love to hear their version of the encounter.

No you are NOT the only one.

And LE forgot to get the fourwheelers numbers? What's that?

Do they use scent dogs in mines? The scent led to a mine shaft. A crew was called in. What exactly and how exactly did this crew search?

I am not only wondering about the fourwheelers but the search grid too.

[SallyG]

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone


No you are NOT the only one.

And LE forgot to get the fourwheelers numbers? What's that?

Do they use scent dogs in mines? The scent led to a mine shaft. A crew was called in. What exactly and how exactly did this crew search?

I am not only wondering about the fourwheelers but the search grid too.

I would think that if a woman is missing, and a couple of guys say "oh, yeah...we saw her wandering around....we gave her a couple of bottles of water and went on our way"....HUH???? I see red flags popping up all over the place. I mean, sure, they may have been just passing by and be totally innocent, but I would think the whole scenario would raise a few suspicions. I would think a second look at these guys would not be out of order.

[magpie1]

One of the reports - I believe one of the reports from the Crime Library, stated that the men who were four-wheeling gave her the 2 bottles of water and then the NEXT DAY found her purse with her credit cards and $900 in cash intact. The article states that it was then that they got suspicious and reported it to the authorities, who didn't get the names of the men.

The logical thing for the four-wheelers to do would be to have insisted on giving Renee a ride into town so she could get help - call her family to report what had happened.

If Renee was reluctant to go with strangers, the four wheelers should have gone into town, and reported to the authorities that a young woman's car had broken down and she was wandering alone out there in the desert. At that point, the police would have likely been able to locate and assist her.

I'm suspicious of the four-wheelers.

I'm also questioning how someone can walk into a sheriff's office with a found purse containing a sizeable sum of money, and the police not getting the names of the individuals who turned the purse in?

[SallyG]

Originally posted by magpie1
I'm also questioning how someone can walk into a sheriff's office with a found purse containing a sizeable sum of money, and the police not getting the names of the individuals who turned the purse in? [/B]

Exactly! It's always been my experience that when someone finds a purse, wallet, etc. and turns it into the police, they always get the name, address, and phone number of the person who found it. That way, if the owner wants to contact them and give them a reward, etc, they can find them.

Also, finding a purse in the desert with a large amount of money, credit cards, license, etc.....wouldn't that at least raise some suspicions by the police? In a city, ok...I can see MAYBE someone losing a purse or wallet like that...but in the middle of the desert????? Come on...someone in the sheriff's dept needs to get on the ball.

[magpie1]

At this point in time, the police or private investigators might want to talk to the men who were four-wheeling, in hope of obtaining any additional clues to Renee's disappearance. But without an address or phone number, that avenue is lost.

The one thing that's really concerning about this case is Renee leaving her purse behind, with all her credit cards and a sizeable sum of cash. I can see a woman leaving other belongings behind, but not her purse.

[RogerV]

Originally posted by magpie1

The one thing that's really concerning about this case is Renee leaving her purse behind, with all her credit cards and a sizeable sum of cash. I can see a woman leaving other belongings behind, but not her purse.

Exactly. They didn't find either of the water bottles, and I'm now wondering if they even existed. Why would someone leave her purse with hundreds of dollars in it behind, but take empty water bottles?

There's still the possibility that she was impaired-- perhaps she fell off the wagon on drugs or alcohol. It's also possible that she was so disoriented and perhaps dehydrated to the fact that she wasn't thinking logically anymore.

Lots of questions here and few answers so far...

[RogerV]

I'd actually never heard of the town before this, and a Mapquest search proves that it is somewhat isolated. Its population is only about 800, but nonetheless it has motels, restaurants, shops, and the county courthouse. In other words, it would still be the first place you'd head if you were in trouble in the region and thinking coherently. Again, another piece of this puzzle that doesn't seem to add up.

[magpie1]

Roger,

I'm quite familiar with the town of Independence, having travelled through it on our way to Mammoth, June Lake, or other points north many many times.

It's a very small town, with fast food places, motels, and gas stations, and is basically a place to stop for gas or lunch on a long trip.

Independence is the Inyo County seat, and has a quaint old courthouse. The town was made famous in 1969, when the Inyo County Sheriff arrested hippies who were living in an abandoned ranch house out in the desert. Among those arrested was Charles Manson, who orchestrated the Sharon Tate and La Bianca murders in Los Angeles in the summer of 1969. Manson was housed in the local jail in Independence until he could be extradited to Los Angeles to stand trial.

[MakeSomeNoise]

Originally posted by magpie1
One of the reports - I believe one of the reports from the Crime Library, stated that the men who were four-wheeling gave her the 2 bottles of water and then the NEXT DAY found her purse with her credit cards and $900 in cash intact. The article states that it was then that they got suspicious and reported it to the authorities, who didn't get the names of the men.

The logical thing for the four-wheelers to do would be to have insisted on giving Renee a ride into town so she could get help - call her family to report what had happened.

If Renee was reluctant to go with strangers, the four wheelers should have gone into town, and reported to the authorities that a young woman's car had broken down and she was wandering alone out there in the desert. At that point, the police would have likely been able to locate and assist her.

I'm suspicious of the four-wheelers.

"But did not get the names of the men...." That is the craziest thing I've heard lately. I'm with you. What kind of PD wouldn't take down the names???

I'm also questioning how someone can walk into a sheriff's office with a found purse containing a sizeable sum of money, and the police not getting the names of the individuals who turned the purse in?

[MakeSomeNoise]

Well, I guess my other post went out to the Twilight Zone or something...but what I originally posted was the same concerns about the PD not getting the names of the guys on the 4 wheelers. That's just so hard to believe that no names or contact info was taken down. Something isn't right with this.

[MakeSomeNoise]

Would there be any way to obtain this info at this late date?

[magpie1]

The only way the police could possibly contact the men who were out four-wheeling, and who turned Renee's purse into the authorities, would be to make some sort of public plea for the men to contact the sheriff's office.

The local radio station could do a public service broadcast, asking that the men contact the sheriff, giving a number to call, and repeat the message during every commercial break throughout the day for several days.

The local newspaper could also print something on the front page in bold print asking the men who turned the purse into the sheriff to please contact the sheriff.

That's about the only way I can think of that the sheriff might be able to re-contact the two men.

Hopefully the two men were local to the area. If they weren't local, it might be impossible to re-contact them.

[RogerV]

Originally posted by magpie1
Roger,

It's a very small town, with fast food places, motels, and gas stations, and is basically a place to stop for gas or lunch on a long trip.

Independence is the Inyo County seat, and has a quaint old courthouse.

Yes... I think we agree that despite its small size Independence offers the things a person in trouble would need-- food, shelter, law enforcement.

So the question remains, why didn't Renee try to return to town? It would be a simple matter to follow the road she took out of town. Was she impaired in some way? Had her drug problem re-emerged? Was she injured?

[magpie1]

Roger,
The most logical thing to do in her situation with her car disabled would be to walk back to town - Independence, walking back on the road she had come in on. According to my map of the area, she was likely on Mazourka Canyon Road, and according to one article, she was about 12 miles from Independence.

According to my map book, Masourka Canyon Road passes through the very small town of Kearsage, which is about 12 miles east of Independence. On a satallite map, at close range, you can see that the pavement turns to dirt road right after passing thru Kearsage. It doesn't look like there's more than a handfull of structures in Kearsage (satallite photo), and all are off the main road. But, Renee likely could have gotten help from someone who lives in that area.

I feel Renee must have been disoriented, injured, or in some way impaired, that she couldn't reach help.

Here's a link to a satallite map of that area. You can move the image north, south, east, and west, and follow Mazourka Canyon Road from the town of Independence.

http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=36.80577,-118.202307&spn=0.11,0.18

[Second Thoughts]

There are a few more things you folks might want to consider about this situation. Renee' was seen by more than one group on Saturday. We saw her a bit earlier than the four-wheelers, walking up into Mazourka Canyon, headed toward a van that was nearby. (We found out later she wasn't with that group, unfortunately.) I believe she was also seen a bit later in the day by another person.

My husband stopped and asked her if she was alright. She said "Yes." We offered her a bottle of water and she said "Thank you" and kept walking. As a family with a young daughter & dog in our truck, we were about as non-threatening as anybody she'd come across in that deserted area. If she wanted help, we gave her a chance to ask. Since we didn't force her to go with us, does this mean that we should be considered suspicious, just like the four-wheelers?

We reported seeing her to the ranger responsible for the area & he called in the report to the police as we were leaving. This means that more than one report was made about her.

The four-wheelers were probably from out of the area, and have no idea that Renee's still missing. There really is nobody that lives in this area, it's just desert and old mines. Since the dogs lost her scent, she's probably left the area with someone - willingly or not is the part that scares me.

Of course, the most important thing at this point is that Renee' is found. With luck and prayers, this will happen.

[RogerV]

Originally posted by Second Thoughts
We saw her a bit earlier than the four-wheelers, walking up into Mazourka Canyon, headed toward a van that was nearby.

We reported seeing her to the ranger responsible for the area & he called in the report to the police as we were leaving. This means that more than one report was made about her.


UP INTO Mazourka Canyon? By that do you mean that she was walking AWAY from Independence? If that is the case, then she truly was disoriented. If she stayed on the road and had the reserves and strength to do so, she would have eventually arrived at a locked gate at an elevation of over 9,000 feet. One would hope that at that point she'd turn around and retrace her steps, but that's hoping against hope that she had a huge reserve of strength and actually made it that far.

Another possibility is that she might have struck out across the desert hoping for a shortcut, which again is inadvisable.

You've also made a good point, and that is you can't FORCE someone to accept help. It's a free country and walking around the desert with no gear isn't a crime, though it is the height of foolishness.

It's really starting to look like she was suffering from some kind of dementia, and it's anybody's guess as to what might have caused it. The chances of this story having a happy ending are getting dimmer by the minute.

To top it all off, local officials seem to be convinced that she made it to the highway and hitched a ride somewhere... I think someone mentioned Oregon or Salt Lake City just to illustrate that she could have gone in any direction, and is now no longer their problem.

[Second Thoughts]

Roger,
Yes, INTO Mazourka Canyon, she was already far away from Independence, since she was on foot and the temperatures were over 100 that weekend. It sounds like you know this area, so you know how big & deserted this area is. We saw her right by the only house in the canyon, which has running water, and there are many old mines nearby.

The canyon was searched several times and the dogs lost Renee's scent at a mine... she wasn't in the mine, but she would have been able to cool off & hopefully regain her senses.

With the number of folks that visit this area from out of town, perhaps she asked for a lift wherever the next car was headed. If that's the case, she could be anywhere.

If Renee' or someone that knows where she is reads this, please contact her family - it doesn't matter why she left or where she is right now, they just want to know she's safe. Even the people that saw her out in the desert that day are concerned for her and want her to return home safely. My daughter has learned a valuable lesson about asking for help, always letting someone know where she's headed, and being prepared for possible problems.

My prayers go out to all the families that are in this situation - not knowing is one of the worst tortures for a parent.

[magpie1]

Second Thoughts,

You did the right thing, reporting that you had seen Renee to the ranger. There really wasn't anything more you could do. If she needed a ride into town, then a family with a child and a dog would have been the safest.

Did she seem okay? By that, I mean did she seem confused or disoriented? Was there anything that seemed out-of-the-ordinary, or did she seem fine? Did you notice if she had her purse with her at that time?

The fact that when you saw her, Renee was walking AWAY from Independence, puts a different light on this situation. If she knew she was walking away from Independence, then it would appear that she wasn't trying to find help.

I feel badly for her family as they're left not knowing what happened, where she is, or even whether she's still alive. I hope, for their sake, Renee's disappearance is resolved. A very sad situation.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone


No you are NOT the only one.

And LE forgot to get the fourwheelers numbers? What's that?

Do they use scent dogs in mines? The scent led to a mine shaft. A crew was called in. What exactly and how exactly did this crew search?

I am not only wondering about the fourwheelers but the search grid too.

The 4-wheelers are kind-of still a myth. Some people say there were 2 guys, some say 4 guys, and one web site there was a woman saying SHE was with them.

Our family appreciates your concern. More than you know.

[baambaam82]

:rose:

[magpie1]

Originally posted by cabojenn


The 4-wheelers are kind-of still a myth. Some people say there were 2 guys, some say 4 guys, and one web site there was a woman saying SHE was with them.

Our family appreciates your concern. More than you know.

cabojenn,

I presume you are a member of Renee's family. I'm very sorry you and the other family members are having to go through this terrible situation. I pray that Renee is returned to her family safe and sound. :rose:

[GetTheTruth]

Every news story I read has something different, little tid-bits changed here and there, like playing the "telephone game". Things get changed everytime someone else tells the story. You can't believe word-for-word every story you see on the news or read in the paper. Second Thoughts would be my husbands step-mother & my mother-in-law. As she stated in her comment, Saturday afternoon, June 24th, we were headed down the hill, on Mazourka Canyon Rd., passed a van going up the hill with an older couple in it, then saw Renee walking UP the hill. Dad gave Renee a bottle of water, asked her if she was ok, Renee said yes, and we drove on. This was approximately 4:00pm. There were three vehicles in our group, two of which had children, so for Renee to feel unsafe asking for help would be crazy. We immediately reported to the CDF who were at the bottom of the hill that we had seen a woman by herself and had given her water, and that they might want to send someone to check it out. They replied they would inform the Sheriff, who did not start searching untill Sunday. I don't know if there is any truth to there being men on four-wheelers or not. According to the investigator, the couple that we passed in the van Sat. afternoon found her purse Sunday morning as they were coming down from camping overnight. We have been in contact with the authorities since the day we saw Renee, hoping to help in any way possible.

For the people who looked at satallite images, Kearsage is not there. It was a small mining town in the late 1800's, and there are NO structures there what-so-ever. You would never know there was a town there just by looking at it. No one lives in Kearsage. When we saw Renee, we were at least 8-12 miles from Independence, which would be the closest homes. Our family frequents the area often, as we have property in Lone Pine, which is 10 miles before Independence.

As Second Thoughts stated, even though we don't know her personally, we are very concerned for Renee, and have hope that she will be found, and found safe. She is a beautiful girl, and has her entire life to look forward to--with her son and family. Please continue to pray for her and her family, who I'm sure are going through hell right now.
:rose:

[magpie1]

Get The Truth,
Thanks for posting and for your input. It dismaying that the sheriff didn't act promptly when notified on Saturday, and waited until Sunday to start searching.

It was my mistake, looking at the satallite images, that I thought I saw what looked like the roofs of a few structures, all off of Mazourka Canyon Road, and in the area where Kearsage would be.

We've travelled through Independence many times on our way northward or returning from a trip north. It's always been a rest stop for us, a place to stop for lunch or to get gas. We've never ventured off of 395.

This is a terrible tragedy for Renee's family. I pray there will be positive resolution soon.

[GetTheTruth]

magpie1,
There are a couple of hoppers used in mining in the area, most are at, or just above, the base of the hill/mountain. So it's completely understandable to think they were houses or something else when you are looking at a satellite.

When we travel to the area, we tend to be just the opposite of what you described yourself to be. We spend most of our time exploring the mountains on each side of the valley, trying to get AWAY from others!!

We have to stay positive and keep up hope that Renee will be found unharmed.

[RogerV]

I actually don't know this particular area, but I am somewhat familiar with the area around Bodie, which is similar. I knew about the locked gate at the end of Mazourka Canyon Road and the elevation thanks to an up to date web page maintained by the BLM.

I also found some pictures posted on the web that give an idea of just how bleak and rugged the terrain is:

http://www.virtualguidebooks.com/SouthCalif/EastOfTheSierra/NorthInyoRange/NorthInyoRange_FSTOC.html

NOT the sort of place for wandering around alone with no supplies or gear.

I also wonder about the four-wheelers, as I seem to remember that the BLM site said that "off-roading" was forbidden. However, I understand that some of the roads may be so bad that you need 4WD to negotiate them.

It now seems that enough people saw Renee headed AWAY from town and the main highway to discount the alleged sighting near the highway. I only hope the authorities can come to the same conclusion.

[RogerV]

Here is another link to a site that helps explain the region's popularity. It also illustrates that there are so many nooks and crannies that even the most careful search could miss something:

[magpie1]

Roger,
Thanks for the links. From looking at the second link, it looks like there's a few trees to seek shade from the sun, and a few caves that would be cooler.

I hope the searchers checked out the caves and mine shafts thoroughly.

[GetTheTruth]

I would like to know if there are any "missing person" fliers or posters for Renee that are on the internet that I can copy, download, print, etc... If anyone knows where I could find such a thing please share!!!

[magpie1]

Originally posted by GetTheTruth
I would like to know if there are any "missing person" fliers or posters for Renee that are on the internet that I can copy, download, print, etc... If anyone knows where I could find such a thing please share!!!

Get The Truth,
I haven't seen any missing person posters for Renee on any of the websites.

Several years ago a friend who's sister was carjacked from a parking lot in South Carolina, posted pictures of her sister and her sister's car on various websites. People on those websites copied the pictures and made up their own flyers. They posted the flyers at truck stops on major highways, and also sent them online to "Internet Cafe's" used by truckers. In that case, it was hoped that truckers, being on the highways, would spot the car.

In this case, posting flyers with Renee's picture and a brief description, the date and place where she was last seen, in gas stations, fast food establishments, cafes, rest stops, etc., all along 395 would be great. They should also be posted in Mazourka Canyon, if there's any place where the flyer could be posted.

[cabojenn]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,202234,00.html

http://www.cbs2.com/video/?id=21263@kcbs.dayport.com

I have her grad picture that one of our cousins emailed me last night, but I am unable to include it in this forum. Does ANYONE on here except emails? Because her pictures are so pretty and she has changed a bit in the last year. Shorter hair, and a bit aged.

OH! There IS a flyer on a soap message board. Still not the most current of pictures but it's the one I think everyone in the family is using.

http://groups.msn.com/BANNEDT0GETHER/generalhospital.msnw?action=get_message&mview=0&ID_Message=4253&LastModified=4675579670119514854

If the link doesn't work or if they put the board on private sorry. It's a msn group called Bannedtogether for General Hospital. The girls can be ruthless, so if you go there I suggest only look for the link that I posted under Cabojenn and the subject is Email. I have an attachment (pdf) on the thread.

[cabojenn]

http://groups.msn.com/BANNEDT0GETHER/generalhospital.msnw?action=get_message&mview=1&ID_Message=4278

[GetTheTruth]

Cabojenn,

You can e-mail me or send "private messages" on here. Just click on pm under my comment. I was asking about fliers or pictures because I wanted to post a bulletin on MySpace and have other people pass it on...the more people that know, the better the chances!

[GetTheTruth]

Or click on "profile" under my comment--then you can e-mail me

[cabojenn]

As of yesterday, as major search was to begin no later than this morning. Will let you all know if they find anything.

[cabojenn]

http://www.texasequusearch.org/index.html

These are the people out there doing the search. And they also have a flyer.

[ConcernedCousin]

In an effort to help we've created this page.






Help Find Renee Fox www.myspace.com/helpfindreneefox (http://www.myspace.com/helpfindreneefox)

[ConcernedCousin]

Here it is again.


In an effort to help we've created this page.


Help Find Renee Fox (http://www.myspace.com/helpfindreneefox)

Thanks.

[phynickyb]

This is cousin Sandy... I have been hoping for an update about the new search. Any information yet?

[phynickyb]

Cousin Sandy here... Has there been any updated information about the new search?

[ConcernedCousin]

We haven't heard anything.
Cousin John

[magpie1]

Originally posted by ConcernedCousin
In an effort to help we've created this page.






Help Find Renee Fox www.myspace.com/helpfindreneefox (http://www.myspace.com/helpfindreneefox)

ConcernedCousin,
Thanks for the webpage!

I'm familiar with the search team, Equasearch (spelling) who are headquartered in Texas. This group was organized after the founder's daughter was missing. This team also went to Aruba last year to search for Natalee Holloway.

Prayers for Renee and her family. I hope she is found safe and sound soon. :rose:

[RogerV]

Originally posted by cabojenn
http://www.texasequusearch.org/index.html

These are the people out there doing the search. And they also have a flyer.

I'm very glad to hear that they're on the case. This is the type of search where it will be necessary to look under every single bush, tree, or rock. Because they work on horseback they can cover terrain much more quickly than someone searching on foot, and they can also go places that motorized vehicles cannot.

I have an awful feeling that some mines are going to have to be re-searched, but I have no doubt that the Equusearch people will come up with the right kind of personnel and equipment for the task.

Again, my best wishes and hopes for everyone involved!

[cabojenn]

No news yet.

I came in to call my mom, who is with Renee's mom today. I guess they didn't start that search yet. The organization that is supposed to is still out in San Bernardino looking for that 21 year old from Colorado. As soon as they finish up with that they will begin. Hope they find him, but with the fires up there...you know?

Other than that, there are no leads on Nay. Thank you for asking.

I will email you and/or post here as soon as I hear anything.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by ConcernedCousin
We haven't heard anything.
Cousin John

It's Michele's daughter Jennifer.

No news as of 20 minutes ago.

[ConcernedCousin]

Jennifer,

It's your mothers cousin, John. Please keep us posted.

Thanks

[cabojenn]

i am working on her domain...since not everyone likes myspace, though it can be a great site......in order to view it fully, ya have to be a member.

findrenee.com is being brought to us by www.someoneismissing.com

they seem nice.

[DRONES]

Good afternoon,

Have any more sightings been reported lately? I certainly hope that She turns up safe. Tim has used us extensively on many searches and there is talk of us going out there to send up our aircraft to get high res digital images of the search area. Hopefulyy we can help out. We have recovered 3 missing persons for TES and we were also used extensively in the Tara Grinstead case. IF you search this site for "RP Flight Systems" you can see how we use high technology to search. Or you can visit us on the web at www.rpflightsystems.com..
As some of you know Texas Equusearch is a non profit and it runs on donations alone.. When we go on a search with TES our time is donated however it is expensive to get both of us and all our gear on site. We would love to be able to afford to go on all of the TES searches but sometimes funds arent available so if any of you can help TES that would be great.

Drones

[cabojenn]

www.findrenee.com is no longer in use. A family member in the Long Beach area has taken over and had it changed. The NEW site is

http://helpfindmymommy.com


Much better I think, as it is a bit interactive.

Other than that, as of yesterday, no new news.

[cabojenn]

Texas Equusearch will not begin the search until they start receiving donations. Searching does cost money.

If any one can help, we beg you to do so!!!!

Please help our family find Renee.

[DRONES]

Good evening,

"Texas Equusearch will not begin the search until they start receiving donations. Searching does cost money.
If any one can help, we beg you to do so!!!!"

To say the least! Tim called us out on a search for a missing 11 year old "special needs" boy a few months ago. We mobilized as fast as possible. Our trip is was to be about 160 miles each way. We needed 4 wheelers and our aircraft.. In our haste to get there we managed to crash both ATV's through the back windows of our trucks(YEAH-YEAH, bonhead move) to the tune of $350 damage each vehicle.. The search was called off because they found the boy as we were leaving the driveway, the end result was awesome, the safe return of the boy but it did hurt the economy of our family... Another search had us travel 480 miles away, On the way home(after finding the person) I blew a wheel bearing in my truck 150 miles from home. not to bore you with details but it took 3 trips of 300 miles each to get my truck home, and replacement parts were another $150 on top of all the fuel cost.. these cost are nothing when you consider that your looking for a person in need and with loved ones, but when you have to foot the unexpected 300-700 dollars a month worth of bills and spend days at a time away from home it really puts a strain on things. I am not complaining becuse the reward of finding someone ranks up there with having children and getting married. I am simply stating that there are alot of unexpected or hidden cost that pop up. TES has to spend tons of money on each search and it really helps for people to donate time or money. I can promise you that being on the "inside" and seeing how the machine works is truly an incredible experience. Just to see the compashion of the TES staff and volunteers is amazing..

Please Help,

Drones

[cabojenn]

I am sure no one thinks you were ranting. Your post was a great example of the unepected costs, which are ON TOP of the other expenses.

Trying to get donations. Thank you.

[socal_native]

To all Renee's family & friends...

First, I am so very sorry. My prayers are with you & Renee.

I am a volunteer with Texas Equusearch. I was in Big Bear with them last week looking for the missing 21 year old man. I will also participate in the upcoming search for Renee.

Please do know that Tim & the rest of us are very concerned about Renee and are very interested in finding her. Although I cannot tell you a specific date - I am hopeful that some of us will be heading to Independence, CA very soon.

In preparation, I noticed there were some folks on this board that actually saw Renee that day. I would be very interested in talking to you personally before I head out there. If you read this message, can you please send me an email on how to contact you?

God Bless,
Mike

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by socal_native
To all Renee's family & friends...

.

Please do know that Tim & the rest of us are very concerned about Renee and are very interested in finding her. Although I cannot tell you a specific date - I am hopeful that some of us will be heading to Independence, CA very soon.


God Bless,
Mike

Mike,

Thank you for your deep concern over my cousin Renee. In my heart, she is my sister and this is very hard on not just me but anyone that has ever met her, not just family. She is an amazing woman, she really, truly is.

There is so much more I could say to the world about her, but today I am just too emotional.

We all look forward to your team's efforts in finding her. Especially her son.

[DRONES]

Hey Folks,

I just got word that my partner has arrived in LA and is in transit with our drone to meet up with Mike to lay out the plans for the next few days of searching. As I understand it, Mike has gotten with some people that know the area very well and that they will assist in designating search areas.
I wish I could be there to help analyze photos but I have to stay back and work. Hopefully with the high res images and some people foot searching we will be able to find Renee.

Myron
www.rpflightsystems.com

[Kylie222]

Search plans are underway by Texas EquuSearch to help search for Renee Fox. The command center location will be posted on our website www.TXEQ.org when the date/location are confirmed.
Saturday appears to be the day.

Any tips or leads needs to go directly to our office by email info@texasequusearch.org or toll free 877/270-9500 and will be fielded from that point.

[GetTheTruth]

Our family is planning on leaving Friday night to head up to Independence to help. Some of our family is already there trying to round up donations for the EquuSearch team. Let's keep praying and have faith!!!

[DRONES]

Good evening everyone,

I just spoke with Gene to get a search update. He had a successful day of flying the drone with some good help from Mike and a few others. He is in the process of "squinting" (analyzing) hunderds of photos that our aircraft took of the search areas. The day was a success when it comes to getting quality images of the search area. Hopefully enough volunteers will come out to get some more ground covered this weekend...

We have been on many searches and it sure seems that "we the people" really need to put the heat on uncle sam to get his head out when it comes to looking for missing persons. I can understand that Law Enforcement doesnt have the recources to get involved but there HAS to be a way that more effort can be put into missing persons by law enforcement. They just dont seem to care.

Myron

[socal_native]

Well, I just got back from Independence, CA this morning (Saturday morning) where the search for Renee has been going on for several days now. I would like to have stayed longer and helped with the ground search that started today but had to tend to family & work back home.

I flew down there Wed morning to recon the area & also start some initial aerial imaging of the area.

During 3 days, I took over 300 photos of the area from the air (from a single-engine airplane).

Additionally, Gene from Texas Equusearch & RP Flight Systems arrived Thu afternoon & also took several hundred more photos with their drone.

Using aerial photography during these searches allows for a much wider area to be "searched" in a very short time. Of course, we're limited to finding only something that is in view so these photos aren't a perfect solution - and why there is still the need for ground searching. But, it does provide an excellent way to cover large areas quickly and focus the ground searching.

I've posted a few of the photos I took on my website in case people are interested: http://www.mikemelson.com/ReneeFox

God Bless,
Mike

[GetTheTruth]

I spent all day Saturday with Renee's family and friends in Independence helping with the search...what absolutely wonderful people. I am filled with even more emotion now than before, and can understand a little better the desperation and pain they are going through. My heart aches for them, and I pray there are some answers to this case very soon. I am compelled to do even more to help Renee's family, and want them to know that our family is here to help in any way.

I wasn't able to meet Mike Melson since he had to leave Friday, but I met Gene Robinson. He was a GREAT help in keeping us organized and focused as we searched. I must give praise to my Aunt Angelique as well! She worked with Mike and Gene to help organize everything, and to enlist donations and help from all the local businesses, and to make sure that all of us doing the foot search were well hydrated and ok.

May God bring Renee back to her family soon. :rose:
"BE KINDER THAN NECESSARY, FOR EVERYONE YOU MEET IS FIGHTING SOME SORT OF BATTLE"

[phynickyb]

I am one of the cousins that could not make it to the search because I am out of state and could not arrange the trip soon enough. The family is so very thankful to those of you that have helped out in whatever way you can, by way of contributions to the Texas Equasearch team, your physical help in the search or your hopes and prayers!

To the rest of my family...I wish you the peace that excels all thoughts! I hope for some resolve and understanding of this horrible ordeal! My love and prayers go out to you all. I miss you and wish I could offer more physical support at this hour of need. My hopes are to arrange a visit soon! Let's bring Renee home!!!

[mtpockets]

Body Found May Be Renee Fox



http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_130.shtml

[magpie1]

Los Angeles CBS News has a video clip of the news of the remains found that are believed to be the remains of Renee.

http://cbs2.com/

[RogerV]

Originally posted by magpie1
Los Angeles CBS News has a video clip of the news of the remains found that are believed to be the remains of Renee.

http://cbs2.com/


Well, that was a very interesting news report-- the reporters are already referring to the remains found as "Renee's body" even though there has been no positive identification yet.

However, I think a family member quotes a law enforcement source which said they believed Renee's body has been found.

The remains were found in a ravine just off the road, and about five miles from town. Assuming it is her, and since most of us can only be "armchair detectives," I'm guessing that weakened from lack of water and food, she simply stumbled into the ravine and was knocked out or simply didn't have the strength to try to climb out.

Whatever happened, my best wishes to all of her family in this incredibly difficult time for them.

[magpie1]

My deepest sympathy to Renee's family and friends. :rose:

[cabojenn]

I have a few problems with that article.
He seems to have forgotten what he had previously reported. Just keep that in mind when you read it, some parts have been exaggerated.
And also know that there are other conflicting stories out there.

We grew up together. I used to read her the Golden Books, because I could read and she hadn't learned yet.
We threw baby showers together.
Renee was my absolute favorite cousin.

Wait to judge or draw conclusions until the autposy is complete.

[GetTheTruth]

Cabojenn~

I agree with you...things tend to get exaggerated to draw readers in.

I spent Saturday July 28th with Reese and Dave, their wives, other members of your family, and some family friends on the search outside of Independence. Let me tell you, what an absolutely incredible and wonderful extended family you have. I can only imagine the heartbreak you are all going through. Please know that all involved from my family send our love and prayers, and are here for anything your family needs. My Aunt has been in constant contact with Reese and Tracey, helping in any way possible. Take care...

God bless Renee's son most of all

[scout]

That's strange. The Crime Library article says that Renee had left her cell phone behind along with her purse, but this article (http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_130.shtml) says that a cell phone was found near the body.

I saw an interview with Renee's brothers displaying a copy of a postcard that was mailed to the Inyo Register, but the details were difficult to make out. Is an image of that postcard posted anywhere?

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by scout
That's strange. The Crime Library article says that Renee had left her cell phone behind along with her purse, but this article (http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_130.shtml) says that a cell phone was found near the body.

I saw an interview with Renee's brothers displaying a copy of a postcard that was mailed to the Inyo Register, but the details were difficult to make out. Is an image of that postcard posted anywhere?

Not strange actually. She had a NEW cell phone. The old one was left behind, the new one was found near her.

No, the postcard is not posted anywhere. In fact I'm surprised my cousins showed it at all. But if you re-watch the interview, you can pause it.

It was signed Elliot Ness (of all names) but maybe the part you can't make out was Chloride Arizona, an old mine town.

[scout]

Originally posted by cabojenn


Not strange actually. She had a NEW cell phone. The old one was left behind, the new one was found near her.

No, the postcard is not posted anywhere. In fact I'm surprised my cousins showed it at all. But if you re-watch the interview, you can pause it.

It was signed Elliot Ness (of all names) but maybe the part you can't make out was Chloride Arizona, an old mine town.

Thank you, Jenn, for sharing that. I was wondering what it said under the signature. I could make out Arizona, but not the word "Chloride".

I'm also curious about the pictures on the other side. I wish I could see them better to know what brand names of products are depicted there.

Another question I have is when the postcard was mailed. Do you know if it was sent before the body was found?

[RogerV]

Originally posted by scout
That's strange. The Crime Library article says that Renee had left her cell phone behind along with her purse, but this article (http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_130.shtml) says that a cell phone was found near the body.


I noticed that also. I suppose it's possible (assuming it really is Renee) that she had more than one cell phone. However, if it was in working condition, why didn't she use it to call for help or contact her family? Maybe the report of this second mysterious cell phone is a mistake? Such things have been known to happen.

I'm also curious as to how well the area where the body was found had been searched before. The region had been subject to several intensive searches, and they all failed to find anything. This time, a single searcher working alone found it.

What's really tragic is that this body was found within reach of help-- near the road and only five miles from town. Could this possibly be a reason why other searchers didn't check it out more carefully?

A lot of questions still unanswered....

[RogerV]

This news story is perhaps the most detailed of all, as it indicates what was used to make the initial identification:

http://www.venturacountystar.com/vcs/sv/article/0,1375,VCS_239_4920417,00.html

It seems to contradict other stories on the degree of decomposition, but this may explain why many parties seemed certain Renee had been found, even before any formal testing had been done.

[cabojenn]

The body found IS that of my cousin. It has been confirmed.

There are things not being reported because of the investigation. However, I must say in MY opinion, they weren't looking very hard. They KNEW she was up there, while she was alive and didn't look for a stranded woman in the desert until a full day later.

They didn't want areas previously searched to be re-searched. They decided she had left the area because someone saw a woman near the highway, even though the description DID NOT MATCH RENEE.

They didn't listen to the family that knew her better than anyone.

Am I accusing them of anything? No. I am waiting for the autopsy. But things just don't make sense.

[RogerV]

Cabojenn,
Thank you for confirming the identification. I am truly saddened for you and all of your family, expecially the little boy who will grow up hardly having known his mother.

The frustrating thing is that the autopsy may be inconclusive, which isn't unusual when a body is in an advanced state of decay.

This is of course speculative, but it looks to me as if she accidentally fell into the ravine and was knocked out, otherwise injured, or simply too exhausted to try to climb back out.

We unfortunately will probably never know why Renee acted in such an erratic manner. I believe I read somewhere that she was known to have a poor sense of direction, and that might possibly explain why she was seen walking into the canyon instead of out of it towards town. However, it's unlikely we'll ever know the complete story.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by RogerV
Cabojenn,
Thank you for confirming the identification. I am truly saddened for you and all of your family, expecially the little boy who will grow up hardly having known his mother.

The frustrating thing is that the autopsy may be inconclusive, which isn't unusual when a body is in an advanced state of decay.

This is of course speculative, but it looks to me as if she accidentally fell into the ravine and was knocked out, otherwise injured, or simply too exhausted to try to climb back out.

We unfortunately will probably never know why Renee acted in such an erratic manner. I believe I read somewhere that she was known to have a poor sense of direction, and that might possibly explain why she was seen walking into the canyon instead of out of it towards town. However, it's unlikely we'll ever know the complete story.

Well, we do know that she was last seen further in the canyon. So either she realized her mistake and was almost back to the highway, and you are right in theory, or she was PUT there. With that being said, most bodies that are "put somewhere" in areas like that are within 20-30 feet of the road.

You could very well be right. But a forensic investigation, assuming the person is any good, should be able to determine foul play, or other. I am being positive on that, of course. They are getting better at that stuff. There was tissue still on her.

Thank you for the condolences.

[RogerV]

Originally posted by cabojenn

most bodies that are "put somewhere" in areas like that are within 20-30 feet of the road.

You could very well be right. But a forensic investigation, assuming the person is any good, should be able to determine foul play, or other. I am being positive on that, of course. They are getting better at that stuff. There was tissue still on her.


I was trying to avoid saying "she may have been thrown into the ravine," but it appears that you've already considered this possibililty. They should be able to tell a great deal from how the body was positioned, among other things. I have no idea whether things like tracks would still be visible after this length of time or not. They hopefully looked carefully for any other clues also.

With luck the autopsy will come up with a definite finding, and that will at least provide some closure for you and the rest of your family.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by RogerV


I was trying to avoid saying "she may have been thrown into the ravine,"

Thank you for being sensitive RogerV. But for the 7 weeks that she was unaccounted for, all we did was flip back and worth on assuming the absolute worst, and hoping she was just out there escaping. And when I say escape, I mean running away. Which would be very unlike her, so we also went back to worst case scenarios.

[baambaam82]

I was so hoping they were going to find her alive, but I am glad to know that her family will now have some closure and will be able to bring her home and honor her memory. God bless her family, especially her little one at home.
:rose:

[magpie1]

I'm so sorry that this ended in the worse case scenario. My condolences to Renee's family, and especially to her son. :rose:

[unconvinced1]

I couldn't read all of the other posts so I'm not sure if this has been addressed. I'm a 27 year old female and I never leave the house without my purse, infact at times it travels with me in my own home... Why is it not a big deal that Renee left her purse with $900 in it- this just blows my mind- she was either on a suiside mission or there was someone that took her out of her car. I can kind of see leaving her cell phone but the purse with $900 in it really bothers me. I also have questions about the people claiming to come across her and giving her water. Maybe I have just read too many stories about people vanishing and all the lies that hindered the investigation, but there are soo many things that are not adding up here. I hate to say the people that are trying to solve this might be botching it up, but if something doesn't make sense to me and I'm just a citizen then why are the trained professionals letting these things slide by?!

-Really bothered by what I have read about this.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by unconvinced1



-Really bothered by what I have read about this.

Thank you for your concern over Renee's story. As we believe there is one.

May I suggest you read the posts? Because family members which I am one of, (by the way) have corrected some of the wrong information already.


To all family and friends, it's a HUGE deal that her purse was found. The cell phone was an old one. Her new one was found by her body.

Renee like you, carried her purse around the house. She would NEVER leave it under ANY circumstance.

No one took her out of her car. It broke down.

Those "people" claiming to give her water are not just people. I believe part of that family came down to help in the search.


What we don't understand, and that's knowing things the public doesn't because there IS an investigation, is why the police did not look for her the day they were told she was up there and maybe needed help.

THEY WAITED.

And WHY didn't they allow the wonderful people from Texas to search areas that had been searched before.

After all, that IS where her body was found. An area already searched by police. So was she still alive while the police decided she left the area and almost make it back towards her car? Did they miss her body the first time?

We may never know.

Maybe if enough people want answers, and demand them, we will get them.


Fox News had covered it in the beginning, but have not officially updated their viewers. Maybe you can help to peak their interest?

[GetTheTruth]

Cabojenn-Fox News did a story last Sunday evening on "The Lineup". Reese and Tracey were interviewed, and they did a wonderful job regarding the problems w/the Sheriff. We have also sent e-mails to Greta VanSustren asking her to cover this story again, but have not recieved any reply yet. Will you be at Renee's services? We will be there...

Unconvinced1--What would you like to know about us? Yes, we saw Renee Saturday June 24th around 4pm, walking up the hill, we were coming down the hill. We thought it was odd that a young woman was alone, as far as we could see, and with no water that we could see, so we stopped, gave her a bottle of water, asked if she was ok, she said yes, we drove on. How were we to know she really wasn't ok? You can't force someone to go with you just because you think the situation is odd. At that time, she wasn't "missing". When we got to the bottom of the hill, we notified Calif. Dept. of Forestry that we saw a young woman with no water walking up the hill, they said they would call the sheriff. As far as we know, the sheriff didn't start looking untill someone else found her purse Sunday morning. We learned the following Tues. or Wed. evening on Fox News that a 25 year old woman was missing in Mazourka Canyon. That's when we realized it was the woman we saw. Ever since then, we have been helping in any way possible. We spoke to the Sheriff numerous times, we've been in contact with Renee's family, and we helped on the search July 28th with Texas EquuSearch.

This has been emotionally hard on our family as well, even though we never knew Renee. Our hearts are aching just as well. I hope the questions that Renee's family have, that we ALL have, are answered soon and they can find peace. Our love to them...

[magpie1]

GetTheTruth,
You and your family did all the right thing. There was nothing more you could have done. I fault the local law enforcement for not acting promptly and getting help to Renee on Sat. June 24th. Instead they waited until the following day and it would appear that they didn't do a thorough search.

Evidently, at some point in time Renee realized she was walking in the wrong direction and turned around and started walking back towards Independence.

You last saw her at about 4:00pm. Renee may have walked a couple of miles further before turning around. That would have put her quite a distance from town - perhaps about 14 miles. By the time she would have gotten to the area where her remains were found, it would have been late at night, after dark.

It would be logical to stay on the road surface and not go off the road, knowing that the road leads back to town. If it was dark, Renee wouldn't be able to see what was on either side of the road, and I think most people would be fearful of stumbling around in the dark on unfamiliar ground. The reports state that her remains were found some distance off the road. I'm puzzled as to why she left the safety of the road.

Prayers for Renee's family and for you, GetThe Truth. :rose:

[curiousfriend]

im an old friend of the family, ive been following this hole investigation closelyand yes there is a lot of screwy info reported, and a bunch of unanswered questions. im gonna go ahead and say it, the sherrifs dept. up there seems to me the first suspects i would look at. but thats my own opinion, and i could be way off, but itsgot my suspision going. i read in another report, i think it was crime blog, that her body was found buried, dont know if that was just another media screw up, with false info, cause that seems to be common with this case. another question is, do they really think she was walking around the desert in 100 degree temps, bare foot, through dirt,rocks,thorns,etc. i wouldn't think so, and i dont believe i read anywhere that her shoes were on her feet, or even found for that matter. I sure hope the family at least, will get some answers soon. I really would like to go to the service, im not sure if it is by invite only or not. I would call judy, but i dont want to bother her at this time, if anyone knows if it is an open service or not, could u please let me know, i will be checking site often, and would be most grateful.. I really dont want to bother reese, dave, or any of the family right now. My deepest sympathies go out to the family, but just know now that she is in warming arms of her beloved brother (eric) who was my very very close friend.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by curiousfriend
im an old friend of the family, ..... I would call judy, but i dont want to bother her at this time, if anyone knows if it is an open service or not, could u please let me know, i will be checking site often, and would be most grateful.. I really dont want to bother reese, dave, or any of the family right now. My deepest sympathies go out to the family, but just know now that she is in warming arms of her beloved brother (eric) who was my very very close friend.

Please please please call my Auntie Judy. You are absolutely welcome to the service.
I'm sure if you were friends of Eric's, your call would mean SO much to everyone, as we still haven't dealt with his loss either.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by GetTheTruth
Cabojenn-Fox News did a story last Sunday evening on "The Lineup". Reese and Tracey were interviewed, and they did a wonderful job regarding the problems w/the Sheriff. We have also sent e-mails to Greta VanSustren asking her to cover this story again, but have not recieved any reply yet. Will you be at Renee's services? We will be there...



I missed it on Fox News. And there is nothing I can find on their web site, which still shows her as missing.

Yes, I am flying back home to the States Tuesday, and will be at the service.

I couldn't possibly miss the memorial to my favorite of the 32 or so 1st cousins, big family....she was more of a sister.

Has anyone thanked you in the family yet for the water you gave to her? Well, thank you.

Jennifer

[GetTheTruth]

Yes, we have been thanked...I wish we could have done more that day. I look forward to meeting you, only wish it were under different circumstances.

[RogerV]

Originally posted by magpie1
By the time she would have gotten to the area where her remains were found, it would have been late at night, after dark.

It would be logical to stay on the road surface and not go off the road, knowing that the road leads back to town. If it was dark, Renee wouldn't be able to see what was on either side of the road, and I think most people would be fearful of stumbling around in the dark on unfamiliar ground. The reports state that her remains were found some distance off the road. I'm puzzled as to why she left the safety of the road.


My best guess is that by the time she got to that point she was probably exhausted, dehydrated, hungry, and confused, all on top of the distress observed by people who saw her in Independence before she disappeared. ANY of these things alone could cause a person to become disoriented, and she was suffering from them all. It has also been reported she had a poor sense of direction.

I don't know if there was moonlight, but even if there was, it's amazing how confusing things are in the dark. It's entirely possible that she unintentionally walked off the road and simply could not find her way back, even though it may only have been a few feet away. It also appears that she wasn't a seasoned outdoorswoman who would have been aware of some of the techniques for reorienting herself. Remember also that the terrain is mostly covered with small scrub brush, so there weren't a lot of trees or other large objects to serve as landmarks.

For some time after learning that she had a new cellphone I wondered why she didn't use it to call for help. My guess is that it also probably had a dead battery. Many people do not realize this, but anytime a cell phone is turned on, it is using SOME power. It's constantly "searching" for a signal so it will be ready to send or receive a call when needed. In an area of spotty cellular coverage, a cellphone can run itself down without a single call being made or received.

As for the sheriff's department refusing to allow an already-searched area to be searched again, their reasoning was probably something to the effect that it made no sense to use scarce resources to go over an area again when there were areas that had not been searched at all. However, they of all people should have been aware of the fact that it's the type of terrain where every bush, tree, and rock has to be looked under, behind, and around. Even an experienced searcher can miss something only a few feet away.

Probably many of these questions will never be answered, and again I offer my sympathy and best wishes to Renee's family and friends.

--Roger

[curiousfriend]

Thank u very much cabojen, I look forward to seeing u at the service, I believe ive met u once before a very long time ago with eric. I think i will give judy a call, and thx again for the respone : ) and rogerv, I can see ur tring to make for a logical possibility that she could have just been disorientated, or wondered off the road, etc. but I still can't believe any of those possibilities could have happened without having a pair of shoes, or sandles on her feet. I wanted to ask the kind folks who seen her and gave her some water, if they may have noticed any shoes on her feet? just seems like an important little factor too me. I cant believe anyone would not think there was some foul play, and i was thinking if she would take a ride to town with obviously a very kind, and innocent family, then i couldn't see her getting in anyones vehicle, unless they were of some kind of authority, that would seem logical to me. but im sure my questions are just as everyone elses are, i just hope the family can get answers.

[GetTheTruth]

Curiousfriend~
Yes, Renee had tennis shoes on when we saw her, tan cargo pants, a dark green spaghetti-strap tank top, and a baseball cap. She was carrying a large purse, and a blanket. You would think she would ask for help if she was stranded in the middle of nowhere for a night and a day and then saw a group of people. Like my mother-in-law said in one of the first posts on this site, we were about as non-threatning as anyone could be. There were three vehicles in our group, two of which had children!! But then again, she could have been delusional from the heat, we just don't know. It was about 105 that day.

It wouldn't be "normal" to wander out there with no shoes on. It's a rough/rugged area. I believe someone else knows the true ending to this, and I hope they are found SOON.

[curiousfriend]

I was wondering if you Are a teacher at pierce college?

[RogerV]

Originally posted by GetTheTruth
Yes, Renee had tennis shoes on when we saw her, tan cargo pants, a dark green spaghetti-strap tank top, and a baseball cap. She was carrying a large purse, and a blanket.


I guess I can now add "sunburned" and "blistered feet" to my list of conditions she was suffering from towards the end (exhaustion, dehydration, hunger, confusion). A tank top is not a good thing to wear in the blazing sun, and tennis shoes are a poor choice of footgear for hiking in the desert.

I can certainly see her carrying her purse, but a BLANKET on a 105-degree day? I really do think she was already in some way impaired when you add that to the facts that she was headed in the wrong direction and didn't ask for help from a group of non-threatening people.

The purse I assume is the one found with the $900 in it, but has the blanket been found? It's not a huge clue, but it might throw a little more light on her movements.

[GetTheTruth]

Originally posted by curiousfriend
I was wondering if you Are a teacher at pierce college?

I assume you mean me?? No, I'm not. That would be ironic & odd if I was, to be in the same area as Renee, when that's the school she went to.
Our family has property & a cabin in Lone Pine, about 15 miles south of Independence, so we spend time exploring, fishing, off-roading, etc. in the area as often as possible. We just happened to be there when she was.

RogerV--I agree with you on the clothing issue, but I don't think Renee was planning on getting stuck. I usually wear tennies and tank tops in the summer, sometimes even sandals, but I'm never alone, in unfamiliar area, unprepared when we're there.

[curiousfriend]

:rose: Get The Truth: I am sorry for not saying thank you immediately for your response as to what she was wearing! My question was actually directed towards RogerV? By the way this is curious friends' girlfriend, and I have been doing alot of researching as well as he. Yes, it would be extremely odd if you were up there at the same time and were a teacher at the college that Renee just graduated from. I was wondering if anyone has heard of "Fat Hill Fandango"?!!:rose:

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by curiousfriend
Thank u very much cabojen, I look forward to seeing u at the service, I believe ive met u once before a very long time ago with eric. I think i will give judy a call, and thx again for the respone : )

Not sure if I am answering curious friend or curious friends girlfriend. Judy REALLY could use a call. In fact, I still haven't called. In denial. Calling makes it too real. Though I will suck it up this morning before I leave for my Mom's. (Flying home today...)It's not about me, I know. See you Saturday.

I think Reese has asked that everyone leave their theory's at home that day. No gossip etc. That will be hard for me, but I'll give it a shot.

[curiousfriend]

Hi, Jen this is his girlfriend and I will ask him to call your aunt today, I believe he is having a hard time with placing the call just as you, because it makes the whole situation all too real, just as you said in a sense a type of denial. I couldn't agree with Reese more! Everyone needs to leave their theories at home and be there to support the family and mourn the loss of Renee and remember all of the good times they spent with her. I feel for her son along with the rest of the family. I will hopefully see you at the service. I'm not sure if I will be able to attend because we just had a baby and I'm not sure if his appearance would be appropriate at that type of arrangement, but please know my thought and prayers are with you and the rest of the family and her husbands family as well. :rose:

[RogerV]

Originally posted by GetTheTruth

RogerV--I agree with you on the clothing issue, but I don't think Renee was planning on getting stuck. I usually wear tennies and tank tops in the summer, sometimes even sandals, but I'm never alone, in unfamiliar area, unprepared when we're there.

I agree completely that she wasn't planning to get stuck and lost in a desert -- she had every intention of returning to "civilization," for which she was more appropriately dressed. My point was that the lack of the right kind of clothing and footgear must have just added all that much more to her misery and discomfort.

Curious friend, no I don't work for any college, and I live in Portland. As an aside, I will mention that many people don't realize that half the state of Oregon is a high desert, and that's the part where I was born and raised. For that reason I have some idea of what it's like to be wandering around in a remote desert area.

[curiousfriend]

Originally posted by RogerV


I agree completely that she wasn't planning to get stuck and lost in a desert -- she had every intention of returning to "civilization," for which she was more appropriately dressed. My point was that the lack of the right kind of clothing and footgear must have just added all that much more to her misery and discomfort.

Curious friend, no I don't work for any college, and I live in Portland. As an aside, I will mention that many people don't realize that half the state of Oregon is a high desert, and that's the part where I was born and raised. For that reason I have some idea of what it's like to be wandering around in a remote desert area.

RogerV - I wanted to apologize for any offense that might have been taken in regards to my question - I was actually hoping you might have been because of a link that you posted earlier for airtrash which I found further down the road linked up with a site called Explore Historical California - whom are Tour Guides that are authorized to give 4x4 guide tours through the Owens Valley, Inyo Mountains and according to their website which is ran by the Vargo's - the main mans name being Roger - to come to find out that they were giving a tour in that area during the same time that Renee was up there, and reading in Rogers wives online journal it turned up that he is also a teacher at Pierce College in the Photo Journalism department. - With knowing that and as I believe you stated earlier that 4 wheeling wasnt allowed up there - being a tour guide with authorization to be up there would give everyone here some direction as to where the 4 wheelers originally came in - so I was hoping that you were Mr. Vargo so you would be able to shed some light on that, but unfortunately you obviously aren't him (which I should have figured on my own- if I would have just looked back over all the posts you made in this thread) (done after the fact of me asking the question of being a teacher). Which I am very sorry - I am just like everyone else trying to figure out answers to the numerous unanswered questions - just got a little excited as to possibly learning as to who or where the 4 wheelers came in! The question was not meant to be taken in any negative way and did not intend to offend anyone by asking it!
My prayers and thoughts and countless for Renee and her entire family!
:rose:

[sanderella]

I would like to share my take on Renee and her Memorial, Saturday, August 26, 2006 to those of you that are following the case.

Renee was obviously a much loved young woman by the over flowing crowd at Reardon Mortuary. It was standing room only and the doors burst at the seams. She was eulogized by many with fond memories of her goodness, her charm, her wittiness, her love of her darling son, her love of her family and friends. The elements of a beautiful and giving woman. Eric, all 5 years old, got up to the mic and spoke a little about his mommy. What a doll he is! The many, many photos of all her beautiful smiles lit up the room. The times of innocent youth, the times of adulthood were there for you to touch your heart. What touched my heart the most was the almost life size picture of Renee and her brother, Eric, at her High School Graduation. It was the most beautiful picture ever taken of any two people. They were so happy together and Eric was so proud of her. They are both desperately missed.

Reese and Traci did a wonderful job at opening their home to this huge crowd. Judy is remarkable in holding up to the public eye and looked beautiful. And Jennifer... you are about the sweetest thing and I know how much you are hurting. I am so very sorry for you. What a resemblance to Renee you have.

I hope that those of you that read this forum continue to follow the case of Renee as someone has to be held accountable. The investigation needs to go in full earnest to find out all the answers. I feel a reporter should have been at her memorial to report the out pouring of love and support from at least 200 friends and family and perhaps that would bring the case more to the fore front up in Inyo County….

God bless Renee. May she be at peace with her brother in Heaven.

[curiousfriend]

yes it was a wonderful service, it was very nice to see the building overcrowded with friends and family. I too would love to have a copy of the picture with renee and eric, he was such a close friend, and i miss them both. I agree that the media should continue to shed light on the investigation, for there are so many unanswered questions. But is guess for now we can only wait for the autopsy report, which i do hope they make available to the public to read.

[ChristaShook]

I knew Renee and Judy from many years ago. Renee worked for me at 1st National Bankcard in Simi Valley before she moved on to Farmers Insurance.

I am deeply saddened that the world lost such a beautiful, kind young woman. She was always very sweet and sincere. The company (1st National Bankcard) moved to Nevada in 1999, and returned back to Simi in 2002. I ran in to Renee several times since I moved back the last time about 8 months ago, making this even harder.....

I just want her family to know that no matter what challenges she encountered in her short life, she left a lasting impression on those of us that knew her.

I will always remember her beautiful smile.....

[deuxlumieres]

I hope this isn't an inappropriate segue here, but I have been following this story since Renee disappeared. I was raised and still live in Simi Valley, and I played with Eric (Renee's brother) when we were kids. We all lived in the same neighborhood, and I just loved him. He was such a sweetie! I lost touch with him after junior high, and I hadn't realized until Renee's disappearance that he had died.
Can someone please tell me how he died? I remember he had hemophilia, but it absolutely never slowed him down when we were kids. He was always sporting some bruises, but would take jumps on his bike like he had no cares in the world. He was a cool guy.
Thanks in advance for any info you can give me!

[curiousfriend]

Hey whats up, yes eric died about 7 years ago. I believe the cause of death was due to liver failure. You are absolutely right about his disease never slowing him down, i think he pushed the limits on everything he did just to piss us off, lol and to prove a point that his handycap would never get in his way, or be used as an excuse for anything. I can say he is probably the strongest person ive ever known, and is very missed. god bless eric, & renee

[cabojenn]

1st, to address the last two posts, Eric died from medication. A doctor put him on something, and it destroyed all of his vital organs. Very tragic, but we were able to say good-bye. Okay, I chickened out at the foot of his hospital bed; but we had the chance to.

And that day, I saw Renee in a way that I wish many could have. She was strong, and gentle, and kind. She was literally taking care of her "big brother", and stayed by his side until he went to sleep in death. What I witnessed that night are private moments, but moments that I will always remember.

When we were little, we had our own clan. As cousins, we were more like siblings; our children even referred to us as Auntie Jenn, Auntie Renee. Somewhere in there she became the wise one, the strong one. She was that way with us all, I think; the way that I saw her with her big brother that last night he was with us.

Renee's memorial. A lot of people are saying that there were 200 in attendance. But really, it seated 200, then there was standing room only, plus who ever stood in the parking lot.

Sanderella's thoughts on the service were correct. Many of us are still at a loss of words, and cannot speak of her without breaking down.

While at this time, as far as I know, we still do not know what really happened up there; but personally I would like to thank you for your support during this time.

[GetTheTruth]

Originally posted by sanderella

Renee was obviously a much loved young woman by the over flowing crowd at Reardon Mortuary. It was standing room only and the doors burst at the seams. She was eulogized by many with fond memories of her goodness, her charm, her wittiness, her love of her darling son, her love of her family and friends. The elements of a beautiful and giving woman. Eric, all 5 years old, got up to the mic and spoke a little about his mommy. What a doll he is! The many, many photos of all her beautiful smiles lit up the room. The times of innocent youth, the times of adulthood were there for you to touch your heart. What touched my heart the most was the almost life size picture of Renee and her brother, Eric, at her High School Graduation. It was the most beautiful picture ever taken of any two people. They were so happy together and Eric was so proud of her. They are both desperately missed.

Reese and Traci did a wonderful job at opening their home to this huge crowd. Judy is remarkable in holding up to the public eye and looked beautiful. And Jennifer... you are about the sweetest thing and I know how much you are hurting. I am so very sorry for you. What a resemblance to Renee you have.

I hope that those of you that read this forum continue to follow the case of Renee as someone has to be held accountable. The investigation needs to go in full earnest to find out all the answers. I feel a reporter should have been at her memorial to report the out pouring of love and support from at least 200 friends and family and perhaps that would bring the case more to the fore front up in Inyo County….

God bless Renee. May she be at peace with her brother in Heaven. [/B]

I couldn't agree more...It was so obvious how loved she is by all the people there that day.

I would like to thank Renee's family and friends for being so welcoming to our family. That means the world to me. They are all so incredible, and made us feel like a part of their family. I hope we can all stay in contact. I wish I could go back to that day in June, and take more time than we did, to make sure Renee really was ok. I live with that regret everyday. Renee is always on my mind, and will forever have a piece of my heart.

Happy birthday to her today...:rose:

[curiousfriend]

I was just wondering if anything on the cause of death has been determined? I keep looking everyday and haven't had any luck in finding anything new on her case. It's driving me nuts I just can't believe that it was from dehydration or heat, Renee would have taken help if offered, be it if she were in that situation, she was very intelligent and wouldn't put her life in jeopardy that way. If they havent found out yet, does anyone know if they are going to allow the autopsy results to be made public?

Happy late Birthday, Renee!! You are greatly missed and loved!!!

How is the little guy doing? I still hear his words from the service, it brpke my heart he is so adorable, just like his mommy! :rose:

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by curiousfriend
I was just wondering if anything on the cause of death has been determined? ......................... If they havent found out yet, does anyone know if they are going to allow the autopsy results to be made public?

Happy late Birthday, Renee!! You are greatly missed and loved!!!

How is the little guy doing? I still hear his words from the service, it brpke my heart he is so adorable, just like his mommy! :rose:

Nothing yet. Could still be weeks. I am sure that the results will be made public, but don't quote me.

There is still an ongoing investigation, so time will tell. In the meantime, maybe if we shout loud enough someone will listen and actually do something to find out (referring to Inyo County's lack of concern).

cutting this short...late for the afternoon carpool and there's another hurricane I've got to prepare for.

Eric IS adorable, huh? Bet he'll be just as great a man when he grows up like his late Uncle Eric!!!

Jenn

[RogerV]

Originally posted by cabojenn


Nothing yet. Could still be weeks. I am sure that the results will be made public, but don't quote me.

There is still an ongoing investigation, so time will tell. In the meantime, maybe if we shout loud enough someone will listen and actually do something to find out (referring to Inyo County's lack of concern).


The potentially very frustrating thing about this case is that the autopsy may result in an indeterminate cause of death. Even the actual time of death will be next to impossible to establish, and will have to be "guesstimated" from the last point that anyone definitely saw her alive.

I know that I'm starting to sound like a broken record (that is if anyone even knows what a broken record IS anymore), but there is little question in my mind that Renee was in some way impaired because her known movements simply do not make sense.

The logical thing to do would have been to remain with her disabled car until morning (and she may well have done this), then either walk the relatively short distance back to town, or hitch a ride with one of the several vehicles known to have been in the area. Instead, she was spotted several miles from her car, walking uphill, and away from town, and she apparently declined at least two offers of help. She also at some point lost her purse which contained $900 in cash. Even without the money, a purse is about the LAST thing that any woman will turn loose of or forget.

SOMETHING was not right, but we may never know for certain what it was.

[cabojenn]

I don't think anyone answered your question...yes, her blanket had been found.

The water bottles, her tennis shoes, and her shirt are still missing, along with a few other items.

Recap on Nee...she was last seen in the LATE afternoon miles and miles away from her car. Her purse and blanket were found CLOSER to her car than where she was last seen. You made a comment about using recources on areas already searched; they weren't tax payers recources. It was private. Family, and
http://www.texasequusearch.org/index.html and possibly these people www.rpflightsystems.com
both teams are experienced in searching areas of all terrain, AND have successfully found the missing, even in places already searched. A well trained eye...that is what they do.

The sheriff had already decided Renee had left the area and was probably just being irresponsible, so what did he care if the family wanted to re-trace her steps?

However, the sheriff allowed a stranger to search the area? And he found her? Why? And before that day, why wasn't there any smell? There is so much more...

And we are supposed to believe that all along she was right there, 1/4 mile from her car?

[RogerV]

Originally posted by cabojenn
I don't think anyone answered your question...yes, her blanket had been found.

The water bottles, her tennis shoes, and her shirt are still missing, along with a few other items.

Recap on Nee...she was last seen in the LATE afternoon miles and miles away from her car. Her purse and blanket were found CLOSER to her car than where she was last seen. You made a comment about using recources on areas already searched; they weren't tax payers recources. It was private. Family, and
http://www.texasequusearch.org/index.html and possibly these people www.rpflightsystems.com
both teams are experienced in searching areas of all terrain, AND have successfully found the missing, even in places already searched. A well trained eye...that is what they do.

The sheriff had already decided Renee had left the area and was probably just being irresponsible, so what did he care if the family wanted to re-trace her steps?

However, the sheriff allowed a stranger to search the area? And he found her? Why? And before that day, why wasn't there any smell? There is so much more...

And we are supposed to believe that all along she was right there, 1/4 mile from her car?

You misunderstand me... what I meant was that it was the SHERIFF'S reasoning about use of resources, both public and private that kept them from searching the area where Renee's body was eventually found, not mine. If it had been me, I'd have had them search every inch of ground, no matter how many times it had been gone over before.

There is also the possibility that her body wasn't there when the area was first searched. The fact that a single searcher working on his own found her very quickly would seem to support this contention.

I think we are in basic agreement that SOMETHING doesn't add up here, and if the truth is ever discovered there may a number of things that contributed to the tragedy.

[cabojenn]

I didn't mean to sound however I sounded. I was starting to make a point that I guess I didn't finish. There are a lot of things going on up there that smell fishy to a lot of people. Not just about Renee. I cannot elaborate at this time though...

[one_eyed_Jack]

Is there any news on Renee?? The autopsy should have been done by now. I'm not real happy with how this investigation has been going or the lack of communication to the public from the authorities.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by one_eyed_Jack
Is there any news on Renee?? The autopsy should have been done by now. I'm not real happy with how this investigation has been going or the lack of communication to the public from the authorities.

Still waiting for the results. It seems Inyo County doesn't do anything unless toxicology tests are completed...just look at what happened to Shaleen Duckey; she had lacerations and there was a knife found near her body, but they won't say she was murdered because "her results" aren't back yet.

Also, the "authorities" up there do not like to communicate with the families either .

Maybe we (both families; Renee's and Shaleen's) are asking them to work too hard?

Thank you for asking...will update the board as soon as we hear anything. Promise.

[phynickyb]

CaboJenn, please let us know if you are aware of ways that we can create some urgency in solving this. Such as contacting news agencies and other departments of law enforcement that might put the pressure on the Sherrif's department up there. Thanks

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by phynickyb
CaboJenn, please let us know if you are aware of ways that we can create some urgency in solving this. Such as contacting news agencies and other departments of law enforcement that might put the pressure on the Sherrif's department up there. Thanks


I really should consult with other family members first...however, last night on CNN they interviewed Tim Miller, the man behind EquuSearch. The interview was not about Renee, but it did show that they were qualified to search the area.
See link:
http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/glenn.beck/

This is relevant because Inyo County didn't want them up there saying it was dangerous, that were were inexperienced etc., and while Inyo DID let them do some searching, they would not allow them to search certain areas "already searched".

We truly feel that had they allowed Tim and EquuSearch some "freedom", she would have been found much sooner. Had we found her sooner, it may have made it easier for the coroner to give us a cause of death...and as of an hour ago, it is still pending.

Maybe e-mail or call CNN and and bring up that?

Fox News has covered our families tragidy as well...yet their web site shows her as still missing. They covered Renee's story during Greta's hour, maybe by e-mailing and calling them too.

You know, I never thought I would get involved in a "cause", for any reason. But this isn't just about Renee anymore. Have you heard about Shaleen Duckey? She vanished about 2 weeks after Renee. She was found 2 weeks after that, and her family doesn't have answers either. Shaleen was from Bishop; same sheriff's.

There's more going on up there as well...but I need to consult with others first.

SOMETHING IS GOING ON UP THERE!!!!!!!!!!!

So to answer your question, we would love some heat added to the fire, before this happens again, to someone else's mommy, daughter, sister, wife, friend, and beloved cousin. Renee was all of those things. She wasn't just my cousin. She was my entire childhood.

[cabojenn]

I am SUCH a dork!!! It didn't dawn on me who was asking until this morning what more could be done. Consult the family...duh to myself and a big "HELLO"???? I guess no body is home. hee.

[phynickyb]

Jenn, no worries about not realizing who I am, it is not like we are using our real names...just being in AZ and away from the rest of the family, I check this site daily for any updates. I thank you sweety...you have really showed others on this message board how these simple inconsistencies really do amount to a lot of unanswered questions.

Renee represents so much more than a lost loved one, mommy, family member. She represents the inadequacies of our government to provide assistance to family members of missing persons. Realizing that local governments and LE may not have funding for extensive searches, still there should be a "place" (government department) that families can turn to to get the needed help IMMEDIATELY!!! And yet, what other help does a family in need get? Nothing from the government, the FBI doesn't necessarily have "jurisdiction" if the local LE has it under investigation. Waiting, and then trying get donations, etc....to fund a search, is just not good enough.

TexasEquuaSearch, what a phenominal group of volunteers. They were a great help in the search for Renee as well as a support group. But let's face it...as volunteers of their time and resources, imagine the expense a search in another state creates for their organization. Yet they are willing and very skilled at what they do. Travel, organization, food, just to name the basics. I encourage any and all that have been watching this Message Board, please consider making a donation to http://www.texasequusearch.org/index.html.

I apologize for the rant. It is just the building frustration with the whole handling of the case that should not be swept under the table. We need concerned citizens to get involved and create some heat under the INYO County Sherrif's department and those who monitor their actions. There are a lot of unanswered questions, but as long as the case is considered an "ongoing investigation" a lot of the information and inconsistencies are just not being addressed. Meanwhile, the passing of time really hinders the truth from coming out.

Jenn, thank you for your updates. Let's keep the interest in this case going, so the truth can come out!

Cousin Sandy


http://www.texasequusearch.org/index.html

[cabojenn]

http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_228.shtml

Not about Renee, just a mention of her. For those that don't know, Shaleen Renee Duckey went missing just a few weeks after OUR Renee. Her body was found about two weeks later; cause of death is still unknown. However, it is interesting to see how her family is just as ignored as ours, and that they still can't say what happened to her. There was a knife found near her body. She had lacerations on her body, and they needed toxicology tests??? Hmmm.

[RPFlight]

I've been kind of quiet but have been observing and listening to things going on here and in Inyo county. As the Search Director there in Independence for Texas Equusearch I am certain that we could have done more in the search if allowed. But we are obliged by protocol to respect the authority in place (Inyo Count SO) and we did so. Their (ICSO) understanding was that we were only going to fly one of my drones around and take pictures, not do a full fledged search - which kind of surprises me given Texas Equusearch's reputation. That being said I have to believe that an opportunity was squandered to bring Renee home a bit sooner. The connection between Renee and Shaleen is pretty unlikely in my opinion but it's just that, an opinion. It's also my opinion that little was done in both cases to resolve the facts.

I would like express my personal gratitude to Reece and Tracy and all the other volunteers that came out that day and worked with us. To Angelique, that relieved me of the drudgery of the paperwork that had to be done and the school for allowing us the use of their building for the CP. The businesses in Lone Pine extended their hospitality to us and that too is greatly appreciated. I have been on many searches across the U.S. with this organization and I have ALWAYS met a fantastic cross section of America that allows me to see the tragedy that we sometimes have to face, while it renews my faith in my fellow man.

With all of your help, we will continue our efforts.

Thanks

Gene

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by RPFlight
***snipped***

The connection between Renee and Shaleen is pretty unlikely in my opinion but it's just that, an opinion. It's also my opinion that little was done in both cases to resolve the facts.

***snipped***

Gene

Hi Gene!!!

Personally, I do not think Renee and Shaleen's deaths are related, in the sense they they died the same way. I whole heartedly concur with you in that little was done and little is being done to resolve both of these cases. That is the whole point. Why don't they care?

And for me, it's not just about these two women and Inyo County. Why is it that most people in general, don't care? They only care when there is a scandal behind the scenes.

Very tragic.

***I have been on many searches across the U.S. with this organization and I have ALWAYS met a fantastic cross section of America that allows me to see the tragedy that we sometimes have to face, while it renews my faith in my fellow man.***


You have been fortunate my friend, to see people come together in such a way.

From the very depths of what makes me, well, ME...thank you for all of your efforts.

[cabojenn]

~~The sheriff is claiming that the family is confused about some things, including what happened on July 24th.

**First of all, there was more than one group of people to see her that day!

**Let’s quote

[Second Thoughts: Renee' was seen by more than one group on Saturday. We saw her a bit earlier than the four-wheelers, walking up into Mazourka Canyon, headed toward a van that was nearby. (We found out later she wasn't with that group, unfortunately.) I believe she was also seen a bit later in the day by another person…]

[Get the Truth: Dad gave Renee a bottle of water, asked her if she was ok, Renee said yes, and we drove on. This was approximately 4:00pm…. ]

~~Sheriff says the contact was fairly short in nature

[Get the Truth: Renee had tennis shoes on when we saw her, tan cargo pants, a dark green spaghetti-strap tank top, and a baseball cap. She was carrying a large purse, and a blanket…she could have been delusional from the heat…]

~~The sheriff said no reports of a missing woman was made nor, he said, was there any immediate indication that the young woman was in jeopardy

**but there was a report of a woman in trouble:

[Second Thoughts: We reported seeing her to the ranger responsible for the area & he called in the report to the police as we were leaving. This means that more than one report was made about her.]

[Get the Truth: (just after 4pm) When we got to the bottom of the hill, we notified Calif. Dept. of Forestry that we saw a young woman with no water walking up the hill, they said they would call the sheriff….]
**Interesting to me because the sheriff said these people went on to have a good time and BY CHANCE informed them about Renee, an after thought

~~Sheriff: The following day, on’ Sunday afternoon’, the 25th, unrelated informants found a purse, some personal property.

**Are these the same unrelated informants mentioned here the same as the people in the van?

[Second Thoughts:she.. headed toward a van that was nearby…]

[Get the Truth: According to the investigator, the couple that we passed in the van Sat. afternoon found her purse ‘Sunday morning’ as they were coming down from camping overnight]

**So the last people to see her alive are confused too?

**I would like clarification…was her purse found late in the afternoon as the sheriff claimed, or in the morning?

~~Motweiler denied that the investigators were reluctant to allow Texas EquuSearch to participate in the hunt for Renee…

[RPFlight: As the Search Director there in Independence for Texas Equusearch I am certain that we could have done more in the search if allowed… That being said I have to believe that an opportunity was squandered to bring Renee home a bit sooner.]

**Family: Had the sheriff’s department allowed an organized search off of Mazourka Canyon Road, Renee would have been found within 15 minutes of searching, and much more evidence would have been preserved**note: with lots of hope of finding her alive, being realistic my family was looking for a body.

~~Sheriff response: their efforts would not have significantly altered the tragic outcome of the case. When Renee’s body was found on Aug. 10, it was in an advanced state of decomposition.

**Uh….excuse me for interrupting myself here, but there would have been a heck of a lot more left of Renee, had she been found sooner…and THAT was their response?

~~Sheriff: Finally, Motweiler disputed the family’s assertion that the sheriff’s department had been less than cooperative with Renee’s distressed relatives.

**Renee’s “distressed relatives” included her MOTHER (whom she had been living with just before her disappearance), her BROTHERS, not just her estranged husband. Renee’s “distressed relatives” have been going to the ends of the earth first to find her, and then to get answers. Answers to questions that Inyo County answers by hanging up on them.

~~Sheriff’s final quote: Apparently that was not satisfactory for some of those family members

**No sheriff, it’s not satisfactory, not to THIS family member.
Maybe it’s just me, but their response to our concerns made NO sense at all.

[cabojenn]

A wife, mother, daughter, sister, cousin, the kind of friend that always brought a smile...always thinking of everyone else


http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=92620373&MyToken=a50ac3a4-0438-48ab-9a0e-cd4af017cbde

[phynickyb]

Originally posted by cabojenn
[B~~Sheriff response: their efforts would not have significantly altered the tragic outcome of the case. When Renee’s body was found on Aug. 10, it was in an advanced state of decomposition.

**Uh….excuse me for interrupting myself here, but there would have been a heck of a lot more left of Renee, had she been found sooner…and THAT was their response?

CaboJenn...You are absolutely correct. Besides, does Mr. Motweiler have the slightlest clue as to the agony and despair that Renee's disappearance had upon her loved ones? Obviously not. As one day without notice is horrible, but an additional 2 weeks of only imagining the horrible demise she had been faced with.

~~Sheriff: Finally, Motweiler disputed the family’s assertion that the sheriff’s department had been less than cooperative with Renee’s distressed relatives.

**Renee’s “distressed relatives” included her MOTHER (whom she had been living with just before her disappearance), her BROTHERS, not just her estranged husband. Renee’s “distressed relatives” have been going to the ends of the earth first to find her, and then to get answers. Answers to questions that Inyo County answers by hanging up on them.

~~Sheriff’s final quote: Apparently that was not satisfactory for some of those family members

**No sheriff, it’s not satisfactory, not to THIS family member.
Maybe it’s just me, but their response to our concerns made NO sense at all. [/B]

Not only not satisfactory, but downright offensive in that a person in the position of taking "care" of people in need has absolutely no clue about how to deal with such tragedy to those ones that are affected by that tragedy. To take the "estranged husband" and apply him with information only is sooooo utterly ludicrous. Consider who was there, searching for her, according to their abilities (Her Bro and Sister in Law Reese and Tracey, her Brother David). Yes some were more able to do the physical search, and others the clerical (phone calls, paperwork, etc... other members of her close family). A mother is a mother always...not the same as an admitted estranged husband. What a poor excuse for disbursement of information to the wrong avenue, Mr. Motweiler.

[GetTheTruth]

wow...I have to clarify one thing. Maybe more. Sat. June 24th we were coming DOWN Mazourka Canyon Rd. approx. 4 pm, (NOT early in the day) passed a van with an older couple in it going UP Mazourka Canyon Rd., then saw Renee walking UP Mazourka Canyon Rd. When we got to the bottom of the hill, we reported seeing her to the CDF, who happened to be in the right place at the right time! (What are the chances of that??) We did not go about our sightseeing first, this all happened at the end of our day as we were headed back to our cabin. From the time we saw her to the time we reported seeing her, was only about 20-30 minutes. If that! We reported her because we thought it odd that a woman would be there by herself, in that heat, apparantly with no water, and she declined help from us.

Renee's family needs answers, and not to be shut out!!!

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by GetTheTruth
wow...I have to clarify one thing. Maybe more. Sat. June 24th we were coming DOWN Mazourka Canyon Rd. approx. 4 pm, (NOT early in the day) passed a van with an older couple in it going UP Mazourka Canyon Rd., then saw Renee walking UP Mazourka Canyon Rd. When we got to the bottom of the hill, we reported seeing her to the CDF, who happened to be in the right place at the right time! (What are the chances of that??) We did not go about our sightseeing first, this all happened at the end of our day as we were headed back to our cabin. From the time we saw her to the time we reported seeing her, was only about 20-30 minutes. If that! We reported her because we thought it odd that a woman would be there by herself, in that heat, apparantly with no water, and she declined help from us.

Renee's family needs answers, and not to be shut out!!!

Thank you for backing up my post my friend...

[GetTheTruth]

Originally posted by Freshwater


Please forward this information to Seamus McGraw at
seamusm@ptd.net Provide your name and phone number so he can verify your identity and information.

FH20

We have already told him our story, through E-mails, after he wrote the original story when all this first happened.

[LetsBeConcerned]

*****""According to Motweiler, there was no missing person’s report filed when Renee first wandered off into the desert after her car broke down on a rugged back road on Saturday, June 24. Nor, he said, was there any immediate indication that the young woman was in jeopardy.""****** An oxymoron statement if there ever was one~!!!!!!!!!!

Renee was last seen in triple digit heat~!!! Over Eight miles from food, shelter or Fresh Drinking Water~!!!

Yet the sheriff's said, "Nor, ... was there any immediate indication that the young woman was in jeopardy" (I suppose that these sheriff's have also never heard of Death Valley, one of the hottest places, after all, it is also located in their county)

It is absolutely shameful that the Sheriff's are pointing fingers at good citizens~!! :no: :no:

The original family that first reported that Renee was walking in the desert, first, they did NOT know how she got there. They did NOT know that her car broke down. They did NOT know that she had already walked 4 miles in the 107-degree heat, when they saw her lying in the road. They did NOT know that she had tried calling 411 a few times (and might have been expecting some help to arrive). They also did NOT even know her name. What they did KNOW was, it did seem odd, and the Sheriff should check to see if she was okay~!! That is the Sheriff's JOB~!!

This family did EVERYTHING they thought to do. They reported it. They thought the report would be taken seriously. This family ALSO went out of their way, driving several hours and making many arrangements that needed to be done for the search as well as participating in the search. They also drove several hours just to attend Renee's services. Our family extends its deepest gratitude for the lengths that this family has done for us. Including giving Renee water and showing concern for Renee's well being and reporting the situation. It all is greatly appreciated~!!

*****""According to Motweiler, there was no missing person’s report filed when Renee first wandered off into the desert after her car broke down on a rugged back road on Saturday, June 24.""*****

Who were they expecting to file a missing person report~??? Not to mention that Renee wasn't missing and the local officials were TOLD where she was.... had the Sheriff's went out to check on her, she would be alive today.

(Then again, if we were to go with Motweiler thinking, Renee is not dead, until we have a death certificate~??? Sorry for the sarcasm~!! )

Then the Sheriff's Dept. INSISTED that Renee had left the area. Publicly stating that she could be anywhere~!! But DEFINITELY NOT in the Desert~!!! Out of their jurisdiction and not much that they can do....

The Sheriff's did tell EquuSearch not to come... Stating that it was a waste of time. That she was definitely was not in the area.

We would also like to know at what point does immediate family, a mother and brother, are no longer considered "next of kin"~???? Renee had been separated and ceased living with her husband for more than a year. Renee was living with her MOTHER when she disappeared. Yet the mother is NOT considered "next of kin"

I am sure that MOTHERS everywhere would be outraged at that~!!!

Inyo County, our family deserves answers~!!



"Evil is aloud to flourish, when good people do nothing"

[GetTheTruth]

Originally posted by LetsBeConcerned
*****"

The original family that first reported that Renee was walking in the desert, first, they did NOT know how she got there. They did NOT know that her car broke down. They did NOT know that she had already walked 4 miles in the 107-degree heat, when they saw her lying in the road. They did NOT know that she had tried calling 411 a few times (and might have been expecting some help to arrive). They also did NOT even know her name. What they did KNOW was, it did seem odd, and the Sheriff should check to see if she was okay~!! That is the Sheriff's JOB~!!




THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!! You could not have said it better!!! That's what I've been trying to get across...we didn't know all that information when we saw Renee...and she declined help from us. What else could we do??

This family did EVERYTHING they thought to do. They reported it. They thought the report would be taken seriously. This family ALSO went out of their way, driving several hours and making many arrangements that needed to be done for the search as well as participating in the search. They also drove several hours just to attend Renee's services. Our family extends its deepest gratitude for the lengths that this family has done for us. Including giving Renee water and showing concern for Renee's well being and reporting the situation. It all is greatly appreciated~!!

You're welcome!! It was the LEAST we could do..."Do unto others..." I truly believe that! I would want all the help I could get if our family was in that situation. Renee and the rest of her family and friends will be a part of my life, and heart, forever. We have gained a wonderful addition to our family.

[tandarat]

I realize I'm coming in late to this thread, but I've read everything and, unfortunately, am not at all surprised by what is happening with the SO..

First, my sincerest condolences to Renee's family. To lose a loved one under any circumstances is painful enough - to lose one too soon and in a way that could be prevented is that much worse. I can't even imagine adding the stress and heartbreak of being treated with such callousness and insensitivity by those you had relied on to find Renee and had assumed would do everything in their power to keep her safe, if at all possible.

Though I've never had the bad luck of dealing with the Inyo Co. SO, I grew up in rural and semi-rural California, and their actions do not surprise me one bit.

I see two very possible scenarios here....either or both could easily happen. First, they were obviously lazy and did not want to be bothered looking for someone who very well could be just fine, and part of a group camping. Then, when they found out there WAS someone in trouble, and now missing, and that person did not have a "perfect", "storybook" life (her past troubles with drugs), they didn't feel they needed to look very hard....she was a "lowlife", and they didn't think she was worth it. If SHE was a lowlife, and her family was actually concerned, then THEY must be lowlifes, as well. They now realize their negligence and are desperately covering their butts to avoid lawsuits, investigations and possible punishment from external agencies, and the obvious embarrassment this would all cause.

The other thought, and this is from a family experience with another agency many years ago, is that she WAS at least assaulted, and possibly murdered, and the person(s) responsible are somehow related to members of the local LE...friend, relative, or perhaps even a member of the SO or other civil service agency. This would explain the seemingly incompetent, careless investigation, denying access to certain areas to be searched, deletion or switching around certain facts, etc.

I'm not saying any of this is true, but from previous experience with "small town" law enforcement, these are all possible, if not likely.

Also, in terms of where and when the body was found. I apologize in advance to family and friends if this is offensive, but this could be important. From what I've read, her body was found in a ravine fairly close to her car, in an advanced state of decomposition. How far from the road/trail was her body found? How often is that road/trail accessed by hikers, cars, off-road vehicles, horseback riders, etc? Even if the body was not visible, wouldn't someone have noticed the odor of a decomposing body? I've smelled this before, and trust me when I say you can't HELP but notice it from quite a distance, and through closed car windows if it is close enough. Even upwind, I've noticed that smell when I got within about 100 feet of dead animals about the size of a human, and have had the misfortune of smelling a human body through closed windows, walls, etc. from about 20-30 ft. away. It sounds like this path is used quite often...I can't believe that if the body was there that long, SOMEONE didn't notice. Again, sorry if I seem insensitive, but this is something that has been bothering me since I started reading about this case.

Anyway, something is just not sitting well with me about this case. Someone is covering for someone else here...The question is who and why.

[GetTheTruth]

Originally posted by tandarat
I

Also, in terms of where and when the body was found. I apologize in advance to family and friends if this is offensive, but this could be important. From what I've read, her body was found in a ravine fairly close to her car, in an advanced state of decomposition. How far from the road/trail was her body found? How often is that road/trail accessed by hikers, cars, off-road vehicles, horseback riders, etc? Even if the body was not visible, wouldn't someone have noticed the odor of a decomposing body? I've smelled this before, and trust me when I say you can't HELP but notice it from quite a distance, and through closed car windows if it is close enough. Even upwind, I've noticed that smell when I got within about 100 feet of dead animals about the size of a human, and have had the misfortune of smelling a human body through closed windows, walls, etc. from about 20-30 ft. away. It sounds like this path is used quite often...I can't believe that if the body was there that long, SOMEONE didn't notice. Again, sorry if I seem insensitive, but this is something that has been bothering me since I started reading about this case.

Anyway, something is just not sitting well with me about this case. Someone is covering for someone else here...The question is who and why.

Renee was found 30-40 ft. from Mazourka Canyon Rd. Many people have been on that road since her disappearance. When we searched a month after she disappeared, there were people, including family, that drove up the road, so yes, you would think there would have been a strong odor. But no one seemed to notice anything. Hopefully the autopsy results will be able to tell how long she was there, that might help in some way to solve this.

[cabojenn]

snipped...
Originally posted by tandarat

First, my sincerest condolences to Renee's family. ...


Also, in terms of where and when the body was found...

her body was found in a ravine fairly close to her car, ...

Anyway, something is just not sitting well with me about this case. Someone is covering for someone else here...The question is who and why.

Thank you for your condolences.

Yes, Renee was in a ravine, I believe not too far from where the "pavement" ends and the "dirt" began on the canyon, but her car was SEVERAL miles away.

[tandarat]

cabojenn...

Thanks for the clarification. It still sounds like she was close to a pretty busy path. Things just aren't making sense.

Michelle

[LetsBeConcerned]

Originally posted by tandarat


Also, in terms of where and when the body was found. I apologize in advance to family and friends if this is offensive, but this could be important. From what I've read, her body was found in a ravine fairly close to her car, in an advanced state of decomposition. How far from the road/trail was her body found? How often is that road/trail accessed by hikers, cars, off-road vehicles, horseback riders, etc? Even if the body was not visible, wouldn't someone have noticed the odor of a decomposing body?





Where it is TRUE, that you did read that in a local Simi paper, the information is wrong~!!!! I have also seen incorrect information in other papers as well.

Renee was found over 8 miles away from her car and closer to town than where the car was found. (both her car and body were found on Mazourka Canyon Road, away from HWY 395) Also from what I understand, it does not sound like a ravine.

Mazourka Canyon Road goes for very many miles. Only the first few miles are paved. Then it turns to dirt with a “Wash Board Effect”. This road continues in a relatively flat area from town and then goes up into a canyon in between two mountain ranges and beyond. How far it goes I am not sure. I went up there mainly to understand where/how Renee disappeared.

Renee was last seen in the canyon.

Renee was found on the “Valley Floor”, out of the canyon and closer to town than where she was last seen.

The area, that Renee was found in, would be looked at as boring, compared to the other places that would be much more interesting to explore.

Renee’s body was visible, but it was not obvious. Though technically could be seen from the road, it would not be noticed unless someone pointed it out to you. There is a lot of brush in the area, that acted as camouflage.

We did have our windows down when we drove up Mazourka Canyon Road, but when we drove onto the dirt, it was a natural instinct to roll the windows up as not to be choked by the dust cloud we had created.

It was good Samaritans that reported that Renee might be in trouble on Saturday.

The authorities did NOT know her name or her past when they got the report.

Renee was a person, a human being, whether you knew her or not. The authorities have the job of protecting it citizens.

The “cover up” started when she disappeared.

Back then, Bedell said…..

To quote the Inyo Register article published only a few days after Renee disappeared.

***…………“According to Inyo County Sheriff’s investigator Paul Bedell, travelers on Saturday called the Sheriff’s Department to report a woman walking west on Mazourka Canyon Road towards Independence, however, when sheriff’s deputies arrived at the scene to help her reach town, she was nowhere to be found.…………

“On Sunday, sheriff’s deputies still looking for Fox located “property belonging to Fox”……. However no traces of Fox herself were found……..

“At this time, the Sheriff’s Department does not believe that Fox was kidnapped. According to Bedell the way her property was recovered on Sunday, it appears that it may have blown out of the back of a pickup truck.”……..***

This article does say more, but I wanted to make the point how the Sheriff’s SAID they HAD been searching for Renee since Saturday. Only later, did we find out, that they really did NOT look for her until Sunday. Which was after they found out her name and contacted her family.

Renee is the victim and people need to quit finding fault with her.

Also note, the “property belonging to Fox” mentioned in the above article was actually her purse and cash. Yet, “the Sheriff’s Department does not believe that Fox was kidnapped.”

Pleeeeeeeeease~!!!!!!

Inyo County needs to start giving some HONEST answers and stop the “Smoke and Mirrors”~!!

[cabojenn]

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=92620373&MyToken=07bb1c01-6a87-4af5-9793-40870cad2935

[tandarat]

LetsBeConcerned....

In no way am I trying to "bash" Renee or look at her flaws. I have always believed that EVERYONE should be treated the same in this type of situation. No one's life or safety is more important, or more deserving, than another's. That is one thing that angers me about many (not all) law enforcement, not to mention the media. Someone with a "history" often is treated as second class.

And thank you for clarifying where Renee was found. There have been so many different stories, it had become confusing. However, I'm even a bit more suspicious now, if anything.

The reason I asked about where her body was located, and how much that particular road is travelled is because the smell of a decomposing body is very, very strong, AND it travels. Even if the windows of your car are rolled up you can smell it from a distance, unless you are in a very well-insulated car and run the air conditioner with recirculated air. Think of a skunk when you drive by on the freeway - a decomposing body smells at least that strong, and it is a very distinct odor. If the road is even reasonably well travelled, SOMEONE would have smelled something in that time, and I would think that at least some of the people going that way would be aware of the fact that Renee was missing and last seen somewhere along that road. That leads me to believe that her body was NOT there initially....she probably was placed there long after she had actually died. Also, if she was found back towards town, it sounds like the canyon was quite busy that weekend - is this the only road that leads to it? Wouldn't SOMEONE have seen her walking back along the road at some point? If she was seen at 4pm, and she was found 8 miles CLOSER to town, this would take several hours for someone who was fresh to walk. It would take her considerably longer. Even if she had walked all night, my thought is she would have still been able to make contact with someone, or be seen, early in the morning. If she walked during the day, she certainly would have been seen at some point....see where I'm going? It just does not make sense that she would have been found where she was found, when she was found, for several reasons.

[magpie1]

Although I haven't posted in a while, I've checked here often to read the comments and follow-ups.

I've hoped, as I know all of Renee's family and friends have hoped, for the autopsy report, which will hopefully give a conclusion as whether her death was accidental or if there was foul play.

The Inyo County law enforcement has not acted with any degree of credibility or responsibility in this situation.

One aspect that's bothered me is that early into the search for Renee, the local Inyo County newspaper received a very strange postcard that had cutout pictures glued to it. There was a picture of Renee, a house, some bottles, chips (?) and a police officer's body with a batboy head. It was signed "Elliott Ness Cloride, Arizona."

It's difficult to access the intent of this postcard. Is the sender just some crazy person? Or is it someone who knows something?

Has there been any explanation of this strange postcard? Any thoughts on what the sender intended?

[LetsBeConcerned]

This road may not be as well traveled as you might think. Though I think that others may know more, as far as how often someone would use this road. I personally never saw anyone else on this road, except those that we were meeting. While we were in the area for a few days, driving past this road a few times, never once did I ever see anyone else on this road. So I do see that it is plausible that days can go by without anyone using this road. After all, it is a fire road with no destination.

I too know of the smell that you are talking about and it is truly unforgettable. Something that is burned into your brain and you will never forget. Though I agree that a decomposing body can be very strong, it also depends on the conditions. Decomposition is twice as fast in water than on land. Much slower if on land and exposed to extreme cold or HEAT~!!!! A body will dry out quickly and eliminate the moisture needed for decomposition to proceed… along with the smell.

Also, there was nothing covering Renee’s body but the shadow of a bush.

Now is 110 degree heat enough to be considered extreme and reduce the smell~?? I don’t know.

California did have a heat wave with record-breaking heat this summer. So the temperatures could have been even higher.

Also from what I read on the subject and I would assume “normal conditions,”… after 31 days “(a body will) no longer give off a powerful stench and smell just like the soil surrounding it”

When we were up there, it was a month after Renee disappeared.

The family did call the coroner this week and still no results. We do want them to be as thorough as possible and run as many tests that they need. But the family was reminded that they are “not next of kin.”… Funny, how we can pass a DNA test.

There is also nothing to report about the post card. I did find that there is a ghost town in Inyo County, California, also named “Chloride”. I am not sure how far this ghost town is from where they found Renee.

It is nice to see that people are still following this case as confusing as it is. It is heartwarming that people still care.


:seeya:

[GetTheTruth]

Originally posted by LetsBeConcerned
This road may not be as well traveled as you might think. Though I think that others may know more, as far as how often someone would use this road. I personally never saw anyone else on this road, except those that we were meeting. While we were in the area for a few days, driving past this road a few times, never once did I ever see anyone else on this road. So I do see that it is plausible that days can go by without anyone using this road. After all, it is a fire road with no destination.



:seeya:

I don't know how many people actually travel this road in the summer time, but we were just there Oct. 21st, and I can say at least 8 cars passed by us all within about an hour. Of course that's because it was opening day for bird hunting, and also people go up there to deer hunt. There are spots to camp at the top of the mountains as well.



I too know of the smell that you are talking about and it is truly unforgettable. Something that is burned into your brain and you will never forget. Though I agree that a decomposing body can be very strong, it also depends on the conditions. Decomposition is twice as fast in water than on land. Much slower if on land and exposed to extreme cold or HEAT~!!!! A body will dry out quickly and eliminate the moisture needed for decomposition to proceed… along with the smell.
Also, there was nothing covering Renee’s body but the shadow of a bush.

I don't want to upset or offend anyone, but when we were there last week, there was still an odor. It wasn't noticable from the road, only when close to the bush. Mind you, Renee was found two and a half months ago. To me, it would seem that around the time, and before the time she was found, there would be a VERY strong smell. To quote tandarat, even if your windows were up, you might be able to smell something. She really wasn't that far from the road. I don't believe that absolutely no one had driven that road from the time we saw her and the time we searched to the time she was found. There wasn't really much of a ravine either. The bush was completely visible from the road.

The postcard is very odd as well, so many things just don't make sense. :shrug:

[LostPaws]

Originally posted by phynickyb


Not only not satisfactory, but downright offensive in that a person in the position of taking "care" of people in need has absolutely no clue about how to deal with such tragedy to those ones that are affected by that tragedy. To take the "estranged husband" and apply him with information only is sooooo utterly ludicrous. Consider who was there, searching for her, according to their abilities (Her Bro and Sister in Law Reese and Tracey, her Brother David). Yes some were more able to do the physical search, and others the clerical (phone calls, paperwork, etc... other members of her close family). A mother is a mother always...not the same as an admitted estranged husband. What a poor excuse for disbursement of information to the wrong avenue, Mr. Motweiler.

I just wanted to offer my thoughts, prayers, & condolences to each of the lives affected by this terrible loss & tragedy. Also, perhaps offer a suggestion that may prove helpful in some small way . . . I am very aware of the "rights of confidentiality," etc., and do respect them. I believe that if the Renee's estranged husband will personally authorize information to be shared with other named kin/family, that this will allow them access to the information, IMHO.
:rose: for Renee

[Northwest Girl]

http://www.crimelibrary.com/news/original/1106/0202_renee_fox.html

[curiousfriend]

:confused: :shrug:

Has anything been determined in regards to the 2 postcards sent to the press and family? Or have they just been pushed off to the side in hopes they might be forgotten about? I read the article and it says that they feel Renee probably succombed to the heat, if that is so, then what happened to the remaining articles of clothing that hasn't been found yet? Why/Who sent those postcards? Why is the coroner doing another test and results are now pending for another couple of weeks/months? Why isn't this case top priority? So many darn questions, with no answers (without any in near sight) a beautiful life has been lost and some questions need to be answered!! Renee's case should be just as important as others in this world like Anna Nicole Smith's son has already had 2 reports completed including toxicology tests, Why is that? Because she has money? Come on now, sheriff get on the ball with getting the answers that Renee's family DESERVES, since the LE has slacked in all areas regarding Renee from the minute they were informed to now! The least the LE could do is put a RUSH priority in determining the cause of death. It's times like these that I wish I had the authority to fire those SOB sheriffs up there and get some compitent men up there who aren't trying to figure out how to pull their heads out of their asses for the last 6 months! Sorry for some of my comments, out of respect for the family, I am sorry if I offended anyone in the family and friends only! Renee is such a beautiful person inside and out, it just makes me enraged at the thought of her no longer being with us any longer! I pray for her family and son every night before bed. I hope that they can have some resolution soon!
:rose:

[goatgirl]

:rose: for Renee Fox:rose:

[RogerV]

Originally posted by curiousfriend
:confused: :shrug:

Has anything been determined in regards to the 2 postcards sent to the press and family? Or have they just been pushed off to the side in hopes they might be forgotten about? I read the article and it says that they feel Renee probably succombed to the heat, if that is so, then what happened to the remaining articles of clothing that hasn't been found yet? Why/Who sent those postcards? Why is the coroner doing another test and results are now pending for another couple of weeks/months? Why isn't this case top priority?

I think the short answer to your question is that the authorities are proceeding on the assumption that it was an accidental death. I'm not saying I agree or disagree, but that's the most likely reason.

Here in Portland, the companion of a good friend of mine died of a diabetic seizure in his sleep. It took the Medical Examiner (we have ME's in Oregon, rather than coroners) over TWO MONTHS to issue a finding so that a death certificate could be issued, and even then they got it wrong. This case, like Renee's, was pushed to the back burner while murder, or suspected murder cases got priority.

[curiousfriend]

I don't understand why the LE has ruled out the option of Renee's death as being a murder. We have the postcards?, the 2 four wheelers that saw her going up there that supposedly gave her water and the next morning found her wallet with money in it and they supposedly gave the wallet to another person(s) in which they asked them to turn it in to the local police, in which the names were never taken and no one has heard from the first four wheelers who saw her since then, also the water bottles were never found if I remember correctly. I'm not talking about the family that has a cabin up there in Lone Pine, they did everything they could to help Renee. I thought that the LE found an abandoned car near by or one that has gotten stuck in some sort of fashion. So that leaves another suspectible reason for murder. There was no other person found near that vehicle - so that means there is one other somebody wandering out there around the same time. I wish there was something that we the public could do to get the ball rolling here, it's a real disappointment knowing that if she did die due to heat exhaustion, the fault would lay with the INYO COUNTY SHERIFFS department, due to the fact that they were informed of a woman wandering down the road alone. They could have gone to the location she was reported as last seen - could have picked her up and brought her back to safety. (maybe they did do all of the above except for bringing her back to safety, dont know but in my opinion things seem to lay in that type of direction!) Sorry if that means im pointing fingers but in a way I am.

We MISS you Renee:rose: :rose:

[curiousfriend]

Originally posted by RogerV


I think the short answer to your question is that the authorities are proceeding on the assumption that it was an accidental death. I'm not saying I agree or disagree, but that's the most likely reason.

Here in Portland, the companion of a good friend of mine died of a diabetic seizure in his sleep. It took the Medical Examiner (we have ME's in Oregon, rather than coroners) over TWO MONTHS to issue a finding so that a death certificate could be issued, and even then they got it wrong. This case, like Renee's, was pushed to the back burner while murder, or suspected murder cases got priority.

Thank You roger for your input right about now any type of anything right now seems to ease my mind a bit.

[magpie1]

CuriousFriend posted that there were postcards - plural. I was aware that the editor of the Inyo County Register had received a postcard, but I didn't know that Renee's family had also received a postcard. Can someone clarify this?

There are a few details in this case that are suspicious, and make me wonder if there was foul play.

The postcard(s?) is one detail. It's as if the sender of the postcard is trying to tell the media that there is more to this case than has been reported. The postcard depicts a building, bottles, a picture of Renee, what appears to be chips, a police officer's torso with a batboy head, and is signed Elliott Ness, Cloride, AZ.

The other detail that I find suspicious is the location where Renee's body was found. It wasn't in a remote area where people rarely travel. It was, in fact, closer to town than where Renee was last seen. Renee's remains were found not too far off a road that is fairly well travelled.

Forgive me if this in any way offends someone, but GetTheTruth reported that
Renee was found 30-40 ft. from Mazourka Canyon Rd. Many people have been on that road since her disappearance. When we searched a month after she disappeared, there were people, including family, that drove up the road, so yes, you would think there would have been a strong odor. But no one seemed to notice anything. Hopefully the autopsy results will be able to tell how long she was there, that might help in some way to solve this.

GetTheTruth also reported that she was there on October 21st, two and a half months after Renee's body was found, and there's still a lingering odor.

Logically, it would seem that with the various search parties travelling back and forth on Mazourka Canyon Road, someone would have detected a strong odor within a couple of weeks of Renee's disappearance, assuming that Renee died of heat exposure and exhaustion.

It was seven (7) weeks before someone stumbled across Renee's remains, which were within the area searched by various search parties.

If foul play is suspected, it's possible that Renee was picked up by someone the night of June 24-25 and taken somewhere out of the immediate area. At some later time, she was killed and her body placed in that location, 30-40 feet off Mazourka Canyon Road.

This is a possible explanation as to why none of the search parties found Renee's remains earlier, or no odor was detected by the earlier search parties. It would also explain why her clothing was not found with her.

The postcard is eerie as it ties in with the above scenario, suggesting that Renee was taken to a building where her captor(s) partied. The policeman's torso with the batboy head suggests that the police are too dumb to figure it out, hence the signature of a legendary detective, Elliott Ness.

Again, I hope that suggesting a possible murder scenario doesn't offend anyone.

[curiousfriend]

magpie
the building on the postcard is of Laws Depot which is now a museum up there in independence and the sheriff's uniform is from I believe a somewhat close by town in Nevada, I think It was Nei or something like that it was stated in another blog Huff's Crime Blog "A Story to watch" as far as the postcards I'm almost positive that there was a second one but am unsure as to what was entailed with it I believe I was told that it had some sort of number on it - I think that someone in the family called the number and it was disconnected. Not stating positively whether it was a phone number or not - I don't know. I believe that postcard was also sent to an FBI profiler involved in the case. But with what you stated above and the fact of her shirt and shoes still not being found it raises a big question in my head of Renee succombing to the heat.

[magpie1]

CuriousFriend,
Thanks for the clarification regarding the possibility of two postcards. Do you have a link to Huff's Crime Blog?

I'm familiar with Law's Railroad Depot as my husband I visited it some years ago. The only copy I've seen of the postcard was very poor quality and I didn't recognize the building.

Here's the only copy I have of the postcard - front view:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v237/mrspeavey/Postcardpictures.jpg

And the address side:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v237/mrspeavey/Postcardwriting.jpg

[cabojenn]

Was also sent to the Inyo Register. Pretty postcard with a phone number that had been disconnected.

As far as I know, there is no word on the postcards, and no one ever mentions the FBI in the family so...I don't know what to think.

[curiousfriend]

magpie
I have the same copies of the postcards as well I'm not exactly sure of the site address because I had to format my computer and therefore wiped out all of my favorites. But, I will find it and post it on her later today

[magpie1]

CuriousFriend,
Thank you for the link to the blog. I had tried a search for it, and couldn't find anything. Interesting to note that others feel there's a possibility of foul play.

[cabojenn]

I have copied something from a website where a ‘local’ from Bishop posted on the deaths of Renee Fox, Shaleen Duckey, and an unknown third death. I can't find anything on this third 'victim' personally, but apparently, the locals seem to know all about it, though they tend to be 'hush hush'.



http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:mgfPOWbjUywJ:crimeblog.us/%3Fp%3D33+renee+fox+inyo+county&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5




I HAVE BEEN FOLLOWING THIS CASE SINCE THE BEGINNING. I FIRST HEARD ABOUT THE CASE WHILE ON VACATION IN JUNE LAKE WHEN I SAW THE FLYERS POSTED IN REGARDS TO RENEE. I WORK IN BISHOP, CA AND I AM VERY FAMILIAR WITH INYO COUNTY. THIS CASE DOES NOT SIT WELL WITH ME. WE HAVE A YOUNG BEAUTIFUL WOMAN LOST IN THE DESERT, FOR WHOM A SEARCH WAS NOT CONDUCTED UNTIL 24HRS LATER, SICKENS ME. RENEE LEFT BEHIND A YOUNG CHILD, FAMILY, AND NUMEROUS FRIENDS. LET US NOT FORGET ABOUT HER, WE HAVE T0 KEEP PUSHING FOR ANSWERS. I FIRMLY BELIEVE FOUL PLAY WAS INVOLVED, AND I ALSO BELIEVE THE OUTCOME OF THIS TRADEGY WOULD HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT IF THE SHERIFF’S OFFICE HAD RESPONDED QUICKLY! TO RENEE’S FAMILY AND FRIENDS, PLEASE DO NOT TAKE OFFENSE TO THIS, BUT HOW COULD HER BODY NOT HAVE BEEN FOUND FOR 6 WEEKS, WHEN THE AREA IS CRAWLING WITH AN ABUNDANCE OF WILDLIFE SUCH AS BIRDS, RABBITS, AND COYOTES , NOT TO MENTION IN AREA THAT IS HIGHLY TRAVELED WITH TOURISTS EACH WEEK. NOTHING ABOUT THIS CASE MAKES SENSE. WE HAVE HAD THREE SUSPICIOUS DEATHS IN INYO COUNTY OVER THE LAST 6 MONTHES OR SO,RENEE FOX, SHALEEN DUCKEY, AND ANOTHER WOMAN FOUND DEAD IN THE LOCAL HOT SPRINGS, COULD THERE BE A CONNECTION? I DO HOPE WE DON’T HAVE A SERIAL MURDERER ON OUR HANDS. MAYBE THIS CASE IS NOT RECEIVING AS MUCH ATTENTION AS IT DESERVES DUE TO THE FACT THAT THE AREA IS A HOT SPOT FOR TOURISM, AND GOD FORBID, WE INFRINGE ON TOURISM! ANYWAY, MY PRAYERS GO OUT TO THE VICTIMS FAMILIES. PLEASE DONT’ FORGET ABOUT THE LIVES THAT HAVE BEEN LOST. MAYBE IF WE MAKE ENOUGH NOISE ABOUT THESE CASES, ANSWERS WILL BE PROVIDED. IT HAS TO BE DIFFICULT FOR THE FAMILY MEMBERS TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE GRIEVING PROCESS, WHEN QUESTIONS ARE LEFT UNANSWERED. MY PRAYERS GO OUT TO ALL OF YOU. GOD BLESS

sorry abouot the CAPS. they aren't mine, that is how she typed it.

[magpie1]

Cabojean,
I read that comment from the local Bishop person about the third death - a woman who was found at the local hot springs. I wish we could find more information on that death.

I do know that there are hot springs along the Owens River from Bishop to Mammoth. Just outside Mammoth is an area called Hot Creek, and it's been a popular swimming area. There's been deaths at the hot springs due to some areas that are dangerous, and signs are posted in the areas where the water is too hot. But the person who commented in that blog about the woman found dead at the hot springs wouldn't have mentioned that death unless it was unusual.......not one of the accidental deaths associated with the hot water.

[sanderella]

I was up in the Lone Pine area on October 13th. I spoke with a "local" and I brought up the "murders" in Inyo County. I was trying to do a little of my own private investigating. This person who works for the City of Lone Pine told me that there had been three murders, Renee, Shaleen and the third female who she said was "murdered at Keough Hot Springs". No one can seem to find any information on this third woman with the exception of what is written on this forum and the link provided.

She also told me some other things that I don't feel I should publicly write about on this forum. As she said, everyone up there is keeping real quiet about this and the FBI is involved.

To me, it would be logical to warn the public that there is a possible perpetrator preying on women instead of burying their heads in the sand waiting for a possible next victim, ( IMO).

There is no doubt the Sheriff and his Posse did not do their job and I for one, hold them in part, accountable in Renee's death.

I hope that the autopsy is conclusive enough to get those answers. I don't like it one bit that the release comes from Inyo Sheriff's Office. Are they going to twist the truth AGAIN? I am aggravated with them, I am hurt for Renee and her family and what they have put them through.

God Bless Renee & her brother, Eric Somes.

(Excuse me if this is redundant, as I posted it on another thread as well).

[magpie1]

Sanderella,
Thanks for the additional information. After I had written the above, I read on another forum that it was stated that the woman found dead at Keough Hot Springs was murdered.

I'm glad to hear that the FBI is involved as the investigation will be much more thorough..

I too wish that it wasn't the local Inyo County Sheriffs Dept. who will release the findings. Orange County is much better equipped to deal with this.

I have a suggestion for the family if there's any lingering doubts once the autopsy findings are released. Autopsy/Coronor's reports are public records. When the report is released, I would request a copy and have someone with expertise in foresnic science evaluate the report. I would be inclined to go through the Ventura County District Attorney's office for a recommendation. They have a good reputation, and have foresnic experts that they rely on.

[sanderella]

You are very welcome, Magpie. I am in total agreement with you regarding the autopsy report. And yes, Ventura County does have a good reputation for forensics.

I am just so perplexed as to why all the secrets up there in Inyo. Aren't the law enforcement agencies there to protect? It is absolutely shameful... It's unconscionable.

I guess we all will be talking this in circles until the day we die. I know I do it daily because I know Renee's death WOULD HAVE been avoided HAD the Sheriff gone out when she was reported as wandering up Masourka Canyon. :mad:

[magpie1]

Sanderella,
I agree that it likely that if the Inyo Sheriffs Dept had responded immediately, Renee would have survived.

I believe the Inyo Sheriffs Dept. made a mistake that proved to be fatal. Now politics are coming into play.

Our family is dealing with a murder. But we're dealing with the state of Texas, not California. The suspect was arrested immediately, and has been indicted by the county grand jury. But, right after the grand jury proceedings in February, the district attorney in that Texas county lost in the March primary election. Since then, we're dealing with a lamb duck district attorney who has spent the last 8 months doing nothing but serving out his remaining months in office. Also since the March primary election, the suspect was released on bail. We're waiting for the case to go to trial.

[cabojenn]

Originally posted by magpie1

Our family is dealing with a murder. But we're dealing with the state of Texas, not California. The suspect was arrested immediately, and has been indicted by the county grand jury. But, right after the grand jury proceedings in February, the district attorney in that Texas county lost in the March primary election. Since then, we're dealing with a lamb duck district attorney who has spent the last 8 months doing nothing but serving out his remaining months in office. Also since the March primary election, the suspect was released on bail. We're waiting for the case to go to trial.

I am SO SO SO sorry for what you have been going thru, and for your loss. We both know there is nothing that I can say to ease the pain, and I can do little more than offer prayers, and hope you know you are in my thoughts.

[magpie1]

Cabojenn,
Thank-you for your kind words and sympathy. Yes, it's difficult, and more so when authorities don't do their job.

My sister's oldest son - my nephew - was murdered on Dec. 29, 2005 by his 19-year-old stepson in a small, rural county in Texas. The stepson beat my nephew to death with a baseball bat. The stepson was arrested at the scene and was in jail for about a month before someone bailed him out. The detectives in the case have stated that there's overwhelming evidence for a conviction.

In the aftermath, detectives were in contact with my sister, who lives in upstate New York, on a regular basis and after the stepson was indicted by the grand jury for murder, the district attorney was in regular contact. He told my sister and her two remaining children, my niece and youngest nephew, to prepare victim's impact statements as the case would go to trial soon........in a matter of months.

The district attorney lost in the March primary election. Since then, he hasn't called with any updates, and nothing has happened in the case. The case hasn't moved forward to trial. The newly elected district attorney will be sworn in sometime in January, and we're hopeful that the case will then move forward.

The reason why I mentioned our situation is to illustrate that local politics sometimes play a role in criminal cases. In our case, the local district attorney was voted out of office, but still had a remaining 10 months to his term, and opted to not prosecute cases.

In Renee's case, I feel that the local Inyo County Sheriff Dept. made a huge error in not responding immediately to the report of a young woman in trouble. I'm sure they know they made a mistake, but egos are involved, and they won't admit it. They know too that their failure could result in a wrongful death lawsuit against their agency and the county, so they're going to try to side-step the issue.

I strongly urge the family to request a copy of the autopsy report (public record) when it becomes available and have an independent foresnic expert give their opinion. The Ventura County District Attorney's office would be my choice as a place to start. They have a lot of resources at their fingertips and could make a recommendation.

[cabojenn]

since Renee's body was found completely nude, most of her clothing such as her shirt and shoes her still missing, and we still await an autopsy report!!!

[magpie1]

Cabojenn,

I can't understand why it's taking so long for the autopsy report. Hopefully, they're being thorough, and that's what's causing the delay.

The fact that Renee was found without clothing and shoes is very puzzling. Even if someone was confused due to heat exhaustion, I can't see them removing their shoes and being able to walk any distance without them in the desert terrain.

Prayers for you and the family having to endure this wait for answers. :rose:

[sanderella]

http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_302.shtml

I just saw this report on Sierra Wave, "Summer Deaths
Still Unresolved" dated 11/15/06, link above FYI.

I went back to read the article that had some statements from Molweiler regarding Shaleen… Hmmm, he's burying his head in the sand with her too.

I wished I had the solution as to what can be done to light a fire under their butts up in Inyo to investigate THOROUGHLY and resolve these MURDERS; to release the TRUTHFUL INFORMATION. They can say all they want that they feel Renee died of exposure. But again, why was she found nude and her clothes not found? Why was her body not found prior to the time it was found although much of the area searched? Because it WAS NOT THERE until much later. And what does anyone know about the person from Ridgecrest that just arbitrarily called the LE and asked it he could search for her? BAM! He finds her right away. And we can go on and on and on. NOTHING ADDS UP. PERIOD. Well, the only thing that adds up is the incompetence of the LE in Inyo....

It saddens me to say that I have lost a lot of respect for the authorities up there after they have absolved themselves of any moral or professional responsibility to the victims, their families and the citizens of their jurisdiction.

I feel angry today about the inadequacies and the fact that there is a good possibility that Renee would be alive today if they did their job when they were first called out about her wandering alone in the desert.

I still cry for her and all the family members and friends that loved her so much, her son, her mom, her brothers.......

So many mixed emotions today....

[cabojenn]

Has been updated a bit thanks to our cousins.

http://www.myspace.com/memoriesofreneefox

[cabojenn]

I was not going to publish this today, but so many people have been waiting.


http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_328.shtml

http://extra.sierrawave.net/news.mov

I guess she died within the hour...whatever that means. I am not convinced she did this to herself. Too many questions about the investigation, and the condition of her remains for me. Could Inyo have prevented this tragedy by looking for her when the family that saw her, reported her 30 minutes later to the rangers? Yes. They would have found her and she would still be alive. I feel that with every cell in my body. Should they answer to this and change their policies in answering distress calls/reports? Yes. In LA, they always prefer a false call than a real one.

Could there be a lot more to this? It is very possible.

Regardless of the results, there is a very special little boy that will have to grow up not knowing and one day possibly forgetting what a wonderful mommy he had. She really was a great mom. Here I am the older cousin, with children older than hers, and SHE taught ME a lot.

The last few months of her life may have been in turmoil, but Renee truly was a strong and determined woman. Yes, we all know she could have and should have had many more years to make a few more mistakes and come out on top.

Very few people know why she packed up her car and started driving to an area unknown to her. She was emotionally kicked while she was down. But to family reading this, we CANNOT point fingers. It will not change this past summers' loss.

Regardless of our current lifestyles, we have all been taught about the resurrection. Let us all work on being able to see her again in paradise.

Thank you to everyone that has cared enough about our families grief so be so supportive.

[cabojenn]

Renee was not found in July. It was August 10th. I know it doesn't change anything, I just hate how they can't get anything right at that paper.

And thank you Merrick.

[sanderella]

I am so sorry for the tragic loss of Renee. My heart goes out to all of you and I hope that family and friends find peace and resolution someday.

The memories that I have of her, her beautiful smile, her friendliness, her kindness, her love of her son, family and friends will forever be embedded in my mind.

I, too, feel there is much more to this. But, that isn't why I am writing today.

My prayers go out to all of you that loved her so much.

Sandy:rose:

[tandarat]

Well, at least there is an answer...sort of.

I have a few questions, though. I'm by no means an expert in illegal drugs, but I have some understanding about how they work. If I am wrong in any of my assumptions, PLEASE tell me...it would clear up some of the things that are just irking me about all this.

First, I know that meth can be a very dangerous drug...small amounts can kill, even someone who has been taking the drug for a long time. If your metabolism is out of whack, if you have developed a medical condition that can be affected, or have a pre-existing condition...any of these things can cause a fatal reaction. However, the report says "extremely lethal" amounts were found in her system. My immediate reaction was to assume that this meant the amount would be lethal to ANYONE, including someone who had build up a tolerance to the drug through continued use. I would love to know the exact concentrations, and compare that to what is considered lethal to someone who has never taken the drug, someone who was currently a regular user, and someone who had previously abused the drug but had stopped using it for a period of time. This could say a lot. Could she have accidentally overdosed by taking what used to be a "normal" dose for her, but because she had not taken the drug for some time and/or was dehydrated/overheated from her environment that amount proved deadly?

These are the only two reasons I could see her accidentally overdosing, if she was, in fact, an "experienced" user of meth. The other possibilities I see would be that she got a "bad" batch of meth that was too strong or somehow adulterated (were there other overdoses or near overdoses where she may have purchased the drug?) or the overdose was intentional...either by her hand (doesn't seem likely) or another. The only other thing I can come up with is that because of where she had died, the body dehydrated as it decomposed, leaving an extremely concentrated amount of the drug in her system, and so gave a false reading. Is this possible, and if so, did they take this into account?

Do these concerns make sense to anyone else? Everything about this case is just so out of whack, I'm suspect of EVERYTHING, including the autopsy report. I hope the coroner, or at least the forensic group that helped with the testing, will be a little more forthcoming and compassionate to Renee's family, and help them make sense of all the results, including answering any questions about how this could have happened.

Michelle

[cabojenn]

Well, at least there is an answer...sort of.


Michelle

snipped for length only, as you have some very valid points and questions. I am running late to pick up my son from school, but will post again in the morning.

Food for thought...adding to yours:

Renee was seen on hwy 395 AND buying or obtaining water at a store in town as late as 9:30 that same night she supposedly died.

How did she get back there, and her purse several miles in FRONT of her body. Maybe she dropped it along the way before reaching town. But how DID she get back there?

I was prepared to except whatever the autopsy said. But something does not sit right with me.

More in the am.

jenn

[cabojenn]

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:7GZCc3BOWVYJ:www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_63.shtml+renee+fox+simi+valley&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=4

The link above, is where I found this...

"She was last seen wearing a black spaghetti strap top and may have been seen on 395 near the courthouse in Independence on Saturday June twenty fifth between 5 and 7 in the Evening."

I know somewhere there is an article with a witness account later in the evening, I just haven't found it yet, as there are so many to go thru.

But again, how and why did she go back to the canyon?

[RogerV]

[url]http://66.102.7.104/search?

"She was last seen wearing a black spaghetti strap top and may have been seen on 395 near the courthouse in Independence on Saturday June twenty fifth between 5 and 7 in the Evening."



If I recall correctly, this "sighting" was later determined to be a mistake. However, it provided one more reason for local authorities to not pursue the search.

[cabojenn]

If I recall correctly, this "sighting" was later determined to be a mistake. However, it provided one more reason for local authorities to not pursue the search.

The local LE has also RECENTLY claimed that they did not know someone had encountered her and gave her water around 4:30 that day, which is interesting , because they had interviewed this family, and my entire family has met them, including me.

It was my family that thought the sighting was a mistake, Renee would not have made it to the hwy just to start a new life; she would have contacted us, maybe not that same day, but she would have.

So imo, anything they say (LE) is horse 'you know what'.

[cabojenn]

T because they had interviewed this family,


They interviewed this family with-in the 1st week of Renee vanishing. And then they "forgot"?

[cabojenn]

a quote from someone that lived up there....

"I agree, it's pretty apparent to all who have been following the case that the police are covering something up. They seem to have a history of doing so. They rarely admit they are wrong, to the point of covering things up or distorting the facts to make it appear they are doing a good job. I’m pretty surprised they admitted they made a mistake, although I suppose it was pretty hard to cover it up with the multiple independent witnesses.

Growing up, I always heard stories of how inept or corrupt the police in Inyo County are, but didn't believe any of it until the events of the past year. I hope that the cases of Renee Fox and Shaleen Duckey (who they seem to believe is a suicide despite the knife wounds and fact she bled to death, among other suspicious circumstances) will bring the problems in Inyo County to the attention of the Justice Department."

and the link:

http://www.topix.net/forum/county/inyo-ca/TG5D9BLIF9IGRB1I1/p2#lastPost


Does anyone know what she's talking about? I hadn't heard LE admitted to a mistake. But then I haven't talked to anyone in days.

[cabojenn]

couldn't edit today and I had forgot to add the "quote" things etc, I also wanted to delete where this person was from because he/she did not give a name.

[LetsBeConcerned]

Does anyone know what she's talking about? I hadn't heard LE admitted to a mistake. But then I haven't talked to anyone in days.

Here's the link...
http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_329.shtml

While they admit that Renee was not dressed or prepared for the elements, AND a Heat Advisory was Released AND the CDF Battalion Chief did call…. “The call did not come across as an emergency.”

What~!!! Are they trying to say~?... A Battalion Chief is NOT to be taken seriously~??? OR... The California Department of Forestry Doesn’t know the effects of the outdoor elements on a human being~???? Pleeeeeeeeease~!!

Yet they want to say that they are NOT making EXCUSES~!!!

[cabojenn]

Thanks for the link, as I was unable to find it. How odd that she had her arms crossed on her chest, I have NEVER heard of someone dying of any drug to be found like that, not even a pill overdose. The only time I have ever heard of dead bodies discovered with their arms crossed is when someone else crosses them.

On a private note, I hope you are doing well. Yesterday was especially hard for me...I kept hearing her voice over and over again, remember past conversations.

Hello to the family.

[LostPaws]

My thoughts, prayers, & condolences to all those "touched" by the tradegy of Renees' death & the terrible circumstances surrounding this situation. While many answers may never be known in this life, may what we have learned be "enough" to give us peace for yesterday, renewed strength for today, & limitless hope for tomorrow.

[cabojenn]

The caps are not mine....

http://crimeblog.us/?p=33

"AS A NURSE, STILL HAVE MY SUSPICIONS REGARDING THIS CASE. LOTS OF THINGS DO NOT ADD UP. ...WITH HER ARMS FOLDED ACROSS HER BODY, MAKES NO SENSE TO ME. AS SOMEONE WHO DEALS WITH DEATH AND DYING, I HAVE TO SAY, I HAVE NOT SEEN ANYONE PASS AWAY IN THAT POSITION BEFORE! TO THE FAMILY OF RENEE FOX, KEEP PUSHING FOR ANSWERS. DON’T GIVE UP YOUR FIGHT, UNTIL THE WHOLE TRUTH IS TOLD.".... HAD SHE BEEN FOUND PROMPTLY AND TREATED IN THE ER, SHE WOULD LIKELY BE HERE TODAY... "MAY RENEE REST IN PEACE, AND A SPECIAL PRAYER FOR HER YOUNG SON WHO WILL GROW UP WITHOUT HIS “MOMMY”, MY THOUGHTS AND PRAYERS GO OUT TO HIM"

I did not post the whole paragraph (site copyright rules says I can), but the link will provide you with the rest of her comment.

[Inyo Native]

Here is an article that was posted in the Inyo Register, the weekend edition December 2-3, with a few of my comments as well. Isn't it interesting how they downplay the dispatchers mistake? I mean, check out the headlines.


Cause of Death found for Renee Fox
Investigation determines it was drugs, not exposure, that killed missing Simi Valley woman this past summer.
By Mike Gervais

The case of Renee Fox, who was found dead this past summer outside of Independence, has finally been closed, but not without an internal investigation in the Sheriff’s Department and a number of twists and turns that made the case exceptionally difficult to solve.

The Inyo County Coroner’s Office announced this week that Fox died of a massive drug overdose after her car broke down on Mazourka Canyon Road outside of Independence on Saturday, June 24.

The Inyo County Sheriff’s Department, in a press conference on Friday, disclosed the details of the investigation into Fox’s disappearance, and the internal investigation involving a sheriff’s dispatcher who failed to notify deputies of more than 20 hours of a report of a woman seen in the Mazourka Canyon area, in “inappropriate attire.” It has been confirmed that the woman was Fox.

According to local officials, the 25-year-old mother from Simi Valley overdosed on methamphetamine and amphetamine, a byproduct of methamphetamine.

“The mystery of the Mazourka Canyon death has been resolved,” a press release from the Inyo County Coroner’s Office states. “After an extensive criminal investigation by the Inyo County Sheriff’s Department, Inyo County Coroner’s Office and with the assistance of our contracted forensic autopsy service in Southern California, we have determined the cause of death for Renee Michelle Fox as acute methamphetamine/amphetamine intoxication,” the press release sates.

Inyo County Coroner Leon Brune said the toxicology tests concluded on Fox’s remains “confirmed an extremely lethal amount of the drugs were in her system”

“We kind of expected that” a drug overdose could have been the cause of death “from the get-go” Brune said, noting that the other likely possible cause of death would have been “hyperthermia and exposure.” But, Brune said, with the toxicology report in hand, it is a “proven fact” that Fox died of a drug overdose.

“There were no signs of trauma “Sheriff’s Investigator Paul Bedell said at Friday’s press conference, “no evidence of foul play, no wounds, no defensive wounds and no bruising”

(Would it really be possible to find bruising and defensive wounds, given the passage of time?)

The toxicology report conducted on Fox’s remains found that she had 4.2 milligrams per kilogram of methamphetamine in her system and 1.8 mg/kg of amphetamine in her system. Fox weighed roughly 50 kilograms.

For someone who has not used methamphetamine, “.09 (mg/kg) could be fatal,” Brune said, noting that it appears that Fox had built a tolerance to the drug.

“She died within minutes of taking the drugs, not hours,” Brune said, adding that the drugs appeared to have been ingested orally, one of the most potent ways of introducing the drug into the body, thought there were glass pipes found in Fox’s abandoned vehicle.

There were also traces of marijuana found in Fox’s system, though it was “not quantitative,” Brune said.

(Love how they have to throw that in there even though it’s irrelevant)

Fox was found to have several empty “satchels” that are believed to have contained methamphetamine, as well as one satchel still containing drugs, Inyo County Undersheriff John Eropkin said at Friday’s press conference.

Eropkin said that Fox died on Saturday, June 24 at an unknown time, but probably “some time that evening.”

(Is it really possible to pinpoint the date?)

Investigators found some of the missing woman’s property- a purse containing $900 cash, blanket, and some clothes- while looking for Fox on Sunday, June 25, shortly after she was reported seen, though not missing. Those clues, however, did not lead investigators towards any conclusions regarding her whereabouts.

Sheriff’s investigators and Inyo County Search and Rescue searched the area for four days by land, air, and with K-9 units, but were unable to locate Fox. Also, many volunteers from in and near Inyo County, friends and family of Fox and the non-profit volunteer search group Equusearch scoured the area for days. Equusearch even utilized aerial drones in search for Fox or her remains.

All those efforts, however, came up with negative results, and it wasn’t until nearly two months after her disappearance that Fox’s body was located. Fox’s body was discovered in mid August by a Ridgecrest resident who had “made it his mission” to look for Fox in his spare time, utilizing a quad, said Inyo County Sheriff’s Lieutenant Bill Lutze in a previous interview with The Inyo Register.

The man located the body in a drainage ditch about 40 feet north of Mazourka Canyon road after 5 p.m. Aug. 10. “I think he was just getting ready to call it a day” before he saw the body, Lutze said.

[cabojenn]

"Investigators found some of the missing woman’s property- a purse containing $900 cash, blanket, and some clothes- while looking for Fox on Sunday, June 25, shortly after she was reported seen, though not missing. Those clues, however, did not lead investigators towards any conclusions regarding her whereabouts."

It said that she was reported seen, but not missing. Right? Those people did not tell the rangers "Hey, we just SEEN a girl". (I wrote it wrong on purpose). They expressed serious concern. I'm sorry (not really), but everywhere else in the country, when "Rangers" are told there is a person that is in need of help, they go look, darn it!!!!! The rangers informed the sherriff, and the sheriff's dept freaking FORGOT!!!!

Explain that to her son. I'M SORRY LITTLE BOY, YOU MOMMY ISN'T COMING HOME BECAUSE I FORGOT.

Renee was ALONE in an area unknown to her. I don't care if the autopsy is right. LE is here to serve and protect. Period. And part of their job is to protect us from ourselves.

Please, do not let Inyo get away with this. What if this was you? Or someone YOU love????

Anyone remember the story of Hellbound? (in case the site thinks I wrote a bad word, it's not meant that way. H--E--l--l--b--o--u--n--d, in case it gets **'d out)

[cabojenn]

see how mad I am???

It isn't bound, it's bend. ****bend.

[tandarat]

Has the family obtained an attorney? Do they have access to a private investigator?

Because of the nature of everything that has happened, I'm guessing that even if the family can't afford an attorney, there's got to be at least ONE out there that would be willing to help pro bono. This entire situation just STINKS.

If not, maybe there could be some kind of fund raiser so the family CAN get an attorney? If I were them, the first thing I'd do is fight for her mother or other BLOOD RELATIVE to be designated "next of kin". I'd then fight to get the entire law enforcement file, including autopsy report/findings, any correspondence they had within the department, as well as outside it, etc. etc. etc. I'd also attempt to find another, uninterested and objective forensics expert to review the case. A private investigator would be nice to look into all the other stuff that's going on out that way. I can't afford to give any money (my medical bills, a 3-year-old daughter and a dying car have strapped us to our limit right now), but I'm an artist, and I'd be more than willing to donate some items to sell to help raise funds (I do animal portraits, and right now I'm really getting into dollhouses and miniatures in general). I'd also be willing to donate some time - I just can't be out in bright sun or heat due to a medical condition, but I'd be more than happy to help in other ways. I'm just sick and tired of going to various websites, reading about all this, and feeling so helpless. I don't know why this particular case has hit me so hard....I guess because it could have been any one of us, and this just didn't have to happen. I can only imagine the pain and frustration the immediate family is going through right now. Hopefully her son will be able to come out of this a stronger person as he grows up, and it doesn't cause lasting damage.

Michelle

PS...I thought the blanket was never found????

[Inyo Native]

Investigators found some of the missing woman’s property- a purse containing $900 cash, blanket, and some clothes- while looking for Fox on Sunday, June 25, shortly after she was reported seen, though not missing. Those clues, however, did not lead investigators towards any conclusions regarding her whereabouts.

Really, Inyo Register? "Shortly" after being reported "seen"? Ugh. (I just noticed that).

I spoke to my family about the article today. They said it struck them as "too much information" and an obvious attempt to clear the name of the local investigators. They wondered what her family thought about it, as it was so demeaning toward Renee. I informed them that her family didn't know because they're not in the valley and don't receive the local paper.

While the opinion of my family doesn't represent the whole population in Inyo, I'm sure many others in the valley feel the same way about the article- that they gave way too much information about Renee's alleged drug use and downplayed the mistakes that were made.

One good thing about the Inyo Register is that they will often print letters to the editor, so long as it has the person's contact information. I have found that this is a good way to give information the paper won't report or investigate themselves. If anyone is interested in writing them, their contact info is:


The Inyo Register
450 E Line Street
Bishop CA, 93514
Attn: Darcy Ellis, Editor

You can also email them at editor@inyoregister.com .

[Inyo Native]

Not that it's relevant, I guess, but I also wonder why they chose to use her drivers license as the photo.

http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p107/InyoNative/InyoREgisterarticleaboutRenee.jpg

[cabojenn]

Not that it's relevant, I guess, but I also wonder why they chose to use her drivers license as the photo.

http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p107/InyoNative/InyoREgisterarticleaboutRenee.jpg

Maybe because it's not as pretty a picture? She looks a little 'hard' in that picture, but whose ID photo ever turns out? Maybe if they used the prettier pictures, the public would FEEL more towards her family?

[Inyo Native]

Maybe because it's not as pretty a picture? She looks a little 'hard' in that picture, but whose ID photo ever turns out? Maybe if they used the prettier pictures, the public would FEEL more towards her family?

That's probably true. I mean, there were other pictures widely available, why use that one? There's no good reason, and it's pretty callous and impersonal.

I'm not sure if anybody has mentioned this before, but temperatures in Inyo County can fluctuate widely during the night. I remember trying to have sleepovers outside as a child and each time, I would wake up freezing even though it had been warm - almost hot- when I went to sleep. I always ended up going back inside my house to sleep, because no amount of blankets could warm me up. There are always at least a couple hours EVERY night in which the temperatures dip below freezing, even in the summer. And of course, all locals know this, including the investigators. There is no good excuse for them to neglect checking on her, and I bet they are thanking their lucky stars that she did not die of exposure. That said, I think there's still a possibility they could be sued for wrongful death because had they checked on her, she probably would have lived. It seems that something was already wrong with her when people saw her, as her actions were somewhat strange. Either she was already under the influence, or she was succumbing to heat exhaustion. If officers had checked on her, she might have been arrested for meth possession but at least she would still be alive!


If the final report on Shaleen Duckey suggests she had a lethal amount of drugs in her system, it might be time to investigate the coroner too.

[tandarat]

There is no good excuse for them to neglect checking on her, and I bet they are thanking their lucky stars that she did not die of exposure. That said, I think there's still a possibility they could be sued for wrongful death because had they checked on her, she probably would have lived.


Actually, I'm not sure exactly how the law is written, but I'm guessing that it doesn't really matter HOW she died. They were informed of her presence in a timely manner, and they failed to investigate. It doesn't even matter that the dispatcher "forgot" to pass on the information. The officer(s) on duty should have been given a heads-up immediately (they have radios, don't they, if not cell phones?), and then a follow-up. The only significance of dispatcher error, really, is that he/she can also be named personally in a lawsuit. When an organization screws up, the entire organization is liable, even if the error is pinpointed to a single individual. The only thing I can see here that *might* help the Sheriff's office is the fact that drugs were found in her system. A good attorney could use that to make Renee look like some kind of crazy drug addict, and turn the jury against her, making them feel like somehow she "deserved it". We all know it is bs, but that is what lawyers are paid to do, and too many people in this world are really gullible.

Does the family have any plans to pursue this further?

I'd be interested in hearing what an outside pathologist/forensic team would say about all the evidence and autopsy findings.

Michelle

[Inyo Native]

This is the follow-up article to the first, published December 5, 2006:


Cops open up abut Fox case

Details released about confounding investigation into missing woman and ultimately her death
By Mike Gervais

With the case of Renee Fox’s disappearance and death finally wrapped up, local law enforcement, in an attempt to answer any nagging questions, essentially opened the file on the case and shared the details of the investigation.

At a press conference last Friday, Inyo County Undersheriff John Eropkin, lead investigator Paul Bedell and Search and Rescue’s assistant coordinator, Sheriff’s Corporal Keith Hardcastle, spoke about how difficult the case was to solve due to a confusing timeline, overlapping cases and an overall lack of information.

Throughout the course of the investigation, one sheriff’s dispatcher was the subject of an internal investigation, investigators came across a stolen car in the search area and eye-witness reports placed the missing woman in several unlikely locations in and around Mazourka Canyon area, either where she was last reported seen, or her car was located, or eventually, where her body was found.

Inyo County Coroner Leon Brune recently announced that autopsy and toxicology reports proved that Fox died of a massive methamphetamine/amphetamine overdose.

Sheriff’s Internal Investigation
Eropkin said Friday that a group of recreators in the Mazourka Canyon area notified a California Department of Forestry employee that they had seen Fox in the Mazourka Canyon area “in inappropriate” attire for the 105 degree weather that day, Saturday, June 24.

The CDF dispatch contacted the Inyo County sheriff’s dispatch, three hours after the encounter with the group of recreators, to notify law enforcement of the report.

The CDF dispatcher related that a woman was seen in the Mazourka Canyon area, and that she was “definitely not prepared for the elements.”

“I don’t know if you want to send a unit up there,” the CDF dispatcher said on a recording of the actual transmission, which was played during the press conference. The sheriff’s dispatcher replied that there were no available units at the time, as the only deputy in the area was booking a prisoner at Inyo County Jail, but said that when a deputy became available, someone would be sent to the area.

“At this time,” Eropkin said Friday, “there was no information” reported about Fox’s disabled vehicle in the Mazourka Canyon area, or any mention that Fox may have been under the influence of a controlled substance. “How uncommon is it in Inyo County to see someone walking around, especially in that area? I’m not making excuses, but it wasn’t an emergency situation at that time, I’ll tell you that,” he added.

From the time that call was made to the sheriff’s dispatch, “there was about a 20-hour delay before an Inyo sheriff got on it,” Eropkin said. “That is not acceptable,” he added, explaining that a deputy was not dispatched to the Mazourka Canyon area until the next day, Sunday, June 25, when a report was made from another party regarding a wallet, purse, and other effects found on Mazourka Canyon Road.

At the time of the second report, on Sunday, another sheriff’s dispatcher realized that no one had responded to the initial report the previous day. A deputy was sent to meet with the “RP,” or reporting party, of the purse and other effects on Sunday.

Eropkin said that an internal investigation was conducted regarding the delay, and the dispatcher who took the initial report from the CDF dispatch was disciplined. Eropkin refused to release the name of the dispatcher of the disciplinary action that ensued, but did mention that this was the first offense on the part of that dispatcher.

[Inyo Native]

(Dec. 5 article contined)


The Investigation
Investigators continued working on the case, by contacting friends and family of Fox, and attempting to establish a connection between her and Inyo County, something that continues to be a missing link in the case.

Fox’s motives for coming to the Owens Valley remain unclear, however it is known that she did have a history of drugs abuse, and was facing felony methamphetamine charges in Ventura County.

“She had absolutely no history with the Owens Valley,” Bedell said, noting that the lack of a motive for Fox being in the area was a major challenge for investigators.

Fox had just graduated college and had a fulltime job working for an insurance company in Simi Valley. During her trip to Inyo County, Fox paid for everything with cash, making it impossible for law enforcement to track her transactions. She did borrow a credit card from her mother, lead Investigator Bedell said, but she never used it.

About a week before she made her trip to Inyo County, Fox had cashed about $13,000 in checks. Investigators recovered a total of $6,400 from Fox’s purse, car and clothes throughout the investigation, leaving $4,500 unaccounted for.

Equusearch and a New Lead
The volunteer search group Equusearch came to Inyo County on Thursday, July 27 and launched their own search of the area, utilizing volunteers on the ground, a fixed-wing plane and aerial drones that took photos of the area.

Equusearch was asked by the Sheriff’s Department not to allow volunteer searchers to canvas the Mazourka Canyon area, because of the hazard of open mines and because it had been searched extensively by local law enforcement. The group’s volunteers were instead advised to search along U.S. 395, where Search and Rescue personnel had not looked, and recent reports suggested Fox had been seen.

“The only restrictions we placed on them were to stay out of the mining area” Bedell said. “I even told them they could fly the plane up there.”

The Equusearch efforts bore negative results, and eventually the volunteer group called off its search. Reports of a strong odor near Manzanar Reward Road were delivered to the Sheriff’s Department on July 29. Investigators, along with Search and Rescue, a K-9 unit and the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power, which lowered water levels in nearby ditches to allow searchers to dredge the water, looked in the area from July 30 through Aug. 2. No traces of Fox were found, and that search was called off on Aug. 2.

Grim Discovery
Fox’s remains were found by a firefighter out of China Lake on Aug. 10. The man had been hearing reports of the missing mother, and chose to look for her while recreating in the Mazourka Canyon area, where he owned property.

The China Lake man “caught an odor and followed it” to Fox’s remains between 3 and 4 p.m. on Aug. 10, Bedell said.

He found Fox dead and naked in bitterbrush bush, lying on her back with her arms folded across her chest.

“There is no proof, no indication” that Fox ingested the methamphetamine in a suicide attempt, Bedell said. The death “is listed as accidental” by the Inyo County Coroner, he added.

Investigators believe Fox died sometime in the evening of Saturday, June 24. If she was still alive on Sunday, we didn’t get any sightings,” Bedell said. It appears that Fox, under the influence of methamphetamine, and possibly suffering heat-related ailments, removed her clothes to cool off. She then walked several yards to a tall bitter brushbush that could have provided some shade. She laid down in the bush and died.

For almost two months there had been speculation, locally and nationwide (thanks to wide-spread television coverage), about foul play, kidnapping, Fox running away, but in the end she sadly fell victim to her own demons, drugs.

[cabojenn]

................
As the Search Director there in Independence for Texas Equusearch I am certain that we could have done more in the search if allowed.
But we are obliged by protocol to respect the authority in place (Inyo Count SO) and we did so.
Their (ICSO) understanding was that we were only going to fly one of my drones around and take pictures, not do a full fledged search - which kind of surprises me given Texas Equusearch's reputation.
That being said I have to believe that an opportunity was squandered to bring Renee home a bit sooner. ................
It's also my opinion that little was done in both cases to resolve the facts.

...................
Thanks

Gene

I snipped a bunch, to point out a few things coming from one of the searchers.

[Inyo Native]

Yes, it's apparent they distorted plenty of facts. They also didn't mention how the police were trying to convince the public that Renee had probably caught a ride out of the valley (and out of their jurisdiction).

I also noticed there were a lot of discrepancies between this article and the first one (in the Inyo Register). For example, the first article said that the investigators had found her purse (the whole sentence is misleading): Investigators found some of the missing woman’s property- a purse containing $900 cash, blanket, and some clothes- while looking for Fox on Sunday, June 25, shortly after she was reported seen, though not missing. The second article told the truth- that other people had found her purse, and it was at that time that they realized a mistake had been made- that nobody has responded the day before. It's all very odd because the same guy wrote both articles.

It seems like the first article was laying the framework to clear the investigators name- by making it sound like they did a better job. The second is more truthful, but also distorts some things to make the officers seem as though they did the best they could, were helpful and nice to the family, and conducted a thorough investigation.

They don't even mention the obvious problem- that the search was ended awfully early (I mean, 4 days? Come on!) and that they did not find Renee's body in the area they "extensively" searched. And then, of course, they wouldn't let anyone else search in that area. It sounds very suspicious to me, and they just kind of gloss over all of that.

[cabojenn]

I can't remember where I read it...here or elsewhere, maybe a PM, but someone from the search told me that they were even limited to WHERE they could fly the plane, and that it was suprising because they have a good reputation...

I am very offended by the insensitive remarks that the sheriff made:
“We kind of expected that” a drug overdose could have been the cause of death “from the get-go” Brune said, noting that the other likely possible cause of death would have been “hyperthermia and exposure.”

What a relief for them it wasn't exposure, huh?

And they make believe they were kind to my family? Telling Renee's brother not to call, is being kind? Refusing to see her mother, is kind? Now I am not being mean spirited towards Renee's husband, who was clearly emotional when speaking at her service, but they were about a day away from the divorce being final, Renee was living with her mother, she talked constantly with two of our Aunts...the people that knew who best before she vanished, and the LE only wanted to talk to the "legal" next of kin?

Could it be that they really stopped searching because a 'little birdie' told the sheriff that Renee was either partying or dead, and this is within DAYS of the search? Could it be THAT is why they gave up? No, I don't think this person had anything to do with anything, just pointing out at some influences that LE may have had.

And what about those darn postcards? Was it REALLY just a prank?

Not too long before Renee vanished, did you know she was clean? She really was making an effort. Even my mom could see it. One day Renee was like, "See Auntie, I'm trying to follow the rules! I'm being good!". Not an actual quote of course, but she was trying.

It is so sad that something pushed her back in the wrong direction, and now she is gone. I truly believe that had Renee made it out of that canyon alive, she would have found that right path again. Now the LE is making her sound like a terrible person. I don't know too many terrible people that have HUNDREDS of people at their funeral, standing room only, with a parking lot full of people hoping to see or hear part of the service.

LE should show some respect for her family.

Renee was a GREAT person having a bad year.

NO ONE, will convince me otherwise.

[Inyo Native]

I think I remember seeing something about the limited search area for the plane too, somewhere...

“At this time,” Eropkin said Friday, “there was no information” reported about Fox’s disabled vehicle in the Mazourka Canyon area, or any mention that Fox may have been under the influence of a controlled substance. “How uncommon is it in Inyo County to see someone walking around, especially in that area? I’m not making excuses, but it wasn’t an emergency situation at that time, I’ll tell you that,” he added.

Well, actually, it's not normal to see somebody walking in that kind of heat in a desert/unpaved area. Maybe riding bikes or driving, but not walking. It's pretty easy to get heat stroke if you're unprepared, even when I was young I suffered a couple of minor heat strokes while I was playing outdoors because I forgot to drink enough water. And it was exactly because it was abnormal that people were concerned.

Another thing that doesn't make sense is their refusal to search at night (flashlights/searchlights, anyone?) and their insistence that it's a dangerous area, yet it wasn't out of the ordinary for Renee to be wandering around in that area.

[cabojenn]

"Oral Methamphetamine Dosages
Threshold 5 mg
Light Stimulation 5-15 mg
Common 10-30 mg
Strong (some rushing) 20-50 mg"

Found that on the web. Not sure I trust the source of the site, or where they get their info from...
http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/meth/meth_dose.shtml

[Inyo Native]

Now, I may be misunderstanding the toxicology report printed in the newspaper, or it may be erroneous... but in my limited research, it appears to take far more than 4.2 mg/kg for a lethal dose. In fact, the numbers are so far off, I'm thinking there's just a mistake on the paper's part, or perhaps I'm misunderstanding the numbers.

I mean, 4.2 mg/kg is barely lethal enough to kill mice.

[tandarat]

I think they were talking about her blood level. Kind of like blood alcohol level. Meth needs to be absorbed into the system, which takes time.

Prescription levels of amphetamine-dextroamphetamine (plain ol' adderall, which is used to treat ADD, narcolepsy, and to fight fatigue caused by chronic fatigue syndrome, lupus, etc.) range from 5mg-30mg. 30mg of this drug could cause a high in someone who is sensitive to the drug.

I found this comparison between Adderall and meth -

http://www.erowid.org/chemicals/amphetamines/amphetamines_info2.shtml

Looking at that comparison, a 30mg Adderall is the equivilent of 25 mg of meth, but not as long lasting (it is essentially metabolized more quickly). Now, I can tell you that I have had to have double that amount just to stay awake on some occasions, due to a chronic health condition. My understanding is that 60 mg of amphetamine a day is the most allowe dy law.

Doing some basic conversion, when I'm taking 60mg of amphetamine at a time, I'm ingesting, essentially, 1.5 mg/kg at a time. Though I will admittedly feel a little "kick" when I first take this amount at once, and often suffer tachycardia (fast heart rate - I also suffer from this when not taking Adderall, but amphetamines are definitely a trigger), I would not consider this even a high, and I doubt sincerely that Renee would get much pleasure from it. (very rarely, mind you - I usually take between 30 and 40 mg, either all at once or split between two doses during the day, but if I am sick or in a flare, I will need 60 to be able to function enough to work, or even get up and speak coherently).

Therefore, I would guess they are speaking about blood levels. I'll see if I can find some information to suppor their claims.

Michelle

[Inyo Native]

Hmm, maybe the numbers weren't that far off, but I don't see how they know for certain that the dose killed her. I think they're a little too confident about that, and it's kind of suspicious. Of course, I don't particularly trust Mottweiler anyway- given his theories about Shaleen Duckey being a suicide/accident. Seems he chooses whatever cause of death makes them look good. Here's something I found online in a science journal. It's kind of hard to wade through it all, it's surprising how hard it is to find estimates of lethal dosages online- in humans, anyway:

To overcome many of these difficulties, various animal models have been proposed using specific drug exposure protocols. In addition to the ability to precisely control dosing regimens, studies in animals allow for a significantly greater range and accuracy in the neurochemical characterization of stimulant effects. Particularly with respect to rodent models of METH abuse, an acute 'binge' regimen has been most frequently used to study the consequences of high-dose METH exposure. The high doses used (most commonly in the range of 4-10 mg/kg) are presumed to be comparable to those achieved by many long-term METH abusers (see, eg, Sonsalla and Heikkila, 1988; Hogan et al, 2000; Davidson et al, 2001). Multiple injections are administered within a day, typically at 2-h intervals, to simulate the prolonged elevation of drug associated with binge-pattern administration in humans.

http://www.nature.com/npp/journal/v28/n10/full/1300247a.html

It seems like the 4 mg/kg range isn't necessarily lethal, especially for those who have developed a tolerance.

[tandarat]

I agree. Also, if her body was in as bad shape as I have read elsewhere, where exactly did they get the tissue/fluid to get an accurate result? I could understand if they were checking tissue for evidence of long term use, but for determining the amount in her system at time of death? I'm assuming they used organ tissue...liver or brain, maybe....but with the amount of decomp they are talking about, plus exposure to high heat, I would like to have someone explain to me how they can get an accurate reading. Logic (common sense?) tells me there would be any number of natural processes that would affect the actual concentration of the drug: dehydration of the body, breakdown of body tissue (and possibly of the drug molecules themselves), chemical reactions after death, etc. Is there anyone out there who could tell us if it is even possible to get an accurate number under these circumstances, and why?

Also, taking into account that she could have died of an overdose, if she had been clean for an extended period of time (no idea how long that would be with meth), her tolerance could have been lowered. Also, dehydration and hyperthermia can affect how the body react/tolerates/metabolizes many drugs. I'm sure this would affect amphetamine-based drugs quite a bit. She may not have been aware that what would be a normal (or even low) dose for her could be lethal. In her defense, I could easily see her taking meth that night to stay awake, especially if she was waiting for help, or hoping someone would come by the next morning if she did suddenly realize she was in trouble, and had no way to get out of the desert safely. It still doesn't explain the crossed arms, the location of her personal items, the missing items, or the possible sightings of her close to the highway, but it seems to be a reasonable explanation of why she took the drug if she was trying very hard to be clean and change her life.

[Inyo Native]

I've been skimming some articles and noticed some mention that heat can play a big factor in meth toxicity. I also saw an article which mentioned that methamphetamine can distort the estimated time of death, which it seems the coroner should know. I question his confidence in the time of death as well. I mean, it's pretty specific and that is odd.

This is the best article I've found (most comprehensive and readable): http://www.inchem.org/documents/pims/pharm/pim334.htm
7.2 Toxicity

7.2.1 Human data

7.2.1.1 Adults

1 to 4 grams of street
methamphetamine was ingested by a 27 years
old man; blood pressure was 180/100 mmHg,
pulse rate 146/min, respirations 26/min and
oral temperature 37°C, pupils widely dilated
and reactive to light. (Gary & Saidi, 1978)
After intravenous injection of an unknown
amount of methamphetamine by an adult
patient, he was lethargic with restless
movements of extremities and hyperresponsive
to stimuli. The blood pressure was 120/80
mm/Hg and the pulse rate was 150 beats/min.
with loud heart sounds. Deep-tendon-reflexes
were hyperactive (Kane et al., 1969).

The toxic dose varies considerably due to
individual variations and the development of
tolerance. Fatalities have been reported
following ingestion of doses as low as 1.3
mg/kg, while tolerance has been developed to
1000 mg at a time and up to 5 g in a day.






For someone who has not used methamphetamine, “.09 (mg/kg) could be fatal,” Brune said, noting that it appears that Fox had built a tolerance to the drug.

“She died within minutes of taking the drugs, not hours,” Brune said, adding that the drugs appeared to have been ingested orally, one of the most potent ways of introducing the drug into the body, thought there were glass pipes found in Fox’s abandoned vehicle.

This is all speculation, of course, but I assume that the toxicity was probably enhanced by Renee's prolonged exposure to extreme heat, which is why she succumbed to such a low level. Considering that the dosage was on the lower threshold of fatal dosage, she probably could have been saved had they reached her in time, as they could have treated the symptoms which were probably exacerbated by the heat- fever, dehydration, etc. I have yet to find anything about how quickly death would occur, but most cases I have read about so far indicate it would take at least an hour (often several), not minutes as the coroner said. I think he just said that so they won't be found liable for her death, because they could claim they wouldn’t have been able to help her anyway.


Also, from what I've seen, oral ingestion is not necessarily the most potent ways to introduce the drug. My understanding, considering the other alternatives, is that it's among the least potent. Intravenous, smoking & inhaling are all methods that appear to be much more potent.


This link too has some good information, although it seems to lump cocaine, amphetamines and methamphetamines together at times.
http://www.acnp.org/g4/GN401000166/Default.htm

[RogerV]

There is one thing that I have never been able to get clear about this tragic case, and that is the actual condition of Renee's car. A lot of news media don't seem to understand the difference between "stuck" and "broken down," or perhaps never bother to ask.

1) "Broken down" means that something is mechanically wrong with the car that prevents it from running or being driven. It can be caused by something as minor as a dead battery, or as serious as a total engine failure.

2) "Stuck" usually means that the car is running, but conditions around it prevent it from being driven or moved. The most usual causes are snow and mud (neither applicable in this case). However, a car can also get stuck in deep sand or in ruts that are so deep it can't drive over or out of them.

The reason that I'd like to know the answer to this question is that it might give some insight into Renee's condition. You usually don't have a lot of control over when or where a car breaks down, but you sometimes have a bit more control over getting stuck.

I don't know if there are signs warning motorists that the pavement is about to end, but if there are and Renee missed them, and/or if she continued to drive on the unimproved road until she got stuck, I think one could make an argument that she was "impaired" at the time. It's also possible she caused damage to her car herself by driving too fast off the end of the paved road and hitting ruts, ridges, or rocks which might have damaged the car's undercarriage. Again, not really the actions of someone truly aware of her surroundings.

And of course there is the final frustrating question: Regardless as to what the trouble was, breakdown or stuck, WHY didn't she just walk back down the nearly-straight road to town? Something or someone prevented her from doing so... her judgement was impaired, or could someone possibly have stopped her from doing so?

I doubt we will ever know, especially in view of the fact that Inyou LE now considers the case closed.

[cabojenn]

Roger,

I do not know exactly what was wrong with her car, other than her brothers considered it a total loss. When they went up there to collect Renee's personal effects, they left the car behind and because of the amount of damage, it was not financially worth trying to save. (I think that's what they told me).

So to answer your question, she was broken down.

Renee's car was several miles into the canyon. She was positively seen closer to town, which show she was trying to make it to town. She was reportedly seen (meaning I personally never spoke with this witness, but did with the first) on the highway. She also may or may not have been seen that same NIGHT in a little store. We can conclude then, that she was trying to get some help, or at least to safety.

It is what happened next that is the puzzle. I mean, her freaking arms were crossed over her chest. Google it. How often are people found that way? Actually, if you google it it'll lead you back to this site about Renee. After that, 99.99% it's something that someone does TO the deceased. Either ancient buriel ritual, or out of guilt, etc....

[Inyo Native]

Yes, that is one of the strangest things about it. I mean, if she was so overheated she cast off her clothing and crawled under a bush, why would she just lie there with her arms over herself? That would serve to warm her up, not cool her down (from body heat). Also, from what I've read regarding methamphetamine overdoses, the victim's hearts beat rapidly... they tend to shake, etc. It makes no sense for her to just lie down and die like that.

[cabojenn]

WHen I made the comment about Renee being clean not that long before this all happened...it was to emphasize that she was truly a good person.

She had dreams, just like the rest of us. Her last years choices on dealing with her whole world falling apart may have set those dreams back a bit...but in the end, you would have prayed for a teacher like her. She would have changed lives for the better. She loved kids. If you knew her son, you would see that he had a good - no, GREAT mommy.

I just hate how the LE wants to paint her as someone not worth looking for, not worth grieving over, and not worth ... their precious time. :cuss:

[Inyo Native]

Oh, I definitely agree that they wanted the public to perceive her that way. When I first saw a picture of her I was somewhat surprised, as she did not appear to be as bad as they led people to believe. While outside press mentioned her as a "missing mother" the local press and officials rarely mentioned she was a mother or well educated. Most of the information they released mentioned her alleged drug use, and they obviously didn't put much effort into finding her. As I've said- 4 days??? And the majority of it a helicopter search? Not that it's bad, but it obviously wasn't as effective as a foot search would have been (considering how close to the road she was). It's like they decided she was probably dead, so they didn't bother to continue looking. Even though (technically) she could have been alive at 4 days. And to make themselves look good, they told the public that she had been sighted on the highway and probably hitched a ride out of the county.

And honestly, as somebody who lived there most of her life and has family there, the whole case scares me. I mean, what if something like that were to happen to somebody I love? Considering the way they handled this case and Shaleen's, it's apparent they would probably bungle the whole thing, cover up their mistakes, and release all the "dirt" they could find on the person to the media.

They were so callous about it that even the locals (well, those I and my family know) who didn't know Renee noticed how heartless they were acting. I truly do hope the officers involved pay for their insensitive and sloppy investigation.

Is anybody going to try to do something about it? Of course, it's probably not good to discuss legal action publicly, but I would encourage the family to look into it. The Inyo County officials do consider the case closed I'm sure, but will have to reopen it to defend themselves. Even letters to the media can help, as it puts pressure on them. Also, perhaps the new sheriff would be inclined to help, since he's not the one who messed up the initial investigation. He seems to be a man of action (although he has just started): http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_360.shtml

I am out of the area right now, but I will be visiting for the holidays. If anybody wants me to look into anything, take pictures, etc. just let me know.

[cabojenn]

http://www.myspace.com/memoriesofreneefox

If you scroll down to the very slow to loading myspace for Renee, one of her friends uses a photo of Renee instead of her own, and the photo is actually from a memorial that was put up in Inyo County. I believe it was put there by the family that gave her the water and tried to assist her. (We've adopted them).

Not sure where this memorial is, maybe in or near the canyon, or possibly on their property.

Don't know why I am telling you this....

[Inyo Native]

Aww, that's a sweet memorial. I'll keep my eyes out for it. I'll be in the Indendence area a few times and will probably check out the Mazourka Canyon road... Just to see for myself how plausible it would be for somebody to walk on that road. I do plan to write the paper about it soon and want to make sure I know what I'm talking about.

[LetsBeConcerned]

Also, perhaps the new sheriff would be inclined to help, since he's not the one who messed up the initial investigation. He seems to be a man of action (although he has just started): http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_360.shtml

I am out of the area right now, but I will be visiting for the holidays. If anybody wants me to look into anything, take pictures, etc. just let me know.


If you wouldn’t mind, could you please go to Independence (which is the County Seat and where all the County Services are)…. We would appreciate it if you could take notes/ pictures of things like the Rangers station, County Vehicle Yard, County Jail, Sheriff’s Department etc.. And anything else that you may see as relevant.

I would like to know what the sign on the Rangers station actually says and if there is one. I am not sure if it is the California Department of forestry, United States Forestry Service or maybe Parks and Recreation~?? Since it has been said that we are confused about a few things, I want to get the facts straight and call these buildings by their proper names.

My point being that they said that there was no one available to go out and check on Renee.

We would also like to know the exact distance of all these buildings to Mazourka Canyon Road. I believe they can be seen from the intersection of Mazourka & 395. I would like to know the distance from one side of town to the other.

Renee’s body was found about 4 miles up Mazourka Canyon Road. If you go up the road past where the pavement turns to dirt, there is old wooden mining structure to the right… and Renee was found on the left side of the Road. Past the hill that wooden structure sits in. I am guessing about 100 yards from that small hill on the other side of the road.

Renee was last seen further up INSIDE the canyon, miles away. I would like to know how far the mouth of the canyon is from Independence~? I would not recommend anyone going up there into the canyon itself in anything other than a vehicle meant for off-roading. Something that sits higher off the road. There are rocks in the road, too large to drive over in a street vehicle, and in some areas the road is too narrow to drive around the rocks and debris. Not to mention, that the road is not wide enough to turn around.

Which I think is why Renee went so far on this road hoping to find a good area to turn back. The road is lined on each side with large rocks. It was in an attempt to turn her VW Jetta around is when her car got stuck/disabled. It was these rocks that line the road, that Renee ran over, while trying to turn around, that disabled her car.


To quote the link below airing just months before the election….
“Lt. Bill Lutze said it was unconfirmed that the remains belonged to Renee Fox, but certainly a possibility. Lutze also said that there is nothing to suggest a connection between the death of Bishop’s Shaleen Duckey and the body discovered.”
http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_130.shtml
(I would be curious who else he thought it would be~? Are there more women that went missing up there that we don’t know about ~?)

[RogerV]

Which I think is why Renee went so far on this road hoping to find a good area to turn back. The road is lined on each side with large rocks. It was in an attempt to turn her VW Jetta around is when her car got stuck/disabled. It was these rocks that line the road, that Renee ran over, while trying to turn around, that disabled her car.



Hmmm... I think I'd classify her car as wrecked rather than either "broken down" or "stuck." It's looking to me like we have a case of a city girl on a dark, nearly impassible rural road. She'd probably never encountered such a situation, and had no idea of what to do... and then of course there's the question of her being "impaired" on top of that

[Inyo Native]

If you wouldn’t mind, could you please go to Independence (which is the County Seat and where all the County Services are)…. We would appreciate it if you could take notes/ pictures of things like the Rangers station, County Vehicle Yard, County Jail, Sheriff’s Department etc.. And anything else that you may see as relevant.

I would like to know what the sign on the Rangers station actually says and if there is one. I am not sure if it is the California Department of forestry, United States Forestry Service or maybe Parks and Recreation~?? Since it has been said that we are confused about a few things, I want to get the facts straight and call these buildings by their proper names.

My point being that they said that there was no one available to go out and check on Renee.

We would also like to know the exact distance of all these buildings to Mazourka Canyon Road. I believe they can be seen from the intersection of Mazourka & 395. I would like to know the distance from one side of town to the other.

Sure, I'd be happy to look into that!


To quote the link below airing just months before the election….
“Lt. Bill Lutze said it was unconfirmed that the remains belonged to Renee Fox, but certainly a possibility. Lutze also said that there is nothing to suggest a connection between the death of Bishop’s Shaleen Duckey and the body discovered.”
http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_130.shtml
(I would be curious who else he thought it would be~? Are there more women that went missing up there that we don’t know about ~?)

Oops, never mind about the new sheriff being helpful- since it's Lutze. I didn't realize he was involved in the investigation. *sigh*

As for other cases of women missing, I haven't heard of any. I know people who are in positions in which they would be aware of any strange deaths (they alerted me about Renee & Shaleen) but I haven't heard about any other cases. I know there was one mentioned in some forums about a death at Keoughs Hot Springs, but deaths there aren't unheard of and are usually a result of adverse affects from the hot springs (dehydration, swimming while intoxicated, etc.). I'll ask around, though!

[tandarat]

...During 3 days, I took over 300 photos of the area from the air (from a single-engine airplane).

Additionally, Gene from Texas Equusearch & RP Flight Systems arrived Thu afternoon & also took several hundred more photos with their drone.

Using aerial photography during these searches allows for a much wider area to be "searched" in a very short time. Of course, we're limited to finding only something that is in view so these photos aren't a perfect solution - and why there is still the need for ground searching. But, it does provide an excellent way to cover large areas quickly and focus the ground searching.

I've posted a few of the photos I took on my website in case people are interested: http://www.mikemelson.com/ReneeFox

God Bless,
Mike


I was going back through the older posts on this forum to try to find the name of the building depicted in the postcard, and came across this post.

Does anyone know if anyone has gone back over these photos to see if the area Renee was found in was actually photographed by the drone when Equusearch was out? It might give a clue as to how likely her body was at that location when the photos were taken. I'm assuming this is more like a small tree than a bush...it would obscure her body from the air? But maybe....just MAYBE...something that would not be seen as suspicious could yield a clue...a shadow, a flash or reflection that could be a foot or hair...SOMETHING. At least then it would answer the question of her actually being there during these searches.

Also, are these photos still available? I'm trying to set up a saved collection of maps/markers for areas significant to her disappearance, search, and eventual discovery of her body. I'm hoping that maybe SOMEONE can find some clues about what really happened. Also, I have access to some 3D topography maps, and hope to be able to find the ones relevent here, import them into a 3D application, and try to recreate everything, following her footsteps as best as possible. Combining that with a timeline would be helpful to perhaps make sense of some of the things that seem to just not add up. Aerial photos taken at a time relatively close to when she disappeared would be helpful to recreate the landscape as close as possible to what really existed.

Anyone who would like to see this map, follow this link:

http://maps.live.com/?v=2&cid=45548D4303AD0D53!101

I'm still new at using this service, so I'm not sure if others can add pushpins, information, etc., but if you can, feel free to do so if you think it is helpful. You can also PM me with anything you think shoudl be added, and I'll include it ASAP.

In any case, right now I could use the following information:
Does anyone have the exact longitude/latitude of where any of the following? If not, address or describe as closely as possible where it is, using map above for guidance.

Location of:
Her car
Her purse
Her body
Last place she was seen in the canyon
name/address/location of the places she was possibly seen Saturday evening
Location of the two CDF, rangers, fire dept., etc. officials when the reports were given of seeing her in the Canyon, and location of where they made the call.
Location of where deputy was (supposedly) when call came in
Location of sheriff's station (I can probably find this online myself :))
Location she was at when she made last contact with family (if possible).

And hey...if I'm stepping on any toes, and family members really don't want me doing this, please tell me, and I'll stop immediately. This entire case is just keeping me up at night. I realized last night that this may be a good way to set up a virtual "crime scene", and might help make sense of all this.

Inyo - if you are in the area taking photos, could you get some of Mazourka Canyon Rd...what it looks like at the intersection with 395, typical as it passes town, where it turns to dirt, and possibly the area her body was found...I won't even ask for ones where she was last seen and where her car was found....that's too much :eek: . However, photos of the sheriff's station, the building in the postcard, and the convenience store she was possibly spotted at that evening, if we can get an address, would be helpful. If this is too much, or you don't get out there, that's fine. If you do, thanks in advance ;) .

I'll be up north visiting relatives Sat.-Tues., and may not have time to get online tomorrow, but I'll continue working on the map as soon as I get back.

[Inyo Native]

Inyo - if you are in the area taking photos, could you get some of Mazourka Canyon Rd...what it looks like at the intersection with 395, typical as it passes town, where it turns to dirt, and possibly the area her body was found...I won't even ask for ones where she was last seen and where her car was found....that's too much :eek: . However, photos of the sheriff's station, the building in the postcard, and the convenience store she was possibly spotted at that evening, if we can get an address, would be helpful. If this is too much, or you don't get out there, that's fine. If you do, thanks in advance ;) .


Sure, I can do that. Does anyone know which convenience store she was seen at? There are a couple of them. I'll go through this thread and try to find out...

[Inyo Native]

Something else I find questionable (maybe I overlooked something in the newspaper articles) is that the police only mentioned one report about Renee, weren't there a couple of people that informed the authorities? Or did they both inform the Forestry guy and he in turn relayed the message once?

Also, the Inyo County Jail is not very far from the area, just a few miles on the outskirts of Independence. Frankly I find it highly questionable that they would only have one deputy available on a Saturday. I wonder if that's even possible.... I mean, what if there was a serious crime and he needed assistance? And there are other personnel available at the jail, it seems. I've been there before on a Saturday* and there were several deputies.

* Not as a prisoner, of course...

[RogerV]

Also, the Inyo County Jail is not very far from the area, just a few miles on the outskirts of Independence. Frankly I find it highly questionable that they would only have one deputy available on a Saturday. I wonder if that's even possible.... I mean, what if there was a serious crime and he needed assistance? And there are other personnel available at the jail, it seems. I've been there before on a Saturday* and there were several deputies.

* Not as a prisoner, of course...

If a major emergency happens, they call in off-duty officers and reinforcements from the state police and nearby jurisdictions. Obviously, they didn't consider this to be a "major emergency."

[cabojenn]

I have NO idea what I said to you, but a billion years ago I sent you a PM when this was still a courttv board. I since deleted it from my sent folder because it was full and I could not receive new messages, but it still shows as unread on the other board.

[LetsBeConcerned]

Aww, that's a sweet memorial. I'll keep my eyes out for it. I'll be in the Indendence area a few times and will probably check out the Mazourka Canyon road... Just to see for myself how plausible it would be for somebody to walk on that road. I do plan to write the paper about it soon and want to make sure I know what I'm talking about.

While you are up there, could you please drive up to the “green shack”… Which will tell you a lot about the environment that Renee was in… and how it DOES change drastically~!!!

The “Green Shack” has been described to me as an “Oasis” in the desert, something that you would have to TRULY SEE to BELIEVE ~!!!

But then you will also understand the environment that Renee was in and that it does get worse the further you go into the canyon.

Renee was last seen further North from the “Green Shack” which is actually an old miners camp. With Grape Vines and fruit trees growing~!!

While I was up there, I was even told, "Check out the outhouse"
:lol:

http://maps.live.com/?v=2&sp=Point.q4958r54scr9_green%2520shack_Renee%2520wa s%2520last%2520seen%2520futher%2520north%2520of%25 20this%2520spot.__

Going there, will devinately give you much more insight into the situation~!!!

Thank You sooooooo much~!!!
:seeya: :seeya:

[RogerV]

Renee was last seen further North from the “Green Shack” which is actually an old miners camp. With Grape Vines and fruit trees growing~!!

While I was up there, I was even told, "Check out the outhouse"
:lol:
:seeya: :seeya:


I have seen some pictures of the "green shack" on the web, and it appears to be well-maintained, though boarded-up. I also think I remember reading somewhere that it's the last place with a water supply as you head up into the canyon.

[LetsBeConcerned]

Something else I find questionable (maybe I overlooked something in the newspaper articles) is that the police only mentioned one report about Renee, weren't there a couple of people that informed the authorities? Or did they both inform the Forestry guy and he in turn relayed the message once?



YES~!!! It is true that the Police did talk to more than one family/group of people that had seen Renee. I am not sure if the police ever got the names of these people.

To quote the first article that came out in the Inyo Register, “We have conflicting statements as to where she was seen and who saw her,” Bedell said. (Isn’t a detective’s job to know “WHO” they talked to~?? Isn’t the first thing that they ask for is your name~!!)

I am not sure of its actual print date because I just have a faxed copy, but the date of the fax is 6/27/06.

I have also noticed nothing being said about the other groups. When this first began, the family had gone on television to try to find more people that might have seen Renee that day. So they could talk to them personally. The problem was that they could have been from anywhere, on vacation and just so happened to have seen Renee.

http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/story?section=local&id=4322927

http://cbs2.com/video/?id=21263@kcbs.dayport.com&cid=71

The odd part was a family member had called the local affiliates around Inyo to see if they could run the story on their station. We were told that it was a local news story( to So. Cal). In a follow up phone call, I tried to explain to them that since it happened up there they should show equal interest in Renee’s case.

I think that what she meant or should have said is that they wanted do their own story with their own reporters. But what she said was “it’s not a local news story.”

[LetsBeConcerned]

I have seen some pictures of the "green shack" on the web, and it appears to be well-maintained, though boarded-up. I also think I remember reading somewhere that it's the last place with a water supply as you head up into the canyon.

Everything up there is “Man Made” and will give you a sense of how they must have lived over a hundred years ago. Tapping into some kind of underground water source and then using a pipe to divert it and then digging trenches to have the water trickle over to the trees. Keeping it all self-sufficient. This trench appears as a line of grass in the picture.

A fascinating place that takes you back in time.

The house is painted green hence the nickname. The “slit” just north of the trees is the entrance to the mine. The black dot is a cavern behind the outhouse. Something that will bring back childhood nightmares of “falling in.” :eek:

[RogerV]

Everything up there is “Man Made” and will give you a sense of how they must have lived over a hundred years ago. Tapping into some kind of underground water source and then using a pipe to divert it and then digging trenches to have the water trickle over to the trees. Keeping it all self-sufficient. This trench appears as a line of grass in the picture.

A fascinating place that takes you back in time.

The house is painted green hence the nickname. The “slit” just north of the trees is the entrance to the mine. The black dot is a cavern behind the outhouse. Something that will bring back childhood nightmares of “falling in.” :eek:

Here are links to pictures I found on the web. It truly is an oasis, and I wonder why the owners didn't put in an appearance during the recent activities in the area....

http://www.airtrash.com/vacjun05/vac12.jpg

http://www.airtrash.com/vacjun05/vac13.jpg

http://www.airtrash.com/vacjun05/vac14.jpg

--Roger

[cabojenn]

I have also noticed nothing being said about the other groups. When this first began, the family had gone on television to try to find more people that might have seen Renee that day. So they could talk to them personally. The problem was that they could have been from anywhere, on vacation and just so happened to have seen Renee.

But didn't the Inyo LE recently act as if there had been NO actual 'witnesses'? Weren't they quoted somewhere as saying they were unaware that people had seen her? And this is since the autopsy results came in...alledgedly, in a phone conversation with a relative of Nae's, one of the sheriff's pretended not to know about them, until the relative told them their names!

Maybe I should send them that nice photo of that family (the family that didn't exist?) from Renee's memorial to help refresh their memory.

I guess they (LE) don't want there to be eye-witnesses. I doubt they ever did, otherwise they would have done a better job at collecting names, and actually writing them down in the file, and communicating that information with everyone that was supposed to be looking for her!!!! :mad:

[tandarat]

As I study maps, aerial, and ground photos of Mazourka Canyon Rd. and the surrounding areas, I become more baffled by the fact that it took SIX WEEKS to find her body. I have to question whether any serious search of the road was done. If it was, and her body was where it was reported to be, it should have been found. Didn't I read that they claim dogs were used at one point? I think they said they were used near where she was last seen, but what about around where her car was found? The road in between? They claimed early on they thought she had gotten out of the canyon and to the highway...well...shouldn't they have used scent dogs all along the road from where she was last seen to the highway, then, in case she got there by foot or "open" vehicle that may have left a scent? Didn't they (LE) use aircraft during the search? Wasn't she found something like 20 yards from the road? Do you realize that 20 yards is 60 feet, or approximately 4 (3.7) Honda Accords bumper-to-bumper? One article says she was found under a bitterbrush. Depending on the species, these generally only grow 5-8 ft. They can appear dense, and depending on her position, could possibly be completely hidden to someone casually looking, but if the area was being SEARCHED, you would guess the teams would be looking around and behind these bushes, especially that close to the road.

Yes, I realize they searched "only" 4 days. How many were included in that search? You can cover a lot of ground in that time, especially if you are sticking close to the road and areas she was known to be at some point (purse, car, last point seen, and all areas in between these places...and I would also guess from this area back to town, if to a lesser degree. I would also assume aircraft was used considering the environment and terrain. Did they use infra-red technology? Come on...I have a 5 year old camcorder that has infrared, and it wasn't a very expensive one, either. They are more "useful" when searching for someone who is still alive, but remains also produce a different heat than the surroundings. I would guess that even in the middle of summer in the desert, infra-red at night would be quite useful

The more I look into this, the more questions I have. I'm curious - does anyone know if the Equusearch drone and helicopter take pictures in the area she was found, specifically the bush she was found under? That would certainly be worth going back to research.

[tandarat]

I found the following article about methamphetamine. It has some interesting information that may shed light on some of the questions posed.

narconon.org Methamphetamine information (http://www.narconon.org/druginfo/methamphetamine_meth.html)

One thing I found interesting was that smoking/injecting meth and snorting/swallowing have completely different effects. Smoking (Renee's usual method) causes a sudden, intense high, while ingesting (as the coroner stated Renee did) causes a longer, less intense high, and can last several hours.

I also found the following paragraph very interesting, and could explain why she died (as opposed to the "very lethal" amount supposedly found):

Methamphetamine can cause a variety of cardiovascular problems. These include rapid heart rate, irregular heartbeat, increased blood pressure, and irreversible, stroke-producing damage to small blood vessels in the brain. Hyperthermia (elevated body temperature) and convulsions occur with methamphetamine overdoses, and if not treated immediately, can result in death.

Also, ingesting meth is the SLOWEST method, not the fastest, and takes 15-20 minutes to begin entering the bloodstream in enough quantity to produce effects. Snorting takes 3-5 minutes. Smoking (and intravenously), though no time is specifically given, probably has immediate, or near-immediate, effects, from what I can gather.

It does not have amounts needed to overdose in this article. I'll snoop around some more. It is pretty obvious, though, that the coroner doesn't know squat about the medical and physiological effects of methamphetamine. Remember, a coroner is NOT a medical professional. In many cases (and I believe this is the case in Inyo county...please correct me if I'm wrong), the Sheriff and Coroner are one and the same. He'll pretty much get the autopsy report from whichever medical examiner he uses, and can determine anything he wants from the report. Often, the report is very short, only giving a brief outline of what was found. The coroner can make whatever he wishes of that. And, of course, if he's a bonehead....:eek:

[tandarat]

Some links:

Physiological effects of a meth overdose (http://www.montana.edu/wwwai/imsd/rezmeth/effmethod.htm)

Pretty much completely disproves the theory that Renee died "minutes" after ingesting a lethal amount of methamphetamine.

1st hand account of an overdose (http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=1825795)

Not fatal (obviously), but shows how unlikely crossing her arms would be, and also that symptoms didn't become critical "within minutes".

So far, virtually every site that deals with meth overdose says that there is no possible way to set a specific amount for an overdose. There is certainly a possibility that she did....hyperthermia and dehydration (leading to hyperthermia) are the among the most common causes of death in a meth overdose. After a day in extreme heat, Renee most certainly was overheated and dehydrated, if not already suffering from heat exhaustion.

HOWEVER, from what I'm reading, symptoms are not immediate, especially when ingested. It would take 15-20 minutes just for the drug to start to take effect. Anyone who has taken oral meds knows that the medication needs to build up in your system, even for fast-acting meds. Hyperthermia is evident only after significant metabolic stimulation over time. Even if she was already suffering from heat exhaustion, I would guess that death would have taken at LEAST an hour. I'm guessing that she did not take the meth until some time after the family that reported her were gone. Again, only a guess, but I really think that she took the drugs to stay awake through the night - possibly to give her the energy to walk back out of the canyon after she realized she was going further into the desert, and not to civilization, or to stay up while waiting for help. I'm pretty confident she was not under the influence while talking to the family - note the symptoms of extremely dilated eyes (which would result in photophobia in the desert glare), jerky movements, etc....none of which she had when she encountered the witnesses.

And, frankly, I'm still not completely convinced this was an overdose, at least by her own hand. I want to know what happened after the last known witness saw her. Where she went, what she did, who, if anyone, she encountered.

For those close to the case: how confident are you of the witnesses who saw her in/close to town Saturday evening, and why? That one is a HUGE stickler for me. I'm not convinced she was seen, if only because I haven't seen evidence that proves to me that these were true sightings.



Could the crossed arms been from the chills she felt while suffering from extreme hyperthermia? If so, why didn't she recloth?

[cabojenn]

If Renee had crossed her own arms because it was cold, then her body would also most likely have been in a fetal position. Who lays down on their back when they are cold?

As far as the 'eye witness' that saw her on the highway...LE felt so sure this was fact, that it was one of their reasons for stopping the search. Plus the dogs lost her scent. Remember, they said she could be anywhere, but definately NOT in the canyon.

LE said that when her purse was found, along with a few other items, it appeared that they had blow out of the back of a truck...again, a "clue" for them to stop looking.

Suddenly she is found in the canyon, supposedly having been there the whole time, and she passed away in the mannor they thought she did?

So we are supposed to believe that a woman who has never allowed her purse out of her sight, dropped her purse because of - whatever reason, but remembered to take her phone and "satchels" of meth with her, walked all the way to the hwy tossing her belongings about? Then she walked BACK into that canyon away from help?

I just don't buy into it. I do not believe for one second she was alone in the end.

[sanderella]

I agree 100% that Renee was not alone in the end, too. As said many times, one does not just lie down and cross their arms over their chest to die. Wasn't it evident to they Coroner?? Shouldn't that be a huge clue as to something a little more sinister? As suggested earlier, can the autopsy be reviewed, (second opinion), by an "unbiased" Coroner along with the photos taking at the CRIME scene? It WAS a crime, unlike Inyo LE wants you to believe.

Inyo LE is covering their asses and I am curious to know if the family is up to pursuing a second opinion on the autopsy and having the Justice Dept. review this case? If the Justice Dept. gets involved, will the FBI also get involved? I do realize this has taken its' toll on the family and they are overwhelmed and exhausted from the past 6 months.

There is so much more to this than Inyo LE is trying to make the community believe. Renee's families deserve the truth and they deserve answers.

[Results]

This is a quote from FW and the reason I am using her quote it shows you where the forum for Roxanne is, "The aunt of Roxanne Paltauf an Austin teenager missing since July is posting as aperry58 on the "Missing/Found" forum in the Missing Children's section. Renee's family has been helping them and I am certain they could use whatever support is possible for all of you."

Thanks to the family of Renee for helping this family through their trying times God Bless You.

Roxanne's Mother has informed us that Roxanne's Birthday is January 7th and she would be turning 19 years old. If at all possible please go to the thread and wish Roxanne a Happy Birthday. Roxanne's Mothers post was heart breaking to read. Lets show her what the Crime Library Family is all about please post Happy Birthday January 7th! Thanks! Please pass the word around. Thank you and sorry to get off topic here. Sincerely, Results

[Results]

This is a quote from FW and the reason I am using her quote it shows you where the forum for Roxanne is, "The aunt of Roxanne Paltauf an Austin teenager missing since July is posting as aperry58 on the "Missing/Found" forum in the Missing Children's section. Renee's family has been helping them and I am certain they could use whatever support is possible for all of you."

Thanks to the family of Renee for helping this family through their trying times God Bless You.

Roxanne's Mother has informed us that Roxanne's Birthday is January 3rd and she would be turning 19 years old. If at all possible please go to the thread and wish Roxanne a Happy Birthday. Roxanne's Mothers post was heart breaking to read. Lets show her what the Crime Library Family is all about please post Happy Birthday January 3rd! Thanks! Please pass the word around. Thank you and sorry to get off topic here. Sincerely, Results

Correcting my date Roxanne's Birthday is the 3rd of January and an article will be written on her on the 7th of January!

Also forgot :rose: for Renee!

:rose: for her Family, Loved Ones, and Friends

[obi]

From reading all of the posts and linked articles, I've put together this rough draft. Please feel free to add, delete, or correct.

Timeline

Fri Jun 23
Renee talks to BF by cell phone.

Sat Jun 24
According to Second Thoughts (post 18) a bit before the four wheelers, she, her husband, young daughter and dog, stopped on Mazourka Canyon Rd and asked Renee (who was walking up the canyon) if she was all right. They gave her a bottle of water, left and reported her to a CDF Ranger who reported it to police as they were leaving. (Meeks/Mahaney family?)

3:00 pm According to the CL story linked on post 1, Renee seen walking by 2men 4 wheeling in the desert. They give her 2 bottles of water before leaving her behind.

4:00 pm Renee seen walking on Mazourka Canyon Rd (eb/uphill/into the canyon) by the (Meeks/Mahaney?) family. 3 vehicle caravan. Passed van, with an older couple, going uphill before seeing Renee. (GetTheTruth-post 25) She was wearing tennis shoes, tan cargo pants, a dark green spaghetti-strap tank top, and ball cap. Carrying a large purse and blanket. (GetTheTruth-post 97)

5-7 pm Possible sighting of Renee near courthouse on Hwy 395.

Possible sighting of Renee near Hwy 395 at Shepherds Cr (about 2.5 miles south of Independence). (I believe this was a caption to a pic from Mike, who flew the airplane)

9–9:30 pm Possible sighting of Renee in a store getting water.

Sun Jun 25
Renee’s purse (containing $900 and credit cards) and other items are found by the men who were 4 wheeling the previous day. When they came across another traveler, they asked him to carry it back to town and notify police.

Renee’s purse is found by the older couple in the van, seen by GetTheTruth the previous day, on their way down the canyon. (GetTheTruth-post 25) 11miles up Mazourka canyon Rd. (from the CTV cold case board)

3:30 pm Search for Renee started by LE. (post 128)

LE find Renee’s car.

Wed Jul 26
Texas EquuSearch starts searching.

Thu Jul 27
Date that 1 of 2 postcards was postmarked according to crimeblog website.

Thu Aug 10
3–4 pm Human remains found 30-40 ft north of Mazourka Canyon Rd, about 5 miles east of Independence, by a China Lake firefighter from Ridgecrest on an ATV searching on his own.

Wed Aug 16
Remains identified as those of Renee.

Sat Aug 26
Memorial for Renee.

Thu Nov 30
Corner releases cause of death

[AmyW]

If Renee had crossed her own arms because it was cold, then her body would also most likely have been in a fetal position. Who lays down on their back when they are cold?

As far as the 'eye witness' that saw her on the highway...LE felt so sure this was fact, that it was one of their reasons for stopping the search. Plus the dogs lost her scent. Remember, they said she could be anywhere, but definately NOT in the canyon.

LE said that when her purse was found, along with a few other items, it appeared that they had blow out of the back of a truck...again, a "clue" for them to stop looking.

Suddenly she is found in the canyon, supposedly having been there the whole time, and she passed away in the mannor they thought she did?

So we are supposed to believe that a woman who has never allowed her purse out of her sight, dropped her purse because of - whatever reason, but remembered to take her phone and "satchels" of meth with her, walked all the way to the hwy tossing her belongings about? Then she walked BACK into that canyon away from help?

I just don't buy into it. I do not believe for one second she was alone in the end.

First of all, please let me offer my sincere, heart-felt condolences to your family for the loss of Renee. She is in my thoughts, as well as all of her family, her little boy included. I have a son of my own; I can't imagine how my family would feel if this situation was about me.

I also don't think she was alone. I think it's odd that her arms were crossed like that. And I am inclined to agree that if it was due to cold, she would be curled up in a fetal position. Forgive me if I missed the answer to this, but why would she be naked? If she was disoriented and just laid down, wouldn't she have still at least been clothed? :confused:

I think you're right on target with your thoughts. I'm sorry that your family has suffered so. :rose:

[LetsBeConcerned]

Forgive me if I missed the answer to this, but why would she be naked? If she was disoriented and just laid down, wouldn't she have still at least been clothed? :confused:

I think you're right on target with your thoughts. I'm sorry that your family has suffered so. :rose:

Amy W.

You have not missed anything. Most of her clothes are still missing. The only article that has been found are her pants. Her shoes, blouse and undergarments have never been found. It is the Inyo Sheriff’s that are missing “something”.

Renee’s purse was found almost 7 weeks before with $900. Yet the LE wanted to imply that she left the area of her own free will. Stating that there was no reason to believe that she was kidnapped. But did believe that she left the area (without her purse).

Shaleen Duckey went missing a few weeks after Renee. After finding her body, they found her bicycle. The Sheriff said the bicycle was undamaged, yet look closely at the picture in this link and you will notice that it is missing the pedal.
http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_122.shtml ( I personally cannot ride a bike without pedals)

Shaleen’s body was found on July 25 with lacerations to her body, with a knife that was also found…to the best of my knowledge, her family is still waiting for the autopsy report. Yet the LE is implying that both deaths are “Accidents” with no foul play involved.

With Renee, no clothes, no foul play~!!

I Personally think that something smells pretty foul in Inyo County.

[Inyo Native]

I agree, especially after my own independent investigations while I was in the area. After visiting the area where Renee was found, I was aghast at how much time it took to find her! She was only around 20 ft. from the road at the most, not 20 yards! And she was found only 4 miles up the road from the jail (which is where they only deputy was when the sightings of Renee were reported)- and less than 1/2 mile from where the pavement ends. It's very suspicious. I took some pictures of both the area where she was found and the area where Shaleen was found, I'll be posting information and the pictures later this week.

[LetsBeConcerned]

I agree, especially after my own independent investigations while I was in the area. After visiting the area where Renee was found, I was aghast at how much time it took to find her! She was only around 20 ft. from the road at the most, not 20 yards! And she was found only 4 miles up the road from the jail (which is where they only deputy was when the sightings of Renee were reported)- and less than 1/2 mile from where the pavement ends. It's very suspicious. I took some pictures of both the area where she was found and the area where Shaleen was found, I'll be posting information and the pictures later this week.


Thank you, soooo much for taking the time out of your holiday schedule to look at this. It had to be very disheartening to see that, just over in the distance, is the city and the highway~!! Renee was not far from civilization, let alone the road.

What I have been waiting to ask you is would you describe the area that Renee was found in “a ravine~??”

:seeya: :seeya:

[Inyo Native]

What I have been waiting to ask you is would you describe the area that Renee was found in “a ravine~??”



Ah yes, the ravine. I don't know what dictionary the police department goes by... It is nothing like a ravine! It's more like a slight, gentle dip, if that.

It's so slight it's not worth mentioning unless, say, somebody is trying to make themselves look better by insinuating that it could easily hide a body.

[cabojenn]

Ah yes, the ravine. I don't know what dictionary the police department goes by... It is nothing like a ravine! It's more like a slight, gentle dip, if that.

It's so slight it's not worth mentioning unless, say, somebody is trying to make themselves look better by insinuating that it could easily hide a body.

I too, truly appreciate your taking time out of your holiday to .. well...a very emotionally difficult thing for our family.

[tandarat]

Inyo...would you be able to pinpoint the area she was found, and double check what I have already marked?

About how large was the bush she was found under?

The map is here:

http://maps.live.com/?v=2&cid=45548D4303AD0D53!101

Also, once I start setting up

Thanks!

[LetsBeConcerned]

Ah yes, the ravine. I don't know what dictionary the police department goes by... It is nothing like a ravine! It's more like a slight, gentle dip, if that.

It's so slight it's not worth mentioning unless, say, somebody is trying to make themselves look better by insinuating that it could easily hide a body.


THANK YOU~!!!!!

It could not have been put any better~!!!

I will transcribe the video taped interview with the Sheriff, on Mazourka Canyon Road, on the day that they recovered Renee's body.

If a picture is worth a thousand words, this video is got to be worth a lot more~!!!

[LetsBeConcerned]

(I have transcribed the video below that aired on the local TV station on Aug, 11, 2006 about Renee & Shaleen. Also, I included some of Bill Lutze’s stammering) (The webpages are somtimes just a synopsis of what actually airs.)

"Good evening, I am Bennett Kessler. This is Eastern Sierra News. The big news of the day is the discovery of skeletal remains off Mazourka Canyon Road near Independence believed to be the remains of the missing Renee Fox, although that is not confirmed. We were on scene today as investigators searched for further clues and we will tell you all about that. And in news of the week, the latest on the Shaleen Duckey death case and revelations this week on that one…."

http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/article_130.shtml (during this report, there are several video clips, some zoom in on the hwy, and the city, and then pans over to where they are searching)

“Today I talked to Sheriff’s Lieutenant Bill Lutze about the discovery.” (It then breaks to a video taped interview with Bill Lutze on Mazourka Canyon Road )

Bennett Kessler said, “Bill of course, the speculation this morning is that the body of Renee Fox has been found. Do you know that to be true?”

Bill Lutze said, “… Uhh… we do not know. We just have human remains at this time. Ahh..We haven’t identified it. And it will be turned over to the coroner for identification. Uhh it has been out here for quite some time and uhh do to the decomposition of uhh we are going to have to do dental some records”

Bennett Kessler said, “What will be going on today?”

Bill Lutze said, “Ahh… Today we are collecting ahh, evidence and photographs that we see. Ahh Umm of doing a complete search of the area to see if we find anything else that she may have been carrying with her.”

Bennett Kessler said, “Okay, you know this is! Her body is just essentially right off of Mazourka Canyon Road. How do you think it went unnoticed, this long?”

Bill Lutze said, “Well, its uhh…I I… have been though quite a few of these, and it is not unusual to be off the road a little bit and nobody to be able to spot anything. Umm… it’s, it’s in kind of a ravine, so it is not something that you could readily see, unless you actually walked up on it.”

(She breaks away and then continues with what is in the same link above on Renee)

Bennett Kessler then goes on, “And in news of the week” (There is also video tape including the bicycle)
http://www.sierrawave.tv/artman/publish/printer_122.shtml
(Notice in the above link that Sheriff Detective Jeff Hollowell states there was no damage to the bicycle, yet if you look closely at the picture, the pedal is MISSINGl~!!! It can also be seen in the video)

Bennett Kesller ends with, “And we should note.., that officers are EMPHATIC that there is no connection between the death Shaleen Duckey and that of Renee Fox. That has been a concern expressed by the public. But investigators say there is no evidence of any connection.”

[Inyo Native]

Inyo...would you be able to pinpoint the area she was found, and double check what I have already marked?

About how large was the bush she was found under?

The map is here:

http://maps.live.com/?v=2&cid=45548D4303AD0D53!101

Also, once I start setting up

Thanks!

Sure, she was found a little past the miners building (# 7 on the map) on the left side of the road. I'm not good with figuring out distance from sight, but it seemed like no more than a quarter mile- the building was within sight (I could see people exploring the building, although it was not quite within shouting distance). The bush was maybe 3-4 feet high, kind of scraggly and not dense at all. She could not have been completely concealed by the bush.

Also, the paved road was well within sight- it seemed like a short distance away. It was definitely less than a mile (according to my odometer).

[GetTheTruth]

If you set your odometer to "0" when you hit the dirt, Renee was found .7 of a mile from where the pavement ends. ...And I would defenitly say it's not a ravine!! To quote Inyo Native--It's more like a slight, gentle dip-If that!! And the bush is maybe 4 ft. tall. It's pretty obvious now because a lot of people have put momentos on and around the bush, and someone made a rock pathway to the bush. It is only about 30 ft. from the road, hard to imagine how she wasn't seen, especially if airplanes/helicopters were used. :shrug: I truly feel that her body was not in that spot the whole time. As far as Mazourka Canyon Road being a "rough" road, it's really not. The county keeps it graded. If you were to drive off the main road, it would be rough. There are side roads off Mazourka that are rough roads, and if I recall from reports, Renee's car was on a side road. We never even saw her car when we were on Mazourka, that's why we were concerned when we saw her walking, with no vehicle in sight. I agree with most everyone...someone else knows the real story behind this case, and I hope it can be solved soon!!

Inyo Native: Have you been there recently? When we were there Thanksgiving weekend, our memorial sign was coming apart-has it gotten worse?? :( I was hoping to fix it soon, don't know when we'll be up there again.

Not ONE single day goes by, nor will it ever in my life, that I don't think of Renee and her family, and the pain and hell they are going through. My love to them...
http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j265/Brookiepoo1/Sierratrip004.jpg

[obi]

Witnesses:
I would like to ask anyone here if they know of any evidence of anyone besides the Mahaney/Meeks family coming into contact with Renee that day, besides LE saying there was. Unless there is, I believe with all of the uncaring, forgetfulness and confusion with LE that night and next day, that the people 4 wheeling and the Mahaney/Meeks family are one in the same.
The search:
Did TES fly any of their aircraft over that section of Mazourka Canyon Rd at all? Did anyone else search that section of road besides LE? If so, how was it searched? On foot or by car?
I have this sneakin suspicion that if Renee was there the whole time, that any search by plane or helicopter was done going to fast and to high. And any ground search was done from the road in car/truck going to fast. And all were probably looking for Renee walking, not in the prone position behind a bush. I think that it why it was so easy for that man on the ATV to find her. Thank goodness he ventured out on his own, not asking permission from LE (I don't know that he didn't .. just assuming), just going out and doing it. Otherwise Renee may still be out there.
Locations and times:
Okay, so now we know the exact location Renee was found (thankyou InyoNative) and where and when she was last seen. It would be great to know where and when her purse and her car were found.

I, too, think there is something very fishy about this whole thing.

JMO

P.S. any corrections/additions for my timeline?

[curiousfriend]

:confused:
I was wondering if what I had read on another post somewhere was true or if it has just been overlooked on here? I read that the items pasted onto the front of the postcard were actually items that had been found along the roadside nearby to where Renee's car was found. If this is true that brings up a whole different whirlwind of questions, also stating that there is more to this story than meets the eye. Also, I wasn't sure, but did they ever find the bottles of water and did they ever investigate more into that mine where the dogs lost her scent?

[obi]

:confused:
I was wondering if what I had read on another post somewhere was true or if it has just been overlooked on here? I read that the items pasted onto the front of the postcard were actually items that had been found along the roadside nearby to where Renee's car was found. If this is true that brings up a whole different whirlwind of questions, also stating that there is more to this story than meets the eye. Also, I wasn't sure, but did they ever find the bottles of water and did they ever investigate more into that mine where the dogs lost her scent?Last I read, they haven't found the water bottles.
Second Thoughts or GetTheTruth:
Do you remember how many bottles of water (also size and brand), y'all gave to Renee? TIA

eta: I'm fairly new to posting on these boards. The dot next to my nic is sometimes red and sometimes blue. Anyone know why? Also, it keeps logging me off every ten minutes or so. I would appreciate any help. Thanks.

[LetsBeConcerned]

Here is a clipping of a story that ran on the front page in the L.A. Daily News last week


Other top stories for 2006:

…..In one of the area's more bizarre mysteries, Renee Fox, 24, of Simi Valley was found dead on a remote road east of the Owens Valley in Central California.
The mother of a 5-year-old son, she had disappeared June 24, and her family frantically searched for her along Mazourka Canyon Road, east of the town of Independence.
That's where her nude body was found in August. Her death was labeled accidental, and her family said she had a bad sense of direction and probably just made a wrong turn and became hopelessly lost.
During the investigation, a photo of Fox was sent to the Inyo County Register, along with a postcard featuring cut-out pictures of alcoholic beverages, potato chips and the head of an extraterrestrial creature pasted on a sheriff's uniform. The mailing was turned over to police.

http://www.dailynews.com/news/ci_4926102

[cabojenn]

:confused:
I was wondering if what I had read on another post somewhere was true or if it has just been overlooked on here? I read that the items pasted onto the front of the postcard were actually items that had been found along the roadside nearby to where Renee's car was found. If this is true that brings up a whole different whirlwind of questions, also stating that there is more to this story than meets the eye. Also, I wasn't sure, but did they ever find the bottles of water and did they ever investigate more into that mine where the dogs lost her scent?

When I came home for Renee's memorial I had a late night conversation with one of our relatives (Renee's and mine) that went up there for the search. She told me that some liquor bottles, beer cans, the same kind as in the postcard, along with a personal size bag a Lays chips were along the road. It was very disturbing for her.

The search was limited from what I understand the "safer" area like the very busy highway (395) with no real shoulder for people to walk without risking their lives :confused:. They were not permitted to go up as far as Renee's car, so I have to assume the answer is no, the items were not near her car.

[Inyo Native]

The search was limited from what I understand the "safer" area like the very busy highway (395) with no real shoulder for people to walk without risking their lives :confused:. They were not permitted to go up as far as Renee's car, so I have to assume the answer is no, the items were not near her car.

That "safer" area is among the most dangerous stretches of highway in California, as far as I know. There have been many fatalities due to impatient tourists and few passing lanes- many people risk their lives by trying to pass cars when it's not safe to do so. I hate driving that road, and most locals know it's not very safe. I don't know why they haven't put in more passing lanes, but I suppose it's some bureaucratic nightmare or something.

The area where Renee was found didn't look very dangerous to me- it was not "mining" country at that stretch (as far as I could tell). Definitely safer than Highway 395 by Independence.

[tandarat]

OK, I've updated the map with the approximate place she was found. It looks like there are some trails/unmaintained roads leading off to the south from where she was found, and another, that looks like it *may* be at least minimally maintained or at least used a lot, that heads up to a small bowl that appears to be part of some kind of surface mine or acid wash. Do these sound familiar to anyone? Does anyone who has lived in the area know if the bowls up there are "hot" spots for locals? Parties...drinking...drugs....that sort of thing?

Another question...I may have asked this before, so bear with me :). Have any family members pursued the 411 calls Renee made? It occured to me that most, if not all, cell phone companies automatically forward 411 calls to the number, offering to text message the number as well. There should be some kind of record of what number she requested, even if the calls never went through.

Can anyone pinpoint where her car was found? That would be the next step. Also, could someone repost the links to the postcards? I can't access a lot of the sites such as myspace from this computer. I thought of something and wanted to take a look at the postcards again. Just a weird hunch that probably won't amount to anything, but I wanna check to appease my curiosity :).

Michelle

[curiousfriend]

http://crimeblog.us/?p=33

I hope that works for you:(

[curiousfriend]

:confused: http://www.ericrench.com/FOURWHEEL/INYO/08JUL04/

thrs a link that shows alot of the type of area she was in