Ocillians & Local News [Archive] - Page 2 - Crime Library Message Boards

gacountry

07-28-2006, 03:26 PM

Originally posted by Results
Gacountry,

Lets set up a chat room .... no message boards. I will even let you open the chat up anywhere you want. Anyone you want to be in the debate invite and I will come alone. Let me ask questions and you answer honestly and you ask me questions and I will answer honestly. Let us debate and not attack. IF you want to make this debate worth something I would like to bring only 2 people with me. Your call. Debate or not? \

We had a great chat room at one time, I have been to several since and it is still not the same. Most of your friends on TT were there and we were all close, we could brainstrom, laugh, fight, cry and disagree but we stayed centered on the case. Some of us, like me, got left in the distruction the night the egos got in the way and we went poof. I tried to follow at their request when a new board started but it was never the same. Then insults started and peoples feelings were hurt. Friendships were lost.

I am on the Sar Chat now, and I post here and at CB. My post are mostly support for the family and the searchers. I don't think you will find anywhere that I have said MH or anyone else did anything. I am on the Sar Chat because of the founder of our chat RQ. He is well trained and trains people in Search and Rescue, most of the ones searching now were trained by him. We respect LE just know they are not searching, due to budget, manpower and other reasons.

I will not set up a chat but I would go into one if I thought it would do any good. I betcha a dollar to a doughnut I could guess the two you would bring in and I have in the past had the upmost respect in them both. I guess on the same principle I should choose two to bring in with me.

I do not think there will ever be discussions that are meanful anymore. To many hurt feeling, to much lack of thrust, to many agendas but I sure wish we could all get together and brainstorm like we use to.

Respectfully,
Gacountry

simply quiet

07-28-2006, 03:54 PM

Originally posted by Results

I give you my word of honor that you will not be attacked or called any names. You bring 2 with you and I will bring 2 with me. This can be a wonderful thing gacountry. It's time to stop losing friends and it's time to join together not to be hurtful but to accomplish something. I believe you are a good person and it is never too late to get together and brainstorm. If you will come I will set up a private chat invite you then we will invite your 2 people then I will invite my two people to be fair to you. That way you are not in that chatroom alone with any that I invite. I want it to be a good thing gacountry and I want to make it pleasant for all in that room. Will you please come?

Congratulations Results and GA.....this sounds like a great idea.

I would love to be able to read it, there is no need for me to chime in as I have no authentic info. Can there be a gallery for people to just read? I will understand if that can't be done, and it would have to be agreed upon by all partakers.

gacountry

07-28-2006, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by Results

I give you my word of honor that you will not be attacked or called any names. You bring 2 with you and I will bring 2 with me. This can be a wonderful thing gacountry. It's time to stop losing friends and it's time to join together not to be hurtful but to accomplish something. I believe you are a good person and it is never too late to get together and brainstorm. If you will come I will set up a private chat invite you then we will invite your 2 people then I will invite my two people to be fair to you. That way you are not in that chatroom alone with any that I invite. I want it to be a good thing gacountry and I want to make it pleasant for all in that room. Will you please come?

OK. Now I have "date night" tonight we take our 4 year old Granddaughter out to dinner(McDonalds) and shopping(toy dept Walmarts), lol. Weekends are hetic but get it together and give me a time. I will stay until respect and profanity starts, if this happens I am gone.

Thanks,
Gacountry

kebo

07-28-2006, 04:09 PM

Great Idea you 2!!! I hope it all comes together for ya'll.

Stay Tuned for Updates? (maybe?)

kebo

07-28-2006, 04:21 PM

Originally posted by Results

I think it will be a huge benefit for us. As far as the updates as long as the 6 people in that chat room agrees upon it.

Fair Enough!

gacountry

07-28-2006, 04:25 PM

Originally posted by Results

Fair enough. What about now or you tell me when you can. Also, LOL on toy dept that is cute. Thank you for agreeing gacountry it means alot to me. Tell me when your available and I will tell my 2 when.

OK I agree fair enough. I tried to edit my last post but my 5 minutes was up. I put "respect" when it should have been disrespect. I will stay as long as we can be respectful and not use profanity.
I think I am looking forward to this(???!??)
Gacountry

gacountry

07-28-2006, 05:23 PM

Originally posted by Gooch

We will see...

Gooch, you know I am proud of who I am, so I have no problem. Now let me get this Grand to Ole' MacDonalds.

Peace and Poof,
Gacountry

zorro

07-28-2006, 05:27 PM

I posted the following at Carla Baron:

“....these landowners having nothing to hide either. Here is the problem.

This is not an "official" search, there are no law enforcement people with them. They don't even ask permission, and BOOM......***** they found a piece of Tara's something or other on your land. Guess what? Now you are a target.

Or.....some sleuths figure out how to scope out a piece of property...lets tell the owners we are looking for Tara......guess what happens next?”

The excerpt above is from another board. I brought it here for two reasons. First the searches are being portrayed as haphazard and reckless invasions of private property. In addition, the intention and honesty of the searchers is being questioned. Second, the readers of Carla Baron’s forum deserve the truth. Readers on this site are trying to find information about Tara’s disappearance and investigation. They do not want lies and rumors about the family. To describe a search or its organization would be a waste of time on the other message boards.

The searches are organized weeks in advance to maintain their integrity. Locations are chosen based on tips and information the family has received. This information can come from several confidential sources. The area to be searched is identified at the local tax office. The contact information for the property owners is collected from public records at the tax office. The local land owners are then contacted in person. In some cases, the land owners have been contacted by telephone. Depending on the topography of the land and the searchers available to help, a date is set to search. The searchers are contacted and told of a time to meet to search. By the day of a search, the area is divided into grids to be searched on a local map. The areas where permission has not been granted are identified to the searchers. The searchers are often told what particular piece of information has led to this particular search. Items of particular interest are described. On this past search we were told of Tara's earrings, her purse and articles of possible clothing. If something is found then we are to mark the spot and notify the family. The family then returns with the searcher to the spot and a GPS reading and photographs are taken. Nothing is touched or examined. If the item is deemed of interest then the GBI is notified. At the end of the day a discussion is held about the thoroughness of the search. If the searchers feel an area merits a repeated search then a return search is scheduled. Often a return search will involve having an area checked by cadaver dogs. If an item found by a searcher has interested the GBI a written statement by the searcher is turned over to the GBI.
There have been occasions when land owners have denied access to their land but more often we are approached by adjacent land owners and told to search their land too. For the most part land owners have bent over backwards to help in searching for Tara. I find it very curious why certain posters on other boards are calling for an end to private searches. Why do they wish to stop the family from searching for Tara? Why should the family be denied the opportunity to look for answers? Should the family be prevented from laying Tara’s body to rest? Dr. Godwin, Carla Baron and Law Enforcement are working hard for answers. If the family was putting the investigation at risk then wouldn’t the GBI step in and stop the searches?

BikerBabe

07-28-2006, 05:29 PM

I can set up a channel in my IRC network for a chat for everyone if it's needed. Let me know if this would help. It's not affilated with this case or anyone involved in it, so would be impartial. We do have a java client attached to the network's website for those that don't want to download and install a true IRC program too.

BFD - v2.0

07-28-2006, 06:43 PM

Originally posted by zorro
*snipped*

If something is found then we are to mark the spot and notify the family. The family then returns with the searcher to the spot and a GPS reading and photographs are taken. Nothing is touched or examined. If the item is deemed of interest then the GBI is notified.

*snipped*

Whoa Nelly!!!

This goes beyond a red flag!, it's right up there with day flares being shot over a topic of interest.

Why in the world would the family be called and it be up to them to determine if something warrants law enforcement involvement?

That does not sound right at all. In fact, it sounds downright scary.

Let's hope there isn't a wolf in sheep's clothing. Because it sure smells that way.

TuscanDreams

07-28-2006, 06:43 PM

Originally posted by IrwinIndian
Was the lingerie and the rubber glove found by Dr. Godwin on one of these searches left untouched for LE to pick up? NO.
Was the "key" SUPPOSEDLY found by Marine Man and the metal detectors in Tara's yard left untouched? NOT ACCORDING TO THE POSTERS AT CARLA BARON'S SITE.
Shall we go on and on?
I noticed you mentioned searchers may find something then call "the family" to look at it before calling LE. Why is that? Who is "the family"? Why should Larry or Anita Gattis have to "clear" something before LE is called? This is very odd to me.

I haven't been to that site, but I will say this:

In a court hearing today, (I'm just a parole officer- a peon, who happened to be in court) a Judge threw out evidence in a drug trafficking case~ because the chain of evidence was broken. In that case, the police officer had placed the evidence in his pocket. Yes, he knows better but he's human like the rest of us. What concerns me about people searching for Tara is that the chain of evidence could be tossed out if the searcher does not follow the rules of evidence.

I mean, if a police officer can make that mistake, a searcher could as well. I'm all for people pitching in and searching for Tara (and other missing people) but I want them to at the minimum have a brief training with LE.

As Concerned Mom noted previously, that chain HAS to be maintained or the evidence collected gets thrown out.

grandline

07-28-2006, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by IrwinIndian
Carla Baron is working hard for answers? I thought her show already aired.

Someone up there said the searchers were trained by an RQ. What is an RQ?

RQ is a K-9 handler and he hosts the SAR chat.

concernedperson

07-28-2006, 07:37 PM

Originally posted by grandline

RQ is a K-9 handler and he hosts the SAR chat.

But isnt he in the Dakota's somewhere. Not on the ground in Irwin County I feel sure. He is also good with computers..as I have been witness too.

grandline

07-28-2006, 07:40 PM

Originally posted by concernedperson

But isnt he in the Dakota's somewhere. Not on the ground in Irwin County I feel sure. He is also good with computers..as I have been witness too.

Yep, pretty sure he's in South Dakota. I don't know how many times he has come to GA or if he has been down recently though.

He has a website for SAR that is linked to the SAR chat but I do not have that link. I'm sure someone on board here could provide it if anyone is interested in looking further into this.

concernedperson

07-28-2006, 07:52 PM

Originally posted by grandline

Yep, pretty sure he's in South Dakota. I don't know how many times he has come to GA or if he has been down recently though.

He has a website for SAR that is linked to the SAR chat but I do not have that link. I'm sure someone on board here could provide it if anyone is interested in looking further into this.

I have it. www.sar-info.com/. But, my ip is banned. They don't like me over there as Godwin doesn't like my questions nor my absence of adulation. Hey, we all do what we have too. Somewhere in this chit is Tara. This is why we are here...not any of the secondary players.

mooloo

07-28-2006, 08:07 PM

I still say in these litigious times (is that even close?), landowners should be sure all their bases are covered before allowing searches on the property.

Originally posted by Gooch

IMO NO LE...NO Search... If an area has a good reason to be searched then LE will surly accompany you. If there is not good enough reason for LE to go then not enough reason for anyone else to go.. JMHO

simply quiet

07-28-2006, 09:07 PM

BFD - v2.0

07-28-2006, 09:46 PM

Originally posted by IrwinIndian
Zorro posts this where no one can reply on the Baron site. What a strange thing to do instead of answering questions here. He takes issue with BFD apparently. Truth must be what he types without any questions? And I guess because family conducts searches they overrule LE as to what is important, if found. I call that suspicious controlling conduct IMO. Guess we're just idiots. LOL

"LOL - you aught'a see them at CTV!!! They have completely lost any semblance of sanity! I asked for it, didn't I. The first post on CTV that contained nothing but pure facts and information on something they asked about and they are picking it a part line for line. They've gotten so used to being caught up in rumors and blatant lies that they don't even recognize what truth looks like. I don't even think truth could slap them in the face and they wouldn't even notice. Sad. Of course it's the same 5 or 6 folks.
My favorite - one poster said "whoa nelly" - LOL, "why is the family called to determine if something should be looked at" - LOL. For anyone who is actually keeping up: THEIR THE ONE'S CONDUCTING THE SEARCHES. Everyone has very clear instructions on what to do at a search. I'm not going to try to explain it anymore on CTV. Those idiots are a lost cause.
I will say one last thing regarding the searches. The proper authorities are aware of any and all searches."

Pshaw.... anytime anybody would like to debate the issues and/or how things should be done in a legal framework to make sure any possible future prosecution is not tainted, I'll be more than happy to do so.

People don't like my way of saying it like it is. I don't sugarcoat crap. As I often say, "it is what it is".

Doesn't it seem strange people say that a psychic's forum is allegedly the platform for "truth"? In my opinion that's about as contradictory as one can get since the whole profession is centered around conning a victim.

And furthermore... maybe we might understand the "truth" if it wasn't kept in "secret PM's". If it's the "truth", there is no need to hide it.

In fact, their version of "truth" would allow resolution much faster if they did just announce it. Because if they have anything that points to anyone... lay it out and see what happens. If the person they believe is the guilty party makes a bolt for the border after the release of this fantastic evidence... then they've got consciousness of guilt to hand a DA along with the rest of the evidence.

If their suspect doesn't make a run for it, then it will allow everyone else a clear insight into their "truth" and they might get more people to assist them in getting "justice for Tara".

mooloo

07-28-2006, 10:15 PM

ooooh, II...now you have done the ultimate sin...COPIED AND PASTED!!! The Fluffies will tar and feather you. WAIT. Is that like cutting and pasting---tarring and feathering.

Originally posted by IrwinIndian
Zorro posts this where no one can reply on the Baron site. What a strange thing to do instead of answering questions here. He takes issue with BFD apparently. Truth must be what he types without any questions? And I guess because family conducts searches they overrule LE as to what is important, if found. I call that suspicious controlling conduct IMO. Guess we're just idiots. LOL

"LOL - you aught'a see them at CTV!!! They have completely lost any semblance of sanity! I asked for it, didn't I. The first post on CTV that contained nothing but pure facts and information on something they asked about and they are picking it a part line for line. They've gotten so used to being caught up in rumors and blatant lies that they don't even recognize what truth looks like. I don't even think truth could slap them in the face and they wouldn't even notice. Sad. Of course it's the same 5 or 6 folks.
My favorite - one poster said "whoa nelly" - LOL, "why is the family called to determine if something should be looked at" - LOL. For anyone who is actually keeping up: THEIR THE ONE'S CONDUCTING THE SEARCHES. Everyone has very clear instructions on what to do at a search. I'm not going to try to explain it anymore on CTV. Those idiots are a lost cause.
I will say one last thing regarding the searches. The proper authorities are aware of any and all searches."

concernedperson

07-28-2006, 11:01 PM

Zorro. do you even know what the truth is?

gacountry

07-29-2006, 12:06 AM

concernedperson, this is a prime example why no one that is involved bothers with you'all. You do not want info that is real and happening when rumors and dreams are more interesting to you, Zorro was kind enought to give you all the inside truth of what and how the searches come about. He would have been the one that could have offered much insight~~~~but you all did not want it. I have seen that happen over and over. You cry for locals or searchers or family to come on and just share. Well you see what happens. Then if we presist to try and get you to see we become some sort of ignorant hick that can't tie our own shoes.

lighthousedazy

07-29-2006, 12:57 AM

Originally posted by guitarstring
Ok. I get it that LE is not searching anymore for evidence, but what I don't get is WHY, if searchers find ANYTHING suspected of possibly belonging to Tara, or even remotely RESEMBLES anything of Tara's.....why is the FAMILY called first to pick and choose what is WORTHY of a call to LE to say they may have found something? This is a LOUD message:

IMO, it can only mean one of two things:

1)someone in the family wants to be the first to know and the first to compromise something, if found.....

OR>>>>>2) the family feels a member of LE is involved and they don't trust anyone who may be close with this LE person, or anyone who may try to cover his tracks for him?

Does this make any sense at all to anyone else? No it's very hard to make any sense out of it. Maybe it's time for the feds to get involved, or maybe they have been all along, or maybe even the marshals . jmo

luvmy2labpups

07-29-2006, 01:03 AM

Oh goodness, Zorro, your post left me with more questions then answers. I am glad you posted what your procedure is, it makes me more firm in the belief that landowners should contact LE the moment any of the "searchers" approach them and request a search. The landowners should make it VERY clear that LAW ENFORCEMENT is welcome to do a search. I find it very disturbing that THE FAMILY is called if anything is found. That is just not right. Why would the family feel they have the right to determine, muchless feel that they are qualified to determine what is and is not worthy of contacting the GBI or any other LE. If anything, I hope your post cleared up exactly why LAW ENFORCEMENT should be the ones doing the search.

simply quiet

07-29-2006, 08:16 AM

This particular recent search is what most of this conversation is supposed to be about.

It happened on/near Snappdragon Road, and I believe it is a follow up on the Carla Baron show. Surely Carla knows to contact LE, in fact her show tells us that her team discusses the results of their work with LE. I would have thought Carla would have made sure a member of LE was there.

The problem with this particular search was that the landowners were not notified, as we were informed by a relative, which led to a conversation about the problems with such searches.

Somehow this conversation took a turn to say GBI and LE will no longer search, people have things to hide etc. Lets make it clear what we are talking about here, a particular search or searches in general.

gacountry

07-29-2006, 09:04 AM

Originally posted by simply quiet
This particular recent search is what most of this conversation is supposed to be about.

It happened on/near Snappdragon Road, and I believe it is a follow up on the Carla Baron show. Surely Carla knows to contact LE, in fact her show tells us that her team discusses the results of their work with LE. I would have thought Carla would have made sure a member of LE was there.

The problem with this particular search was that the landowners were not notified, as we were informed by a relative, which led to a conversation about the problems with such searches.

Somehow this conversation took a turn to say GBI and LE will no longer search, people have things to hide etc. Lets make it clear what we are talking about here, a particular search or searches in general.

I know this will do NO good at all but I have to respond. This search DID have landowners permission, in fact they called to ask their land be searched, the only area that did not give permission was a tiny area around the property owned by the family of a person we all know. We had to go by a PUBLIC county maintained road to get to the property of the neighbor that wanted THEIR land searched. This is when our local sheriff decided to protect the dust that was made at this persons house instead of Tara searchers. I am sure land owners names could be given but why search for TRUTH when folly is so much more fun.

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 09:11 AM

Originally posted by gacountry

I know this will do NO good at all but I have to respond. This search DID have landowners permission, in fact they called to ask their land be searched, the only area that did not give permission was a tiny area around the property owned by the family of a person we all know. We had to go by a PUBLIC county maintained road to get to the property of the neighbor that wanted THEIR land searched. This is when our local sheriff decided to protect the dust that was made at this persons house instead of Tara searchers. I am sure land owners names could be given but why search for TRUTH when folly is so much more fun.

It would seem by your post that you were at this particular search and that you're stating the Sheriff's office responded in some manner.

Perhaps you can tell us exactly what the representative of the Sheriff's Department told you.

I think it would clear up a lot of confusion.

simply quiet

07-29-2006, 09:17 AM

Originally posted by gacountry

I know this will do NO good at all but I have to respond. This search DID have landowners permission, in fact they called to ask their land be searched, the only area that did not give permission was a tiny area around the property owned by the family of a person we all know. We had to go by a PUBLIC county maintained road to get to the property of the neighbor that wanted THEIR land searched. This is when our local sheriff decided to protect the dust that was made at this persons house instead of Tara searchers. I am sure land owners names could be given but why search for TRUTH when folly is so much more fun.

Thank you clearing that up. Hopefully they will contact all landowners in the future to prevent any more misunderstandings.

gacountry

07-29-2006, 09:50 AM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

It would seem by your post that you were at this particular search and that you're stating the Sheriff's office responded in some manner.

Perhaps you can tell us exactly what the representative of the Sheriff's Department told you.

I think it would clear up a lot of confusion.

It would seem by your post that you were at this particular search and that you're stating the Sheriff's office responded in some manner.

Yes I was there. Our sheriff that WAS ELECTED sent his deputy to Protect a family sitting on a carport. The only reason we could see was to fan the dust, from the COUNTY MAINTAINED road, off them when we went past.
Before I got back to my house after the search I heard a warrant was to be taken out on us by this well protected family. I called the sheriffs office talked with him, told him my medications I would need while incarcerated and my dentist name since I had chipped a tooth. Needless to say he was very polite but my opinion of him has changed since this search. I feel we have good LE for the small things this community is use to but this WAS over their heads. Our Police Chief had the forethought to contact GBI at the first of this case with Tara, from there on it has been a mess.

Now as to exactly what the sheriff said I can't remember all of it. His office felt the one family from the community who no one was bothering should be protected above everyone else. So be it my opinion and my next vote was determined that day. And again I have no idea if this protected family had anything to do with Tara, but I do know No deputy, no sheriff, no family member came out and asked us anything.

Now I also know as far as my group of serchers we were very courteous of all landowners, we had a map of where we were to search, the center had written permission from these land owners, we were met by families that expressed their concern that LE was not searching, and some even asked if we could search their land. We told them to get in touch with the center or LE.

Where all this disrespect of searchers and landowners is coming from I have no idea, but I wish they would get their stories straight. I can say for a fact as an Irwin County land owner my
500 +acres on two different farms were NEVER searched by anyone but us. I know for a fact that the only search this entire area of the county has had was a fly-over and a group of 4-wheelers go though never going down a farm road and that is it. Some of our property has HWY 107 that leads to I-75 frontage, all wooded land some not fenced. BUT our local sheriff has done his job? I think not.

All My Opinion and I am awaiting the negative post I know I will get back,
Gacountry

luvmy2labpups

07-29-2006, 09:51 AM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone
What Law Enforcement? That is the biggest disconnect to me for this missing person case and I don't understand why any and all can't see what a confusing nightmare this family has had to deal with- not only is their loved one missing but LE has made it even tougher on this family! Show me anywhere where they have not - even the Mayor of Ocilla chimed in with his frustration in Jan.

Look at the facts- there are two tracts when a person vanishes - the search grid and the investigation.

Tara vanishes, the Ocilla Chief says "WAIT A MINUTE - TARA has ties to this department and SHERIFF's DEPARTMENT - Better call in GBI to take the LEAD -

BUT - the phone number even on the GBI website for Tara's case was and is the "nonemergency listed phone number" for the Ocilla Police Department, isn't it?

http://www.state.ga.us/gbi/missing/taragrinstead.html

(229)468-7494

TYPE IN THIS NUMBER at this site--

http://www.anywho.com/qry/wp_rl

WHAT IS THAT?

AND THE GBI has made it clear they DON'T SEARCH - they only follow leads... (that assumes there are leads AND THE GBI gets them, right?)

HOW can they when they did not or do not even list on their own site their own PHONE NUMBER? Do they expect people to call that Ocilla PD number and provide a tip? Is Agent Dominic Turner sitting there answering the nonemergency number at Ocilla PD, I somehow doubt it - BECAUSE I CALLED THAT NUMBER and I reached the most apathetic man who told me he had no no idea how to reach the GBI! Obviously NOT Agent Turner! Or anyone who was ready and willing to get someone to the GBI imo.

I wondered before and AFTER that conversation even more - Isn't that really reaching? Why would the GBI expect anyone to feel safe calling the local Ocilla PD where this case was concerned? If the Ocilla Chief felt it important enough to bring the GBI in right away, why wouldn't or didn't he or anyone else get a CLUE that others in the town might also see a conflict and be discouraged from calling in tips on that particular number? Over and over I have brought this up and over and over it is ignored. I think it is HUGELY relevant.
IMO -the investigation was set up really pecular and imo counterproductive.

And then there is the SEARCH ASPECT OF THIS CASE- since the GBI does not search, that work fell to the Sheriff's department. But there was a conflict or a perceived one between that department and Tara too, right? So how did that even really happen? Did the GBI clear a few officers right away to be handle this search? How did or do the townsfolk or anyone know this if it even occurred? There was/is only that one number, there was/is NO second one designated for searches. Or the named deputy who was supposedly in charge included in contact info. It was not until the searches were concluded before that deputy was interviewed or quoted right? The Sheriff's department searched between 10/25 and 11/9 and then stopped. Where and how did they decide to search? It is not like they have a great deal of experience with missing persons. There some some pockets of the US where there are literally body dumping areas... that was not the case here obviously. It was and is a rural terrain. In just a couple of weeks the Sheriff said DONE! Only if they got a tip would they search. But the tip line was/is for the Ocilla Police Department, right? The Sheriff also made a point saying they CLEARED the whole county. Doesn't that seem to hve been a extraordinary claim? And didn't it seem to contradict what the lead deputy in charge of searches said? The deputy in charge of the search to find Tara was quoted as saying looking for Tara was like looking for a needle in a haystack.

I find myself wondering did any tips reach the Sheriff's department? Did they reach the GBI? Fundamentally I found myself throughout this cas wondering if people ever felt comfortable trying to provide a tip? Or had any success in doing so?

How on earth did this family understand it all? Were they as confused as I have been? The trauma of dealing with a missing person is enough-- but add in all the extra hoops LE have dealt them...

I don't know what I would have done in their shoes.

I remain baffled how any person with any sense who is in goverment whether it was/is Tara's Federal Representatives or State representatives especially the Governor's office would not see the disconnect or possible problem a long long time ago... why they would just shuffle letters of concern to the GBI and not do any reasonable assessment infuriates me. At the very least I expected to see a change in phone numbers at some point to reflect that someone in authority reviewed the progress or lack there of , i. e. NO TARA.

But instead there appears to be this false expectation family members should be experts and infallable and LE should be allowed every excuse.

And now instructions by some on this board advising or suggesting folk that they contact LE to search their land and should not allow private searches to be conducted (while I fully appreciate the liability question and the chain of custody issue)

I think it is fair to ask anyone to be specific - many of the time we ask for links. Well in this case I really want to know what LE? Whom should these people be contacting? What number? What person?

Just MOO. of course.

:seeya: Matt I think you are confused and that's ok, the numbers have been listed over and over and over. I am sorry you have not been a success when trying to get ahold of them but if you have read any of the message boards including this one, the numbers are very clear. You assume that there is a conflict between the police department and Tara, we don't know with certainty that there was. A conflict between Tara and Le is different then a conflict of interest where Tara was close with many in LE and they wanted to do right by the case in contacting GBI getting someone in that has no small town connections.

There are no expectations of the family being experts, in fact, quite the contrary, I think many understand that they are NOT experts. Zorro's post made it VERY CLEAR, where the disconnect is and it doen't appear that it is coming from LE. When a searcher must contact the family if they find anything, and the family determines what is and is not worthy of bring it to the attention of the GBI then you have probelms, BIG PROBLEMS. It is not acceptable that the family should have expectations of LE yet skip right over LE and play lead detective when determining what is of evidentary value. Let's face it, if (BIG IF) something did happen to Tara and this would ever get to a court of law, anything found by this group would come under heavy scrutiny and possibly cause a trial judge to dismiss any case against a potential criminal. Now that's not really what I think is the case, because I think she is alive but if they think she is no longer alive, they are destroying day by day any potential chances of anybody receiving a FAIR TRIAL, muchless ANY TRIAL.

Now Matt, just to clarify for others who come here to read, THE GBI is in charge of Tara's disappearance, if you go to the GBI website, there are clearly contacts and numbers listed there, you can also go to findtara.com, there are contacts listed there, not to mention a whole host of other websites that have numbers to call. Then there is also the option of contacting the local LE for Ocilla, they will be more then happy to help you get going in the right direction. You shouldn't bad mouth LE and pretend that the LE has put anybody through hoops because you are confused and didn't get to where you needed. Please take care of your confusion and stop providing misinformation.

gacountry

07-29-2006, 12:30 PM

Originally posted by Results

That was a very christian thing to say? You proclaim to be a christian? :no:

I do not proclaim to be a Christian I AM a Christian. Gooch was my helper when I was over the District Cub Scouts amd yes I was glad to see him use the name Lord. Gooch is a good man, he was raised right and I believe he still has strong values and scruples. We just went in different directions over this case. We have had disagreements but I will always think of him as a friend. I will state I have not agreed with all he has done or said, but I am not a Judge, if any of us have done wrong we will account for it but not to one another.
Gacountry

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 12:41 PM

Originally posted by gacountry

It would seem by your post that you were at this particular search and that you're stating the Sheriff's office responded in some manner.

Yes I was there. Our sheriff that WAS ELECTED sent his deputy to Protect a family sitting on a carport. The only reason we could see was to fan the dust, from the COUNTY MAINTAINED road, off them when we went past.
Before I got back to my house after the search I heard a warrant was to be taken out on us by this well protected family. I called the sheriffs office talked with him, told him my medications I would need while incarcerated and my dentist name since I had chipped a tooth. Needless to say he was very polite but my opinion of him has changed since this search. I feel we have good LE for the small things this community is use to but this WAS over their heads. Our Police Chief had the forethought to contact GBI at the first of this case with Tara, from there on it has been a mess.

Now as to exactly what the sheriff said I can't remember all of it. His office felt the one family from the community who no one was bothering should be protected above everyone else. So be it my opinion and my next vote was determined that day. And again I have no idea if this protected family had anything to do with Tara, but I do know No deputy, no sheriff, no family member came out and asked us anything.

Now I also know as far as my group of serchers we were very courteous of all landowners, we had a map of where we were to search, the center had written permission from these land owners, we were met by families that expressed their concern that LE was not searching, and some even asked if we could search their land. We told them to get in touch with the center or LE.

Where all this disrespect of searchers and landowners is coming from I have no idea, but I wish they would get their stories straight. I can say for a fact as an Irwin County land owner my
500 +acres on two different farms were NEVER searched by anyone but us. I know for a fact that the only search this entire area of the county has had was a fly-over and a group of 4-wheelers go though never going down a farm road and that is it. Some of our property has HWY 107 that leads to I-75 frontage, all wooded land some not fenced. BUT our local sheriff has done his job? I think not.

All My Opinion and I am awaiting the negative post I know I will get back,
Gacountry

So, these people knew you were coming and were waiting out beside the road with a deputy?

Or was this an extended trip up and down the road over a course of time and the deputy finally showed up?

I also don't quite understand the part of "protecting the family". How were they "protecting them"? Did someone say something to them? Was there any type of harassment involved? Words exhanged? Menacing looks?

I just can't wrap my head around the idea that this deputy just happened to be sitting there while the searchers just happened to drive by on a public road. How long did it take to drive past this house?

I have no disrespect for people searching. I have disrespect for people that may taint a possible future court case because they want to play detective without the proper training or expertise. Now, if they have the proper training and expertise, my apologies. But what has been posted publicly by different searchers doesn't give that impression.

It further baffles me that the family is called to make a decision whether to contact law enforcement or not when something is found. Anita Gattis isn't going to have the slightest idea whether a particular piece of clothing or jewelry or what-not is going to belong to Tara. It's a nice excuse someone is trying to make... but when, prior to Tara going missing, did Anita take an inventory of Tara's possessions?

Does Anita or Larry Gattis have the proper forensic training to determine if something is of evidentiary value to the case? For some reason I get a feeling the answer will be no.

If Anita hadn't publicly stated that she already has her mind made up in regards to "who" harmed Tara (if she is indeed harmed in any manner) I might cut her some slack. But it gives the impression of impropriety when she needs to be consulted whether something is of evidentiary value or not. In other words, does she view it in the light that it could be connected to Marcus Harper or one of his alleged conspirators? And if not, is it then dismissed?

I'm sorry, but I do sense something terribly out of whack about how these searches are conducted and exactly what these searches are intended to find.

I personally don't think the searches are intended to find Tara. I think they're intended to find evidence. And if that is the case, it needs to be handled by the appropriate law enforcement personnel.

Of course, this is all just my opinion.

gacountry

07-29-2006, 01:12 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

So, these people knew you were coming and were waiting out beside the road with a deputy?

Or was this an extended trip up and down the road over a course of time and the deputy finally showed up?

I also don't quite understand the part of "protecting the family". How were they "protecting them"? Did someone say something to them? Was there any type of harassment involved? Words exhanged? Menacing looks?

I just can't wrap my head around the idea that this deputy just happened to be sitting there while the searchers just happened to drive by on a public road. How long did it take to drive past this house?

I have no disrespect for people searching. I have disrespect for people that may taint a possible future court case because they want to play detective without the proper training or expertise. Now, if they have the proper training and expertise, my apologies. But what has been posted publicly by different searchers doesn't give that impression.

It further baffles me that the family is called to make a decision whether to contact law enforcement or not when something is found. Anita Gattis isn't going to have the slightest idea whether a particular piece of clothing or jewelry or what-not is going to belong to Tara. It's a nice excuse someone is trying to make... but when, prior to Tara going missing, did Anita take an inventory of Tara's possessions?

Does Anita or Larry Gattis have the proper forensic training to determine if something is of evidentiary value to the case? For some reason I get a feeling the answer will be no.

If Anita hadn't publicly stated that she already has her mind made up in regards to "who" harmed Tara (if she is indeed harmed in any manner) I might cut her some slack. But it gives the impression of impropriety when she needs to be consulted whether something is of evidentiary value or not. In other words, does she view it in the light that it could be connected to Marcus Harper or one of his alleged conspirators? And if not, is it then dismissed?

I'm sorry, but I do sense something terribly out of whack about how these searches are conducted and exactly what these searches are intended to find.

I personally don't think the searches are intended to find Tara. I think they're intended to find evidence. And if that is the case, it needs to be handled by the appropriate law enforcement personnel.

Of course, this is all just my opinion. [B]

No way I will answer you and you runderstand Because you have made up your mind BUT once again I will

1. My search area was the woods and lower field of a land owners directly in front of the house of the people in question.
To get to this field we had to go by the house, well we could have gone 10 or so miles and came in the other way BUT who would have thought to do that?
We went by the house to the field road and down to the woods. When we left it was to go to another wooded area and we went back out by the house and down another road to get there. At the end of the day we again went by the house to get to the HWY to go back into Ocilla. This was our extent of riding a public county maintained road by this house.
2. I knew nothing about any problems until we went to the center and found that they were protected by a Deputy that I as a county tax payer pays salary.
3. The family is called to see IF the evidence or whatever we find to register its location and take a picture of it. I am of the understanding LE asked this be done when we search. LE has said numerous times about short manpower and budget is one reason for this ANOTHER is family would like a record of these to make sure LE is doing their job, can you blame them with the visable lack of LE feedback? Do you not see where a statement of some type has been needed for a long time by LE and GBI?
4. I do not know how much training or instruction the Gattis family has but I do know How hard they have worked to find Their sister, sister-in-law and Aunt.
I do know they have tried to work with LE and will even defend some of these officers now.
5. We would love to have the searches back like they were before, large numbers, LE support (very little but at least a little) and support by those that love
Tara____but just the kind of stuff that is posted here has killed all that.
6. It is a shame that no local or searcher or just general supporter of the fmily can post without redicule. Why is that? You don't even have to have a mindset of who did what, just voice an honest opinion about helping Tara in an auctual search and you are disrespected and hung out to dry. Why?

I know this is not all I wanted to say and I know what a load of bad response I will get but the truth is the truth and this is what happened that day with the group I was with. The next day Sunday, I had church and could not go what happened then I do not know.

Gacountry

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 01:34 PM

Originally posted by gacountry
[B]

No way I will answer you and you runderstand Because you have made up your mind BUT once again I will

1. My search area was the woods and lower field of a land owners directly in front of the house of the people in question.
To get to this field we had to go by the house, well we could have gone 10 or so miles and came in the other way BUT who would have thought to do that?
We went by the house to the field road and down to the woods. When we left it was to go to another wooded area and we went back out by the house and down another road to get there. At the end of the day we again went by the house to get to the HWY to go back into Ocilla. This was our extent of riding a public county maintained road by this house.
2. I knew nothing about any problems until we went to the center and found that they were protected by a Deputy that I as a county tax payer pays salary.
3. The family is called to see IF the evidence or whatever we find to register its location and take a picture of it. I am of the understanding LE asked this be done when we search. LE has said numerous times about short manpower and budget is one reason for this ANOTHER is family would like a record of these to make sure LE is doing their job, can you blame them with the visable lack of LE feedback? Do you not see where a statement of some type has been needed for a long time by LE and GBI?
4. I do not know how much training or instruction the Gattis family has but I do know How hard they have worked to find Their sister, sister-in-law and Aunt.
I do know they have tried to work with LE and will even defend some of these officers now.
5. We would love to have the searches back like they were before, large numbers, LE support (very little but at least a little) and support by those that love
Tara____but just the kind of stuff that is posted here has killed all that.
6. It is a shame that no local or searcher or just general supporter of the fmily can post without redicule. Why is that? You don't even have to have a mindset of who did what, just voice an honest opinion about helping Tara in an auctual search and you are disrespected and hung out to dry. Why?

I know this is not all I wanted to say and I know what a load of bad response I will get but the truth is the truth and this is what happened that day with the group I was with. The next day Sunday, I had church and could not go what happened then I do not know.

Gacountry

Thanks for responding... so it would seem I'm getting closer and closer to finding out what occurred.

So, you didn't actually see a deputy, you heard about all of this after you went back home and the search was over?

gacountry

07-29-2006, 02:00 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

Thanks for responding... so it would seem I'm getting closer and closer to finding out what occurred.

So, you didn't actually see a deputy, you heard about all of this after you went back home and the search was over?

Nope the person who lives in the house with the mother, passed us as we were leaving escorting a sheriffs car to the house. We did not know what was happening until we got to the center. Then I think it was a Monday when I found we were all being considered in an harassment suit, then I called the sheriff.

AGAIN I was not there on Sunday but a deputy did go to the house on Sat.
Let me state this is all what I saw when I was there, I did not talk with the family that lived in the house, the son or the duputy that was going there. I had no contact with the searchers on Sunday I was at church. I DID call the sheriff on Monday.

gacountry

07-29-2006, 02:12 PM

Originally posted by Results
gacountry,

#4. Why is it always the Gattis family?

Where is Tara's mom and dad in all this? Tell us the truth. I want to hear the truth. I'm listening to you.

OK Mrs. FAye Grinsted, Tara amnd Anita's mom, has been in very poor health even before this heartbreak entered her life. She was not able to be in any searches she was barely able to stand on her own. Her cancer reoccured after Taras disappearance, to my understanding she was admitted to the hospital this week. She also lost a brother and has another in very poor health. Should we contact her?
I talk with Connie and Billy just about everyweek, they live out of State and are involved. Connie has cancer and I think Billy has health problems. Should we contact them?

I have tried, this is not the first time I have tried to help some of you understand. Results I planned to go into a chat with you and two of your buds, if your attitude is as it has been today, Why should I?

I relayed to you where I was, what I did, what I saw, and what did I get?

I hope you other posters can see I tried.

Gacountry

gacountry

07-29-2006, 02:39 PM

Originally posted by Results

gacountry,

I asked questions that you have answers to. I asked a question about the family...did you let me respond before you jumped on me? I know that FG is in bad health. But, hey she was on that show Haunting Evidence and she just sat there not one word. You can't even imagine how that broke my heart to see her on that show. The public needs a plea from her parents. I'm sorry they are sick but can't a TV station or any type of show go to their house and let them plead for leads for their lovely daughter, Tara. Where have I disrespected you or cussed you, gacountry? That was the term of the debate in chat, was it not? Show me where I disrespected you and cussed you? I asked you questions. How are we going to debate without questions and answers?

I can't help you people, no matter what I say you try to twist it and make it suit your version. So be it. I tried. Now you all just have it your way but know I tried. I hope others will read this entire thread and see Tara searchers and supporters came here to help and once again we were shot down. Results try to find someone else to have fun with I will graciously decline. And Results no you did not cuss me but the respect thing is in guestion. Gacountry

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by gacountry

Nope the person who lives in the house with the mother, passed us as we were leaving escorting a sheriffs car to the house. We did not know what was happening until we got to the center. Then I think it was a Monday when I found we were all being considered in an harassment suit, then I called the sheriff.

AGAIN I was not there on Sunday but a deputy did go to the house on Sat.
Let me state this is all what I saw when I was there, I did not talk with the family that lived in the house, the son or the duputy that was going there. I had no contact with the searchers on Sunday I was at church. I DID call the sheriff on Monday.

Okay... I have to ask... who told you about a harassment charge?

Because you're stating you called the Sheriff's Department. They didn't contact you.

So, where did the information come from regarding harassment?

What did the representative at the Sheriff's Department tell you when you called? Did they say someone was going to press charges against you? And if so, what happened to those charges?

Or did the representative from the Sheriff's Department have any idea what you were talking about?

Doesn't the Sheriff's Department know how to get to this house? Why would they need an escort?

Did the Sheriff's Department call the search center and advise someone there what was going on? How did someone at the search center figure this out?

I'm wanting to make sure we don't have someone saying, "oh, they're probably going to charge us with harassment" in idle conversation regarding seeing a deputy... and it somehow grew out of that.

In other words, did at any point in time (that you're aware of) did a representative of the Sheriff's Department tell anyone to: leave the premises, that someone would be charged with harassment, or that they took issue with this particular search?

And if you didn't hear it; but someone else claims something like that was said; who was the person that allegedly heard it?

(I don't mean to sound like I'm giving you the third degree, but I'm used to questioning people about things and so far there are some gaps here that aren't quite making sense to me. If the searchers were harassed in any way by local law enforcement while searching on property that was okay'd by the owners to do so... then I think it needs to be investigated further. I'm trying to ascertain if that is what happened.)

gacountry

07-29-2006, 02:45 PM

Originally posted by Hey Paula

Hi Gaountry!

FWIW, your honesty, and the purity of your purpose in finding Tara, and learning what has become of her, shines through in your posts, IMO.

I want you, and all who love and search for Tara, to know that I fully support your efforts, and pray for a successful outcome. Each and every one of you have my respect, admiration and full support.

Thank you, I have tried so very hard to be honest and even to help others see and understand an actual search. I am honest when I say I do not know that MH did it. I hope and pray no one in Irwin county is guilty of anything. I admire our LE, some more than others after this case. I have said from the first that our LE was not prepared for this type thing and I admired them for getting GBI in at once. My only problem has been I support the family, and I will do this until I am proven wrong.

Again thanks for the support, I will more than likely sit back and just read now. I was willing to go into a chat but I think maybe you see why that would not be wise.

Respectfully,
Gcountry

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 02:50 PM

Originally posted by gacountry

Thank you, I have tried so very hard to be honest and even to help others see and understand an actual search. I am honest when I say I do not know that MH did it. I hope and pray no one in Irwin county is guilty of anything. I admire our LE, some more than others after this case. I have said from the first that our LE was not prepared for this type thing and I admired them for getting GBI in at once. My only problem has been I support the family, and I will do this until I am proven wrong.

Again thanks for the support, I will more than likely sit back and just read now. I was willing to go into a chat but I think maybe you see why that would not be wise.

Respectfully,
Gcountry

It is possible to support the family without having to agree with Anita's version of events.

simply quiet

07-29-2006, 03:33 PM

I have read this whole conversation and have yet to see anything disrespectful.

Perhaps we could leave this space for just BFD and Results and GA to hash this out, we all can just read for the time being.

Sound good?

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 04:01 PM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

*snipped*

That LONE number 229-468-7494 has always bugged me since it is a general nonemergency number for the Ocilla PD.

Why there was no dedicated number setup by the GBI, no number associated with this case that fed directly to their regional or headquarters

*snipped*

Laci Peterson's case didn't even get a "dedicated number". They used the same anonymous tipline they use for every other case in Modesto.

I don't know if the Ocilla PD has a dedicated tipline. If not, then it makes complete sense to give the non-emergency number to the PD, because they are the jurisdictional authority in this particular case.

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 04:08 PM

Originally posted by Hey Paula

Hi SQ! :seeya:

The ONLY (emphasis only) posters, who know how the searches are actually conducted, and the response and demeanor of LE, and the property owners, when they are conducted, are those who participate in them, themselves.

The ONLY (emphasis only) posters who know all the players, personally, and who are qualified to comment on their demeanor, are those who have come in direct and personal contact with them.

The searchers, from some of what I've read on this board, have come under much criticism and ridicule, which I find very upsetting, since they have given so much of themselves, in an effort to find Tara. They have chosen to take a proactive role, which most here have either chosen not to , or simply cannot, due to location and other constraints.

Regardless of our individual beliefs re this case, we should be unanimous in our support of the searches, and in their goal to "find" Tara, and/or learn her fate. LE has long decided to halt their searches of Tara. Does that mean those who love and care about her should accept that and not look for her themselves? Would any of us do that? I know I wouldn't, if I loved and/or cared about Tara.

IMO

The searchers have not come under ridicule. The methods have been ridiculed. The "tips" that lead to the searches have been ridiculed.

I've yet to see anyone ridicule a person for wanting to search for Tara.

Some of us have the ability to divorce behaviors from a person and judge the behaviors... not the person.

gacountry

07-29-2006, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

The searchers have not come under ridicule. The methods have been ridiculed. The "tips" that lead to the searches have been ridiculed.

I've yet to see anyone ridicule a person for wanting to search for Tara.

Some of us have the ability to divorce behaviors from a person and judge the behaviors... not the person.

Just a little question:
What do you directly KNOW about the tips OR the methods?
Where do you get your insight?

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 04:29 PM

Originally posted by gacountry

Just a little question:
What do you directly KNOW about the tips OR the methods?
Where do you get your insight?

Some of the methods have been posted on this forum and other forums.

Nothing secret about them.

So far as the tips... I will never know all of the tips (nor do I really want to), but there is no doubt some of the "tips" were Carla Baron's. I have "secret PM's" too. You just never know where I might show up.

And some of my insights into this case are from various sources. Some are locals that live there. Some are law enforcement. Some are media members. I have a wide pool of resources I use to get as much information as possible (from different angles) to be able to make an informed decision about different things going on in this case.

I refuse to use just one resource as my pool of information.

BFD - v2.0

07-29-2006, 04:33 PM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

Ocilla PD were not leading this INVESTIGATION per their own CHIEF BILLY HANCOCK.

THe GBI was leading it.

And the Senator representing that district as well as Mr McFarland with the GBI made that clear months later.

ALL along it was NOT the Ocilla PD - to avoid any conflict-

yet the only number was the Ocilla PD number.

I don't know waht life is like in Modesta, Ca. But did Lacy Peterson have ties to the Modesta PD department?

Did the Modesta Police Chief bring in within a few hours of the reported disappearance the California equivilent of the GBI?

apples and oranges, BFD.

IMO.

V:seeya:

No.

Yes.

Not apples and oranges in any way, shape or form.

If they created "dedicated tiplines" for every person that goes missing in this country, it would be a huge burden.

No matter if the GBI is called in or not... the Ocilla PD is the jurisdictional authority that handles the case. The GBI isn't going to "take over" the case. They are used as a support organization for local departments. They are there to "assist".

gacountry

07-29-2006, 05:01 PM

Originally posted by Results

This is where we are talking about GBI in town. Why didn't they go to the new Tara Comman Center instead of going to the old one? That apparently can't be answered by anyone or they either couldn't answer to protect the ongoing investigation. JMHO

You ever been to any of the Center locations? The first was at the Senior Center, lots of space inside and LOTS of parking space outside. The second was at the BOE's trailer at the old high School, small space inside but worlds of parking outside. The center is now on a side street downtown Ocilla. Divided offices spaces inside with several companies. NO parking space outside. Now go figure why they did not go there. Where would they park?

Take this for whatever you want. I have been to them all. When CUE came a month or so ago we barely had room to park our few cars. I walked about a block when I had to leave and come back later. Just a tad bit more of info from a local involved person.

gacountry

07-29-2006, 05:07 PM

Originally posted by Gooch

I knew it would not happen... Gave her an excuse...

Gooch,

Sorry to disappoint you. But as you always said what does it matter, I don't know anything anyway. I was going to already had my two lined up and ready but I saw today how it would be and I can better use my time sending cards to Mrs. Faye. Oh and baking cakes for the effort.

Peace and poof,
Gacountry

Lindsey

07-29-2006, 06:19 PM

I've been reading here for nearly an hour to try and catch up. I'm not local so I don't know much. But I do know this (I think).

The search that gacountry was talking about was not the last search that was done and I thought that's what this discussion, about landowners should contact LE if they are agreeable to having their property searched, was about.

The search that gacountry talked about in great detail (the one that she helped with) took place months ago. I believe it was March. The incident that was being discussed earlier in this thread about a neighbor of a landowner (on Snapdragon) sending the searchers away I believe took place this month; July.

Two separate incidents somehow got all mixed up into one during the course of this thread.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

JMO IMO MOO IMHO

concernedperson

07-29-2006, 07:18 PM

I am going to post this wthout my real name and address (which I am sure most of you understand)

Dear Ms............

Your recent correspondence to Governor Perdue regarding the disappearance of Tara Grinstead has been forwarded to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation for review. Please be advised that the GBI is vigorously pursuing any and all leads in this investigation just as we do in all cases.Please be aware that many of the investigative acts in an on-going CRIMINAL investigation cannot be publicly disclosed without jeopardizing the investigation.

Sincerely,

Kent E. Wilson
Deputy Director for Investigations

It is on GBI letterhead with the correct address.The envelope is also GBI with a real stamp and a real post office address. Georgia Bureau of Investigations, 3121 Panthersville Rd., Decatur, Georgia 30037-0808. Phone number 404 244-2535.

I added the emphasis on criminal. I would be glad to fax this letter to anyone who wants to verify the content and wording. Of course, I will white out my personal information.

concernedperson

07-29-2006, 07:51 PM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Hey Paula
[B]

Here's one:

I know you are a bright and sensitive poster. I am too. But I have also been subjected to a lot of personal harrassment which is uncalled for. I don't live in Ocilla. Nor Omaha. Nor Modesto. Nor many other places crimes occur. But,I still care and I will still call it as I see it.

Ths is the only case where my personal space has been invaded and there is truly no need. But, someone, has another agenda.

simply quiet

07-29-2006, 08:13 PM

Originally posted by Lindsey
I've been reading here for nearly an hour to try and catch up. I'm not local so I don't know much. But I do know this (I think).

The search that gacountry was talking about was not the last search that was done and I thought that's what this discussion, about landowners should contact LE if they are agreeable to having their property searched, was about.

The search that gacountry talked about in great detail (the one that she helped with) took place months ago. I believe it was March. The incident that was being discussed earlier in this thread about a neighbor of a landowner (on Snapdragon) sending the searchers away I believe took place this month; July.

Two separate incidents somehow got all mixed up into one during the course of this thread.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

JMO IMO MOO IMHO

TY Linds....hope we can get this cleared up.

concernedperson

07-29-2006, 08:14 PM

Originally posted by gacountry

Hey Paula,

This post from the CB site might be the reason for fsbiii response. I'm not him/her but I would imagine that this type of behaviour should not be tolerated anywhere for a missing persons case and now to find out a criminal case. Wonder how you would feel if they were talking about you that way? This is very disturbing to say the least. What is even more disturbing to me is that the post were not taken down. Yet they preach loud and clear that their quest is to finding Tara. How could they joke about killing luvpups? I'm telling you this is not funny this is scary. MHO

Did not see my name in any of that Results, did you? But the response from this poster used my name in his post? Why you reckon? [/B][/QUOTE]

Of course you should realize this isn't about you. It is about threats to luvs. Luvs and I don't always agree, in fact we are polar opposites but I would never consider taking my truck to run over her. It is appalling to see even in a joking way that this is a consideration.

fsbiii

07-29-2006, 08:14 PM

Please don't drag me into this crap, Hey Paula. I've tried my best to stay off this thread and let it ride for 2 days. There is a reason for everything I post, and usually it's a reaction to something that's untrue, an attack on me, or something stupid.

Keep on playing the games and leave me out of your back & forth, please.

fsbiii

07-29-2006, 08:21 PM

My post was to Hey Paula, not you Results.

She posted something I said days ago out of context without explaining the posts ahead of that one to show where it came from.

Predictable.

BFD said he didn't ridicule searchers, I never said that. When I am ridiculed, I can ridicule back.

Originally posted by Results

I'm sorry. I will not mention your name again please accept my apology.

concernedperson

07-29-2006, 08:37 PM

Originally posted by fsbiii
Do you know how many times I get "honestly it wasn't my intent to" (fill in the blank here for some crazy conduct)...

Your honesty doesn't bode well with me, Paula. I've heard about the aliases and the self-promoting posts...

Seen BroadwayJoe lately?

Based on my info, you might be the master of ceremonies for the games--not just a player.

Fiz, I know this poster. She ain't the master of ceremonies just a regular poster.It becomes a very hurtful scenario when we are attacted.She has been around since the word go.

Broadway Joe is a hurtful evil intended person and this is not Paula. It is J4T or Sassy or her husband. All with another dictate.

fsbiii

07-29-2006, 08:40 PM

Unfortunately, you are way off. This is me, always has been me. I've had 3 different people on CTV pm me saying you used to post with different handles to promote yourself and even admitted it on one board. 2 of the 3 weren't even posters on Tara's board either.

Just leave me alone and I'll ignore you. Deal?

Originally posted by Hey Paula

A post such as this, down to its very format, can only be authored by lm2lp. You are so recognizable behind your nics.

I'm pleased to hear I don't bode well with you. That is the greatest compliment you can pay me, as I would never wish to say or post anything you agree with.

You cannot debate. All you can do is hurl personal attacks.

concernedperson

07-29-2006, 08:47 PM

I just trust too much. I need to back away .

simply quiet

07-29-2006, 09:00 PM

Originally posted by concernedperson
I just trust too much. I need to back away .

I am with you about backing away. This thread has spiraled downhill since the earlier conversation with Results and GA.

concernedperson

07-29-2006, 09:38 PM

Originally posted by gacountry

Chin up, today has proved to me some can dish it out but they can't take it. And the truth is not wanted here. OK with me, but it sure makes me wonder who has the problem with that tunnel. You keep on Hey Paula your post or good and you seem sincere, they will bite you anyway and anywhere they can, Some even leave scars. Now to the others here get back to your dreams and rumors.

Get over yourself. You don't have the comprehension right now to understand what is going on.Everyone has called you on the search methods and the truth is what is being sought. Not platitudes for goodness sake. GBI is on this case and they are not going to search willy nilly everytime a request is made by the Gattis's.People should not be made culpable by unsubstantiated innuendo and especially in light of the fact that some have failed LDT's.This is an open case with no suspect but a lot of possibles.

luvmy2labpups

07-29-2006, 10:33 PM

Originally posted by Gooch

"The Truth... ?" They can't handle the truth! Nicholson can play me.... :lol:

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 10:49 AM

Originally posted by mooloo
Property owners have a lot of liability when strangers just wander around the land. What if....one of them climbs a fence, falls and breaks a leg or a back? What if.....one of them falls into an old, abandoned well? There are people just looking for an excuse to file a lawsuit and there are far too many attorneys (Call 1-800- ToGetPaid). I don't blame anyone for refusing strangers who want to search without an LE escort. They can tell LE why they want to search, if LE thinks it is reasonable and will accompany them, fine. Otherwise, nimby.

That's why reasonable people have insurance. In addition, it might not be a bad idea for a release from liability to be signed by the searchers. If they wanted to search bad enough, which apparently they do, they should have no problem signing a document of this sort. Wouldn't this solve the problems on BOTH sides? Otherwise, it DOES appear from what I've read here that someone is attempting to keep searchers away, for whatever reason, JMO.

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by zorro
I posted the following at Carla Baron:

“....these landowners having nothing to hide either. Here is the problem.

This is not an "official" search, there are no law enforcement people with them. They don't even ask permission, and BOOM......***** they found a piece of Tara's something or other on your land. Guess what? Now you are a target.

Or.....some sleuths figure out how to scope out a piece of property...lets tell the owners we are looking for Tara......guess what happens next?”

The excerpt above is from another board. I brought it here for two reasons. First the searches are being portrayed as haphazard and reckless invasions of private property. In addition, the intention and honesty of the searchers is being questioned. Second, the readers of Carla Baron’s forum deserve the truth. Readers on this site are trying to find information about Tara’s disappearance and investigation. They do not want lies and rumors about the family. To describe a search or its organization would be a waste of time on the other message boards.

The searches are organized weeks in advance to maintain their integrity. Locations are chosen based on tips and information the family has received. This information can come from several confidential sources. The area to be searched is identified at the local tax office. The contact information for the property owners is collected from public records at the tax office. The local land owners are then contacted in person. In some cases, the land owners have been contacted by telephone. Depending on the topography of the land and the searchers available to help, a date is set to search. The searchers are contacted and told of a time to meet to search. By the day of a search, the area is divided into grids to be searched on a local map. The areas where permission has not been granted are identified to the searchers. The searchers are often told what particular piece of information has led to this particular search. Items of particular interest are described. On this past search we were told of Tara's earrings, her purse and articles of possible clothing. If something is found then we are to mark the spot and notify the family. The family then returns with the searcher to the spot and a GPS reading and photographs are taken. Nothing is touched or examined. If the item is deemed of interest then the GBI is notified. At the end of the day a discussion is held about the thoroughness of the search. If the searchers feel an area merits a repeated search then a return search is scheduled. Often a return search will involve having an area checked by cadaver dogs. If an item found by a searcher has interested the GBI a written statement by the searcher is turned over to the GBI.
There have been occasions when land owners have denied access to their land but more often we are approached by adjacent land owners and told to search their land too. For the most part land owners have bent over backwards to help in searching for Tara. I find it very curious why certain posters on other boards are calling for an end to private searches. Why do they wish to stop the family from searching for Tara? Why should the family be denied the opportunity to look for answers? Should the family be prevented from laying Tara’s body to rest? Dr. Godwin, Carla Baron and Law Enforcement are working hard for answers. If the family was putting the investigation at risk then wouldn’t the GBI step in and stop the searches?

Excellent point!!!

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 11:19 AM

Originally posted by Results

I'm sorry guys. I sure did not have any intentions of this thread going downhill. What I really wanted was to be able to debate and try to wade through the bull crap and get some honesty going and make some headway to try to join together and work together as a team to the quest in finding Tara. I realize that I was a fool to believe that maybe I could make a difference and try to stop this hatred. I failed.
Don't stop, because I don't think you failed. We just need to get those 2 posters up there to stop arguing about whatever it is they are arguing about. Surprise! It doesn't appear to have anything to do with Tara Grinstead. I think your chat room idea is a good one, and I hope it comes to pass.

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 01:49 PM

Thank you Freshwater.
:)

gacountry

07-30-2006, 02:12 PM

I started back at the beginning reading this thread!!! There is three different topics at least in this thread so where do you start? I think the first part is from " anyone know "whats going on in Ocilla" then it went to "Ocillian" and then turned into the foodchain.

So what topic is the topic for the day?

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 02:21 PM

Originally posted by gacountry
I started back at the beginning reading this thread!!! There is three different topics at least in this thread so where do you start? I think the first part is from " anyone know "whats going on in Ocilla" then it went to "Ocillian" and then turned into the foodchain.

So what topic is the topic for the day?

That's anyone's guess gacountry. Anyone at all. LOL

So, IS there anything new going on in Ocilla? If so, fill us in. This case looks to be growing cold at a high rate of speed.

luvmy2labpups

07-30-2006, 03:22 PM

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
I wanted to address the searches that have been taking place.

I was told that in a recent search with ag & lg, one of the "message board" posters that assisted, was injured and had to be taken to the hospital.

A word of caution to you and your family members, by allowing a search by those who are not properly trained you open yourselves up to a liability, one that is not necessary. I know many of you have been extremely giving of yourselves, your time and have allowed this group to march all over town in an effort to be helpful, however, you should consider the dangers that come along with allowing untrained individuals on your property.

If I might make a suggestion, if someone approaches your land/property and requests to do a search, please contact LE and inform the "searchers" that LE is welcome to do a search. This way, you are still being helpful, but making sure that the appropriate, trained individuals are the ones doing the searching.

Please be cautious. :patriot: BUMPING for others who may not remember the topic of discussion.

luvmy2labpups

07-30-2006, 03:36 PM

Originally posted by Results

I'm with you on this one. Since a letter was written stating that this is a criminal case please have LE with you. Results, I don't necessarily think it is a criminal case but that more sounds like a standard response from someone who does not wish to answer any questions. However, I absolutely agree 100% that LAW ENFORCEMENT should be called the moment any landowner is approached by any "searcher" and again I feel that Ocillians should let the "searchers" know LAW ENFORCEMENT is welcome to do a search.

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 04:42 PM

gacountry

07-30-2006, 04:42 PM

I wish this was not the way it is but from where I have been the last few months of this search effort for Tara Grinstead this is how I see it.

Since everyone seems to think things are not being handled right, might I suggest YOU go to the trouble family has been forced to go to.

First you will need limitless funds to put into this effort. Then you could get in touch with LE and hear their story about budget and manpower, then call GBI and hear we do not do searches. Call your congressman and hear "OK we will get back with you".
Then you would have to determine where the search was to be by tips or even phychic tips that would have to be posted either to LE or to one of the tip lines. Expect critizism.
Then you would have to go about finding where this land is due to the fact that Irwin county farms and timberland can be divided so many ways per plat.
When you decide who the owner of this plat is you will have to get in touch with that land owner and get his permission.
Then comes getting searchers to give of their time to come many miles to search, knowing any accident or snakebite, or heat stroke will be that searchers responsibility. When you give your help and time freely to a purpose you feel strongly about, why would you not accept full responsibility for any accidents or harm that comes to you?
Then you need to have water, food and basic needs these searchers will need.
Then you would need to have digital cameras, gps equipment, flags etc to pin point any thing of interest you might find (This will be told to you by LE).
Then IF you find something you call LE and just sit in the heat and wait to see if LE shows up (this comment due to the above one about budget and manpower).
Then when your searchers get home tired, sweaty or freezing, you will have to console them when they read the boards about how these searches should be stopped.

This is just the minor things I can think of first hand~~~who want to plan and schedule the next search?

This post is not here to get anyone upset its just the cold hard facts.

All the above IMOO according to what I have seen and helped with in my small ways.
Gacountry

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 04:46 PM

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
Results, I don't necessarily think it is a criminal case but that more sounds like a standard response from someone who does not wish to answer any questions. However, I absolutely agree 100% that LAW ENFORCEMENT should be called the moment any landowner is approached by any "searcher" and again I feel that Ocillians should let the "searchers" know LAW ENFORCEMENT is welcome to do a search.

Ok, I have read the whole thread, as someone suggested. REF your post, isn't the problem that LE WON'T HELP with the searches?? If that's the problem, then what good would it do for land owners to call them?

luvmy2labpups

07-30-2006, 04:58 PM

Originally posted by BroadwayJoe

Ok, I have read the whole thread, as someone suggested. REF your post, isn't the problem that LE WON'T HELP with the searches?? If that's the problem, then what good would it do for land owners to call them? Call LE and ask them if they have denied this group help and if they say yes ask them why. If they say no, ask them why they think others are coming on a message board to post it. I don't believe for one minute that they have refused anybody help. As matter of fact, I believe LE along with the community has bent over backwards to accomodate LG & AG and have been met with nothing but a slap in the face for all their efforts. Even with that being said, I fully believe LE will do whatever is necessary, when necessary. If there was a tip called in and a search was needed they would do it. I have no doubt in my mind. However, family doesn't seem to be sharing tips with LE unless they determine that their search and items found were worthy of contacting the GBI....please see zorros post. How can you expect LE to get involved in tips they are unaware of?

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 05:00 PM

Originally posted by IrwinIndian
There is a possibility that these people would plant evidence too. Someone was once told to go to Marcus Harpers house and pretend to be a salesman and get a "soil sample" from his yard. There is a danger in allowing these people to run wild on your land especially if you are in the area they think is suspicious based on Carla Baron and John Olivers "psychic" thoughts. The search crew is not God and cannot play God no matter how bad they want to. If they dont want Local LE and GBI to know what they are doing ask yourself WHY NOT? Remember the lingerie supposedly found? Picked it up and gave it to LE. Tainted evidence. See how these private searches are filled with problems? Nevermind the liability issues. It is not right period.
Do you have links to support that info or is this something you just heard from someone else? Searches shouldn't be hindered based on rumor, IMO.

ipswitch

07-30-2006, 05:02 PM

Originally posted by BroadwayJoe

Ok, I have read the whole thread, as someone suggested. REF your post, isn't the problem that LE WON'T HELP with the searches?? If that's the problem, then what good would it do for land owners to call them?

Well, they certainly came out when searchers were searching the land next to one of the POI's. Ask anyone who was on the search near MH's land, and they can tell you, the sheriff came out and was on MH's mom's land making sure that no searchers went on it.

If they can come out for that, then they can come verify if something found is relevant to the case. IMHO

I'm not putting the Local LE down, but it seems a little odd that they would be out "protecting" someones land, but won't go out if there is a search that COULD be relevant.

But, I'm not from Irwin Co, I don't live there, so all of this is IMHO and all that.

(and FWIW, I don't think MH should be the main POI, IMO)

BFD - v2.0

07-30-2006, 05:02 PM

Originally posted by gacountry
I wish this was not the way it is but from where I have been the last few months of this search effort for Tara Grinstead this is how I see it.

Since everyone seems to think things are not being handled right, might I suggest YOU go to the trouble family has been forced to go to.

First you will need limitless funds to put into this effort. Then you could get in touch with LE and hear their story about budget and manpower, then call GBI and hear we do not do searches. Call your congressman and hear "OK we will get back with you".
Then you would have to determine where the search was to be by tips or even phychic tips that would have to be posted either to LE or to one of the tip lines. Expect critizism.
Then you would have to go about finding where this land is due to the fact that Irwin county farms and timberland can be divided so many ways per plat.
When you decide who the owner of this plat is you will have to get in touch with that land owner and get his permission.
Then comes getting searchers to give of their time to come many miles to search, knowing any accident or snakebite, or heat stroke will be that searchers responsibility. When you give your help and time freely to a purpose you feel strongly about, why would you not accept full responsibility for any accidents or harm that comes to you?
Then you need to have water, food and basic needs these searchers will need.
Then you would need to have digital cameras, gps equipment, flags etc to pin point any thing of interest you might find (This will be told to you by LE).
Then IF you find something you call LE and just sit in the heat and wait to see if LE shows up (this comment due to the above one about budget and manpower).
Then when your searchers get home tired, sweaty or freezing, you will have to console them when they read the boards about how these searches should be stopped.

This is just the minor things I can think of first hand~~~who want to plan and schedule the next search?

This post is not here to get anyone upset its just the cold hard facts.

All the above IMOO according to what I have seen and helped with in my small ways.
Gacountry

I will gladly organize searches that are deemed appropriate from credible leads and/or tips.

Just let me know when.

ipswitch

07-30-2006, 05:03 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

I will gladly organize searches that are deemed appropriate from credible leads and/or tips.

Just let me know when.

BFD, if you organize one, let me know when, I'll be up there to help!

luvmy2labpups

07-30-2006, 05:05 PM

Originally posted by gacountry
I wish this was not the way it is but from where I have been the last few months of this search effort for Tara Grinstead this is how I see it.

Since everyone seems to think things are not being handled right, might I suggest YOU go to the trouble family has been forced to go to.

First you will need limitless funds to put into this effort. Then you could get in touch with LE and hear their story about budget and manpower, then call GBI and hear we do not do searches. Call your congressman and hear "OK we will get back with you".
Then you would have to determine where the search was to be by tips or even phychic tips that would have to be posted either to LE or to one of the tip lines. Expect critizism.
Then you would have to go about finding where this land is due to the fact that Irwin county farms and timberland can be divided so many ways per plat.
When you decide who the owner of this plat is you will have to get in touch with that land owner and get his permission.
Then comes getting searchers to give of their time to come many miles to search, knowing any accident or snakebite, or heat stroke will be that searchers responsibility. When you give your help and time freely to a purpose you feel strongly about, why would you not accept full responsibility for any accidents or harm that comes to you?
Then you need to have water, food and basic needs these searchers will need.
Then you would need to have digital cameras, gps equipment, flags etc to pin point any thing of interest you might find (This will be told to you by LE).
Then IF you find something you call LE and just sit in the heat and wait to see if LE shows up (this comment due to the above one about budget and manpower).
Then when your searchers get home tired, sweaty or freezing, you will have to console them when they read the boards about how these searches should be stopped.

This is just the minor things I can think of first hand~~~who want to plan and schedule the next search?

This post is not here to get anyone upset its just the cold hard facts.

All the above IMOO according to what I have seen and helped with in my small ways.
Gacountry WHEW! :rolleyes: That is the most drama filled post I have read on this forum. CONSOLE the searchers when they read the message boards? OH MY! If they get that upset over a message board, perhaps they should be searching for medication rather then Tara.

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 05:07 PM

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
Call LE and ask them if they have denied this group help and if they say yes ask them why. If they say no, ask them why they think others are coming on a message board to post it. I don't believe for one minute that they have refused anybody help. As matter of fact, I believe LE along with the community has bent over backwards to accomodate LG & AG and have been met with nothing but a slap in the face for all their efforts. Even with that being said, I fully believe LE will do whatever is necessary, when necessary. If there was a tip called in and a search was needed they would do it. I have no doubt in my mind. However, family doesn't seem to be sharing tips with LE unless they determine that their search and items found were worthy of contacting the GBI....please see zorros post. How can you expect LE to get involved in tips they are unaware of?
I don't think LE would talk to me, a total stranger, from another state, about why they ARE or NOT helping with searches for Tara Grinstead. But I DO think a reporter should be put on this to find out why. It if IS true, and it does appear to be, then I would be interested as to the reasoning behind it. If the land owners have nothing to hide, then does LE have something to hide? I think that's a fair question, based on all of the posts here. And as far as "planted evidence" the other poster implied, I didn't realize they were looking for evidence exactly. It was my impression this is a search for a body? Or not?

luvmy2labpups

07-30-2006, 05:10 PM

Originally posted by BroadwayJoe

I don't think LE would talk to me, a total stranger, from another state, about why they ARE or NOT helping with searches for Tara Grinstead. But I DO think a reporter should be put on this to find out why. It if IS true, and it does appear to be, then I would be interested as to the reasoning behind it. If the land owners have nothing to hide, then does LE have something to hide? I think that's a fair question, based on all of the posts here. And as far as "planted evidence" the other poster implied, I didn't realize they were looking for evidence exactly. It was my impression this is a search for a body? Or not? I don't think anybody is hiding anything. I am sure they will verify or deny if they are still willing, capable and able to search for Tara. Give em a call.

ipswitch

07-30-2006, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
WHEW! :rolleyes: That is the most drama filled post I have read on this forum. CONSOLE the searchers when they read the message boards? OH MY! If they get that upset over a message board, perhaps they should be searching for medication rather then Tara.

luv,

When we were in a previous chat room, it was bantered about that (according to one of the searchers) the "ground" searchers and the "internet" searchers should have separate rooms, because those of us that hadn't been on the ground searching had no idea what they'd been thru.

I may not have been on any of the ground searches for Tara, but I have done my share of searching before for missing people. And that "suggestion" really ticked me off. BUT in the end they got what they wanted... most of the "ground searchers" went to Carla Baron's forum, and the others went to TalkTara.

ipswitch

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 05:11 PM

BFD - v2.0

07-30-2006, 05:11 PM

Originally posted by ipswitch

BFD, if you organize one, let me know when, I'll be up there to help!

I will glady work with anyone and lend my expertise to help search for Tara.

I will not search for evidence. I have enough training to know that I am not properly trained in recovering evidence.

But if anyone wants to search for Tara or her remains. I'll organize a search from any credible tip that could point us in that direction.

I'm sure I can gather quite a few people for a search in that manner.

And if they choose to allow me to help them, I thank you in advance for your offer ipswitch.

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 05:13 PM

Originally posted by Results

They will talk to you. Many posters who read my post know that I call people and ask things all the time and report back to this board and tell them what they said. Trust me you would be surprised what you will learn from the horses mouth. JMO

Okay, I'll give it a try.

luvmy2labpups

07-30-2006, 05:14 PM

Originally posted by ipswitch

luv,

When we were in a previous chat room, it was bantered about that (according to one of the searchers) the "ground" searchers and the "internet" searchers should have separate rooms, because those of us that hadn't been on the ground searching had no idea what they'd been thru.

I may not have been on any of the ground searches for Tara, but I have done my share of searching before for missing people. And that "suggestion" really ticked me off. BUT in the end they got what they wanted... most of the "ground searchers" went to Carla Baron's forum, and the others went to TalkTara.

ipswitch The strange thing is, they say everyone should help but they turn everyone away from helping, including telling others that their donations were not needed. Kinda strange to ask for help then refuse it if ya ask me.

ipswitch

07-30-2006, 05:15 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

I will glady work with anyone and lend my expertise to help search for Tara.

I will not search for evidence. I have enough training to know that I am not properly trained in recovering evidence.

But if anyone wants to search for Tara or her remains. I'll organize a search from any credible tip that could point us in that direction.

I'm sure I can gather quite a few people for a search in that manner.

And if they choose to allow me to help them, I thank you in advance for your offer ipswitch.

No problem BFD, I understand about the not searching for evidence. When I was in that area last week, I kept finding myself wondering, what would happen if I came across evidence or her remains, which LE would I call, and all that.

I have searched before for missing people, and it is hard work. I don't want anyone who has been searching to feel like I'm saying otherwise.

But BFD, I am right there with you if they choose to allow you to help, just give me time and place!

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 05:18 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

I will gladly organize searches that are deemed appropriate from credible leads and/or tips.

Just let me know when.

I thought they searched "grid by grid". Are you willing to search based on an area that's just never been searched for one reason or another? Or are you willing to help regardless? I think they would welcome this type of help, and maybe it would clear the air as well.

luvmy2labpups

07-30-2006, 05:22 PM

Originally posted by BroadwayJoe

Reading back, not very far at all, weren't you the poster that got very upset over something said on a message board concerning you? Is there a difference here? I don't see any. Let's not get this off topic AGAIN. I'm not a searcher, but they appear to be the most hard working of ALL involved. Give them a little respect. JMO. I thought it was disgusting and disgraceful YEP I SURE DID. If you can't see the difference in the two then you have a serious problem. Kinda reminds me of the stupid post the other poster made, ya know the one I am talking about right BROADWAY?

BFD - v2.0

07-30-2006, 06:10 PM

Originally posted by BroadwayJoe

I thought they searched "grid by grid". Are you willing to search based on an area that's just never been searched for one reason or another? Or are you willing to help regardless? I think they would welcome this type of help, and maybe it would clear the air as well.

I have conducted and managed grid searches in the past.

I will not search willy nilly because someone has a gut feeling.

Credible leads.

At this point it is pretty much impossible to search the entire county in a grid fashion. In fact, at this point it would be a complete waste of time. The first 72 hours would be the best time to do something like that. Ever enlarging the target circle.

I'm not sure what you mean by "clearing the air". But if I can act as an intermediary between the various factions of this case, then by all means I'll try to help clear the air.

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 07:08 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

I have conducted and managed grid searches in the past.

I will not search willy nilly because someone has a gut feeling.

Credible leads.

At this point it is pretty much impossible to search the entire county in a grid fashion. In fact, at this point it would be a complete waste of time. The first 72 hours would be the best time to do something like that. Ever enlarging the target circle.

I'm not sure what you mean by "clearing the air". But if I can act as an intermediary between the various factions of this case, then by all means I'll try to help clear the air.
So you WOULD or WOULD NOT help in a "grid search" if there were areas that had not been searched for one reason or another? I disagree that a grid search would be impossible. Why would it be impossible?

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 07:11 PM

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
I thought it was disgusting and disgraceful YEP I SURE DID. If you can't see the difference in the two then you have a serious problem. Kinda reminds me of the stupid post the other poster made, ya know the one I am talking about right BROADWAY?
Actually I DON'T know the post you are talking about but I do know you referenced that you were very upset about a post. I was comparing the fact that YOU were upset about a post, yet found it impossible that someone ELSE could be upset about a post. I was comparing apples to apples, that's all. Let's keep this on topic and not get personal. Thanks.

BroadwayJoe

07-30-2006, 07:14 PM

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
The strange thing is, they say everyone should help but they turn everyone away from helping, including telling others that their donations were not needed. Kinda strange to ask for help then refuse it if ya ask me.

Whose help and donations were turned away? And why, if you know?

BFD - v2.0

07-30-2006, 07:52 PM

Originally posted by BroadwayJoe

So you WOULD or WOULD NOT help in a "grid search" if there were areas that had not been searched for one reason or another? I disagree that a grid search would be impossible. Why would it be impossible?

Your question doesn't make sense.

The reason an area may not have been searched could be one of logistical reasons or legal reasons.

Logistically speaking a grid search of the entire county is impossible. Mainly because of the two reasons I just gave you.

The other reason is due to manpower.

Irwin County is 356 Sq Miles. Think about that, please. Not 356 acres. 356 square miles.

Now, imagine how long it takes to search one square mile in a grid pattern. Multiply that by 356.

Depending upon the sweep width and speed (mainly due to the terrain) it could easily take a team of 100 a complete day to complete a grid search of just one square mile. (And that's being extremely generous)

Now, do you see the logistical problem?

The other problem with a grid search at this time is lost evidence and/or tracks due to time.

In the first 72 hours you would have a better chance of seeing tire impressions on the ground, clothing or other items that looked as if they were freshly discarded and evidence of scavengers in the area.

At this point in time those things are gone. Long gone. If Tara is somewhere dead, she is bones. Most likely scattered about due to scavengers, the elements, etc.

When you change your target object's size, you've considerable changed the dynamics of sweep width and speed in a grid search.

When looking for small items, you need a much closer knit grid. Larger items you can get away with a larger pattern.

I have been on grid searches where we have been basically shoulder to shoulder looking for evidence. Of course that wouldn't be necessary in this case, but since this amount of time has elapsed, it would be darn near a shoulder to shoulder search looking for skeletal remains.

Now, if you can muster up a few thousand people and have them willing to work non-stop for about a month, you might be able to pull off a grid search of Irwin County. (Where terrain allows)

concernedperson

07-30-2006, 08:34 PM

Well, BFD, we better get cracking on good leads because south Georgia is a lot of territory to cover by grid or sweeping views for that matter.

The scope needs to be on everyone connected to Tara and their alibis for that weekend. The alibis need to checked throughly and the motivations as well. Then IF everyone can be checked to verifiable move out to sex offenders, burglars, peeping toms etc.

I still say it is someone close to Tara that she trusted enough. More than likely someone else is covering even if in a miniscule way. As in denial and no real knowledge.

TuscanDreams

07-30-2006, 10:44 PM

Have canine's ever searched for Tara? I don't remember hearing anything on that one way or the other.

zorro

07-30-2006, 11:18 PM

Originally posted by TuscanDreams
Have canine's ever searched for Tara? I don't remember hearing anything on that one way or the other.

Yes. Cadeaver and scent dogs have been used.
Article and Link

Cadaver Dogs Search for Missing Georgia Teacher
Updated: 11/2/2005
By Raymond Ruda
WMAZ
MACON, GA -- Irwin County Sheriff Donnie Youghn says cadaver dogs are searching ponds and the area around Tara Grinstead's home. This is the first time cadaver dogs were brought out.
Search and rescue crews are also searching the south part of the county from 129 to highway 90 on horse, foot, four-wheeler and by air.
It's been nine days of searching, hoping and waiting, but family members and friends of missing teacher Tara Grinstead still have no answers. The last time they saw Tara was Saturday, October 23 at a friend's home in Ocilla. Tara's originally from Hawkinsville...

http://www.angelsmissing.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=3802&st=15

zorro

07-31-2006, 12:00 AM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

Your question doesn't make sense.

The reason an area may not have been searched could be one of logistical reasons or legal reasons.

Logistically speaking a grid search of the entire county is impossible. Mainly because of the two reasons I just gave you.

The other reason is due to manpower.

Irwin County is 356 Sq Miles. Think about that, please. Not 356 acres. 356 square miles.

Now, imagine how long it takes to search one square mile in a grid pattern. Multiply that by 356.

Depending upon the sweep width and speed (mainly due to the terrain) it could easily take a team of 100 a complete day to complete a grid search of just one square mile. (And that's being extremely generous)

Now, do you see the logistical problem?

The other problem with a grid search at this time is lost evidence and/or tracks due to time.

In the first 72 hours you would have a better chance of seeing tire impressions on the ground, clothing or other items that looked as if they were freshly discarded and evidence of scavengers in the area.

At this point in time those things are gone. Long gone. If Tara is somewhere dead, she is bones. Most likely scattered about due to scavengers, the elements, etc.

When you change your target object's size, you've considerable changed the dynamics of sweep width and speed in a grid search.

When looking for small items, you need a much closer knit grid. Larger items you can get away with a larger pattern.

I have been on grid searches where we have been basically shoulder to shoulder looking for evidence. Of course that wouldn't be necessary in this case, but since this amount of time has elapsed, it would be darn near a shoulder to shoulder search looking for skeletal remains.

Now, if you can muster up a few thousand people and have them willing to work non-stop for about a month, you might be able to pull off a grid search of Irwin County. (Where terrain allows)

So it would take you about a month with a few thousand volunteers to cover the county? The Sheriff beat you. He was able to do it in 15 days with without having to use a few thousand volunteers:

Search for missing teacher completed in Irwin County
Nov. 08, 2005
By Tim Sturrock
TELEGRAPH STAFF WRITER
More than two weeks after they began, volunteers and public safety officials completed their land search of Irwin County on Tuesday for missing teacher Tara Grinstead, Ocilla police Chief Billy Hancock said.
"Essentially we are through unless we get any additional leads that would call us back," he said.

http://www.angelsmissing.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=3802&st=30

But wait, didn't Detective Morgan from the Irwin County Sheriff's Department tell us on Carla Baron's "Haunting Evidence" that they had covered the county at least twice?

Can anyone tell us how many deputies (full and part-time) work at the Irwin County Sheriff's Department? I have heard 5 or 6 full time (hearsay mind you). No idea how many part time.

So BFD how long would it have taken you to search the 227, 840 acres of Irwin County using 6 deputies and all your part-time help? Could you have done it twice by April?

BFD - v2.0

07-31-2006, 12:26 AM

Originally posted by zorro

So it would take you about a month with a few thousand volunteers to cover the county? The Sheriff beat you. He was able to do it in 15 days with without having to use a few thousand volunteers:

Search for missing teacher completed in Irwin County
Nov. 08, 2005
By Tim Sturrock
TELEGRAPH STAFF WRITER
More than two weeks after they began, volunteers and public safety officials completed their land search of Irwin County on Tuesday for missing teacher Tara Grinstead, Ocilla police Chief Billy Hancock said.
"Essentially we are through unless we get any additional leads that would call us back," he said.

http://www.angelsmissing.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=3802&st=30

But wait, didn't Detective Morgan from the Irwin County Sheriff's Department tell us on Carla Baron's "Haunting Evidence" that they had covered the county at least twice?

Can anyone tell us how many deputies (full and part-time) work at the Irwin County Sheriff's Department? I have heard 5 or 6 full time (hearsay mind you). No idea how many part time.

So BFD how long would it have taken you to search the 227, 840 acres of Irwin County using 6 deputies and all your part-time help? Could you have done it twice by April?

They're considering aerial sweeps as part of "searching".

If they were looking for a car, truck or house, I might understand their reasoning. But an aerial sweep while looking for a human with all of the swampland, standing timber, etc., not gonna cut it in my opinion.

The only positive I could see from the aerial sweep is if there were any backroads/fields recently traveled on. Any recent firepits or freshly dug earth.

But with the tree cover... hard to do. I've never been down to that part of Georgia, but is it mainly hardwoods? Is there a fair share of evergreens?

The question regarding how long it would take, isn't quite accurate. They had many volunteers also searching, not just the Irwin County Sheriff's Department by themselves.

But if I had an army of 100 people working grid searches, it would take at least a year to search the entire county looking for a target the size of a human body.

Think of it this way. A prone human body is basically 7.5 square feet. A square mile is 27,878,400 square feet.

Let's get it down to a more manageable size for us to understand. Something we can visualize.

Place a jellybean randomly in an NFL football field. That's close to the equivalent of searching one square mile. (And that's with smooth terrain, no coverage) Now let's place that jellybean in only one of 356 football fields. How long do you think it would take someone to find it?

And all of this is predicated on the belief that Tara's remains would even be in Irwin County. It's possible she's not in Irwin County at all.

Which is why I think it's important to follow up on credible leads.

zorro

07-31-2006, 12:51 AM

Let me try and address some issues that I have seen raised.

The GBI was called into assist on the investigation on the first day by Chief Billy Hancock of the Ocilla Police Department. The GBI has been leading the investigation since that time. The GBI does not organize searches.

I have been on searches in Irwin and Ben Hill Counties. I have been on searches organized by the Klass Foundation, Texas Equusearch and the Gattis family. Of all of the searches that I have attended, only one has had Law Enforcement accompany the searchers on the actual search. This was in Ben Hill County when a deputy was assigned to accompany the group. On the remainder of the searches, LE was available but not on the search. Sometimes LE would be patrolling the area, sometimes LE would assign a deputy to the command center and others LE was only a cell phone call away. I have seen Dr. Gattis speak to the GBI on the phone discussing something that has been found, so I know that Dr. Gattis stays in touch with the GBI on searches.
As simply defined as I can: A search is covering an assigned section of a grid. The area is covered by foot, four wheeler or boat. Basically you are looking for something that does not belong. The searchers are looking for something out of place. The searchers are not crime scene investigators or detectives or pretending to be such. The searchers are a set of eyes looking for something that stands out as unusual or unexpected.

The family is called because they are there searching, usually within several hundred yards. A Sheriff’s deputy may be 20 to 30 miles away on an emergency call. Any item that is found is reported to LE (for example: an item may be a shoe, a sock, a shopping bag or any item that one would not expect to find in the woods or anything the searcher feels is suspicious). Dr. Gattis will record the location on a GPS device and a picture of the item will be taken. If cadaver dogs are not available at that time, Dr. Gattis will lead a dog team back to that location when a team is available. No one is touching or handling anything. Anything suspicious is viewed at a distance. Mounds of dirt are often deemed as suspicious. Dr. Gattis has received instructions to mark the mounds, photograph the mounds, record the location of the mounds, have the dog teams check the mounds and then leave them alone until LE can investigate them. Very frequently bones are found. If bones are found who better to call than a practicing physician? In the 357 square miles of Irwin County, how many bones do you think will be found? If a practicing physician can identify bones as animal at the time of the search, then isn’t that better than calling a sheriffs deputy 20 miles away to come investigate? I think a practicing physician is qualified to make a decision as to whether a bone is animal or human. The items mentioned on the last search: the earrings, the purse and possible clothing were all items familiar to Anita. If items were found, wouldn’t the GBI ask Anita to try to identify them?

On each of the Gattis family searches, dog teams have been used to check anything found. These teams are approved through G.E.M.A. They are trained professionals. The handlers and the dogs are doing the real work.

Don’t you think that the searchers are aware that anything they find is going to fall under incredible scrutiny? The searchers are aware that anything they find may require a written statement to the GBI. Once again, if the GBI felt the searches were detrimental to an investigation or prosecution then wouldn’t the GBI put a stop to the searches?

benhill29

07-31-2006, 01:07 AM

Thank God for the GBI!
:rose: Always for Tara

benhill29

07-31-2006, 02:26 AM

I have been waiting patiently for justice to be served....but first we have to have some arrests made...then comes justice.
I feel sure we will all be happy fairly soon that we are well on our way to achieiving justice 4 tara.

:rose: Always for Tara

BFD - v2.0

07-31-2006, 09:21 AM

Originally posted by zorro
Let me try and address some issues that I have seen raised.

The GBI was called into assist on the investigation on the first day by Chief Billy Hancock of the Ocilla Police Department. The GBI has been leading the investigation since that time. The GBI does not organize searches.

I have been on searches in Irwin and Ben Hill Counties. I have been on searches organized by the Klass Foundation, Texas Equusearch and the Gattis family. Of all of the searches that I have attended, only one has had Law Enforcement accompany the searchers on the actual search. This was in Ben Hill County when a deputy was assigned to accompany the group. On the remainder of the searches, LE was available but not on the search. Sometimes LE would be patrolling the area, sometimes LE would assign a deputy to the command center and others LE was only a cell phone call away. I have seen Dr. Gattis speak to the GBI on the phone discussing something that has been found, so I know that Dr. Gattis stays in touch with the GBI on searches.
As simply defined as I can: A search is covering an assigned section of a grid. The area is covered by foot, four wheeler or boat. Basically you are looking for something that does not belong. The searchers are looking for something out of place. The searchers are not crime scene investigators or detectives or pretending to be such. The searchers are a set of eyes looking for something that stands out as unusual or unexpected.

The family is called because they are there searching, usually within several hundred yards. A Sheriff’s deputy may be 20 to 30 miles away on an emergency call. Any item that is found is reported to LE (for example: an item may be a shoe, a sock, a shopping bag or any item that one would not expect to find in the woods or anything the searcher feels is suspicious). Dr. Gattis will record the location on a GPS device and a picture of the item will be taken. If cadaver dogs are not available at that time, Dr. Gattis will lead a dog team back to that location when a team is available. No one is touching or handling anything. Anything suspicious is viewed at a distance. Mounds of dirt are often deemed as suspicious. Dr. Gattis has received instructions to mark the mounds, photograph the mounds, record the location of the mounds, have the dog teams check the mounds and then leave them alone until LE can investigate them. Very frequently bones are found. If bones are found who better to call than a practicing physician? In the 357 square miles of Irwin County, how many bones do you think will be found? If a practicing physician can identify bones as animal at the time of the search, then isn’t that better than calling a sheriffs deputy 20 miles away to come investigate? I think a practicing physician is qualified to make a decision as to whether a bone is animal or human. The items mentioned on the last search: the earrings, the purse and possible clothing were all items familiar to Anita. If items were found, wouldn’t the GBI ask Anita to try to identify them?

On each of the Gattis family searches, dog teams have been used to check anything found. These teams are approved through G.E.M.A. They are trained professionals. The handlers and the dogs are doing the real work.

Don’t you think that the searchers are aware that anything they find is going to fall under incredible scrutiny? The searchers are aware that anything they find may require a written statement to the GBI. Once again, if the GBI felt the searches were detrimental to an investigation or prosecution then wouldn’t the GBI put a stop to the searches?

I appreciate your post. But I need to ask a question to answer a question.

When was the last time Anita Gattis had been to Tara's home before Tara went missing? A month? 6 months? A year? 2 years?

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 09:40 AM

Zorro, I see a whole lot of dancing around in your post, can you answer one thing. Are you and Anita and Larry saying that if a CREDIBLE, REASONABLE, tip was called in to LE that they will not follow up on it?

benhill29

07-31-2006, 09:43 AM

It would depend on which branch of LE it was called into in my opinion. I am thankful for the fact that local LE is NOT IN CHARGE!
:rose: Always for Tara

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 10:28 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
It would depend on which branch of LE it was called into in my opinion. I am thankful for the fact that local LE is NOT IN CHARGE!
:rose: Always for Tara I don't believe for one minute that ANY branch of LE would ignore a CREDIBLE, REASONABLE TIP. Are you saying that you think they don't want to find Tara? If so, I think you are sadly mistaken. I saw your other post that something is coming "soon". This is a familiar tune that has been hummed for months now and have yet to see anything that even points in that direction. Heck, GBI even says there is no evidence of foul play.

hypnotized

07-31-2006, 10:35 AM

Nice to hear from you again....thought you were gone forever!

It would be nice to have some actual progress, much less an arrest!

Do you know something we don't know?

:)

benhill29

07-31-2006, 10:38 AM

Due to the fact that the GBI recognizes that not every one in LE is a good guy.....I am thankful that you haven't heard any thing that points in the direction of closure. I would not be back on this board if I didn't have it from reliable sources that within the next week news will be out and some of the guilty will at least be made public.
:rose: Always for Tara

benhill29

07-31-2006, 10:49 AM

but those who were recently "brought in" are probably hoping for closure soon too....I am sure that trip up the interstate for one of those was the longest trip.....Thank God for the GBI!

:rose: Always for Tara

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 10:49 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
Due to the fact that the GBI recognizes that not every one in LE is a good guy.....I am thankful that you haven't heard any thing that points in the direction of closure. I would not be back on this board if I didn't have it from reliable sources that within the next week news will be out and some of the guilty will at least be made public.
:rose: Always for Tara UMMMMM ok. I see where you are heading. Another "reliable" source. Pardon my lack of belief in your statement.

BFD - v2.0

07-31-2006, 10:55 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
Due to the fact that the GBI recognizes that not every one in LE is a good guy.....I am thankful that you haven't heard any thing that points in the direction of closure. I would not be back on this board if I didn't have it from reliable sources that within the next week news will be out and some of the guilty will at least be made public.
:rose: Always for Tara

I thought it was the FBI who were doing this? Isn't that what you posted a while back?

Maybe I'm thinking of someone else, but when I first started following this case, I thought it was you who said the FBI had become involved and that this would wind up as a federal court case?

fsbiii

07-31-2006, 10:58 AM

*Marking calendar for August 7th*

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 10:59 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
but those who were recently "brought in" are probably hoping for closure soon too....I am sure that trip up the interstate for one of those was the longest trip.....Thank God for the GBI!

:rose: Always for Tara Ok, benhill, these secret sources are tiresome. Have never panned out yet. Those who have seen this type of post numerous times are well aware and know enough to understand it has become a game for some. If they had anything they wouldn't need a week to arrest anybody.

benhill29

07-31-2006, 10:59 AM

that perhaps the FBI needed to become involved. Regardless of whether the GBI or FBI gets the job done, all that really matters at this point is that results are achieved.

:rose: Always for Tara

simply quiet

07-31-2006, 11:02 AM

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
Ok, benhill, these secret sources are tiresome. Have never panned out yet. Those who have seen this type of post numerous times are well aware and know enough to understand it has become a game for some. If they had anything they wouldn't need a week to arrest anybody.

And they sure wouldn't let "loose lips" here brag about it. IMO

fsbiii

07-31-2006, 11:02 AM

"I agree 100% with you Sassy. IMHO it has been a little over a week since the FBI became involved and thank goodness that they are here....wherever they may be."

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

I thought it was the FBI who were doing this? Isn't that what you posted a while back?

Maybe I'm thinking of someone else, but when I first started following this case, I thought it was you who said the FBI had become involved and that this would wind up as a federal court case?

benhill29

07-31-2006, 11:08 AM

than to come back on this board but that is ok because all those GBI vehicles scurrying all over town and "swabbing" mouths will surely help. I think it better to just wait patiently until next week rather than agitate those on this board who would rather this case remain in a stale-mate.

:rose: Always for Tara

fsbiii

07-31-2006, 11:09 AM

I agree.

Originally posted by benhill29
than to come back on this board but that is ok because all those GBI vehicles scurrying all over town and "swabbing" mouths will surely help. I think it better to just wait patiently until next week rather than agitate those on this board who would rather this case remain in a stale-mate.

:rose: Always for Tara

simply quiet

07-31-2006, 11:12 AM

shelock

07-31-2006, 11:12 AM

Ben,
I am so glad that you're back-I thought the perp got you or something. I'll be an optimist and hope for a happy ending - that Tara is okay.
:) :)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by benhill29
I have been waiting patiently for justice to be served....but first we have to have some arrests made...then comes justice.
I feel sure we will all be happy fairly soon that we are well on our way to achieiving justice 4 tara.

:rose: Always for Tara [/QUOTE

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 11:13 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
that perhaps the FBI needed to become involved. Regardless of whether the GBI or FBI gets the job done, all that really matters at this point is that results are achieved.

:rose: Always for Tara No you didn't, I just went back and read your post, you told sassy back in april that FBI was involved for about a week. Go back and read.

benhill29

07-31-2006, 11:21 AM

Originally posted by simply quiet

Next week??? You said it would be this week. :(

If you go back and read the post I stated within the next week.
:rose: Always for Tara

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 11:25 AM

Originally posted by simply quiet

And they sure wouldn't let "loose lips" here brag about it. IMO Yep

hypnotized

07-31-2006, 11:27 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
than to come back on this board but that is ok because all those GBI vehicles scurrying all over town and "swabbing" mouths will surely help. I think it better to just wait patiently until next week rather than agitate those on this board who would rather this case remain in a stale-mate.

:rose: Always for Tara

No one is hoping for a stale-mate...most are looking for some resolution at best, and at the least, some positive forward movement.

We have all be subjected to many empty promises from a variety of posters. By indicating that something will happen soon, it places your post in with a select group of posters who apparently want to be "in the know."

So, do you have a reputatible source? And is it the same source that led you to believe the FBI was involved?

I am glad to see you back because I do believe you were doing some sleuthing and you were sharing your first hand experiences early on....

benhill29

07-31-2006, 11:28 AM

Yes and Yes.
:rose: Always for Tara

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 11:30 AM

odette

07-31-2006, 11:35 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
Due to the fact that the GBI recognizes that not every one in LE is a good guy.....I am thankful that you haven't heard any thing that points in the direction of closure. I would not be back on this board if I didn't have it from reliable sources that within the next week news will be out and some of the guilty will at least be made public.
:rose: Always for Tara

You say "that within the next week news will be out and some of the guilty will at least be made public."

Yikes! How many are involved?

ipswitch

07-31-2006, 11:57 AM

Originally posted by fsbiii
*Marking calendar for August 7th*

Well, if something happens then, someone better call me... That's when I'm having surgery and will be offline!

But in all seriousness.... haven't we heard this a million times?? I mean, I thought for sure the week I was up there there would be some resolve, but there was none.

There have been many times we've heard this since the beginning, I think I'll just play the "wait and see" game... Unless we hear something from the GBI, LE, FBI, whatever, I'm still waiting impatiently. IMO, and all that jazz.

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 12:06 PM

Gather your troops - you know who you are!!!!

Next week it will all be VERY clear!!!

:D

benhill29

07-31-2006, 12:09 PM

You got that right....I am glad too!

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 12:12 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin

When did they say that? Take a gander at the many crime library articles and numerous other articles. You will find it.

BFD - v2.0

07-31-2006, 12:13 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin

When did they say that?

Thank goodness you're back.

Did you witness the alleged exchange between Marcus Harper and Tara?

Are you willing to testify before a grand jury about what you witnessed?

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 12:20 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin

if you cant give a link to something gbi said then maybe its something you just heard. I just asked when did they say it. If you know then you should post it unless you heard it somewhere or just made it up. I have posted the link numerous times, I am not going to do your research for you. It is very easily found. Don't be lazy.

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 12:22 PM

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 12:24 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin

why do you make fun of a poster who is trying to bring information to us? You should be glad someone is trying to bring information and maybe lead to Tara. I don't understand why you get angry about good news. "information" please, if you want to believe benhill then go for it. I am tired of the misinformation as are many others. I believe benhill has no more information then the man in the moon. As matter of fact, go back and do a search on benhill and you will see it for your self.

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 12:25 PM

But Mannequin, BenHill DIDN'T bring any information to the board. At ALL. Nothing...

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 12:26 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin

I see you dont want to post a link so I guess its something made up. I dont want to go looking for something that might not be there. Thank you anyway. Are you really that lazy? I even told you where to look. Sheesh! If you wish to stay uninformed so be it.

zorro

07-31-2006, 12:34 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

Thank goodness you're back.

Did you witness the alleged exchange between Marcus Harper and Tara?

Are you willing to testify before a grand jury about what you witnessed?

I have a question regarding the exchange for you BFD. If Tara spoke or wrote of this incident then would it be admissible evidence to a Grand Jury?
Why would the Grand Jury want Mannequin as a witness when they could have RR who was in the car?

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 12:35 PM

Originally posted by zorro

I have a question regarding the exchange for you BFD. If Tara spoke or wrote of this incident then would it be admissable evidence to a Grand Jury?
Why would the Grand Jury want Mannequin as a witness when they could have RR who was in the car? Oh Zorro, thank goodness you are here, can you please answer the question I asked you this morning?

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 12:36 PM

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
Zorro, I see a whole lot of dancing around in your post, can you answer one thing. Are you and Anita and Larry saying that if a CREDIBLE, REASONABLE, tip was called in to LE that they will not follow up on it? BUMP FOR ZORRO

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 12:47 PM

Yes, Mannequin, he WORDS his posts so you think he has information....but he didn't BRING any of it to the board. If he actually brought a fact to the board, I'd actually get excited then. IMPLYING does NOT find Tara, unfortunately. :(

BFD - v2.0

07-31-2006, 12:51 PM

Originally posted by zorro

I have a question regarding the exchange for you BFD. If Tara spoke or wrote of this incident then would it be admissible evidence to a Grand Jury?
Why would the Grand Jury want Mannequin as a witness when they could have RR who was in the car?

If Tara spoke to someone about it, it would need to be determined if those people's accounts are credible. Due to the fact Tara would not be able to testify to direct evidence. It's hearsay that has no way of being corroborated.

If Tara wrote about it, it would depend upon the authenticity of the email/letter/note/etc.

Rhett Roberts is but one witness. Corroboration is what's important.

But, this is what I find strange. Everyone keeps talking about doing whatever they can to find Tara and/or get her justice. BUT.. it would seem a possible witness to an alleged encounter is being given every excuse under the sun to not assist. Doesn't that seem awful strange?

Or is it because this person wasn't a witness. Doesn't have any verifiable information, nor can corroborate the information?

And if you can please tell me the last time Anita Gattis had visited Tara's home prior to her disappearance, I'd appreciate it.

gacountry

07-31-2006, 12:52 PM

To all those that pmed me yesterday, I did not get them, I checked my email today and found someone had changed my password. Why don't know, how , don't know but yes it happened. It is sad that anywhere we go to discuss Tara something weird happens. OK back to reading now, sorry just wanted everyone to know. \Gacountry

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 12:55 PM

Originally posted by gacountry
To all those that pmed me yesterday, I did not get them, I checked my email today and found someone had changed my password. Why don't know, how , don't know but yes it happened. It is sad that anywhere we go to discuss Tara something weird happens. OK back to reading now, sorry just wanted everyone to know. \Gacountry

ga- it was my understanding MANY peeps had issues with emails and pm's and CTV - looks like they had a glitch in their system some time over the weekend. FWIW - I don't think it was just you with problems....

gacountry

07-31-2006, 12:59 PM

Originally posted by BevAnn

ga- it was my understanding MANY peeps had issues with emails and pm's and CTV - looks like they had a glitch in their system some time over the weekend. FWIW - I don't think it was just you with problems....

Thanks, Bev Ann, freshwater assured me it was being looked into. When I checked my email today it looked like Court TV was sending out Christmas cards in my account~~~~~still wonder what happened to my PM's(?) Oh well

benhill29

07-31-2006, 12:59 PM

feel free to PM me. For those of you who are already "non-believers" please don't waste my time....and before any one PM's me please be ready for what I tell you because I do have some knowledge that others may not have or may not want to admit could be true. The GBI knows who they escorted to Perry on that Thursday in July.

:rose: Always for Tara

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 01:25 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin
there would not be a link to what I know so I will say I have it from a reliable source that you can choose to believe or not but I personaly know it is truth that it was MH who called tara the ugly name at the redlight. I dont think calling somebody a name makes them a killer but I am just telling what I know to be true.

HMMMMMM, wasn't it you who just gave me grief about links? "I see you don't want to post a link so I see it must be made up" . If you were to search this very board, you would find the information in which the GBI is quoted as saying there is no evidence of foul play, however, you post about a "reliable source" and say it's true. I see how that works. It's just ok for you huh?

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 02:12 PM

Mannequin, and others -

I was at lunch, so sorry for the late reply - and Luv, don't mean to step on your toes, but here is the link I believe is being requested

http://www.crimelibrary.com/features/fea_printPage.asp?curPage=&thisFile=/news/original/0506/1601_tara_grinstead_dna.html

If I didn't like it correctly, let me know! :tongue:

BFD - v2.0

07-31-2006, 02:13 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin
there would not be a link to what I know so I will say I have it from a reliable source that you can choose to believe or not but I personaly know it is truth that it was MH who called tara the ugly name at the redlight. I dont think calling somebody a name makes them a killer but I am just telling what I know to be true.

Thank you for finally answering me.

You have a "reliable source" that says this occurred. In other words, hearsay upon hearsay. And we're to believe third hand hearsay as "fact"?

It may be very probable that Marcus did say this. But I am the kind of person that will not state something is factual in nature unless I've witnessed it myself and/or have other direct evidence to prove so.

But to be more accurate... you know it to be truth that you believe your reliable source, not truth that it actually occurred. Two different things.

fsbiii

07-31-2006, 02:21 PM

"The case, officials say, remains a missing persons investigation, and authorities have uncovered no evidence to suggest that the young teacher was the victim of foul play."

? ? ?

Originally posted by Mannequin
someone sent me this link in a private message:

http://www.crimelibrary.com/features/fea_printPage.asp?curPage=&thisFile=/news/original/0506/1601_tara_grinstead_dna.html

but it just doesnst quote the gbi like you (luvmy2labpups) said. It just says something about they won't comment on the issues of the case. Thank you anyway to the person who sent it anyway I know you were just trying to help.

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 02:22 PM

To quote that particle link, partially anyway,

"The case, officials say, remains a missing persons investigation, and authorities have uncovered no evidence to suggest that the young teacher was the victim of foul play."

So, I think it does back up Luv's claim....

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 02:30 PM

HUH???! WTH? I'm confused now...

Luv said, GBI had stated this. You asked when did they say that? A link, to GBI stating it, was given....now, what are you trying to divert to? :shrug:

janis

07-31-2006, 03:09 PM

Officially, authorities will not even confirm the existence of the DNA evidence, or any of the other leads Godwin has claimed to uncovered in the months since he launched his own probe into the schoolteacher's disappearance. "The issuesare not something we're going to comment on," said John Bankhead, a spokesman for the Georgia Bureau of Investigation. The case, officials say, remains a missing persons investigation, and authorities have uncovered no evidence to suggest that the young teacher was the victim of foul play. In the past, authorities have been circumspect in their comments on Godwin's assertions about the case.

The case, officials say, remains a missing persons investigation, and authorities have uncovered no evidence to suggest that the young teacher was the victim of foul play.

How much clearer do you need it?

fsbiii

07-31-2006, 03:16 PM

*speculating*

I think Mannequin wants a QUOTE from the GBI.

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 03:33 PM

oh...well.

I just want next week to get here!! So we will FINALLY hear new news in Tara's case!!! Or so BH29 says we will!!! HOW Exciting!!!:D

janis

07-31-2006, 04:00 PM

Originally posted by fsbiii
*speculating*

I think Mannequin wants a QUOTE from the GBI.

Okey Dokey.......So...used to, in order to have an important post, it had to have a link; now it has to have quotation marks around individual sentences? I can think of better ways to create a diversion than this.

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 04:03 PM

I put little quote marks around mine too... :( you just can't please everyone :shrug:

simply quiet

07-31-2006, 04:14 PM

Originally posted by benhill29
feel free to PM me. For those of you who are already "non-believers" please don't waste my time....and before any one PM's me please be ready for what I tell you because I do have some knowledge that others may not have or may not want to admit could be true. The GBI knows who they escorted to Perry on that Thursday in July.

:rose: Always for Tara

Hi BH

Welcme back. I sent you a PM, but not sure if you got it.

Just wondering if you could PM me about what you think might be happening.

Who was escorted to Perry?

Thanks for whatever you can tell me.

:rose: for Tara

janis

07-31-2006, 04:24 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin

you confused what I said I think. In the article the gbi man was quoted when he made a statement. The rest of the article didn't have quotes as to who said it or whatever. If she said the gbi "said" something, then that something should be quoted as his statement of that. I didn't mean the whole article had to have quotes around it because that is just plain silly. you all are making it very hard to just answer one question not me.

I didn't say the whole article had to have them. I said "individual sentences....I'm not trying to make anything hard, I just want the last word.......:D

BevAnn

07-31-2006, 04:30 PM

First it was - there's no LINK. then it's - the QUOTES aren't right. Now it's - the GBI wasn't QUOTED as having said that in the article.

I wish I'd been there and heard GBI say that - then I could post it here as a FACT. :D

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 05:13 PM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

The GBI also said this:

http://www.crimelibrary.com/news/original/1105/0902_tara_grinstead_search_complete_probe_continue s.html

(Nov. 22 Article Seamus McGraw wrote for CrimeLibrary titled "One Aspect of the Search for Tara Grinstead Completed, But the Probe Continues")

"We'll let the facts take us where we're going," he (GBI Public Affairs officer John Bankhead) said. "At this point, we don't even know of she's alive or dead."

Until they figure the answer to that question, I think it wise to consider these factors:

A person does not go POOF.

Her disappearance is out of the ordinary.

She must be found.

Until she is found, any conclusion there was or was not foul play cannot be drawn. Te detemination and evidentuary probe into this case has not closed. And while the GBI may have stated that SO FAR THEY DON'T HAVE EVIDENCE OF A CRIME,

Any quote by the GBI must be tempered by the fact and their own acknowledgement that the GBI does not KNOW whether she is dead or alive!

JUST MOO.

:seeya: BEFORE, the above quoted article. So you can try and detract from the most current statement by providing something from November or you can go by the most current statement. People do just go poof all the time. That is why they are called MISSING. They have found NO EVIDENCE OF FOUL PLAY. I will go with the GBI on this one.

BFD - v2.0

07-31-2006, 05:30 PM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

The GBI also said this:

http://www.crimelibrary.com/news/original/1105/0902_tara_grinstead_search_complete_probe_continue s.html

(Nov. 22 Article Seamus McGraw wrote for CrimeLibrary titled "One Aspect of the Search for Tara Grinstead Completed, But the Probe Continues")

"We'll let the facts take us where we're going," he (GBI Public Affairs officer John Bankhead) said. "At this point, we don't even know of she's alive or dead."

Until they figure the answer to that question, I think it wise to consider these factors:

A person does not go POOF.

Her disappearance is out of the ordinary.

She must be found.

Until she is found, any conclusion there was or was not foul play cannot be drawn. Te detemination and evidentuary probe into this case has not closed. And while the GBI may have stated that SO FAR THEY DON'T HAVE EVIDENCE OF A CRIME,

Any quote by the GBI must be tempered by the fact and their own acknowledgement that the GBI does not KNOW whether she is dead or alive!

JUST MOO.

:seeya:

V, you know I admire your determination. But... people do go POOF.

There is nothing unusual about Tara's disappearance. If people going POOF and disappearing without a trace was unusual, we wouldn't have the numerous missing person's organizations. Thousands upon thousands of people go POOF every single year in this country.

And all of them go missing "without a trace". Or they wouldn't be missing.

ipswitch

07-31-2006, 06:29 PM

Originally posted by Scout_2001
Why not finally accomplish something?

Well, that part of your statement is completely uncalled for, but that's JMOO

Can we not go 4 hrs without someone putting someone else down, or being snippy??

simply quiet

07-31-2006, 06:53 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

V, you know I admire your determination. But... people do go POOF.

There is nothing unusual about Tara's disappearance. If people going POOF and disappearing without a trace was unusual, we wouldn't have the numerous missing person's organizations. Thousands upon thousands of people go POOF every single year in this country.

And all of them go missing "without a trace". Or they wouldn't be missing.

Hi BD.

I was reading up on another forum about a missing girl that is local to me, and happened to come across a post with this info in it. I was a bit shocked at the stats.

~~~~

Erin Bruno, director of case management for the National Center for Missing Adults, said 99 percent of all adults reported missing are found safe — and many don’t want contact with the family they deserted.

For families of the missing, that may be hard to accept, Bruno said.

“In the family’s defense, every minute a loved one is gone is a minute too many,” she said. “They’re thinking the worst.”

As of May 1, there were 108,801 people listed as missing in the National Crime Information Center database, including 50,177 adults. Because the NCIC has certain criteria for entering adults in the database, there may be many more missing adults who aren’t included in the center’s statistics, Bruno said.

~~~~

The rest of the post has to do with the state laws pertaining to this girl, her name is Maura Murray, missing now 2 1/2 years.

Although in this case I do suspect foul play. JMO

NancynNC

07-31-2006, 07:35 PM

Originally posted by benhill29
You got that right....I am glad too!

Hello and welcome back Benhill. Missed you.
I have been off the forum for awhile, could not take all these lies and bashing any longer. I do agree that news will come.

:seeya:

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 07:39 PM

Originally posted by ipswitch

Well, that part of your statement is completely uncalled for, but that's JMOO

Can we not go 4 hrs without someone putting someone else down, or being snippy?? It looks like monica needs to take her meds, don't worry ippy, fw will take care of this in a jiffy.

ipswitch

07-31-2006, 07:42 PM

I'm not worried... to each their own, I just don't respond back to trolls

:beer:

Originally posted by luvmy2labpups
It looks like monica needs to take her meds, don't worry ippy, fw will take care of this in a jiffy.

benhill29

07-31-2006, 07:42 PM

but none of us should lose sight of the GOAL!

:rose: Always for Tara

luvmy2labpups

07-31-2006, 07:44 PM

Originally posted by ipswitch
I'm not worried... to each their own, I just don't respond back to trolls

:beer:

And quite a troll it is.:beer:

ipswitch

07-31-2006, 07:47 PM

Here here benhill29!!

Always for TARA!!

Originally posted by benhill29
but none of us should lose sight of the GOAL!

:rose: Always for Tara

BFD - v2.0

07-31-2006, 10:28 PM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

PEOPLE DO NOT GO POOF.

I cannot balance directly in the middle of a mystery and seemingly be content to hang there as if the UNKNOWN was/is some sort of CONCLUSION.

That is illogical to me and I am sure most families who are wrestling with the mystery of a missing loved one hope most people are not content to simply hang there in the middle.

There is an explanation, a conclusion waiting to be learned. It takes the discovery of the body- breathing or not, OR discovering enough of a trail to begin to conclude what happened to a person whose whereabouts are unknown.

Isn't it dangerously shortsighted to hang stoically to a position which offers no explanation or conclusion in the disappearance of a missing person. If this was the position of LE charged to solve this mystery, I would go so far as to say it is negligent conduct.

No BFD-A person does not go POOF. YOU KNOW THAT. The reality is we still have UNEXPLAINED disappearances and the frustration has led to private organizations trying to help create awareness, develop a better system, and solve these mysteries.

Your statements :

"There is nothing unusual about Tara's disappearance.If people going POOF and disappearing without a trace was unusual, we wouldn't have the numerous missing person's organizations"

1- depends on Tara being predisposed to vanishing. This is surely not the case and therefore your statement is false. IT IS MOST DEFINITELY UNUSUAL FOR TARA TO DISAPPEAR. Her father, stepmother, department head and the administrator for her school are all on record saying this is UNUSUAL.

2. People do not go POOF- like a magic trick or a freakish science experiment, people get lost. Their whereabouts are unknown. The explanation remains a mystery until the person is found or enough evidence is collected to explain the disappearance. The reason for numerous missing person organizations is BECAUSE LE has not FOUND THESE PEOPLE, not because they went missing. I think that is a very important distinction to make. Most all of these organizations were borne out of a frustration and disappointment in the our current system. It is not the mystery or the circumstance but the flawed and fractured system we now have to SOLVE such mysteries.

Which makes hanging in the balance or LEAPING to the conclusion that disappearances are NORMAL oversimplifying at best and IMO very dangerous at the opposite end of the spectrum.

When one examines how someone disappears, the explanations are:

accident
illness
abduction
murder
death
hiding

The reasons we say they are missing include:

unlocated
unrecognized

People don't go POOF - they either are unlocated or unrecognized BY US! When it comes down to it there are only three explanations why people remain missing (dead or alive):

they are trapped
they are among strangers
they are hidden

The way to effectively work a missing person case IMO is for US (ALL WHO ARE NOT LOST) to work those three angles: are they trapped, among strangers, or hidden.

It is dangerous and counterproductive IMO to throw out Disappearances are NORMAL. No, they are not. It is not normal to be trapped; it is not safe, usual, or normal to prefer to be or against one's own choice to be among strangers; and it is not normal to want to hide or to be hidden.

JUST MOO of course.

:seeya:

What in the world are you going on about?

How is it dangerous stating something factual?

It's also not unusual for people to be murdered in this country. Doesn't mean I want people to continue murdering. It's just stating a fact.

You seem to think this is some special case that has never happened before.

There are numerous people missing that have gone "POOF", with no trace of them to be found anywhere. Because I say it happens doesn't equate to me saying we should all throw in the towel and quit looking for people. That's asinine. If that was how I felt I surely wouldn't be wasting my time on this board or talking to different people trying to find an angle to answer some of these questions and/or try to lend insight into something that might bring closure. That's "logical". I'm not sure how you started at "A", jumped to "7" and wound up on the color "orange".

FACT: People go missing.
FACT: People go missing with no clues to their whereabouts.

Absolutely nothing unusual about Tara's disappearance. Read what I wrote. I didn't say Tara disappearing wasn't unusual for her. I said Tara's disappearance is not unusual. And it's not. It may be unusual for the town of Ocilla. But it is not unusual in terms of other missing person's cases.

I'm just at a total loss why you are trying to deny reality. By denying that it is normal for people to go missing without a clue... you're just trying to fool yourself. Either that, or you haven't dealt with or seen enough about missing people to understand the impact it has in our country. It truly is an epidemic that doesn't get the attention it should in my opinion.

concernedperson

07-31-2006, 10:59 PM

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0

What in the world are you going on about?

How is it dangerous stating something factual?

It's also not unusual for people to be murdered in this country. Doesn't mean I want people to continue murdering. It's just stating a fact.

You seem to think this is some special case that has never happened before.

There are numerous people missing that have gone "POOF", with no trace of them to be found anywhere. Because I say it happens doesn't equate to me saying we should all throw in the towel and quit looking for people. That's asinine. If that was how I felt I surely wouldn't be wasting my time on this board or talking to different people trying to find an angle to answer some of these questions and/or try to lend insight into something that might bring closure. That's "logical". I'm not sure how you started at "A", jumped to "7" and wound up on the color "orange".

FACT: People go missing.
FACT: People go missing with no clues to their whereabouts.

Absolutely nothing unusual about Tara's disappearance. Read what I wrote. I didn't say Tara disappearing wasn't unusual for her. I said Tara's disappearance is not unusual. And it's not. It may be unusual for the town of Ocilla. But it is not unusual in terms of other missing person's cases.

I'm just at a total loss why you are trying to deny reality. By denying that it is normal for people to go missing without a clue... you're just trying to fool yourself. Either that, or you haven't dealt with or seen enough about missing people to understand the impact it has in our country. It truly is an epidemic that doesn't get the attention it should in my opinion. I hate to quote long posts but this is exceptional. And should be noted. I never go forth in any day where I am not thinking about what happened. And to others.Too many missing and too many gone without explanation.

fsbiii

08-01-2006, 09:21 AM

From an old article:

"Realizing the potential for allegations that the local authorities might have conflicting loyalties, Hancock quickly summoned the Georgia Bureau of Investigation."

I believe it had more to do with the fact that Harper still has connections to officers, worked with them in the past, and has one as an alibi. Throw in the Anderson relationship (former Ocilla PD), and I certainly see why the chief would want to knock out any allegations of loyalty between his department and current/former officers being a detriment to the investigation into finding Tara.

Originally posted by guitarstring
If MH was the only tie to LE that Tara had, would the GBI have been called in?

I was under the impression that the GBI was called due to her relationship with MH AND HD, but I just wonder if HD were not involved, would they have been summoned to this case by the Ocilla Chief?

BevAnn

08-01-2006, 09:39 AM

Smart move on Hancock's part.

BFD - v2.0

08-01-2006, 03:02 PM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

I agree wholeheartedly BevAnn.

What puzzles me though is after making that wise effort...

someone(s) allowed the contact number to be the generic nonemergency Ocilla PD number and the lead investigator to continue to be an Ocilla Police Officer, Bill Barrs.

Wasn't the whole point to give the public confidence the investigation would be free from possible divided loyalities.

In a small town ripe with gossip (we have seen that here over and over), and where so many people are related or friends -

Couldn't it all just have confused and brought the question of objectivity back into question?

Remember that complaint against SF? There was a whole discussion here circling how Tara could have KNOWN any info that evening made its way to MH ONLY through SF? In so tiny a department in a small town we listed many other ways.

How was/is the public supposed to trust the investigation to be impartial, to provide anyone who wishes to contact investigators any confidentiality or separation from the Ocilla PD when the contact number - the ONLY OFFICIAL contact number was and is the nonemergency Ocilla PD phone number.

That just strikes me as going in the exact opposite direction- a contradiction- from the start.

IMO -I believe it would be wonderful since the current set up has not FOUND TARA, to now give out a new contact information that feeds directly to THE GBI and bypasses the Ocilla PD entirely.

Just MOO, of course.

:seeya:

Come on... you're joking, right?

If someone had information that could lead to Tara, Tara's body or evidence showing foul play was involved, you really think they're holding back giving that information because of a contact phone number?

I'm sorry, I find that a ludicrous proposition. They could pick up the phone book and look up the GBI's phone number or the local FBI office's phone number. Or they could get on the internet and see the many numbers given for this case and call the "Tara Command Center" with information.

To somehow lay blame for a lack of movement on this case to a contact phone number or a possible perceived impropriety is tad bit short of fantasy in my opinion.

BFD - v2.0

08-01-2006, 05:26 PM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone
I can't believe someone with LE experience could make the statement you just did.

BFD- how many informants do you know who want to call the general PD line?

Add in if someone has info regarding someone who has ties to that force - over and over you have remarked how everyone down there is related some way to each other -- why on earth would they want to call that line?

And then there is the whole question of confidentiality and the lack there of in providing a KNOWN general nonemergency line as the CONTACT number for this missing person case- that line was and is not a direct line for the investigators working this case.

I am amazed you cannot see this.

Just amazed. I am beginning to suspect it is not what I post but that I post that draws your ire....

Disappointing. Very very disappointing.

:(

No. It doesn't make sense to me.

Your post is basically saying someone who had information doesn't know how to use a phonebook.

And if there was an informant, they would go through the same channels they have always used in the past. It's a trust factor there.

Do you honestly believe that someone who had information would not contact ANYONE, just because the contact number is for the Ocilla PD?

BFD - v2.0

08-01-2006, 10:18 PM

Originally posted by Mukato
I wanted to comment on this because I was an informant years ago and the case did involve one law enforcement officer. I went around the world to avoid calling in my information to the "general number" and WAS very afraid at the time of the officer involved finding out I had called. For whatever it's worth, that was my personal experience, so I can understand why someone might withhold something unless they felt safe.

So, you chose not to give the information?

Rick Karon

08-01-2006, 10:39 PM

From what I read here they are all crooked so who cares what number is put out by LE if they are all involved in the cover up.

BFD - v2.0

08-01-2006, 11:52 PM

Originally posted by Rick Karon
From what I read here they are all crooked so who cares what number is put out by LE if they are all involved in the cover up.

LMAO

Good point.

simply quiet

08-02-2006, 05:42 AM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

<snipped>

Time is critical in a missing person case. LE should know that and build a system that maximizes their efforts and does not hinder it.

Tara is STILL MISSING.

I see the contact info as an area of opportunity.

If something is not working, why stick with it? I say change it and see if the change evokes the response hoped to achieve.

When you weigh the costs and benefits, I don't see why there is so much push back here?

JUST MOO. OF COURSE.

:seeya:

What did they say after you contacted them with this problem that you see?

mooloo

08-02-2006, 07:43 AM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

In a small town ripe with gossip (we have seen that here over and over), and where so many people are related or friends -

:seeya:

And there is a small town UNRIPE with gossip??? WHERE IN THE WORLD WOULD THIS BE? :lol:

mooloo

08-02-2006, 07:54 AM

This I gotta see...may be part of my circular family tree!! Perhaps the Miami branch??? PURPLE??? :punch:

Moo, running for the cameraOriginally posted by luvmy2labpups
ok, and cows will fly all over Ocilla this week 2. Purple cows no less. :rolleyes:

luvmy2labpups

08-02-2006, 08:59 AM

Originally posted by mooloo
This I gotta see...may be part of my circular family tree!! Perhaps the Miami branch??? PURPLE??? :punch:

Moo, running for the camera LOL, please share the pictures.

fsbiii

08-02-2006, 01:42 PM

The story is archived online, apparently.
http://www.unionleader.com/article.aspx?headline=When+adults+disappear&articleId=a5c92236-da30-4752-8658-c191adb51e3b

When adults disappear
By ELISE CASTELLI
Union Leader Correspondent

*snipped*

“(Adults) have the legal right to up and leave,” Estabrook said. “I can see how a loved one would be concerned with that, but you have a right to be missing.”

Erin Bruno, director of case management for the National Center for Missing Adults, said 99 percent of all adults reported missing are found safe — and many don’t want contact with the family they deserted.

For families of the missing, that may be hard to accept, Bruno said.

“In the family’s defense, every minute a loved one is gone is a minute too many,” she said. “They’re thinking the worst.”

“Most (missing persons) turn up fairly quickly,” Thomas said.

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone

Still looking for that LINK for the article you quoted earlier. Did you miss my request?
:seeya:

simply quiet

08-02-2006, 02:32 PM

Originally posted by fsbiii
The story is archived online, apparently.
http://www.unionleader.com/article.aspx?headline=When+adults+disappear&articleId=a5c92236-da30-4752-8658-c191adb51e3b

When adults disappear
By ELISE CASTELLI
Union Leader Correspondent

*snipped*

“(Adults) have the legal right to up and leave,” Estabrook said. “I can see how a loved one would be concerned with that, but you have a right to be missing.”

Erin Bruno, director of case management for the National Center for Missing Adults, said 99 percent of all adults reported missing are found safe — and many don’t want contact with the family they deserted.

For families of the missing, that may be hard to accept, Bruno said.

“In the family’s defense, every minute a loved one is gone is a minute too many,” she said. “They’re thinking the worst.”

“Most (missing persons) turn up fairly quickly,” Thomas said.

Thank you kind sir........I forgot I was trying to get this yesterday for M71, and I got distracted.

I will pm her the whole post from the other forum, I don't think the Water Clan want us posting links to other forums.

Again..................ty

simply quiet

08-04-2006, 09:16 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
Due to the fact that the GBI recognizes that not every one in LE is a good guy.....I am thankful that you haven't heard any thing that points in the direction of closure. I would not be back on this board if I didn't have it from reliable sources that within the next week news will be out and some of the guilty will at least be made public.
:rose: Always for Tara

Well.......the "within the next week" time frame is 3/4 's over...................any news?

benhill29

08-04-2006, 11:08 AM

I have August 10th marked on my calendar and I am patiently waiting....
:rose: Always for Tara

BFD - v2.0

08-04-2006, 11:13 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
I have August 10th marked on my calendar and I am patiently waiting....
:rose: Always for Tara

LMAO

I can see a GBI agent's daytimer right now...

August 10th:

8:00am: Drop off laundry at Murray's Dry Cleaners.

8:30am: Go arrest Tara's murderer.

10:30am: Attend news conference regarding arrest.

12:00pm: Eat lunch with Agent Dimwiddy at Flo's Diner.

1:00pm: Pick up laundry from Murray's Dry Cleaners.

2:00pm: Arrest drug dealer.

4:00pm: Knock off an hour early, we've had a big day.

concernedperson

08-04-2006, 11:26 AM

LMAO...BFD. I needed that.

Seriously though, does anyone believe that GBI is giving out arrest dates? C'mon........

benhill29

08-04-2006, 11:39 AM

I am simply relying on the information I was given in order to base my time frame. I was told over a week ago that it would be within 2 weeks...when I posted we were already well into the first week...thus the reason I stated that particular date in August....I never said the GBI was passing out dates.
:rose: Always for Tara

simply quiet

08-04-2006, 11:42 AM

Originally posted by concernedperson
LMAO...BFD. I needed that.

Seriously though, does anyone believe that GBI is giving out arrest dates? C'mon........

Aug 10th isn't really good for me, I think I will call and see if we can change it.

luvmy2labpups

08-04-2006, 11:44 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
I am simply relying on the information I was given in order to base my time frame. I was told over a week ago that it would be within 2 weeks...when I posted we were already well into the first week...thus the reason I stated that particular date in August....I never said the GBI was passing out dates.
:rose: Always for Tara First you said one week, now it's 2? Sheesh, this timing thing is becoming quite the problem.

Please tell me why your source says that any LE office needs 2 weeks, 1 week or even a day to make an arrest if they have the information necessary to make an arrest? I will anxiously await your response.

goldylocks

08-04-2006, 11:57 AM

Originally posted by benhill29
I have August 10th marked on my calendar and I am patiently waiting....
:rose: Always for Tara well that would be a wonderful bday present for my hubby considering that he knows how much time time i have spent wondering and worrying about Tara's case, yeah that would be nice see what you can do OK.

BevAnn

08-04-2006, 03:58 PM

@$%@# I was getting the HAIR done on the 10th!! 80's style big hair too. MAN...guess I need to either reschedule OR....hope my hair lady has a tv handy....:D

Atok

08-04-2006, 05:20 PM

Results: Now to catch the Baseline Rapist.

Agree... kudos to the officers on the shooting sniper case... over 200 officers involved, over a year of searching, now to tie it together and toss it to the courts.

It's terrible to tell your children, no you can't go ride your bike or walk the dog or head outside alone...ever. But the world has come to that.

luvmy2labpups

08-04-2006, 11:05 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin

Maybe they need a body. I dont know. So they just know they are going to find a body in 2 weeks and make an arrest? How does one do something like this? A vision? Ya see what I mean, it makes no sense. If they are speaking of arresting someone, I can't imagine them needing 2 weeks to arrest anybody. I can't help getting the feeling someone is fibbing. :shrug:

luvmy2labpups

08-04-2006, 11:27 PM

Originally posted by Mannequin
I said maybe they need a body, then I said I don't know. Thats not fibbing, thats just not knowing. I think you really want to be right about this and will almost make a clone of Tara so you can be right and show us look I found her I told you she was ok. thats looking trhrough a tunnel with no other ideas my opinon. I am local you are not. I know things you couldnt. thank God. I was not speaking of you when I was talking about fibbing. Consider the subject of an arrest in a couple of weeks. I don't believe that. I have heard it a billion times before. Here we sit, still same ole same ole. Now as far as cloning, ummm, nope. Sure I would love to be right about Tara being alive, don't you hope I am right as well? Or is that tunnel vision set on one view and one view only? Just because you are local, that does not mean you are "in the know". As far as I know, NOBODY in Ocilla knows for certain what happened to Tara. Are you saying you do or are you just looking for a pat on the back because you have a front row seat?

kundalini

08-05-2006, 09:13 AM

Maybe they have a body or a part of a body and need a positive i.d.

luvmy2labpups

08-05-2006, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by kundalini
Maybe they have a body or a part of a body and need a positive i.d. I doubt they would need to wait for identification. If they had ANY evidence of someone committing a crime they would not wait. People are arrested without a body. Read up on some of the cases on here you will see. The fact is, the GBI has stated that there is no evidence of foul play. If you go back for months and months you will see all the false promises of arrests coming soon. It never materializes, no matter how much they wish it to be true. Lie after lie has gotten us nowhere and will continue to get us nowhere.

luvmy2labpups

08-05-2006, 11:36 AM

Originally posted by Mannequin

I think somebody local DOES know what happened to Tara. just my opinion. I doubt it. That town along with all of their citizens have been under the watchful eye of media, le, etc. There has been intense scrutiny, rumors and speculation for 9 months now and the thought of anybody roaming the town and thumbing their noses just doesn't seem likely. I feel like someone would have done something stupid by now (not that there hasn't been alot of stupidity) but stupidity in regard to getting caught. That hasn't happened, right? There have been no arrests, right? GBI has interviewed many people, right? Yet there is still NOTHING. Make's me more convinced in my view that she is alive.

Hey Paula

08-05-2006, 11:40 AM

Originally posted by Mannequin

I think somebody local DOES know what happened to Tara. just my opinion.

I agree with you. Someone always knows something about every case. And if Tara was met with foul play, the perp certainly knows what happened to her.

IMO

BFD - v2.0

08-05-2006, 02:18 PM

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone
Mannequin, Hey Paula -

I agree too. *snipped for brevity*

Personally, I believe the key lies in Hawkinsville; not Ocilla.

Hey Paula

08-05-2006, 02:46 PM

quote:Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone
Mannequin, Hey Paula -

I find it remarkable that anyone here can pronounce with certainty what sort of scrunity had/has been going on in Ocilla and elsewhere (since Tara was not only always in Ocilla) where this case goes. Gee, one of the last places she was seen was in Fitzgerald in a neighoring county.

I don't recall ever seeing or reading that a complete canvas was done in her neighborhood, her school where she taught, her schools she attended, her church, or her gym,or elsewhere. I don't recall a plea by LE for any and all who took photos or film at that Pageant to please make them a copy or contact them so they can view it.

I don't recall ever seeing or reading where anyone other than a few (a very few) POIs were interviewed by investigators - let me see: MH (per his attorney & his interview), B.Merritt (per the Crime Library article), ? who else. Isn't any other at this point for any of us NOT in Ocilla simply hearsay?

Hi V! :seeya:

I hated to snip your post because I thought it was great. The three paragraphs above iterate what I find most interesting and perplexing about this case.

In the cases I've followed, SOP for LE was to investigate family first, along with those closest to the missing person, as well as any known enemies the person might have had. Once the aforementioned parties have been cleared, the investigation and search for the missing person moves from that circle, onto other possibilities, such as you've outlined in your post.

However, we've not heard about, or witnessed, through the media, e.g., anything like this occurring in Tara's case. LE hasn't enlisted, or sought the help of the community in this regard. This leads me to believe that LE might very well know what happened to Tara, and if she was met with foul play, as the GBI once stated they believed might be the case, they might very well know who is responsible.

IMO

kundalini

08-05-2006, 04:14 PM

Excuse me, can you tell me what is in Hawkensville?

kundalini

08-05-2006, 04:19 PM

I mean WHO is there? I am not familiar with the whereabouts of the poi's and am curious to know!

kundalini

08-05-2006, 04:21 PM

Unfortunately yes. I assume it is an ex but do not wish to assume anything right now.

singlesix

08-05-2006, 09:41 PM

"Are you serious?"

Seemed like a perfectly reasonable and polite question to me. I'd like to know also if someone would be so kind as to answer the question and dispense with the attitude.

singlesix

BFD - v2.0

08-05-2006, 09:46 PM

Originally posted by kundalini
I mean WHO is there? I am not familiar with the whereabouts of the poi's and am curious to know!

It's not necessarily a "who" in Hawkinsville that matters.

Tara's past is in Hawkinsville. And some of her present (when she went missing) was in Hawkinsville.

Such as church, family and friends.

I'm curious, do you think all of the members of her church have been questioned?

When someone goes missing, one of the first things asked (and typically put in a missing person's report) is possible destinations. Hawkinsville was most definitely a possible destination due to church and her mother thinking she might be coming up there to visit.

I still think it's very possible Tara made it to Hawkinsville, but her car made it back to Ocilla minus her.

kundalini

08-05-2006, 09:52 PM

Thank you singlesix.

Aussie

08-05-2006, 10:05 PM

I agree with you BFD.
I was pm'd by someone who used to be in AG's camp and told that they also believed the answer could be in Hawkinsville.
They also said that AG was only interested in searching in Tifton County and would not listen to anyone who suggested anything different.
It seems like Hawkinsville, like some people have been shielded so far in this case.

Hey Paula

08-05-2006, 10:11 PM

Originally posted by Aussie
I agree with you BFD.
I was pm'd by someone who used to be in AG's camp and told that they also believed the answer could be in Hawkinsville.
They also said that AG was only interested in searching in Tifton County and would not listen to anyone who suggested anything different.
It seems like Hawkinsville, like some people have been shielded so far in this case.

Why do you suppose LE hasn't gone to Hawkinsville, if it holds the answer to Tara's disappearance?

Given the controversy surrounding Tara's ties to the Ocilla PD, I would think LE would be delighted to solve this case via Hawkinsville.

IMO

concernedperson

08-05-2006, 10:23 PM

Originally posted by Hey Paula

Why do you suppose LE hasn't gone to Hawkinsville, if it holds the answer to Tara's disappearance?

Given the controversy surrounding Tara's ties to the Ocilla PD, I would think LE would be delighted to solve this case via Hawkinsville.

IMO

The searches haved involved Irwin and Ben Hill Counties. If anyone can attest to a different county than I would most appreciate it.

fsbiii

08-05-2006, 10:26 PM

I believe Aussie meant Irwin County, too, cp. I've heard of some searching in Berrien County (south of Irwin) as well as Ben Hill County, but nothing in Tift County (Tifton, GA) or Pulaski County (Hawkinsville).

Originally posted by Aussie
I agree with you BFD.
I was pm'd by someone who used to be in AG's camp and told that they also believed the answer could be in Hawkinsville.
They also said that AG was only interested in searching in Tifton County and would not listen to anyone who suggested anything different.
It seems like Hawkinsville, like some people have been shielded so far in this case.

hypnotized

08-05-2006, 10:27 PM

Originally posted by kundalini
Unfortunately yes. I assume it is an ex but do not wish to assume anything right now.

kundalini,

I know it must be difficult to drop into this discussion at this juncture, but maybe you will want to read over the pertinent articles to familiarize yourself with the jist of this case. :)
And then read over the posts (lol, it took me several days!).

IMO, this forum has been a trolling ground, and some "posters" have reincarnated themselves and manufactured unsubstantiated claims of "sources" which prove to be untrue. So don't be surprised if your questions are not answered quickly, with genuine candor. Many who have been here a lengthy time are not naive, and tend to cut-to-the-chase quickly.

:read:

Aussie

08-05-2006, 10:30 PM

FSBIII you are right, I stuffed up, I meant Irwin county.
I am a long way from there and all those counties get me very confused.
Sorry to confuse you all.

Hey Paula

08-05-2006, 10:52 PM

Originally posted by concernedperson

The searches haved involved Irwin and Ben Hill Counties. If anyone can attest to a different county than I would most appreciate it.

I'm not familiar with the fine state of GA, so I don't know what county Hawkinsville is situated in.

scubadvr99

08-06-2006, 12:57 AM

Originally posted by Hey Paula

I'm not familiar with the fine state of GA, so I don't know what county Hawkinsville is situated in.

Pulaski County

singlesix

08-06-2006, 12:58 PM

"I know it must be difficult to drop into this discussion at this juncture, but maybe you will want to read over the pertinent articles to familiarize yourself with the jist of this case.
And then read over the posts (lol, it took me several days!).

IMO, this forum has been a trolling ground, and some "posters" have reincarnated themselves and manufactured unsubstantiated claims of "sources" which prove to be untrue. So don't be surprised if your questions are not answered quickly, with genuine candor. Many who have been here a lengthy time are not naive, and tend to cut-to-the-chase quickly."

I have read. I remember a lot and I forgot quite a bit. I choose not to wade through it all again. Heck, I could re-read the entire board, bad attitudes, insults and all, but I choose not to.

You know, for all the typing it took you to say go look it up yourself you could have answered the question. Thanks for your time anyway.

:shrug:

singlesix

Hey Paula

08-06-2006, 01:06 PM

Originally posted by scubadvr99

Pulaski County

Thanks Scuba!

Do you know if LE has searched or visited Pulaski County?

scubadvr99

08-06-2006, 01:19 PM

Originally posted by Hey Paula

Thanks Scuba!

Do you know if LE has searched or visited Pulaski County?

Not that I am aware of Paula

:seeya:

Hey Paula

08-06-2006, 01:21 PM

Originally posted by scubadvr99

Not that I am aware of Paula

:seeya:

Hi Scuba! :seeya:

Thanks! If this is true, then apparently LE doesn't consider Hawkinsville relevant to Tara's disappearance.

IMO

Hey Paula

08-06-2006, 03:03 PM

Originally posted by Results

Well, here is the mystery for me. MHu and FG stated they were looking for Tara in Hawkinsville before she was reported missing. HMMMMM Now we have MHu going to Tara's house ASAP. Then we have AG & LG not getting to Ocilla until afternoon. I wish we could find out what made HD, MHu, and FG panic so quick to be looking for her before she went missing. Anybody know????

Perhaps, they had called Tara on both her landline and cell phones, couldn't reach her, even after having left messages for a return call, and thought she might had perhaps gone to Hawkinsville.

IMO

BFD - v2.0

08-06-2006, 03:06 PM

Originally posted by guitarstring
*snipped*

When did Anita or Larry LASt speak to Tara, either in person or email or phone?

That is the burning question I have. It would tell me a lot about the amount of confidence I should put in some of their statements. (re: Tara's habits, clothing, jewelry, things she would be inclined to discuss with them, etc.)

BFD - v2.0

08-06-2006, 03:11 PM

Originally posted by guitarstring
What makes you think they thought she was in Hawkinsville and may have started looking there?

What basis is there for thinking that?

She was last seen in Ocilla, not Hawkinsville.

There is an article somewhere (I'm not sure which one) where Maria said they were in Hawkinsville looking for Tara Monday morning.

Why they were looking for her prior to her being reported missing is anyone's guess.

That's why I believe some of the answers lie in Hawkinsville. Why would they think Tara would be in Hawkinsville on Monday morning when they know she has to go to work? Doesn't make sense. But yet, that's what they were doing.

Hey Paula

08-06-2006, 03:14 PM

Originally posted by guitarstring
What makes you think they thought she was in Hawkinsville and may have started looking there?

What basis is there for thinking that?

She was last seen in Ocilla, not Hawkinsville.

Even if they had done this, prior to reporting her missing, I don't see this as a big deal, or mysterious in any way.

Why report someone missing to LE, when they might be elsewhere. It makes sense to first check the places where Tara might be, prior to reporting her as a missing person.

IMO

jond

08-06-2006, 04:46 PM

Agreed, HeyPaula. Imo, they were looking for TG because she was missing and when she could not be found, they reported it to LE. I suppose somebody's got to know you are missing before reporting it...don't know if it could be any other way.

Hey Paula

08-06-2006, 05:02 PM

Originally posted by jond
Agreed, HeyPaula. Imo, they were looking for TG because she was missing and when she could not be found, they reported it to LE. I suppose somebody's got to know you are missing before reporting it...don't know if it could be any other way.

If Tara's family did look for her in Hawkinsville, prior to reporting her as a missing person, I credit them for being levelheaded and clearthinking, as some might simply panic and call LE prematurely, without first thoroughly eliminating all possibilities of where their loved one might be.

IMO

Hey Paula

08-06-2006, 05:15 PM

Originally posted by Results

THE FAMILY DID NOT REPORT TARA MISSING. THE SCHOOL DID.

Are you saying the school called LE before contacting Tara's family, those closest to her, and/or her neighbors to first find out if there had been an emergency/death in the family, which would explain why she didn't show up for class?

jond

08-06-2006, 05:48 PM

TG is/was a 30 year old single female with a life of her own. She went missing over a weekend, but at the time TG could have just taken a day trip without notifying anyone...was she supposed to...she is 30 and single. IMO, no need for any sense of urgency such as contacting LE. Perhaps, over the course of the day and early evening without contact, questions and concern mounted in the mind of FG, call begin to be made. It is said HD was in her yard Sunday night to check on her..he sees her car nothing looks amiss, she is single..what should he have done..break the door down, call her boyfriend and girlfriends? IMO, the search was on for TG late Sunday into early Monday, it just was not offcial. IMO, not showing up to work solidifed this a missing person case, and not a single person having a weekend. I would think the school would have contacted FG to see if TG had been heard from prior to going to the police.

Hey Paula

08-06-2006, 05:55 PM

Originally posted by Results

You fail to realize the situation we are talking about. Why? HD drove to Tara's house wee hours 12:15 AM Monday called FG and FG turns around and calls the neighbors to ask if anything looked wrong. You call a neighbor at 12:30 AM you are pretty worried to call someone at that hour. Why not call at 10 PM or 11 PM? I know you don't like questioning the family but I thought we were suppose to try to get to the truth, no stone unturned. Rather you like it or not they were searching for her in Hawkinsville that morning before the school contacted the police to report Tara missing. If you don't think it is a mystery then so be it but I do and I would like to know the answer to my questions. HD drove to Ocilla and was in Tara's yard then when Tara wasn't at home the search continued for her in Hawkinsville. I never said that AG and Tara were close because I don't know them. AG said they were close but I find it very odd that FG would be talking to HD, MHu, and the neighbors at this tine of hour and not contact AG, Tara's half sister. JMHO

We already know that HD tried to contact Tara a number of times the night she disappeared, so I don't find it odd that he would call Tara's family because MAYBE he didn't see Tara's car in the carport and was concerned about her.

Why shouldn't HD be worried if he couldn't reach Tara, and she didn't return his calls. Most people, who care about someone, would do the same thing.

IMO

I'm not sure if I answered all your questions because they were grouped together and not separated into separate questions/paragraphs.

Hey Paula

08-06-2006, 06:17 PM

Originally posted by Results

Paula, don't worry I am fully aware of my writing problems. Sorry you couldn't get the questions to answer them. Your second paragraph is what you keep defending on. I'm not saying HD wasn't worried but when you say HD was WORRIED then why did he leave without answers. You can't have it both ways. This is exactly the problem that I keep seeing go all around the world and ignore what is in front of you that we do know to make that MH theory fit. Why can't you look outside the box for 2 minutes and really try to grasp what I am saying? I give you the respect to look at from your point of view but you don't give me the same, why?

How can HD get answers when LE can't even get them?

If I read your fomer post correctly, it was HD's inquiry which prompted Tara's family to check Hawkinsville, since she wasn't home, and no one seemed to have seen her, or was able to reach her by phone.

I'm sorry you took my post the wrong way.

I respect everyone who respects me.

concernedperson

08-06-2006, 07:05 PM

I understand her car was there when HD was knocking and calling. I believe he suspected she had company and that is why she wasn't answering the door or calls. Very similar to when AV was knocking and banging and he was inside.

concernedperson

08-06-2006, 07:20 PM

Originally posted by Results

If that were true then why would he call FG? Why wouldn't he just say OK she has someone in there and leave?

I am not positive that he called FG.I am not sure if everything wasn't manufactured after the fact. Lets say he was spurned and his cell phone connects to Tara's phone and family ties consider loyalty above everything. So, they say it he was calling Faye to check on Tara. This explains his numerous calls. But, of course, LE already knows the phone situation and they aren't talking. So, we see a spin for the public.

And so it goes.

sogalady

08-07-2006, 10:32 AM

Originally posted by Results

If that were true then why would he call FG? Why wouldn't he just say OK she has someone in there and leave?

Results, I don't have any idea where to start looking for the link, but wasn't it posted and discussed at one time that possibly FG asked HD to go to Ocilla to check on Tara ? I am sure that I remember reading that, not sure how true that it was, but if indeed he was checking on Tara after having been asked by FG then why would FG in turn call Tara's neighbors?

I am sure that this was discussed at one time, 'cause I remember thinking,, If HD was in front of her house, then why would she need to call the neighbors to ask if everything looked OK ? Don't you remember something to this effect ? I think that it was right after Dr. G got involved IIRC.

sogalady

08-07-2006, 10:47 AM

Results,, One more thing that I noticed while reading this thread, sometimes you are much like myself, ( I have been accused of being too soft at work occasionally because I tend to be a little on the gulable side,,, not a bad thing, just usually comes from those who are very tenderhearted.) But sometimes it is more obvious to the ones that are reading instead of posting. Be careful, there are those on this board lately that know exactly what the answers to their questions are because they have been here almost since the beginning of time and I am certain that they know (or at least feel as certain as we all do ) about most everything that they are questioning,,, I think that they get a kick out of some kind person attempting to explain the scenario once again. Just be careful not to be taken advantage of by those who think that it is OOHHH so cute !:rolleyes:

fsbiii

08-07-2006, 10:50 AM

sogalady-

Like you, I recall a person posting here about the reason HD went and why he left the card in the door for the 'next person to find', etc. This person has since stated elsewhere that she was 'told' or 'requested' by others to post that information here on this forum.

The same 'others' also provided (to the same person and others I am sure) the information about Dr. Gattis being 'on a run' the morning of 10/24 as the reason it took so long for Anita and him to get to Ocilla.

FWIW--

Originally posted by sogalady

Results, I don't have any idea where to start looking for the link, but wasn't it posted and discussed at one time that possibly FG asked HD to go to Ocilla to check on Tara ? I am sure that I remember reading that, not sure how true that it was, but if indeed he was checking on Tara after having been asked by FG then why would FG in turn call Tara's neighbors?

I am sure that this was discussed at one time, 'cause I remember thinking,, If HD was in front of her house, then why would she need to call the neighbors to ask if everything looked OK ? Don't you remember something to this effect ? I think that it was right after Dr. G got involved IIRC.

Hey Paula

08-07-2006, 12:28 PM

If Tara didn't answer her phone and return calls made to her, why shouldn't they look outside of Ocilla, and in Hawkinsville, where Tara had ties?

For those who wish to promote their belief that Tara's family looked no where else, and at no one other than MH, turning to Hawkinsville even before Tara was reported missing, should immediately dispel those thoughts, but I doubt that it will.

IMO

BFD - v2.0

08-07-2006, 12:44 PM

Originally posted by Hey Paula
If Tara didn't answer her phone and return calls made to her, why shouldn't they look outside of Ocilla, and in Hawkinsville, where Tara had ties?

For those who wish to promote their belief that Tara's family looked no where else, and at no one other than MH, turning to Hawkinsville even before Tara was reported missing, should immediately dispel those thoughts, but I doubt that it will.

IMO

Don't confuse her "family" with "Anita".

Anita wasn't involved in these "looking for Tara" moments before she was officially reported missing.

I haven't seen her father, mother or step-mother accuse Marcus Harper. Only Anita.

So, if somehow the family (minus Anita, she was out of the loop) was looking elsewhere, then Anita's immediate fixation upon Marcus isn't relative to the initial "looking for Tara" statements.

Logically speaking, your assumption and attempt to whitewash the accusations made by Anita have failed by bringing up events Anita was not a party to.

concernedperson

08-07-2006, 01:44 PM

He allegedly was on a jogging "run". The source was Anita.

odette

08-07-2006, 02:05 PM

Originally posted by guitarstring

WE don't know if Tara disappeared on Saturday night or Sunday night for that matter.

Also, I have to call attention to your statement about "maybe he didn't see Tara's car in the carport and was concerned about her."

If he didn't see her car in the carport, then that has to mean he went there more than one time.

When he went there at 12:15-12:30 AM on Monday morning, I thought he said her car WAS there. The neighbors even said her car was there on Sunday when they got back in.

Hey Paula, get a clue. Read up.

This really makes me wonder if the left hand knows what the right hand is doing sometimes. So many inconsistancies.

For instance, HD allegedly made a phonecall to FG around 12:15am on the Monday morning from Tara's yard, (according to cellphone records). Then shortly after that call finished FG phones the neighbors .. one of the reasons given by Faye herself, was to "see if a car was home". IF Faye KNEW that HD was in Tara's yard, she surely would have asked him if Tara's car was there.

Something is just not adding up.

NANCY GRACE ~ CNN ~ Aired January 13, 2006

GRINSTEAD: Well, I started calling her that afternoon and she did not answer the phone. And I didn`t think too much about it at first, but she never called me back. I left her a message and she didn`t call me back because I`d call both phones. But I really didn`t start to get worried until later on in the late afternoon. And when she had not called me back, I began to get concerned then.

GRACE: Did you call the neighbors?

GRINSTEAD: I did not call the neighbors until very late Saturday night, Sunday night...

GRACE: So you did call Sunday night?

GRINSTEAD: Sunday night.

GRACE: Right.

GRINSTEAD: I did not call her Saturday night. It was very late, say 12:30 or 1:00. I did call the neighbors to see if a car was home or if anything looked unusual.

GRACE: What did they say?

GRINSTEAD: They didn`t seem to think anything looked unusual, that the car was there. They had been gone all day and didn`t get back until late, but they said the car was there. Nothing looked unusual.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0601/13/ng.01.html

BFD - v2.0

08-07-2006, 02:06 PM

Originally posted by guitarstring
*snipped*

IF they reached her, well then, she's a bigggg girl. Why, when she's been so "in your face" about things would she suddenly become submissive and say, "oh, my hubby is "on a run" somewhere and I know the police have been called and my half-sister is missing, but I just can't get there until he gets back. "

She is a control FREAK and seems she would be IN the mix from the get go......

*snipped*

I absolutely agree and this is what raised my hackles when hearing about it.

In my opinion, Anita's demeanor after coming to Ocilla seems so contradictory to someone who will wait around for her hubby to finish his run.

If nothing else, Anita seems to be the kind of person to get in the car, find him on his jogging path and get him to Ocilla with her pronto. Jogging shorts and all.

jond

08-07-2006, 07:10 PM

OK, so what does all that mean and what is its relevance to TG disappearance/death? If there is some relation, I would like to read it. What does it matter at what time any particular person arrived that day unless there is some implication being made? IMO, I still think birddogging AG and LG is a wild goose chase initiated by personal dislike and unsubstantiated rumors. I was not on the MH hunt in 05 and, IMO, since January 06 the AG/LG shots outnumber MH by an easy 2:1.

concernedperson

08-07-2006, 07:31 PM

It could be because that is when the inconsistancies were being recognized and acknowledged. Most people on crime forums look for inconsistances in statements and actions. I believe it is a learned response after following true crime for a long period of time. Also, many LE have written books or given interviews after the fact as an educational source for further indicaton of criminal activity and ways to recognize when one is possibly in harm's way.

This is not an indication of guilt in this particular case but a way of looking at why there are so many questions.

BFD - v2.0

08-07-2006, 08:35 PM

Originally posted by jond
OK, so what does all that mean and what is its relevance to TG disappearance/death? If there is some relation, I would like to read it. What does it matter at what time any particular person arrived that day unless there is some implication being made? IMO, I still think birddogging AG and LG is a wild goose chase initiated by personal dislike and unsubstantiated rumors. I was not on the MH hunt in 05 and, IMO, since January 06 the AG/LG shots outnumber MH by an easy 2:1.

Finding inconsistencies is the heart of investigative work.

When investigating something, answers don't just pop up out of the blue. It's by questioning numerous paths and vetting them out.

When an inconsistency arises, it always begs the question, "why?". 99.9% of the time inconsistencies lead to the answers you're looking for.

Just google "inconsistent" and "crime". You'll be sure to find many, many pages that will talk about a particular crime and someone's "inconsistent statement" that finally broke the case.

I don't really care "who" the inconsistent statement came from. It is what it is. And it needs to be vetted.

HonestInjun

08-08-2006, 12:14 AM

WOW - Hope the attorneys READ THIS ONE!!

BTW - Has anyone other than BenHill heard when the arrests will be made????

Originally posted by guitarstring
IMO. IMO. IMO.

Well, if inconsistency is the key to solving this case, then Anita Gattis unlocks the whole shebang.

And if withholding info paves the way to the truth, then there's blacktop all the way to FG. (i CANNOT think of another person who was interviewed, gave a statement, and then we later found out which part they DIDN'T tell in that interview. IMO, if you are REALLY out to get to the truth of what happened to your daughter, you don't withhold info at any time. You tell the truth, the WHOLE truth and nothing but the truth. And let the chips fall where they may. )

I'm still curious as to why Faye Grinstead withheld the fact that Heath is the one who called her on Sunday night/Monday AM from Tara's driveway on his cell. She sure withheld that info. Nancy Grace put a few questions out there and she answered, but her responses have always been odd, short, and just unemotional.
(I've sensed she fears Anita's wrath? Can't put my finger on it, but Anita seems to have some issues that are yet to be discussed here. I don't know anything for a fact but I do know for a fact that I'm in a long line of others who feel the same way. )

Funny thing is, it's mother and daughter that have withheld or given inconsistent statements about things. And brother in law failed a lie detector test. And a married close friend of the family that is shrouded in secrecy. So, maybe the GBI cannot rule out or get beyond the family involvement, so they've yet to enlist the help of the public due to this? This seems like a perfectly logical reason. If they thought that a kidnapping had taken place or a murder took place and NEEDED the public's help, they would ask for it. They haven't, so this can only mean to me that they are lingering on a few and cannot move on.

And there's more we aren't being told, so I'm sure a lot of what we ponder and poke at here gets a good laugh from those closest to this case who are doing the CONSISTENT WITHHOLDING OF INFO.

Someone's making a mockery of this board and has taken advantage of our genuine concerns for another human who is missing.

By telling less than the truth, they laugh because the joke is on us.

IMO. IMO. IMO. IMO.

gacountry

08-08-2006, 05:27 AM

Why and for What?

I have lay in bed tonight and thought about all the "hate" and "hateful things" that have popped up in this case. And I can't help but wonder why? What right have we to be so vocal about people and things when a lot of us are going only on a personallity we saw on tv? I think more lives have been shattered than can ever be made right again. These people we so casually condemn are human not a story made up to practice our dectetive skills on, when this is over and an answer comes these people will have to try to repair and go on~~~but will they always be looked on in suspision, just because we can't admit to our own role in making this a hate crime?

When I think of this I am not only thinking of Tara, Faye, Anita, Larry, Gabe, Connie and Billy, who have been made into the most dysfuntional families ever. All the love they had for one another has been racked over the coals and made ugly. But lets look at the other families as well. Marcus and his family, Anthony and his family, Heath and his family, Rhett and his family, Joe Potier and his family, Joe Perry and his struggling young family. All the "I am sorrys" in the whole world cannot bring these families back to where they were before Oct. 05. And for what? What have we accomplished by posting Myspace and date sites, and dug up every bit of personal information for all the world to see? Has it brought Tara home?

Then we post an opposing opinion and we get slammed with the "hate" issue and what a bad person we are. I am totally disgusted with it all. I cannot see where anything is different now than it was 9 months ago EXCEPT more lives have been ruined and more emonitional drama has been let loose to fester and cause even more hate. Has it brought Tara home?

Who are the experts in this case? I certainly am not, and from reading others post I see they think they are but they are not either. I think LE and the GBI reads this rubish for their downtime, because if they are as confused and as filled with hate as most posters Tara is certainly lost for ever.

This popular vision we have that one board versus another board is just crazy. We are doing nothing productive by hurting another person because another person hurt us. This my reliable sourse versus your reliable is just a laugh, because in the long run our sources are not worth the time we took to type them out. This going over each others post to make sure we get in all the proper cuts and bruises to all the most tender parts is just childish.

Back in the first months before all the rumor and lies and hate started I thought we were getting somewhere. I could not wait to help in anyway I could, now that no news has been coming forth and most people revert to digging up what dirt they can, and if they can't find dirt they make up their own, it is just like a sickness.

WE have attacked peoples line of work, their family values, their positions in the communities, their religion, and the list goes on. What have we accomplished but hurt the very people that came together to help Tara?

I am tired of this hate-go-round. I will read, I will help family or LE anyway I can, and I will pray but I have seen all the damage to the Memory of Tara that I can take. And again I ask is Tara any nearer home? If she is alive could she come home?

TuscanDreams

08-08-2006, 06:52 AM

I'm changing the way I approach Anita Gattis in posts. I don't know her, don't pretend to know her and yet I bash her. So, I'm going to knock that off. She seems to do things that I don't understand and appear hinky, but maybe they are explainable.

My father in law's memorial service was on Friday night. His grown kids from his first marriage arrived on Saturday morning at my mother in laws to clean out her house. They took a home entertainment center, photography stuff, etc. My mother in law is shell shocked because her husband died within 5 days of his diagnosis. She is barely able to function and these idiots clean her out.

I only mention that if not for the Grace of God, I could be in Anita's place. I'm going to stop judging her, although, I still don't agree with a lot of her stuff.

Hey Paula

08-08-2006, 08:46 AM

Originally posted by TuscanDreams
I'm changing the way I approach Anita Gattis in posts. I don't know her, don't pretend to know her and yet I bash her. So, I'm going to knock that off. She seems to do things that I don't understand and appear hinky, but maybe they are explainable.

My father in law's memorial service was on Friday night. His grown kids from his first marriage arrived on Saturday morning at my mother in laws to clean out her house. They took a home entertainment center, photography stuff, etc. My mother in law is shell shocked because her husband died within 5 days of his diagnosis. She is barely able to function and these idiots clean her out.

I only mention that if not for the Grace of God, I could be in Anita's place. I'm going to stop judging her, although, I still don't agree with a lot of her stuff.

I think the family might have reservations about making too many things they might know made public. Because of Tara's negative ties to LE, I can't say that I blame them if they harbor feelings of mistrust. This could be part of the reason for some of your concerns about Anita.

May I ask, what it is about AG that you find troubling? If it's something you've read solely on this board, I'm sure you know, if you've been around as long as I have, that in every case we follow on these boards, there is always a segment of posters who criticize the victims' families.

IMO

simply quiet

08-08-2006, 09:27 AM

Originally posted by gacountry
Why and for What?

I have lay in bed tonight and thought about all the "hate" and "hateful things" that have popped up in this case. family, Heath and his family, Rhett and his family, Joe Potier and his family, Joe Perry and his struggling young family. All the "I am sorrys" in the whole world cannot bring these families back to where they were before Oct. 05. And for what? What have we accomplished by posting Myspace and date sites, and dug up every bit of personal information for all the world to see? Has it brought Tara home?

<snipped>

This is CTV, and we are discussing this case. I know some wish it would just go away, but it isn't.

I don't see "hate posts" anywhere here. Some posts may hit a nerve when you see people you have gotten to know discussed. Perhaps it would be better not to read.

None of us knows what happened to Tara, and a lot of us have differing opinions. But we are free to look down all the avenues. And because so few facts are known, we have many many questions.

I still think the family would benefit from a respected Public Relations Spokesperson.......but that is JMO

Peace

BFD - v2.0

08-08-2006, 09:51 AM

Originally posted by guitarstring
Ok. I see the concerns with my post. I don't know the family or anyone involved personally, so it's easier for me to post what I think or feel than it must be for a local who may know these people. I'm just a message board member with a viewpoint. An outsider looking in. I guess it came across a little harsh to a few?
I didn't mean it in an ugly way, but a "call it like I see it" way.
Key word is "I" ... I'm not speaking for anyone but myself.

What I said was in response to the post that said 99.9% of the time, the inconsistencies lead to the solving of a case.

I am sorry to offend anyone, but I was making a point that there have been MANY inconsistencies in this case and it's baffling, to say the least. We hear something from somebody who we feel "should know" something and then we hear them change the story or alter it. or find out they left out a very important part? It's just confusing and has made so many scratch their heads. We have all wanted to help Tara but feel helpless when we feel like we've been given wrong info to base our theories on, or we feel foolish when we put so much energy into one area only to find out later that we weren't given the whole truth to work with.

I'm not saying any ONE of them is guilty of harming TARA, but guilty of making inconsistent statements and withholding info is in black and white. And Dr. Gattis and his wife even went on TV to tell everyone he failed a LDT, so how is that a lie or a misconception or an untruth on my part?

If any of that is not true, then, I apologize, but I'm going on transcripts, interviews, releases by Dr. Godwin giving the info about HD in the area of Tara's home when the call was made to FG, etc....

I'm simply saying that if someone says that in 99.9% of cases the inconsistencies lead to solving the case, then we definitely have inconsistencies and we definitely have something showing somebody wasn't forthcoming with all the info in an interview. We can certainly assume this person was forthcoming with the GBI, but when she spoke to NG, she didn't tell it all. That's what made a few people a little dizzy with wonderment of why that particular part was not stated.
I'm sure there has to be a reason, but what those reasons are are yet to be known to us ctv'ers and Tara is still missing.

I'm not being slanderous in my statements, I don't think.

It's a fact that AG has made inconsistent statements and it's a fact that FG never said in any media interview (that I saw) that HD called her on Monday morning from Tara's driveway.

Now, if any of that is untrue, then I apologize. If it's true, it's true.

If an attorney is reading this and thinks I've broken a law, please PM me and tell me which one it is....other than the unspoken one.

I just read the post on inconsistencies and these were my thoughts. Sorry if it was harsh. But lies or untruths? I don't feel like it is. Wouldn't it be nice if we could just bend the truth to fit any size hole we wanted it to fit? WE can't. It is what it is.

Please PM me if I've broken a law with my post? I really would like to know.

What in the world are you apologizing for? You haven't broken any law.

You haven't done anything wrong.

If someone gets offended, big deal.

People do not come to this message board and discuss Tara Grinstead's case because of anyone other than Tara Grinstead.

Anita is hinky as hell. She does some strange stuff.

That isn't libelous. It's my opinion. And obviously the opinion of a lot of other people. She is a strange bird.

I personally do believe that the answer to Tara's disappearance lies up in Hawkinsville. There is a lot of stuff that isn't being said. A lot of lies being told. A lot of misinformation being spread. A lot of ommissions.

Everyone is buzzing about this "behind the scenes", but everyone is scared to death to say anything publicly because of the stigma attached to "bashing family" of a victim. I don't care if they're the family of the pope, if something stinks, it stinks. I'm not gonna tell everyone it smells like roses when it doesn't.

There is absolutely nothing malicious in your post. Therefore there is absolutely nothing slanderous. People get off on this slander and libel crap when they get their feelings hurt. Hurting someone's feelings does not equate to libel.

I'm not an attorney, but believe me, I've walked the line so close for so long and have been threated so many times to be sued, I've done my fair share of defensive reading about libel. I don't see anything within your post that could possibly be construed as libel.

(Don't let people scare you away with that talk. That's been the tone for the last 6 months when someone says something they don't like: "Oooohhhh... I'm gonna tell.... and you're gonna get sued..." LMAO Idiots.)