old Discussion 7/30-8/9/06

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by julianella
Here is an article on the FBI's involvement, kinda tells what they are doing with this case..

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159711,00.html

Thanks for posting this link julia.

I have always acknowledged the FBI was in Aruba from the very beginning, but their role was limited. Also, in the second link I am providing, it has always been a mystery to me as to why two FBI divers traveled to Aruba, and never got in the water. There must have been something to indicate that divers may be needed. From the beginning, I have believed Natalee was taken out in the water, where she remains to this day.


IMO

From the the link above:

Nine FBI officials are now working with Aruban authorities in the search for Holloway, some of whom are serving as observers. The agency has said they'd help in any way they can but, so far, have been asked for in minimal amounts.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159128,00.html

Five FBI agents remain in Aruba observing the investigation, said Judy Orihuela, FBI spokeswoman in Miami. Two FBI divers traveled to Aruba over the weekend and returned to the United States early this week.

"They were asked to do some site survey," Orihuela said. "They never got in the water."

[cassidy]

Originally posted by candykisses


Can you elaborate on that one Cham?

Yes, please do.

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by cassidy


And how do you know they didn't follow a chain of evidence? What if an FBI agent was present as the swatch was cut and hand delivered it to the lab in the USA?

I don't know, that's why I was asking?

[julianella]

Originally posted by cassidy
[QUOTE]Originally posted by chambord
[B]


It was deemed too old .




And is it totally impossible that is was too old? Is it at all possible that ALE could tell from it's condition that it had been out in the elements far to long to be of any value as evidence?

Well lets put it this way when they looked at the blood / cleaning fluid in the car, they claimed it was blood, after testing it that changed... perhaps after testing the belt, that would have changed too! imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Hopeintown


Thanks for posting this link julia.

I have always acknowledged the FBI was in Aruba from the very beginning, but their role was limited. Also, in the second link I am providing, it has always been a mystery to me as to why two FBI divers traveled to Aruba, and never got in the water. There must have been something to indicate that divers may be needed. From the beginning, I have believed Natalee was taken out in the water, where she remains to this day.


IMO

From the the link above:

Nine FBI officials are now working with Aruban authorities in the search for Holloway, some of whom are serving as observers. The agency has said they'd help in any way they can but, so far, have been asked for in minimal amounts.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159128,00.html

Five FBI agents remain in Aruba observing the investigation, said Judy Orihuela, FBI spokeswoman in Miami. Two FBI divers traveled to Aruba over the weekend and returned to the United States early this week.

"They were asked to do some site survey," Orihuela said. "They never got in the water."

I wonder about the diving too, kinda like when Tim finally got the equip, to go deeper in the water, he was stone walled by Dompig.

YOu are not alone on your thinking that Natalee is in the water!

imo

[cassidy]

Originally posted by SukiJane


I don't know, that's why I was asking?

I don't know either Suki. I would just tend to believe that before the FBI released any finding on the evidence, they would be positive that the chain of evidence had been correctly followed. I just don't think they are naive up there in the lab in Quantico. And I don't think they perform tests on just anything sent in unless it can be verified where it came from? I will take the FBI's word on this one.

[julianella]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Do you think they should test and analyze every scrap of garbage they found on the beach for a few weeks after Natalee ran off?

With in reason yes! WHy not! One scrap of garbage could hold a tiny pice of DNA!

[ebnrsg1]

I thought on an earlier board that someone had reported that blood samples were taken from Deepak's car and some were sent to each lab. Both results were reported at the same time.

In Defense of Robin, could not this scenario seem to be plausible. Joran said I am from Holland, I go to school here in Aruba, I am going back to the Netherlands in the fall to go to school. MB students thought AHA Foreign exchange student based on what is common in the US. If someone from abroad comes to US for high school and goes back home they are most generally FE students. Therefore when Robin said he was a foreign exchange student she was reporting what could have been a very honest mistake on all parts. Unless someone has said specifically that Joran used the actual words FE student , this could be where the mis information came in. At least it seems logical to me

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Do you think they should test and analyze every scrap of garbage they found on the beach for a few weeks after Natalee ran off?


Silly silly Gregor.. of course.. :tongue:

Heck they have only been digging around that island for over a year.. and nothing has shown up.. might as well test every piece of fluff that shows up.. it could be something Joran left behind.. dontcha know !!!

[ebnrsg1]

Originally posted by cassidy


I don't know either Suki. I would just tend to believe that before the FBI released any finding on the evidence, they would be positive that the chain of evidence had been correctly followed. I just don't think they are naive up there in the lab in Quantico. And I don't think they perform tests on just anything sent in unless it can be verified where it came from? I will take the FBI's word on this one.

Cassidy,
I know that the FBI takes samples from law enforcement agencies around the country that have been submitted but as you say they definitely know the chain of custody in those cases.
I think they have high standards. Do you know if samples that would be submitted by someone from another nation would be held to higher standards since they might not have the standard procedures for collecting evidence that we have. It seems to reason that they would either insist upon doing the collecting of samples or at least have a very high standard to acheive before they would do the testing. I agree that if the FBI lab did the testing it could be held up as a good source.

[dinojen]

Originally posted by chambord



What they find and what they discard doesn't mean that "nothing has shown up" imo.


Oh please.. if they would of found something that pertained to this case Jossy would of been all over it.. broadcasting it to anyone who would listen to him...

JMO.. but I don't think they have any evidence.. nothing..

I hope they do find out what happened to Natalee, every parent needs to know that of a lost or missing child..

But as for evidence of a crime.. I dont' think they have zip...

And you can't charge someone with murder only because they were the last person known to be seen with them...


And please don't even mention LIES.. because there is enough of those going around from all those concerned it would take years to unscramble them... again JMHO

[julianella]

Originally posted by dinojen



Oh please.. if they would of found something that pertained to this case Jossy would of been all over it.. broadcasting it to anyone who would listen to him...

JMO.. but I don't think they have any evidence.. nothing..

I hope they do find out what happened to Natalee, every parent needs to know that of a lost or missing child..

But as for evidence of a crime.. I dont' think they have zip...

And you can't charge someone with murder only because they were the last person known to be seen with them...


And please don't even mention LIES.. because there is enough of those going around from all those concerned it would take years to unscramble them... again JMHO

When things are just tossed aside without testing them how do you know there was no evidence?

[dinojen]

Originally posted by julianella


When things are just tossed aside without testing them how do you know there was no evidence?



How do you know "things were tossed aside"... were you there also investigating...?

And if you are referring to the "oh so important belt".. obviously ALE AND THE FBI.. deemed it not relevant to this case... please provide us with what else has been tossed aside..

We know no more what they have tested than what has been fed to us by the media or the Holloway/Twitty's and of course good old Jossy... need I say more at the mere mention of the name Jossy...

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


I'm back and forth here today. Am I missing something though .... someone is questioning the FBI's findings??

JMO

No, some are questioning the chain of custody of any possible forensic evidence, in my opinion.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160298,00.html

Meanwhile, a source close to the investigation told FOX News that evidence taken from two cars impounded from the van der Sloot residence will be taken to The Netherlands for testing.

The source also said the FBI only helped with the exterior search of the Dutch teen's home but did not go inside the structure.

[julianella]

Originally posted by dinojen




How do you know "things were tossed aside"... were you there also investigating...?

And if you are referring to the "oh so important belt".. obviously ALE AND THE FBI.. deemed it not relevant to this case... please provide us with what else has been tossed aside..

We know no more what they have tested than what has been fed to us by the media or the Holloway/Twitty's and of course good old Jossy... need I say more at the mere mention of the name Jossy...

The FBI cannot just go testing things without approval of the ALE, so if the ALE says no, then even if the FBI tested it on their own it would not matter!

imo

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Have you heard there are nine suspects?

Where did you see a copy of the police report?

Speaking of other suspects. I wonder how good ole Freddy is doing these days.

I found it interesting that Joran was upset that the Kalpoes had implicated Freddy, and of course the Kalpoe's reply was, we were only telling the truth.

Hmmm, makes me wonder what the truth is, since Joran's story doesn't seem to involve Freddy.

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by candykisses


Personally, I would love to see a one on one interview with Satish first and then Deepak.

Joran's stories are a bit confusing, but I am sure one of the brothers could straighten things out.

JMO.

Me too, personally I would love to hear from all the suspects. It's kind of hard to get the full story, when we have no idea what the other suspects have said, because according to Karin Janssen there was a lot of conversing going on between the suspects (J2k at the time) and others following Natalee's disappearance. JMO

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by No Nic


Suki, is Freddy a suspect? I can't remember all of them, 9-WOW.

To me, he looks like one scary dude. :eek:

What about Koen, he was never arrested or questioned to my knowlege, Dompig was formulating questions for him for months and IIRC, nothing materialized. What's up with that? Thorough investigation ?? Yeah, Right !
imo

Oh yeah, definitely a scarey dude...it seems he might be the photographer of the bunch. Can't imagine a photo shoot with Freddy. I wonder if Freddy is the one that takes pictures of his buddies making out, ie the pic of Joran on the boat with the girl? JMO

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by nascarmom
When did the prosecutor say that?

Back in June of 2005 in an interview with Martin Savidge.

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Natalee was a virgin
Didn't drink
Was taken from CnC
Didn't take drugs
Was always on time
Joran punched Natalee
Joran stalking Natalee at hotel
J2K raped Natalee
etc.

MOO



Would love to know how her parents were sure of her virginity status..which I find deplorable being discussed anyway.. as I think Natalee would also.. geesh she was 18..

Well we know she drank from pictures that have come out since this...

Wasn't taken from C&C.. went along by her own free will.. as the story goes..

Not sure about the drugs.. we have seen photos of her smoking but cigs aren't a drug...

I will give you always on time...

It's been proven it wasn't Joran that punched Natalee.. I believe it was dang can't think of his name.. the blond kid G..

Stalking at the hotel..okie dokie then.. he saw her one time at the hotel and that was in the casino.. so the story goes and hasn't been proven differently..

And the rape.. yes...in and out of consciousness... no proof of that either...

:shrug:

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom
Joran straightened out his own stories, didn't you see his interviews :shrug:

you mean twisted :shrug:


:biggrin:

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Do you consider only those who were arrested to be suspects, or is every person on the island who knows Joran a suspect?

How about everyone on the island who came in contact with Natalee too?

[treetime]

Originally posted by candykisses


uh huh.....;)

like a PRETZEL :D

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Laurus


Even the ones that don't seem to know Joran are suspect, at least suspected of really knowing Joran.

He runs the island and his father is allowed to live lawlessly off the land.

IMO



Good one... I forgot that Aruba had an 18 year old Godfather..

I bet they wish they really had the pull and standing in Aruba that some posters seem to think they have...

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Even if they didn't know Joran?

Yep

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Do you consider only those who were arrested to be suspects, or is every person on the island who knows Joran a suspect?

All those that were arrested, and possibly others, except for Steve Croes, I just think he was a freakin' idiot, but oh well. As far as them knowing Joran, I do believe Joran was a very popular feller on that island, just my opinion.

I found it interesting that in one of Joran's interviews, he feels so bad for the arrest of Steve Croes, because he was just trying to help (paraphrased). If I was Joran and innocent of any wrongdoing I'd be ticked off as heck if someone tried to corroborate a lie that I had told, one in which I was trying to fix. JMO

[peg54]

Originally posted by candykisses


Okay, so we are talking about the alleged claim that Julia made, correct?

Hey Hope...you are not alone in your thoughts about where Natalee really was taken.

JMO tho.:(


I also believe that Natalee is out further in the ocean (or what's left of her) in the fisherman's cage.

peg

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Laurus


That's hilarious. The first time I heard her say that I thought of Euell Gibbons who wrote those living free off the land books, also of Mother Earth News. Living off the land.

However I have to admit I have never heard of anyone living lawless off the land before. Maybe she meant "he lives just lawlessly ON THE (IS) LAND".

IMO


Ex-hubby use to eat that stuff he did commercials for.. can't think of the name of the stuff.. looked like kitty kibble..:rolleyes:


But who's living off the land lawlessly... we wouldn't be talking about Jossy are we.. noooooooo.. that would be Joran or Paulus.. but it should be Jossy.. and a few others...

[cassidy]

Originally posted by nascarmom

Not that I recall......

Someone did post a pic a long time ago. IIRC they are not real big. If I find it I'll post it.

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

What are they used for?

Not 100% sure but I think they are used for trapping bait to use for fishing? Maybe some of the fishermen on here could be more helpful?

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
When was that proven? By who?


I believe Gregor is right.. Beth made comment about it.. I don't have my links handy.. as I got a new computer at work .. so I'm screwed for backup.. but I remember it being discussed when G was brought in for questioning...

:shrug:

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Was she there?



I just remember this being discussed over and over and over when that G kid was brought it.. I can't remember if it was one of the kids or who said it.. but it was discussed at length about how G had punched Natalee.

And I do recall Beth discussing it on one of her many many many many interviews on the cable networks.

Will look for the link when I get home as I have some interviews saved.

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
I remember. Beth said GVC. Many others who were there said Joran.

MOO



MB "children " said alot of things... and then again.. they high tailed it home without helping or giving statements also..

I take what the ones that have spoken with little faith.. as it was quite obvious for the majority of their interviews they were told what to say... IMOOC... with the one exception of the tall blonde that Greta interviewed.. the rest had to look at each other before answering.. to me that is very telling.. Hmmm any comment Miss Frannie...:rolleyes:

[dinojen]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


WOW.... I agree with you, jen. None of them were exactly "forthcoming" with information, were they??

JMO



Nope and still not to this day... very telling if you ask me of her "best friends"... looks like to me they were only worried about covering their own hinney's for fear of what they were up to would get back to mommy and daddy dearest... jmooc... and have thought that from day one.. hence the zipped lips..;)

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by nascarmom
The FBI could not investigate or interrogate, that was their limitation :read:


“There are no traces or facts to come to the conclusion that Natalee is no longer alive,” Attorney General Caren Janssen told The Associated Press in a telephone interview.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8389319/

Not to mention her letter stating there is no evidence that a crime was committed that is attached to the civil suit filing :read:

You have nothing to base you OPINION about destroyed or hidden evidence except wishful thinking.

Taken from your link above:

Aruban officials have said previously a murder conviction is possible without a body, but the case requires strong evidence such as a confession, reliable statements and forensic evidence of wrongdoing. Aruba is a Dutch protectorate and as such operates under Dutch law.

Well by golly, no wonder they don't have a case....

let's see, they needed strong evidence...

such as a confession: Well we had one of those but then it was retracted.

reliable statements: Many statements I believe, but who knows how reliable.

forensic evidence...well if there was any, it was long gone by the time officials decided to investigate.

Yep, I can see why there is no evidence of a crime, and can see very clearly why there will be no case.
JMO

[dinojen]

Originally posted by nascarmom

but but but Beth KNOWS Joran is responsible and if we can't believe what Beth KNOWS then the world will implode or stop spinning on it's axis. No evidence is needed, just Beth's knowledge and since ALE refuses to prosecute based on Beth's knowledge, they are inept and corrupt and involved in a coverup and even got to her own congressman and the FBI !!!:eek:


Oh silly me... that's how it's suppose to work.. well by gosh or golly then why hasn't Joran been charged and convicted by now..

Here I thought they needed actual evidence.. whatever was I thinking.. :shrug:

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

But it's just not relevant.

And I'd hazard a guess thta someone would have noticed that baby being rolled down the beach. :shrug:

[cassidy]

Originally posted by FrankieBones1

Yes, it is big, Cham. I thought it was when I pictured it in my mind but I was glad to see a real pic of it.
imo

Ummm... I don't think that's the kind of fish trap they were referring to. I do think people would have noticed something like that on the beach, don't you?

[cassidy]

Originally posted by chambord



Somewhere out there there is a ohoto of the actual size of the traps that were stored in the fishermen's hut. I do recall seeing it, and I must say, that I was shocked at the size of them. They were large enough to hold a body, of course not as large as your lasted link showed.


moo

I remember seeing a photo too Cham. I don't remember if it was a photo of the actual traps they use or just something that might be similiar. But I think the one I saw would have taken some rearranging to get a body to fit into it. Not small but not super large either.

IMO

[cassidy]

Originally posted by nascarmom
yeah, it looks like a big blob of nothing.

That's pretty much what it looks like to me too. The picture is too fuzzy.

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom
Joran must have been wearing his invisibility cloak to carry poor dead Natalee all the way from his house to the tip of Aruba where the California lighthouse is, without being seen or picked up on any security cameras.

they were never at the LIGHT HOUSE ]

it was a LOAD :D

[MiamiNice1]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Just had an earthquake! Nothing bad.

MOO

Whoa, Luke! Are you OK?

Hurricane Chris is heading towards Miami. Luckily, I'll be in Minnesota for the week! (Just heard Tornadoes have hit Minnesota and more are heading that way!)

:confused:

[MiamiNice1]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


Hi Miami! :seeya:

I was thinking about you when I heard that Chris was heading your way. I'm so glad to hear that you'll be away for the week! Don't go to MN!!! Come to NY. It should be cooler here by next week (I hope!).

Stay safe, friend!

Thanks, Paula! People are already battening down the hatches and buying Hurricane supplies! I'll be relieved to be out of here!

Thanks for the kind wishes and be well! :seeya:

[treetime]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


My personal belief is that Natalee died in Joran's apartment. I don't believe Joran left Natalee on the beach.

IMO


he was NEVER on the BEACH

LOAD LOAD LOAD :D

[treetime]

i wonder if you can order a TRIPLE LOAD from an ice cream stand

"yea, hi, give me a triple JORAN , please... in a sugar cone


:D :tongue:

[treetime]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by nascarmom
So his cell phone walked there on it's own? [/QUOTE




NO :flamemad:

several possibilities


1. the cell towers DONT pinpoint EXACTLY where you were

2. someone else had his phone

3. the whole cell tower stuff is WRONG

4. :biggrin:

[treetime]

i want to see the TEXT MESSAGES that were bouncing around that night

i bet they will shock ya :D

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom


Option 5: Tree is wrong


OPTION 6

Tree is the smartest tree in the WORLD

:cool: :tongue:

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom
I dunno about that - look how long it took you to finally make it to the new home


:flamemad: :flamemad: :flamemad:

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom
So shocking in fact it caused them to be charged with a crime.

Oh wait, that didn't happen:tongue:


cover up


simple as that

:flamemad:

[gcarter1]

Originally posted by ebnrsg1


I would be interested in hearing your opinion. I think it is good to hear all angles. I for one have never considered the Croes to be more than in the background but since the discussion has been brought up and bandied about by you and others I am now wondering if there is not some connection to something. For instance does anyone know how exactly it came about that C and Beth happened to make connections on the island. I mean of the thousands of people how did it happen that he was the one to enter the picture? He identifies Joran and then the boys mention the security guards and then all at once there is another Croes corroborating the story. Did C. send S. to corroborate because of a pang of guilty conscience in identifying the boys? Did he want the guards identified to throw the investigation off the trail etc etc. Yes inquiring minds must be the topic of the board tonight :)

Allow me to add this - With Beth meeting up with these individuals after arriving on the Island, (I'm going to make the assumption they live on this Island) it still took Beth 36 hours to Find a police department. The minute she landed on that Island the police department should have been her first stop or shall I say her second after meeting with Natalee's chaperone and discussing the progress of what's been done prior to her arrival.

So here the question - What's wrong with this picture?

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

You've heard the expression "dumb as a post"?

Posts are made from?


Gregor... I'll take that for $1000.00 that would be wood.. which comes from tree's...

Dino that is correct.. next question :biggrin:


Ok... back on topic.. but I couldn't resist..;)

[treetime]

Originally posted by chambord



Especially the eight and a half minute one. That's a long time to ask only for a ride.


moo


JACKPOT

check this out
yea, i got my stopwatch out... hold on..here goes


"hi deepak, come pick me up..ok ?"



3 seconds


UH OH..JORAN in trouble


8 MINUTES..................HOLY COW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom
When was that determined to be a text message?



doesnt matter

phone call, telex, fax machine, fed ex, voice mail, text message


8.5 minutes to Call for a RIDE ?????????????????????


naw,,,,,something STINKS

its called,

"MAKE A PLAN, FAST, i NEED HELP, im in BIG TROUBLE"



:cuss:

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom

So in other words you are just making stuff up :no:

i aint making anything up


the only perople making things up are JORAN and K2

:D :flamemad:

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by nascarmom
(don't tell the FBI, SOS or congressman Bachus)

I notice you like to stand behind Bachus and his statement.


I wonder if you also agree with him that whatever happened to Natalee was of a criminal nature?

Or that the family has done an admirable job representing themselves and this case.

Or that he didn't think the Aruba investigative team was experienced in investigating murder cases. He doesn't say, runaway, or just missing person cases, but murder.

Or that the Aruba investigative team was up against a pretty sophisticated group. Interesting, I wonder who is in this sophisticated group.

Or that the Aruban officials that came here want him to help them improve communications with the FBI. IMPROVE? Goodness and here we were thinking they were getting along just dandy. JMO

[treetime]

this case is a perfect example of Adam Smith's invisible Hand
at work


somehow, something has been exchanged for SILENCE


:flamemad: :flamemad: :flamemad:

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Laurus
Was the Dutch re-enactment true to the facts?

Blue suitcase= if Natalee didn't have a blue suitcase, what color was it and where is it. The bag they showed on TV is not big enough to hold the things Mrs. Twitty showed on the list, the things that Natalee brought to Aruba, and we haven't seen the list of items left behind after she went missing.

Bikini top= the actress that played Natalee was wearing a bikini top in the airport. If true, Natalee could have attracted the wrong kind of attention from her arrival at the airport.

IMO

I have no idea what Natalee was wearing...but I certainly don't think anyone would be stunned, shocked or in awe of someone wearing a bathing suit on a tropical island. JMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by SukiJane


I notice you like to stand behind Bachus and his statement.


I wonder if you also agree with him that whatever happened to Natalee was of a criminal nature?

Or that the family has done an admirable job representing themselves and this case.

Or that he didn't think the Aruba investigative team was experienced in investigating murder cases. He doesn't say, runaway, or just missing person cases, but murder.

Or that the Aruba investigative team was up against a pretty sophisticated group. Interesting, I wonder who is in this sophisticated group.

Or that the Aruban officials that came here want him to help them improve communications with the FBI. IMPROVE? Goodness and here we were thinking they were getting along just dandy. JMO

Wow!! Good one!

[julianella]

Originally posted by Laurus
Was the Dutch re-enactment true to the facts?

Blue suitcase= if Natalee didn't have a blue suitcase, what color was it and where is it. The bag they showed on TV is not big enough to hold the things Mrs. Twitty showed on the list, the things that Natalee brought to Aruba, and we haven't seen the list of items left behind after she went missing.

Bikini top= the actress that played Natalee was wearing a bikini top in the airport. If true, Natalee could have attracted the wrong kind of attention from her arrival at the airport.

IMO

They had a blue suit case, but please remember, they aslo have a guy playing Joran who wasn't even the same ethnic background as Joran!

So does that mean the guy on TV claiming to be Joran, is not him?

imo

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by nascarmom


Actuallly I don't agree with your representation of what he said.

And the communication line was with the State Dept who were sitting on their request to interview the MB children. Why would they need to improve FBI communications, they had a meeting with the FBI when they got out of the meeting with Bachus.

Goodness indeed.

Too funny, you don't agree...interesting, but not surprising. Maybe you should watch the video again.

The communication problem was with the state department and the FBI. Yes, they had a meeting, and I'm assuming to improve communications. JMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by Laurus


I've traveled a lot, and so far haven't seen anyone in a bathing suit at the airport. Tropical island or no. And if someone was in a bikini top at the airport, it probably wouldn't be the most sheltered, virginal, and less experienced member of the group.

IMO

Actually I have seen it a lot, went to the Carolinas, girls were wearing bathing suites everywhere, including dinner, they had a wrap thing that looked like a skirt, but it was the bathing suit top. And went to Puerto Rico, same thing, girls were wearing open tops with bathing suit, or just bathing suit top, flew from there to Aruba, people were walking around Aruba shopping area, casino with bathing suit top. IMO

:shrug:

[julianella]

Originally posted by chambord


So factual that the actor that portrayed Joran looked exactly like him, no?


moo

Right that is what I was saying too!

[julianella]

Originally posted by Laurus


Yes the guy didn't look like Joran, but I think people are off the wall when they say he was "non-white". He looked Hawaiian to me, but mainly from his features, his mouth. He had very light skin.

But it doesn't compare to the missing suitcase at all, because although the actor playing Joran didn't look much like him, at least we know Joran exists. Do we know the suitcase exists? Where is it.

IMO

Obviously the suit case doesn't exsist, as the ALE would have mentioned it, or AMW would have it in their Clues to look for... Think about that!

The guy was darker skinned then Joran. Not even a close comparison.

Just like the white car? Appearantly that was nothing too!

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Laurus


Airport.


Yes flying from San Juan to Aruba!

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by nascarmom

Perhaps you should take your own advice.

I've watched it a couple of times, it's too bad you just choose to hear what you want from the video.

[julianella]

Originally posted by Laurus


No it's not obvious at all. They may know what Natalee did with it, and just don't feel like disclosing the information.

There was no reason to prominently feature that blue suitcase, if there hadn't been one with Natalee.

IMO

Why did they disclose the white car? WHat involvement does that have?

It is obvious you are just choosing to spin it IMO! When her discription went out where was there mention of the suite case? There was none? Has Anyone on the family, ALE, FBI, or anywhere else mentioned it as a clue to look for?

Has any TH mentioned it? IMO It was a prop! It was nothing more then that!

In the re enactment did they mention the suite case by saying it or was it just there? Did they say have you seen this or any info about this?

Natalee has a flyer from the Exploited children right? Is it listed on there as a missing objuct of hers?

IMO

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by Laurus


I don't report posts, but if I did I would report yours.

I didn't say that at all, you're just trying to start trouble.

Shame on you.



Please Laurus.......
don't take the bait. this one and others are trying their best by baiting to get this one and only thread closed down. IMOHOO.


No, I am not a mod, just trying my best to not lose this thread also. I sometimes have to sit on my hands to not get dragged into the baiting. It is hard though.


Have a safe one !

;)

[julianella]

Originally posted by nascarmom


So they should have cast an actor that LOOKED like Joran instead of one that had his physical characteristic of TALL?

LMAO

Better call all the true crime shows and tell them they better cast actors that LOOK like the people they are portraying. LOL LOL

Tall, do you know haw many tall guys there are in the world.... lol When they do reenactments it is a goal to get as close looking as they can. Tall....lol! COme one! HE was darker then Joran, looked nothing at all like him... imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Laurus


If you don't know what kind of attention one attracts by dressing inappropriately, or by lying on a bar to invite a stranger to lick your belly button, then it's way too late to clue you in.

IMO

Oh my how bad of her to do that, I mean gesh...Like she was the only one to ever do that? lol:rolleyes:

It says nothing, except take this jelly shot off me. It does not say hey I want sex, or anything else of that nature.

IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by nascarmom

Why do you need for the blue suitcase not to exist?

I don't need for it to not exsits.... lol

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by julianella


Why did they disclose the white car? WHat involvement does that have?

It is obvious you are just choosing to spin it IMO! When her discription went out where was there mention of the suite case? There was none? Has Anyone on the family, ALE, FBI, or anywhere else mentioned it as a clue to look for?

Has any TH mentioned it? IMO It was a prop! It was nothing more then that!

In the re enactment did they mention the suite case by saying it or was it just there? Did they say have you seen this or any info about this?

Natalee has a flyer from the Exploited children right? Is it listed on there as a missing objuct of hers?

IMO

I didn't see the reenactment, can you tell me where the blue suitcase comes into play? Thanks, in advance.

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Laurus
"Following the track of the poster through the United States, we hypothesized that this prolific poster, if Natalee Holloway, could have entered Ontario, Canada via Detroit, Michigan. With this hypothesis, a search of possible, Canada connections was compiled and juxtaposed. It was discovered from sources that prefer to remain anonymous that Beth Twitty disappeared for a few days when she traveled to Canada in order to meet with the Attendence Group Marketing in Montreal the day of Natalee's birthday. But, when the researcher went to the office, the meeting was not in that office, and Beth was nowhere to be found, Where was Beth Twitty? Once again, from sources that prefer anonymity, a specific area of Canada was narrowed down as to Beth Twitty's possible clandestine travel."

http://www.hyscience.com/archives/2006/08/harrytho_82_nat_1.php#more

Wow, interesting. I wonder if Elvis is living next door to her.

[julianella]

Originally posted by nascarmom
Then why the spin over it?

It was focused on. Where is it?

So no answer to my questions huh?

Why did they disclose the white car? WHat involvement does that have?

It is obvious you are just choosing to spin it IMO! When her discription went out where was there mention of the suite case? There was none? Has Anyone on the family, ALE, FBI, or anywhere else mentioned it as a clue to look for?

Has any TH mentioned it? IMO It was a prop! It was nothing more then that!

In the re enactment did they mention the suite case by saying it or was it just there? Did they say have you seen this or any info about this?

Natalee has a flyer from the Exploited children right? Is it listed on there as a missing object of hers?

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by SukiJane


I didn't see the reenactment, can you tell me where the blue suitcase comes into play? Thanks, in advance.

From this this one, I do not even see a blue suitcase...

http://www.amw.com/missing_persons/video_photos.cfm?id=32411

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by SukiJane


I notice you like to stand behind Bachus and his statement.


I wonder if you also agree with him that whatever happened to Natalee was of a criminal nature?

Or that the family has done an admirable job representing themselves and this case.

Or that he didn't think the Aruba investigative team was experienced in investigating murder cases. He doesn't say, runaway, or just missing person cases, but murder.

Or that the Aruba investigative team was up against a pretty sophisticated group. Interesting, I wonder who is in this sophisticated group.

Or that the Aruban officials that came here want him to help them improve communications with the FBI. IMPROVE? Goodness and here we were thinking they were getting along just dandy. JMO

OUTSTANDING post!

Those are some interesting words that Bachus chose to use "criminal nature", and he DID use the word "murder".

Then he said the Aruban investigation team was up against a "sophisticated group". Now, who could he have meant by this?, and what did he learn in that meeting?

What is even more surprising is when he admits that the communication between the Aruban officials and the FBI needs IMPROVING. We know that the FBI was allowed to "observe" when they were in Aruba, with one agent being allowed to sit behind a glass during interrogations. But, to this day I wonder if that agent had a live feed during the crucial questioning, or if he was, indeed allowed to ONLY "observe".

There are many unanswered questions in this case. But, there is not a doubt in my mind that Natalee Holloway was a victim of a crime on her last night in Aruba, and the last known person who was with her, who escorted her from C&C's, who had Deepak Kalpoe park his vehicle in the back of C&C's 30 minutes prior to closing and wait in the car.........knows exactly what happened to her.

IMO

[cassidy]

Originally posted by nascarmom
You don't think Natalee spent any of the crisp dollar bills given to her for tips that was still all there in her purse?

Maybe leaving them behind was a message of some sort :shrug:

[julianella]

This is an interesting statement from one MB student..

O'REILLY: Had you seen her with this guy before, before this night?

JORDAN: No, but he was in our casino a lot.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
O'REILLY: Now, did you know Van Der Sloot? Did -- how did you know who he was?

KISSEL: I didn't know him, but I had seen -- he had been around the hotel and the casino with her and with her friends, her closer friends, just hanging out around the hotel for the last few days, two or three days.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159764,00.html


These are older statements, but it is interes to see Joran say he was there a lot... so I am curious has there been any clairifications of what Joran did in the eveings prior to the day Natalee disappeared?

Was he gambling? If so where is he getting all this $$?

imo

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Hopeintown


(snipped)

What is even more surprising is when he admits that the communication between the Aruban officials and the FBI needs IMPROVING. We know that the FBI was allowed to "observe" when they were in Aruba, with one agent being allowed to sit behind a glass during interrogations. But, to this day I wonder if that agent had a live feed during the crucial questioning, or if he was, indeed allowed to ONLY "observe".

There are many unanswered questions in this case. But, there is not a doubt in my mind that Natalee Holloway was a victim of a crime on her last night in Aruba, and the last known person who was with her, who escorted her from C&C's, who had Deepak Kalpoe park his vehicle in the back of C&C's 30 minutes prior to closing and wait in the car.........knows exactly what happened to her.

IMO

Another interesting thing from Bachus' speech was that he and his team refused to look at certain evidence, because as we've all heard what is leaked can't be used in court. Makes me wonder if the Aruban team said...look, now if we show you whats in our big red folder, we either have to kill ya, or there will never be a case. I think Bachus should have looked, myself. JMO

Did the FBI agents there speak dutch, or did they have someone translating for them?

Someone posted a pic the other day of the area behind CnC's. Looked very secluded and seedy in that area. Is there a back entrance to CnC's?

[julianella]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


We know that Beth's lawsuit states that Natalee met Joran for the first time in the casino on the day she disappeared. That was confirmed by her friend who gave an interview.

I do think there was a local hanging out with the MBers, but I don't think it was Joran. Learning who it was would be interesting. Is this mystery local the one who said he was an exchange student?
IMO



:)

I agree he did not meet Natalee until that day, but what I wonder is the MBers saw him, in the casino was he gambling? If so how does a 17 year old get that kind of $$?

All I ever hear is that Natalee had never met Joran prior to that day, none of the ofther MBers deny meeting him prior do they?

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


The friend who gave the most recent television interview was quite definite that "they" met him for the first time that day in the casino.

I have no idea who "they" included.

:)

WHile re going ove Lee's AMW interview it seems she stresses that Natalee did not meet him before that day, yet there are reports that JOran had been around aome friends of hers during the week.

I look at this, I think maybe JOran had been seen around, and perhaps that is why Natalee felt more comfortable around him. I wonder if maybe Natalee maybe seen him around and thought he was attractive, which would explain her being the one approaching him first at the bar?

imo

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by nascarmom


No that is NOT what he said!

What wasn't said?

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by mrman
Thought I would check in to see if any new developments and find --- same ole same ole --- pro and con --- missing or ran away --- murdered or accident --- J2K or a different stranger --- and lets not forget the sentiments about Beth.

Yep, nothing around here changes but the weather, mrman.

JMO

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


But we all keep coming, Suki .... lol ;)

JMO

Yep, we sure do! :)

[bchand]

http://kdka.com/national/topstories_story_215160620.html

Judge Dismisses Lawsuit In Natalee Holloway Case


(I don't know if the judge ever has to comment but I don't see anything.)

[bchand]

Originally posted by TAYLOR FLADGATE
Rumour is the civil suit has been dismissed!!

MOO

See link above.

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by TAYLOR FLADGATE
Rumour is the civil suit has been dismissed!!

MOO


:rolleyes:

[dinojen]

Originally posted by bchand
http://kdka.com/national/topstories_story_215160620.html

Judge Dismisses Lawsuit In Natalee Holloway Case


(I don't know if the judge ever has to comment but I don't see anything.)



Hmmmm guess I will have to tune into Greta tonite...;)

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by bchand
http://kdka.com/national/topstories_story_215160620.html

Judge Dismisses Lawsuit In Natalee Holloway Case


(I don't know if the judge ever has to comment but I don't see anything.)

Thanks bchand...you get a big blue star for being on top of things today!

[Xainia]

Another link to the dismissal


http://wcbstv.com/topstories/local_story_215155412.html

Xainia

[court~critic1®]

Think I will wait to celebrate untill I hear just who the "source close to the case" is told. Sure hope this is true though.

The reporter in the piece that was linked to sure sounds like someone from the Twitty side. IMOHOO

[court~critic1®]

OK .... I believe it now. lol Joe Tacopia just said it was dismissed in an interview. Oh Happy Day. doing happy dance here .... that isn't a pretty sight. lol

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Might be a coincidence but it appears to me the NY judge was waiting for the Aruban judge to make the award decision.


MOO

Did you ever doubt what the decision would be?

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
I imagine Beth's phone is very busy with everyone wanting a comment.

MOO


You betcha!!! I bet she is having a hissy fit big time. moo

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Might be a coincidence but it appears to me the NY judge was waiting for the Aruban judge to make the award decision.


MOO

Ut Oh..more conspiracy theory? Or maybe simply wrong venue for this particular case?

[dinojen]

Tree ya better hurry to that bank and get your money... before the news gets out on the networks... hopefully they haven't cashed your check yet..:eek:

Still want to know what happened to Natalee, but this civil suit wasn't the way to do it.. IMOOC..

Boy.. wonder what the cables shows are going to be like tonite.. :tongue:

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
1% I really had doubts about why it was delayed. I think the judge was waiting for the Aruban decision.


MOO

I think the judge was on vacation and it wasn't on her priority list of things to do. Curious..why would you think she was waiting for the Aruban decision?

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by dinojen
Tree ya better hurry to that bank and get your money... before the news gets out on the networks... hopefully they haven't cashed your check yet..:eek:

Still want to know what happened to Natalee, but this civil suit wasn't the way to do it.. IMOOC..

Boy.. wonder what the cables shows are going to be like tonite.. :tongue:


Just IMOHOO I doubt if we hear anything. We sure didn't hear anything from them when Paulus was granted his settlement in his suit. Shame on the tabloid shows and T/H.

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
They just came so close together. I hope she releases her reasoning but I doubt it. I guess Beth and Dave can still sue in Aruba?

MOO

I doubt that one would have any bearing on the other, but I couls be wrong.

As for the Hollowy-Twitty's sueing in Aruba...I don't think they'd be anxious to go back, a lot of bridges burned there. IMO

[bchand]

Originally posted by SukiJane


Thanks bchand...you get a big blue star for being on top of things today!

You're welcome. I was just lucky to be perusing at the right time. I really hope we do get some comments from the judge at some point.

As far as JoeT saying he's not saying where JVS IS, doesn't he read the papers? He can't be serious about worrying about his safety when he (Joran) clearly doesn't seem worried. (I guess it's just his preamble to his future lawsuits.)

[treetime]

Originally posted by dinojen
Tree ya better hurry to that bank and get your money... before the news gets out on the networks... hopefully they haven't cashed your check yet..

Still want to know what happened to Natalee, but this civil suit wasn't the way to do it.. IMOOC..

Boy.. wonder what the cables shows are going to be like tonite..

naw, i aint worried

it aint even close to being over

i know the PLAN :D :cool:

its working perfectly :patriot:

[treetime]

Originally posted by TAYLOR FLADGATE
Joe Tacopina on Tucker Carlson right now!!!!

"Joe says this is the first step towards justice. He does not want to share where Joran is right now as there are people out there that want to act like Charles Bronson.

Joe also said that people had attempted to ruin Joran life by labeling him as a murderer and rapist!"

moo

he makes me PUKE :D

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


FWIW, Luke, I don't believe it was a coincidence either.

Why? What does one have to do with the other? The decision on Mr VanDerSloot was only on a monetary award. He had been released by the court as a suspect long ago.

[dinojen]

Originally posted by treetime


naw, i aint worried

it aint even close to being over

i know the PLAN

its working perfectly :patriot:




Better be careful old buddy.. only a couple of months left before we will be chopping firewood... better plan carefully...

We don't want to lose you with your

"bank it's"... :biggrin:

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Hey Paula
I don't think anyone is surprised by the Judge's decision, least of all Beth and Dave.

One way or another, I believe justice will be served for Natalee, be it in this world, or the Hereafter.

IMO

I would think they'd be the MOST surprised. Why file at all if they didn't think it was going to fly?

IMO

[bchand]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

When Kelly made his motion to have the case heard in New York , one of his arguments was there was no other forum available to Beth, however Beth has petitioned the court in Aruba for compensation in the event there is a successful criminal prosecution.

That petition in effect said that Beth did believe Aruba was the proper forum to seek compensation. After all, the lawsuit in New York is seeking financial compensation.

Maybe the judge in New York will wait to see whether or not Beth will be compensated in Aruba before she makes her ruling.

Gregor, the judge in NY HAS made her ruling.

Speaking of coincidences (not you Gregor), the website Arubatruth has gone by the wayside and now I see aruba.com no longer has the "holloway" page. I had both bookmarked for a long time but they no longer exist.

[treetime]

Originally posted by GrrlPwer
How much longer will J2K be suspects? about a year? I fear this case is over. It's truely sad. Wish there was some kind of evidence

things are very clear to me


no worries

100 percent confident

k2 and JORAN are TOAST

:D :patriot:

[treetime]

Originally posted by TAYLOR FLADGATE


Your roots are rotting!!!!

BANK ON IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


OOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHYYYAAAAAAAA!!!!!


JUSTICE BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!!



new york case HELPS the big picture

cant you see it ?

if you cant




im not telling

cant KELP ya :patriot:

[treetime]

Originally posted by GrrlPwer
Tree you are so funny LMBO. Keep dreamin'


i can sense these things


DONT DOUBT MY INSTINCTS

the last person that did
went inwith POCKET KINGS and i went
in with 7 10 OFFSUIT


i cleaned up


:patriot:

[dinojen]

Originally posted by GrrlPwer
Tree you are so funny LMBO. Keep dreamin'


Hope they don't light up our Tree to make that toast..lol..

[bchand]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

I saw your original post and deleted mine, but you caught me.

You are fast.

I've just been trying to catch up, and when I responded to Luke's post, I thought I was on the last pag.

lol sorry Gregor.

[treetime]

Originally posted by GrrlPwer
I find it funny a month ago Tree was saying that the case would go forward and now that it has been dismissed he says it HELPS the big picture. lmbo

sometimes, even US good guys had to MISLEAD others to get ot the truth



:patriot: :patriot:

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom
You think it's going to go to the world court?

LMAO

Keep dreaming!!!


Beth not filing a claim with the Netherlands to complain about the investigation will bite her because she did not persue all avenues available to her under the governing law.

Not that the World Court would even hear her case.


did i mention anything about the WORLD COURT ??


NO, :flamemad: i did not

[treetime]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Tree reminds me of a guy who was in Baghdad.... Bob I think.


:cuss: :cuss: :cuss:

[dinojen]

Just read the judge's decision.. it's pretty clear... dismissed.. plain flat out dismissed, without prejudice and or without cost or disbursements..

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


I agree with you, cc. They never had a problem dragging his name through the mud. At least give SOME recognition to the fact that he was arrested without any basis whatsoever.

JMO


Nope they sure didn't. They did it on a nightly basis. I expect to see BHT on their shows crying "oh poor me" I need your money even more now. moo I sure hope JT gets down to the nitty gritty and sues the pants off all of them. I do mean ALL. moo

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by TAYLOR FLADGATE
[URL

Thanx JennyM



Where's the barf icon?


moo

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


This family is accustomed to being disappointed. But all of this pales when compared to losing Natalee.

IMO



IMOO the only disapointment they have had is the fact they haven't been able to railroad Joran. they sure have tried though. I am sure the monies they have garner will help with their disappointment in this case being dismissed. moo of course.

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by Hey Paula
I don't think anyone is surprised by the Judge's decision, least of all Beth and Dave.

One way or another, I believe justice will be served for Natalee, be it in this world, or the Hereafter.

IMO

I totally agree with you, Paula

And if it's true that Joe T. even uttered the words that "this is the first step towards justice" for Joran, then what little respect I might have had for him as a lawyer is gone. I actually laughed when I read that.

It was ALL of Joran Van der Sloots LIES that caused him all the havoc that followed him, and will continue to follow him. After all, he was the last person to be seen with Natalee Holloway and she was never seen alive again. Joran Van der Sloot is the person who lied to authorities and Natalee Holloway's family. He not only lied to them on that very first night, he lied to them for over 10 DAYS until he was caught in his lies. He had a meeting with his father and others and the big ole lie continued. He allowed a missing girls family to go thru h*ll, and let the authorities arrest two innocent men while he roamed the island. He purposely led the investigation in the WRONG direction.

I have said from the very beginning that if the truth had been so simple Joran Van der Sloot would have told it on that very first night, but it wasn't. He had to lie, because the truth was so ugly.

Your exactly right, one way or another justice will be served for Natalee Holloway. Of that, I have no doubt.

IMO

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


****SNIPPED****
As I've stated before. It is, what it is. If Joran is responsible for Natalee's demise, nothing will ever change that. Winning lawsuits will not cleanse him or his deed.

IMO

And if he isn't responsible?

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


Lying is COG, so I believe he is responsible. Either way, Joran bears responsibility for leading the "investigation" in the wrong direction. At the very least, Natalee's body might have been found, and laid to her final resting place in America, where her family could visit, any time they choose, just as we visit our own dearly departed loved ones.

IMO

So you think that if he had said that very first nite "I left her on the beach" she would have been found by now? And why do you keep insisting that she is dead?

[cassidy]

Originally posted by chambord


The best thing to hope for is that KJ hurries up and closes this case. That's when the truth will emerge, and the Twitty/Holloway's will finally be able to tell their story without restraints.


moo

Which is exactly what everyone wants. ALL of the truth to come out.

[dinojen]

Originally posted by nascarmom
Greta didn't even seem impressed with it :shrug:


Did Greta mention the ruling on her show tonite? It's early here.. ganother 10 mins. before she is on...just curious..:shrug:

[dinojen]

Originally posted by nascarmom
someone posted she will be discussing the dismissed civil suit and Paulus' suit... but I don't know if it's tonight or not


Almost time for her show.. will post if she says anything.. Law and Order is just about over...and I get control of the remote..:rolleyes:

[dinojen]

Yeah she just said breaking news in the Natalee Holloway case..but have to listen to Israel and Iran argue first...

[treetime]

Originally posted by nascarmom


More like a train wreck :D



:flamemad:

[dinojen]

Originally posted by treetime




:flamemad:



Tree please stop with the flaming face.. you might catch yourself on fire..especially with all the hot weather we have been having as of late... so be careful....


We need you around... I'm sure for something...;)

[cassidy]

Originally posted by chambord
Out of Joe T's mouth...this investigation was KEYSTONE KOPS!!!!!

I didn't see it. Did he actually say Keystone Kops?

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Watership Down



No. That was poetic license.

Thanks. I just read the unofficial transcript and I didn't see that there.

[cassidy]

Originally posted by chambord


Check the transcript...Joe T DID say it...

You mean the on at RU?

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by No Nic


One can only hope, but I have my doubts.

Bet the Aruban Tourism Association loves having JoeT put the word put out that they have "keystone kops" protecting thier Happy Island. lol

imo

Joe T will have a short celebration.

His client, Bernie Kerik, is now being investigated by the feds for corruption.

That is if Joe T didn't drop Bernie after he pled guilty, to the Bronx DA, to two misdemeanors in June.


moo

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by nascarmom
Who cares? This is the Natalee Holloway case.

Doesn't your obsession leave room for anything else?



moo

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by chambord




Hmmm, perhaps to see that there isn't any? We know the first ten days statements are missing, maybe it has all disappeared. What has Aruba claimed this investigation has cost them? All down the drain for nothing. What a waste!

moo

I'm disappointed in the ruling, but not surprised.

I think the case will be closed soon, but I do have a fear that there will be missing statements, when it is released as I believe ALE has been very shady and deceitful, in my opinion.

I'm with Greta, the answers do lie in Aruba. Deepak and Satish come to mind, in my opinion, and I think they know what happened that night, as one of them said to Joran...that lie was for you.

JMO

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Is it up to JoeT? I thought he worked for Paulus and Joran.

MOO

I thought he wanted the publicity.


moo

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by chambord



Simple. No coincidence. Check the ruling document, everything is typed including the month "Aug", and ta da, the 3rd is handwritten. Now you tell me what that denotes?


moo

Isn't the decision 10 pages?

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


I agree with you completely, Cham!

I wonder if he burned his bridges?

[treetime]

Originally posted by chambord
Joe T did more tonight to advance Beth's case than had she prevailed in the NY court today! Its finally out there in the open that even the suspects lawyer calls this investigation a sham.
I wonder what the Aruban Strategic Task Force Industry will conjur up to counter Joe T's attack. A boycott is no longer needed, Joe took care of it very nicely tonight.


MOO

JOE T comes thru AGAIN !!!!!

WoooHooooo:patriot:

[treetime]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


I don't think it's over. Once ALE officially closes its file, the FBI can release info from its files. Or perhaps, as I once suggested, the info contained therein, might be obtainable via the Freedom of Information Act.

IMO


<-------------------waiting to see the 8 1/2 minute conversation :D

i see trouble coming round the MOUNTAIN for JORAN

repeat

repeat

repeat :cool:

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by nascarmom
No, that would be JQK and his filing of the civil suit. LMAO

Joe T is a publicity hound. Even you know that.

He's a criminal defense attorney who is now taking on civil cases as long as they are high profile. In addition to Bernie Kerik and the Bianchi girl, he is representing the family of Immette St. Guillen, a victim.

moo

[treetime]

Originally posted by Hey Paula


I've always believed JQK was a class act, not at all the publicity seeking type. I honestly believe JT is the publicity seeker.

IMO


that is RIGHT on the MONEY :D

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by StoliMoli


I think this case is over as far as ALE is concerned, I think it was over for them a very long time ago. IMO, they are simply waiting until they feel enough time has passed they can officially call this a cold case or close the file (or whatever their law calls it).

There is no crime on Aruba. Or more honestly, we want the "image" of no crime on Aruba, 'cause it would be bad for tourism.

imo

I agree.

[treetime]

Originally posted by No Nic


No, but he is very "slick" looking.


imo

:D

[treetime]

i have SLICK tires

they are slippery tooooo !!:D

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by nascarmom
No I don't know that.

You seem obsessed with JoeT. He's quite good looking isn't he?

The obsessed on this board have made themselves painfully obvious.

Anyone who knows about the cj system in NY has to know about Joe T - unless you're living on another planet. Like I said, he's involved himself in every high profile case.

Oh - and while he has basic good looks he's now greasy and bloated - not my type.


moo

[treetime]

Originally posted by forensicpsy


The obsessed on this board have made themselves painfully obvious.

Anyone who knows about the cj system in NY has to know about Joe T - unless you're living on another planet. Like I said, he's involved himself in every high profile case.

Oh - and while he has basic good looks he's now greasy and bloated - not my type.


moo



:cool: :D

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by treetime
i have SLICK tires

they are slippery tooooo !!:D

Slick and slippery. Good description.


moo

[forensicpsy]

Originally posted by nascarmom
Yeah I know, they (well you actually) post on and on and on about JoeT's clients.

JoeT won the ruling and he won on ALL FIVE POINTS argued.

:beer: Justice for Joran

Really? I'm not the one who posts 24/7 every day.

[julianella]

WOW What A night I see...
First I will say I do not know why there is really a "surprise" in this dismissal at all? I mean I know I am disappointed, but not surprised, and if we go back to the court date, I think we will see I doubt Beth or JQK are surprised either, they too are probably disappointed, but they never actually counted on winning the ruling.

My opinion is this is far from over, even if today Aruba closed this case it will not be over.

I truly felt sick reading some of the comments here from last night, I cannot believe how cold certain people are, one even calls Beth evil!

Let me say this Beth sent her daughter on a vacation, she gave her daughter something that many parents can't and that was a celebration for all of Natalees hard work. Now whether the trip was right or wrong, really how can we decide that? I mean look at spring break here... look at other trips students take to other "vacation spots"? They are just as wild! The entire week Natalee was drinking, partying, having a good time, but night after night she made it back to the HI safely.... Whether she was carried back, rolled back, or walked back she made it back! Now on her very last night, she leaves with a local boy who began his lies that night with Natalee, she has not been seen again? This far into the investigation no one has came forward to say they have seen her, at all!

I look at it like this Joran claims there were witnesses on the beach that night, and he claims he left Natalee aloe, now IF there were witnesses wouldn't they notice strange activity like someone taking Natalee? Wouldn't they notice if a girl walked into the water but didn't come back out?

Joran says in one interview he was sitting on the beach with Natalee when he called Deepak for a ride, but in another statement or interview he claims he was by the huts, and was not able to say goodbye to Natalee because Satish was in a "hurry" to get out of there....now if you are sitting by Natalee and know your ride is coming why didn't you say goodbye?

If you felt sooo bad for leaving Natalee on the beach then why did you lie about it? Is the beach story more convenient because there are no cameras to say if you were or weren't there? What is the "true" story Joran that you said you would tell when this is all over? Why wait til it is over to tell it?

Why did Natalee want to see your house, yet when you pulled in front you did not go in? Why didn't you go in? OR did you go in?

Was the free tournament you and your father went to the day you met Natalee? Why was Lorenzos name brought up?

Regardless of what people feel about Beth, this is her daughter that is missing. She has been lied to and their searches have been stone walled. She IMO has been doing what parents do for their kids and that is fight for them. How can we expect her to say to Joran ok don't worry about lying, don't worry about continuing to lie while in jail, its ok? NO WAY! That raises suspicion. And when she is the one going through it, her suspicion is probably 100% more then mine!

All I know is that this case is hokey, there are to many things missing here. Bloody mattresses, white sheets covering a "dog", Natalee's father witnessing the ALE loading something into a car, and when he questions them about it they don;t know what he is talking about... Bones found in the ocean, duct tape with blond hair, "fish net" fabric with the striking resemblance of Natalees shirt.... the comments reported about "misplaced" evidence.... the confession, that "never happened"..... Investigators, and reps who feel this is a murder investigation, while there is "no evidence to support a crime"...

Cover up or not this investigation was screwed from day one! The minute the investigators did not take control of the case!

So cheer all you want for "justice" but lets not forget the one who needs the justice here is Natalee! As I said before Joran can walk and talk, go to college, have breakfast lunch or dinner with his family, he can still beat up his little brother, he can still live his life, but Natalee has not been here to live her life in how long again! SO the only "justice" I see worth celebrating is Justice for Natalee!

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


I have to agree with you, WD. Posters have had no problem WHATSOEVER with the "tunnel vision" that has existed on this board. One poster said last night .... she "dislikes" Joe T. because of the way he defends his clients?????? I wonder if posters "dislike" JQK now, because of THIS latest farce ??

I never thought one way or the other about Joe T. before this case. I think he's been BRILLIANT in his defense of Joran ((who cares who his other clients were, before anyone says anything)). He has been aggressive, and made it perfectly clear, according to him, his client DID NOT harm Natalee. What more can someone ASK from their attorney??

JMO

I have to ask what latest farce?

And aren't Defense attorneys all supposed to claim their client "did not harm" who ever the victim is?

I will not knock either attorney, as they are both doing their job. I don't see them taking shots at each other, so really why should we? I think they even said they were friends right? I mean I look at it this way, they have a job to do, but at the end of the day they are like most of us, leave their work at work. JT's job is to convince Jorans innocense, JQK's job is to convince his guilt...

JT won this round, which I really don't think comes to a surprise to anyone, but I truly do not feel this is over.

What I do think is interesting is that JT says this case was done wrong from the beginning and there is no outrage, like there is when someone from Beths camp says it....lol!

Oh well!

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



Some procalimed Joran guilty from day one. Before he was even arrested they had him all but convicted. That goes beyond tunnel vision.

According to those same posters JQK is the greatest thing since sliced bread and Joe T is slime. If the roles were reversed and JQK was the VDS' attorney and Joe T was Beth's their opinions would be 100% opposite. As long as their title has defense in it they will never be respected by some on here.

WD you are the same way! You think this suite was a joke and I have seen you comment on JQK, yet if he was defending Joran and JT was Beths attorney you would be doing the same thing you claim the other side does... so really what's the point of your post?

Double standards go both ways! IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


Then you don't understand the concept of justice.

:)

I understand quite well. This is about a missing girl. What deserves more justice a missing girl, or a young man beng called a few names...

Sitcks and stones make break your bones but name will never hurt you! Remember that one?


This is about Natalee Holloway. Look at it like this perhaps if Joran didn't make himself look guilty he would not need to feel like he "deserves" justice.

He lied, he made himself suspect, and he continued to lie in jail, which made him look even worse! So Please tell me again, what exactly does he deserve?

What part of his life os ruined? What part of his life can he never get back? What part of his life will he never have? So what exactly does he deserve justice for?

IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



Paula, Cham, Forensic and others spent a good bit of time last night insulting Joe T because he defends Joran. As I said in another post if the roles were reversed JQK would be the object of their scorn so that shows it has nothing to do with the man himself but solely with his role.....Defense Attorney.

Again, Joe T saying the investigation was handled badly is vastly different than posters on here saying it. Posters here think it was botched because Joran, Deepak, Satish, Paulus and others aren't in prison. Joe T said it because his client was focused on to the exclusion of all else. You can't compare the two.

Like I said I personally cannot really talk bad about either attorney... IMO they are just doing their job.

The reasoning for this case being badly is not the point. Because there are others who feel Joran and the brothers are involved, but also think others are involved too, theat have not been investigated, yet when that is brought up, I get eye rolls, and laughing icons, because I must be a conspiracy therorists!

The point is we have said this case was handeled wrong, JQK and Beth have said it, JT said it, even the PM said it! but there are still some on here that would aregue that is has been handeled right...

see where I am going with that?

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



The only thing I criticized JQK for was the way the first filing was written. If you are honest you will admit that was a cheesy, badly written synopsis of a corny romance novel. I don't and have never insulted him just because he was an attorney.

I never read the first filing! And I am not insinuating you would insult him for just being an attorney, but because he was BETH"S attorney! IMO

Just as maybe some wouldn't insult JT for being an attorney but would because he is JORAN's attorney!

That is why I say double standard goes both ways!

IMO

[julianella]

OT but this is a bit scarey!

http://www.newsnet5.com/travelgetaways/9627469/detail.html

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


Then you don't understand the concept of justice.

:)

Justice cannot be for one side alone, but must be for both.
Author: Eleanor Roosevelt

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



I'm not doing the merry go round thing with you again. There is a world of difference between Joe saying the investigation was handled badly and beth and posters on this board saying it.

Beth's side is saying it because evidence doesn't support her claims that Joran kidnapped and raped natalee and ALE didn't charge and try him for theat.

Joe T is saying it because ALE focused on his client only. Others leads weren't investigated because of the tunnel vision some had towards Joran. Those leads may have led to the solution of this case. Huge difference.

So no one on Beths side has ever questioned the way arrests and who was arrested were made?

Merry go round? LOL That is what I mean. How bout this we can agree to disagree.....

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



Read last nights posts. Other cases Joe has handled were brought here in the ongoing saga of insulting Joe T. How do those cases apply to Joe T defending Joran? They don't.

I did read last night, and that is why I said I will not judge either...

I read worst things from last night other then who previouse clients were! IMO

[court~critic1®]

Joran has had a wonderful birthday week. First his Father wins his lawsuit ,and now the useless lawsuit the Twittys filed have been dismissed. Next one will be even better. He will be dismissed as the suspect in this case. imooo


Happy Birthday Joran.

[julianella]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


Justice applies to everyone, or there is no justice. Natalee's family deserves no more, or less, justice than Joran.

If you read the Judge's ruling, you will see that if this case had been allowed to go forward in NY, the court would not have the power to compel witnesses from Aruba to testify.

If you believe that a trial in which the defense cannot call material witnesses would be provide justice, you’re living in the wrong country.

:)

What justice does Joran need? What? He did this to himself, so why does he deserve anything? And I am sorry but I disagree that EVERYONE deserves justice, because there are some people in this world who do some sick things, that IMO deserve no justice at all!

What exactly would have happened to Joran in this suite? What that would impair him from lliving a normal life...

IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by julianella


I understand quite well. This is about a missing girl. What deserves more justice a missing girl, or a young man beng called a few names...

Sitcks and stones make break your bones but name will never hurt you! Remember that one?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Threats of vigilante justice are being made. Joe M made threats in the past. That children's rhyme doesn't apply to this case in any way shape or form.

A childs rhyme? Was Joran harmed? OR is his life going on as usual?

Seems to me he is doing quite fine... or did you miss him frolicking at the HI? Wonder was that a tourist? I would love to know how they met!

Joe M is not Beth!

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by Unperson1984
JoeT was just on MSNBC. He said they are preparing, and will be filing two lawsuits against people who have made untrue statements about the Joran.

:)


tks for the good news . I hope one is against Nancy G. and the other one against Greta.

moo

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by chambord



How about letting Joe T. know that Joran is not 17 as he said last night on Greta. You might want to tell him that Joran has had TW0 birthdays since Natalee disappeared .


moo


Well lets' see. Joran was 17 when all this BS started, now wasn't he. uumm

moo

[dinojen]

Originally posted by Watership Down




Oooh now it's really going to get interesting.

My guesses are Geraldo and Skeeters.


I'm with you on that.. I don't think he is even thinking about the H/T's he said a long time ago when they filed the civil suit, that his issues weren't with the family.. it was with other.. Skeeter's.. Bo Dietl... there are many many more...

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by chambord


Sure but he is 19 now, and was as of last night's broadcast. BS? You call it BS when a person disappears? **shaking head**


moo


How do you get I was calling Natalee dissappearing BS???? IIRC I was speaking about the lawsuits and etc. so do please continue to "shake your head" IMOO

[cassidy]

[[B]--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by julianella


I understand quite well. This is about a missing girl. What deserves more justice a missing girl, or a young man beng called a few names...

Sitcks and stones make break your bones but name will never hurt you! Remember that one?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Justice applies to BOTH. One cannot run roughshod over someone else in a search for justice. And words CAN wound..deeply.

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by Watership Down



And IIRC his birthday is later this month so he has only had one since Natalee disappeared.



Thank you for the correction WD. I do have senior moments quite often. For some reason I though it was the first week in Aug. My mistake. I still think they are good birthday gifts. moo

:o

[dinojen]

We would have to go back a few months when this whole civil suit came about.. and make a list of the names that JT could go after and trust me there are many for the slanderous things that were said and both Joran and the family were accused of... leaving out the family of course.. because that's what JT said ..he had no interest in adding more stress to them... BUT...

hellllllllllllooooo Lucy....

Skeeter
Artsie Wood
Dr. Phil
Geraldo... (by the way, did his show get cancelled ?)
Would love to see him add in Joe Scarbourough..
Jossy

The list could go on ....




And for all of you that are upset about the happy dancing... it's not happy dancing because any one was found NOT GUILTY.. it's that justice was served.. there was no reason for the suit to even be filed in the United States...

There will never be happy dancing over Natalee not being found or not knowing what happened to her. I hope someday there is resolution..and they have their answers.. I just think they had their minds set from day one who they were going after and couldnt' see it any other way... that's not justice.. and it can't all be blamed on Aruba and ALE...



JMHO

[ebnrsg1]

Originally posted by Watership Down



The information didn't and doesn't belong out in the public domain. It is an active, ongoing investigation. :rolleyes:

I am not sure now that it was the object to get information. John Q the way I took his comments tonight said he knew the case would not be heard and prepared Beth and Dave before filing that it probably would not be heard but the three decided to go ahead and file the suit to keep Natalee's name out there in the news. I remember at the time saying to my husband that the judge should probably not be watching as that could be interpreted as a frivilous lawsuit. I think he just felt it was as he said earlier shortly after the suit was filed that it was "a hail Mary" shot. The last ditch attempt to do anything. I do feel sorry for him as he just acted so dejected and when talking about telling Beth and Dave of the decision his voice broke or at least it appeared to me that it did. He said that he is going to Aruba next week. Joe did say that he felt for the family as well as Joran's family and wished that the case would be resolved for the sake of both families but doubts that it ever will. Both sides voiced displeasure at the way the investigation was conducted.
This might be a goofy suggestion but would it not be in the interest of all parties if Joe and John were to get together compare notes and see where the investigation is lacking from each of their perspectives and then hire a COMPETENT investigator to go and investigate independently then spoon feed the inform to Karen J as they find it so that the case might come to resolution. I thought Greta was on the right track about sending a team from both sides as well as independents ( the panel, Mark f. John Joe and herself as well as Jeanine P. ) to investigate. Maybe I would not have chosen those exact participants but the idea is a sound one. At least I think so

[dinojen]

Originally posted by chambord


Does that also apply to Natalee, Beth, Jug, and Dave?
The "words CAN wound..deeply"

The invasion of their private lives
The slander and libel posted against them on Hate blogs
The defamation of their character

You think they are wounded too?


moo



You have a point..both sides have had their lives invaded upon.. slanderous comments of both families and big time defamation of character more so in one family than the other..

I don't count the blogs because their is enough spewing on them going around for each family.. that's a given..

Both families have been wounded... but the VDS's weren't on tv nightly... the VDS's weren't discussing very private details about Natalee.. alot of the invasion of privacy you are referring to in the H/T case was discussed by them.. not dug up by reporters.. it came from Beth's and even Jug's own mouth's in their interviews...

This is a no win case... they want to know what happened to their daughter.. and the VDS's are protecting their son and their family who honestly believe he is innocent..

No one is a winner...

[julianella]

Originally posted by dinojen




(SNIP)

No one is a winner...

Not according to certain posters on here! imo

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Post of the week.
MOO


ITA 1000% Some sanity posted at last. moo

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


I'm not sure why some want to "sugarcoat" it.

JMO

Maybe if the case went through they could then gain access to the paper work, maybe that is why this case was filed in the first place, as I said before I don't think it was about money, but information. But I was laughed and and told that I thought this suite was to solve the case! No I think it was always about information! And JQK has now said that too! So I guess maybe I should have been the one laughing! imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


Well forensic .... He seems to have done the job well for THIS particular client. I mentioned in a post earlier, I really hadn't given Joe T. any thought whatsoever before this case. I think, in THIS particular case, he made JQK's filing look foolish.

JMO

I don't think he made JQK look foolish in the least, as JQK even said it was a stretch, or "hail mary" if you will..!

:rolleyes: imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

I asked Paula last night and she didn't answer, so I'll ask you.

Do you think Beth's filing to receive 50,000 Florins compensation from the Aruban government is also just a search for information?

If you do, please explain it to me.

I think the suite was filed and an amout was put in, personally I do not think this case was EVER about $$! I think it was to gain access to files that they cannot gain access to!

I think the money was just a sum put in because mostly when people sue money is involved. But the case itself was for the Information..IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


It doesn't, nm. They are holding his phrase "Keystone Cops" as a banner, for what they have termed a "CORRUPT" investigation . Everyone knows there is a difference.

When you think about it .... there are MANY phrases stated by MANY people, which indicate this was an attempted "lynching".

I'm surprised this is the first time people have HEARD Joe T. use that phrase. I've heard him use it a few times in connection with this case.

JMO

Who is they???

[julianella]

Originally posted by Laurus


$30,000 is a drop in the bucket for what he went through, and what the whole family is still going through.

It should have been approximately 100 times that much, but maybe he and his son will get the big bucks they deserve from Dr. Phil (or Oprah?:eek: ?).

The "non-profit" bashing of the boys and Aruba, that is taking place in our schools under the guise of "safe travel" has to be stopped.

IMO

You are aware that HE is not losing out on anything, he was not in the same "jail" at the others, he was moved to an alternate location... ANd what HE went through...LOL oh yeah becasue his kid is missing right? He has been searching and hitting brick walls at every turn right... oh yeah he's had it so rough...lol!

[julianella]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

This doesn't answer my question.

How does asking Aruba for 50,000 Florins for compensation equate with seeking information?

I don't think it does, I never said it did, I said it was a figure added in!

This had nothing to do with money IMO.

What does the $$$ PVDS went for compensate? What is he compensating for?

[julianella]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


For having his civil rights violated. He was arrested and detained without proper grounds.

He received the maximum award of fifty thousand florins.

:)

And again if it was sooo bad for him, how does the $$ compensate?

Does it make it go away? Will it change the past?

[julianella]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

How does asking for financial compensation, 50,000 Florins, the equivalent of about $28,000.00, not have to do with money?

Paulus was compensated for being falsely imprisoned and having his character besmirched.

In similar circumstances in this country his compensation would probably be in excess of a million dollars.

Yess but is it about the actual money or is it about setting the record straight?

I do not think this SUIT was about $$, as I said I think the primary reason was to get information that they do not get access to! imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by redjetta


Not being able to become a judge - now as a lawyer he has a scared reputation from the media & allegations brought aganst him which effects his ability to obtain clients. Basically the career he has worked (probaly extremely hard for) is ruined & so is his name.

imo

Didn't he fail the judge thing BEFORE this case... so I don't think that had anything to do with it...and with this $$ will he be able to become a judge?

His name is not ruined he was cleared!

[julianella]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Why are you avoiding my question about Beth's asking for monetary compensation from Aruba?

I have answered it three times now! when you sue people ALWAYS ask for $$, does that mean it is the primary reason.

[julianella]

Originally posted by redjetta


YES he was cleared, however did the allegations go away? Did he stop getting accused of things after he was cleared as a suspect? If you need a lawyer would you want someone who has been accused of awful things or would you want someone that has'nt?
NO money will not make him a judge but money will help him provide while he is still under a dark cloud of suspision. imo

Well Beth gets accused of things daily also, yet she was not even a suspect!

And I am sure there is a reason Beth feels PVDS knows more then he lets on...perhaps she too thinks he met Natalee!

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Laurus


If you had a son that that was villified on international TV by members of the most powerful nation on earth, called a serial sexual predator, kidnapper, gang rapist, murderer, and that the father is, well you know what her spiel was, you don't think that would bug you a little? Or is it because they're foreigners that all this doesn't count?

It's either Joran's fault that Natalee disappeared, or it isn't.

IMO it isn't, and if I am correct, the vendetta of Mrs. Twitty will go down in history, in the chapter of the most shameful eras of TV in America.

lol

I have seen worse on tv...WMD is more shameful that anything BEth has ever said or done! But anywho, his son got him in the perdiciment he was in, no one told him to lie, no one pointed a gun in his face and told him to make himself and his family look bad, and if his son cared or was remorseful then perhaps he would have told the truth in jail instead of telling more lies there too!

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Sorry, that doesn't answer the question either. I have to assume after three attempts you want to avoid it.

That's fine, but please no more "it's not about money." It's only about money.

How did I not answer the question? Because I didn't say what you feel?

You think its about the $$, I don't so I will just have to say we can agree to disagree. IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
I wonder what his lawyer bills amount to?

FOr whose lawyer? His? or the Kapole brothers?

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


julia .... IMO, the filing of this civil suit was a farce. It was filed based on NOTHING but rumors and speculation. No "evidence" whatsoever .... thus the reason for my opinion.

Yes, I believe Defense Attorneys DO speak out for their client .... As I said Joe T. has done an excellent job in that regard.

I find it interesting you don't think JQK or Beth will be surprised by this ruling. Why do you think they FILED it, in the first place .... just to hear the Judge dismiss it!!??

JMO


Remember "hail mary"

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by redjetta


Not being able to become a judge - now as a lawyer he has a scared reputation from the media & allegations brought aganst him which effects his ability to obtain clients. Basically the career he has worked (probaly extremely hard for) is ruined & so is his name.

imo

Maybe some of us don't give him the much needed respect that he wants because in my opinion he was a spineless man who couldn't control his minor son to come forward with the truth in a missing person investigation.

It sickens me to see rewards given to people of such low moral character, ones that can cover for their lying son, all the while allowing 2 SGs to sit in jail. I'd probably cover for my lying son too, but it certainly wouldn't mean I was a class act, and one to be given any kind of compensation.

In my opinion even if Joran was innocent, you would think he would have tried to come forward with the information he had to make sure that ALE had the right people since their investigation was started on a lie. If Joran didn't have the legal sense to know this, then his father surely did.

JMO

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
I wonder what his lawyer bills amount to?

They may not have been too high if he would have been completely innocent of any wrongdoing and anteed up with the truth before an arrest was made. JMO

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

I asked Paula last night and she didn't answer, so I'll ask you.

Do you think Beth's filing to receive 50,000 Florins compensation from the Aruban government is also just a search for information?

If you do, please explain it to me.

Maybe it was Beth's way of trying to punish the keystone cops for a lousy investigation in her daughter's disappearance. JMO

[dinojen]

Originally posted by julianella


FOr whose lawyer? His? or the Kapole brothers?


I take from your post you are suggesting once again Paulus financed the Kalpoe Bros, attorney's.....

I believe it was pointed out in the beginning that he referred an attorney to them... but I'm sure you will want evidence of that..and that I can't provide.

[cassidy]

Originally posted by chambord


Does that also apply to Natalee, Beth, Jug, and Dave?
The "words CAN wound..deeply"

The invasion of their private lives
The slander and libel posted against them on Hate blogs
The defamation of their character

You think they are wounded too?


moo

As with any high profile case, there are those who will go to great lengths to invade privacy of any and all involved. It's happened in this case, we've all seen it. The words of anoymous posters on internet blogs aren't worth a hill of beans.
What I haven't seen in this case are the Van Der Sloots maligning the Holloway-Twitty's. I have witnessed the opposite on many occassions.

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by SukiJane


They may not have been too high if he would have been completely innocent of any wrongdoing and anteed up with the truth before an arrest was made. JMO



Just what was or is Paulus guilty of????????

:confused:

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


Suki, I think Joran told his father the same story he told the police at first.

:)

Then that is sickening to me too, because if a father doesn't know when his son is lying in a very serious situation, then I don't know what to say. JMO

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

I don't think she's in charge of dispensing punishment in Aruba, on tabloid television, or in school auditoriums.

True enough, but for a parent of a missing child to be so angry and frustrated with an investigation that they would lash out in this manner, doesn't surprise me at all. You take whatever means are available to you. I would, and I think we all would. Goodness it's only 28,000 dollars, how far does that get a person these days. JMO

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


Come on Suki, are you saying that you never got away with telling your parents a lie when you were a teenager?

;)

C'mon Unperson, this isn't about who broke Anita's favorite vase. This was a very very serious situation one in which I'm sure Joran was scared, matter of fact he said so, I think any parent would be scared as well and would get to the bottom of the matter. JMO

If Joran can fool his own parents so easily, then Joran, in my opinion, is a very scary person. JMO

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by SukiJane


True enough, but for a parent of a missing child to be so angry and frustrated with an investigation that they would lash out in this manner, doesn't surprise me at all. You take whatever means are available to you. I would, and I think we all would. Goodness it's only 28,000 dollars, how far does that get a person these days. JMO


Pleas do not presume for me. There is NO way I would go on TV tabloid shows nightly and spew such pretensions and lies, as imo BT has and still does in our schools. I sure wouldn't beg for monies to fill my pockets. As none of the monies she has garnered been spent on the seach of her daughter.MOO

[cassidy]

Originally posted by SukiJane


Then that is sickening to me too, because if a father doesn't know when his son is lying in a very serious situation, then I don't know what to say. JMO

Then I must sicken you too. I have 6 kids and not one of them has never lied to me. Some big lies, some small lies. But in either case they looked me straight in the eye and lied. And I had NO clue. It happens, you deal with it and I can clearly see how it may have happened in this case.

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

But if it's "not about money", how do you justify asking for money?

If you think Beth didn't care about Natalee, and what has happened to her, and only seems to care about money, then that is your opinion, it is certainly not mine. I stated the reason I thought she filed for the money, and you are trying to nitpick everything to death, and it's such a silly immature game in my opinion. JMO

[dinojen]

Originally posted by SukiJane


Then that is sickening to me too, because if a father doesn't know when his son is lying in a very serious situation, then I don't know what to say. JMO



Obviously his father would know him better than the media and any poster on a message board..so he must have believed him from the beginning... I highly doubt the VDS family care if you approve of how their children are raised.

I don't think Paulus or Anita are the type of people to back their son if they thought he was being untruthful...jmho.. it's just the impression I have of them.

[julianella]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Julia, I'm going to try one more time.

I'm not talking about Beth's frivolous suit against Joran and Paulus.

I'm talking about the fact that Beth petitioned the court in Aruba for compensation in the amount of 50,000 Florins.

She didn't petition to have records made public, and she didn't petition for the opportunity to review any information ALE or the prosecution might have.

She petitioned to be compensated in the amount of 50,000 Florins, cash.

How is that not about money?

Ok I was referring to the suit. May I ask what info there is about the Aruba $$? Is there a link I can read about it? What were the terms?

TIA

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

But it's not when you do it? OK.

okay

[julianella]

Originally posted by SukiJane


They may not have been too high if he would have been completely innocent of any wrongdoing and anteed up with the truth before an arrest was made. JMO

THere may have been no legal fees if there hadn't been so much lying going on!

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Why would a non-suspect try to mislead people?

Ah yes did she really mis lead people though?

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


As I asked you before, julia .... Why do you think they FILED this civil suit in the first place??

JMO

I answered it before to , IMO to gain information!

[julianella]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Was she misleading people when she said GVC punched Natalee?

ONLY MY ASSUMPTION HERE
No at first Beth thought is was Joran, then after talking to MBers about the situation she hears the "G" thing, then "G"VC is arrested, and was a t the club friday night, so I don't think is was misleading at all! imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Then you don't think it was Joran as all the witnesses said?

I thought the witnesses said it was "g"

[julianella]

Originally posted by redjetta


I think it is misleading when she used Jorans name in reference to what happened. She should have verified the stroy before stating it as fact.

imo

Per Laurus's link, she states it as the families perspective!

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


You know, julia .... sometimes you just totally LOSE me. I can't IMAGINE what it must have been like for the VDS family this past year plus. Can you imagine YOUR son being accused at every turn, of the horrendous crimes the Holloway/Twitty family has accused them of?? You think this is like a "walk in the park" for them. You thiink this has NOT disrupted their lives??

Your problem seems to be .... you think what the VDS family went through was a joke?? You think it was funny?? I can't even THINK what it would be like.

JMO

My laugh is sarcastic! I personally think it is sad that is is ok for PVDS to get money for ALL he went through, but yet Beth and family have gone through more and will continue to go through more, but is it an outrage for Beth to get money!

IMO

[dinojen]

Originally posted by julianella


My laugh is sarcastic! I personally think it is sad that is is ok for PVDS to get money for ALL he went through, but yet Beth and family have gone through more and will continue to go through more, but is it an outrage for Beth to get money!

IMO



Well you could look at it this way... Beth had a fund to work from, many of her stays in Aruba were comped..and we haven't even mentioned the time her fellow teachers gave up of their so she would continue to be paid... I could go on but I won't..sadly Dave didn't have all that available to him also...but that's another story.

Paulus on the other hand, lost his job, was being held in jail for something he was accused of that he had nothing to do with..the whole time his son is being crucified in the american media on a daily basis..doesn't make for good mental state to even attempt to work.

He deserves every florin he gets in my book....

Just as Natalee's dad Dave deserved help also... but...we know how that went..

Like I said last night.. there is no winner in any of this... all of their lives have been terribly disrupted and I don't think it's right to tally points as to who has had it worse.

Nothing compares to losing a child.. I admit that, but comparing the rest of it is wrong. There is no compensation for a lost loved one.

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by Unperson1984


Hindsight is always 20/20, but I don't believe that J2K realized how important it would become.

At first everyone in Aruba seemed to think Natalee would show up, as Jacobs said to Dave, "they always do."

:)

But it was important enough to have pow wow the next day and lawyer up.JMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by dinojen




Well you could look at it this way... Beth had a fund to work from, many of her stays in Aruba were comped..and we haven't even mentioned the time her fellow teachers gave up of their so she would continue to be paid... I could go on but I won't..sadly Dave didn't have all that available to him also...but that's another story.

Paulus on the other hand, lost his job, was being held in jail for something he was accused of that he had nothing to do with..the whole time his son is being crucified in the american media on a daily basis..doesn't make for good mental state to even attempt to work.

He deserves every florin he gets in my book....

Just as Natalee's dad Dave deserved help also... but...we know how that went..

Like I said last night.. there is no winner in any of this... all of their lives have been terribly disrupted and I don't think it's right to tally points as to who has had it worse.

Nothing compares to losing a child.. I admit that, but comparing the rest of it is wrong. There is no compensation for a lost loved one.

Beths fund was for searching, tips, and Natalee, IF she is going for this money, which I would still like a link on cause I never read it, then it is the same reason PVDS went for his, she has since left her job started a program which is non profit, to help others avoind going through what she went through.

Again I will say it is ok to PVDS to get PERSONAL cash, but it is not for beth and that is sad! She lost something here, not him! imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


Yes .... I think she is "misleading" school kids all across this country. Her "description" of this investigation is NOT based on factual evidence.

JMO

I disagree, and the simple fact is this is not mandatory, these "school kids" partents can decide whether or not they attend, and appearantly she is not doing to much wrong, as there are many people who support her iincluding parents of these "school kids", teachers, sherriffs....

And a lot of her speeches are done at colleges, in the evening... they were here at least!

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



And when she said Natalee never drank? And when she said Natalee would never willingly get in a car with strangers?

How is that misleading, not all parents know their children drink, and perhaps Beth never expected Natalee to get in a car willingly with three strangers. I personally think she got into a car willingly with ONE guy, not knowing they were friends.

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



Dontcha just love it? They hate the sites, call them evil, vile, disgusting and other names then repeatedly reference what is posted on them. :biggrin:

I hate jogging so I avoid it. I hate liver so I avoid eating it. I guess I'm just funny like that but I go out of my way to avoid things I hate.

Kinda like how a certain posters hates what Beth calls the suspects yet that poster posts it constantly......:o

Or when a poster constantly talks about the credibility of a mod on another site, and mentions it all the time....:eek:

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



Beth paid for her child to go on an all inclusive, alcohol included vacation. So her saying Natalee didn't drink wasn't true. Or do you think Beth just paid the extra cost just in case?

She also said, after it was known that Natalee went with the boys of her own accord, that Natalee would never do that. Not true. :rolleyes:

Just because alcohol was included does not mean Natalee had to drink? Nor does it mean Beth knew Natalee drank! Sorry.

Ever been to a wedding, those drinks are included, alcohol too, yet I can say there were plenty of people who didn't drink the alcohol.
:rolleyes: right back at ya!

[julianella]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
The only one I heard say "g" was Beth. MOO

Hmm I thought one of the students say that in the Jot T filing??

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down


I have no clue what you are trying to infer with your first sentence. Beth is open for discussion here.

That mod posted a fradulent document claiming it to be the original police statement of someone involved in this case on her site that was brought up over here by "pro" posters. She has no credibility. And what she did should have legal reprecussions. But I know I know....you don't see any differences.

:rolleyes:

Sure but you comment was that these sites are talked about all the time even though the ones talking don't like the sites, and my comment was that a certain poster doesn't like certain names Beth calls the suspects, yet that poster continues to quote them almost daily!

The site mod also corrected the document, funny how Joran is allowed to correct his mistakes, but when someone else does it, you won't let go... lol and posters say we need to get over the lies:rolleyes:

And what Joran did should have legal reprocussions, but everyone seems to think his reprocussions are to much....

imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



You are going to compare a wedding reception to a vacation? :rolleyes:

Beth paidextra money for the alcohol to be included. I don't know any parent that would 1) pay for their minor child to drink alcohol anywhere 2) pay for alcohol knowing their child wasn't going to drink it.

He alcohol included is alcohol included... Do you think everyone who goes on vacation all inclusive is going to drink? I don't think so!

Again just because she sent her on a trip where alcohol is included does not mean she KNEW Natalee drank!

What do you think of parents who take their child to a casion to join a tournament together?

imo

[SukiJane]

Originally posted by julianella


Kinda like how a certain posters hates what Beth calls the suspects yet that poster posts it constantly......:o

Or when a poster constantly talks about the credibility of a mod on another site, and mentions it all the time....:eek:

Or how some despise Beth, yet plan their day around one of her interviews, already deeming her not credible, so I find it interesting that they're actually looking for news on the case.

Or how some have become so obssessed with Beth that they check her website constantly looking for changes. Or peruse the internet for any news on her safe travel speeches.

Yep, I'd say it works both ways.

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



No my comment was about the ones who constantly complain about those sites then run over here to post what is said on them.

Joran spent three months in jail. How long should his sentence be Judge Julia?

Debbie posted a bogus document on her site most likely knowing it was bogus. After knowing it was bogus she continued to leave it posted.

Judge Julia I like that :D

Well considering he lied while in jail, I don't think his sentence was anything he was really worried about!

"most likely" so you don't know as fact, therefore you are ASSuming the same way your gripe about Beth for doing! And did she not post BOTH on there, and point out that one was false! Making a mountain out of a mole hill huh? imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by SukiJane


Or how some despise Beth, yet plan their day around one of her interviews, already deeming her not credible, so I find it interesting that they're actually looking for news on the case.

Or how some have become so obssessed with Beth that they check her website constantly looking for changes. Or peruse the internet for any news on her safe travel speeches.

Yep, I'd say it works both ways.

Yes it does, I agree totally!


-Judge Juli! :D

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down


I think I know what a couple are.

1 Saying she never called Joran a rapist and predator.

2 GVC and Natalee not knowing each other.

3 Saying the boys named the sg's.

4 Implying they had Natalee in the VDS home.

2 she said they may have crossed paths, didn't know how he was related to Natalees disappearance

3 Maybe they did

4 She said after they left the VDS home, didn't say they were in the home, just that they were there, which Joran has said too!

[julianella]

Originally posted by Watership Down



This really is going to be my last post to you. I get headaches trying to follow your "logic".

Anyone with an ounce of integrity would have pulled the bogus document. They would not have left it on the board for the world to see. But since you obviously see nothing wrong with it that speaks volumes.

Maybe if you didn't roll your eyes so much you head wouldn't hurt as bad! Just because I have a different opinion then yours!

Anyone with integrity would not lie about a missing girl and continue to do so even after they were arrested, but you continue to defend them...so where is the difference!

They left it on the board to show the differences, and perhaps show that the "translater" is the one who lied and to correct their mistakes... but again its ok for Joran to correct his mistakes but when someone else does it, look out!

[julianella]

Originally posted by paralegallin


I am curious to know if it was a tournament that different ages could join to play. I have seen tournaments like that in various gambling places.

:shrug:

Legal age to gamble is 18, according to the Joran defenders here he was a 17 year old child minor! Therefore illegal to gamble! imo

[julianella]

Originally posted by paralegallin


and once again I will say that perhaps it was a tournament that allowed younger particpants to play. Do we know for a fact that it wasn't a special event sort of thing? Was it for real money or just a tournament to play with winners and no cash prizes? Those things do happen.

MOO

Joran said it was a free tournament but you win a cash prize, now that tells me it was a regular tournament. he also said his father hates gambling but he talked his father into going to show him is was not so bad. (paraphrasing here)

So no mention of a father son day, no mention of special event, no mention of legal to let the illegal gamble day.

So how do you feel about that? Its not good for Beth to send her daughter to another country and pay for an alcohol included trip, but is it ok for a father to go with his son to gamble in a tournament?

Also wasn't Joran back in the casino the next night too?

IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


julia .... I'm not sure how many messageboards you've participated in, but I have to tell you .... you are a MASTER at this game .... you LITERALLY make me dizzy!!!

As has been mentioned a THOUSAND times, probably .... it's not a matter of "defending" Joran. I shouldn't speak for others, so I should say .... for ME .... it's not a matter of "defending" Joran. It's a matter of questioning whether or not he is involved in Natalee's disappearance. His lies have been acknowledged by EVERYONE .... That does not mean he kidnapped, raped, and probably murdered Natalee.

JMO

I have participated in two boards, this being one, and most of my time is here, I don't change my name, so I am sure we can guess what "other" board I am on, and if you are dizzy sit back and relax, as you spin also fair! But it is a matter that you speak your opinion and I respect it as your opinion I just debate it, which is why we are here right? Now if my posting bothers you there are two solution, one pass over it, or two ignore me!

The poster I commented to constantly rolls eyes, so I think perhaps that is why their head hurts.

Thanks for calling me a master at this, because I felt like I was just as clueless as you and everyone else speculating here. I post fact with link when I have them.

And again we are constantly eye rolled or laughed at for discussing the lies, which is a key FACT in this case, but when another poster does the same thing to someone not even involved in this case, a speculator just as you or I am, its ok? I find that hypocritical!

His lies are excused by some and one imperticular is claiming and speculating on "lies" of a Message board poster! When that poster has admitted the wrong thing was posted.

Can't people just admit that this goes BOTH ways instead of constantly claiming there is spinning, or washing machines involved? I guess not! Fair you are one of the "other side" posters I USED to enjoy posting with but as of late, I don't know if you are "playing the game" or what!

IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


WD .... I shouldn't try this, because I'm going to BUTCHER it .... lol .... but there is a Jewish word .... "menusha" ((IS that a Jewish word??)). Anyway, I LOVE that word .... because it SOUNDS just like what I THINK it is .... extra stuffffffffffffffff lol.

I find, THINKING about all that "extra stuff", instead of thinking about WHO is responsible for Natalee's disappearance .... is tiresome.

I KNOW I've probably misspelled that word .... MY interpretation for what it is might be wrong also . I'm sure I'll be corrected if it is.

JMO

Is that what Martin Lawrence says in Bad boys 2?

[julianella]

Originally posted by paralegallin


I don't believe I have ever said it wasn't good for Beth to send her daughter to another country and pay for the all you can drink trip. I believe, that is your battle with other posters.

I will say that I find that both sides have some points that seem a bit one sided, meaning that if it is good for their side but not good for the other side.

Both sides had young adults that were doing things that were illegal (joran drinking at 17, some mb students drinking at 17, joran gambling, some mb students drinking back in the states)

I feel that the casino should have stopped Joran from gambling at their place of business, they know the laws. Just as I feel that C&C's should have checked ID's for everyone involved.

moo

You are correct, it was other posters, Sorry Para, didn't mean to refer to you there!

I agree both sides have one sided comments, I definately agree with that. I know I do. i try to change them, but I am hard headed! BUT there are some things that I can look at from both sides, and I have openly on this board!

Yes they both did have drinking, gambling, but to strictly blame the parents is wrong, and that is the ONLY reason I bring up the PVDS and JVDS gambling trip! To make a point, that hey if you don't like the underage drinking trip how do you feel about the underage gambling trip.(not you, but you in general)!

And I agree C&C's and the casino maybe should have ID'ed or looked at wrist bands! IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


I don't know, julia .... it's just a word I chuckle at when I hear it. Like I said .... I'm not even sure of the meaning of it.

I assure you, I don't play games .... when I talked about the "messageboard game", I was speaking generally.

This case has been EXTREMELY interesting to me, from the beginning. I try to make my opinion known as best I can. I find it tragic that a girl is missing. I ALSO find it tragic that the girls mother has been able to CRUCIFY 3 individuals for what she THINKS they did to her daughter. I find it tragic she was able to file a frivolous civil suit for something which happened in a foreign country.

I've never ONCE said Joran et al didn't lie .... what I HAVE said constantly, is, to me, that doesn't mean they ARE responsible for Natalee's disappearance.

JMO

If you chuckle and it is the same word, see the movie, it is funny. I think he pronounced it musaw or something (I am not sure of the spelling) But the movie is hilarious.

Back on topic

I too have been hooked on this case, and in the beginning if you go back I didn't want to believe these boys were involved. But the more and more I hear, I keep going back to the saying if you have nothing to hide why would you try to hide something!

Do their lies MEAN they did those things to Natalee, NO I have said that, but do their lies make me become suspicious of the of their involvement in her disappearance, heck yeah! And that is why I stick with them, and Steve Cores! I feel they know more!

That is that!

IMO

[julianella]

Originally posted by TobyTiger


CTV says the "new development" in the Natalee Holloway case will be discussed on Catherine Crier today at 5:00pm ET/ 2:00pm PT

:hat:

Greta has something on her site about the suit on tonights show!

[treetime]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


julia .... I'm not sure how many messageboards you've participated in, but I have to tell you .... you are a MASTER at this game .... you LITERALLY make me dizzy!!!

As has been mentioned a THOUSAND times, probably .... it's not a matter of "defending" Joran. I shouldn't speak for others, so I should say .... for ME .... it's not a matter of "defending" Joran. It's a matter of questioning whether or not he is involved in Natalee's disappearance. His lies have been acknowledged by EVERYONE .... That does not mean he kidnapped, raped, and probably murdered Natalee.

JMO

JORAN acknowledged the LIES only after BEING BAGGED
with the LIES


BAD JORAN


:no:

[treetime]

Originally posted by candykisses


ABSOLUTELY TREE...

ME THINKS SOME ARE SO BLINDED BY THEIR DISTASTE FOR BETH, they can't see the forest for the TREES.:tongue:

candy kisses are VERY good :D

[treetime]

Originally posted by Freshwater
I've gotten some repsonses that posters prefer the one thread on NH because it contains the descussion. Do you agree? I'll open up a poll and let's here from you!! Since this forum has been an experiment we all may have reached the point where one thread really is enough. Cast your vote and let me know!!

Fresh

YES, i agree with you


i vote for ONE thread


unless people LEARN to get along we will all be in
ROUGH WATER



:cool: :biggrin:

[treetime]

Originally posted by TAYLOR FLADGATE


If the water is "cold enough" TREE'S can last for hundred's of years!:tongue:

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by TobyTiger

Thanks for the link, Luke.
OK, so what's going on in Ontario, Canada? Vacation? :D


Isn't that where her new web page designer is?? IIRC she was in Canada to have that done. I may be wrong though.

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by TobyTiger

That could be. I know Luke always changes location with whatever is going on with the case at the time! :D


LOL.... so true.... that guy moves around a lot....hope he has someone to pack for him.....I get tired just watching him move.


Safe one!

[court~critic1®]

Originally posted by TAYLOR FLADGATE


Montreal Quebec! moo

Then apparently she was MIA for a few days where she went to visit a N. Holloway! moo




tks! for the info.

:seeya:

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


julia .... I'm not sure how many messageboards you've participated in, but I have to tell you .... you are a MASTER at this game .... you LITERALLY make me dizzy!!!

As has been mentioned a THOUSAND times, probably .... it's not a matter of "defending" Joran. I shouldn't speak for others, so I should say .... for ME .... it's not a matter of "defending" Joran. It's a matter of questioning whether or not he is involved in Natalee's disappearance. His lies have been acknowledged by EVERYONE .... That does not mean he kidnapped, raped, and probably murdered Natalee.

JMO

Then what does it mean? what should ALL of Jorans lies mean to the public? and especially Natalee's family who has not seen their daughter alive since she was last seen in the company of Joran Van der Sloot?

I am so tired of reading that "Jorans lies have been acknowledged". Thats not good enough. Why did he have to lie in the first place? that's the question you seem to be avoiding. Why did he continue to lie for over a week while two innocent men sat in jail, and he continued to embellish his FALSE story about dropping Natalee Holloway off at her hotel? Joran Van der Sloot lied until he was caught in his lies.

But he didn't stop there, Joran Van der Sloot continued to lie after he was released from jail. There have been lists posted on various boards of his inconsistencies. And, I might add that Joran spent THREE MONTHS in jail. Which means there had to have been evidence enough to hold him there, and each time he went before the judge there had to be MORE evidence to keep him there.

The real question remains is why Joran Van der Sloot is walking free today when the judge ruled there WAS enough evidence to hold him, and later reversed his decision that SAME day, where did all that evidence go?

A few posters on here like to say how the Arubans support Joran, I wouldn't be so sure of that. In fact, I heard rumors he wasn't too popular in Holland either. Think about it, he is responsible for what has happened to Aruba and their tourism. His lies. And Natalee Holloway remains missing, no matter what you want to believe Joran Van der Sloot was the last person to see Natalee Holloway alive, and he LIED about where he left her, he lied for over a week. He implicated innocent people, that speaks volumes to me.

IMO

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
There was a nutty story that Natalee is in the phonebook and has been seen there.:biggrin:

Gosh, the rumors never stop do they?

IMO

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by Heyes


He!! yeah!

I'm right there with ya!

[cassidy]

Originally posted by fairmaiden


Believe this or not , candy .... It has nothing whatsoever to do with "distate for Beth". It's all about lack of evidence, for me.

JMO

The same is true for me.

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
From the Catherine Crier show, it looks like Joran is a suspect in name only. ALE is following other leads and sorry for their past tunnel vision.

Joran and his family were shown celbrating with friends.

MOO

Okay, sorry if this question sounds "out there", but what is being a "suspect in name only" mean? that sounds like something the ALE would say.

How else would you be a suspect? :confused:

ALE should be sorry, sorry for their poor excuse of an investigation, or lack of.

IMO

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Hopeintown


Okay, sorry if this question sounds "out there", but what is being a "suspect in name only" mean? that sounds like something the ALE would say.

How else would you be a suspect? :confused:

ALE should be sorry, sorry for their poor excuse of an investigation, or lack of.

IMO

I think it means that they have no evidence against him, only that he was the last known person to see Natalee. He is on the same level as all of the other suspects. That's just the way I am interpreting that statement. :shrug:

[dinojen]

Originally posted by cassidy


The same is true for me.


Ditto me too...

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Didn't you just say you "heard" a rumor Joran wasn't too popular in Holland?

Actually, what I heard was more than a "rumor" but I won't go into that now. :)

IMO

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
Being named a suspect means something but now it means nothing, it is just a name.

It might be comparable to a doctor who has no patients, he is still a doctor in name only.

MOO

Ahh, believe me, it still means something. ;)

IMO

[Hopeintown]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Do you think anyone will now stop calling him the "prime" suspect? A term ALE or the Aruban prosecutor never used.

NOPE

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Gregor's Back

Do you think anyone will now stop calling him the "prime" suspect? A term ALE or the Aruban prosecutor never used.

Doubt that will happen. But I think they were trying to get across that there is no PRIME suspect?

[bchand]

Originally posted by Luke Davis
There was a nutty story that Natalee is in the phonebook and has been seen there.:biggrin:

No no Luke, wasn't it Montreal? Supposedly, someone called the "N Holloway" listing and a young girl answered, speaking in French. Please, let's get our nutty stories correct ;)

[cassidy]

Originally posted by Hopeintown


Actually, what I heard was more than a "rumor" but I won't go into that now. :)

IMO Then it remains a rumor.