The Men in this Case: Discusssion

[BevAnn]

Zip - no actually...I had not heard either way...I just assumed it was (bad sleuthing on my part, assuming!!) I guess my thinking was - if he was THERE and her car was GONE, he'd just assume she was GONE....and not worry so much....

However, if her car was THERE and she wouldn't answer him...then he'd get worried enough to start calling everyone. You know, if her car was GONE, he'd just say, well she stopped off at the gas station, or WalMart or a friends house, etc....and not really worry so much.

Therefore I deduced (see I AM a sleuth!!LOL) that her car WAS there for him to become so worried...

Bev Ann :D

[The R]

Ben,

I hear ya on HD....my question would be.......IF the family knew that she had related she was in danger to HD, how'd they receive this info? From HD or Tara?

[jela72]

Originally posted by benhill29
all of what has been posted about HD this morning but a good point is made...what if she was inside while he was outside calling her the whole time? What if she was already unconscious based on some others theories that have been posted. I am just speculating as to why....but the poster could be on to something about how she may have made plans to see HD and then was unable to do so due to being either not there while he was outside or being unconscious....which would still mean that he is basically only guilty of not following through more carefully after getting no response from Tara. However, this could have been normal behavior as far as he was concerned. She had been inside with him before and not answered the door while others were outside trying to reach her according to previous posts on other threads. Just thinking out loud and in type...disregard if you think is is stupid.

Good thought but the one weird thing about this, ben, is if that's how he felt, then why call her mother if he truly believed that? So her mom called the neighbor to confirm everything appeared fine.

May have happened but doesn't seem logical. But then that's just me :)

[BevAnn]

zip - you are quiet welcome! :)

My question is - where did we start getting there was a relay of she was in danger???? Like I said, it's probably been mentioned somewhere by someone....I just don't remember - why did we think she was calling out an SOS to HD?? :shrug:

Bev Ann

[benhill29]

I know..none of this seems logical. Hopefully if we can get someone to stand up and do better police work we can get some logical answers from LE since all we can do on here is speculate and try to find bits and pieces on quotes to substantiate what we do think we know.

[BevAnn]

Well, heck, since we anaylize every tid bit to death!! I have THIS question...

WHY did her mom call the neighbor's??? Sure they kept an eye on Tara...but it's the middle of the night! This elderly couple has been in bed for probably a couple hours. Why would the mom think they'd have any info more than what anyone else did?? And if they HAD suspected something was wrong, surely they would have contacted the mother before this phone call???

And ANOTHER thing! Probably been mulled over many times here - BUT if a parent of my young neighbor calls in the middle of the night upset - do I tell her, no, everything's fine. And go back to sleep? Did The P's ever actually get out of bed and go across the yard to knock on her door? (again I may have just missed this info in all the postings)

All fill in info would be greatly appreciated! :seeya:

Bev Ann

[benhill29]

Originally posted by BevAnn
zip - you are quiet welcome! :)

My question is - where did we start getting there was a relay of she was in danger???? Like I said, it's probably been mentioned somewhere by someone....I just don't remember - why did we think she was calling out an SOS to HD?? :shrug:

Bev Ann
It was mentioned 2 days ago on a thread. I am looking for the needle in the haystack now but it may take awhile to find it but if this helps any one remember where it may be located it was talked about on here after Dr.Godwin was threatened and we all FINALLY learned that HD was in the front yard. The explanation from what I can remember had to do with him being the long time friend who she depended on when she had issues or drama. I am speculating here but from what I read it sounded like since she had previously had issues with AV, MH, etc. that she needed a "hero" to help her or protect her or whatever...JMHO from the threads. I am looking for the "explanation now....I will get back to you on it once I can substantiate that it was explained in that particular fashion to all of us who are in shock that HD was in the yard looking for Tara before we even knew she was missing.

[BevAnn]

Ahhh, thanks Ben - so it COULD have been like I said....maybe...maybe not...

Thanks for the help!

Bev Ann

[jela72]

Same questions lots of folk have, BevAnn. Faye G called the nighbors after HD, sitting outside Tara's house, called Faye to see if Tara was OK (or to that effect). Faye called T's neighbors, the P's - who said everything appeared OK.

My question to all this was: if HD was right outside around 12:15 in full view (walking distance) of the P's residence, why not go and ask them himself (after not getting a response from Tara).

If he was supposed to be looking out for her and her car was there - what could her mom do at that time, other than call the P's.

Something is just NOT adding up, lol...


Originally posted by BevAnn
Well, heck, since we anaylize every tid bit to death!! I have THIS question...

WHY did her mom call the neighbor's??? Sure they kept an eye on Tara...but it's the middle of the night! This elderly couple has been in bed for probably a couple hours. Why would the mom think they'd have any info more than what anyone else did?? And if they HAD suspected something was wrong, surely they would have contacted the mother before this phone call???

And ANOTHER thing! Probably been mulled over many times here - BUT if a parent of my young neighbor calls in the middle of the night upset - do I tell her, no, everything's fine. And go back to sleep? Did The P's ever actually get out of bed and go across the yard to knock on her door? (again I may have just missed this info in all the postings)

All fill in info would be greatly appreciated! :seeya:

Bev Ann

[BevAnn]

ok, let's summarize with this snapshot of timeline for this part of the evening...

It's 12:15 am (approx) on SUNDAY morning (yes?)

#1 - HD arrives at Tara's home (at exactly WHAT time he ARRIVES we really don't know??? correct?) (and WHY, we don't really know either)

#2 - we must assume he tries to contact Tara, either by knocking on the door or calling her using his cell, from his truck

#3 - IS HER CAR IN THE CAR PORT????

#4 - he gets no answer

**at some point he puts his card on her door**

#5 - he then calls FG from his cell phone

#6 - FG then calls the neighbor's -the P's- who say they feel uncomfortable going across to check on her at that hour (?)

# 7 - ????? does FG call HD back and tell him this conversation? Does HD just wait for awhile with no contact with anyone, and then decide to drive off?? WTH. This is really looking more and more odd...

As always, correct me where I'm wrong!! :D

Bev Ann

[BevAnn]

Took to long to be able to edit - BUT

This was on MONDAY morning!! See, I thought this visit happened Saturday night after the pagent, but it was actually Sunday night - after she hadn't been heard from in a day.....hhmmm...

Bev Ann

[BevAnn]

Originally posted by zip4spd
I think (IMO) that TGs parents have already stated that they were concerned earlier in the day when they could not reach here on cell or housephone. It is beyond comprehension that the portiers would not go and knock on her door. I mean afterall they had keys to her house and her car and even a little system (according to Mr. P) about a signal to his wife with the light on certain nights of the week. But yet they had no problem strolling over and opening the door and tidying the house before the cops got there the next morning. Could it be that they knew danger was pre-existing? IMO

zip - it is weird that they were very "close" to Tara, for neighbor's anyway. And they had this little system for her safety, etc...YET when the mom calls they brush her off - yes, does not mix.

again, hhhmmmmm

Bev Ann

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by The R
I posted this on another thread. It is a quote from a report on CL. Am I wrong or does it say that HD and Tara were dating?

"A few days later, ****s, a policeman from nearby Perry and long-time friend of both Grinstead and her family, a confidant whom she had recently been dating turned up in Ocilla. She left school early. That too was unusual for the highly devoted and motivated eleventh-grade teacher"

Somebody straighten me out on this....if this IS the case it would sure shed some light on things for me. HD is a married w/kids LE in Perry, right?

Can you post a link for this article?

[The R]

Nancy,

see big news thread

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by Sassy
FWIW take his statement and believe it....

HD Quote:
But I really can't make a lot of comment due to the ongoing investigation. It really wouldn't be fair for me to make any comment that would jeopardize the investigation.

If you knew everything, you would know HD had nothing to do with Tara's disappearance. Stay posted...more on this later..

Were they dating?

[NancynNC]

These threads are getting so long, much longer than before, I can hardly get to the bottom...:D

[BevAnn]

Originally posted by NancynNC
These threads are getting so long, much longer than before, I can hardly get to the bottom...:D

Nancy - I thought the SAME thing!! THey are like twice as long as they normally were!! Thought it was just me!!

Bev Ann

[Atok]

I believe HD was a male platonic friend/comforter of Tara. I can see how his behavior seems like romantic involvement, but frankly we don't know that is fact.

For those that believe there was an affair, either a once in awhile thing, a hot n heavy thing, a long time ago "once" thing... I say this issue is really between him and his wife. I don't think it makes him more likely to HARM her. if anything it makes it LESS likely. Even if she wanted it broken off, if he was infatuated, I don't think he's going to kill her. It's a long term relationship they had, spanning since childhood. If anything he'd want her around to convince her to keep it going.

I will start with the giving HD the benefit of the doubt that this was platonic like he says.

I believe HD was there the day AV banged on the door.
I believe AV banged on the door becuase he really wanted Tara's attention and he knew HD was there because he saw HD's vehicle there and he expected the door to get answered.

I believe neighbors called the police about AV banging on the door.
From a source who knows AV, I recieved information that AV's charge was more because he shoved at SF while arguing that he should leave the scene.
I think Tara's complaint about SF IS NOT about him relaying private information to MH regarding who was in her house that day. MH got this information from other sources anyway. I think Tara complained about SF shoving at AV and making the situation escalate and hauling AV down for it was her beef. Tara's complaint that SF was heavy handed with AV is what eventually dropped AV's charges.
Anyone who has access to the complaint form can verify why there was a complaint filed.
Is this complaint "Public Record?"

Back to HD.

I believe HD was asked by Tara to keep an eye out for her.
LE can verify if there are really emails between LG and Tara about concerns she had about MH. I've been told there most certainly are. Tara emailed LG regularly about medical questions she had, questions students had and the like. She emailed LG regularly, not AG often or directly. AG and Tara's relations were strained. (why? could be lots of things...)

These "speculated emails" are all in LE evidence I am sure becuase if it's true it's on date stamped Ip recorded computer records.

LE can verify if Tara ever told HD about these fears and concerns. I believe she did. She got protective attention when she expressed she was vulnerable.

I don't know when HD's calls to Tara started. I don't have the phone records, but LE does. LE knows if Tara called HD initially and when that was. If we had these records I am sure his calls would be placable in the time line. Obviously, the call record has been gone over repeatedly in questionings and whatever HD said was not suspicious enough to LE to require further spotlight.

I find successive phone calls to be indicitive of one of two behaviors: Either a rising in concern OR an obsessive covering of guilt.

Let's assume it's rising concern, first. He either gets a call from her and is trying to return it or he makes a call to her and she hasn't replied in the timely fashion he is accustomed to. The calls rise in frequency as his concern rises. He eventually gets to a place of concern where he wants to drive over to Tara's.

Why arrive there at 12:15 am?? Someone who knows his work schedule can say whether or not this is when he is finally off duty and could make the drive. It's not overly late for him. People think it is, but any LE wife can state the hours are sometimes crazy.

Why don't we know he went there until recently? Recall HD's role in the case has been very quieted. He knows not to talk to public, he's a police captain, his friends know not to say a darn thing. His family wouldn't comment. If other POI's had people around them like HD did we wouldn't have any info on them either.

Maybe the salient detail that he was there at 12:15 was a detail LE was saving FOR A REASON. It's out of the bag now and it looks like HD was hiding the info for nefarious reasons. I disagree.

When HD arrives at Tara's is her car there?. I believe it is which is why he goes to the door to knock, it is why he is more concerned about no answer on the phone. It's why he calls her mom, he's thinking maybe someone came and picked her up? The call to Faye relates that she doesn't know where Tara is either. HD hangs up. It is too late to go over and bug the neighbors.

He has already walked around the property now. The glove. I can't say I know whether the glove was present and HD missed it, that it wasn't there yet OR that HD dropped it himself accidently. Dr. Godwin obviously knows a little more about this.

Maybe HD told him, "I wasn't carrying them in my truck, I didn't use one when I was walking about the property and I didn't see one when I was there." Based on where it was found, Dr. Godwin believes HD would have seen it had it been there. I understand it was near the front door.

Why place a card there if he was trying to hide he went there? He wouldn't. He wanted it known that he had been there checking up on her, in case Tara returned from being out in someone else's vehicle. He was determined to get a message to her since the phone thing wasn't working.

Was the card there when the "gloved one" returned. Did the "gloved one" even re-enter the house? If they did why wasn't the card noticed? I can't solve this section.

Next, HD, having called her mom, having left his card, having left multiple phone messages, not being willing to wake up the neighbors after midnight on this... what does he have left to do? In all actuality, Tara may just be out on a date. There is STILL no reason to suspect foul play. He has no legitimate option but to drive back home, unsettled though he may be, that's why he just leaves. He does have a wife and family to get home to.

Comments?

[BevAnn]

Atok - I agree, follow you on 99% - good thoughts! HOWEVER, I do take argument with one statement you made/theorized:

"Obviously, the call record has been gone over repeatedly in questionings and whatever HD said was not suspicious enough to LE to require further spotlight."

Now, we can't deduce that necessarily. We don't know what LE is spotlighting. And I still haven't seen where HD is cleared, as they aren't even labeling this as anything but a missing person....

However, I do follow your thoughts, and agree, I think HD is an innocent bystander in this, who was genuinely trying to help Tara in some capacity.

:D Bev Ann

[Saunterer]

Macon Telegraph - 1/4/05: “The Perry Police Department switched its patrol officers to 12-hour shifts on March 16, said Perry police Capt. Heath ****s, who commands the patrol division. Three-day weekends every other week, decreased scheduling headaches for vacation and sick leave and a decreased need for overtime sold ****s on the 12-hour shifts. ‘It's a morale booster,’ ****s said. ‘It's one of the best things we've done in the last 12 years.’"

This was from an article on the Warner Robbins patrol officers going to 12-hour shifts. I don’t know if it's online anymore (link does not work) - http://www.warnerrobinsarea.com/.../mld/macon/news/local/states/georgia/counties/houston_peach/10559557.htm

Various CL articles describe HD as being among Tara’s “closest friends and confidants”, a “friend of hers since they were kids”, and someone “who Tara often turned to in times of stress”. There is one CL article (on 11/2/05) which says: “A few days later, when a policeman from a neighboring community whom she had dated turned up at school, she left early.” It doesn’t list the source of this information.

MOO - I don’t know when the shift change is or what HD’s schedule was. But if he was on duty Sunday (10/23) it could explain all the calls he allegedly made ... perhaps even why he’s supposedly at her house, but not until around midnight. Regardless of his relationship with Tara, that’s what friends will do, out of genuine concern.

Tara did not answer the phone or the door. But even if HD saw her car parked in the carport, he may have concluded she was out with someone else. Maybe he was still on duty and wasn’t even suppose to be out of Perry at that time. And maybe his concern had not risen to the point of being alarmed.

IMO - Officially or unofficially, HD cannot become involved in the investigation. That has to be rough on him. But if he is even half the friend he is portrayed to be, I feel confident that he would not allow this case to go unsolved.

[Atok]

I don't think HD is "cleared" exactly, no one is cleared until the case is judged and over.

I believe the phone records have been the subject of extreme scrutiny and if his records were suspicious or timed in such a way to warrant more question we would have seen more "heat" on this POI. Not everyone that works in LE can love the guy, so something would've leaked.

I should phrase the whole LONG thread JMO. LOL.

Thank you for your comments so far.

Anyone else...

As to Sassy's comment : I plead the 5th. :D

[Atok]

Thanks Saunterer!

Very helpful. Makes the timing make more sense, doesn't it?

[concernedperson]

The only thing I can add is if 20 phone calls were made during the day Sunday then he couldn't be the perp for he would know that she was already dead. And, if he were the perp why would he call attention to himself.....he is a cop and knows they can trace phone calls. The logic is apparent to me...the people that did this pretended to be no where around.

[BevAnn]

Yes, the part of him being there at 12:15 never bothered me - as LE his shift could have been whenever, or he could have been on call, and had to run out for a call,etc.. And Saunterer's post shows that the time frame isn't so off

And Saunterer, absolutely, as a friend, having been by there, he could not be involved as LE - conflict of interests.

And let's assume he innocent of any wrong doing, and was truly just a great friend - he's gotta feel like crap now that he didn't do MORE at that time...

Bev Ann

[Saunterer]

Originally posted by Atok
Thanks Saunterer!

Very helpful. Makes the timing make more sense, doesn't it? Only if we knew HD's work schedule, IMO. Other info about HD on the web (pre- and post-10/24) just gives me the sense that HD is one of the good guys. But then again ... I'm not very intuitive, and anything is possible.

This is not directed at anyone in particular >>> No saints in Ocilla, Fitzgerald, Hawkinsville, Perry ... or anywhere else for that matter ... including Tara. No news there. Something went terribly wrong for Tara. But whatever has happened to her, I can't understand why anyone would intentionally harm her.

Someone knows what happened to Tara. Someone needs to come forward with the information ... better sooner than later. Confession is good for the soul. All JMOO. Prayers for Tara.

[Atok]

Originally posted by concernedperson
The only thing I can add is if 20 phone calls were made during the day Sunday then he couldn't be the perp for he would know that she was already dead. And, if he were the perp why would he call attention to himself.....he is a cop and knows they can trace phone calls. The logic is apparent to me...the people that did this pretended to be no where around.

Let me say, in response that if he were the perp and knew she was dead that it doesn't stop him from making the phone calls.

I meant to include this section under "obsessive covering of guilt"

Guilty people DO leave copious phone records. Usually hysterical calls to the person they've killed. It calls attention to themselves, yes, but they say they were upset and worried.

These messages a la Scott Peterson are all about, "I love you" and most of all, "sorry." The National Enquirer's article is the one that said he called 20 times leaving those types of messages. I'm sorry, but the NE is not a reliable source of info for me.

[Atok]

What is the source of how many calls he gave and what the contents of those calls were?

Until I have something better than NE, I'm going with...

No one knows but him and LE.

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by Sassy
Vote please....does anyone here believe what they read in the National Enquirer......Oprah???....Tom Cruise???....

Who even reads tabloid junk much less gives them an interview????

Someone did....was it TP??? Who really gave that interview anyway.....Good question????

I don't buy those magazines at all. I think it was TP for a small amount of chump change and the opportunity to spread rumors. Otherwise, the article would have been honest that TP was representing MH.

[Saunterer]

I didn't see the NE article, so I don't know what particulars were said about HD's phone calls. But in the CL article dated 11/18 an unnamed source challenged the NE report, saying that "several people had noticed her absence on Sunday and some, ****s among them, had telephoned her home looking for her." Also that "it would make sense that ****s ... would have repeatedly [tried] to reach the woman he regarded as a close friend and confident [sic]."

[mooloo]

Oh, dang!! That one left a mark.


Originally posted by Justice4Tara

So then you're the younger of the two sisters then? LOL Maybe the 2 of you can get together and bake a great big cake. With a file in it.

[benhill29]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

So then you're the younger of the two sisters then? LOL Maybe the 2 of you can get together and bake a great big cake. With a file in it.
While baking the cake I hope someone baked one for Ocillians birthday that she just celebrated. Happy Belated Birthday Ocillian!

[longcoolwoman]

TP did not speak with the NE. Mrs. TP told me that they did contact him repeatedly and he repeatedly told them "no comment". That didn't stop them from quoting him, however. I know TP well enough to believe he wouldn't stoop to giving info to a rag mag even if he is a lawyer. :tongue:

I know the NE reporter contacted lots of people asking for interviews; in fact, he emailed me and asked for one. Just for the record, my reply to him verbatim was "I don't think so. Sorry." I have had no further contact from him. (I was accused on this very board of possibly hindering the investigation by corresponding with the NE, so I thought I'd mention that. *rolling my eyes*)

There were rumors that information was sold to the NE, but the subjects of the rumors flatly deny that. I also heard that the reporter talked to several people at the Tara center who did not know he was an NE reporter until after they had spoken with him. I can see how this could happen because there were an awful lot of folks in and around the Tara Center back in November. I know the times I was there I talked with lots of people that I didn't know (no, I didn't give out any information that I know....just to cover my rear again).

What irritates me is that so many people ran out and bought the issues that had articles about Tara. If no one puts stock in those magazines, why in the world would you give them your money?

Sorry for the rant. That's just a pet peeve of mine. Okay, off my soapbox now. Back to your regularly scheduled thread. :D

[longcoolwoman]

Oh, BTW. About the phone calls. The people who went into the house on Monday morning listened to the answering machine. Mystery solved.

[UltraDeluxer]

Longcoolwoman, Can you verify if Larry and Deena Harper went inside Tara's house very early Monday morning? It has been reported as fact and I am told that Dr. Goodwin was given this information as well. For those that do not know - that is Marcus Harper's father and stepmother. I cannot understand why they would be going through Tara's house and listening to her answering machine messages if this is a true account.

[concernedperson]

lcw, how could they quote him if he didn't say anything? Did they just pull this out of the air? Too specific to this case for an NE reporter from out of state to even know how to manufacture this info.

[longcoolwoman]

Originally posted by concernedperson
lcw, how could they quote him if he didn't say anything? Did they just pull this out of the air? Too specific to this case for an NE reporter from out of state to even know how to manufacture this info.

All I know is what Mrs. TP told me. If the NE reporter talked to as many people as I think he did, he could have gotten his information from anywhere or anyone.

[longcoolwoman]

Originally posted by UltraDeluxer
Longcoolwoman, Can you verify if Larry and Deena Harper went inside Tara's house very early Monday morning? It has been reported as fact and I am told that Dr. Goodwin was given this information as well. For those that do not know - that is Marcus Harper's father and stepmother. I cannot understand why they would be going through Tara's house and listening to her answering machine messages if this is a true account.


I think that is a question that should be posed to them for them to answer. I know who was in the house that morning, but I don't think it's my place to say that on a message board.

I can tell you that both of them care very much for Tara.

[longcoolwoman]

Originally posted by GeneralLee
Is it a fact that MH's father and stepmom went into the home early Monday AM? If so, who called and notified them? If it was early Monday, then it was before the GBI came into this, and it was while all these folks were just strolling in and out of a potential crime scene. This still makes me boil when I think of what was compromised. Somebody straightened up, now somebody listened to the machine (rumor) and her car was washed, on and on......Did the neighbors listen to the machine, also?

And, how do we know anyone listened to the machine?
If this is a fact, and the UNKNOWN person who gave info to the NE is in question, then, considering the nature of the info centered around the 20 phone calls from HD, then it could be the attorney for MH, as we have discussed, or, if someone else DID listen to the answering machine, then perhaps they were PAID by NE to release what they knew? If not paid, then in order to divert attention off of themselves or a loved one, they released that info to the National Bullshi**er, I mean Enquirer, since it implicated another person?

Again, I don't think it's my place to tell the names of who was in the house that morning, but I can tell you that I was told directly by one of these people that the messages were there and that they listened to them. I can assure you that this is NOT the person who gave the info to the NE, if anyone did.

Everyone should keep in mind that when the first people went into Tara's house that Monday morning, it didn't occur to any of them that it was a possible crime scene. Perhaps it should have, but bottom line is, it didn't.

And you can count me among those who believe that the house and car should have been sealed and NO ONE should have been traipsing in and out....not family, not Greta, no one. In fact, I specifically asked Agent Turner why the car wasn't impounded and why people were allowed into the house....and even why the last clothes Tara wore weren't taken in for testing. He told me that the GBI went through everything three times and they were finished with everything. (I know....it doesn't make sense, but that's what he told me!)

[UltraDeluxer]

You have to wonder... if Mr. & Mrs. Harper heard Marcus on the machine say something about coming over or being mad at Tara over the emails or whatever... would they have left the message on there or quickly hit delete? Just speculating, not saying it happened. Still don't understand why his mom and dad were there so quickly and inside the home.

[benhill29]

How may sets of keys were floating around to Tara's house....Just wondering since it seemed to be open house there from the beginning of this nightmare.

[Babes]

Originally posted by UltraDeluxer
Longcoolwoman, Can you verify if Larry and Deena Harper went inside Tara's house very early Monday morning? It has been reported as fact and I am told that Dr. Goodwin was given this information as well. For those that do not know - that is Marcus Harper's father and stepmother. I cannot understand why they would be going through Tara's house and listening to her answering machine messages if this is a true account.


How early on monday morning?

[Babes]

Originally posted by Candace


How'd they get in?

I dont know this is new to me. :)

[Babes]

Originally posted by Candace


Me too, babes..There's so much gossip going around I don't know what to believe. I wish those who have facts would produce links.

I am curious with "very early in Monday Morning" statement she/he mentioned because as far as i know the school reported her missing at 8:50am.

[Babes]

Originally posted by Candace


It amazes me that no one reported her missing 'til Monday morning, does it you?

Actually, I am surprised that the school reported her missing to LE right away at 8:50am. How many schools will report to LE that a teacher didnt come to work and didnt show up or called in what..2-3 hours? I am wondering who made the report to LE about this and what made her decide to call LE right away. Did they contact the emergency phone numbers of Tara that was listed on Human resource files?

[Babes]

Originally posted by Candace


Maybe HD called the school and told them she is missing..It does seem that someone would have told the school b4 the school calling LE...unless they know how conscienous Tara is, and by her not showing up something sinister happened.. just a thought.

I was thinking that HD maybe talked to Tara's co-worker and asked for Tara and maybe HD insisted that co-worker to report to LE because he doesnt want to report it to LE thinking SF will be the one who will be there and he probably didnt have a good relationship with him.. Arghh dunno...

[4ANGELS]

Originally posted by Candace


You make alot of sense...I do think HD had only the best intentions toward Tara.

I agree too.

[bred]

Let's say school starts at 8AM. Teachers probably have to be there by 7:30AM. There is much that goes on before school in order to be prepared and there are usually meetings of various committees, etc. Tara's dark classroom(or simply her absence) could have been noticed by someone by 7:45. Alarm would have set in at 8AM when the students arrived to no teacher. A phone call would have been placed to Tara's cell, land line, and then whoever she had listed as "the person to contact in case of an emergency." I know of a case in which the Principal went to the "late" teacher's house and another in which LE was sent first. Her school had a policy to follow and probably did so...and very quickly. That first contact person may have called in others.

[justbrowsing2]

How many wives would think it is ok for their husband to go rescue a pretty woman and leave them at home? How many wives would think it was ok to spend the night with them. How many wives would say I will go too and not let the husband go alone? why is a married man calling 20 times? Why did Hd and Av get into a verbal conflict the day at the gas station. Could Hd of been jealous? Why even say anything to a young boy? Why didn't they answer the door? Why did Tara wait until Hd was gone to bail Av out? Could she have been afraid to make Hd mad? If they were only close friends then why did Hd say anything to Av? What did it matter to him since he is married. He should of shook his hand and said nice to meet you. He should have been glad to meet another friend of Tara's. Do you think Hd has control issues. Maybe his wife can't go with him and has to keep her mouth shut. just thinking outloud. :cool:

[goldylocks]

I'll bite why cant she go and why does she have to keep her mouth shut?

[justbrowsing2]

forgot this,
Why wouldn't Hd come back to tara's house around 6:00am to check on her before school if he was so worried to go over in the middle of the night? just wondering.

[Atok]

Originally posted by justbrowsing2
How many wives would think it is ok for their husband to go rescue a pretty woman and leave them at home?

Depends on the relationship.

How many wives would think it was ok to spend the night with them.

When did he spend the night with her?

How many wives would say I will go too and not let the husband go alone?

Suspicious wives wouldn't let their husbands out alone and wives with children to take care of would stay behind since this is a midnight drive.

why is a married man calling 20 times?

I see you get your info from the National Enquirer.

Why did Hd and Av get into a verbal conflict the day at the gas station.

Sorry, I wasn't there.

Could Hd of been jealous?

Jealous of WHAT?

Why even say anything to a young boy?

Is AV a young boy? HD can't address someone if they are younger than him??

Why didn't they answer the door?

If there was an altracation earlier maybe they didn't want to continue it at the house so they ignored the "young boy".

Why did Tara wait until Hd was gone to bail Av out?

Um.. maybe she felt he could cool his heels a bit? Could be she was having an important conversation with HD and couldn't be interrupted at that time.

Could she have been afraid to make Hd mad?

I don't think Tara had a bone in her body afraid of HD. Other people maybe.

If they were only close friends then why did Hd say anything to Av? What did it matter to him since he is married. He should of shook his hand and said nice to meet you. He should have been glad to meet another friend of Tara's.

This all depends on what AV said to HD, dont you think? Maybe AV wasn't starting out friendly himself. Again I sure don't know I wasn't there.

Do you think Hd has control issues.

You're asking for my opinion? I don't know HD personally. Perhaps someone who does can address that. Actually I think MOST people in the Law Profession have control issues, but again that's JMO.

Maybe his wife can't go with him and has to keep her mouth shut.

I'm sure his wife couldn't go with him and is required to keep quiet about stuff TO THE PUBLIC because this is an ongoing investigation and her husband is a police captain. She certainly can talk to the investigative team anytime she feels she has a piece of valuable insight or information.

/whew!

BTW I don't know anyone in Ocilla personally, wouldn't recognize them if they sat next to me on a park bench.

[justbrowsing2]

Sorry I meant to say young man. I would think that Hd would know how to handle the situation with Av without it escalating to a "young man" knocking at Tara's door. He was in LE and a captain at that. Why didn't he take care of the situation? This is strange. If Tara was so scared of something why didn't she have a friend, AG, stay with her. Why didn't she stay with a friend if so scared. This is strange. :confused:

[justbrowsing2]

I have to wonder since HD is a police captain and protecting Tara from who knows what, why didn't she get a restraing order from the person or people she was so scared of. A police captain should suggest that.

[IBC]

Originally posted by justbrowsing2 I have to wonder since HD is a police captain and protecting Tara from who knows what, why didn't she get a restraing order from the person or people she was so scared of. A police captain should suggest that.

Who knows if she was scared.

I'm not so sure HD wanted to be involved in any with with the local LE. Sounds like T may not have wanted to be involved with them either - reference SF.

[The R]

OK...I missed it....

would someone post who alerted HD that Tara might be missing and why he showed at midnight Sunday night at her house?

Thanks,
R

[Babes]

Originally posted by The R
OK...I missed it....

would someone post who alerted HD that Tara might be missing and why he showed at midnight Sunday night at her house?

Thanks,
R

My theory is that Faye is supposed to meet Tara on Sunday at Hawkinsville and when Tara didnt arrive she contacted HD and see if Tara's with him maybe. And then HD tried to contact Tara through phone but cannot reach her and since he probably called about 20 times, he waited for his shift at work or maybe wait till his wife is sleeping and rush to Tara's house to check if she's there. When Tara isnt answering the door HD called Faye again to tell her than no one is answering the door so Faye tried to contact Mr Portier and check with him if they see Tara ..maybe Mr P said Tara is probably sleeping already and the car is there .... I dont know just a theory here.

[Esah]

Matthew 7:1,

That about wraps it up! Did you sleep last night? lol

Wow, you did a remarkable job. The thing that impresses me most is how you have left opinionated remarks out. You have put this wealth of information together in an objective way, so that the reader can form their own opinions. Your posts are not pointing fingers, only pointing out details!

Thank you for doing this. There have been a few new people on here lately and your post will help them to get an overview of what we have spent months sorting through.

Now with all of it in one place, maybe someone will read this and be able to come up with a new thought about Tara and her whereabouts. The missing piece!

Good Job.

[Saunterer]

Originally posted by Esah
snip ... Thank you for doing this. There have been a few new people on here lately and your post will help them to get an overview of what we have spent months sorting through.

Now with all of it in one place, maybe someone will read this and be able to come up with a new thought about Tara and her whereabouts. The missing piece!

Good Job. MOO - Yes, the numbers of threads and posts show amazing continued interest in this case. But there have been many posts with questions/comments which appear to have been adequately addressed before. For newbies (and I include myself as one) I found the CL articles to be very useful for background information. And while I did not go back and read every post on every thread, I found some of the first posts to be very useful also. I think the "Tara Grinstead, 30, Missing ...." thread must have been the first one.
http://board2.courttv.com/showthread.php?threadid=244793&pagenumber=1

There are links there to some early reports ... one dated 10/25 which verifies the early involvement of the GBI ...
http://walb.com/Global/story.asp?S=4026341

... and another (11/2) on the early search efforts, including the involvement of the GEMA and Office of Homeland Security, and some (IMO very interesting) comments by Sheriff Youghn (while he was still talking to the press).
http://walb.com/Global/story.asp?S=4064869

There are also some early speculations about what happened, early information about the lamp and clock, a transcription of "Meghan's" 10/25 post on voy.com, and more.

[concernedperson]

Saunterer,

That is a very interesting article from the Albany station. I had never seen it before. Please post it one or two of the newer threads as a general reference as it may bear relevance as the days go forward.

Thanks so much.

[fsbiii]

Harper attended further training on December 1, 2005 to get his minimum 20 hours in for 2005. He does not show up as being employed presently by law enforcement or at any time in 2005.

OCILLA POLICE DEPARTMENT
1996 to 2000

IRWIN CO. SHERIFFS OFFICE
1995 to 1996

BEN HILL CO. SHERIFFS OFFICE
1994 to 1995

[bred]

So would someone from Ocilla be kind enough to tell us what he IS doing now? I realize it's not a fact that will help Tara be located...but it will help us in our sorting out details. TY

[concernedperson]

The only thing I can say is older people are not inclined to get involved with younger people's business. They may have thought she was having a rendevous(sp) with a suitor and weren't about to get into that action.For what they knew everything was cool and Tara has a right to expect privacy. Her mom could be conceived as meddling in their minds. Granted I don't know these people at all. I am just given a different perspective.

[concernedperson]

The only thing I can say is night blindness. I know it has affected me. I won't drive at night at all. Don't know if this was a factor but I can tell you, if it were, you drive the roads that you know really well. You are racing to beat the darkness. And when you get to your destination you are relieved.But, I understand the other things you are saying.

[Luckys_Wife]

If the last call was to HD then is it possible that HD actually used Taras phone to call his house to let his wife know...it was over ? Just a thought.

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone


DITTO GENERAL! That timeline still gives me fits. Glad I am not the only one puzzled about this discrepancy/contradiction/conflict - oh, what to call it!

I will give you another one to ponder.

Dr. G. says: " HD did phone Faye Grinstead around 12:15 am Monday morning sitting in front of Tara's home and Faye in turn phoned Mrs. Portier to see if she had seen Tara."

Faye says to NG:
GRACE: So you did call Sunday night?

GRINSTEAD: Sunday night.

GRACE: Right.

GRINSTEAD: I did not call her Saturday night. It was very late, say 12:30 or 1:00. I did call the neighbors to see if a car was home or if anything looked unusual.

GRACE: What did they say?

GRINSTEAD: They didn`t seem to think anything looked unusual, that the car was there. They had been gone all day and didn`t get back until late, but they said the car was there. Nothing looked unusual.

By this, Faye did not know that HD was at Tara's house. If so he would have said Tara's car is here. Why would you call next door to verify this?

I think that is why Faye did not mention HD's name. I bet she called Maria H. and others but did not mention thiem. Some people were concerned about Tara late Sunday night. Maria was at the house early the next morning.

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by Sassy


Well, I heard it was HEAVILY suggested that she and "GOOFY" were intimate but I did not see this with my own eyes and I am not privy to their intimacy AND I can't provide a link.....so you may or may not believe me.....it is JMOHO...

Sorry but I could not resist that one......

Well if Minnie goes missing and is harmed, you can bet it is her past and lifestye that caused this. Don't she know Goofy is a DOG?

[ocean]

quote:Originally posted by Justice4Tara

I hope Minnie isn't reading this...


:)

ocean

[baffled]

While reading over the post and the timeline that Dr.Godwin states Tara was abducted/disappeared and then the phone calls that were made from her house (leading to believe that the time frame may not be accurate)

Is it possible that calls were made from Tara home, but not by herself. Would it be possible for someone to have abducted Tara and placed the calls themselves.... she could have been abducted at the earliest hour Dr. G had suggested the person may have taken her car and come back to her house and placed the calls ; therefore making it appear that it would be logical that Tara would have had to been present at the alloted times the calls were outgoing.

Sometimes I'm not so good at wording things just so.....
Maybe it's not too confusing.

[benhill29]

yes....you have one taker.
:rose: Always for Tara

[Luckys_Wife]

I was the one who wondered if it was possible that HD used Tara's phone to call his own number. I wondered this because I find it odd that she (Tara) would call a married man at such a late hour. Also, we have never heard any information placing HD on duty at this hour or anywhere else. So I figured him to be home. I was under the impression that the last 3 calls came from Taras phone. ME then MH (female friend) and last to HD. If this is inaccurcate then I apologize, it is what has been stated early on in the court tv threads, and I was going from that.

Also, if records have been obtained, and they show that HD was not in Ocilla on the 22nd. If the calls were made after 12:00am then it was the 23rd. Where was he on the 23rd? Where does his cell place him on this date?

[concernedperson]

I still like MH for the murder, SF for the alibi and ML for additional coverup. Then the list can be added to for additional coverup. Like where best to hide a body after it has been moved. That could bring in the turkey guy and then the rest of them for the best shut-up in history in a small town. I don't know if they got lessons from Aruba or Aruba got lessons from them but they seemed to be in the same mindset.

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by seekeroftruth


You can like whoever you want to but this is not a popularity contest nor is it American Idol. Facts are necessary. Right now we have ONE poi who has been placed at the "scene" during the period between when she was last seen and when she was reported missing. His alibi has to be evaluated. It only makes sense. I don't care if he is a nice All American guy or not. I want to know where he was ALL weekend and what the heck he was doing at her house at midnight the evening before she was reported missing.

I understand that facts are necessary and no, I don't think this is American Idol, and in fact I have never watched it.I do wonder why you were kicked out of the Tara Center though. Would you care to share the circumstances?

[Luckys_Wife]

Originally posted by MATTHEWsevenone


Lucky - Great questions! By the way, what are your thoughts about why he would use Tara's phone to call his own number??
Keep in mind this is just a theory..

If HD and Tara were more than friends and he is still married when she disappeared this tells me that he had not/was not leaving his wife for Tara. My thoughts were he may have disposed of Tara for the sake of his marriage. He could have called her (wife) to tell her what happened. She may have known in advance or not. There have and there are women who would cover for their husbands especially if she believed he did this for her. Him being a police officer with knowlegde of a crime scene investigation it may have made sense to use her phone instead of his own. I guess it would all depend on the actual timeline of events.....

[jela72]

GREAT post, seeker. Logical, fair and valuable to the case, as your posts usually are (outside of playing in traffic with mooloo, lol).

ESPECIALLY your last sentence! (And .... I respond to that sentence with: ME TOO!)



Originally posted by seekeroftruth


You can like whoever you want to but this is not a popularity contest nor is it American Idol. Facts are necessary. Right now we have ONE poi who has been placed at the "scene" during the period between when she was last seen and when she was reported missing. His alibi has to be evaluated. It only makes sense. I don't care if he is a nice All American guy or not. I want to know where he was ALL weekend and what the heck he was doing at her house at midnight the evening before she was reported missing.

[Luckys_Wife]

I also think HD had motive.....including losing his wife and kids as which is not easy if you have an established marriage. Maybe Tara wanted more.....she wanted marriage and kids of her own. Maybe she threated to tell? Or maybe he was obsessed with her and she was trying to break it off......and maybe he found out about her resent trip to MH's home.

MH could have killed her in a fit of rage IMO, but I can't see why he would want her gone. There were over......both had moved on...so what does he have to gain?
Anythings possible...IMOO

[jela72]

Hmmm. And this theory cannot be ruled out until we know more.
Yep, IF (if,, if) HD knows more, his wife may know that little bit more, too. Who's to say?

After reading up here, I joined this forum to post due to the 'ominous secrecy' that seemed to prevail around HD's (alarming) presence right outside of Tara's house. We know he was there and his calls were made right outside T's house.

What we DON'T know, as yet, is whether or not HD was actually in his car. We do know HD and his mobile phone were there.

And his being in LE gives him great understanding with regard to 'criminal investigation'....

Again, just adding to your theory :

Originally posted by Luckys_Wife

Keep in mind this is just a theory..

If HD and Tara were more than friends and he is still married when she disappeared this tells me that he had not/was not leaving his wife for Tara. My thoughts were he may have disposed of Tara for the sake of his marriage. He could have called her (wife) to tell her what happened. She may have known in advance or not. There have and there are women who would cover for their husbands especially if she believed he did this for her. Him being a police officer with knowlegde of a crime scene investigation it may have made sense to use her phone instead of his own. I guess it would all depend on the actual timeline of events.....

[Luckys_Wife]

Originally posted by seekeroftruth


Good point LW.

On the flip side. There are men who would cover for their wife too. I am not saying that is what happened. Knowing why he was really there at midnight and where he was the rest of the weekend would help a lot. IMO

Your right seeker...its just as possible there could be a whole other person responsible....one with a motive: jeolousy, anger, rage, resentment. And IMO most men would cover for thier wives if they were the very ones that caused the whole mess in the first place. Why haven't we heard about where MRS. HD was on the night in question...maybe its ther same reason we haven't heard about HD whereabouts either. IMO

[jela72]

And we've seen it SO many times, before, LW. recall Anne Marie Fahey - beautiful young intern seeing the prominent lawyer, Capano.... Chandra Levy's mysterious disappearance - seeing the prominent politician Gary Condit - to save tedious reading, there are many more; most involve high profile men dating 'pretty single females' - who tragically disappear.

We cannot RULE out HD. He drives 90 miles cross-county as (reportedly) Tara tells him, and only him, she is in 'Real Danger'. He tells absolutely no-one this and takes it upon himself to check up on her. Once there - he calls TARA'S MOTHER after midnight - and Faye calls the neighbours. MEANWHILE - we HAVE to ask: DID Faye actually KNOW HD was parked right there? Or ... could he have misled Faye by what he DIDN'T say? He could have simply said:

"I've been trying to reach Tara ... no luck ... is she ok?"

Faye may have easily assumed HD was at his home (or thereabouts). HE could SEE the neighbour's house! HE could have walked on over and asked if tara had gone to them, or talked with them earlier that night. HE could have (and SHOULD have bashed her door and alerted emergency...) NOT just slink off into the darkness and keep mum about his midnight driving session - UNTIL .... phone records placed him there.

Agreed: until we know more - it's not our place to judge. BUT judging by what we DO know - well .... hmmmmm?


Originally posted by Luckys_Wife


Your right seeker...its just as possible there could be a whole other person responsible....one with a motive: jeolousy, anger, rage, resentment. And IMO most men would cover for thier wives if they were the very ones that caused the whole mess in the first place. Why haven't we heard about where MRS. HD was on the night in question...maybe its ther same reason we haven't heard about HD whereabouts either. IMO

[Luckys_Wife]

I would imagine that Tara knew HD's wife...so its entirely possible she would have left with her to confront HD? They take their own cars. Then after she got her to go along. they pull over ...they argue.....she killed her (a gun maybe) far enough out that it would not be heard. Maybe it was the Mrs. that made the call from Taras house to HD that night. Maybe HD had no idea until after the fact, but was left with no choice but to cover for his wife. Maybe he followed her back to Taras car so the Mrs could drive it back. and another woman would know to keep her purse and keys if it was to look as if she just left on her own... If HD did call her numerous times on sunday to apologize and tell her he loved her........hmmmm maybe he really is sorry....IMO
...just trying out other angles...

[concernedperson]

The first time I read that article I thought "What would it take to convince the sheriff it was a crime scene....pools of blood on the floor and sprayed on the walls"? Re-reading it I still say the same thing....it is like he diminishes the oddities and wants everyone else to do the same. And the comment about searching for at least 7 or so more days indicates he was giving lip service to the investigation. JMO.

[baffled]

What is the possibilty that Terra was meeting someone after the bbq and hadn't told anyone? Maybe she planned to pick them up at a desginated location, did so and that person brougth harm to her (with previous intent of doing so) disposed of her body and drove her car home, and spent hours at her home searching through her things to anything that might link him/her to Tara as a reasoning of bringing harm to her over issues that may have arisen in the past few weeks. The perp could have placed the calls so that it seem Tara was physically at her home at that hour.

If the theory is that there was an accompliance, it would have been easy for the 2nd to pick up the 1st from Taras home, and that person came back the second time to make sure the scene was a clean as possible; pretty much checking after the 1st to make sure nothing is left to be linked to him/them.

[fsbiii]

I think baffled's theory is a good one. It also lines up with the info sweettater was trying to convey about other guys in the picture. I've always thought the "going home to watch the pageant video" after 11pm on a Saturday night seemed strange. She just returned from the pageant--why watch the video that night?

[janis]

OK, nuther brainstorm.....If and I say "if", SF had told MH about HD being at her house when trouble with AV started....last call is supposedly from HD.....maybe Tara was meeting HD somewhere, rather than being caught at her house again???? Thoughts, anyone?

[baffled]

Another thing just came to mind.....

I think it would be a good idea to go back a few weeks or as far as a month with the cell phone signals for the people in question now.

If they feel it was premidated and the disposal site had been pre -selected... maybe once graphed out it would show a particular location that had been visited more than once......

If I put myself in the situation that I was preselecting a site I would visit that area more than once to get a feel for the place, to really check it out.

Any thoughts on that?

[janis]

Baffled, best idea I have heard in a while. My thoughts about Tara maybe meeting HD, was because of statement by MHulett, regarding "Tara would have left her cell, if she didn't want to be bothered"............I just really think cell phone records and clay sample from tire, would solve all of this. I just don't understand what is taking them so long. Unless, these recent searches with the dogs are stemming from that info.

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by fsbiii
I think baffled's theory is a good one. It also lines up with the info sweettater was trying to convey about other guys in the picture. I've always thought the "going home to watch the pageant video" after 11pm on a Saturday night seemed strange. She just returned from the pageant--why watch the video that night?

I so agree on watching a video, never made sense.
On the theory, if this was planned, the perp would have had to set up a meeting. It would not have been an accidental face-to-face.
IMO

[Luckys_Wife]

Originally posted by GeneralLee
Another angle:

In theory only, suppose Tara felt uncomfortable for some reason around the neighbor, but was unable to put her finger on the reason and unable to tell anyone, except for HD.

Suppose she told HD about her uncomfortable feeling and
he is the only one who knew what her feelings were about the neighbor?

I realize that Mr. P is a city councilman and a church going upstanding citizen, according to all the locals. I do realize his support in that area, but I'm only theorizing, considering we really don't KNOW WHAT happened to Tara. (And I'm not lucky enough to be local and KNOW him personally, so I'm totally unobjective here.)

Could it be possible that HD didn't go to the neighbor's home because maybe the neighbor was the "danger" Tara talked to him about? (I'm speculating ONLY, not fact, ok? Just brainstorming.)

If neighbor made her uncomfortable in some way, maybe she only told HD, because most everyone in the town knows the man, so who would she tell that would believe her? Who could she say something like that to?
Maybe only HD, considering he is in LE?

AND, considering the position of Mr. P in the city government, Tara couldn't report anything to the police, right? The chief was on Mr. P's speed-dial! Tara knows the close knit group in Ocilla, so who could she tell?

So, my speculations make me ask why we keep turning away from a man who knew so much about her life, her habits, her routines, watched out of his window nightly for her lamp to come on, worked in the yard with her, had a key to her home, says he also had a key to her car (?), was the VERY FIRST person inside her home BEFORE police got there, supposedly straightened up a bit inside her home, raked and mowed her yard, etc.
I'm not in any way saying HE DID IT, I'm only going through the paces of a theory. Again, slam me if you want, but I'm just working through a new angle on why HD or Faye (if she knew that HD was there) would not mention to the neighbors that HD was in Tara's yard, or driveway that night. What if in doing so would have also put HD in danger in some way? Just typing what I'm weighing out in order to weed it out if it's not plausible.

I do still find it odd that we've never heard from Mrs. P on anything. I just kept expecting the couple from next door to Tara, the really close neighbors, to appear together in interviews or atleast hear Mrs. P's side of the story. We've only seen the Mr. not the Mrs. -ever-
I think it most definatly should be looked into. He has done things (washing her car, cleaning) that are in the very least odd.
Im not sure if anyone else has seen the picture of Tara with Mr and Mrs. P ?.......if not check it out....Mr P seems to be clutching Tara and Mrs P looks a little uncomfortable (IMOO) ..but it certainly makes you theory reasonable. (IMOO of course)

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by GeneralLee
Zip4spd, you asked
"If they were so concerned about TG, then why wait until the police were already called before they went over that monday morning."

I must correct your understanding of this.

You asked WHY they waited until after police were called to go over on Monday, correct?

Well, they didn't wait. The didn't go at 12:30-1:00AM, obviously, but they did go over.........and used the house key.........and went inside Tara's home...........and looked around.........and it's said that they straightened up a bit inside (someone reported that Mr. P was down trying to coax Tara's cat to come out from under the bed that morning) .......and all of this was done BEFORE the police were called.

Reportedly, Mrs. P was inside the home with Mr. P when they were "looking for Tara."

Tara's home is very small. I believe that upon hollering out her name at the door, and she didn't answer, they should have shut the door and called police right away.

Instead, they spend TIME inside there.
Mr. P even called the school to see if Tara was at work.
Why not call police right away?
I mean, her car was there, right?
Let the police determine that she was at school, and then it was better safe than sorry, but instead, he called her JOB to see if she was there?

Yes, I have doubts about things that I cannot clear up.

And for one person in particular who wrote about this:
Did you see someone get smacked with the newspaper?
I have always felt like you were a witness, but afraid to come forward. Go as high up as you can and then tell it.
TELL IT! Tell what you saw.

Reread Maria's interview.
When she got there the door was unlocked and the police were there. She did not see the clock until her second visit to the bedroom and she said it was under the bed.

[IBC]

The theories surrounding T's disappearance have become so wide and bizarre that I quit posting.

Early posters suggested that Mr. P should be thoroughly checked. However, many Ocillans think that to consider him a suspect would be violating sacred ground; he's apparently considered as a very "nice old man" who would never do something to Tara.

Mr. P should be thoroughly questioned and, along with others, should be a POI. Mabye it will turn out he is just a considerate old man, but someone abducted Tara, and right now no one this close to the investigation can be eliminated.

[justbrowsing2]

Does anyone know if Mr. P's cabin property has been searched with dogs? I feel it should be to rule that out.

[zorro]

I have a simple question about MH's alibi for Saturday night /Sunday morning. His attorney stated in the Greta interview, "Marcus can account for every minute of his time during that time. He has provided that information to the GBI." If MH spent the morning hours with patrolman SF in a squad car patrolling the streets of Ocilla then where are the witnesses to confirm this? From roughly 1:30 am to 5:30, MH is riding along with the officer. Did the officer have any call-outs during this time? Did the officer issue any citations? Did the officer stop for a snack or meal during this time? Did the officer get a potty-break during this time?
I would think a lawyer as competent as Pajadas could find some witnesses to confirm if MH was in the patrol car the whole time and where the car was.
In my opinion, it seems like a good attorney would want to clear his client from any suspicion as quickly as possible.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,174968,00.html

[concernedperson]

That information has never been forthcoming and remains part of the mystery. No denials or affirmations. So,it only fuels the fire for complicity IMO.

[Atok]

You can't defend your client if you learn that he is guilty. A defense attorney doesn't ask his client that question. Those details are not something TP wants to know or currently needs to know. His job is to defend from accusations made by prosecution in a court of law. His public role is to answer interviews only if he feels it would benefit his client. Since the first interview of MH did not strengthen the feeling he is innocent in the court of public opinion, do not expect any further grantings of public interviews.

Since MH is not on trial, TP does not need to know anything more detailed than what his client has shared. If MH is ever brought to accusation in a court of law then TP will have to start preparing a more rigerous defense.

[hypnotized]

Originally posted by zorro
I have a simple question about MH's alibi for Saturday night /Sunday morning. His attorney stated in the Greta interview, "Marcus can account for every minute of his time during that time. He has provided that information to the GBI." If MH spent the morning hours with patrolman SF in a squad car patrolling the streets of Ocilla then where are the witnesses to confirm this? From roughly 1:30 am to 5:30, MH is riding along with the officer. Did the officer have any call-outs during this time? Did the officer issue any citations? Did the officer stop for a snack or meal during this time? Did the officer get a potty-break during this time?
I would think a lawyer as competent as Pajadas could find some witnesses to confirm if MH was in the patrol car the whole time and where the car was.
In my opinion, it seems like a good attorney would want to clear his client from any suspicion as quickly as possible.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,174968,00.html


Hello all...I continue to hope!

I have wondered if the SF/patrol car had been searched or offered to the dog searchers for inspection. And on that same thought, cars, trucks, etc., belonging to MH?


:rose:

[Mindis]

Originally posted by Sassy


Wasn't it mother's home at 5:30 - 10:30a.m. (sleeping)....then to father's home in town at 10:30....and who knows where after that....

I think so.. sounds right.. MH was probably with SF that night but whether they were in the patrol car is questionable.. MH had something to do with Tara's disappearance and the truth will come out eventually.. Once Tara is found there will be more evidence linking MH.. It's just a matter of time..

[Mindis]

It was cancelled according to findtara.com :

3/31/06 - Nancy Grace - cancellation
We're sad to report that Tara's story has been bumped from the line up for the Nancy Grace Show tonight. There are many things being covered that are happening at the moment and Nancy had to move the piece on Tara to another date. When it is rescheduled we will make that announcement.

[justbrowsing2]

I agree with General Lee. I want to know other people's alibis of the timelines. Like Hd for one!!

[justbrowsing2]

If I remember correctly MH was searching for her and also had a helicopter searching and Anita said he wasn't allowed to help search. So I would say he tried and Anita didn't want him to help because she already has him guilty. What a shame if she is wrong.

[justbrowsing2]

I didn't say MH hired a helicopter to search. I said he was in a helicopter searching for her. Why is it that whenever someone trys to say anything that MH has done you get so upset. I think that you have made someone guilty before proven by law. Do you have some great evidence or info on MH that you should share with everyone? We are just discussing what we have available to us. Why are you so sure MH is guilty?

[IBC]

I jumped on the MH Guilty Bandwagon, perhaps somehow aided by SF, and am not certain I'm off it, but other possibilities keep creeping into this scenario.

Whoever did this definitely has to be local. Interstate 75 isn't close enough that someone would just wander over to Ocilla. You might drive through Ocilla to get to a few other towns, but even then, there are alternative routes. Someone following or stalking her from outside Ocilla without raising a red flag doesn't seem logical.

Also, random abductors/murderers don't usually take time to hide a body so well and clean up the scene. It's been suggested that the culprit returned to the house, another indication of local involvement.

When you look at obvious suspects, it's not surprising MH receives the #1 culprit vote. But, I think women in Ocilla need to ask themselves what their husbands, boyfriends, partners, brothers, dads were doing that night. Sisterhood could very well help solve Tara's disappearance.

[fsbiii]

What were Harper and Hilton gonna do if someone got too close? Snipe them from the helicopter?

J4T, people have accused me of being too hard on Harper from the start of all this, and I have admitted he is my GUT choice, and still is. But you seem to be 110% convinced of his guilt and offer a lot of "oh, there's more to come" statements each day. Can you share any of this, or is it just idle information that fits into the outcome you want? I have learned to open my eyes a little wider the last few months, and it's a great feeling.

No one posting on the boards knows who is responsible (except the guilty party or parties themselves if they are online). I'd just like some clarity on why it is you are so certain of Harper's guilt.

[sweettater]

I agree with fsbiii. If you have info that would indicate more probability of guilt toward ANY of the poi's, you need to bring it forward. Playground theatrics don't convince anyone of anything. No offense meant by this, and I'm not insinuating you are not privaledged to info, but anyone can post over and over "I know something you don't know". (We all got that part ;) )

[fsbiii]

This was the tip that came from a computer in the Ben Hill County school system, right? IMO, if TES was all set to go on Harper land, they should've stayed the course. I don't know that to be a factual statement, however, and I trust TES did what they thought was best under the circumstances at the time.

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

Maybe divert attention elsewhere if searchers headed in that direction. Like the *tip* that coincidentally came in the day TES was all set to get on Harper land. If you recall, this *tip* led them to another county.

[suzee]

MH did pledge money along with thousands of others. He did search because I saw him. He help hire a private helicopter because I was witness to that to and no JH was not the pilot of that one. I have posted this before and it has been discussed. Maybe some have missed it, so I am repeating the same information again. Not in the defense, but just for facts. Hopes this helps eliminate some wasted time arguing what MH did and did not do.

[gafan33]

re. Genral lee comments
I agree with General Lee. I want to know other people's alibis of the timelines. Like Hd for one!!




General Lee, I would like to know more about TG's relationship with HD. I fail to understand why so many fingers are pointing at MH and not at HD. One was as involved as the other with TG from what we have read so far, along with numerous others. IMHO I would like to see the good ppl of Irwin County get behind MH with their support. Also too, JMHO, this message board has only been filled with gossip, rumors, and heresay. I have not read one post that has proved anything beyond a reasonable doubt that has helped in finding Tara.

Praying for Tara to come home.

[suzee]

t was one of the very first searches before Anita asked him not to return to the Tara center. There were hundreds of people searching. I believe it may have been either the first massive Sunday search. I do know from talking with him what the amount was and if you want to know you can call and ask him. It has nothing to do with finding Tara. It is something for you to use in your negative way to destroy his reputation. If he pledged a million would it be too much or too little? If he pledge nothing at all that would be a problem too. I did see the helipcopter fly over the Tara center and I do know that it did fly over land in Irwin and land in other counties. This was not the only search he or his family did either. Nothing he does is going to be good enough for those who have already convicted him. IMOPO this is not helping to find Tara, this is only bashing him and his family. Did you search for her. Did you donate money? What about the other people who are considered to be so called "persons of interest" did they search? Did they pay money? I can;t for the life of me understand what difference it makes. Good Lord,. I didn't know her and I gave money and searched. does this make me guilty? The board on CTv was beginning to become a peaceful and pleasant place for people to discuss their feelling s and pull together and now that some are allowed back on, it is becoming such a hateful place to be once again. And just for the record, Just because MH went to school with ML does not mean they are friends. I have never heard him speak of him and neither have many others. MH hasn't hidden anything from anyone. He has told his where abouts, given up e-mails, private letters, given a poly and abilged by every thing the LAW has asked him to do. I would assume since the LE isn't beating down his door and questioning him, they must know more than we do. Everyone involved in this horrible tragedy can't be corrupt, this isn't the movies, it's a nightmare and I hope any day we all wake up and she is standing on her front porch with a smile on her face and ready to begin a new life. Hate and judgement doesn't get you far in life, it will consume you and destroy you. Thank goodness MH and his family are good Christian people who are forgiving and contiue to pray for Tara and her family every day.

[oldyeller]

Originally posted by Sassy


The reward money is $200,000. $100,000 from Liberty National Ins. Co. and $100,000 from another source. I have heard nothing about any pledges from MH. If this is not accurate feel free to come forward and correct me.

i read somewhere that liberty co gave $50,000 so the other 50 came from somewhere else

[fsbiii]

Oldyeller is right according to media reports...

"Two rewards are being offered: $100,000 for Grinstead's safe return and $100,000 for information leading to the arrest and conviction of anyone responsible for her disappearance. Half of the reward for her safe return is funded by Liberty National Insurance Co., where Grinstead's father is a vice president, while the other half is from donors in Ocilla and surrounding communities. An anonymous individual is funding the second reward."

[Mindis]

Originally posted by GeneralLee
You know, sometimes FACT is much more strange than FICTION, yet when someone gives an alibi for their whereabouts and it is air-tight (so to speak) we look at that in a HMMMMM? kinda way.
But what about those who HAVE NO ALIBI? Why are we all over MH because he HAS SUCH A GREAT ALIBI, but we aren't nailing down those who DON'T HAVE A GREAT ALIBI????

It seems like to me that no matter whether or not MH produced a video camera with him on it all night long showing him in another town, some of you would still say he did this.

Can't you look deeper into those who have a weak alibi or NO alibi?

PS: iiin bed with my spouse, sleeping, is not a good enough alibi to me. My husband sleeps so deeply and snores so loudly that I could crank up a chainsaw by that man's ear and saw the house in half, clean up the mess, change my clothes and hop back in bed and he wouldn't miss a SNORT in his sleep, so don't tell me that "in bed sleeping with my spouse" holds much water.
And besides, smokers sometimes go out for a while to catch a puff and their spouse is sleeping right through it because they are used to them going out in the night to puff on a cancer stick.
So, you can be in bed, get out of bed and your spouse thinks NOTHING if it's your normal routine. AND if you had been married for 30 years or more, sometimes you don't even sleep in the same ROOM, so if you got up and went out, your spouse may not even KNOW IT. So, let's look at the NO alibi people or the WEAK alibi people, unless there's more info on MH that people just have not shared here. I am just not convinced he's involved in this in any way.

How much of the reward money did MH pledge? Anybody know? [/B]

Bingo! And it won't be shared until Tara is found and the perp is in custody..

[grandline]

Originally posted by Ocillian

If someone does do something (reward and search) they're covering something up or just simply knows the truth. If someone doesn't do something(reward and search), they don't care. I wonder if this stands true for all POIs involved?

I can't find myself to think like this. And of course....IMO.

Exactly. Darned if they do, darned if they don't (IMO)

I find nothing wrong with brainstorming and speculating/theorizing but I'm bothered by some of witch-hunts that have gone on (IMO).

It seems like every new bit of info we get ends up being twisted to meet someone's agenda (IMO). Perhaps we should just take the FACTS for what they are instead of trying to create double-meanings in everything (IMO).

Did I make it clear that this was all just my opinon? :lol:

[suzee]

You are so right Matthewsevenone MH has let these things roll off his back b/c he wants as much as anyone to find T and for her to come home. Just imagine waking up one day to realize the person you spent the last 6 years with has disappeared without atrace and for absolutley no visible reason, one person i her family accuses you out of the blue of doing something with that person.
He has done searches of places she loved to visit in hopes that she may be there lost in crowds trying to pull her life together. Many people that TRULY new her and TALKED and SAW her daily have searched in places that are not mentioned. For some reason the LE has not changed her status, she is still a missing person.
He and others knew of other men in her life, there was no jealousyon his part regardless of what one believes. He let her know in the very begininng he was dedicated to his job (see Greta interview) and those that know him best know this fact about him.
He doesn't have to prove his innocence, the judicial system will do that. There are only a few people who doubt him and most of them are either on this board or out of town. Those that know M, love him and respect him. His involvement isn't in vain but in the same effort as the rest who want to find T.

[janis]

I am looking forward to a response from that post.:D


:seeya:

[oldyeller]

Originally posted by Sassy


No bites yet, Jan....hmmmm

fish usually don't bite when the bait is real obvious. what fish wants to get eaten?

i wouldn't mind seeing the answers to those questions for MH and HD too though. those are the 2 i am looking at the moment and the more i can leanr maybe i can make some snese out of it

[suzee]

I will tell you what I know about M.
When he was little, he looked just like one of the little boys off the little rascals, except much cuter. Even as a small child he adored army men and would always say things like, I'm gonna save the world. He loved his mama and daddy and spent time with his family. He was a child who never got in trouble, he had good friends, good grades, and was one of the most considerate children in the classroom.
His compasssion for animals was amazing. He wouldn't even kill a wasp. He would always try to "shew' it out of the way instead of spraying it down and causing it harm. He was a child who showed respect to all adults and to any girl around him. His parents had instilled this trait in him. His love for the Lord was passionate. He grew up in a Christain home and T even went to Church with him and his mom.
He worked his way thru the military to anadvanced career, which some may find conspicuous, suspicious, or just down right confusing. He has such a great ability to follow orders, obey the rules and learn quickly that he rose to the top of the military without any trouble. He knew from a young child what a priviledge it was to be free, to be an American and to bellieve in a system of JUstice. His private life is just that, private. He still works the same job he did before T went missing. The type of work he does is not public and will not become public, that's an oath M took and will not break it for anyone. The LE knows this and I guess the public will just have to form their own opinion. His life is put on the line each and every time he gets on a plane and leaves the USA just as it is for others who serve. He loves his country, his community and his family, and is a tremendous asset to the lives of many.
He has given up alot in the last few months to protect his family and to assist in the search for T. He doesn';t advertise this, publisize this, or want any recongnition for this. and will probably not like the fact this is on the board if someone tells him. He and his mom do not read it . They know the truth and believe in God and have faith. their family prays each day this will end and that the outcome will be positive and that T will come home to Dolly and Madison. Just because the relationship was over, I am sure does not mean there the genuine feelings of caring are gone. M is not a hater!!!! Even after all this drama and harrassment his family has been put thru, he and his family remain positve that T imaybe out there and willl be found. To spend the day with M to me would be like spending the day with someone you knew you could depend on, someone who was loyal, who would take care of you if you needed it, and someone who would be your best friend and the sweetest little boy all rolled up into one.
Is he perfect... Of course not... No one is, except for Jesus Christ... But if I had a daughter his age and he showed up at my door to take her out on a date, I would get on lmy knees and thank God for the blessing he had sent to my daughter and to my family. Just for the record, I'm not family. I don't even see him more that 4-5 times in a year. But I know him and I know that family and I watched him grow up... And these are the things that I know about the man you call the person of interest.

[fsbiii]

The judicial system will prove Harper's innocence? Last I checked, the judicial system didn't prove anything. If he is charged with a crime, he will be presumed innocent and the State will have to prove his guiilt.

Since you mentioned judicial system, do you see things headed that way, Suzee?

Way more than "a few" people doubt him, too. You might need to wander a little further from the family tree to realize that. Take a poll nationwide and get back with us on it.

Originally posted by suzee
You are so right Matthewsevenone MH has let these things roll off his back b/c he wants as much as anyone to find T and for her to come home. Just imagine waking up one day to realize the person you spent the last 6 years with has disappeared without atrace and for absolutley no visible reason, one person i her family accuses you out of the blue of doing something with that person.
He has done searches of places she loved to visit in hopes that she may be there lost in crowds trying to pull her life together. Many people that TRULY new her and TALKED and SAW her daily have searched in places that are not mentioned. For some reason the LE has not changed her status, she is still a missing person.
He and others knew of other men in her life, there was no jealousyon his part regardless of what one believes. He let her know in the very begininng he was dedicated to his job (see Greta interview) and those that know him best know this fact about him.
He doesn't have to prove his innocence, the judicial system will do that. There are only a few people who doubt him and most of them are either on this board or out of town. Those that know M, love him and respect him. His involvement isn't in vain but in the same effort as the rest who want to find T.

[suzee]

I am so sorry, frisbee you must have missed the part about me not being on the family tree. And as far as the judicial system goes, you must first have an Indictment before you can actually have a case. An indictment (incase you don't know) is based on enough factualfactual information that enables the court system to press charges on someone and bring them to a trial. this is what i mean by the judicial sustem. I am so sorry that you do not know about the system. You can look this up on court 101.
Believing in the Judicial system as I stated, means that he will not be charged, because he did not do anything, and without and indictment you can not have a trial. Maybe this helps clear up some of your confusion. The judicial system proves everything, that's why we have it.......
As far as what the Nation thinks... Opinions are like bellybutton lint.... everyones has it... but......... Sorry if I sound so spiteful, but you have exhausted my kind side and you my dear are sending me away for a while. When I feel the need to be ugly and stoop to the levels of people like you, I become you, and that doesn't make a positive difference for me or for anyone else involved in this case. Have a great Easter....

[fsbiii]

Please don't leave on account of me, Suzee. I remember some of your postings from the prior message boards and how you ran away when questions started being asked. I'm sorry. Please stay. I don't mind your statements and inability to answer factual questions. Really, I don't. Please stay. Please.

[fsbiii]

People like "suzee" (and "joanne" for you longtimers) want us to THINK they know Marcus Harper. Notice that the other posters on here who know him never throw such blanket accusations out there and don't rush to criticize the Gattis family in their postings. She claims to see him 4-5 times a year but knows all about his warm and fuzzy feelings toward animals as a child? Joanne's husband worked with Marcus, and Joanne could tell you, supposedly, everything he ever did 24/7.

People overcompensate when people get too close to the truth.

[concernedperson]

Good point Chal, I think I figured out what MH did overseas. The way he wanted his face shown in profile on Greta, the fact that the military doesn't have parttime jobs, the fact that MH pops in and out of town leads me to believe he is a paid mercenary.

A lot of ex-military do this for good money especially in light of advanced stealth training and skills.

[Atok]

Questions that don't need answers, just pondering...

What turns a wasp-shooing, animal loving, cute lil rascal Christian boy into a mercenary?

Why would he prefer this life to one of marriage to Tara?

Was marriage to Tara a "not now" feeling or a "not ever" feeling for MH?

~Speculations~

The military service hardened him. Maybe 9/11 angered him. That's harsh to assume his faith would keep him from raising a gun. There are an awful lot of Christians who see no problem with miltary service. They don't see it as a conflict and some consider their work necessary to God's will as well.

We don't know he's a mercenary, maybe he's a hostage rescuer. It requires the same amount of secrecy. Maybe his heart is in that line of work.

He never was planning to marry Tara or anyone else for that matter. He doesn't see himself as able to settle down, he feels like a person with a mission and that image doesn't include a wife and kids. He doesn't want to put people he loves at risk nor does he want to get close enough to people when he's at risk. But a guys gotta have a girl... and so... the on again off again between him and Tara. She keeps hoping he'll change enough to want to marry and he sits in the position of not being ready. They love each other ~ they break it off ~ they cling, they repell...they try to move on.

Unfortunately something happened to Tara that doesn't look good. Assuming MH is innocent I bet he wishes he was out of the country when it occured and if he does find out who harmed her, it's going to be one messy confrontation.

That's all I'm ruminating on now folks...back to work for me...

:patriot:

[IBC]

There's a lot of people in Irwin Co. that know RR. I have not heard it mentioned that he is a suspect or even a POI.

[concernedperson]

There are mystery men and women in this case. But the bottom line is why searches are being impeded, why the initial crime scene was not secured, why the burned house w/ cadaver dog hits was not investigated from the get go, why every Tom, Dick and Harry was allowed in Tara's home to investigate her phone messages, why the sheriff gave this 15 days from the day she went missing as the end of the search, why the Tara Center is moved from location to location and then be dismissed, why did Dr. Godwin receive a death threat, why do we wonder that there is a conspiracy, why doesn't this solvable case get solved?

[Babes]

Ok, we needed some answers on this conflicting stories we are getting. Acording to Missy Davis Interview on TV that she spoke to Tara's bf about this and was sad on what happened . Now poster General Lee made a very good question.... Who is this BF. Some locals claimed it was RR. I checked some other threads and other message board and claimed it was RR too. Now another poster , IBC, said on his post

http://boards.courttv.com/showthread.php?threadid=246350&perpage=40&pagenumber=27


IBC
Member

Registered: Feb 2005
Location:
Posts: 251

If T replaced MH, it was not with RR - maybe DH - but not RR. RR, if I recall, is much younger than T and was not terribly interested.

T broke up with MH, presumeably because she wanted to move on with her life, get married, raise a family. MH was not ready for that life. However, T still deeply cared for MH. It sounds like MH was not over T either.

I dont want to put IBC on the spot but i felt someone needs to clear this informations because every angles on this case, whether these people are innocent or not, should be discussed.
If RR isnt the last bf then who is this guy Missy Davis referring to as the last BF. This is important because one neighbor claimed that they saw Tara on a curb talking to a boyfriend.

[Babes]

Just FYI.. Lindsey posted this on another thread....


Lindsey
Member

Registered: Mar 2006
Location: middle Georgia
Posts: 2

This is what RR's mother said about their relationship in the first 2-3 days after Tara disappeared.
Direct quote:

"Tara has been such a dear friend to Rhett and our family. She and Rhett dated some this past year."

Doesn't sound like an affair to me. It sounds like they dated some and then decided to remain friends instead of pursuing a romantic relationship. IMO

Thanks Lindsey for this post.

[Babes]

One interesting post too is on this board about RR:

leoga1970
Member

Registered: Feb 2006
Location: ga
Posts: 1
The Math Teacher
I understand that the students thought that Mr. R******, the math teacher, was still dating Tara when she disappeared.
He is a football coach. I would think that he would have some things in common with Tara. Both are single, young, outgoing, athletic and active at the school. I also understand that he was going to end the dating when he learned that it was going nowhere due to Tara's involvement with M.H. I wonder why there are two versions of when they quit seeing one another.
I wonder why so little has been said about him. He is from Ocilla and owns a house in her neighborhood. Can someone tell us more about him?

http://boards.courttv.com/showthread.php?threadid=256733&highlight=rhett+roberts



RR is going to end the dating to Tara because of MH? Is this true? If this is true then could it be that Tara is supposed to follow MH at the bar but the jealous RR didnt agree with it?

[Babes]

Is RR on the military too? Just curious if he got some military or law enforcement background.

He got one post at michaelmoore.meetup.com which isnt available anymore and only cached from google

Rhett Roberts

"I would love to attend, but due to due being in the military, I will not know until closer to the date if I can attend."

http://72.14.203.104/search?q=cache:zIIuKDgn8NcJ:michaelmoore.meetup.co m/16/events/%3FeventId%3D3728286%26action%3Ddetail+%22rhett+ro berts%22+Georgia&hl=en&gl=us&ct=clnk&cd=2

[Babes]

Ived heard from different people here that RR is a good / decent hardworking guy but i think it is still important to discuss his whereabouts from Saturday to Monday Morning. At crimelibrary, it was mentioned that he's one of the few guys questioned right away by LE but we heard little informations about him just like HD. Where is RR on Saturday night till Monday Morning? I hope someone can share to us RR's alibis during those days. Thanks.

[Mindis]

Originally posted by Candace


ty for being involved in the search..If I lived closer I would go on wk-ends...Are they searching every week-end? if you know. I hope your theory is right...It would be wonderful to see her home, ALIVE.

Yes it would.. Carla Baron doesn't seem to think she is though.. :( As stated below..


Psychic: Grinstead is dead, knew her killer

By Christy Pruitt
Reporter

Renowned psychic Carla Baron was on hand last week in Ocilla, hoping to provide more answers to family and friends of missing teacher Tara Grinstead. While she did come to town to offer support in the ongoing investigation, she also is obligated to report her findings, no matter how grim the results may be.

“I am positive that Tara is no longer alive at this point, but she was not killed in her house,” Baron said. “She was also in a prior sexually intimate relationship with the killer.”

Baron does have more intricate details regarding her theory of what happened before, during and following the disappearance and possible murder of Grinstead. However, her visit to Irwin County was taped and will be featured in a future episode of the upcoming television show “Haunting Evidence”, which is produced by Departure Films. The show will premier in June on Court TV. Due to contractual reasons, Baron cannot divulge the additional information at this time.

“Tara would just melt in the presence of this person,” she said. “He was like kryptonite to her, she had no control when he was around.” Another psychic, John Oliver, joined Baron on her trip to the South.

“This entire experience has been very mind boggling because we have them working on one end, and the scientific nature of Dr. Godwin’s work on another side of the spectrum, and all of the facts, scenarios and timelines are coming together between them,” said Anita Gattis, sister of Grinstead. “God bless Carla and John for the gifts that they have been given.”

Dr. Maurice Godwin, a forensic consultant, visited Ocilla earlier in the month. Following his investigation, Dr. Godwin observed that Grinstead was “dead within two hours of when she went missing ... and “knew her assailant”.
“We may have heard some things we did not want to, but we have to just remain positive and continue to look for Tara and for more answers,” said Gattis.

Grinstead, known for her involvement in beauty pageants and her love of educating her students, has been missing for five months. Despite many searches and a media blitz throughout the United States, no additional information has been released regarding her disappearance and no official suspects have been named in the case.

I would like to think she is wrong here but her theory makes sense to me.. I believe her.. As does Tara's family. They have alot of faith in Carla..

[NancynNC]

I agree, Bring it to the board or it is not worth the trip. No hate mail!!

Odd the person just joined and knows about about all your posts. Probably someone using a new name.


:seeya:

[Mindis]

Sassy, I also recieved a pm from him/her.. I was wondering if anyone else did..

[fsbiii]

Get outta here!

[Mindis]

MH used to sleep in a handmade casket?!? I just got the chills... :confused:

[llisa]

Okay, so what is it about the casket? We are all dying to hear. This is very strange behavior not only for a child, but anyone, and the parents are perpetuating it? Hmmm.

[llisa]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

Black Ops.

So MH is possibly a mercenary?! Sounds logical to me and I just looked up the entire definition of it and it is a violent job.
Hope we can hear about the casket soon, I don't think I can go to sleep until I know.
JMHO.

[llisa]

Originally posted by Chalandrapi
PM from Sogalady:

sogalady
Member
Registered: Apr 2006
Posts: 0

YES, HONESTY IS YOUR WAY,, HUH?
Sassy, How stupid do you think the ppl on this board are ??
You have been so " anti-MH" the entire time and now you want to know "ALL ABOUT HIM" ???? How many idiots do you think will really fall for this,,,,,??? I am sure that you are not the only one that play this game.

Unfortunately, there are many of us that thinks MH is most likely the #1 suspect of harming Tara. I know there is plenty of things we do not know, but what facts that has been put out there, it's not very hard to come to that conclusion, IMO.
I am still concerned about the White Horse that can't serve alcohol after 11:45 on a Saturday night, but stays open until after 1:30am? [/B][/QUOTE]

I just showed this to my husband. He is from Mexico and he said that SOGA in spanish is the word for noose. The rope that you hang people with. Whoa. Who is this person?

Or con la soga al cuello- which means "with the knife at one's throat".

This NAME SOGALADY HAS A LOT OF CONNOTATIONS AT THIS POINT. I HOPE THAT SOMEONE LOOKS INTO THIS PERSON!!!!!

[llisa]

Originally posted by Mindis
Sassy, I also recieved a pm from him/her.. I was wondering if anyone else did..

MINDIS,
I JUST WANTED TO TELL YOU THAT SOGA MEANS HANGING ROPE IN SPANISH.

AND SOGA EN EL CUELLO MEANS KNIFE AT THE THE THROAT IN SPANISH.

PLEASE ALERT SOMEONE TO THIS. THIS PERSON IS SCARY.

[local]

COLOR=red]red[/COLOR] Since you seem to know every move the little darling ever made during his little boy years, which I don't doubt [he was adorable], because most little boys ARE adorable, can you fill us in on the story about sleeping in the handmade wooden casket as a child? And the relatives in Tifton at the funeral home who refused to sell a real casket to his mother? When I heard this, I thought, IMO, that I'd heard everything. Apparently not, IMO. Enlighten us please, or if anyone else is familiar with this childhood incident, please post. Please, by all means, post



wow....i don't believe it....sounds to me like people want to prove him guilty more and more everyday....i'm not he's saying innocent but i'm not going around and spreading "stories" about him either...that's just a little too creepy for me to believe....and tell me something else....what does that have to do with Tara? fill me in because i would love to know....thanks:)

[BlkBeauty57]

:shrug:

The Phantom:

Nice to read you. I'm sure it can't be just that simple. It has to be some sinister person involved in the Tara Grinstead conspiracy? LOL

It would be so funny...if it wasn't so sad!:confused:

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

Black Ops.

Here is a definition of what Black Ops are. Stealthy group with very little accountability

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_ops

[Mindis]

Originally posted by The_Phantom
I'm sitting here laughing ! Really, I am.

llisa, I'm not trying to be a snob, but..... do you think the nic sogalady might possibly stand for Southern Georgia Lady ???

This is not a laughing matter Phantom.. Maybe sogalady does stand for what you say.. But I find no humor in this.. Tara is missing.. llisa, I don't know what the nic means, if he/she pm's you and is nasty just ignore him/her. Their posts will be moderated here.

[Mindis]

Originally posted by concernedperson


Here is a definition of what Black Ops are. Stealthy group with very little accountability

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_ops

Thanks for the link, will look now.

OMG.. violent.. wow.. I wonder if he is in this.. will we ever know?!?

[Saunterer]

"U.S. Turns to Mercenaries", The Village Voice, April 1, 2004:
http://www.villagevoice.com/news/0414,mondo6,52382,6.html

"America's For-Profit Secret Army", New York Times, October 13, 2002:
http://www.newsfrombabylon.com/index.php?q=node/2421

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

Since you seem to know every move the little darling ever made during his little boy years, which I don't doubt [he was adorable], because most little boys ARE adorable, can you fill us in on the story about sleeping in the handmade wooden casket as a child? And the relatives in Tifton at the funeral home who refused to sell a real casket to his mother? When I heard this, I thought, IMO, that I'd heard everything. Apparently not, IMO. Enlighten us please, or if anyone else is familiar with this childhood incident, please post. Please, by all means, post.

I wonder if it relates to an oeidipal complex of some sort.

[llisa]

You are absolutely right. The MH camp does a lot of damage control, as it were, however, nothing changes any of the facts And the fact is, a child sleeping a casket is not normal,
but moreover, the parent of the child sleeping in a casket is not normal. The parent/parents have perpetuated this behavior by either making the casket for them or having it made. And by the way, I have heard something about this guy before (MH), that he has a fascination with graves as well. I can't expand on that given the person who said this. So this is not too far off course.And telling the hearsay is usually not too far from the truth sometimes. If he is not guilty, then there is the burden of proof as to why not.
JMHO.
And also, my question is, how far do loyalties go when there is a possible murder? How long would you hang with a person until you start to notice his "clay" feet, so to speak.IMHO

[Atok]

I didn't really want to touch this section... but doesn't this casket and grave fascination remind people about the theory that Tara is buried along with someone else. Maybe someone who had a recent burial so that things are still easily accesible?

That whole body on top of an already buried body theory of hiding someone?

I know ewwww, but damn good place to hide a corpse. In Iraq there are mass graves of way more than two.

In the U.S. we don't disturb graves and if someone were to use a freshly created burial site to add a second corpse... who would ever know? The body would NEVER be found.

Very clever.

But how would you go about searching... exhume everyone buried in Georgia??! Good lord that will never happen.

Who is to say the perp disturbed a current grave, or a random grave. You have no way of determining. What if he chose a family member's site. Can you see the lawsuits when GBI askes to exhume MH's Grandad or something?
They will NEVER have enough information to allow that.

We have trouble exhuming people we legitimately know are buried in a location.

This is one way of hiding a corpse that someone would IMO easily get away with. Not sure what one could do about it. If this was the way it was done, this case will never have a body. People aren't able to take cadaver dogs into cemetaries... kind of stupid... they'd hit everywhere...

And in the perps sick mind, he DID bury her and she's "at peace", right?

We all get pm's from people, the psychic related PM's I've gotten have all related to Tara being buried, being face up, laying prone. Not some ravine, or bridge or pond or water...just to add that into the mix.

Would make me pretty damn smug if I were the killer. Make me feel smarter than everyone... would make me not be sweating much at all.

Frankly, not getting caught in the action of harming Tara and having her burial site be so "perfect" would you be worried at all??

[mooloo]

Nope, that is not the Ocilla RR. Never been in the military.


Originally posted by Babes
Is RR on the military too? Just curious if he got some military or law enforcement background.

He got one post at michaelmoore.meetup.com which isnt available anymore and only cached from google

[concernedperson]

All good points Atok. But we know there have been 2 locations that cadaver dogs hit. Both water/pond. The buriel idea has been used before but the corpse has to get to the site. That means it had to be transported and eventually they could use dogs on the vehicles of the perps and they would hit on the vehicles. As decomposition would have been advanced after 2 water locations, putting this around late November or December (my guess).

With that said, other than the burned up vehicle I would be watching to see if any poi's decide to trade their vehicles for another.

[fsbiii]

Getting back to zorro's original inquiry on this thread, I found it interesting that Pujadas was quick to offer up a corroborating witness for Sunday night, but he didn't have anything for Saturday night.

Pujadas talked about a vehicle stop by the DNR officer (Hilton) on Sunday night that "turned out to be a different offense" and the party came to Pujadas for legal representation. (I was told this was a drug case, by the way.)

If Fletcher and his ride-a-long Harper had stopped anyone or worked a wreck or crime scene on Saturday night, I'm sure we would've heard about it...if they were together...if anything happened that night where LE was needed. Fletcher being the solo alibi, in light of things learned about him relating to Tara, doesn't amount to anything solid for me. IMO.

Originally posted by zorro
I have a simple question about MH's alibi for Saturday night /Sunday morning. His attorney stated in the Greta interview, "Marcus can account for every minute of his time during that time. He has provided that information to the GBI." If MH spent the morning hours with patrolman SF in a squad car patrolling the streets of Ocilla then where are the witnesses to confirm this? From roughly 1:30 am to 5:30, MH is riding along with the officer. Did the officer have any call-outs during this time? Did the officer issue any citations? Did the officer stop for a snack or meal during this time? Did the officer get a potty-break during this time?
I would think a lawyer as competent as Pajadas could find some witnesses to confirm if MH was in the patrol car the whole time and where the car was.
In my opinion, it seems like a good attorney would want to clear his client from any suspicion as quickly as possible.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,174968,00.html

[Mindis]

Very interesting theory and possible.. You always bring new ideas to the table, I didn't think that route..

by the way, your mailbox is full.. ;)

[sweettater]

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/01/18/48hours/main1219166_page5.shtml

This confirms that there has been one case in Georgia where someone was convicted of murder without the presence of a body or a crime scene.

[local]

IMO, a child who is intrigued by violence and death at an early age grows up to be a disfunctional adult who is still intrigued by violence and death. If you were to add disfunctional parents to the mix you'd have quite a milkshake. IMO, people don't just wake up one morning and declare, "I think I'll go kill someone today!" It is a psychological trigger which has been brewing for a long, long time, and could be enhanced by any number of things, including environment, home life, family, etc. IMO, after the "military training", this person may have suddenly discovered (in his own mind) that he WAS truly capable of murder, and COULD (in his own mind) get away with it. That's just my thought and theory, but IMO it makes sense.

Just one question, Local. If you saw a kid sleeping in a casket, would you consider that normal? Maybe we can all go on the Dr. Phil show and debate this... IMO, that is no where NEAR normal.




heck no....that's not at all normal...but how do we know that it is true?? i have never met the man in my life....but that is too little "munsters" for me...i am not saying that it could not happen...i am just saying how do we know that he slept in a casket when he was little and how is him doing that when he was a child gonna help us find tara?? i know what you are saying about the who psychological stuff...your childhood makes who you are when you are an adult....i just want to find tara...i don't really care about what MH did when he was a child....

i've got a question for you J4T, if the LE finds tara and proves that MH is innocent, would you still claim that he was guilty?? i'm just wondering because we don't know for a fact that Tara is gone....i pray everyday that she isn't....i have a horrible feeling that she is...but we don't know what happened on that horrible october night/day....so we don't need to count our chickens before they hatch....that's all i'm trying to say....nothing against you...and i can see where all of you is coming from....i 've heard all of the things that are going around about this one and that one....like my grandfather used to tell me...believe nothing that you hear and half of what you see....that's why i'm so skeptical about what i've heard....you just don't know who or what to believe anymore....like i said nothing against you...if i've offended you in any way i'm sorry....

[concernedperson]

He had one as a toy box? Are you crazy or am I?

[Atok]

So he put all his toys away in a casket?

Are women toys to him?

[concernedperson]

There is no justification for this aberrant leaning. Period, end of discussion. If you further this, then we really want to know what do you know and how can you help. I suspect so many would like to tell all, it is a cleansing episode.

[Babes]

Originally posted by fsbiii
Getting back to zorro's original inquiry on this thread, I found it interesting that Pujadas was quick to offer up a corroborating witness for Sunday night, but he didn't have anything for Saturday night.

Pujadas talked about a vehicle stop by the DNR officer (Hilton) on Sunday night that "turned out to be a different offense" and the party came to Pujadas for legal representation. (I was told this was a drug case, by the way.)

If Fletcher and his ride-a-long Harper had stopped anyone or worked a wreck or crime scene on Saturday night, I'm sure we would've heard about it...if they were together...if anything happened that night where LE was needed. Fletcher being the solo alibi, in light of things learned about him relating to Tara, doesn't amount to anything solid for me. IMO.



IMO Pujadas offered alibis on the time Tara left the cook-out till the time he reached his house but didnt offer any other alibis on the entire Saturday which is important because if he did it with planning then he could be planning it the entire Saturday morning till evening maybe. Where is MH during the pageant... Is he the guy referring to as the exboyfriend talking to Tara on the curb or did MH see Tara talking to a boyfriend ( maybe RR ) while he's staying on his father's house?

IMO if MH is responsible for this then phone records of MH the whole Saturday could be important because it can put him to places he went first before placing Tara there.

[yummers59]

Originally posted by Atok
So he put all his toys away in a casket?

Are women toys to him?


Atok, that's certainly food for thought isn't it?

That whole thing about the casket is sick, there's absolutely no way on God's green earth that I would want a casket in my house, especially to hold my kids' toys! If nothing else, it seems to be making light of something that is "normally" used in a somber event.

[zorro]

Originally posted by fsbiii
Getting back to zorro's original inquiry on this thread, I found it interesting that Pujadas was quick to offer up a corroborating witness for Sunday night, but he didn't have anything for Saturday night.

Pujadas talked about a vehicle stop by the DNR officer (Hilton) on Sunday night that "turned out to be a different offense" and the party came to Pujadas for legal representation. (I was told this was a drug case, by the way.)

If Fletcher and his ride-a-long Harper had stopped anyone or worked a wreck or crime scene on Saturday night, I'm sure we would've heard about it...if they were together...if anything happened that night where LE was needed. Fletcher being the solo alibi, in light of things learned about him relating to Tara, doesn't amount to anything solid for me. IMO.


I agree fsbii but it also seems like the Ocilla Chief of Police would be eager to offer up the 911 dispatch log to prove Harper and Fletcher's innocence. After all, Harper is a past OPD officer and Fletcher is a patrol sergeant, wouldn’t he want to protect the police force's reputation.

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by zorro

I agree fsbii but it also seems like the Ocilla Chief of Police would be eager to offer up the 911 dispatch log to prove Harper and Fletcher's innocence. After all, Harper is a past OPD officer and Fletcher is a patrol sergeant, wouldn’t he want to protect the police force's reputation.

A great point zorro!!
People talk about the rumors going around town and here on the boards, many of them could be stopped in their tracks if some people would come forward and say something. It seems like that they all are covering up something and it may not be that way at all. The only interview given was by MH and what did he do? Lawyered up and hid his face. I do not blame him for getting a lawyer but he let the lawyer answer most of the questions. And then they wonder why we would doubt him.

Most missing person cases that go on TV, has the family on with the local LE with them. Not is this case. No press conferences. No nothing. If the sheriff or Ocilla police announced a press conference tomorrow for any reason, the networks would cover it, but they seem to want it all to go away.

[Babes]

Originally posted by NancynNC


A great point zorro!!
People talk about the rumors going around town and here on the boards, many of them could be stopped in their tracks if some people would come forward and say something. It seems like that they all are covering up something and it may not be that way at all. The only interview given was by MH and what did he do? Lawyered up and hid his face. I do not blame him for getting a lawyer but he let the lawyer answer most of the questions. And then they wonder why we would doubt him.

Most missing person cases that go on TV, has the family on with the local LE with them. Not is this case. No press conferences. No nothing. If the sheriff or Ocilla police announced a press conference tomorrow for any reason, the networks would cover it, but they seem to want it all to go away.

I also think that hiding his face on camera could mean something else I dont think it is already a job related issue coz as far as we know , he hasnt come back to work yet at all and his pictures are all over the crimelibrary site. What if he did tried to hide his face so no one could really identify or remember that somebody saw him on this place and that place that Saturday night or Sunday morning.

[Babes]

Originally posted by mooloo
Nope, that is not the Ocilla RR. Never been in the military.




Thank You for your info.
That Rhett Roberts on that site belongs to members of Macon,GA.

[oldyeller]

Originally posted by zorro

I agree fsbii but it also seems like the Ocilla Chief of Police would be eager to offer up the 911 dispatch log to prove Harper and Fletcher's innocence. After all, Harper is a past OPD officer and Fletcher is a patrol sergeant, wouldn’t he want to protect the police force's reputation.
maybe he did and we dont know it? wouldn't the gbi make sure about that?

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by Babes


I also think that hiding his face on camera could mean something else I dont think it is already a job related issue coz as far as we know , he hasnt come back to work yet at all and his pictures are all over the crimelibrary site. What if he did tried to hide his face so no one could really identify or remember that somebody saw him on this place and that place that Saturday night or Sunday morning.

You are so right on Babes. Maybe someone at the bar??

[NancynNC]

IMOO if anyone is innocent here, it is RR. He just happened to date Tara some. We do not know how many times. Probably too much drama for him to get into. He has a career at the school and sets up websites. I visited the one he set up for the real estate company. Seems like a nice friend.

[Babes]

Originally posted by NancynNC


You are so right on Babes. Maybe someone at the bar??

Yeah maybe they could remember what time did he really arrived or leave the bar

[Babes]

Originally posted by NancynNC
IMOO if anyone is innocent here, it is RR. He just happened to date Tara some. We do not know how many times. Probably too much drama for him to get into. He has a career at the school and sets up websites. I visited the one he set up for the real estate company. Seems like a nice friend.

Actually i think he is probably innocent too and i would think he's more like a witness on this case. I also think that he's the guy someone is referring to that he saw Tara with a guy talking to a curb. I also think MH possibly saw them talking and got jealous. Remember MH was so mad when he saw Tara with RR on a stop sign and yelled at him on April 2005. Maybe MH was so pissed when he saw Tara and RR talking near MH's father's house . thatSaturday night as well. If MH really saw them then that goes the motive for MH hurting Tara even more. Imagine Tara replaced him with a much younger and good looking guy. Too bad for MH's ego i guess.

I also think that some people are trying to remove RR from the limelight because it can cost him his job at the school where DH and the Harper clan is possibly has a lot of control.

[longcoolwoman]

Originally posted by Babes
Ok, we needed some answers on this conflicting stories we are getting. Acording to Missy Davis Interview on TV that she spoke to Tara's bf about this and was sad on what happened . Now poster General Lee made a very good question.... Who is this BF. Some locals claimed it was RR. I checked some other threads and other message board and claimed it was RR too. Now another poster , IBC, said on his post

http://boards.courttv.com/showthread.php?threadid=246350&perpage=40&pagenumber=27



I dont want to put IBC on the spot but i felt someone needs to clear this informations because every angles on this case, whether these people are innocent or not, should be discussed.
If RR isnt the last bf then who is this guy Missy Davis referring to as the last BF. This is important because one neighbor claimed that they saw Tara on a curb talking to a boyfriend.

I'm still waiting on someone to tell me what curb Tara was sitting on. There is no curb. How could someone have seen Tara sitting on an non-existent curb?

[local]

but how do we know that he slept in it?? do you have pictures?? i mean i'm not gonna sit here and say oh i know he slept in it because so and so said he did....i still don't know what this has to do with finding tara...i am not saying he is innocent...i don't know if he is or not...i know what I"VE HEARD points everything to him....it is so sad to me that things have gotten this far....i am not trying to offend anyone...it's just everyone has this guy already to go to the chair and we have no hard proof that he has anything to do with it....i have never met mh...i'm just looking at the whole situation from a different point of view....and if he did do it, i hope he gets what he deserves....i'm just trying to be objective here....not trying to make anyone mad or start some crap....i have a gut feeling that everything is gonna come out sooner than later...i hope my gut is right....we all need closure especially tara's family....

[Mindis]

Originally posted by local
but how do we know that he slept in it?? do you have pictures?? i mean i'm not gonna sit here and say oh i know he slept in it because so and so said he did....i still don't know what this has to do with finding tara...i am not saying he is innocent...i don't know if he is or not...i know what I"VE HEARD points everything to him....it is so sad to me that things have gotten this far....i am not trying to offend anyone...it's just everyone has this guy already to go to the chair and we have no hard proof that he has anything to do with it....i have never met mh...i'm just looking at the whole situation from a different point of view....and if he did do it, i hope he gets what he deserves....i'm just trying to be objective here....not trying to make anyone mad or start some crap....i have a gut feeling that everything is gonna come out sooner than later...i hope my gut is right....we all need closure especially tara's family.... [/B]

And how do you know there isn't proof?!? The LE isn't going to announce it on FOX 5 Atlanta news.. You'll see soon enough local.. It's just a matter of time..

[oldyeller]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara


Thank you Mindis. Well said. (And he DID sleep in it by the way) some of you have this fella tried and hung and we dont even know what happened to this girl yet. i hope you are right because if you aren't you got some splainin to do when you get in front of the big Man and i don't mean the sherif neither!

i am startin to remember some of those big mouth ball players who liked to dance around and talk trash before the game even started. you know what happens to those guys dont you? most times they end up looking like fools. this aint no game and there aint no place for trash talking. get the facts find the girl let the law arrest somebody and then you talk the trash all you want to. if any of this weird stuff is true the law probably aint too happy bout it being said anyway. thats my opinion but i wasnt a trash talker when i played ball eiher so what do i know?

[concernedperson]

Behaviors are relevant to this case and others. There are indicators's that criminologists and psychiatrists use to pinpoint disorders. This is one I think particulary relevant for clues in Tara's case. Please take the time to read the link as it will make you look harder at clues.

http://faculty.ncwc.edu/toconnor/301/psycpath.htm

[Atok]

Did he mutilate his little green army men? Did he destroy barbies?

(I say this sort of tongue in cheek when it isn't funny at all, I know. But boys will be boyish and if MH is innocent there's going to be a lot of people guilty of character assasination. If he's not we sure have a lot of information that ties to psychological issues creating a sociopath. A sociopath without an outlet will kill again and again, but MH has an outlet in his line of work...so why kill Tara... the crime doesn't look to be accidental...)

One thing that shivered me was thinking about how maybe he was done "playing with his Tara doll" and "put her back in the toybox" for good. The one picture of Tara holding a collector edition Barbie made me think about that...

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara


The psychological angle to this case is very deep, IMO. I think that most any psychologist could find a direct link between abnormal behavior as a child and abnormal and/or violent behavior as an adult. "Acting out" as an adult reveals itself as verbal and emotional abuse of others, violence toward others (including murder) and a host of other unacceptable behaviors. Just "sleeping in a casket" wouldn't be the entire reason or cause, but perhaps that, coupled with the fact that he also slept in an aluminum garbage can (also as a child), and the encouragement of this behavior by a parental figure could all result in a very violent and maladjusted individual that doesn't play well with others, and perhaps even runs with scissors. If you attempt to make every child's "fantasy" a reality, they grow up not knowing the difference between the two. This creates the individual we call the Sociopath. You can read more about this disorder here, or email Scott Peterson and ask him: www.angelfire.com/zine2/narcissism/antisocial_sociopath_psychopath.html

Excellent info. Alrighty then....casket and aluminum garbage can. Can we say enclosed areas? Similar to the womb. Oedipal tendencies mixed in early on.Sort of a self-castration for the future.

As for ScottyTooHotty...no thanks! He has his momma to do all his out of prison lawsuits and looking for "the real killer".

[llisa]

Originally posted by Atok
I didn't really want to touch this section... but doesn't this casket and grave fascination remind people about the theory that Tara is buried along with someone else. Maybe someone who had a recent burial so that things are still easily accesible?

That whole body on top of an already buried body theory of hiding someone?

I know ewwww, but damn good place to hide a corpse. In Iraq there are mass graves of way more than two.

In the U.S. we don't disturb graves and if someone were to use a freshly created burial site to add a second corpse... who would ever know? The body would NEVER be found.

Very clever.

But how would you go about searching... exhume everyone buried in Georgia??! Good lord that will never happen.

Who is to say the perp disturbed a current grave, or a random grave. You have no way of determining. What if he chose a family member's site. Can you see the lawsuits when GBI askes to exhume MH's Grandad or something?
They will NEVER have enough information to allow that.

We have trouble exhuming people we legitimately know are buried in a location.

This is one way of hiding a corpse that someone would IMO easily get away with. Not sure what one could do about it. If this was the way it was done, this case will never have a body. People aren't able to take cadaver dogs into cemetaries... kind of stupid... they'd hit everywhere...

And in the perps sick mind, he DID bury her and she's "at peace", right?

We all get pm's from people, the psychic related PM's I've gotten have all related to Tara being buried, being face up, laying prone. Not some ravine, or bridge or pond or water...just to add that into the mix.

Would make me pretty damn smug if I were the killer. Make me feel smarter than everyone... would make me not be sweating much at all.

Frankly, not getting caught in the action of harming Tara and having her burial site be so "perfect" would you be worried at all??


ATOK,
My hat is off to you. That is the perfect crme scene. I had called one of the main people in her search last week with this same suggestion.

Here is my suggestion: If the sister of TG were to publicly ask the people in the surrounding areas, if when they go to church this Sunday (Easter) to please step out to the cementary and see if anything looks suspicious or disturbed. If it was done in November, then the grass or whatever would not have settled quite yet. And if it was a fresh grave. then chances are the body will be laying on top of the cement over the casket. So if someone were to find something weird, I suggested doing a core sample of the dirt all the way down, that way you could check for changes in ph or whatever they check for to determine a body is out. It certainly would not be enbalmed and I called a local funeral home, and they said that the trend, nowadays is not to put a slab. So you would be in luck there. You really wouldn't have to exume anything with the testing.

[llisa]

Originally posted by llisa



ATOK,
My hat is off to you. That is the perfect crme scene. I had called one of the main people in her search last week with this same suggestion.

Here is my suggestion: If the sister of TG were to publicly ask the people in the surrounding areas, if when they go to church this Sunday (Easter) to please step out to the cementary and see if anything looks suspicious or disturbed. If it was done in November, then the grass or whatever would not have settled quite yet. And if it was a fresh grave. then chances are the body will be laying on top of the cement over the casket. So if someone were to find something weird, I suggested doing a core sample of the dirt all the way down, that way you could check for changes in ph or whatever they check for to determine a body is out. It certainly would not be enbalmed and I called a local funeral home, and they said that the trend, nowadays is not to put a slab. So you would be in luck there. You really wouldn't have to exume anything with the testing.

How would sonagram or ultrasound come into play with this?

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by Atok
I didn't really want to touch this section... but doesn't this casket and grave fascination remind people about the theory that Tara is buried along with someone else. Maybe someone who had a recent burial so that things are still easily accesible?

That whole body on top of an already buried body theory of hiding someone?

I know ewwww, but damn good place to hide a corpse. In Iraq there are mass graves of way more than two.

In the U.S. we don't disturb graves and if someone were to use a freshly created burial site to add a second corpse... who would ever know? The body would NEVER be found.

Very clever.

But how would you go about searching... exhume everyone buried in Georgia??! Good lord that will never happen.

Who is to say the perp disturbed a current grave, or a random grave. You have no way of determining. What if he chose a family member's site. Can you see the lawsuits when GBI askes to exhume MH's Grandad or something?
They will NEVER have enough information to allow that.

We have trouble exhuming people we legitimately know are buried in a location.

This is one way of hiding a corpse that someone would IMO easily get away with. Not sure what one could do about it. If this was the way it was done, this case will never have a body. People aren't able to take cadaver dogs into cemetaries... kind of stupid... they'd hit everywhere...

And in the perps sick mind, he DID bury her and she's "at peace", right?

We all get pm's from people, the psychic related PM's I've gotten have all related to Tara being buried, being face up, laying prone. Not some ravine, or bridge or pond or water...just to add that into the mix.

Would make me pretty damn smug if I were the killer. Make me feel smarter than everyone... would make me not be sweating much at all.

Frankly, not getting caught in the action of harming Tara and having her burial site be so "perfect" would you be worried at all??

I have always thought this was possible. The perfect way to hide a body. IMO it would be a fresh grave. It would not look so obvious.

[oldyeller]

sure hope yall are right. if not, i got pity for you on judgement day.

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by oldyeller
sure hope yall are right. if not, i got pity for you on judgement day.

With all respect, I don't think anyone contributing on this board is looking at judgement day for their posts. The only one that should be looking is the perp(s). That is if the good State of Georgia doesn't inject them first. JMO.

[llisa]

I believe they would.

And OldYeller,
Are you meaning that we might burn in the lake of fire?
Gee, I haven't seen this much bible beating since I was 5.

[oldyeller]

the things yall are saying are sick and hateful. all you got is someones words and you take that and believe the sick stuff and you have this fella guilty. i dont know this fella and neither do any of yall from what you say but you are trying to act like you know what he is and what he did when all you got is a couple of people who came on here and said some weird stuff. judgement day is when God comes and judges us for what we did while we lived here. if this fella did something bad to that girl he will have a real bad judgement day but if he didnt then some of you got some splainin to do on judgement day.i wouldnt want to have to splain some of this if i was the one saayin it

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

Huh?
Ya know, I will debate a post. I will defend a post. I will ask for other info but in no case will I defend stupidity. It just isn't here or now. Is that all that is left from some? Man, get a lawyer people....and one not Ocilla oriented. You need some big time help. PM me and I will give you some names in Atlanta. Just kidding I wouldn't help you out of your swamp if you were drowning.

[Atok]

I don't think I've said anyting hateful, and I'm pretty comfortable about my place in the afterlife.

I have discussed issues that to me are sickening. I don't believe speaking these things makes me have accounting to do in front of my maker.

I have always believed that what makes darkness flourish is to keep things secret and hidden and dark, you can't grow evil with light spread all around. I say light your candles and curse the darkness.

If you are addressing the mounting 'assumptions' about MH and behavior that hasn't been proven to your satisfaction to be fact, then I can sort of see your point.

My advice is don't subject yourself to rumor or association with rumor mongers. (I'm sure there is a reference to biblical text in that at least my memory thinks there is, but I can't find it at the moment...hm)

Perhaps you are meaning to remind us of the following:

Exodus 23
Do not spread false reports. Do not help a wicked man by being a malicious witness.

Exodus 23:7
Have nothing to do with a false charge and do not put an innocent or honest person to death, for I will not acquit the guilty.

Leviticus 19:16
Do not go about spreading slander among your people.
Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD.

1 Timothy 5:13
Besides, they get into the habit of being idle and going about from house to house. And not only do they become idlers, but also gossips and busybodies, saying things they ought not to.

Psalm 34:13
Keep your tongue from evil and your lips from speaking lies.

If so your point is well taken and I still feel comfortable about my afterlife, but thanks for checking on me.

[victoria01]

Oldyeller: Are you also known as WHITE RABBIT in some areas?

[llisa]

Originally posted by Atok
I don't think I've said anyting hateful, and I'm pretty comfortable about my place in the afterlife.

I have discussed issues that to me are sickening. I don't believe speaking these things makes me have accounting to do in front of my maker.

I have always believed that what makes darkness flourish is to keep things secret and hidden and dark, you can't grow evil with light spread all around. I say light your candles and curse the darkness.

If you are addressing the mounting 'assumptions' about MH and behavior that hasn't been proven to your satisfaction to be fact, then I can sort of see your point.

My advice is don't subject yourself to rumor or association with rumor mongers. (I'm sure there is a reference to biblical text in that at least my memory thinks there is, but I can't find it at the moment...hm)

Perhaps you are meaning to remind us of the following:

Exodus 23
Do not spread false reports. Do not help a wicked man by being a malicious witness.

Exodus 23:7
Have nothing to do with a false charge and do not put an innocent or honest person to death, for I will not acquit the guilty.

Leviticus 19:16
Do not go about spreading slander among your people.
Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD.

1 Timothy 5:13
Besides, they get into the habit of being idle and going about from house to house. And not only do they become idlers, but also gossips and busybodies, saying things they ought not to.

Psalm 34:13
Keep your tongue from evil and your lips from speaking lies.

If so your point is well taken and I still feel comfortable about my afterlife, but thanks for checking on me.


Wish I would have said that. Has anyone read Lake Wobegon Days by Garrison Keller. Please get it, read it. It has a chapter in there about religion. You will enjoy it, I promise.
But yes, thanks for checking on us, Oldyeller.

Gee, I wonder why those people in the north "thinks us sutherners are stoopid". God help me.

[concernedperson]

The one thing I can say about myself is I never lie. I know truth is uncomfortable for a lot of people. But I would rather deal head on than lie. It aways comes back to bite you in the butt. Just talk, get the truth out there. Let Tara go home to her family. This is not hard.Think of your loved ones.I would want my loved one home. Shannon Melendi was never allowed to go home. But, yet we have a killer. I saw her mom, dad and sister go through the depths of hell.They wanted to see their baby home... they never did. They saw the perp brought to justice. But where is my baby! Where is my baby! This cry is heard in so many places. Families need to know...it isn't closure it is resolve. And, if anyone can help you need to step up.Someone is crying for help.

[frznwsalt]

Both Tara and MH were in Fitzgerald Saturday night--Tara at the pageant, and MH at the tavern. Not sure if their times would have overlapped, tho.

Other random coincidence: the winner of the Miss Sweet Potato shares a last name with MH's lawyer.

[Mindis]

Originally posted by llisa



Wish I would have said that. Has anyone read Lake Wobegon Days by Garrison Keller. Please get it, read it. It has a chapter in there about religion. You will enjoy it, I promise.
But yes, thanks for checking on us, Oldyeller.

Gee, I wonder why those people in the north "thinks us sutherners are stoopid". God help me.

Not all northerner's llisa.. ;) I visit the south as much as possible and love it.. more layed back and friendlier people.. One day perhaps when I'm retired I will move south.. :)

Anyway.. thanks for checking on us oldyeller..

[llisa]

Thanks Mindis.
It is really nice down here. The weather, although humid, is nice too.:)

[Mindis]

Originally posted by llisa
Thanks Mindis.
It is really nice down here. The weather, although humid, is nice too.:)

I could deal with that.. I could put my shovel away for good! ;)

Any news on the Montel Show?!? I don't want to miss the segment on Tara..

[llisa]

Originally posted by Mindis


Not all northerner's llisa.. ;) I visit the south as much as possible and love it.. more layed back and friendlier people.. One day perhaps when I'm retired I will move south.. :)

Anyway.. thanks for checking on us oldyeller..

Also we are overrun with hispanics. I even married one.
Couldn't help it, he looks like Erik Estrada when he was on CHIPS. LOL

What are you seeing with all your reading here? I know that you told us in the other forum about your friend who is in prison. I got kicked off of that one for being anti MH and pro TG. That forum is not a forum at all. It is for the MH Oscillans. Wonder why if it is on her website. Strange.

[Babes]

Originally posted by frznwsalt
Both Tara and MH were in Fitzgerald Saturday night--Tara at the pageant, and MH at the tavern. Not sure if their times would have overlapped, tho.

Other random coincidence: the winner of the Miss Sweet Potato shares a last name with MH's lawyer.

Both Tara and MH were in Fitgerald Saturday night? Is there a truth on this statement or just your opinion?

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by Candace


Interesting. Wonder what time MH actually arrived at the tavern? He claims he left at 1-1:30am..

Yes, his lawyer did not give out that info. The time he arrived at the bar, must not have been favorable for MH. IMo

[Babes]

Originally posted by NancynNC


Yes, his lawyer did not give out that info. The time he arrived at the bar, must not have been favorable for MH. IMo

Yep and IMO i dont think he needs a lot of time to dispose Tara . He could do it in 30 minutes or less maybe specially if he's planning on it and he's with someone else helping him.

I wonder where is SF prior to Tara's disappearance. Will it be possible that MH and SF are also together prior to Tara's disappearance and they staged a scene that MH will be looking for SF at the station to create an alibi

[llisa]

This is all worth observing in this man. I don't believe I would be able to continue to be friends with him in light of all of this, but apparently his friends are extremely loyal, for some reason. I say this because of the posts insisting that he hasn't done a thing and suggesting at every turn that TG just ran off and is not dead, etc. The other forum is a joke. You can say anything you want, but do not ever suggest that MH would have done such a thing. It is on TG's website.
JMHO

[Babes]

Originally posted by llisa
This is all worth observing in this man. I don't believe I would be able to continue to be friends with him in light of all of this, but apparently his friends are extremely loyal, for some reason. I say this because of the posts insisting that he hasn't done a thing and suggesting at every turn that TG just ran off and is not dead, etc. The other forum is a joke. You can say anything you want, but do not ever suggest that MH would have done such a thing. It is on TG's website.
JMHO

Well you know how powerful the MH clan in the small town of Ocilla and SF could be the next chief of their LE and Mr P will be the next Mayor of Ocilla... Some people cannot speak because it is hard to find a better job on a small town and these people have families and houses to protect. If DH is responsible for the removal of Tara center ... that just tells you how powerful they are in their town. Oh not to forget maybe some die hard defender team of MH who works under DH might get a raise next year? LOL ....ALL IMO !

[longcoolwoman]

DH had nothing to do with the removal of the Tara Center.

[llisa]

So who did and why?

[llisa]

Originally posted by Babes


Well you know how powerful the MH clan in the small town of Ocilla and SF could be the next chief of their LE and Mr P will be the next Mayor of Ocilla... Some people cannot speak because it is hard to find a better job on a small town and these people have families and houses to protect. If DH is responsible for the removal of Tara center ... that just tells you how powerful they are in their town. Oh not to forget maybe some die hard defender team of MH who works under DH might get a raise next year? LOL ....ALL IMO !

That all sounds about right. And from inside sources, the a lot of these same people do not like Ms. G....s and they say that she is an attention freak. They also on the other board ripped Dr. Godwin apart and accusing him of helping for only to write a book.
Well you know, Ms. G---- has been through quite a lot and for these mean, back biting people to say such a thing is just that. And they did say that, I know for an absolute fact.And as for Dr. Godwin writing a book. I hope that he does, for one thing, so young girls can see how these type of relationships develop and maybe look a little more closely at who they pick to have a relationship with. And also it can help on other cases around the US.
And these amoral people refusing to help in a constructive way is very disturbing. The people I am referring to are the types that are described above, mean and backbiting. And poor examples for the youth in the area. It is kind of like having JB Stoner for your dad. Great role models. Drive into that one people.
JMHO.

[llisa]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

He slept in it.

You said it all.
JMHO

[longcoolwoman]

Originally posted by llisa
So who did and why?

Why don't you call the board members and ask them?

[llisa]

Originally posted by Atok
I don't think I've said anyting hateful, and I'm pretty comfortable about my place in the afterlife.

I have discussed issues that to me are sickening. I don't believe speaking these things makes me have accounting to do in front of my maker.

I have always believed that what makes darkness flourish is to keep things secret and hidden and dark, you can't grow evil with light spread all around. I say light your candles and curse the darkness.

If you are addressing the mounting 'assumptions' about MH and behavior that hasn't been proven to your satisfaction to be fact, then I can sort of see your point.

My advice is don't subject yourself to rumor or association with rumor mongers. (I'm sure there is a reference to biblical text in that at least my memory thinks there is, but I can't find it at the moment...hm)

Perhaps you are meaning to remind us of the following:

Exodus 23
Do not spread false reports. Do not help a wicked man by being a malicious witness.

Exodus 23:7
Have nothing to do with a false charge and do not put an innocent or honest person to death, for I will not acquit the guilty.

Leviticus 19:16
Do not go about spreading slander among your people.
Do not do anything that endangers your neighbor's life. I am the LORD.

1 Timothy 5:13
Besides, they get into the habit of being idle and going about from house to house. And not only do they become idlers, but also gossips and busybodies, saying things they ought not to.

Psalm 34:13
Keep your tongue from evil and your lips from speaking lies.

If so your point is well taken and I still feel comfortable about my afterlife, but thanks for checking on me.

Touche.

[llisa]

How long can they keep MH as suspect without charging him? As I understand it, they have prevented him from going back to his job until he is cleared. Who are the "they"? Who is the people that will decide to press charges?GBI, district attorney?"
Can some of the locals be charged with obstruction of justice if that were the case?
How is the local atmosphere as far as the helpfulness "in person", as opposed to the opinions on this forum?
JMHO

[Mindis]

Originally posted by llisa


That all sounds about right. And from inside sources, the a lot of these same people do not like Ms. G....s and they say that she is an attention freak. They also on the other board ripped Dr. Godwin apart and accusing him of helping for only to write a book.
Well you know, Ms. G---- has been through quite a lot and for these mean, back biting people to say such a thing is just that. And they did say that, I know for an absolute fact.And as for Dr. Godwin writing a book. I hope that he does, for one thing, so young girls can see how these type of relationships develop and maybe look a little more closely at who they pick to have a relationship with. And also it can help on other cases around the US.
And these amoral people refusing to help in a constructive way is very disturbing. The people I am referring to are the types that are described above, mean and backbiting. And poor examples for the youth in the area. It is kind of like having JB Stoner for your dad. Great role models. Drive into that one people.
JMHO.

Alot of people defend MH.. That's why I told the story of the guy I went to school with who is in prison for murder.. With that story I honestly thought he was innocent.. Boy was I wrong, about the case and about him.. People snap and I think that's what happened with MH.. JMO..

[Atok]

I had not heard MH was unable to return to work if he chose to. I had not heard he was being 'held' in any way. Can you explain further?

Was it a strong suggestion by his attorney not to go anywhere or is it a matter of he would prefer not to at this time?

Is anyone else being asked or 'enforced' not to leave the area?

[llisa]

I heard that he was not "allowed" to return to work until he was cleared.I heard this from an Oscillan. Can anyone expand?
JMHO

[llisa]

Originally posted by Mindis


Alot of people defend MH.. That's why I told the story of the guy I went to school with who is in prison for murder.. With that story I honestly thought he was innocent.. Boy was I wrong, about the case and about him.. People snap and I think that's what happened with MH.. JMO..

If MH were caught red handed, in the act, these people would insist he was not a guilty party. Why? Because the majority of the people in town are related to this guy. And in south GA, it is a degradation to your family to have this type of thing occur. So insisting that he did not/could not/ would not/would never harm a fly is their theme. Who wants their family disgraced in this manner?
My cousin was the sherriff of Lowndes county some 20 odd years ago and he was put in jail for some subversive things with gambling. And he was guilty, no doubt. But I can remember my dad staunchly defending him, his cousin. And I remember myself thinking how in the world is Daddy defending this obviously guilty man?
Blood is thick in this instance.
JMHO

[Mindis]

Originally posted by llisa


If MH were caught red handed, in the act, these people would insist he was not a guilty party. Why? Because the majority of the people in town are related to this guy. And in south GA, it is a degradation to your family to have this type of thing occur. So insisting that he did not/could not/ would not/would never harm a fly is their theme. Who wants their family disgraced in this manner?
My cousin was the sherriff of Lowndes county some 20 odd years ago and he was put in jail for some subversive things with gambling. And he was guilty, no doubt. But I can remember my dad staunchly defending him, his cousin. And I remember myself thinking how in the world is Daddy defending this obviously guilty man?
Blood is thick in this instance.
JMHO

You could be right.. JMO of course..

[llisa]

Originally posted by Ocillian



"Cleared"??? I didn't know he was charged for anything. Has AV, SF, ML, HD or JP been "cleared" to return to work? This is not true. IMO he has chose not to return to work for now. Also, he has not been "enforced" or advised to stay in the area either.

So why doesn't he go back to work? So are you saying he is not a suspect? Come on.
Blood is thicker than water.
IMHO

[llisa]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Ocillian



"Cleared"??? I didn't know he was charged for anything. Has AV, SF, ML, HD or JP been "cleared" to return to work? This is not true. IMO he has chose not to return to work for now. Also, he has not been "enforced" or advised to stay in the area either.



IMO, MH won't be leaving the area again unless it's to go to the big house. I understand his military people are none to happy with this situation.

I think it's fine for him to work locally though, you know someplace in town. Maybe the Chicken Delight, one of the drug stores, etc. Maybe at the school as a playground guard or something. I really don't know what's available right now in a town that small. It's just an unhappy situation any way you look at it.

I don't think he needs to be around all those little kids at the playground although maybe at the board of education with the bigger kids. JMHO

[llisa]

Originally posted by Atok
Did he mutilate his little green army men? Did he destroy barbies?

(I say this sort of tongue in cheek when it isn't funny at all, I know. But boys will be boyish and if MH is innocent there's going to be a lot of people guilty of character assasination. If he's not we sure have a lot of information that ties to psychological issues creating a sociopath. A sociopath without an outlet will kill again and again, but MH has an outlet in his line of work...so why kill Tara... the crime doesn't look to be accidental...)

One thing that shivered me was thinking about how maybe he was done "playing with his Tara doll" and "put her back in the toybox" for good. The one picture of Tara holding a collector edition Barbie made me think about that...

You are correct, a sociopath will kill over and over. Tara was surely a victim. Unfortunately, sociopaths, look normal in pretty much every aspect other than a dark side noone sees.
JMHO

[TN_Profiler]

Originally posted by llisa


You are correct, a sociopath will kill over and over. Tara was surely a victim. Unfortunately, sociopaths, look normal in pretty much every aspect other than a dark side noone sees.
JMHO


The other aspect of sociopaths that is important to note is the timeline between killings is not necessarily short. Some may allow years to pass before killing again.

Just because others in Ocilla are not missing does not mean this isn't the work of a sociopath. I don't think we can rule a sociopath in or out at this point .... I just don't see enough evidence to sway my opinion one way or another.

Sadly I think we cannot definitively say this was a person within Tara's social circle anymore than we can say it was a sociopath who stalked her. One day, I hope we find the answer.

I have learned from the Groene case that even when everything about the case looks like the work of a "local" ....... amazingly, it can also be a person from 4 states away. That case makes me keep an open mind ..... even when I want to think differently.

If Tara's body is discovered 800 miles away (assuming she is dead)....... would that change anyone's opinion about who is or isn't a suspect?

[llisa]

Originally posted by Ocillian


You asked could anyone expand and I did.

Maybe he CHOOSES not to go back to work. I don't know. I never said he's not a suspect and secondly, I didn't know the LE had named any "suspects". Don't put words in my mouth.

You stated that "I heard that he was not "allowed" to return to work until he was cleared." and I was saying that is incorrect info.
Someone else implied he had to stay in the area and that is incorrect too. That's it. I'm not taking up for his innocence or guilt. If he's proven guilty of wrong doing against T, then I hope he gets the maximum sentence he can possibly get. IMO

"If MH were caught red handed, in the act, these people would insist he was not a guilty party."
That's the point, no one was caught red handed.

I don't know why you imply that we're kin because we are not.



We are free, supposedly to say what we want, and certainly plenty of this has been said and speculated. While it is true, we don't know all of the facts, nor will we unless we are directly involved with this, it is speculation. There are many cases to speculate on as you can see from the first page on this court tv.
I don't believe that who ever is in charge of investigating this case is going to arrest anyone without good reason. It would be negligent on their part and nowadays, with all the legal mumbo jumbo, the LE have to be very careful in their arresting procedures for fear of countersuits. So it is speculation and nothing more.
JMHO

[llisa]

Originally posted by TN_Profiler



The other aspect of sociopaths that is important to note is the timeline between killings is not necessarily short. Some may allow years to pass before killing again.

Just because others in Ocilla are not missing does not mean this isn't the work of a sociopath. I don't think we can rule a sociopath in or out at this point .... I just don't see enough evidence to sway my opinion one way or another.

Sadly I think we cannot definitively say this was a person within Tara's social circle anymore than we can say it was a sociopath who stalked her. One day, I hope we find the answer.

I have learned from the Groene case that even when everything about the case looks like the work of a "local" ....... amazingly, it can also be a person from 4 states away. That case makes me keep an open mind ..... even when I want to think differently.

If Tara's body is discovered 800 miles away (assuming she is dead)....... would that change anyone's opinion about who is or isn't a suspect?
Where was the Groene case?

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by fep
If I am correct that MH was with LE (Game Warden) I would like to have information on his regular working hours. Does he always work at night or maybe always on call????
I believe someone reported a spot light in an area out from Ocilla and he went to investigate and made arrests for marijuna on the Sunday night around 10 - 10:30 the weekend Tara went missing. I looked up job description of game warden and I personally can not see a game warden riding this time of night without a reason. I wonder what they were investigating. If I am wrong about the LE being a game warden please excuse the post

We have heard that before that he was a game warden. It seems odd to me that he would make an arrest for marijuana. It seems like proper protocol would be to contact the sheriff or local police. Here is a link about a game wardens LE duties...nothing about making drug arrests.

http://georgiawildlife.dnr.state.ga.us/content/displaycontent.asp?txtDocument=207

[singlesix]

Could have been out looking for someone spotlighting deer (they freeze when a light is shined on them after dark and make very easy targets) or maybe following up on a reported violation. Spotlighting is a problem everywhere - and against the law everywhere AFAIK.

Here's an excerpt of an old report on Virginia I googled up:

"One study (Kaminsky and Giles, 1974), for example, analyzed deer spotlighting in Virginia and found that, among other things, 85 percent of all spotlighting violations occurred during September, October, November, and December and that 68 percent of the violations occurred from 8:55 p.m. to 2:19 a.m. That 96 percent of spotlighting violations would have been visible from the air suggests a potential for increased aerial surveillance."

___________

Georgia has a program for turning in poachers. You can call them 24/7.

"You can be paid for turning in a poacher! If your TIP leads to an arrest, arrangements will be made for you to receive reward money even if you wish to remain anonymous. If you see or learn of a violation, try to write down: a description of the violator; a description of their vehicle; the location of the violation; and the type of violation.

TIP Hotline
Call 1-800-241-4113 or *DNR (Cellular for Cingular Mobility Customers)
7 days a week / 24 hours a day."

[clue]

What time did the officer's shift officially end the early am of 10/23? 5:30am? 6 am? Or when?

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by clue
What time did the officer's shift officially end the early am of 10/23? 5:30am? 6 am? Or when?

You would have to ask someone in Ocilla PD and I doubt they would give you that info. I assume you are talking about SF and not the DNR guy? The DNR alibi was for Sunday night....not a.m.

[BFD - v2.0]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

I don't have to call them to know this, because it will be noted somewhere in the "secret" minutes, and mentioned in the audit. But now that I think of it, in all fairness, DH didn't have EVERYTHING to do with it, but I'm sure incidents like Suzee C. running to the mayor screaming that LG had been arrested for Tara's murder (big gigantic lie as we all know) didn't help the fate of "the Tara Center" since Suzee pleaded with the mayor on that day (one Monday morning in late January) that the Tara Center should close for the good of the city.....and since that time it's been like a "thorn" in the side of the BOE, IMO. Bottom line, there are people here on this board that are NOT here for Tara. Very very sad, IMO. Why be on the message board if you aren't here to learn what happened to Tara? And if it's ONE FAMILY you are concerned about (and what will happen to YOU when that family goes down) then maybe priorities should be examined.

Being new to this forum I haven't really seen a lot of bickering, in-fighting or what not.

But, I think I can speak with some experience in this matter regarding "why" someone posts.

It will often come across as being "against" the victim when all possible scenarios are discussed in one manner or another.

Sometimes people will have a favorite suspect and/or person of interest and will determine any favorable comments regarding that suspect/POI as being "against" the victim. That is not always necessarily the case.

Again, I don't know the particulars of this case or who could possibly be here and not be here "for" the victim. But one should always remind themselves that within jurisprudence there is often discussions regarding every possible scenario. Not all of them "favorable" at all times. Unfortunately it is what it is.

With that said, I would hope no one has already determined (steadfastly) in their mind who is responsible for Tara's disappearance with the few facts that are known to the public.

I've yet to see anything (circumstantial or direct) in any manner that could point towards one particular person's involvement (or non-involvement). But I do see quite a few questioning MH (whoever MH is, I'm assuming the ex-boyfriend). A military background and the fact he dated her isn't what I would call terrific evidence towards suspecting him being involved.

Granted, I may be missing quite a bit of information regarding this case; but what I've seen as substantiated facts are few and far between.

Hopefully we can refrain from castigating forum members for any particular belief; you never know what you may learn from them. Sometimes people that are perceived as "enemies" have the best (and most accurate) information.

Just my opinion.

[NancynNC]

Originally posted by TN_Profiler



The other aspect of sociopaths that is important to note is the timeline between killings is not necessarily short. Some may allow years to pass before killing again.

Just because others in Ocilla are not missing does not mean this isn't the work of a sociopath. I don't think we can rule a sociopath in or out at this point .... I just don't see enough evidence to sway my opinion one way or another.

Sadly I think we cannot definitively say this was a person within Tara's social circle anymore than we can say it was a sociopath who stalked her. One day, I hope we find the answer.

I have learned from the Groene case that even when everything about the case looks like the work of a "local" ....... amazingly, it can also be a person from 4 states away. That case makes me keep an open mind ..... even when I want to think differently.

If Tara's body is discovered 800 miles away (assuming she is dead)....... would that change anyone's opinion about who is or isn't a suspect?

I so agree with you. I followed the Groene kidnapping and murder. Posters had the dad and brothers almost on death row. They said no one person could do all that. We found out different.
I try so hard to keep an open mind. It is hard to do. I do know who appears guilty in this case but we need some evidence and more facts.

[concernedperson]

BFD-V2.U,

Your posts are always reasonable and we value your input. I don't know how much time you have to read but I would start in February of this year. The most useful info has come out then. The early reports were never expounded on...and heresay was taken as the word.

We have since learned about a burned house and vehicle and cadaver dogs hitting in that locale even when it was spun by local LE early on. We have learned that MH has a black ops background and a propensity for chirlish childhood behaviors.We have learned that people like to shut it down in defense of their town. We know that a bunch of us want Tara home and if the fingers are pointed in one direction....so be it. None of these people deserve special regard until Tara is home. Their turf is our turf until she can be buried in her rightful place.

And, no, Tara never ran away. She is not in a HonkyTonk in St. Louis waiting for Mr. Right. JMO.

[Mindis]

Originally posted by concernedperson
BFD-V2.U,

And, no, Tara never ran away. She is not in a HonkyTonk in St. Louis waiting for Mr. Right. JMO.

Even Tara's family has said she wouldn't do that, she would have called by now.. It's been 5 1/2 months..

[llisa]

The term for the spotlighting is "shining" as we south Georgians know it. And actually some people have a permit for it because of crop damage.

[llisa]

Originally posted by llisa
The term for the spotlighting is "shining" as we south Georgians know it. And actually some people have a permit for it because of crop damage. This was in reference to the deer hunting at night. I didn't hit the quote button.

[longcoolwoman]

Originally posted by Justice4Tara

I don't have to call them to know this, because it will be noted somewhere in the "secret" minutes, and mentioned in the audit. But now that I think of it, in all fairness, DH didn't have EVERYTHING to do with it, but I'm sure incidents like Suzee C. running to the mayor screaming that LG had been arrested for Tara's murder (big gigantic lie as we all know) didn't help the fate of "the Tara Center" since Suzee pleaded with the mayor on that day (one Monday morning in late January) that the Tara Center should close for the good of the city.....and since that time it's been like a "thorn" in the side of the BOE, IMO. Bottom line, there are people here on this board that are NOT here for Tara. Very very sad, IMO. Why be on the message board if you aren't here to learn what happened to Tara? And if it's ONE FAMILY you are concerned about (and what will happen to YOU when that family goes down) then maybe priorities should be examined.

Justice, I don't know who you are, but I think you are a bit confused about where I stand on this whole issue. You seem to think that I am "close" to MH and his family. This is not true. I am neighbors with his dad and stepmom, and she and I work in the school system. But we're far from "bosom buddies" and I have never known MH personally. I am not concerned about ONE FAMILY, and I have no idea why I should be concerned about what may happen to me when this family "goes down".

If I am on anyone's "side", it's Tara's. Whatever injustice has been done to her, I hope the perpetrator(s) is/are caught and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. I want to see the truth come out and Tara found, if for no other reason to give her family some closure. Being the mother of two daughters, I cannot imagine what Tara's mom must be going through. And yes, until I experienced sickness in my family at Christmastime, I was at the Tara Center often and personally witnessed the pain AG is going through. Regardless of the nasty things some people are saying about her, she wants her sister found and is doing what she feels is right to do so.

And I admit some of this is for selfish reasons. I live very close to Tara's house; in fact, she probably drove past my house on her way home on that Saturday night. It gives me chills to think that someone may have been following her. I never go outside anymore without wondering if there's some psychotic individual loose in Ocilla, and worse, in my neighborhood. If this is the case, I hope this person is found and dealt with accordingly, WHOEVER it is, before something happens to one of my daughters. Yes, that's probably selfish, but the last time I walked on water I was mopping the bathroom floor.

Having said all that, I also believe in the concept of innocent until proven guilty, and some of the things that are being said on this board simply make me sick. You know as well as I that there are a LOT of facts that haven't come out about this case. I know a lot of things that it wouldn't be appropriate to say on a public message board, but that doesn't mean they aren't true.

But unfortunately, there are some people here who don't believe this way, and even worse, take small tidbits of information, some partly true and some not true at all, and create elaborate scenarios that make the "POI's" look like psychopaths, all in the name of speculation. Yes, finding Tara should be top priority, and dealing with whoever did something to her should be right up there with that. But the "poi's" as the people here like to call them, can't all be guilty, and it's just not right to keep speculating, discussing, and trashing them here. Right's right and wrong's wrong, and putting "IMO" after an outrageous statement or scenario doesn't make it RIGHT.

IMO, of course. :)

[longcoolwoman]

Originally posted by BFD - v2.0


Being new to this forum I haven't really seen a lot of bickering, in-fighting or what not.

But, I think I can speak with some experience in this matter regarding "why" someone posts.

It will often come across as being "against" the victim when all possible scenarios are discussed in one manner or another.

Sometimes people will have a favorite suspect and/or person of interest and will determine any favorable comments regarding that suspect/POI as being "against" the victim. That is not always necessarily the case.

Again, I don't know the particulars of this case or who could possibly be here and not be here "for" the victim. But one should always remind themselves that within jurisprudence there is often discussions regarding every possible scenario. Not all of them "favorable" at all times. Unfortunately it is what it is.

With that said, I would hope no one has already determined (steadfastly) in their mind who is responsible for Tara's disappearance with the few facts that are known to the public.

I've yet to see anything (circumstantial or direct) in any manner that could point towards one particular person's involvement (or non-involvement). But I do see quite a few questioning MH (whoever MH is, I'm assuming the ex-boyfriend). A military background and the fact he dated her isn't what I would call terrific evidence towards suspecting him being involved.

Granted, I may be missing quite a bit of information regarding this case; but what I've seen as substantiated facts are few and far between.

Hopefully we can refrain from castigating forum members for any particular belief; you never know what you may learn from them. Sometimes people that are perceived as "enemies" have the best (and most accurate) information.

Just my opinion.

Hi BFB, :seeya:

I'd like to add a big "amen" to your post.

:beer:

[mooloo]

Whoa....what secret minutes?? what audit??


Originally posted by Justice4Tara

I don't have to call them to know this, because it will be noted somewhere in the "secret" minutes, and mentioned in the audit. But now that I think of it, in all fairness, DH didn't have EVERYTHING to do with it, but I'm sure incidents like Suzee C. running to the mayor screaming that LG had been arrested for Tara's murder (big gigantic lie as we all know) didn't help the fate of "the Tara Center" since Suzee pleaded with the mayor on that day (one Monday morning in late January) that the Tara Center should close for the good of the city.....and since that time it's been like a "thorn" in the side of the BOE, IMO. Bottom line, there are people here on this board that are NOT here for Tara. Very very sad, IMO. Why be on the message board if you aren't here to learn what happened to Tara? And if it's ONE FAMILY you are concerned about (and what will happen to YOU when that family goes down) then maybe priorities should be examined.

[Mindis]

I believe when Justice4Tara stated "And if it's ONE FAMILY you are concerned about (and what will happen to YOU when that family goes down) then maybe priorities should be examined. " She was referring to "judgement day". One poster on here stated since we would have to answer to god on judgement day because we think MH is guilty and if he were found not guilty we would have some explaining to do. I could be wrong but I believe that's where it was coming from.

[llisa]

Originally posted by sogalady


llisa, I am sure that you are not interested in my opinion, but what it is worth,,,,, after this response and the post about your family member being the Lowndes Co. Sheriff, who had a problem that your Dad could not see or believe due to the fact that he was too close to him and also that you realized that as a child has restored my faith that you might be a " little more open minded" than previously thought. Seriously, thank you for some post that carry a little more optomisim, not toward anyone, but just in general,,,,,,,,,thanks


I am interested in everyone's opinion. BUT when and/if anyone is arrested for this crime, it won't matter what I think, you think, anyone at that point.
The LE and investigators have things that we are not privy to. Just like in the case of the woman who shot her husband just recently, the preacher's wife. We all know that one. The lawyers are withholding the motive until the trial. Why? Because they don't want any publicity or take a chance of ruining their case.
But, people are going back and forth SPECULATING about why she did it, from homosexuality, infidelity, the whole gamut of things.
Why? Because it is interesting.

So let's just say, for example, that my grandson were to be the person in this scenario with Tara. That he were the ex-boyfriend in this picture. I love my grandson, almost more than life itself. And certainly, if the whole United States were saying in essensce that he was sociopathic killer, I really don't know what I would do. I would have to be committed at some point.
But for one thing, I wouldn't read the posts BUT stick with the program of supporting him. I wouldn't know if he did or didn't, because although I helped raise this boy and he is my own flesh and blood, the devil (here we go with the religious talk) or evilness overtakes us all. Some more than others. So I suppose the waiting game is the issue here. I would want for him to be innocent, because certainly I would be castigating myself everyday. What did I do wrong?

Here is the problem that I have with some of these posters:
1. They are adamantly insisting that one person didn't do it.
2. They are not offering a more plausible theory as to who might have done it.
And when I say done it, I mean "harmed Tara". They are basically saying, that "A" didn't do it, and "B", she might not be dead.
I believe a better stance at this would be, "I believe, because of all of the evidence, that Tara has been abducted and/or killed. Most of the people believe this, otherwise they would not be over here with cadaver dogs or searching for a grave. But the person, you suspect might not be the true person that might have done such a thing." Because, as someone pointed out the Groene case, that sometimes it is not always the obvious.

I feel the evidence with tell all.

Also, on the subject of Dr. Godwin. A lot of people are criticizing him for some reason. If you have read his VITAE, how could a person suggest that he doesn't know a thing about investigating. Dr. Godwin, out of everyone, A. knows a volumn about all of this and B. he is interested.
You are suggesting that he is doing it for money. Of course he is. Do the GBI officials go to work everyday and don't get paid a cent. NO. Yes he has gotten into a particular line of work to make money. This is his profession. He may even write a book. I hope he does. The sister of Tara has chosen a good investigator, number one, first and foremost, because of his notariety. That is going to put her face out there before millions. Which is good, since some are insisting that the possible guilty party, is not living in this area.
So, bad mouthing Dr. Godwin is only fueling the fire.

And really I am surprised at some. I understand that some of you posters are teachers and pastors. I would think that you would rise up and be an example here, to be open minded. I respect all of you but this is a speculation forum. I don't mean to offend anyone. Certainly some of you are related to me, I bet.
I am willing to concede that a person didn't do it. But also that a person might have. Can you say that?

And worth noting to the teachers, in debate, one person takes one view, one takes another, whether they believe what they are debating or not. So taking opposite sides is not a bad thing. It is a logical form of reasoning things out.

[llisa]

And here is a challenge to you people who want to be seen as OPEN MINDED as you want for me to be open minded.

I AM WILLING TO CONCEDE THAT MH MAY/OR MAY NOT BE GUILTY OF A CRIME OF HARMING TARA.

CAN YOU SAY THAT sogalady and long cool woman IN THE SPIRIT OF OPENMINDEDNESS?

If we are all supposed to be open minded, then that doesn't mean just some people?

Agree or not. Say "uncle".

[Atok]

His money comes from conference appearences, speaking engagements, book writings and such. This investigation, I thought he was providing his services free to the family because while he gets many requests, he selects those he feels are interesting and could benefit from the type of investigation he does well.
Maybe he will write a book about this case, and frankly I don't care if he does, I just want to see it solved and if his notoriety keeps Tara's case in front of the public eyes and keeps it from falling into ignored then I'm all for it.

I hope the type of investigating he does is relevant to closure in this case and he is able to make a difference.

[BFD - v2.0]

I can see this forum has it's share of venom.

This board has turned like so many others. The posters (instead of the content of their posts) become the point of interest and conversation.

I was hoping to assist in whatever way I could be looking at things with a set of fresh eyes without any preconceived notions. I think there are too many emotional investments for me to start looking at this case too hard on the CourtTv forum.

Emotion blinds objectivity and a lack of objectivity stifles progress for resolution. Hence the reason when I was in LE we very seldom shared details regarding the investigation with anyone with an emotional investment. Only if we absolutely had to; to gain information needed to further the investigation.

I would hope everyone can just step back and look at things in perspective. The agony and pain of dealing with a situation like this intensifies immensely when given an opportunity to speak anonymously on a message board without fear of immediate repercussions.

[longcoolwoman]

Originally posted by llisa
And here is a challenge to you people who want to be seen as OPEN MINDED as you want for me to be open minded.

I AM WILLING TO CONCEDE THAT MH MAY/OR MAY NOT BE GUILTY OF A CRIME OF HARMING TARA.

CAN YOU SAY THAT sogalady and long cool woman IN THE SPIRIT OF OPENMINDEDNESS?

If we are all supposed to be open minded, then that doesn't mean just some people?

Agree or not. Say "uncle".

I have said repeatedly on this and other message boards that I am on no one's "side". And though I have been accused of doing so repeatedly, I have NEVER said that any particular person is innocent of a crime against Tara. Obviously, SOMEONE is guilty of this crime, and yes, often the guilty party is the person folks least expect (the preacher's wife comes to mind).

You want me to say MH MAY or MAY NOT be guilty of this crime. The same thing could be said of every other human being on the face of the earth. Everyone living and breathing MAY or MAY NOT be guilty of harming Tara. That's about as open-minded as I can get. Will that do?

[fsbiii]

J4T makes a good point. Why do you come and look if you despise the postings so much? Do you report back to anyone with what you see and read? Just curious. I remember "joanne" used to say she showed MH some of the things posted, and he "appreciated her" having "his back."

Do you have anyone's "back," kvickers? I mean longcoolwoman...sorry. Hard to keep up with the handle swapping on these sites.

[Hotwater]

Sometimes when a discussion gets to this point it is best to go back and re-examine the facts of the case.

Check out the case links and review the time line. Make sure you all agree on the facts and the sequence of events before discussing whodunnit. Review the cast of characters.

Just a suggestion from your friendly neightborhood moderator.

Hope this helps,

--Hh20

[concernedperson]

I hope if they get a change of venue it is headed to Atlanta. Fairly sophisticated jury pool in N. Fulton, Cobb and parts of Gwinnett. Afterall, got a conviction in the Shannon Melendi trial without a body and many years later. Bless Shannon!

Tara, darling, you will have a chance for justice soon.

[llisa]

Originally posted by Sassy


Tara did nothing but fall in love with the "wrong person"....IMHO

What about you GL.....suppose YOU had done something to degrade your family then I guess we could say your murderer had every right to kill you because you were not clean and pure of spirit.....Mentality.....Dangerous....Excuse me....please....



What I was trying to get across, I don't know if this got taken out of context. But I meant having someone that committed a crime and was convicted, was a degradation. My father was a very prominent business man in Valdosta, and when our cousin, the sherriff was tried and convicted, it reflected on the whole family, mainly because of the name. So in essence, my Dad kept defending him to other people, when the man was very guilty of the crime.
I didn't mean Tara did anything. From what I've read and understood, she was a great person. And the fact that she was buying prom dresses for the girls. That is so moving really.

[llisa]

Also a change of venue is a great idea for any type of serious crime. It is only fair to everybody. I feel sure that everyone involved here would hate to see somebody's life wasted, if it was not the correct person.
We have to rely on the people gathering the facts in the case.

[concernedperson]

Originally posted by llisa


What I was trying to get across, I don't know if this got taken out of context. But I meant having someone that committed a crime and was convicted, was a degradation. My father was a very prominent business man in Valdosta, and when our cousin, the sherriff was tried and convicted, it reflected on the whole family, mainly because of the name. So in essence, my Dad kept defending him to other people, when the man was very guilty of the crime.
I didn't mean Tara did anything. From what I've read and understood, she was a great person. And the fact that she was buying prom dresses for the girls. That is so moving really.
I understand where you are coming from. I also think you very brave to acknowledge the sins of the father so to speak.You seem like a good person with a real time understanding.

Just the fact that you acknowledged a problem goes a long way with me and, I am sure others.

[hypnotized]

...my notes...

Saturday, October 22, 2005
In the afternoon, girls come by for hair and makeup assistance prior to the Sweet Potato Pageant.

Tara attends the pageant.

JP & wife return home approx 7 pm Saturday, and Tara’s car is not at home.

Tara drops by the Davis’ home for dinner and then returns home @ 11:00 pm.

She calls a girlfriend, and shares the evenings activities.

"Megan, Marie and HD. I know Megan said she was third to last. Megan said Tara went missing at 12:30." (court tv msg board?)

Dolly starts barking.

HD calls Tara’s number repeatedly. He calls Tara’s mother, who calls the Porters.

HD arrives at Tara’s home @ 12:15 am Sunday morning, and Tara is not home (or is unable to respond), neither is her car.

The Porter’s response to Tara’s mother’s inquiry is that nothing appears to be amis. HD continues to call Tara, finally leaving his card stuck in the door.

Sunday, October 23, 2005

MH is at the Whitehorse bar, staying until about 1:30 AM Sunday, Oct 23, he was at the bar with his stepsister and her boyfriend up until the bar closed.)

The bar closes and M drives to meet with SF at dispatch.

Sunday early AM. Dolly is barking again.

M drives to his mother's and reportedly goes to bed.

Sunday morning, Dolly barks and doesn’t quiet down until around 9 am.

Monday, October 24, 2005

"...At 8:50am a report was made to the Ocilla Police Department by neighbors and coworkers who were concerned about her well being. Tara did not show up for work and they were unable to reach her...Items missing are her purse and keys."

The following week:

A fire starts at house on Snapdragon Lane in the early am on Sunday, November 6.

[llisa]

Are these the facts as we know them to be?

Because this is the first time I read that her car was not there when HD was there. I know I must have overread that, but I am happy that you have done this so we can explore it again.

So my next question, her car keys were not in the house?!! But her cellular was? That is so strange. Very strange.

[llisa]

ALSO, IMPORTANT.

IS DOLLY A BARKER? MEANING DID THE NEIGHBOR'S ALL THE TIME HEAR HER YAPPING AWAY, OR WAS THIS AN ISOLATED INCIDENT OF CONTINUED BARKING?
OUR DOGS, WHEN THEY START BARKING ABOUT AN INTRUDER IN THE YARD, THEY DO NOT STOP UNTIL THAT PERSON OR STRANGE DOG IS COMPLETELY GONE. IT CAN GO ON FOR HOURS AND HOURS.

[fsbiii]

According to Dr. Godwin, HD was there at 12:15 am on Monday morning, not Sunday morning. Tara's car was home when HD was there. Not sure where the mixup arose on this issue.

[llisa]

What time did MH arrive at the bar? How far is the bar from Oscilla, driving time?

[llisa]

Originally posted by fsbiii
According to Dr. Godwin, HD was there at 12:15 am on Monday morning, not Sunday morning. Tara's car was home when HD was there. Not sure where the mixup arose on this issue.
Thanks, I thought I had heard it was Monday am.

[hypnotized]

I wish we could post one factual (or thereabouts) timeline and all be able to "adjust" what we know to be a fact...go for it guys...hopefully some good will come of all our speculations! Cut and paste all you want!

[hypnotized]

facts? part 2 ...my notes...?

Saturday, October 22, 2005

In the afternoon, girls come by for hair and makeup assistance prior to the Sweet Potato Pageant.

Tara attends the pageant.

JP & wife return home approx 7 pm Saturday, and Tara’s car is not at home.

Tara drops by the Davis’ home for dinner and then returns home @ 11:00 pm.

She calls a girlfriend, and shares the evenings activities.

"Megan, Marie and HD. I know Megan said she was third to last. Megan said Tara went missing at 12:30." (court tv msg board?)

Dolly starts barking.

Sunday, October 23, 2005

MH is at the Whitehorse bar, staying until about 1:30 AM Sunday, Oct 23, he was at the bar with his stepsister and her boyfriend up until the bar closed.)

The bar closes and M drives to meet with SF at dispatch.

Sunday early AM. Dolly is barking again.

After ending the ride-along with SF, M drives to his mother's and reportedly goes to bed.

Sunday morning, Dolly barks and doesn’t quiet down until around 9 am.

Monday, October 24, 2005

HD calls Tara’s number. He calls Tara’s mother, who calls the Porters.

The Porter’s response to Tara’s mother’s inquiry is that nothing appears to be amis.

HD continues to call Tara. HD arrives at Tara’s home @ 12:15 am Monday morning, and Tara is not home. He leaves his card in the door.

"...At 8:50am a report was made to the Ocilla Police Department by neighbors and coworkers who were concerned about her well being. Tara did not show up for work and they were unable to reach her...Items missing are her purse and keys."

The following week:

A fire starts at house on Snapdragon Lane in the early am on Sunday, November 6.

[yummers59]

According to the following quote from Pajadas during the Greta interview, he at first says MH went home to go to sleep, "at his mother's house" but THEN corrects it to "his father's house". If that's true, it certainly puts him a lot closer to Tara's house during some questionable hours seeing as his father lives near Tara.

Here's the quote from the interview:

PAJADAS: Marcus can account for every minute of his time during that time. He has provided that information to the GBI. They have checked with everyone of the individuals that he was with. He was in the company of somebody, either a law enforcement, Department of Natural Resources, at home asleep, at his mother's house, at his father's house, I mean.
.................................................. ...............

Later in the interview, Pajadas says that MH got to his father's house around 10:00 a.m. Sunday, well, according to the above quote MH had slept there........so looks like someone is a bit confused!

[llisa]

Technically, it seems that if he went to the father's to go to sleep. Well if he got there at 10AM and went to sleep, then that is true.
I suppose after staying out all night, that would be the time to hit the sack.
But yes, that is a good question, what time did he get there?
Does anyone know if MH is left handed or right handed?

[frznwsalt]

Babes--you asked if both Tara and MH were really in Fitzgerald Saturday night. Sorry--I just saw the question. I got that from news articles that said that both the pageant and the bar were in Fitzgerald. So it's extra weird that his lawyer won't say when he arrived at the bar.

Hypnotize--I think it wasn't until 12:15AM Monday, when HD was parked outside of Tara's, that he called Tara's mother, and she called the Portiers.

Was he one of the three people she spoke to Saturday night? He sure got worried quickly. Maybe the real reason he went there Sunday night was because they had plans? And he only started to worry when she didn't answer the door?

I only realized a minute ago that MH's dad lives near Tara--when a poster said she's his neighbor, and lives near Tara. So again, extra interesting that MH slept there after going out Saturday night.

[yummers59]

Originally posted by frznwsalt
Babes--you asked if both Tara and MH were really in Fitzgerald Saturday night. Sorry--I just saw the question. I got that from news articles that said that both the pageant and the bar were in Fitzgerald. So it's extra weird that his lawyer won't say when he arrived at the bar.

Hypnotize--I think it wasn't until 12:15AM Monday, when HD was parked outside of Tara's, that he called Tara's mother, and she called the Portiers.

Was he one of the three people she spoke to Saturday night? He sure got worried quickly. Maybe the real reason he went there Sunday night was because they had plans? And he only started to worry when she didn't answer the door?

I only realized a minute ago that MH's dad lives near Tara--when a poster said she's his neighbor, and lives near Tara. So again, extra interesting that MH slept there after going out Saturday night.


Interesting too is right before his arrival at his father's at 10:00 a.m. (one of the times TP stated), is when Dolly was barking so much and for so long.

My question on MH's arrival time at his father's is.. if he was supposed to have gone to his father's to sleep at 5:30 a.m. Sunday (stated by TP in first part of interview) then how can TP state later that AFTER MH got up he went to his father's around 10:00 a.m. Sunday....... he had already stated earlier in the interview that MH had slept there!! Did MH get up after 5:30 at some point and go "somewhere else" and then come back to his father's at 10:00??? In other words, TP stated two different times (5:30 a.m. and 10:00 a.m.) that MH arrived at his father's. I'm confused, hope I'm not confusing everyone else, lol.

[oldyeller]

HD was the last person to call her and he called her mobile.