Nona Dirksmeyer, 2005 Miss Arkansas pageant contestant found dead in her apartment

[hawgustusgloop]

I think the language about the stick in the PCS was something along the lines of, "The investigation revealed that........," so maybe it was something that was confirmed by multiple sources, and therefore, generally accepted as true. Perhaps, K.Jo, Nona's mom, her stepdad, other friends, etc., who had been to her apartment before knew about that stick.

Y'all are practically daring me to bump Whodunit's "The Missing Stick" post again, but I will resist the urge. :D

[lorettalockhorn]

It's good to question. I was just checking to make sure there was no "offical" reason to question. Thanks.

Not that I'm aware of.

Has this been posted yet?

http://couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15273

[FDInLaw]

Not that I'm aware of.

Has this been posted yet?

http://couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15273 Nope! Thanks! :seeya:

[lorettalockhorn]

I think the language about the stick in the PCS was something along the lines of, "The investigation revealed that........," so maybe it was something that was confirmed by multiple sources, and therefore, generally accepted as true. Perhaps, K.Jo, Nona's mom, her stepdad, other friends, etc., who had been to her apartment before knew about that stick.

Y'all are practically daring me to bump Whodunit's "The Missing Stick" post again, but I will resist the urge. :D

LOL

You are correct about the wording of the PCS, KJ apparently described the way to open the door after LE determined that a stick had a one time existed. It very well could be that LE interviewed Nona's mom, stepdad, friends, etc. before they interviewed Kevin or tested the door opening method and I may be mistaken that they learned about the stick from him.

"Affiant’s investigation revealed that normally the door was secured by placing a stick placed in the bottom of the door frame to prevent the sliding half of the door from sliding. However, on the afternoon of the 1 5th of December, there was no stick in the door frame and after an extensive search of the apartment and surrounding area, no stick was ever found. In his interview on the 15th of December, Jones stated that he was able to open the sliding door by using extra force to overcome initial resistance from the door. The action described by Jones during the interview was consistent with the action affiant was required to use to open the sliding door when the door was locked from inside. From Jones’ description and the experiments done by affiant with the sliding door, affiant believes that at the time Nona’s body was discovered, the door was locked from the inside using the locking mechanism but not braced by an object at the bottom of the door"

[Mishell1383]

Ahhh..........
lol leave it to you to find this stuff. ! :)

[lorettalockhorn]

I remember mgrace. Didn't he leave before the gag order was instated? Anyway, it was curious to me that he seemed to waffle on whether or not it was possible that KJ could be guilty. Maybe he was taking a defense stance for the sake of general principal and likewise sometimes seemed to support LE. At any rate, I don't remember that he ever stated a theory as to how or why Kevin could possibly be innocent. Maybe he'll be back after the trial is completed.

In the meantime, those of us who have seriously considered the evidence available at this time and have gone on the record with our thoughts would like to hear from the pro-defense types as to how this crime possibly occurred. (Me and minimally one other.) There has got to be someone out there who believes in KJ's innocence and who isn't bound by the gag order.

[lorettalockhorn]

Welp, lo, I have stated my thoughts, and I'm not bound by the gag order. So, what are you REALLY trying to say here?


I'm really trying to say that I'm sorry, I missed your theory and also that of some of the others. :seeya:

I should look in your history? Maybe someone will bump it for me? I think it would be interesting to discuss the case from the perspective that he didn't commit the crime but don't recollect those posts, I thought that I had read the entire thread.

[hawgustusgloop]

Perhaps his varying in times is because he wants to protect someone other than himself. Maybe he was with someone that day but doesn't want to bring them into all the mess.

Don't forget about this one!

[lorettalockhorn]

Thanks for the bump! I'm guessing that the third post is yours?

ITA about the phone records. If any combination of cell/home/store/etc. phone records can confirm that KJ made the calls that he claimed to LE, it will not only solidify his alibi but will go a long way to helping the jury see his character in a better light; he will be seen as more truthful than he is now. Also, if the store has a timeclock, some sort of security camera, or even if each employees has some sort of identifying key on the cash register that will also help with the alibi. If Nona died at 11:04 and Kevin left his home at 11:45 to go to work, that would give him only forty one minutes to stage the scene, drive to Dover, clean up, and destroy his clothes and/or the stick. Is that even possible?

I noticed that you mentioned the stick and that Nona and Kevin were both seeing various people. Are you inferring that one of their other dates or partners committed the crime and took the stick away?

If the owner of the condom wrapper can be identified and confronted at trial, I think that KJ might be acquitted. If it can be proven that LE didn't interview fifty people during the 3 1/2 month period before the arrest, didn't test the alibis of any other suspects, didn't search for evidence and/or lied in the PCS, I think that KJ will likely be acquitted.

[lorettalockhorn]

Don't forget about this one!

Man, I feel sorry for Kevin if he was with someone that day who isn't willing to come forward on his/her own and save his bacon. (Not to mention his parents' retirement account.)

[FDInLaw]

haha ALL resources are helpful, including past posters!
Seriously, these old posts did make some good sense to me, even with the heavy legal jargon tones.;)Huh. So, are you saying that you think mgrace was a member of Kevin's defense team?

[lorettalockhorn]

Huh. So, are you saying that you think mgrace was a member of Kevin's defense team?

hmmm I hadn't considered that. When you read all of his posts, he sounds kinda out there.

[FDInLaw]

hmmm I hadn't considered that. When you read all of his posts, he sounds kinda out there. That's what's weird. Did any of us think Janie was Lemoncello? I had no clue. It was SusieQ's comment about "heavy legal jargon tones" that made me wonder. Mgrace was also the one that posted the complete Response to the Motion for Discovery (the witness list was deleted by the moderator). Who knows?

[lorettalockhorn]

That's what's weird. Did any of us think Janie was Lemoncello? I had no clue. It was SusieQ's comment about "heavy legal jargon tones" that made me wonder. Mgrace was also the one that posted the complete Response to the Motion for Discovery (the witness list was deleted by the moderator). Who knows?

He sure was.

The only thing that I ever remember thinking about Lemoncello was the she was disguising her writing style for some reason. I guess that was true!

[hawgustusgloop]

That's what's weird. Did any of us think Janie was Lemoncello? I had no clue. It was SusieQ's comment about "heavy legal jargon tones" that made me wonder. Mgrace was also the one that posted the complete Response to the Motion for Discovery (the witness list was deleted by the moderator). Who knows?

I never suspected that lemoncello was Janie Ginocchio. I thought she was someone closely connected to the case but not under the gag order. I kind of thought she really relished having a little extra info and just posted in that odd way to feel more mysterious.

[lorettalockhorn]

Nah, the third post is someone else's. That's why it said quoted from susieQ above it.

Yes, I mentioned the stick. I have recently rethought that, that I never truly heard anyone "verify" the existnce of the stick. I have come to doubt that there ever was one.

I believe LE interviewed over 50 people, just not well. I truly think that no one else was printed or tested for DNA. Just a hunch. I believe there was a search for evidence, just not great enough, i.e. vehicles, clothings, suspects homes, etc. Lied in the PCS, whether intentionally or unintentionally? Like I said, at this point for me, anything the RPD is questionable, highly.

As for the time frame, any body got a clue where KJ actually lives in Dover? Is it far out? On the edge of Russellville? Actually in Booger Hollow? Or, what? Dover has a lot of ground to cover there, and I think that will play a role as well.

As for the reference about the alibi, that was just a "what if", a surmise just like every one else on here. I have no idea what his alibi will be and obviously the defense is not divulging that till the trial, for a reason of their own.

The prosecution may not bring the final six suspects (or whatever the number) into play but the defense may or may not choose to, or they may choose to single some out. Who knows? I just bet they will become a factor somehow. That's just my guess. Wonder what their alibis are? Are they airtight? I'd be curious to know.

Wait, which post was yours? The first one? (I'm guessing not the second one since you don't usually refer to yourself in the third person. LOL) I thought that you were bumping where you posted your theory and I couldn't figure out why you edited the poster names?

Now, I'm really puzzled!!

I seriously doubt it. It would be too unwise.

You doubt that Janie was disguising her style? If Lemoncello was an example of her journalistic abilities, I'm surprised that she ever got a job! NOT saying that I didn't enjoy reading her stuff.

(Still puzzled.)

[lorettalockhorn]

No, the third one really was mine. I was actually trying to make a joke with you. However, since I didn't use any smiley's I can now see where you wouldn't be able to realize that. I didn't edit the names, actually, I just copied and pasted and it did not work like I planned. Not well at all, I am guessing.

As for the other statement, my family was trying to distract me and I guess I was because that was meant for another statement.

Gotcha. LOL

(I do have a friend on another board who only refers to herself on the board in third person; in YM and emails, she is perfectly normal and sane sounding!)

(Less puzzled!)

[jonikay]

on Rushing Road in Dover. About 5 minutes or so from the station . . . towards Booger Hollow, but not even close. I don't know if they still live there or not.

[sololobo]

That very well could be. For some reason, that he was to attend the party with mom niggles me. Maybe he went every year, maybe he was a special student, maybe there were several children at this party, maybe he was her frequent escort. Maybe it's not important at all! I do wonder where some of those teachers might be now when they could be here (for instance) shoring up Kevin's character. Not knowing him, I would like to learn more about why he couldn't have committed this heinous crime.

Everything negative I've heard about Jones begins with the assumption he killed Nona. "Kevin killed Nona therefore he is a bad person." Everything I have heard that does not start with the above assertion has been positive.

“I liked him,” Dipert said, adding that Jones had been like a “son, a good friend” to her. She said she had “no idea” what might have triggered an attack on her daughter. Asked if her daughter ever indicated Jones had been violent, Dipert said: “Never.” This is “completely unlike the Kevin I know.”
http://www.nwanews.com/adg/News/150430

I'm sure the supporters of Jones are aware they shouldn't speak out in his defense before the trial and that they should let his lawyers handle this, they are professionals. "Silence is golden" aplies in this situation. And they would be cognizant of the outspoken few in this community who believe "They support Jones the killer, therefore they are bad people".

[sololobo]

I totally get that there are pro-defense types here, but I'm wondering if they have a theory about the crime? Something that they could put forth for the purpose of discussion?

Are there people on the fence that feel that there is a fatal flaw in LE's theory? Several folks have stated that there are questions that will help them to decide more certainly about KJ's guilt, such as substantiation of Kevin's alibi.

It's not likely that the State is going to give details of the original six suspects at trial (at least not in my mind), does anyone out there have some ideas about why the other suspects should have been indicted?

I don't know who any of the other suspects are so all I can do is speculate. Nor do I know of any evidence linking Jones to the murder other than a questionable bloody print. Many possibilities exist in this murder case, none proven, none disproved. The below is one of these possibilities, not proven, not disproved. This or some variation of it is possible but remote, very remote.

Warning: Another sololobo speculative scenario below:)

When I drive up W. 12 street approaching Nona' apartment complex, the first thing that comes into view is the cleared power line adjoining the apartments going straight up the hill to Skyline Drive. In my mind it appears as an accusatory finger pointing up to a possible suspect. Did any of the suspects live in the vicinity of Skyline Drive directly above the apartment complex? I don't know, but what if?

When I first did a map search of Nona's address, I was struck by the close proximity of Skyline Drive to her apartment. Subsequent viewing of satellite and topographic maps left me unsure if this area was navigatable on foot. Since then, I have learned there are 4-wheeler and mountain bike trails all through there and that Nona's apartment complex is accessible from Skyline Drive by walking down this wooded area.

What if Nona had an admirer, an older married man? One who helped her pick this particular apartment for its close proximity to his house up the hill? One who perhaps helped pay the rent? Perhaps Nona respected and trusted this man, and to her there was nothing sexual involved. But the man was smitten by her beauty and personality. Perhaps one cold December day, he discreetly walked down the hill and confronted Nona, telling her how he loved her and wanted her. Nona laughs at his advances and in a fit of rage, he kills her.

Frantic panic overcomes him when he realizes what he has done. He must remove all traces of his visit that day and any indications of his true feelings for Nona. Cell phone messages? Delete all messages from and to him from her phone. Remove and take the battery to make sure they are deleted. His clothes are bloody, especially the torso area. He had taken off his coat and it was not bloody. He put on his coat, hiding most of the blood stains. Hmmm, make it appear to be a rape. He opens a condom wrapper, (he had fantasized this would turn out differently and came prepared) and not realizing he deposited DNA on it, left it on the counter. He carefully removed her clothing and put them in a trash bag from the kitchen, leaving blood stains in the kitchen. He checks her PC for anything relating to him, messages, photos. He exits through the sliding back door with the trash bag, slides it shut in the lock position, and taking the stick with him, sneaks back up the hill. He disposes of the bloody clothes, the stick and the coat which now had blood on the inside of it.


Pure fiction, pure speculation and pure imagination:) But so are many scenarios with Jones the killer if the bloody print was made after discovery of the body. With what little we know, nothing really fits. And an overactive imagination can envision almost any scenario. We need more information, more facts before we can make an honest conclusion about this case. The trial should enlighten us. Until then, I have no viable opinions as to the true identity of her murderer.

[sololobo]

RUMOR RUMOR RUMOR RUMOR RUMOR***
Since I believe it is ok to let rumors out on this forum, I am about to give everybody one . . . I have never relied on this rumor as being true, although I don't necessarily rely on it to be false. I heard this rumor way back when, before KJ was convicted, from a close relative of a police official . . . take this as you will, but I heard from this person that police found KJ's clothes a few days after the murder at the local salvation army. Apparently, he had dumped his clothes there thinking no one would find them, but according to this person, the police searched up and down to find the clothes. I like to think of it as a good theory as to what could have happened to KJ's clothes, since we are on the topic of it. I also like to think that the RPD and the Gibbons clan are holding a lot of information in . . . this possibly being a bit of it . . .

Does the Salvation Army accept bloody clothes as donations?...:) I wonder if the police checked Marva for the missing stick?....:)

[al38]

On channel 7 this am they were doing a story on the case. Did any of you see it? Right after Nona was murdered they interviewed Duane and Carol. OK, so Duane is saying that Nona was part of a study group- that there was a boy there in her apartment with this group- and that he didn't want to study what they were supposed to be studying and he had to be "kicked out" Physically is what I got from it. I took it that he was making passes at Nona, but I hadn't had my coffee yet. And that that boy needed to be looked at in Duane's opinion. But by the time of Nona's funeral, the family didn't want K to sit with them. So do any of you remember anything about the boy with the study group?

[FDInLaw]

On channel 7 this am they were doing a story on the case. Did any of you see it? Right after Nona was murdered they interviewed Duane and Carol. OK, so Duane is saying that Nona was part of a study group- that there was a boy there in her apartment with this group- and that he didn't want to study what they were supposed to be studying and he had to be "kicked out" Physically is what I got from it. I took it that he was making passes at Nona, but I hadn't had my coffee yet. And that that boy needed to be looked at in Duane's opinion. But by the time of Nona's funeral, the family didn't want K to sit with them. So do any of you remember anything about the boy with the study group?

Thanks for posting this. I did just check for a video link but did not find one. Here is another story that was done on Fox 16 earlier this week.

http://www.fox16.com/mediacenter/local.aspx?videoId=47885

[JR2007]

Thanks for posting this. I did just check for a video link but did not find one. Here is another story that was done on Fox 16 earlier this week.

http://www.fox16.com/mediacenter/local.aspx?videoId=47885
Thanks for the Link FD.:)

[JR2007]

On channel 7 this am they were doing a story on the case. Did any of you see it? Right after Nona was murdered they interviewed Duane and Carol. OK, so Duane is saying that Nona was part of a study group- that there was a boy there in her apartment with this group- and that he didn't want to study what they were supposed to be studying and he had to be "kicked out" Physically is what I got from it. I took it that he was making passes at Nona, but I hadn't had my coffee yet. And that that boy needed to be looked at in Duane's opinion. But by the time of Nona's funeral, the family didn't want K to sit with them. So do any of you remember anything about the boy with the study group?

Immediately following the murder, all are suspects. They don't stay suspects, if they have an alibi, that holds up, through investigation. they are all taken off the list, one at a time, until those without alibis are left. In this case that was one. At the same time LE looks at the evidence and follows the trial it leads them, if the trail leads to the same person as he without an alibi, then you have your killer. 99.9% accurate. Sure the system makes mistakes, those are the very few times, that through DNA testing, someone is proven innocent.
Until our God makes us perfect we will continue to make mistakes. JMO.

[lorettalockhorn]

Everything negative I've heard about Jones begins with the assumption he killed Nona. "Kevin killed Nona therefore he is a bad person." Everything I have heard that does not start with the above assertion has been positive.

“I liked him,” Dipert said, adding that Jones had been like a “son, a good friend” to her. She said she had “no idea” what might have triggered an attack on her daughter. Asked if her daughter ever indicated Jones had been violent, Dipert said: “Never.” This is “completely unlike the Kevin I know.”
http://www.nwanews.com/adg/News/150430

I'm sure the supporters of Jones are aware they shouldn't speak out in his defense before the trial and that they should let his lawyers handle this, they are professionals. "Silence is golden" aplies in this situation. And they would be cognizant of the outspoken few in this community who believe "They support Jones the killer, therefore they are bad people".

I had never heard of KJ before the murder, the negative assumption that I have about him is that he is a liar. If his alibi can be cleared up, I'll feel differently.

Solo, your scenario makes sense to me. With regard to someone walking to Nona's apartment, there are plenty of places nearby that someone could have parked making the trek less treacherous. And there are (were) other wooded areas in the neighborhood where the stick could have been disposed of, if it didn't end up in the lake, strip pits, burn pile, etc.

I don't doubt that Nona (or Kevin) had other relationship(s) and I wonder if would necessarily have to be a sexual one for jealousy to be the motive.

[lorettalockhorn]

On channel 7 this am they were doing a story on the case. Did any of you see it? Right after Nona was murdered they interviewed Duane and Carol. OK, so Duane is saying that Nona was part of a study group- that there was a boy there in her apartment with this group- and that he didn't want to study what they were supposed to be studying and he had to be "kicked out" Physically is what I got from it. I took it that he was making passes at Nona, but I hadn't had my coffee yet. And that that boy needed to be looked at in Duane's opinion. But by the time of Nona's funeral, the family didn't want K to sit with them. So do any of you remember anything about the boy with the study group?


Interesting. I had never heard about the study group. Do you know what class the group was associated with? Drat, wish I had seen that report.

FD, thanks for your link, I missed that one too.

[lorettalockhorn]

I'm sure the supporters of Jones are aware they shouldn't speak out in his defense before the trial and that they should let his lawyers handle this, they are professionals. "Silence is golden" aplies in this situation. And they would be cognizant of the outspoken few in this community who believe "They support Jones the killer, therefore they are bad people".


That's an interesting thought that I hadn't considered. I realize that the attorneys can't speak about KJ or anything else, I'm just curious as to why more of his supporters haven't showed up here where they would have the benefit of anonymity. The defense argued that the change of venue was in part necessary due to The Courier having led people to this site. But I haven't seen much of an influx of actual posters. There do seem to be more lurkers.

[jonikay]

Does the Salvation Army accept bloody clothes as donations?...:) I wonder if the police checked Marva for the missing stick?....:)
A few of the places like that have areas where you drop stuff off and if you have things in a trash bag or something like that, they don't go through it on the spot. And some of the times, people aren't there at all and you can just drop your stuff off at the designated area. But, being that the donations are tax deductible, people usually wait until someone comes out to help them so they can get a receipt. It's a possibility that he could have done that, weird . . . but possible.

[FDInLaw]

JR, I beg to differ on this point. First of all, we don't know what the other suspects alibis were, if they even had one, or if they were airtight. Secondly, no one has ever said that KJ did not have an alibi, so you really can't conclude that he is murderer because he doesn't have an alibi. We just don't know what his alibi is. I'm going to have to go with what JR stated. For a PA to press charges in full knowledge that other existing suspects are without alibis is just stupid. Why waste everyone's time when the defense is going to have an easy go at establishing reasonable doubt? I'm sorry, but I for one will be shocked if any of the other six original suspects are without alibis. Also, if Kevin had a good alibi his defense team could have had the charges dropped A YEAR AGO. Why would they wait till now to disclose that? You are a right, a lack of an alibi does not necessarily indicate guilt. If Kevin was at home alone when the murder occurred, he is not guilty. However, as JR stated, if a person does not have an alibi and other evidence in the case points to them, well, there you have it IMO.

[lorettalockhorn]

I'm going to have to go with what JR stated. For a PA to press charges in full knowledge that other existing suspects are without alibis is just stupid. Why waste everyone's time when the defense is going to have an easy go at establishing reasonable doubt? I'm sorry, but I for one will be shocked if any of the other six original suspects are without alibis. Also, if Kevin had a good alibi his defense team could have had the charges dropped A YEAR AGO. Why would they wait till now to disclose that? You are a right, a lack of an alibi does not necessarily indicate guilt. If Kevin was at home alone when the murder occurred, he is not guilty. However, as JR stated, if a person does not have an alibi and other evidence in the case points to them, well, there you have it IMO.

Yeah, I agree and don't think for a minute that KJ would have been arrested had he had a good solid, verifiable alibi, nor would the charges stick. (There's that word again!)

I don't think that we'll hear much from the prosecution about any other suspects, at least not by name. To bring them into the case at this point seems almost slanderous. I do wonder about the defense; do they want to point the finger at someone specifically, or just Mr. Anyone?

Does anyone think that there is the possiblity of any drama or fireworks in the courtroom?

[al38]

Interesting. I had never heard about the study group. Do you know what class the group was associated with? Drat, wish I had seen that report.

FD, thanks for your link, I missed that one too.

I have no idea about the study group. Only that is was for a class at Tech. I did ask a few other people who are from this area if they remembered anything about it, and they did not. I guess it just kind of surprised me, because I don't recall ever hearing about it before, and it looks like if Duane Dipert had said to look at so and so, that we would have heard about it back then- but maybe it is like one of you said, and that guys alibi checked out.

[lorettalockhorn]

I have no idea about the study group. Only that is was for a class at Tech. I did ask a few other people who are from this area if they remembered anything about it, and they did not. I guess it just kind of surprised me, because I don't recall ever hearing about it before, and it looks like if Duane Dipert had said to look at so and so, that we would have heard about it back then- but maybe it is like one of you said, and that guys alibi checked out.

Thanks al! Maybe I'm naive, but I just cannot help but think that LE did everything by the book including checking out this guy. I guess that he was one of the six maybe?

[hawgustusgloop]

Yeah, I agree and don't think for a minute that KJ would have been arrested had he had a good solid, verifiable alibi, nor would the charges stick. (There's that word again!)

I don't think that we'll hear much from the prosecution about any other suspects, at least not by name. To bring them into the case at this point seems almost slanderous. I do wonder about the defense; do they want to point the finger at someone specifically, or just Mr. Anyone?

Does anyone think that there is the possiblity of any drama or fireworks in the courtroom?

I think the possibility of major drama hangs heavily over this trial. Think about how K.Jo's father reacted in the police station early in the investigation. Think about how Nona's family had waited so long for an arrest and how they have waited over a year and a half for the trial. Think about the fact that they have all been under the gag order for so long, unable to speak out against any rumors. Think about what a conviction would mean for K.Jo and his family. Think about the prosecutor questioning K.Jo's mom or even K.Jo himself. I think there is a huge potential for drama.

[lorettalockhorn]

I think the possibility of major drama hangs heavily over this trial. Think about how K.Jo's father reacted in the police station early in the investigation. Think about how Nona's family had waited so long for an arrest and how they have waited over a year and a half for the trial. Think about the fact that they have all been under the gag order for so long, unable to speak out against any rumors. Think about what a conviction would mean for K.Jo and his family. Think about the prosecutor questioning K.Jo's mom or even K.Jo himself. I think there is a huge potential for drama.


I think there's room for drama here too, starting with whether or not Carol Dipert will be able to be in the courtroom. Also, it sounds like the defense is going to attempt to impeach their witness, Jeremy Martin; is that allowed? Does Martin really have anything earthshattering to swear to that will clear Kevin? I wonder how well Mrs. Jones will do on the witness stand? Especially if it is proven that KJ has no alibi, will that shake her resolve? (Is Mr. Jones a witness too?) I think that I read somewhere that KJ may testify, but I don't remember where.

[JR2007]

JR, I beg to differ on this point. First of all, we don't know what the other suspects alibis were, if they even had one, or if they were airtight. Secondly, no one has ever said that KJ did not have an alibi, so you really can't conclude that he is murderer because he doesn't have an alibi. We just don't know what his alibi is.
The way I see it is if your alibi is refuted by others you have no alibi.

[lorettalockhorn]

This is a quote from a link that Jonikay posted earlier. (I wonder where the source got the idea that KJ might testify, from the witness list?) He had a good reputation before the murder, would it help to restore his persona if he testified?

"In addition, the court filings show that Jones may testify and that his lawyers may call as witnesses Jones' mother, Janice, and the victim's stepfather and mother, Duane and Carole Dipert."

http://www.dnalabsinternational.com/email_newsletter/vol_35_jan_07/newsletter.htm

[sololobo]

Yeah, I agree and don't think for a minute that KJ would have been arrested had he had a good solid, verifiable alibi, nor would the charges stick. (There's that word again!)

I don't think that we'll hear much from the prosecution about any other suspects, at least not by name. To bring them into the case at this point seems almost slanderous. I do wonder about the defense; do they want to point the finger at someone specifically, or just Mr. Anyone?

Does anyone think that there is the possiblity of any drama or fireworks in the courtroom?


A Perry Mason moment?:) Maybe....a long shot. If Jones is not the killer and the killer knew Nona, it is possible the killer is on one of the witness lists, more than likely the defense witness list. I doubt a complete confession on the stand though:)

[lorettalockhorn]

The Courier devoted quite a bit of space to the case this morning in section one, but it's not online yet. Besides the two articles on the front page above the fold; there is a key players segment with pictures and a brief bio of each, except Nona.

Also on P1: "During the State v. Kevin Jones trial, scheduled to begin Monday, The Courier will post midday updates of court proceedings on its Web site."

[hawgustusgloop]

This is a quote from a link that Jonikay posted earlier. (I wonder where the source got the idea that KJ might testify, from the witness list?) He had a good reputation before the murder, would it help to restore his persona if he testified?

"In addition, the court filings show that Jones may testify and that his lawyers may call as witnesses Jones' mother, Janice, and the victim's stepfather and mother, Duane and Carole Dipert."

http://www.dnalabsinternational.com/email_newsletter/vol_35_jan_07/newsletter.htm

I also wonder where they got that info. I may have seen it somewhere else though. I guess I'll go back and :read: .

If K.Jo didn't murder Nona, then IMO it could only help him to get on the stand and truthfully explain for himself his activities and the reasons for his seemingly odd behavior and/or statements. No one else is as qualified to tell the jury exactly what he was thinking or feeling at the time.

However, if he DID murder Nona, he should stay as far away from the witness stand as humanly possible. No matter how sharp or well-prepared he may be, there is no way to anticipate everything the prosecutor would throw at him in the cross-examination.

[lorettalockhorn]

A Perry Mason moment?:) Maybe....a long shot. If Jones is not the killer and the killer knew Nona, it is possible the killer is on one of the witness lists, more than likely the defense witness list. I doubt a complete confession on the stand though:)


I don't think that someone is going to jump up out of the gallery and say that he/she did it or anything that dramatic!

If the "true killer" is on the defense's witness list, are they going to be allowed to beat a confession out of him on the witness stand? Is that allowed?

I guess it is: http://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/fre/rules.htm

http://touchngo.com/lglcntr/ctrules/evidence/EVID-41.htm

[hawgustusgloop]

I also wonder where they got that info. I may have seen it somewhere else though. I guess I'll go back and :read: .

If K.Jo didn't murder Nona, then IMO it could only help him to get on the stand and truthfully explain for himself his activities and the reasons for his seemingly odd behavior and/or statements. No one else is as qualified to tell the jury exactly what he was thinking or feeling at the time.

However, if he DID murder Nona, he should stay as far away from the witness stand as humanly possible. No matter how sharp or well-prepared he may be, there is no way to anticipate everything the prosecutor would throw at him in the cross-examination.

Here is where I saw it:

http://www.couriernews.com/archived_story.php?ID=13430&Search=nona%20dirksmeyer

From the Courier article dated Jan. 1, 2007:

"The trial is expected to take 10 days, with more than 100 witnesses slated to testify — including Jones."

[lorettalockhorn]

Here is where I saw it:

http://www.couriernews.com/archived_story.php?ID=13430&Search=nona%20dirksmeyer

From the Courier article dated Jan. 1, 2007:

"The trial is expected to take 10 days, with more than 100 witnesses slated to testify — including Jones."

Thanks Hawg, his name must be on the witness list submitted to the court. Wonder who else is on the list that I've forgotten or that we haven't seen?

[christina]

I think there's room for drama here too, starting with whether or not Carol Dipert will be able to be in the courtroom. Also, it sounds like the defense is going to attempt to impeach their witness, Jeremy Martin; is that allowed? Does Martin really have anything earthshattering to swear to that will clear Kevin? I wonder how well Mrs. Jones will do on the witness stand? Especially if it is proven that KJ has no alibi, will that shake her resolve? (Is Mr. Jones a witness too?) I think that I read somewhere that KJ may testify, but I don't remember where.

After observing the lawyers during the two hearings- I am confident there will be some level of drama.
The person I want to see on the stand is Duane Dipert. He has been a hothead all along, it was even rumored he was on this blog at one point and pretty "out there". I know you guys are probably tired of my "why would he ask for his murdered step daughter's phone" mantra but I still think that is weird and it will be hard for him to answer that on the stand.

[christina]

Imagine the mixed feelings of all involved today knowing the trial starts tomorrow.

[christina]

I don't know who any of the other suspects are so all I can do is speculate. Nor do I know of any evidence linking Jones to the murder other than a questionable bloody print. Many possibilities exist in this murder case, none proven, none disproved. The below is one of these possibilities, not proven, not disproved. This or some variation of it is possible but remote, very remote.

Warning: Another sololobo speculative scenario below:)

When I drive up W. 12 street approaching Nona' apartment complex, the first thing that comes into view is the cleared power line adjoining the apartments going straight up the hill to Skyline Drive. In my mind it appears as an accusatory finger pointing up to a possible suspect. Did any of the suspects live in the vicinity of Skyline Drive directly above the apartment complex? I don't know, but what if?

When I first did a map search of Nona's address, I was struck by the close proximity of Skyline Drive to her apartment. Subsequent viewing of satellite and topographic maps left me unsure if this area was navigatable on foot. Since then, I have learned there are 4-wheeler and mountain bike trails all through there and that Nona's apartment complex is accessible from Skyline Drive by walking down this wooded area.

What if Nona had an admirer, an older married man? One who helped her pick this particular apartment for its close proximity to his house up the hill? One who perhaps helped pay the rent? Perhaps Nona respected and trusted this man, and to her there was nothing sexual involved. But the man was smitten by her beauty and personality. Perhaps one cold December day, he discreetly walked down the hill and confronted Nona, telling her how he loved her and wanted her. Nona laughs at his advances and in a fit of rage, he kills her.

Frantic panic overcomes him when he realizes what he has done. He must remove all traces of his visit that day and any indications of his true feelings for Nona. Cell phone messages? Delete all messages from and to him from her phone. Remove and take the battery to make sure they are deleted. His clothes are bloody, especially the torso area. He had taken off his coat and it was not bloody. He put on his coat, hiding most of the blood stains. Hmmm, make it appear to be a rape. He opens a condom wrapper, (he had fantasized this would turn out differently and came prepared) and not realizing he deposited DNA on it, left it on the counter. He carefully removed her clothing and put them in a trash bag from the kitchen, leaving blood stains in the kitchen. He checks her PC for anything relating to him, messages, photos. He exits through the sliding back door with the trash bag, slides it shut in the lock position, and taking the stick with him, sneaks back up the hill. He disposes of the bloody clothes, the stick and the coat which now had blood on the inside of it.


Pure fiction, pure speculation and pure imagination:) But so are many scenarios with Jones the killer if the bloody print was made after discovery of the body. With what little we know, nothing really fits. And an overactive imagination can envision almost any scenario. We need more information, more facts before we can make an honest conclusion about this case. The trial should enlighten us. Until then, I have no viable opinions as to the true identity of her murderer.

And the reason you are not writing for TV is?????

[christina]

The Courier devoted quite a bit of space to the case this morning in section one, but it's not online yet. Besides the two articles on the front page above the fold; there is a key players segment with pictures and a brief bio of each, except Nona.

Also on P1: "During the State v. Kevin Jones trial, scheduled to begin Monday, The Courier will post midday updates of court proceedings on its Web site."

Saw that this morning. I am hoping to be able to have my laptop there as well. I understand there is no internet in the courtroom. I'll just follow the Courier reporter out and see where she plugs in!

[JR2007]

A Perry Mason moment?:) Maybe....a long shot. If Jones is not the killer and the killer knew Nona, it is possible the killer is on one of the witness lists, more than likely the defense witness list. I doubt a complete confession on the stand though:)
You didn't take your medication this morning, did you?:D

[FDInLaw]

After observing the lawyers during the two hearings- I am confident there will be some level of drama.
The person I want to see on the stand is Duane Dipert. He has been a hothead all along, it was even rumored he was on this blog at one point and pretty "out there". I know you guys are probably tired of my "why would he ask for his murdered step daughter's phone" mantra but I still think that is weird and it will be hard for him to answer that on the stand.Speaking of "hothead" how about the guy that threw a chair through a wall down at the police station? :biggrin:

[Mishell1383]

SO close!!!!!!!!!!!

[odette]

Yesterday, 08:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Results View Post
Today marks the one year anniversary for missing Roxanne if you could please go post your support on the vigil thread for Roxanne would sure appreciate it. Roxy's Mom reads the forum and post with updates so lets show her our CL community compassion! Sorry to disrupt your thread and everyone have a wonderful weekend. Link below to the vigil thread:

http://boards.crimelibrary.com/showt...ghlight%3DRoxy

This link (below) will take you to the main page for Roxanne .. scroll down a little for the link to the online vigil.

Thank you Results :rose:

http://boards.crimelibrary.com/forumdisplay.php?f=376

[lorettalockhorn]

After observing the lawyers during the two hearings- I am confident there will be some level of drama.
The person I want to see on the stand is Duane Dipert. He has been a hothead all along, it was even rumored he was on this blog at one point and pretty "out there". I know you guys are probably tired of my "why would he ask for his murdered step daughter's phone" mantra but I still think that is weird and it will be hard for him to answer that on the stand.

I've never heard anything about DD or his temperament. I did read in a Courier article that the Diperts were not happy with the bail amount. I also read that H Jones was violent in the police station; an example of where KJ could have learned that behavior.

Almost forgot to ask, which screenname was Dipert using here? I'd like to go back and read his posts. "Out there" doesn't begin to help. hehehe

[christina]

I've never heard anything about DD or his temperament. I did read in a Courier article that the Diperts were not happy with the bail amount. I also read that H Jones was violent in the police station; an example of where KJ could have learned that behavior.

Almost forgot to ask, which screenname was Dipert using here? I'd like to go back and read his posts. "Out there" doesn't begin to help. hehehe

What? You can't narrow the posters to just one that was "out there"!!!

I have been told stories about Dipert by several people-from police officers to people who worked with him to those that know him through Nona's mom. They painted him as "very different", not violent. When I asked some of them how they thought he would do at the trial, all said he would probably lose his temper and say something he shouldn't.
As for his alias on here, I got in trouble by Freshwater (eventually recanted)for "outing" lemoncello as Ginnocio so I better not do the same here. I will send you a private message.
Yes, I was told by a police officer that Jone's father got angry at the station and threw a chair, did not hear about it breaking a window.

[christina]

Speaking of "hothead" how about the guy that threw a chair through a wall down at the police station? :biggrin:

Touche'......

[lorettalockhorn]

What? You can't narrow the posters to just one that was "out there"!!!

I have been told stories about Dipert by several people-from police officers to people who worked with him to those that know him through Nona's mom. They painted him as "very different", not violent. When I asked some of them how they thought he would do at the trial, all said he would probably lose his temper and say something he shouldn't.
As for his alias on here, I got in trouble by Freshwater (eventually recanted)for "outing" lemoncello as Ginnocio so I better not do the same here. I will send you a private message.
Yes, I was told by a police officer that Jone's father got angry at the station and threw a chair, did not hear about it breaking a window.

I've never heard that he was violent or "very different" so I guess you're one up or more than I. I would hope that no one loses their temper at trial, including the injured parties, the Diperts.

Did you out lemoncello? I thought The Courier did? I should read more carefully because I also never read that the H Jones chair throwing incident resulted in a broken window. (Which would explain why I never said that it did.)

Hope that you can get a seat tomorrow!

[chambord]

Do to my work schedule I am going to have to rely on posts here > is anyone planning on posting opening statements, etc?

I would so appreciate it.

[FDInLaw]

Do to my work schedule I am going to have to rely on posts here > is anyone planning on posting opening statements, etc?

I would so appreciate it.:seeya:
Hey stranger! It's great to see you plan to follow the trial! I'm sure that anything that can be had by the public will end up here. So, you've picked a good place to hang out. :)

(O/T do you still have Sanjaya locked up in your closet? If so, please don't let him out! :biggrin: )

[chambord]

:seeya:
Hey stranger! It's great to see you plan to follow the trial! I'm sure that anything that can be had by the public will end up here. So, you've picked a good place to hang out. :)

(O/T do you still have Sanjaya locked up in your closet? If so, please don't let him out! :biggrin: )

That's great that they'll be updates here. I'll catch up every night.

lol...hope your getting some rest..Sanjaya is doing his tour, I had to release him.:cuss:
There's a new crush on SYTYCD..:D

[FDInLaw]

That's great that they'll be updates here. I'll catch up every night.

lol...hope your getting some rest..Sanjaya is doing his tour, I had to release him.:cuss:
There's a new crush on SYTYCD..:D
Let me guess. . . PASHA? :D

It will be sure nice to have you here on Nona's forum, we can use a few more folks with a sense of humor in tact!

[christina]

I've never heard that he was violent or "very different" so I guess you're one up or more than I. I would hope that no one loses their temper at trial, including the injured parties, the Diperts.

Did you out lemoncello? I thought The Courier did? I should read more carefully because I also never read that the H Jones chair throwing incident resulted in a broken window. (Which would explain why I never said that it did.)

Hope that you can get a seat tomorrow!

I posted immediately following the hearing that the defense questioned Ginnocio on the stand and she admitted to being lemoncello and lieing about her experiences. Freshwater caught that(or it was reported to her) and gave me demerits. After several others, including a report in the Courier posted the same information, Freshwater removed me from the bad poster list.

[christina]

Hope that you can get a seat tomorrow!

I heard there was only going to be voir dire and the seating of the jury tomorrow. So I was going to spend the day getting work done and be there Tuesday for what I hope are the opening statements.

[lorettalockhorn]

I posted immediately following the hearing that the defense questioned Ginnocio on the stand and she admitted to being lemoncello and lieing about her experiences. Freshwater caught that(or it was reported to her) and gave me demerits. After several others, including a report in the Courier posted the same information, Freshwater removed me from the bad poster list.

That's good; we've got to have our news fix! I'm still amazed that you can and will take so much time to keep us in the know. Thanks.

[lorettalockhorn]

loretta, are you still not going to attend the trial? You should go. It would be nice to have different views.....

LMAO Just this afternoon, Leroy was telling me that I should pack a suitcase and go. hmmm :punch: Ya think he'd do my chores? :punch:

[christina]

That's good; we've got to have our news fix! I'm still amazed that you can and will take so much time to keep us in the know. Thanks.

It is not often you get to see a murder trial like this first hand. I enjoy non fiction books on crime, watch some fiction shows on crime, but this will be real. I am a little skittish saying that because this is people's lives.
Luckily I am in a position I can take a few days "off" to attend. It is only 45 minutes away and I heard they have a fantastic BBQ place across from the courthouse! Maybe they have a place I can hook my laptop up to!!!
I am taking a copy of the PCS to see what is addressed/actually in evidence, Have my list of questions I want answered and will try to keep a list of witnesses name and occupations.
JR, are you going to try to attend also?

[christina]

LMAO Just this afternoon, Leroy was telling me that I should pack a suitcase and go. hmmm :punch: Ya think he'd do my chores? :punch:

Oh, I have no illusions anything will get done at my house in my absence!!!!

[regularjoe]

Made a trip to the apartment complex today where Nona lived. I thought that I would check out the story that one of the posters scenarios featuring an older male that lived on skyline drive and the apartments proximity to the hill. Her apartment (particularly the back area where the sliding glass doors and stick were) is actually on the side which is near the inglewood street not the hill. There are apartments in the complex which have a back door that would be perfect to escape out the back door and go straight up the hill however not hers.

The other thing that I was thinking about was and I am hoping someone can answer this. What was the temperature in the apartment when her body was found? I want to say that I read in a Courier article that it was something like 58 degrees. This seems particularly cold if that was correct. Any thoughts?

[lorettalockhorn]

Made a trip to the apartment complex today where Nona lived. I thought that I would check out the story that one of the posters scenarios featuring an older male that lived on skyline drive and the apartments proximity to the hill. Her apartment (particularly the back area where the sliding glass doors and stick were) is actually on the side which is near the inglewood street not the hill. There are apartments in the complex which have a back door that would be perfect to escape out the back door and go straight up the hill however not hers.

The other thing that I was thinking about was and I am hoping someone can answer this. What was the temperature in the apartment when her body was found? I want to say that I read in a Courier article that it was something like 58 degrees. This seems particularly cold if that was correct. Any thoughts?

RegularJoe, I thought that I had read that the temperature in the apartment was sixty degrees. I just figured that the perp lowered the thermostat in an attempt to throw off the time of death. Maybe someone will testify that Nona normally kept the apartment chilly? Maybe a window was open? I'm sure that the ME will explain how and a what rate the body temperature falls after death. Glad that you brought this up; it's another question to be answered.

[christina]

Made a trip to the apartment complex today where Nona lived. I thought that I would check out the story that one of the posters scenarios featuring an older male that lived on skyline drive and the apartments proximity to the hill. Her apartment (particularly the back area where the sliding glass doors and stick were) is actually on the side which is near the inglewood street not the hill. There are apartments in the complex which have a back door that would be perfect to escape out the back door and go straight up the hill however not hers.

The other thing that I was thinking about was and I am hoping someone can answer this. What was the temperature in the apartment when her body was found? I want to say that I read in a Courier article that it was something like 58 degrees. This seems particularly cold if that was correct. Any thoughts?

I orginally thought the apartment was on the hillside as well but was informed it was on the street side.
You bring up a good point about escape. Since time of death is between 11 and 12, during the daytime, it seems someone had to see something. Or the person did not draw any suspicion, or the apartments were not occupied, or...

[sololobo]

Made a trip to the apartment complex today where Nona lived. I thought that I would check out the story that one of the posters scenarios featuring an older male that lived on skyline drive and the apartments proximity to the hill. Her apartment (particularly the back area where the sliding glass doors and stick were) is actually on the side which is near the inglewood street not the hill. There are apartments in the complex which have a back door that would be perfect to escape out the back door and go straight up the hill however not hers.

The other thing that I was thinking about was and I am hoping someone can answer this. What was the temperature in the apartment when her body was found? I want to say that I read in a Courier article that it was something like 58 degrees. This seems particularly cold if that was correct. Any thoughts?

It was cold and windy that day. Her heat should have been on but apparently it was not. Did the killer turn it off or the thermostat down?

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KRUE/2005/12/15/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

The killer could have gone out the back and walked directly to the powerline. No matter how he left and where he went, an oppurtunity would exist for him to be seen.

[sololobo]

You didn't take your medication this morning, did you?:D

Perhaps I should increase the dosage:)

[sololobo]

RegularJoe, I thought that I had read that the temperature in the apartment was sixty degrees. I just figured that the perp lowered the thermostat in an attempt to throw off the time of death. Maybe someone will testify that Nona normally kept the apartment chilly? Maybe a window was open? I'm sure that the ME will explain how and a what rate the body temperature falls after death. Glad that you brought this up; it's another question to be answered.

Or perhaps the killer was sweating after the murder and turned the heat down or off while he was cleaning up and arranging the crime scene to appear as an attempted rape.

[JR2007]

It is not often you get to see a murder trial like this first hand. I enjoy non fiction books on crime, watch some fiction shows on crime, but this will be real. I am a little skittish saying that because this is people's lives.
Luckily I am in a position I can take a few days "off" to attend. It is only 45 minutes away and I heard they have a fantastic BBQ place across from the courthouse! Maybe they have a place I can hook my laptop up to!!!
I am taking a copy of the PCS to see what is addressed/actually in evidence, Have my list of questions I want answered and will try to keep a list of witnesses name and occupations.
JR, are you going to try to attend also?
I most like will not be able to attend any next week as I will be out of state for a few days starting Tues.

[JR2007]

Made a trip to the apartment complex today where Nona lived. I thought that I would check out the story that one of the posters scenarios featuring an older male that lived on skyline drive and the apartments proximity to the hill. Her apartment (particularly the back area where the sliding glass doors and stick were) is actually on the side which is near the inglewood street not the hill. There are apartments in the complex which have a back door that would be perfect to escape out the back door and go straight up the hill however not hers.

The other thing that I was thinking about was and I am hoping someone can answer this. What was the temperature in the apartment when her body was found? I want to say that I read in a Courier article that it was something like 58 degrees. This seems particularly cold if that was correct. Any thoughts?
It was 60 degrees. According to the Defense experts testing parameters.

[FDInLaw]

Prayers for the jury selection process.

:rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose:

[chambord]

The first day will actually be for jury selection. I'm not sure if they will get that far......... Who knows?:shrug: I expect jury selection to take a little while, though.


That's right Suzie...thanks

I had forgotten about the jury selection. :punch:

Wonder how long that will take.

[FDInLaw]

That's right Suzie...thanks

I had forgotten about the jury selection. :punch:

Wonder how long that will take.
Sure hope it will only take a day or two!

[lorettalockhorn]

From today's ArDemGaz; this article is slightly different from the edition that we receive here in R'ville:

http://www.nwarktimes.com/adg/News/195216/

The courier still hasn't posted yesterday's articles online. (Is that usual for it to take so long?)

[FDInLaw]

For the discussion about the temperature in the apartment, here's a link that gives weather information for the day of the murder:

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/KRUE/2005/12/15/DailyHistory.html?req_city=NA&req_state=NA&req_statename=NA

(special thanks to my "ninja" friend for the link :) )

[lorettalockhorn]

Sunday's edition doesn't get posted till Monday afternoon since there is no Monday edition.

Thanks, suga. They should call it courierolds.com. I just cannot function until I've read both of my morning newspapers and worked the XWords!

[lorettalockhorn]

I orginally thought the apartment was on the hillside as well but was informed it was on the street side.
You bring up a good point about escape. Since time of death is between 11 and 12, during the daytime, it seems someone had to see something. Or the person did not draw any suspicion, or the apartments were not occupied, or...


I believe that the ME set the time of death between 10:00 and 12:30. She had the phone call with the prof at 10:25.

Personally, I don't know if I would remember a walker, jogger or runner (for instance) on a particular day, unless I had to swerve to avoid him or something was notable about his appearance.

Which reminds me; has there been any statement about where KJ was that morning before he stated that he left for work at 11:45?

[lorettalockhorn]

Does anyone have any thoughts about how the jury composition might help or hurt the prosecution or defense? Will age or gender be important, or should the jury be a demographic cross-section?

An article about questionaires:

http://www.jri-inc.com/article12.htm

[hawgustusgloop]

I believe that the ME set the time of death between 10:00 and 12:30. She had the phone call with the prof at 10:25.

Personally, I don't know if I would remember a walker, jogger or runner (for instance) on a particular day, unless I had to swerve to avoid him or something was notable about his appearance.

Which reminds me; has there been any statement about where KJ was that morning before he stated that he left for work at 11:45?

From the Probable Cause Statement:

"Kevin Jones was interviewed on December 15th and stated that Jones had last seen Nona at her apartment at approximately 00:3 0 on the 15th when he left her apartment and went to Jones’ parent’s home north of Dover to spend the night. He further stated that he called Nona at approximately 01:30 and talked for a few minutes before going to bed. He then stated he had received a text message from Nona at 09:07 on the 15 . He stated that he stayed at his house until 11:45 at which time he left for his parent’s gas station on Hwy 7 South of Dover. He stated he arrived at the station at noon and while there he talked with Blake Walters."

I took this to mean that K.Jo said he was at home from the time he got back from his late night visit with Nona until 11:45 the next day.
So, if he indeed said that, and if the prosecution can place him anywhere else during that time, he is a liar at the least or a murderer at the worst.

[lorettalockhorn]

From the Probable Cause Statement:

Kevin Jones was interviewed on December 15th and stated that Jones had last seen Nona at her apartment at approximately 00:3 0 on the 15th when he left her apartment and went to Jones’ parent’s home north of Dover to spend the night. He further stated that he called Nona at approximately 01:30 and talked for a few minutes before going to bed. He then stated he had received a text message from Nona at 09:07 on the 15 . He stated that he stayed at his house until 11:45 at which time he left for his parent’s gas station on Hwy 7 South of Dover. He stated he arrived at the station at noon and while there he talked with Blake Walters.

I took this to mean that K.Jo said he was at home from the time he got back from his late night visit with Nona until 11:45 the next day.

Thanks, Hawg. I worded my question poorly. I wondered if that was confirmed. In other words, was he home alone?

[hawgustusgloop]

Thanks, Hawg. I worded my question poorly. I wondered if that was confirmed. In other words, was he home alone?

I don't believe I have ever seen anything that either suggested anyone else was there with him or confirmed that he was alone. That is a very interesting thing to bring up, actually. This case could be much more complicated IMO if someone in K.Jo's household were to say he was there with them the whole time IF the evidence shows otherwise. I would guess his mom probably had to work that morning (wouldn't school have still been in session?). I wouldn't even be able to guess about his dad or anyone else who may have been living with them at the time.

[lorettalockhorn]

Anyone else sitting on pins and needles?

Yes, a little. But I was able to vent by yelling at a soap opera!!

OT: Has anyone seen/heard about this?

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/A/AR_FERGUSON_SLAYING_AROL-?SITE=ARMOU&SECTION=STATE&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2007-07-09-02-03-29

Also mentioned on Pat Lynch's blog: http://lynchlarge.blogspot.com/

"A man whose body was found late Saturday in the driveway of a home in a rural area north of Russellville was the victim of a homicide, Pope County Sheriff Jay Winters says. The manner of Chad Ray Ferguson’s death was not disclosed."

[christina]

Just heard they have seated 10 jurors and are working on the last 4 (2 alternates). Hopefully they will not start opening statements until tomorrow morning when I am there to hear!

[christina]

I believe that the ME set the time of death between 10:00 and 12:30. She had the phone call with the prof at 10:25.

Personally, I don't know if I would remember a walker, jogger or runner (for instance) on a particular day, unless I had to swerve to avoid him or something was notable about his appearance.

Which reminds me; has there been any statement about where KJ was that morning before he stated that he left for work at 11:45?

At the hearing, when the defense stated the time of death as between 11:30 and 12:30, Gibbons corrected them and said 11 to 12.

[lorettalockhorn]

At the hearing, when the defense stated the time of death as between 11:30 and 12:30, Gibbons corrected them and said 11 to 12.

hmmm Wonder if the ME has been able to narrow the time frame since he wrote the autopsy results? I think that his testimony will be interesting. No offense to Gibbons, but I want to hear from the expert.

[lorettalockhorn]

In my mind older folks will be helpful to prosecution. Less likely to follow all the techinical things, I think. Also, more likely to just "take" prosecutions side, so to speak.

Younger generation is going to be helpful to defense as I think they will follow the techinical things a little more and open to questioning things.

In general, I kinda think females would be better for prosecution and males better for defense. Anyone else have any thoughts?

All JMO, of course.


ITA about the technical matters. I'm not sure who I imagine would be sympathetic to the defense.

[lorettalockhorn]

Duplicate.

I did find a link to the Ozark Spectator, but it's a weekly paper, so we're not going to learn much there, I don't imagine.

[hawgustusgloop]

From today:

http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15308

It says that they dismissed the jurors that had already been seated, so the opening arguments won't start until tomorrow at 9 a.m.

[lorettalockhorn]

From today:

http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15308

It says that they dismissed the jurors that had already been seated, so the opening arguments won't start until tomorrow at 9 a.m.


Thanks Hawg and Susie.

"Most people don't even care." Hope that was taken out of context.

[FDInLaw]

From today:

http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15308

It says that they dismissed the jurors that had already been seated, so the opening arguments won't start until tomorrow at 9 a.m.
Yeah! :beer: I'm glad they were able to form the jury in one day.

Here's a brief quote from the article:

"By the lunch break, 10 jurors — seven women and three men — "

So far it looks like the jury is mostly women.

[christina]

ITA about the technical matters. I'm not sure who I imagine would be sympathetic to the defense.

I am going to ask around tomorrow and find out what jurors were struck(if any) by each side.

I would think older females would be beneficial to the defense, older males to the prosecution. One becomes more liberal minded as they age, the other more conservative. Young males good for defense, young females for the prosecution. Parents of children 17-25 would split down the middle. I can not imagine the prosecution wants anyone with a law enforcment background because they might hyper think the evidence problems.
Any college educated people would be wanted by the defense whereas blue collar workers would work better for the prosecution.
Ok, I am waaaay to in to this stuff now!

[christina]

Yeah! :beer: I'm glad they were able to form the jury in one day.

Here's a brief quote from the article:

"By the lunch break, 10 jurors — seven women and three men — "

So far it looks like the jury is mostly women.

Glad here also. Since I might only get two days off to attend this week, I wanted to hear opening statements and the first on scene witnesses.
I am thinking both sides will lay out their basic case in the opening statement. I will do my best to take good notes. I am concerned I will not be able to find internet anywhere judging from the mid day article on the Courier site. Its briefness makes me think it was phoned in!

If anyone wants me to note anything in particular- just ask.

[jonikay]

Do you think it will be difficult to get a seat tomorrow? Or any of the other days, for that matter?

[lorettalockhorn]

Surely so. I'm thinking maybe they meant since it wasn't from their area, and they don't really care about all the hoopla and where the trial will be held. Not the murder itself. Most people usually care more about hometown stuff. JMO

I think you're probably right and it just sounded unsympathetic.

[lorettalockhorn]

I am going to ask around tomorrow and find out what jurors were struck(if any) by each side.

I would think older females would be beneficial to the defense, older males to the prosecution. One becomes more liberal minded as they age, the other more conservative. Young males good for defense, young females for the prosecution. Parents of children 17-25 would split down the middle. I can not imagine the prosecution wants anyone with a law enforcment background because they might hyper think the evidence problems.
Any college educated people would be wanted by the defense whereas blue collar workers would work better for the prosecution.
Ok, I am waaaay to in to this stuff now!

I'd love to know if a jury consultant was used!

Here's an interesting article that addresses jury selection and stratification:

http://www.212.net/crime/jury.htm

[chambord]

Yeah! :beer: I'm glad they were able to form the jury in one day.

Here's a brief quote from the article:

"By the lunch break, 10 jurors — seven women and three men — "

So far it looks like the jury is mostly women.


Quickly scanning the posts...it looks like the jury was selected....good news!!!

Is it possible to start a thread for the court proceedings? I know I'm the new kid on the block, its just a suggustion. Just thinking that those who have to catch up later in the day maybe able to get a feel of the testimony, evidence, witness, etc.

[jonikay]

OH MY GOSH!!! According to channel 7 news, the pros has tape of KJ between interrogations, but when cameras were still running, talking to himself. The defense tried to stop it from being played during the trial, but to no avail. Is this news just new to me? Wow! This could be big!

[christina]

OH MY GOSH!!! According to channel 7 news, the pros has tape of KJ between interrogations, but when cameras were still running, talking to himself. The defense tried to stop it from being played during the trial, but to no avail. Is this news just new to me? Wow! This could be big!

Watched it but didn't hear that. They were having audio difficulties they said. Checked their website and its not stated there either.

[lorettalockhorn]

OH MY GOSH!!! According to channel 7 news, the pros has tape of KJ between interrogations, but when cameras were still running, talking to himself. The defense tried to stop it from being played during the trial, but to no avail. Is this news just new to me? Wow! This could be big!

Drat, we didn't watch channel 7. That does sound like it could be a big deal. Did they try to keep it out on general principle or because of what he was saying?

[FDInLaw]

OH MY GOSH!!! According to channel 7 news, the pros has tape of KJ between interrogations, but when cameras were still running, talking to himself. The defense tried to stop it from being played during the trial, but to no avail. Is this news just new to me? Wow! This could be big!
Yeah! New details are coming out already! :hat:

[FDInLaw]

Quickly scanning the posts...it looks like the jury was selected....good news!!!

Is it possible to start a thread for the court proceedings? I know I'm the new kid on the block, its just a suggustion. Just thinking that those who have to catch up later in the day maybe able to get a feel of the testimony, evidence, witness, etc.There is another thread already. . . The State Vs. Kevin Jones (or something like that). Guess the issue is whether or not folks want to move the discussion. Personally, I'll read where ever anything is posted.

[jonikay]

Watched it but didn't hear that. They were having audio difficulties they said. Checked their website and its not stated there either.
I watched it at 5 when they were having difficulties with the audio during the report. I watched it at 6 and that's when the reporter (the same one having audio difficulties) said that during KJ's interrogation, the RPD would go in and out of the room, taking breaks or whatever, but kept the cameras rolling and they "caught Kevin talking to himself." They enhanced the audio and there we have it. They want the jury to hear it, the defense of course says "NO," but the judge says "YES." Am I the only one, outside of my family and friends that called me, that heard this breaking news? It's gotta be worth something or they wouldn't have tried to use it. I have a DVR (tivo type thing) and even rewinded (rewound?) it because I thought I was dreaming . . . I wasn't.

[lorettalockhorn]

No, joni, I heard it on channel 7 AND 4, so you aren't dreaming. But that was all that was said, period. There was no allusion to what the tape said, or if he incriminated himself, or anything else. Personally, to borrow a pro prosecution term, I think it is all smoke and mirrors. He could've said absolutely ANYTHING. He could have been praying, or repeating statements LE made when trying to get him to confess, or just about anything. Considering LE was probably browbeating him to he#* and back, my bet is on KJ praying heavily at that moment. I think the prosecution is now trying to create their big drama and use the media to their advantage. I think it's all been blown out of proportion. ALL JMO.

Jury made up of 8 women and 4 men.


Surely to goodness, if there was any browbeating going on, the tape would prove that also?

[FDInLaw]

If the tape is "nothing" I wonder why the defense didn't want the jury to see it? :cool:

[Mishell1383]

If the tape is "nothing" I wonder why the defense didn't want the jury to see it? :cool:
BOO-YALL!!!!

[Mishell1383]

No, joni, I heard it on channel 7 AND 4, so you aren't dreaming. But that was all that was said, period. There was no allusion to what the tape said, or if he incriminated himself, or anything else. Personally, to borrow a pro prosecution term, I think it is all smoke and mirrors. He could've said absolutely ANYTHING. He could have been praying, or repeating statements LE made when trying to get him to confess, or just about anything. Considering LE was probably browbeating him to he#* and back, my bet is on KJ praying heavily at that moment. I think the prosecution is now trying to create their big drama and use the media to their advantage. I think it's all been blown out of proportion. ALL JMO.

Jury made up of 8 women and 4 men.
THE KIDS CRACKING UP.... IMO

[christina]

Motions are made all the time by one or the other team. That's what the past several hearings have been about.
I am wondering if this is something the prosecution just now came up with, the defense did not have a chance to go over and thus made a motion to exclude it.

Another reason I am wanting to attend as much of the trial in person- after the little I saw in person, I was not impressed with what and how it was reported.

[lorettalockhorn]

Channel 7 reported at 10:00, that two motions were heard today; the one about the tape and another. Does anyone have any idea what the other motion was about?

[christina]

Channel 7 reported at 10:00, that two motions were heard today; the one about the tape and another. Does anyone have any idea what the other motion was about?

You just made my point of why I want to be there myself- the other motion was not mentioned!

[christina]

BOO-YALL!!!!

I don't understand what this means?

[lorettalockhorn]

Do you really think the police went in there and treated KJ all nice? All good cop and no bad cop? You don't think they were tough on him and tried to force a confession out of him?

haha That's the funniest thing I heard all day..........

Don't know about that, but it wouldn't be too smart to show the jury a tape that proves that LE was mistreating a suspect. Oh well, you never know when someone might be willing to fall on his sword.

[lorettalockhorn]

You just made my point of why I want to be there myself- the other motion was not mentioned!

Two motions were mentioned on Channel 7 at 10:00. Channels four and eleven didn't mention the tape nor either motion at all.

[hawgustusgloop]

Motions are made all the time by one or the other team. That's what the past several hearings have been about.
I am wondering if this is something the prosecution just now came up with, the defense did not have a chance to go over and thus made a motion to exclude it.

Another reason I am wanting to attend as much of the trial in person- after the little I saw in person, I was not impressed with what and how it was reported.

IMO the defense didn't move to exclude it until now because if a potentially incriminating tape of K.Jo exists, they wouldn't want it in the news until a jury was seated.

[christina]

IMO the defense didn't move to exclude it until now because if a potentially incriminating tape of K.Jo exists, they wouldn't want it in the news until a jury was seated.

Interesting thought. Someone in the courtroom could have ascertained why from comments made by the two sides. This is what frustrates me about having to rely on a reporter that can only fill 1 1/2 minutes of air time. Maybe the papers will have more detail.
I did see that the step father was in court today. He was not there for either hearing I attended.

[lorettalockhorn]

By brow beating, I don't mean in a physical way. I mean by pure, hard core, pshychiatric means. I feel they were probably pretty rough with intense pressure on KJ to try and obtain a confession. I don't think it would have been a nice scene at all, I doubt by far physical abuse, but I believe what made it onto tape was suitable for a jury audience. What went on off tape? :shrug: Well, who knows. There could have been some physical stuff. It wouldn't be unheard of. However, mind games can be pretty dang intense, brutal and hard core, maybe even enough to make one wish for a physical beating instead. JMO

Yes, I'm aware that browbeating doesn't refer to physical intimidation. I guess when the jury sees the tape, they will have to determine for themselves if LE denied KJ of his rights through bully tactics.

[lorettalockhorn]

IMO the defense didn't move to exclude it until now because if a potentially incriminating tape of K.Jo exists, they wouldn't want it in the news until a jury was seated.


Good point. Or the prosecution for that matter.

Kinda OT: From what I can tell reading and watching the news the past few days, there just isn't a lot of awareness of the case around Ozark.

[christina]

christina, did you make it to Monday's hearing afterall? I thought you weren't going to make it for the seating of the jury?:confused:

No, saw the parents at the courthouse on the news. I thought it odd at both hearings that all of the Jones' were there(including the grandmother) but Nona's mother was alone. So I intentionally looked for Mr. Dipert on tonights video and saw him with Nona's mother.

My car is gased, I have drinks cooling in the fridge, laptop in its case and ready to go for the morning!

[jonikay]

Tell me what you think about room in the court room. Do you think that there will be plenty of seating tomorrow? I think it is supposed to rain. The courier, IIRC, once stated that there was plenty of seating in the room. I guess this will be the same room and the same judge used for the infamous Ronald Gene Simmons trial?

[christina]

Ohhh.....

I see. I didn't see that footage, I guess.

Good luck with getting a seat...... And, try Rivertown BBQ! It's fantastic!!! Tell them they are highly reccomended.

I might try make it myself, at least for the morning, so we might pass by each other without even knowing it! :D

It is weird being anonymous, we could and never know it! I will try to get lunch there but they made it sound in the paper like it would be tough at noon during the week!

[christina]

Tell me what you think about room in the court room. Do you think that there will be plenty of seating tomorrow? I think it is supposed to rain. The courier, IIRC, once stated that there was plenty of seating in the room. I guess this will be the same room and the same judge used for the infamous Ronald Gene Simmons trial?

I thought Simmons was tried in Pope County. That was so long ago though.

[jonikay]

Nope, it was in Franklin County. Spooky, huh? I think so. Not that I am comparing Simmons and KJ AT ALL, but it is weird, they lived very close to one another at some point, both from Dover. If KJ lived toward Booger Hollow at the time, then they were probably thisclose.

[christina]

Nope, it was in Franklin County. Spooky, huh? I think so. Not that I am comparing Simmons and KJ AT ALL, but it is weird, they lived very close to one another at some point, both from Dover. If KJ lived toward Booger Hollow at the time, then they were probably thisclose.

"ope. Same courtroom. Same judge.
I knew there was a change of venue for him, but I originally thought if was to Clarksville (Johnson County).
After reading that it was the same courtroom in the Courier article, I researched and found that it indeed was the same court room."

You guys are paying better attention to those details than I am. That was one weird/sad case from what I remember- killed his whole family, extended and all. Waited at the home north of Dover until they all arrived over Christmas.

[christina]

It is usually pretty busy, even without the trial.....

Shouldn't you be getting some sleep now so you don't fall asleep on the drive?;)

Good point- will write more tomorrow...

[FDInLaw]

Because the prosecution is trying to make it into something it is not, IMO. :cool:
We'll see. ;) :biggrin:

[Mishell1383]

I don't understand what this means?
don't read to much into it.

[Mishell1383]

Seriously? Cracking up? Surely you all don't think that between interrogations, while alone he like incriminated himself or anything?
This was in the beginning, mind you, and he hasn't "cracked up" all along, so.... He didn't crack up and admit to the police upon discovery, he didn't crack up and confess during interrogations (hard interrogations I assume). He hasn't cracked up and confessed all along because, IMO, there is nothing for him to confess to. He is just the convenient one left holding the bag, IMO.
I meant goin crazy.

[FDInLaw]

Seriously? Cracking up? Surely you all don't think that between interrogations, while alone he like incriminated himself or anything?
This was in the beginning, mind you, and he hasn't "cracked up" all along, so.... He didn't crack up and admit to the police upon discovery, he didn't crack up and confess during interrogations (hard interrogations I assume). He hasn't cracked up and confessed all along because, IMO, there is nothing for him to confess to. He is just the convenient one left holding the bag, IMO.
Are you at all open to the possibility that Kevin may have committed this crime? I'm glad you will be in the courtroom. I wonder who you will be sitting next to. You seem to have your mind made up and that level of commitment often comes with a personal connection.

[mandysunshine]

"Defense asks judge to bar press from courtroom"
excerpt "In a sidebar conference at Special Judge John Patterson's bench, attorneys for Kevin Jones asked the press be barred from the proceedings, citing "sensitive" issues the attorneys did not want to be made public, Patterson later confirmed to a reporter."

"The exchange was conducted out of the audience's earshot, although Patterson's response could be heard.
"I think I'm legally bound to keep [the proceedings] open," he said."

[hawgustusgloop]

"Defense asks judge to bar press from courtroom"
excerpt "In a sidebar conference at Special Judge John Patterson's bench, attorneys for Kevin Jones asked the press be barred from the proceedings, citing "sensitive" issues the attorneys did not want to be made public, Patterson later confirmed to a reporter."

"The exchange was conducted out of the audience's earshot, although Patterson's response could be heard.
"I think I'm legally bound to keep [the proceedings] open," he said."

Are you kidding me? Bar the press from the courtroom? Is this for real? Who do they think they are? :cuss:

Last time I checked this is the good ol' USA.:patriot:
This ain't some kind of military tribunal.

[chambord]

Are you kidding me? Bar the press from the courtroom? Is this for real? Who do they think they are? :cuss:

Last time I checked this is the good ol' USA.:patriot:
This ain't some kind of military tribunal.

What are they afraid of? What *sensitive* issues? Towards the defendent or the victim?

[FDInLaw]

"Defense asks judge to bar press from courtroom"
excerpt "In a sidebar conference at Special Judge John Patterson's bench, attorneys for Kevin Jones asked the press be barred from the proceedings, citing "sensitive" issues the attorneys did not want to be made public, Patterson later confirmed to a reporter."

"The exchange was conducted out of the audience's earshot, although Patterson's response could be heard.
"I think I'm legally bound to keep [the proceedings] open," he said."Great catch! Thanks for posting it!

Welcome to the board, Mandy! :seeya:

This is all too funny IMO. The defense loves to throw out names and make implication without sighting facts, but doesn't want the press in the court room. How ironic is that? Friends, I believe we see before us a sinking ship. GO GIBBONS GO! :biggrin:

[chambord]

IMO, in order to bar the press from the courtroom, they would also need to bar the public. Why? Because a ordinary person attending the trial, would be able to leak the information to the press. I have never heard of a *private* trial..

[hawgustusgloop]

Link to an article about the questions that the attorneys asked the potential jurors:

http://www.nwanews.com/adg/News/195291/

Very interesting!

[lorettalockhorn]

Continuing from Mandy's post; from The Courier:

"The conference ocurred late Monday afternoon, ater the impaneled jurors were released for the day. The exchange was conducted out of the audience's earshot, although Patterson's response could be heard.
"I think I'm legally bound to keep [the proceedings] open," he said.
In a 1980 U.S. Supreme Court decision, the Court ruled that "[a]bsent an overriding interest articulated in findings, the trial of acriminal case must be open to the public."

Jones' attorneys also filed a motion at 8:46a.m. Monday to prohibit the prosecutio from entering a videotaped interview police conducted with Jones.
"While the Defendant acknowledges that these interviews may be used by the State to impeach Mr. Jones' testimony, on their own, the statements are purely extrajudicial in nature and should not be allowed into evidence," according to the motion.
Defense attorney Bill Bristow of Jonesboro told Patterson the interview was a "seven-hour statement" taken by police. He said there were periods where detectives left Jones alone but let the recording equipment on, and that Jones "cried and mumbled" during these periods.
Bristow objected to the prosecution's plan to enter an audio enhancement of one of Jones' mumbled statements made while alone into evidence.
Gibbons showed Patterson a five-line transcript of what the prosecution contends Jones said when he was alone. The prosecution contended the statement "goes against [Jones'] interest."
"This doesn't seem rational," Patterson said after reading the transcript.
"It's rational in context," Gibbons said.

Later in the article:

Gibbons told Patterson he wasn't aware of the motion prior to Monday morning, but had been in contact with defense attorneys over their concerns about Jones; statement to police about drugs.
"We said we'd take that out [of the video shown to jurors]," Gibbons said, "The smoking weed and the Adderall and all that stuff."
Adderall is an amphetamine commonly prescribed to treat attention deficit/hyperactivity disorder, according to the product Web site, but nujmerous news reports indicate abuse of the drug is on the rise at college campuses.
Defense attorneys argued Jones did not make a confession during the interview and was therefore not relevant.

Later in the article:

Patterson said he'd allow the taped statement without the drug refences[sic] into evidence based on the information given by the prosecution. He did not address the mumbled statement directly.
The judge also heard arguments regarding a motion filed by the prosecution last week asksing the defense be barred from "incriminating third parties unless the evidence points directly to the guilt of the third party," according to the motion.
Gibbons said Monday afternoon he was seeking to bar the defense from making "bold statements" that three or four people other than Jones "were having a controversy with or even making threats" against Dirksmeyer before her death with "no evidence tying the people to the crime."
"The defense has a constitutional right to have great latitude that would point to other perpetrators of the crime," Bristow said. "If you want us to have evidence tying someone else to the crime, you ought to have some evidence tying our client to the crime, and I don't think you do."
Patterson said he would "play it by ear" at the trail and expected the prosecution to make an objection if they saw a issue.
"I'll make a ruling then." he said.

[hawgustusgloop]

Thank you so much for taking the time to do this! I am very curious to know what K.Jo said on that tape, and I'm really interested in finding out what the defense doesn't want the public to know.

[christina]

The prosecution finished at 10:15. Defense started at10:40 and is still talking at 11:15

[christina]

The defense just said Nona's neighbor will testify there was a man living with Nona that the neighbor thought was her boyfriend. When the RPD interviewed the neighbor that is what she said. The defense said she will testify is was not Jones though.

[hawgustusgloop]

The defense just said Nona's neighbor will testify there was a man living with Nona that the neighbor thought was her boyfriend. When the RPD interviewed the neighbor that is what she said. The defense said she will testify is was not Jones though.

Wow! That would certainly be major motive for K.Jo IMO.

[lorettalockhorn]

The defense just said Nona's neighbor will testify there was a man living with Nona that the neighbor thought was her boyfriend. When the RPD interviewed the neighbor that is what she said. The defense said she will testify is was not Jones though.

I never knew that she had a roommate. If they were platonic, I'll assume that Nona would feel comfortable with KJ visiting her home. If their relationship was anything more, I'll assume that it would go to motive.

[hawgustusgloop]

I never knew that she had a roommate. If they were platonic, I'll assume that Nona would feel comfortable with KJ visiting her home. If their relationship was anything more, I'll assume that it would go to motive.

Also, we don't know the timeline that this person was allegedly staying there. It could have been months before her murder. It could have been a scenario where a guy "stayed over" a lot of the time but didn't actually "live" there. Maybe she had a friend who got in an argument with his roommates and stayed with her for a few weeks until he could find an apartment. If Nona had someone actually living with her and keeping all his things in her apartment at the time of her murder, surely we would have seen quotes or something from someone referred to as her "roommate." If it was a love interest of Nona's that was living there with her, they would probably call that guy her boyfriend instead of K.Jo. All my opinion only.

[lorettalockhorn]

Also, we don't know the timeline that this person was allegedly staying there. It could have been months before her murder. It could have been a scenario where a guy "stayed over" a lot of the time but didn't actually "live" there. Maybe she had a friend who got in an argument with his roommates and stayed with her for a few weeks until he could find an apartment. If Nona had someone actually living with her and keeping all his things in her apartment at the time of her murder, surely we would have seen quotes or something from someone referred to as her "roommate." If it was a love interest of Nona's that was living there with her, they would probably call that guy her boyfriend instead of K.Jo. All my opinion only.

He could also have been there to make her feel more secure. Maybe she simply wasn't ready to live alone.

[lorettalockhorn]

Today's Courier:

http://couriernews.com/

Two articles and the witness list.

[FDInLaw]

http://couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15319

[FDInLaw]

From the article above. . .

"The defense also presented an alternate timeline that they claim gives Jones an alibi for the time they claim the murder occurred. "

Does this mean the defense is going to try to move the time of death?

[lorettalockhorn]

From the article above. . .

"The defense also presented an alternate timeline that they claim gives Jones an alibi for the time they claim the murder occurred. "

Does this mean the defense is going to try to move the time of death?

Could be. That's why I'm waiting to hear from the ME. The PCS says that he set time of death between 10am and 12:30. If the phone call is validated, it would have been after 10:25. The defense tried to pin down the time of death by questioning Gibbons during one of the hearings, I think they mentioned between 11:30 and 12:30 and Gibbons moved it back to at least 11:00-12:30. (If memory serves.)

[christina]

In opening the defense said the neighbor will testify she witnessed an arguement between the two with him banging on the apartment door yelling for her to give them to him. The door opened. Nona threw the keys out and he drove off in a silver mustang

[lorettalockhorn]

In opening the defense said the neighbor will testify she witnessed an arguement between the two with him banging on the apartment door yelling for her to give them to him. The door opened. Nona threw the keys out and he drove off in a silver mustang

Wow, when did this happen? Did he come back and get his stuff or keep living there?

[christina]

From the article above. . .

"The defense also presented an alternate timeline that they claim gives Jones an alibi for the time they claim the murder occurred. "

Does this mean the defense is going to try to move the time of death?

Both sides appear to be trying to nail down timelines for things and people.

[hawgustusgloop]

The Courier's thorough coverage of the trial:

http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15315
http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15314
http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15313
http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15319

All in one place!

[hawgustusgloop]

(from May 31, 2007)
>major snip<

IMO the defense should ESPECIALLY focus on the fact that they believe that the police developed "K.Jo Tunnel Vision" very early on in the investigation, suggesting that they focused primarily on K.Jo instead of fully exploring other possible suspects at such a crucial time in the investigation.



From today's midday Courier article about the opening arguments:

"The defense attacked the police investigation in their opening argument. They claimed the authorities’ focus on Kevin Jones as a suspect as “tunnel vision.”

:lol:

[lorettalockhorn]

From today's midday Courier article about the opening arguments:

"The defense attacked the police investigation in their opening argument. They claimed the authorities’ focus on Kevin Jones as a suspect as “tunnel vision.”

:lol:

Like we couldn't see that one coming!

[lorettalockhorn]

43 currently active users.

[hawgustusgloop]

Like we couldn't see that one coming!

I have a feeling we're going to be bringing up a lot of old predictions over the next couple of weeks.

[chambord]

The Courier's thorough coverage of the trial:

http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15315
http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15314
http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15313
http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15319

All in one place!

Great links....thank you... I'm in the process of trying to get up to speed with this case.

Wow! The witness list is huge on both sides..Is there any prediction how long this trial will go on?

[hawgustusgloop]

Great links....thank you... I'm in the process of trying to get up to speed with this case.

Wow! The witness list is huge on both sides..Is there any prediction how long this trial will go on?

I believe it is supposed to last about 2 weeks.

[lorettalockhorn]

This is a little OT: But despite the defense's motion to bar the press from the courtroom and the reaction that most people probably had; is there not some way that Gibbons can protect the identity of Nona's Little? By taking the oath and stating her name, isn't it possible that she will be outing herself as a victim of abuse? What about the State's mandate and responsibility to keep her identity from the public in that instance?

[hawgustusgloop]

This is a little OT: But despite the defense's motion to bar the press from the courtroom and the reaction that most people probably had; is there not some way that Gibbons can protect the identity of Nona's Little? By taking the oath and stating her name, isn't it possible that she will be outing herself as a victim of abuse? What about the State's mandate and responsibility to keep her identity from the public in that instance?

Good question. I wonder if the judge can order that she only be referred to by her initials in the press to protect her identity? Or maybe just alluded to the way she was in that witness list from the Courier article?

[hawgustusgloop]

Ahh.... I see. I think anyone who had just found their murdered girlfriend might have that potential. I just don't agree that it was in the same context you are thinking. I mean, woah, 6 hours of interrogation? Without an attorney? What was that term I used again, browbeating?

I don't think there is anything wrong with "browbeating" murder suspects in order to obtain information, as long as it isn't taken too far. Interrogation techniques are used everywhere to obtain information and confessions. Lots of murderers are behind bars because of them. K.Jo's attorneys acknowledged that he was read his Miranda warnings. He was well aware that he could ask for an attorney at any time. Apparently he chose not to.

[lorettalockhorn]

I didn't know a little sister is a victim of abuse. I thought it was just an underprivileged child.

I don't know either, that's why I said possibly. Her identity should be protected for that as well in order to keep people from surmising just exactly what her situation is. In my opinion.

[FDInLaw]

After hearing only a couple hours of testimony, my mind is completely closed to the idea that he did do it.

>SNIP< Okay. Well, that says it all! :biggrin:

[lorettalockhorn]

Channel 5 reported that Kevin's taped statement was something along the lines of "keep her with the angels" and "I'm so sorry."

They also reported that in addition to Nona's argument with the unknown man, there was testimony that Nona's relationship with Kevin was unhealthy and that she and KJ had verbal disagreements.

The defense contends (in the opening statement, I presume) that objects were moved during the photographing procedure of the crime scene.

Also that Kevin resumed his relationship with another woman in August of 2005.

[lorettalockhorn]

I would think being a juvenile, her name would HAVE to be surpressed. JMO

Agree. That was the point of my original post; if she is a victim of abuse, she has a right to privacy.

[hawgustusgloop]

>snip<
After hearing only a couple hours of testimony, my mind is completely closed to the idea that he did do it.



Wow. So, after just a couple of witnesses who are only marginally involved in this saga, you have decided that it is impossible for you to believe that K.Jo murdered Nona? Without seeing all or even most of the evidence? Without the contents of the cell phone records? Without the expert testimony on the blood evidence? Maybe K.Jo is just super lucky and all the jurors have already made up their minds for acquittal already, just like you have. :rolleyes:

[lorettalockhorn]

Channel 7 reported that the defense will challenge the timeline by saying that KJ couldn't have driven to R'ville and back in time to have lunch at noon with a friend.

I'll need help here, I thought that he left home at 11:45 and arrived at work fifteen minutes later for work at noon?

Also, Trey York (Jim York III?) and Jordan Harris testified that they were dating Nona. Also, both the prosecution and the defense acknowledge that Kevin and Nona didn't use condoms.

[FDInLaw]

I said mine. Not yours or anybody elses. Unlike you, I have waited all this long to completely make up my mind.But, but you just said that your mind is "completely closed." He, he, he. . . you're so much fun. Now you're not going to be able to back out of that one! :D

Seriously, it's a good thing that neither of us is on the jury. Shall we leave it at that?
:patriot:

I am sincerely thrilled that the trial is finally here, there are so many unanswered questions and I can't wait to hear more. I want to know what happened and whom is responsible and I reserve the right to be wrong. IMO it's foolish to wrap up your ego in a particular verdict. If the defense has a good case for Kevin's innocents and it can be substantiated with facts, I want to hear it. My prayer is for justice to be served PERIOD, if this means I have been wrong, so be it.
:seeya:

[chambord]

Are you at all open to the possibility he didn't? After hearing only a couple hours of testimony, my mind is completely closed to the idea that he did do it.




*THUD*

Thank goodness our jury system is set up that the jury gets to hear all sides, review the evidence, before deciding in a *few hours*, guilt or innocence.

moo

[lorettalockhorn]

Is that what it's called nowadays?

Huh? You lost me there!

[FDInLaw]

*THUD*

Thank goodness our jury system is set up that the jury gets to hear all sides, review the evidence, before deciding in a *few hours*, guilt or innocence.

moo
" *THUD* "

:lol:

I love it when you do that! :biggrin:

[jonikay]

I'm here, in waiting. I just got home and sat in the courtroom during the whole process today. If you have any questions, ask. It is nice to have two sides. By the way, I didn't just take notes. I feverishly wrote the whole time, recording basically everything that was said from both sides. I didn't leave anything out . . .

[lorettalockhorn]

According to Channel 7; KJ's statement: Keep her with the angels. She was a good soul, Lord. She didn't mean any harm... Please Lord I'm so sorry.

[lorettalockhorn]

I'm here, in waiting. I just got home and sat in the courtroom during the whole process today. If you have any questions, ask. It is nice to have two sides. By the way, I didn't just take notes. I feverishly wrote the whole time, recording basically everything that was said from both sides. I didn't leave anything out . . .


Well basically, just spill.

Oh, do we know what the time period was when Nona's neighbor thought that the guy with the wide wristband was living with her? Did he move out after the fight? Or will we have to wait to hear about that when the defense puts on its case?

[FDInLaw]

I'm here, in waiting. I just got home and sat in the courtroom during the whole process today. If you have any questions, ask. It is nice to have two sides. By the way, I didn't just take notes. I feverishly wrote the whole time, recording basically everything that was said from both sides. I didn't leave anything out . . .
Well, for starters, what stuck out to you? What is your general impression of how things went for both sides?

[FDInLaw]

According to Channel 7; KJ's statement: Keep her with the angels. She was a good soul, Lord. She didn't mean any harm... Please Lord I'm so sorry.

Sounds like a confession. No wonder the defense wanted it suppressed. My heart aches when reading that. :(

[jonikay]

Well, really it is so early in the case. Trey's preparedness for the questioning stuck out. The defense really tried to nail him, as would I. Trey said he texted Nona at 11:04 to give her a cake pan and again at 12:58 to tell her nevermind bc he was on his way home to Ashdown. The defense went over billing statements and asked him why there were Texarkana numbers on his phone if he was in Ashdown, T said bc most numbers in Ashdown have Tex area codes. The defense kept asking him where he was at 10:04 and he said that he was sitting in the hall at Dean (ATU) studying for his 10:30 final. SO, the defense brings out the billing document, apparently different from a billing statement, and says that it shows that he texted Nona at 1004 and not at 1104, he said that couldn't be, bc he was where he said he was. The defense had no further questions. Short prosecutor (name escapes me, no offense, though) asks Trey if he is familiar with a billing document, if he'd ever seen one before. He said no. The pros asked him if he was aware that the billing docs are sent through California and reflect Eastern Standard Time and Trey said no. Short pros cleared up that the billing doc is EST. Also, the defense showed him a pic of Nona's car, silver mustang, and asked him what he drove, also a silver mustang. Defense said, "so you can easily get the two mixed up. It would be hard to tell a diff bw the two cars, Trey said no. Older body style mustangs look COMPLETELY different from newer models and Trey explained the diffs thoroughly. I was impressed with the way he handled the badgering.

[whiterivergal]

I'm here, in waiting. I just got home and sat in the courtroom during the whole process today. If you have any questions, ask. It is nice to have two sides. By the way, I didn't just take notes. I feverishly wrote the whole time, recording basically everything that was said from both sides. I didn't leave anything out . . .

You are wonderful!! I just joined recently but have been lurking awhile. This case is really interesting. I just wish I could attend trial. Do you feel (as Susuie-Q does) that there is no way kj is guilty? Thanks for letting me participate...

[FDInLaw]

You are wonderful!! I just joined recently but have been lurking awhile. This case is really interesting. I just wish I could attend trial. Do you feel (as Susuie-Q does) that there is no way kj is guilty? Thanks for letting me participate... Welcome to the board! :seeya:

[hawgustusgloop]

Well, really it is so early in the case. Trey's preparedness for the questioning stuck out. The defense really tried to nail him, as would I. Trey said he texted Nona at 11:04 to give her a cake pan and again at 12:58 to tell her nevermind bc he was on his way home to Ashdown. The defense went over billing statements and asked him why there were Texarkana numbers on his phone if he was in Ashdown, T said bc most numbers in Ashdown have Tex area codes. The defense kept asking him where he was at 10:04 and he said that he was sitting in the hall at Dean (ATU) studying for his 10:30 final. SO, the defense brings out the billing document, apparently different from a billing statement, and says that it shows that he texted Nona at 1004 and not at 1104, he said that couldn't be, bc he was where he said he was. The defense had no further questions. Short prosecutor (name escapes me, no offense, though) asks Trey if he is familiar with a billing document, if he'd ever seen one before. He said no. The pros asked him if he was aware that the billing docs are sent through California and reflect Eastern Standard Time and Trey said no. Short pros cleared up that the billing doc is EST. Also, the defense showed him a pic of Nona's car, silver mustang, and asked him what he drove, also a silver mustang. Defense said, "so you can easily get the two mixed up. It would be hard to tell a diff bw the two cars, Trey said no. Older body style mustangs look COMPLETELY different from newer models and Trey explained the diffs thoroughly. I was impressed with the way he handled the badgering.

So, does this mean that the 11:04 text message that I thought all along (as implied in the PCS) was what may have set K.Jo off, was supposed to be about GIVING HER A CAKE PAN????????

[chambord]

Well, really it is so early in the case. Trey's preparedness for the questioning stuck out. The defense really tried to nail him, as would I. Trey said he texted Nona at 11:04 to give her a cake pan and again at 12:58 to tell her nevermind bc he was on his way home to Ashdown. The defense went over billing statements and asked him why there were Texarkana numbers on his phone if he was in Ashdown, T said bc most numbers in Ashdown have Tex area codes. The defense kept asking him where he was at 10:04 and he said that he was sitting in the hall at Dean (ATU) studying for his 10:30 final. SO, the defense brings out the billing document, apparently different from a billing statement, and says that it shows that he texted Nona at 1004 and not at 1104, he said that couldn't be, bc he was where he said he was. The defense had no further questions. Short prosecutor (name escapes me, no offense, though) asks Trey if he is familiar with a billing document, if he'd ever seen one before. He said no. The pros asked him if he was aware that the billing docs are sent through California and reflect Eastern Standard Time and Trey said no. Short pros cleared up that the billing doc is EST. Also, the defense showed him a pic of Nona's car, silver mustang, and asked him what he drove, also a silver mustang. Defense said, "so you can easily get the two mixed up. It would be hard to tell a diff bw the two cars, Trey said no. Older body style mustangs look COMPLETELY different from newer models and Trey explained the diffs thoroughly. I was impressed with the way he handled the badgering.

Thanks, thouroughly enjoyed your observations. Trying to remain impartial till I hear all the evidence, it does sound to me that Trey did well.

[jonikay]

I've always had my opinions, of course, as everyone does. I went today to try to place myself in the jury's position. Because it is so early, it would be hard to say now, because they haven't questioned many witnesses. I believe that the prosecution better be able to establish a solid alibi, because the defense is giving a different (although less detailed) alibi. I also think, JMO, that it is a long shot for the jury to believe that Nona and the lamp and the knife was moved by the RPD. They just didn't give any evidence or reasoning behind that theory . . . YET.

[chambord]

" *THUD* "

:lol:

I love it when you do that! :biggrin:


Whadda you mean?? It hurts to fall off my chair...:D

[Mishell1383]

He could also have been there to make her feel more secure. Maybe she simply wasn't ready to live alone.
Maybe the neighbor was mistaken? How old is she? Is she senile age? :confused:
Thats definitly New news!

[hawgustusgloop]

Well, really it is so early in the case. Trey's preparedness for the questioning stuck out. The defense really tried to nail him, as would I. Trey said he texted Nona at 11:04 to give her a cake pan and again at 12:58 to tell her nevermind bc he was on his way home to Ashdown. The defense went over billing statements and asked him why there were Texarkana numbers on his phone if he was in Ashdown, T said bc most numbers in Ashdown have Tex area codes. The defense kept asking him where he was at 10:04 and he said that he was sitting in the hall at Dean (ATU) studying for his 10:30 final. SO, the defense brings out the billing document, apparently different from a billing statement, and says that it shows that he texted Nona at 1004 and not at 1104, he said that couldn't be, bc he was where he said he was. The defense had no further questions. Short prosecutor (name escapes me, no offense, though) asks Trey if he is familiar with a billing document, if he'd ever seen one before. He said no. The pros asked him if he was aware that the billing docs are sent through California and reflect Eastern Standard Time and Trey said no. Short pros cleared up that the billing doc is EST. Also, the defense showed him a pic of Nona's car, silver mustang, and asked him what he drove, also a silver mustang. Defense said, "so you can easily get the two mixed up. It would be hard to tell a diff bw the two cars, Trey said no. Older body style mustangs look COMPLETELY different from newer models and Trey explained the diffs thoroughly. I was impressed with the way he handled the badgering.

Ooooohhhhh, silver mustang, ayyy? I saw that guy out in the corridors of the courtroom....... I thought he was about to die of nervousness.... His testimony was so full of loopholes and contradictions and different stories... tsk tsk tsk

So, are these two accounts describing the same testimony of the same witness?

[Mishell1383]

Ahh.... I see. I think anyone who had just found their murdered girlfriend might have that potential. I just don't agree that it was in the same context you are thinking. I mean, woah, 6 hours of interrogation? Without an attorney? What was that term I used again, browbeating?
People go crazy allll the time! I didn't know you could read minds ! SWEEEET! lol :patriot:

[jonikay]

So, are these two accounts describing the same testimony of the same witness?
I suppose so.

[FDInLaw]

So, are these two accounts describing the same testimony of the same witness?
It's really great that we have several first hand accounts. Personal bias is something we all struggle with.

[Mishell1383]

It's really great that we have several first hand accounts. Personal bias is something we all struggle with.
I think its great too! I feel almost like I got to be there!! Thanks for sharing, I really appreciate it!!! First hand too!! YAY!

[jonikay]

I think its great too! I feel almost like I got to be there!! Thanks for sharing, I really appreciate it!!! First hand too!! YAY!
Also, and both sides agreed to this, that KJ and Nona had sex with several different people. We heard from one guy about his relationship with Nona today and will hear from Kevin's side soon. Amy Pitts will testify that she and KJ were "together" a week before the murder. It was weird, because although I suspected that they were on the outs, I wasn't under the impression that their relationship really wasn't one at all, under normal standards. The prosecution plans to use this to their advantage by stating that KJ said he and Nona were "very, very exclusive" and he was planning on proposing to her the next week. Thus, a lie also citing possible motive for KJ's rage during the murder. The defense plans to use this to their advantage by theorizing that one of these guys could have killed Nona. The defense said at the end of their opening statements: He had sex, she had sex, they both had a lot of sex. That doesn't make him a murderer. Excuse the graphic s*x talk, but that was said.

[FDInLaw]

Good grief! Were you two at the same trial? :confused:

Now, I'm getting irritated. . . sure wish I could be there myself! :mad:

[chambord]

Good point there. But like I said, I at least have waited this long.... Most everyone on here has had KJ convicted a LONG time ago. So the justice system is nice, you know IUPG and all. At least the jury seems pretty well balanced. KJ may as well not had a trial in Pope and just went directly to jail. So, I appreciate you pointing that out for everyone to take notice....


No problem..I'm glad you understood what I was trying to say in my lame way.

[jonikay]

Well, I thought he didn't do so well. I thought he was extremely ill at ease. When I saw him in the hall, he was SEVERELY ill at ease.

Don't forget to mention he basically has NO alibi for the time of the murder, except for spilling a coke in the front and back of his car which he had to clean out, which sounds as if he told the police he spilled a drink twice, but denied saying that today. My oh my,,, I wonder what would require so much cleaning in your car after all that? Hmmm.. Then there was all the packing in his room, alone. Then there was getting gas... which he told police was at one EXXON station and then today said another. Oh, there's turning a video in at Hasting's I wonder if he dropped that at the drop off station or the counter? How about not being able to verbalize how he found out about Nona's death, first it was 10pm from some guy whose last name he didn't know that called him, the guy left a message and Trey returned his call. Ooops, no, no calls on his records to verify that.... So defense had him pick it out on cell records, which Trey testified that (?Zack?) used his (?Zack?) cell phone to call Trey on his(TRey's) cell phone. After Trey was asked to find it on his cell record he decided it must have been 7pm. But no in coming call and when asked to identify outgoing call, it was to his home number, not someone else's cell. Then asked if he was able to explain why no calls on record, he could not. Oh, then it was the next day Dec. 16 he learned she was dead, which still had no records of that call. But he still went ahead and text Nona asking her to please call him because he heard something happened to her, and he was worried about her. Supposedly after he had learned she was dead. Hmmm... Nope none of that is peculiar at all....
I don't recall anything about Trey stating to the RPD that he was at one exxon station and said another different one today. The defense never said that either. He said he went to Hastings and got gas. The defense asked, "got gas at Hastings?" He said no. They asked him today several times where he got gas and he told them everytime, the exxon by the interstate. I haven't read any police filings referring to Trey or any statements that he has made, therefore I cannot say what he told police. Some of the things they asked him about several times, but didn't state that he told the RPD anything different, such as the exxon station, where he was at 1004 (bc apparently the def thought the billing document was our time, not eastern time. Either that or they were trying to railroad him). How long it took him for this or that. They asked him the same questions over and over today and he didn't change his mind on anything throughout the questioning today. I could tell that Trey was nervous, but so was Jordan Harris when he had to talk about he and Nona's relationship. I think all the witnesses were nervous. And, let's not forget about the possibility of land lines being used to make or get phone calls. Also, in a college world, it is very normal for people to have classes together for a whole semester, but never even know one another's name, let alone their last name. So, do you think Trey murdered Nona?

[Mishell1383]

No, sweets, i just perceived your tone. You know I love ya, though, right?
LOLOL no sweets!! thats great! of course! right back atcha "blondie!" ;)


So how was Nonas mom? That poor woman, well for that matter I feel bad for KJ's fam too. Its all so sad for them :(

[jonikay]

I didn't hear opening statements, but they want to say his sleeping with another woman a week before the murder was the reason for his rage and murdering Nona? That doesn't make sense.
I'm not saying that at all. The only reason I said this was to put it in the context of their relationship, not the trial in any way. I don't think it is really relevant, being that they were both involved in the same sort of on and off relationships with other people. It is a way that the prosecution will try to show that KJ wasn't being truthful in his explanation of their relationship. With possible motive including Nona's trysts.

[Mishell1383]

I didn't hear opening statements, but they want to say his sleeping with another woman a week before the murder was the reason for his rage and murdering Nona? That doesn't make sense.
I agree too, that isn't plausible or possible. imo

[Mishell1383]

I'm not saying that at all. The only reason I said this was to put it in the context of their relationship, not the trial in any way. I don't think it is really relevant, being that they were both involved in the same sort of on and off relationships with other people. It is a way that the prosecution will try to show that KJ wasn't being truthful in his explanation of their relationship.
o, i'm lost! Don't mind me, I'm blonde.

[jonikay]

o, i'm lost! Don't mind me, I'm blonde.
This in response to susieq's comment about how KJ's sleeping with another woman a week b4 the murder is his motive. Maybe I was writing too fast, but I didn't mean that at all.

BTW, I have to say that Carol Dipert (Nona's mom) is one classy lady. She looked and acted beautifully. She seems in good spirits, taken the situation and got choked up only after listening to the 911 call and seeing the crime scene photos. Understandably so, but let me tell you, she should be an inspiration to everyone, to listen to all of this and keep her head held high. Nona would have been proud.

[regularjoe]

Jonikay, can you tell me what time court wrapped up today? I may try to drive there one afternoon to see some of it. Also, was the courtroom packed or how full was it?

Does anyone know if KJ an JM had the same type of vehicle at the time of the murder? This is a rumor I have heard. I cannot wait to see JM on the stand.

[regularjoe]

Jonikay or susieq can you describe the pictures or did they reveal any interesting details as you saw them?

How many pictures were there?

[Mishell1383]

This in response to susieq's comment about how KJ's sleeping with another woman a week b4 the murder is his motive. Maybe I was writing too fast, but I didn't mean that at all.

BTW, I have to say that Carol Dipert (Nona's mom) is one classy lady. She looked and acted beautifully. She seems in good spirits, taken the situation and got choked up only after listening to the 911 call and seeing the crime scene photos. Understandably so, but let me tell you, she should be an inspiration to everyone, to listen to all of this and keep her head held high. Nona would have been proud.
God Bless her, every parents worse nightmare is to have their child die before them. I couldn't imagine having to relive it and relive it and relive it, the worst day of your life, the end of your being. And to be there with your head held high, to fight for your daughter, is in inspiration to me, ANYDAY! :rose:

[FDInLaw]

Jonikay or susieq can you describe the pictures or did they reveal any interesting details as you saw them?

How many pictures were there?
Good questions! Could someone tell us the type of lamp and the position of it in relationship to the body? Been wondering this for some time.

[lorettalockhorn]

This in response to susieq's comment about how KJ's sleeping with another woman a week b4 the murder is his motive. Maybe I was writing too fast, but I didn't mean that at all.

BTW, I have to say that Carol Dipert (Nona's mom) is one classy lady. She looked and acted beautifully. She seems in good spirits, taken the situation and got choked up only after listening to the 911 call and seeing the crime scene photos. Understandably so, but let me tell you, she should be an inspiration to everyone, to listen to all of this and keep her head held high. Nona would have been proud.

Well, gee. It sounds to me like Nona and Kevin had an on again, off again, and possibly dysfunctional relationship. One of the news channels said that a classmate of Nona's characterized the relationship as unhealthy and said that Nona had told her that she and Kevin had verbal disagreements.

Good to know that Carol Dipert is holding up. We're all likely to hear some awful things here; I think if no one takes joy in them and we support each other, we'll have the strength to tolerate the trial.

[jonikay]

Jonikay, can you tell me what time court wrapped up today? I may try to drive there one afternoon to see some of it. Also, was the courtroom packed or how full was it?

Does anyone know if KJ an JM had the same type of vehicle at the time of the murder? This is a rumor I have heard. I cannot wait to see JM on the stand.
Court wrapped at 430. It was a little more than half full of people. Surprisingly. Regular pic of Nona, pic of condom wrapper, aerial pic of russellville, pics of inglewood apts from diff angles, pic of nona's car, crime scene pics. The lamp was not very far from Nona's body, but based on Ryan's account, the body was face down when they opened the door and KJ flipped her over to her back. Lividity (blood pooling) and rigor mortis show this. Also, the first EMT on the scene had to make KJ get off of Nona, as he was "straddling her" and tried to pick her up at her shoulders.
Nothing at all has been said about good ol JM yet.

[Mishell1383]

Court wrapped at 430. It was a little more than half full of people. Surprisingly. Regular pic of Nona, pic of condom wrapper, aerial pic of russellville, pics of inglewood apts from diff angles, pic of nona's car, crime scene pics. The lamp was not very far from Nona's body, but based on Ryan's account, the body was face down when they opened the door and KJ flipped her over to her back. Lividity (blood pooling) and rigor mortis show this. Also, the first EMT on the scene had to make KJ get off of Nona, as he was "straddling her" and tried to pick her up at her shoulders.
Nothing at all has been said about good ol JM yet.
o boy :eek:

[jonikay]

Well, gee. It sounds to me like Nona and Kevin had an on again, off again, and possibly dysfunctional relationship. One of the news channels said that a classmate of Nona's characterized the relationship as unhealthy and said that Nona had told her that she and Kevin had verbal disagreements.

Good to know that Carol Dipert is holding up. We're all likely to hear some awful things here; I think if no one takes joy in them and we support each other, we'll have the strength to tolerate the trial.
Yeah, that's all she said though, really. As a matter of fact, it was Sara Bailey who said that she and Nona were on the topic of boyfriends, as Sara had one as well. Sara told Nona that she and her bf don't really yell when they fight. She said Nona said that was good bc she and Kevin yelled a lot when they fought. It wasn't mega-significant to me, imo. That is what she said though. Pretty much word for word like I said.

[christina]

I'm here, in waiting. I just got home and sat in the courtroom during the whole process today. If you have any questions, ask. It is nice to have two sides. By the way, I didn't just take notes. I feverishly wrote the whole time, recording basically everything that was said from both sides. I didn't leave anything out . . .

Whoops- you just gave away your identity to me!

[jonikay]

Whoops- you just gave away your identity to me!
Maybe, maybe not . . . Did your cell ring in the middle of the trial? Come on, you can tell me the truth . . . So, who am I?

[lorettalockhorn]

Court wrapped at 430. It was a little more than half full of people. Surprisingly. Regular pic of Nona, pic of condom wrapper, aerial pic of russellville, pics of inglewood apts from diff angles, pic of nona's car, crime scene pics. The lamp was not very far from Nona's body, but based on Ryan's account, the body was face down when they opened the door and KJ flipped her over to her back. Lividity (blood pooling) and rigor mortis show this. Also, the first EMT on the scene had to make KJ get off of Nona, as he was "straddling her" and tried to pick her up at her shoulders.
Nothing at all has been said about good ol JM yet.

Yikes.

Jonikay, do you know from the time of the 911 call, how long the call lasted and how long it took LE and EMS to arrive?

[christina]

Maybe, maybe not . . . Did your cell ring in the middle of the trial? Come on, you can tell me the truth . . . So, who am I?

No way, after what the judge said- I would die before having my cell phone on!!!

[Mishell1383]

No way, after what the judge said- I would die before having my cell phone on!!!
LOL why, did someone have a whoopsie with their cell phone in the court room? I would die!:eek: :read: <- that would be me hiding

[christina]

So, at least three of us in the courtroom today, amazing.
Don't know about the rest of you but I am spent. Did any of the rest of you get caught in the traffic jam on I40 afterward?
Takes lost of energy to listen hard/intently for that long. I took notes as well but tried to watch how the jurors reacted to things.
As for rating the day- Prosecution did ok, Phillips(the short one Joni) is far better than Gibbons, more organized and direct. I have to give the win for the day to the defense though. Very organized and thorough. They brought out new eveidence whereas the prosecution went over basically what we have already heard.
No doubt in my mind- the York guy is squirly at best. He was the only one the PD interviewed who came with a laywer for the interview. I thought I overheard something about "taking the fifth" during the sidebar prior to him entering the room. Did anyone else??

[christina]

LOL why, did someone have a whoopsie with their cell phone in the court room? I would die!:eek: :read: <- that would be me hiding

Yes, two people actually-an older genteman during the defense' opening. After that the judge said phones will be confiscated. When we returned from lunch a woman's phone up in the reporters section went off and the bailiff followed her out of the room. She did not return til the day was over.

[Mishell1383]

So, at least three of us in the courtroom today, amazing.
Don't know about the rest of you but I am spent. Did any of the rest of you get caught in the traffic jam on I40 afterward?
Takes lost of energy to listen hard/intently for that long. I took notes as well but tried to watch how the jurors reacted to things.
As for rating the day- Prosecution did ok, Phillips(the short one Joni) is far better than Gibbons, more organized and direct. I have to give the win for the day to the defense though. Very organized and thorough. They brought out new eveidence whereas the prosecution went over basically what we have already heard.
No doubt in my mind- the York guy is squirly at best. He was the only one the PD interviewed who came with a laywer for the interview. I thought I overheard something about "taking the fifth" during the sidebar prior to him entering the room. Did anyone else??
The first person you see tomorrow ask if they're susieq, that would be a hoot! lolol

[Mishell1383]

Yes, two people actually-an older genteman during the defense' opening. After that the judge said phones will be confiscated. When we returned from lunch a woman's phone up in the reporters section went off and the bailiff followed her out of the room. She did not return til the day was over.
ahahahahahhahahhahahhahahha!!!! ok sorry not funny, i'm not laughing... lolol

[christina]

As said Nona's mom was in the courtroom beside the PA's victim assistant with what I think were family members behind her. Kevin's mom remained outside as she will be called I guess tomorrow. I had the opportunity to speak to both for a second and just hang in there.

[lorettalockhorn]

So is York finished or will he be testifying tomorrow? After the defense questioned him, did the prosecution redirect their questions to clear up discrepancies?

[christina]

Anyone else uncomfortable at those questions? Jordan Harris was for sure. York was not so much. Ms Q is correct here, he double spoke about the gas station thing. When Phillips asked him if he used a credit card to buy the gas and he answered yes- why wasn't that receipt produced and entered into evidence? That bothered me. Basically all we have is his word for what he did that day. From "wanting to return a cake pan" to "cleaning up a spilled coke"(were we ever clear on where he spilled it?) to saying he broke things off because he felt she was using him to get a good grade in biology... something isn't right about him or his testimony.
I would bet the PD is bummed at this point they did not look at him a little longer, at least shore up his non existant alibi. And what about being asked if he ever took out Nona's trash- he answered no. But in the opening the defense say they have a neighbor who will testify she saw him do that. Also in the defense opening we are told the neighbor noticed and couldl describe the guy because he wore leather wrist bands. While on the stand York is asked that by the defense and he says yes.

[Mishell1383]

night all!! I'm pooped! :seeya:
rest up I want my full report about tomorrow!!!! LOL jk jk !

[christina]

So is York finished or will he be testifying tomorrow? After the defense questioned him, did the prosecution redirect their questions to clear up discrepancies?

They tried but it was weak. He will be called back when the defense starts presenting witnesses.

[jonikay]

Yikes.

Jonikay, do you know from the time of the 911 call, how long the call lasted and how long it took LE and EMS to arrive?
The 911 call didn't last long and they didn't give EXACT times, but it was a few mins before 630 bc that's when EMTs arrived. The 911/EMT said 3-4 mins to respond after call was made and location specified. The 911 call was the most "real" piece of evidence today, IMO. By real, I mean real emotion, real everything. Janice was hysterical, the boys were telling her ALL of the information that she needed to give. For instance, the dispatcher would ask Janice the address, she'd ask the boys. Every question was directed to the boys and the boys would yell something. None of them knew the address and were asked by the disp. to look for mail with her name and address on it, which could explain the greeting card being touched, but there was no mention of that during that testimony. This is where Nona's mom cried as did at least 3 jury members (one is pregnant, BTW) One man, I figure a dad with a daughter couldn't hardly stand it. Janice was trying to get answers and the boys were too busy to answer her questions, really. Janice was so frantic, she said at the end of the call, "her mother works at the hospital, her mother works at the hospital." She couldn't hardly, but she did, manage to say her name after a few tries--Nona Dirksmeyer. KJ got on phone for a second and gave the address. B4 this, they needed a home phone # and one of the boys screamed a phone number and then said that she didn't have a home phone, only a cell. It was horrible, really. Incredibly sad, IMO. It got to everyone. Most of what was said was inaudible, as Janice was so hysterical.

[jonikay]

No way, after what the judge said- I would die before having my cell phone on!!!
3 TIMES INTERRUPTED BECAUSE OF A CELL PHONE. 3 TIMES! THE JURY, AS WELL AS EVERYONE ELSE, WERE DISTRACTED BY THIS!!! Whoever it was that last time didn't come back.

[jonikay]

Oh, yes. Mr. defense atty. said what gas station did you get gas at. Trey said at whatever Exxon station. Mr. def atty said but you told police it was Exxon station at another address, is that correct. Trey no sir, I don't recall that. Then Mr. def atty said something to the effect that those were different sites and said something about an Exxon not being by Hastings-- no sir not at that time.

I thought Jordan came across confident and matter of fact but somewhat nervous. I felt Trey was extremely nervous. Even the judge had to keep reminding him to speak into the speaker.

Trey was SPECIFICALLY asked if the calls were made from a cell phone to HIS cell phone and he testified "Yes" and it was asked more than once. Like you said, they kept asking him over and over.

Sare Bailey was nervous, but did well, but she didn't come across to me like Trey did either. TO ME, I am just saying to me. Everyone's perception is going to be different, and it depends somewhat how each person was leaning prior to hearing the testimonies, I think.

Yes, I do agree all witnesses seemed nervous as would be natural. He was the only one I saw outside pacing the halls like crazy before he testified, though.

Everyone who wasn't there will have interpret their own perception into our first hand views because apparently we saw and heard different things.
Now, about the exxon. They asked him which exxon and he said the one by the interstate. They asked if he was aware of another exxon closer to hastings and he said not at the time. Seriously, I do not recall in my mind nor in my notes that Trey ever said it was another gas station. Maybe I'm mistaken, but I really didn't hear or record that on my audio recorder---total lie haha. Jordan was really nervous. He did well, but I was embarrassed for him, really, having to talk about their diff types of encounters. Wouldn't you have been embarrassed. His mother is prob embarrassed to. I thought about her when he was testifying. I'll bet a mil bucks Trey was freaking out. The defense is after him and I'm sure he knew that.

[jonikay]

Anyone else uncomfortable at those questions? Jordan Harris was for sure. York was not so much. Ms Q is correct here, he double spoke about the gas station thing. When Phillips asked him if he used a credit card to buy the gas and he answered yes- why wasn't that receipt produced and entered into evidence? That bothered me. Basically all we have is his word for what he did that day. From "wanting to return a cake pan" to "cleaning up a spilled coke"(were we ever clear on where he spilled it?) to saying he broke things off because he felt she was using him to get a good grade in biology... something isn't right about him or his testimony.
I would bet the PD is bummed at this point they did not look at him a little longer, at least shore up his non existant alibi. And what about being asked if he ever took out Nona's trash- he answered no. But in the opening the defense say they have a neighbor who will testify she saw him do that. Also in the defense opening we are told the neighbor noticed and couldl describe the guy because he wore leather wrist bands. While on the stand York is asked that by the defense and he says yes.
I was uncomfortable by these questions, imagine the folks involved! Now, I know we come from different sides of the fence so to speak, but before trey even, I was confused at how the defense worded their questions and found myself confused at the outcomes. The defense guy got up to the stand close to Trey and I guess I couldn't catch everything. I think that Trey was confused as well, as well as getting irritated by the repetition. Did ya'll catch that? Do ya'll agree with me that some of the questions/statements were confusing, especially during Trey's questioning? The only double speak I recorded was the issue with the timing of the Zack call that informed Trey that something had happened to Nona. Let's not forget to tell the crowd that the 2 had kind of fizzled after Trey thought/decided that Nona took advantage of him and based relationship on getting to copy his work. This doesn't surprise me after hearing stuff today. Christina, do you think Trey is guilty of something? For real ...

[christina]

Good questions! Could someone tell us the type of lamp and the position of it in relationship to the body? Been wondering this for some time.

The lamp was not the open torche type, it had a regular bulb/fork and shade. In the crime scene photos(I was not prepared to see those and teared up immediately) it shows the shade on Nona's ankle and the top part of the lamp with the bulb aimed in the direction of her body about 2 feet away. It would not be hard to imagine Jones touching it when he found her especially if he turned her over. The defense asked both first repsonders about the crime scene and alluded to things being moved around by police. The lawyer said future pictures will show that.

[christina]

The 911 call didn't last long and they didn't give EXACT times, but it was a few mins before 630 bc that's when EMTs arrived. The 911/EMT said 3-4 mins to respond after call was made and location specified. The 911 call was the most "real" piece of evidence today, IMO. By real, I mean real emotion, real everything. Janice was hysterical, the boys were telling her ALL of the information that she needed to give. For instance, the dispatcher would ask Janice the address, she'd ask the boys. Every question was directed to the boys and the boys would yell something. None of them knew the address and were asked by the disp. to look for mail with her name and address on it, which could explain the greeting card being touched, but there was no mention of that during that testimony. This is where Nona's mom cried as did at least 3 jury members (one is pregnant, BTW) One man, I figure a dad with a daughter couldn't hardly stand it. Janice was trying to get answers and the boys were too busy to answer her questions, really. Janice was so frantic, she said at the end of the call, "her mother works at the hospital, her mother works at the hospital." She couldn't hardly, but she did, manage to say her name after a few tries--Nona Dirksmeyer. KJ got on phone for a second and gave the address. B4 this, they needed a home phone # and one of the boys screamed a phone number and then said that she didn't have a home phone, only a cell. It was horrible, really. Incredibly sad, IMO. It got to everyone. Most of what was said was inaudible, as Janice was so hysterical.

Yes, it was gut wrenching to hear. Jones' mothers cries went through me, they made it all so very real. You can hear the boys loudly in the background. I had always thought the text message information was volunteered and that bothered me. After getting the address the dispatcher keeps Jones' mother ont he phone and asks her several quesitons. one was- when was the last time your son spoke to Nona. The mother asks Jones who yells "9, a text message". When Jones got on the phone he did not sound calm, he sounded like he was controlling his voice to focus and answer the questions.
The whole tape left my stomach upset.

[jonikay]

They tried but it was weak. He will be called back when the defense starts presenting witnesses.
oh christina . . . we are on different sides of the universe! This makes me laugh bc the jury is possibly made up of the same type of people. The pros comes back to explain the 1 hour discrep on billing doc to say it is formatting in Eastern Standard Time, like all billing docs. Do you think the defense didn't know this? They hammered Trey on the hour discrep and imo, Trey didn't falter. He eventually said "i know where I was when I called her both times." he didn't change his story on that. Did you get the idea at all that the defense was trying to get him to flop? They also explained the reason that one can tell a diff in Nona's and Trey's cars. Trey said it would not be easy to tell the diff, and the defense tried to get him to state otherwise and he never did. The pros asked him to explain differences. He said body style, front end is longer, head and tail lights completely different. The only similarity is the color. I thought he cleared things up nicely.

[FDInLaw]

The lamp was not the open torche type, it had a regular bulb/fork and shade. In the crime scene photos(I was not prepared to see those and teared up immediately) it shows the shade on Nona's ankle and the top part of the lamp with the bulb aimed in the direction of her body about 2 feet away. It would not be hard to imagine Jones touching it when he found her especially if he turned her over. The defense asked both first repsonders about the crime scene and alluded to things being moved around by police. The lawyer said future pictures will show that.Thanks for the info!

I actually have another question for you, Christina. . . it just come to my attention that Ryan Whiteside is not listed as a witness (http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15313). . . since you know the family can you confirm this? Or is this just a mistake? It seems strange to me that he would not take the stand since he was there when Nona was found.

[christina]

I was uncomfortable by these questions, imagine the folks involved! Now, I know we come from different sides of the fence so to speak, but before trey even, I was confused at how the defense worded their questions and found myself confused at the outcomes. The defense guy got up to the stand close to Trey and I guess I couldn't catch everything. I think that Trey was confused as well, as well as getting irritated by the repetition. Did ya'll catch that? Do ya'll agree with me that some of the questions/statements were confusing, especially during Trey's questioning? The only double speak I recorded was the issue with the timing of the Zack call that informed Trey that something had happened to Nona. Let's not forget to tell the crowd that the 2 had kind of fizzled after Trey thought/decided that Nona took advantage of him and based relationship on getting to copy his work. This doesn't surprise me after hearing stuff today. Christina, do you think Trey is guilty of something? For real ...

Already mentioned that. It was not a good day for displaying Nona's character with some of the things witnesses said abd the defenses' opening. That has got to be hard to hear as a mom.


York's demeanor on the stand bothered me, like a "still waters run deep" kind of thing. I want to hear the neighbor's testimony and see York as a defense witness. Do I think he's guilty of something?-He is suspicious to me, I think he should have been looked at by PD a little more thoroughly, especially if Jones is not found guilty. He admitted to trying to get in touch with her that morning and had no alibi(this meaning no second person to have seen him). This is in stark contrast to the narrow time frame created by alibi's where Jones has no one who saw him. But we'll see after all the other testimony.

[christina]

Thanks for the info!

I actually have another question for you, Christina. . . it just come to my attention that Ryan Whiteside is not listed as a witness (http://www.couriernews.com/story.php?ID=15313). . . since you know the family can you confirm this? Or is this just a mistake? It seems strange to me that he would not take the stand since he was there when Nona was found.

Ryan, Patty and Dennis were all there today. Patty and Dennis inside the courtroom, Ryan waiting with the other witnesses.

[jonikay]

The lamp was not the open torche type, it had a regular bulb/fork and shade. In the crime scene photos(I was not prepared to see those and teared up immediately) it shows the shade on Nona's ankle and the top part of the lamp with the bulb aimed in the direction of her body about 2 feet away. It would not be hard to imagine Jones touching it when he found her especially if he turned her over. The defense asked both first repsonders about the crime scene and alluded to things being moved around by police. The lawyer said future pictures will show that.
The lamp was not what I pictured at all. I had a whole other picture in my head. Also, I must mention that the prosecution stated: How do we know the palm print wasn't made during discovery? Configuration shows it absolutely impossible for KJ to make print at discovery based on placement. He said we'd get more on that later. The defense explained that after the EMT got there and told KJ to get off of Nona, he sat down in a tired sort of exhausted way and put his hands behind him to brace himself. IMO, that goes against what the EMT stated, who said she told him to get off of her and stood up to left of body between she and the lamp and walked to the top of stairs. Am I recalling correctly?

[lorettalockhorn]

Anyone else uncomfortable at those questions? Jordan Harris was for sure. York was not so much. Ms Q is correct here, he double spoke about the gas station thing. When Phillips asked him if he used a credit card to buy the gas and he answered yes- why wasn't that receipt produced and entered into evidence? That bothered me. Basically all we have is his word for what he did that day. From "wanting to return a cake pan" to "cleaning up a spilled coke"(were we ever clear on where he spilled it?) to saying he broke things off because he felt she was using him to get a good grade in biology... something isn't right about him or his testimony.
I would bet the PD is bummed at this point they did not look at him a little longer, at least shore up his non existant alibi. And what about being asked if he ever took out Nona's trash- he answered no. But in the opening the defense say they have a neighbor who will testify she saw him do that. Also in the defense opening we are told the neighbor noticed and couldl describe the guy because he wore leather wrist bands. While on the stand York is asked that by the defense and he says yes.

Questions about sex don't make me uncomfortable, but they probably would if they were about me in particular and in public, ya know? I'm a little confused about the phone call Qs, and York's schedule. Is the problem with his alibi before or after his test? Sounds like his testimony was confusing at best. I guess I don't understand why if he wasn't answering questions, he was dismissed? (Even if he's coming back to testify for the defense.) Is he the guy who was supposed to have been Nona's roommate? Was he asked that question? Was he asked about a fight? Anyway, I doubt very seriously that RPD stuck this case into a file drawer the day that KJ was arrested and didn't take it back out until now. They've probably looked at all of their suspects up, down, sideways and inside out.

[christina]

oh christina . . . we are on different sides of the universe! This makes me laugh bc the jury is possibly made up of the same type of people. The pros comes back to explain the 1 hour discrep on billing doc to say it is formatting in Eastern Standard Time, like all billing docs. Do you think the defense didn't know this? They hammered Trey on the hour discrep and imo, Trey didn't falter. He eventually said "i know where I was when I called her both times." he didn't change his story on that. Did you get the idea at all that the defense was trying to get him to flop? They also explained the reason that one can tell a diff in Nona's and Trey's cars. Trey said it would not be easy to tell the diff, and the defense tried to get him to state otherwise and he never did. The pros asked him to explain differences. He said body style, front end is longer, head and tail lights completely different. The only similarity is the color. I thought he cleared things up nicely.

Were you there for the opening arguments? It also sounds like you know York and Harris, do you?
Agreed, you did not hear/process things like I did. Interesting thing- Eastern Standard Time is one hour ahead of us. Phillips described the call exactly the opposite. The defense needs to jump on that. It means the call was made an hour differently-just the other way which blows his "alibi" worse.

[jonikay]

I gather he must have said something in regards to "twice front and back" to police because defense kept hounding that. But today he said "once, in the front" because they kept asking him if he was sure. He kept saying he didn't tell the police that. I kept expecting the defense to pull his statement out like they did the cell records. I guess that is for another day. He struck me as way suspicious.

In the risk of being called a drama queen here.............. York was on the bottom floor the first time I walked into the court house. You know how sometimes you get a premonition of something but you don't know what? And, this is just to say nothing, just gut reaction. He was pacing around and the look in his eye was so bizarre. He just struck me as very peculiar. I walked up the stairs to the court room and had been directed to the WRONG door. I barely peeked in the door up behind the judge and realized where it was at. I did not realize there was another door and decided (thank GOD) not to go in since court was in session already. I was truly glad I had sense enough to "peek" in instead of barreling through the door like I normally would have!:o I woulda probably been floored by the baliffs!! haha I decided to come back after the lunch break. When I came back, he was on the 2nd floor outside the courtroom, pacing away rubbing his hands togehter. He was the one nearest the REGULAR entryway I found so I asked him, if they were on a break. He just stared at me blankly and took forever to answer. By that time another guy spoke up and said yes, they were waiting on the jury to get back from lunch. About the same time he started speaking, York finally said, "What?" like I was speaking a foreign language. He just struck me as very odd. I did not realize who he was till he testified. His testimony just made him more peculiar for me.
The defense said something to the effect that he told the police he had asked Nona to stop texting him, etc. but he denied saying that ever today. Before they got in to his feeling Nona was using him to copy his biology homework.
Also other had also testified bilogy exam was at 0800 that day but he said 0830. Defense pointed out lots of others already said exam was at 0800, but he said everyone else was wrong. Isn't 0830 and odd time for Tech's classes? All my classes always began on the hour--900, 1000, etc. unless they were night or summer classes. All my tests started when the class was supposed to start. And, why would E:cool: VERYONE else be wrong?
honestly, 830 is very normal for finals. finals are scheduled, most the time, on the half hour. For instance, his 1030 final. I wondered if the reason behind the defense not pulling out any police statements was because they were trying to catch him in a fib. They were not slow at all to pull the cell records, even when they weren't in his time zone. Do you think Trey did it?

[chambord]

So, at least three of us in the courtroom today, amazing.
Don't know about the rest of you but I am spent. Did any of the rest of you get caught in the traffic jam on I40 afterward?
Takes lost of energy to listen hard/intently for that long. I took notes as well but tried to watch how the jurors reacted to things.
As for rating the day- Prosecution did ok, Phillips(the short one Joni) is far better than Gibbons, more organized and direct. I have to give the win for the day to the defense though. Very organized and thorough. They brought out new eveidence whereas the prosecution went over basically what we have already heard.
No doubt in my mind- the York guy is squirly at best. He was the only one the PD interviewed who came with a laywer for the interview. I thought I overheard something about "taking the fifth" during the sidebar prior to him entering the room. Did anyone else??

I think its just fab that three of you have given your time to cover this trial..I am devouring your posts...Dang, I wish this was being televised on CTV.

[christina]

Questions about sex don't make me uncomfortable, but they probably would if they were about me in particular and in public, ya know? I'm a little confused about the phone call Qs, and York's schedule. Is the problem with his alibi before or after his test? Sounds like his testimony was confusing at best. I guess I don't understand why if he wasn't answering questions, he was dismissed? (Even if he's coming back to testify for the defense.) Is he the guy who was supposed to have been Nona's roommate? Was he asked that question? Was he asked about a fight? Anyway, I doubt very seriously that RPD stuck this case into a file drawer the day that KJ was arrested and didn't take it back out until now. They've probably looked at all of their suspects up, down, sideways and inside out.

I imagine we will find some of this stuff out when the defense puts the neighbor on.
The prosecution was using York's testimony for time placement of when the battery was removed from the phone- thus nailing TOD. He texted her at 11:04 and says "call me", no response. He texted again at 12:58(?) to say "nevermind". The prosecution said this was the last message/call to the phone that "went thru", all others went straight to voicemail meaning the battery ahd been removed.

[jonikay]

Questions about sex don't make me uncomfortable, but they probably would if they were about me in particular and in public, ya know? I'm a little confused about the phone call Qs, and York's schedule. Is the problem with his alibi before or after his test? Sounds like his testimony was confusing at best. I guess I don't understand why if he wasn't answering questions, he was dismissed? (Even if he's coming back to testify for the defense.) Is he the guy who was supposed to have been Nona's roommate? Was he asked that question? Was he asked about a fight? Anyway, I doubt very seriously that RPD stuck this case into a file drawer the day that KJ was arrested and didn't take it back out until now. They've probably looked at all of their suspects up, down, sideways and inside out.
He answered the questions, but was asked them repeatedly. There is no "problem" with his alibi. The "problem" was with the defense saying that the call was made at 1004, not 1104 like he said. That was cleared by the prosecution. I assume this is who neighbors say thought stayed with Nona ("roommate" never mentioned), althought the neighbor hasn't testified yet. Trey said Nona would come to her dorm once or twice a week for a while for a few hours, but said he only went to her apartment two times and never took out her trash. He stated that Nona called one night and asked him to spend the night (happened with Jordan, too) with her at her apartment. He did and they kissed, that's all. He left around 800 that next morning bc Nona said she wasn't feeling well. He said he never went back to her apartment after that. Nona texted Trey 147 times in Novand 83 in Dec.

[FDInLaw]

Ryan, Patty and Dennis were all there today. Patty and Dennis inside the courtroom, Ryan waiting with the other witnesses.

Ryan must still be a witness then. Thank you! :)

[christina]

honestly, 830 is very normal for finals. finals are scheduled, most the time, on the half hour. For instance, his 1030 final. I wondered if the reason behind the defense not pulling out any police statements was because they were trying to catch him in a fib. They were not slow at all to pull the cell records, even when they weren't in his time zone. Do you think Trey did it?

The problem being pointed out is that he was the only witness who said a different test time, the other 3 gave the same time.

[christina]

He answered the questions, but was asked them repeatedly. There is no "problem" with his alibi. The "problem" was with the defense saying that the call was made at 1004, not 1104 like he said. That was cleared by the prosecution. I assume this is who neighbors say thought stayed with Nona ("roommate" never mentioned), althought the neighbor hasn't testified yet. Trey said Nona would come to her dorm once or twice a week for a while for a few hours, but said he only went to her apartment two times and never took out her trash. He stated that Nona called one night and asked him to spend the night (happened with Jordan, too) with her at her apartment. He did and they kissed, that's all. He left around 800 that next morning bc Nona said she wasn't feeling well. He said he never went back to her apartment after that. Nona texted Trey 147 times in Novand 83 in Dec.

Do you think York was the only one asked questions repeatedly? And do you think the defense was the only one doing that?
The prosecution was called down twice for asking leading questions. The judge ruled in favor of the defense both times.

[christina]

I think its just fab that three of you have given your time to cover this trial..I am devouring your posts...Dang, I wish this was being televised on CTV.

I appreciate those words. I am really tired, comes from being old! Don't know if it was the bbq or what but I have a mjor upset stomach and am heading to bed.

[regularjoe]

I had just heard that JM and JK both had Jeep's either Jeep's or Jeep Cherokee's and that they looked the same. Anyone know what KJ drove at that time? One question I forgot to ask was if there were any clothes in these pictures, someone told me that she had her socks on and that they were kind of halfway on her feet. Is this correct? I am curious if the clothes were near the body what that might tell considering she was naked.

IMO it sounds to me as if York should have been ?'d a little more by RPD. Maybe later on Frost can explain or the PA can explain why he was confidently cleared as a suspect. Did someone say that he had a test after 11:00. If so I hope someone can prove that he did take the test.

What does everyone think about the statement that KJ made during interrogation breaks? I for one will have to wait until I hear it in the context of whatever the officer's were questioning about prior to leaving the room for the break.

[jonikay]

Do you think York was the only one asked questions repeatedly? And do you think the defense was the only one doing that?
The prosecution was called down twice for asking leading questions. The judge ruled in favor of the defense both times.
Was the prosecution called out twice during York's testimony? I recall that during Jordan's, but not York's. Are you going tomorrow?

[jonikay]

Hi Mom! Cheers to you! :beer:

[jonikay]

I don't think Trey was confused. I think he was calculating his answers. He'd already been tripped up. I am certain the repeating of questions served it's purpose. Yes, IMO, the defense team is pretty sharp. This may all end sooner than we thought....
Honestly, here two of us head a lot of double speak in Trey's testimony. I am sure there are things I missed that you picked up on. Do you think it possible you might have missed it?
Trey and Nona fizzled per his testimony, but continued to speak, etc. texting from Nona over 200 times in one month NOV. 05 and another 150 or so in half of Dec. I don't see that as much fizzle.
I am not Christina, and I am not trying to be sarcastic or snippy or however you all have me characterized, but what is your gut feeling, jonikay?
When York returns, I would not be surprised for him to have an attorney in tow. If he doesn't, he might be smart to. JMO
I don't think I missed anything; however, it is safe to say that I have probably misinterpreted certain parts of the testimony. I am willing to bet that Trey has been working on this testimony for over a year. He came today complete with an attorney. I was seriously confused by the whole testimony and maybe it came out to me that it was the questioning that stumped me. He looked nervous always, confused sometimes, and adamant a lot, IMO. He was probably experiencing a mixture of frustration and fear in the whole situation. If today was exhausting to me, I'm sure it was for everyone involved. It seemed to me like the other ATU students were ready to get it over with. Just what I sensed. I could tell that Trey had a lot more stock in it. Toward the end, I sensed some anymosity from him, part directed toward the defense and part toward Nona, if you want my honest opinion. I appreciate you asking for my gut feeling, and it is . . . After hearing all the exhausting stuff today, the prosecution better have some testimony towards alibi with some merit or they're toast. On the other hand, the defense's idea to blame the RPD for the tampering of evidence is unfounded, imo. They say nothing to back it up. People, for the very most part, have been raised to trust policemen and without valid evidence (maybe they have some, I don't know) I have a feeling this may backfire. The prosecution, at this point, has more explaining to do than I thought they originally had, but the defense doesn't have a rock solid case either. It's obvious that there were things we didn't know until now, so that changes my perspective a bit. My gut feeling is that Trey didn't do this at all. I really don't think so. I feel like he came prepared, but not prepared enough for the mental stamina it takes to endure questioning of that nature. He feels like his life is on the line and I'd be nervous too, but I don't think he did it. I just don't. Please answer me this, did the prosecution get called down twice for leading Trey? I know they got reprimanded for Jordan. Now . . . your turn.

[jonikay]

jonikay, I did hear Phillips say EST, which would explain the time difference, but you said he said they came from California-- I didn't hear that, but that's west coast? Why would something from the west coast have EST?
For the record, I thought it pretty weak also....
I thought it was Cali, but I guess I'm worthless as far as relaying info to ya'll. Specifically, my notes say "shorty pros, states billing document per east coast time, states that clears up the one hour time discrepancy." I guess I added Cali.

[lorettalockhorn]

If York made a phone call at 11:04CST and the billing was EST, the time would show as 12:04. Wouldn't the billing have to be MST to be an hour earlier?

I did hear mentioned on the news that the defense contends that items were moved in the photographs. But with so many people on the scene before RPD arrived, isn't that to be expected to a degree? Kevin turned Nona over and effected his resucitation attempt. I'm assuming that RPD arrived near the same time as EMS, but in the confusion, even if not purposely, I can imagine things being moved.

Re: the fingerprints on the card. I pictured that it was the actual greeting card that was touched; that it wasn't in an envelope (where Nona's address would be). Why would the card need to be taken out of the envelope to find her address?

Thanks to all of you for your interpretations!

[jonikay]

Were you there for the opening arguments? It also sounds like you know York and Harris, do you?
Agreed, you did not hear/process things like I did. Interesting thing- Eastern Standard Time is one hour ahead of us. Phillips described the call exactly the opposite. The defense needs to jump on that. It means the call was made an hour differently-just the other way which blows his "alibi" worse.
I don't know either of them at all. I can relate however, due to my knowledge of ATU music courses/schedules and college courses, finals, tests. I noticed a few discrepancies from both sides, but I think that both sides weren't paying close, close attention to the other's testimonies because they were getting ready for a rebuttal or whatever. But, my opinion don't mean nothing around here, does it? haha I was there for opening statements. The defense said once that KJ wanted to go to Nona's apartment bc he was afraid she'd overmedicated on her anti-depressants, but explained Janice's quick park job by stating the boys thought they could go and knock on the door and satisfy themselves by rousing Nona to get out of the shower or a place where she couldn't here them and answer the door. So, once it's afraid she's dead, next it's figuring she's in the shower.

[jonikay]

If York made a phone call at 11:04CST and the billing was EST, the time would show as 12:04. Wouldn't the billing have to be MST to be an hour earlier?

I did hear mentioned on the news that the defense contends that items were moved in the photographs. But with so many people on the scene before RPD arrived, isn't that to be expected to a degree? Kevin turned Nona over and effected his resucitation attempt. I'm assuming that RPD arrived near the same time as EMS, but in the confusion, even if not purposely, I can imagine things being moved.

Re: the fingerprints on the card. I pictured that it was the actual greeting card that was touched; that it wasn't in an envelope (where Nona's address would be). Why would the card need to be taken out of the envelope to find her address?

Thanks to all of you for your interpretations!
well, it just came to my mind that maybe they were frantic and were reaching for any paper or something. I just heard Janice screaming so loud at them to find the address and the boys were loud too, so I figured KJ could have messed with the card. keep in mind that this greeting card fiasco wasn't mentioned during the testimony.

[jonikay]

Leading questions that IIRC once was actually putting words in the witnesses mouth.
and that was mentioned during Jordan's testimony, right? when he called and asked for a place to crash and she explained that she had reconnected with her boyfriend and he began to explain that she called him an hour later and told him . . . and he was stopped quick by the defense who said that he was leading the witness. The short guy tried to explain himself and he didn't get a chance. That is seriously the only time I remember that being said and it wasn't during Trey's testimony.